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I truly need help. My self sabotage is killing me.

Anything related to matters of the mind

gallagher99

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Long story short:

--> I play poker for a living.
--> I don't have savings, and I have huge money pressure daily.
--> I am a winning player, I can make more than enough money. I play since 2008. Study a lot, love the math, timing tells, etc. I crush the stakes I play, no questions about it.

However I never have success with it, or what I truly need to move up in my life. It is agonizing me, because I know that I'm really capable.
Sadly I have lots of debts because of a family and business problem, I have to pay money loans (which is a few months behind).
I'm using anti depressants (pristiq) and already having therapy.

I always put myself in this loop, seriously it is repeating for YEARS!
  1. I lose everything! I get desperate. Should I sell something? Even my cellphone screen breaks.
  2. I put my head in place, organize my routine --> grind it SUPER focused for multiple days, every cent counts.
  3. I triumph! I make enough for my survival (what was killing my brain and screwing my sleep, like credit cards and super important things, fix broken screen)
    The money I make in this period (2 weeks or 1 month) is probably 10 times bigger than the monthly average in my country.
  4. I think things will go better now. At least I can breathe better and I can see the light at the end of the tunnel --> But no. The cycle repeats.
  5. Everything that I did to make the money to pay what I need, I do the opposite. It kills me, it agonizes me. I get to the bottom of the my life and I have to gain everything again.
I try to have a good routine, sleep cycle, to have stop loss (even stop win), the play sessions of 1 or 2 hours tops, I meditate, I study the game.
But honestly, it is like I have double personality (or whatever the name is)...
For example I had a wonderful February this year. I paid multiple things, had a really huge bankroll, I was really happy because I thought I could now shape my life.
But since the first minute I paid everything, deep down in my mind I think I knew it was gonna happen, I knew deep down that I was gonna F*ck up somewhere... And I didn't have a winning day ever since (or if I had I didn't even remember).
I start winning $ in the day, I start playing well and focused. But every last session I am not myself, I loose focus, I start doing bad things and in seconds looks like i'm another person, I loose all hope, I start playing like monkey, makes me wanna cry because I really needed this money.

The problem is that it happened 20 DAYS IN A ROW in march seriously.... 20 days repeating everyday.
Every day of those 20 days I started the day winning. Yes... Winning a lot actually. But finished losing everything I won and Lost control. Playing more than 12 hours straight, not sleeping, etc. Terrible. For the first time in my life I felt like I had a hangover from poker, a huge burnout and had to stop playing because I felt disgusted from my actions and especially the way I tossed away money and time (12h+ in the day when I tilt like this), it took more than 1 month to regain the will to play poker again, but sadly it didn't stop. I still make this mistakes.

For example today:
I was winning like 9buy-ins in the day. I played for 5 hours in 3 sessions, was feeling really good. However my last session I honestly don't know how to explain what went wrong. I was gonna stop loss when I hit 3buy-ins. But in like 15 minutes I lost everything I grinded in the day. Yes, 5 hours of work I lost in 15 minutes, I don't even remember what happened.
Later on the night I meditated, and crushed a guy in headsup for 4buy-ins, I knew that I was gonna win, no questions.
At least I can breathe a little bit again, right? Doesn't feel so bad. But wow... I knew it was gonna happen...
I found him playing a little bit higher. And I HAD to give all the money back to him again. So today happened two times.



I had a borderline (or whatever the name, she cut herself from time to time) ex-girlfriend. And honestly it feels the same.
Makes me wanna cry, I don't recognize myself, feels like i'm hurting myself, making me suffer. It F*cks my health, I wanna break things.
I know my worst enemy is my own brain.
I don't hate the game or the other players, or having bad luck. I hate WHEN I DO THIS SHIT.


The cycle I mentioned has been repeating for years.
But sadly since my family lost our business, I have to live with my poker money. And it is affecting me a lot from the last 365 days.
I always loose a lot more than I win, because the lack of my self control.
The money I can make playing this game would be more than enough to have any life I want, but I never had the discipline to achieve.

The talks I had with my therapy sessions was that I do this to make me suffer and to make me feel like I don't deserve to achieve success, just like my family (they were really rich but bankrupted).
My family doesn't like that I play poker and by doing this mistakes that I wrote above, I keep myself under-achieved so they can be right.

It agonizes me to be drained in debt, but if I can put my head in place I can make a really good living with the game (without the tilts). I really crush the stakes I play, I discuss the game, study a lot, I do the math and review what I played. I know I can make huge profits playing this game. I just feel really bad doing this shit that I do, specially in a quarantine period where most people are without jobs. I can get what I want in my life with this game, but I can't live doing this things over and over, my health is terrible right now.
 
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Last edited:

Bobby_italy

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Man you’re rambling a lot and I don’t really understand what your question is.
You should make a course and sell it if you’re as good as you say in the theory, I’m pretty sure there’s goos money in that, also make a YT channel and put your face on it.

If you consider making a guide we could review it and give you tips!
 

Kevin88660

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Long story short:

--> I play poker for a living.
--> I don't have savings, and I have huge money pressure daily.
--> I am a winning player, I can make more than enough money. I play since 2008. Study a lot, love the math, timing tells, etc. I crush the stakes I play, no questions about it.

However I never have success with it, or what I truly need to move up in my life. It is agonizing me, because I know that I'm really capable.
Sadly I have lots of debts because of a family and business problem, I have to pay money loans (which is a few months behind).
I'm using anti depressants (pristiq) and already having therapy.

I always put myself in this loop, seriously it is repeating for YEARS!
  1. I lose everything! I get desperate. Should I sell something? Even my cellphone screen breaks.
  2. I put my head in place, organize my routine --> grind it SUPER focused for multiple days, every cent counts.
  3. I triumph! I make enough for my survival (what was killing my brain and screwing my sleep, like credit cards and super important things, fix broken screen)
    The money I make in this period (2 weeks or 1 month) is probably 10 times bigger than the monthly average in my country.
  4. I think things will go better now. At least I can breathe better and I can see the light at the end of the tunnel --> But no. The cycle repeats.
  5. Everything that I did to make the money to pay what I need, I do the opposite. It kills me, it agonizes me. I get to the bottom of the my life and I have to gain everything again.
I try to have a good routine, sleep cycle, to have stop loss (even stop win), the play sessions of 1 or 2 hours tops, I meditate, I study the game.
But honestly, it is like I have double personality (or whatever the name is)...
For example I had a wonderful February this year. I paid multiple things, had a really huge bankroll, I was really happy because I thought I could now shape my life.
But since the first minute I paid everything, deep down in my mind I think I knew it was gonna happen, I knew deep down that I was gonna F*ck up somewhere... And I didn't have a winning day ever since (or if I had I didn't even remember).
I start winning $ in the day, I start playing well and focused. But every last session I am not myself, I loose focus, I start doing bad things and in seconds looks like i'm another person, I loose all hope, I start playing like monkey, makes me wanna cry because I really needed this money.

The problem is that it happened 20 DAYS IN A ROW in march seriously.... 20 days repeating everyday.
Every day of those 20 days I started the day winning. Yes... Winning a lot actually. But finished losing everything I won and Lost control. Playing more than 12 hours straight, not sleeping, etc. Terrible. For the first time in my life I felt like I had a hangover from poker, a huge burnout and had to stop playing because I felt disgusted from my actions and especially the way I tossed away money and time (12h+ in the day when I tilt like this), it took more than 1 month to regain the will to play poker again, but sadly it didn't stop. I still make this mistakes.

For example today:
I was winning like 9buy-ins in the day. I played for 5 hours in 3 sessions, was feeling really good. However my last session I honestly don't know how to explain what went wrong. I was gonna stop loss when I hit 3buy-ins. But in like 15 minutes I lost everything I grinded in the day. Yes, 5 hours of work I lost in 15 minutes, I don't even remember what happened.
Later on the night I meditated, and crushed a guy in headsup for 4buy-ins, I knew that I was gonna win, no questions.
At least I can breathe a little bit again, right? Doesn't feel so bad. But wow... I knew it was gonna happen...
I found him playing a little bit higher. And I HAD to give all the money back to him again. So today happened two times.



I had a borderline (or whatever the name, she cut herself from time to time) ex-girlfriend. And honestly it feels the same.
Makes me wanna cry, I don't recognize myself, feels like i'm hurting myself, making me suffer. It F*cks my health, I wanna break things.
I know my worst enemy is my own brain.
I don't hate the game or the other players, or having bad luck. I hate WHEN I DO THIS SHIT.


The cycle I mentioned has been repeating for years.
But sadly since my family lost our business, I have to live with my poker money. And it is affecting me a lot from the last 365 days.
I always loose a lot more than I win, because the lack of my self control.
The money I can make playing this game would be more than enough to have any life I want, but I never had the discipline to achieve.

The talks I had with my therapy sessions was that I do this to make me suffer and to make me feel like I don't deserve to achieve success, just like my family (they were really rich but bankrupted).
My family doesn't like that I play poker and by doing this mistakes that I wrote above, I keep myself under-achieved so they can be right.

It agonizes me to be drained in debt, but if I can put my head in place I can make a really good living with the game (without the tilts). I really crush the stakes I play, I discuss the game, study a lot, I do the math and review what I played. I know I can make huge profits playing this game. I just feel really bad doing this shit that I do, specially in a quarantine period where most people are without jobs. I can get what I want in my life with this game, but I can't live doing this things over and over, my health is terrible right now.
My opinion is to quit poker playing as your main source of income.

Zero sum games by nature is a very bad business model.

When you run your own business or work in a business, you are adding value to the society, and sharing a growing pie..instead of taking from others and trying to defend others taking your share.

I do not play poker or know poker players but I know so many people who tried to make a living trading stocks/forex. I have seen zero success.
Emotional roller coastal over mega win and losses...(win-loss)divided by time spent: always below minimum wages...for those who make money.
 

Primeperiwinkle

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Ok I can help you!!! I did the EXACT same thing for years basically staying in a loop of success, sabotage, agony, survival mode.

It’s like 50% of me KNEW I could get out of any debt (and I was right I could) but then once I was free of debt the other 50% of me would kick in and say I didn’t DESERVE to be happy.

So I found really inventive ways of punishing myself over and over and over. What finally started the healing process was my kids.. because I wasn’t about to let my hatred for me (the inner angry voice) affect them.

Little by little, I recognized the truth of the above paragraph. It was MY OWN hatred of MYSELF that was crippling me. Every time I got anywhere close to happy I would radically change my environment, redoing my reality to match my inner turmoil. On the outside I looked fine but on the inside I felt like I wasn’t worth shit. So I made certain aspects of my life like shit.

It sounds like you’re doing the same. You get focused because you hate the shit, then you work realllllllllly hard to get out of it.. then you feel like a fraud.

My childhood wasn’t horrible but it wasn’t healthy. Then I got married to.. well not a good guy. It took getting away from all of that WHILE ALSO making solid friends who accept me and loved me while I tackled other stuff (like reading or playing pool or jiu jitsu or hell.. even knitting) to teach me that I was a decent person who can be happy and doesnt have to feel guilty about being happy. My clients helped too cuz they’re all super supportive.

So here’s the steps.

1. Find some more stuff to do with your time besides your job.
2. Inundate yourself with beautiful things and ideas (basically NOT shit)
3.Fail horribly at that stuff.
4. Try again.
5. Figure out what you actually love whether it’s a different music or a different workout or books that no one in your family has ever heard of.. find something to love that SEPARATES you from your past shitty self.
6. Get confidence.
7. Look in the mirror directly into your own eyes and tell yourself you forgive him.
8. Tell yourself you love you.
9. Go have a mini breakdown because wow was that F*cking hard and it clearly shouldn’t be that hard.
10. Hate healthy ppl for a while cuz they don’t have to learn this crap.
11. Realize that EVERYONE who has to recover from any emotional wounds has to do this exact same stuff.
12. Think about God or the Universe or whatever
13. Thank God for making you.
14. Deepen your love for those new beautiful ideas and activities.
15. Realize that your affections are what make you who you are.. and by changing your affections YOU HAVE ACTUALLY CHANGED.
16. Realize the fact that your old shitty self wouldn’t even recognize your new self..
17. Be proud.
18. Keep going with all of that and help other ppl.
19. Realize it’s not 50% good you vs. 50% bad you any more. It’s more like 90/10.
20. Don’t feel too guilty about that crappy 10%. Lol.

So your action step today is to find ANY hobby, activity or idea that is utterly foreign to you.. like soap carving.. or braiding hair or climbing mountains.. or arranging flowers and go try it.

Remember, every time you subtly change your environment you’re gonna push your own comfort levels. Right now you are ACTUALLY MORE COMFORTABLE with failure than you are with success. You believe you’re a failure.

But you’re not. You’re just a person who has failed. There’s a difference. You’re also a person who has succeeded.

If you were actually a shitty person you wouldn’t be trying to change, you wouldn’t be willing to do new stuff and you wouldn’t ever try to help anyone else.

Turns out you’re a good person, who deserves love and stability and safety. Your parents failed at giving some of those to you but it wasn’t because you didn’t deserve them.

Hugs.
 
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sparechange

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I have lots of experience with poker, from reading your post you sound like a degenerate gambler.

Winning players have good bankroll management, if you've been playing for 12 years and have no savings with debt, yes, you are a losing player. Ironically you highlighted in bold that you are a winning player, you are a fish with a little bit of luck. Please do yourself a favor and quit the game, focus on something else. I've had the same problem where I wasn't able to beat the game as well and decided to leave it behind.

#1 Drop the anti depressants, that crap is garbage and messing up your brain
#2 Realize you are a gambler chasing money

Players like you are preyed upon constantly by the elite, sadly I'm pretty sure you will just ignore my advice

I guess it's a good and bad thing, while you are busy ruining your life the real sharks are getting easy money from you, poker is all about taking a suckers money.

Winning 20 days in a row means nothing, large sample sizes are required to ''prove'' you are a winning poker player, I.E the usual average to realize true skill would be 100,000 cash game hands. Online that could be about a month of play if you are playing 12-24 tables multiple hours a day, although it's still common for good players to be on a breakeven stretch and possibly even lose. A great example is Dusty Scmidt, A.K.A leatherass from Pokerstars/Fulltilt, back in the day he was the #1 player around, and years ago he made a return only to be breakeven at mid stakes (200nl - 1knl) with 100k+ hand samples. Not sure if he is even playing anymore, but the point is even he could barely beat online, I looked at his profits for 100k samples and he made a few dollars, yes a few bucks. The actual #1 guy from back in the day with a failed comeback. Even at Micro stakes online people are using solvers and tons of software to help them ''win''

Online games are pretty dry atm, on Pokerstars right now there is a few dozen of the same people trading money away and barely making a profit, while there are a select few that still make some money, it is a million times over easier to make money with business (I am speaking with experience) Making money in entrepreneurship compared to poker is much more effortless and easier, and you have a higher potential for growth.

Now if you are playing live poker you are **** outta luck. I always find it hilarious when people claim they are live poker pros, with my expertise and understanding of the game & studying / playing with the greats, the people that play live are delusional gambling addicts that go on a short run of luck believing they are pokers next gift. A Pokerstars pro at microstakes posted up some graphs with a 10bb+/100 winrate with 6 figure hand samples and in that sample, there were MULTIPLE breakeven or even losing stretches of 20-30,000 hands.

For the live players, that is equivalent to playing for years potentially. At 30 hands per hour on average for a live game, take the 30 and x it by 1000, that's only 30,000 hands. Anything can happen in 30,000 hands (over a 1000 hour period)

1,000 hours / 6 months > = 166 hours, just above the average work week would be 41 hours of playing a week, remember the Pokerstars pro example? How can he be the best player and still post a losing graph at a 30k hand sample? (30k hands means nothing online) You could do it in a few days, the point is for playing at a casino where the amount of volume you can play is capped really is a hindrance. Again anyone that says they are a pro player at the casino is a delusional gambling addicted bum unless they are a fish on a heater that scored a few tournament runs for 6+ figures, straight up.

Even Nanonoko an online legend can't beat the higher stakes online. Right now there is 35 people playing 2/5 zoom on stars, I've played with these guys before and they are insanely good, I can't imagine playing higher up like 10/20 + where the field is even smaller.

Woo what a way to start the day, I feel like firing up a game... It has no effect on me whether or not you quit the game, but I'll tell you that with your mindset you are not cut out for this. Then again, since I'm 99% sure you will just ignore everything I said, the way the poker economy works is people like you that tilt of cash to the gto nits online (or the nits that play live) So regardless of your decision you either benefit yourself or others.

Enough poker talk, lets talk about something more fun than poker, creating a business. What can you start with today? Let's provide some value to people in the form of services of products, get compensated for it, and then after making lots of value vouchers, you can become the big whale (which is what I would rather be) and sit at the highstakes table 50k+ triple barrelling all the pros off top pair.

Do yourself a favor and quit, or at the very least make it a hobby on the side to enjoy. Cheers
 
Last edited:

kleine2

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Long story short:

--> I play poker for a living.
--> I don't have savings, and I have huge money pressure daily.
--> I am a winning player, I can make more than enough money. I play since 2008. Study a lot, love the math, timing tells, etc. I crush the stakes I play, no questions about it.

However I never have success with it, or what I truly need to move up in my life. It is agonizing me, because I know that I'm really capable.
Sadly I have lots of debts because of a family and business problem, I have to pay money loans (which is a few months behind).
I'm using anti depressants (pristiq) and already having therapy.

I always put myself in this loop, seriously it is repeating for YEARS!
  1. I lose everything! I get desperate. Should I sell something? Even my cellphone screen breaks.
  2. I put my head in place, organize my routine --> grind it SUPER focused for multiple days, every cent counts.
  3. I triumph! I make enough for my survival (what was killing my brain and screwing my sleep, like credit cards and super important things, fix broken screen)
    The money I make in this period (2 weeks or 1 month) is probably 10 times bigger than the monthly average in my country.
  4. I think things will go better now. At least I can breathe better and I can see the light at the end of the tunnel --> But no. The cycle repeats.
  5. Everything that I did to make the money to pay what I need, I do the opposite. It kills me, it agonizes me. I get to the bottom of the my life and I have to gain everything again.
I try to have a good routine, sleep cycle, to have stop loss (even stop win), the play sessions of 1 or 2 hours tops, I meditate, I study the game.
But honestly, it is like I have double personality (or whatever the name is)...
For example I had a wonderful February this year. I paid multiple things, had a really huge bankroll, I was really happy because I thought I could now shape my life.
But since the first minute I paid everything, deep down in my mind I think I knew it was gonna happen, I knew deep down that I was gonna F*ck up somewhere... And I didn't have a winning day ever since (or if I had I didn't even remember).
I start winning $ in the day, I start playing well and focused. But every last session I am not myself, I loose focus, I start doing bad things and in seconds looks like i'm another person, I loose all hope, I start playing like monkey, makes me wanna cry because I really needed this money.

The problem is that it happened 20 DAYS IN A ROW in march seriously.... 20 days repeating everyday.
Every day of those 20 days I started the day winning. Yes... Winning a lot actually. But finished losing everything I won and Lost control. Playing more than 12 hours straight, not sleeping, etc. Terrible. For the first time in my life I felt like I had a hangover from poker, a huge burnout and had to stop playing because I felt disgusted from my actions and especially the way I tossed away money and time (12h+ in the day when I tilt like this), it took more than 1 month to regain the will to play poker again, but sadly it didn't stop. I still make this mistakes.

For example today:
I was winning like 9buy-ins in the day. I played for 5 hours in 3 sessions, was feeling really good. However my last session I honestly don't know how to explain what went wrong. I was gonna stop loss when I hit 3buy-ins. But in like 15 minutes I lost everything I grinded in the day. Yes, 5 hours of work I lost in 15 minutes, I don't even remember what happened.
Later on the night I meditated, and crushed a guy in headsup for 4buy-ins, I knew that I was gonna win, no questions.
At least I can breathe a little bit again, right? Doesn't feel so bad. But wow... I knew it was gonna happen...
I found him playing a little bit higher. And I HAD to give all the money back to him again. So today happened two times.



I had a borderline (or whatever the name, she cut herself from time to time) ex-girlfriend. And honestly it feels the same.
Makes me wanna cry, I don't recognize myself, feels like i'm hurting myself, making me suffer. It F*cks my health, I wanna break things.
I know my worst enemy is my own brain.
I don't hate the game or the other players, or having bad luck. I hate WHEN I DO THIS SHIT.


The cycle I mentioned has been repeating for years.
But sadly since my family lost our business, I have to live with my poker money. And it is affecting me a lot from the last 365 days.
I always loose a lot more than I win, because the lack of my self control.
The money I can make playing this game would be more than enough to have any life I want, but I never had the discipline to achieve.

The talks I had with my therapy sessions was that I do this to make me suffer and to make me feel like I don't deserve to achieve success, just like my family (they were really rich but bankrupted).
My family doesn't like that I play poker and by doing this mistakes that I wrote above, I keep myself under-achieved so they can be right.

It agonizes me to be drained in debt, but if I can put my head in place I can make a really good living with the game (without the tilts). I really crush the stakes I play, I discuss the game, study a lot, I do the math and review what I played. I know I can make huge profits playing this game. I just feel really bad doing this shit that I do, specially in a quarantine period where most people are without jobs. I can get what I want in my life with this game, but I can't live doing this things over and over, my health is terrible right now.

Find a relevant 12 steps program for gamblers.
 

MaxKhalus

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Long story short:

--> I play poker for a living.
--> I don't have savings, and I have huge money pressure daily.
--> I am a winning player, I can make more than enough money. I play since 2008. Study a lot, love the math, timing tells, etc. I crush the stakes I play, no questions about it.

However I never have success with it, or what I truly need to move up in my life. It is agonizing me, because I know that I'm really capable.
Sadly I have lots of debts because of a family and business problem, I have to pay money loans (which is a few months behind).
I'm using anti depressants (pristiq) and already having therapy.

I always put myself in this loop, seriously it is repeating for YEARS!
  1. I lose everything! I get desperate. Should I sell something? Even my cellphone screen breaks.
  2. I put my head in place, organize my routine --> grind it SUPER focused for multiple days, every cent counts.
  3. I triumph! I make enough for my survival (what was killing my brain and screwing my sleep, like credit cards and super important things, fix broken screen)
    The money I make in this period (2 weeks or 1 month) is probably 10 times bigger than the monthly average in my country.
  4. I think things will go better now. At least I can breathe better and I can see the light at the end of the tunnel --> But no. The cycle repeats.
  5. Everything that I did to make the money to pay what I need, I do the opposite. It kills me, it agonizes me. I get to the bottom of the my life and I have to gain everything again.
I try to have a good routine, sleep cycle, to have stop loss (even stop win), the play sessions of 1 or 2 hours tops, I meditate, I study the game.
But honestly, it is like I have double personality (or whatever the name is)...
For example I had a wonderful February this year. I paid multiple things, had a really huge bankroll, I was really happy because I thought I could now shape my life.
But since the first minute I paid everything, deep down in my mind I think I knew it was gonna happen, I knew deep down that I was gonna F*ck up somewhere... And I didn't have a winning day ever since (or if I had I didn't even remember).
I start winning $ in the day, I start playing well and focused. But every last session I am not myself, I loose focus, I start doing bad things and in seconds looks like i'm another person, I loose all hope, I start playing like monkey, makes me wanna cry because I really needed this money.

The problem is that it happened 20 DAYS IN A ROW in march seriously.... 20 days repeating everyday.
Every day of those 20 days I started the day winning. Yes... Winning a lot actually. But finished losing everything I won and Lost control. Playing more than 12 hours straight, not sleeping, etc. Terrible. For the first time in my life I felt like I had a hangover from poker, a huge burnout and had to stop playing because I felt disgusted from my actions and especially the way I tossed away money and time (12h+ in the day when I tilt like this), it took more than 1 month to regain the will to play poker again, but sadly it didn't stop. I still make this mistakes.

For example today:
I was winning like 9buy-ins in the day. I played for 5 hours in 3 sessions, was feeling really good. However my last session I honestly don't know how to explain what went wrong. I was gonna stop loss when I hit 3buy-ins. But in like 15 minutes I lost everything I grinded in the day. Yes, 5 hours of work I lost in 15 minutes, I don't even remember what happened.
Later on the night I meditated, and crushed a guy in headsup for 4buy-ins, I knew that I was gonna win, no questions.
At least I can breathe a little bit again, right? Doesn't feel so bad. But wow... I knew it was gonna happen...
I found him playing a little bit higher. And I HAD to give all the money back to him again. So today happened two times.



I had a borderline (or whatever the name, she cut herself from time to time) ex-girlfriend. And honestly it feels the same.
Makes me wanna cry, I don't recognize myself, feels like i'm hurting myself, making me suffer. It F*cks my health, I wanna break things.
I know my worst enemy is my own brain.
I don't hate the game or the other players, or having bad luck. I hate WHEN I DO THIS SHIT.


The cycle I mentioned has been repeating for years.
But sadly since my family lost our business, I have to live with my poker money. And it is affecting me a lot from the last 365 days.
I always loose a lot more than I win, because the lack of my self control.
The money I can make playing this game would be more than enough to have any life I want, but I never had the discipline to achieve.

The talks I had with my therapy sessions was that I do this to make me suffer and to make me feel like I don't deserve to achieve success, just like my family (they were really rich but bankrupted).
My family doesn't like that I play poker and by doing this mistakes that I wrote above, I keep myself under-achieved so they can be right.

It agonizes me to be drained in debt, but if I can put my head in place I can make a really good living with the game (without the tilts). I really crush the stakes I play, I discuss the game, study a lot, I do the math and review what I played. I know I can make huge profits playing this game. I just feel really bad doing this shit that I do, specially in a quarantine period where most people are without jobs. I can get what I want in my life with this game, but I can't live doing this things over and over, my health is terrible right now.
Alex Becker Youtube
 
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Einfamilienhaus

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The most problem we have are based on the lack of acceptance of the situation as it is. You do poker since years and your debts are growing. So you play more poker to make more money but instead you lose money. Your problem could be that you try to reach something that has nothing to do with poker and you use your gambling behaviour as a valve to escape from the reality.

How you tried to get in contact with people with the same situation like yours? You need someone who has truly been walked the same way as you do. In every city there are groups for people for every possible difficult life circumstances. You are not alone, even if your situation feels like the opposite. Other people have been through the same situation like you do and they also made it. You can too. You deserve to have a great life even if you have to work more for it than others but your rewards are going to be bigger than the others have.

Your family needs you the most right now but instead you try to help them in your surreal word of poker. Your family needs a strong son, father or husband right now. Sometimes we do things with good intentions but we receive the opposite effect. If you cant be strong for yourself then you should be for your family. Never let your family down. They are your small light in the pure darkness you feel. They need you. Come back to them.
 

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I have lots of experience with poker, from reading your post you sound like a degenerate gambler.

Winning players have good bankroll management, if you've been playing for 12 years and have no savings with debt, yes, you are a losing player. Ironically you highlighted in bold that you are a winning player, you are a fish with a little bit of luck. Please do yourself a favor and quit the game, focus on something else. I've had the same problem where I wasn't able to beat the game as well and decided to leave it behind.

#1 Drop the anti depressants, that crap is garbage and messing up your brain
#2 Realize you are a gambler chasing money

Players like you are preyed upon constantly by the elite, sadly I'm pretty sure you will just ignore my advice

I guess it's a good and bad thing, while you are busy ruining your life the real sharks are getting easy money from you, poker is all about taking a suckers money.

Winning 20 days in a row means nothing, large sample sizes are required to ''prove'' you are a winning poker player, I.E the usual average to realize true skill would be 100,000 cash game hands. Online that could be about a month of play if you are playing 12-24 tables multiple hours a day, although it's still common for good players to be on a breakeven stretch and possibly even lose. A great example is Dusty Scmidt, A.K.A leatherass from Pokerstars/Fulltilt, back in the day he was the #1 player around, and years ago he made a return only to be breakeven at mid stakes (200nl - 1knl) with 100k+ hand samples. Not sure if he is even playing anymore, but the point is even he could barely beat online, I looked at his profits for 100k samples and he made a few dollars, yes a few bucks. The actual #1 guy from back in the day with a failed comeback. Even at Micro stakes online people are using solvers and tons of software to help them ''win''

Online games are pretty dry atm, on Pokerstars right now there is a few dozen of the same people trading money away and barely making a profit, while there are a select few that still make some money, it is a million times over easier to make money with business (I am speaking with experience) Making money in entrepreneurship compared to poker is much more effortless and easier, and you have a higher potential for growth.

Now if you are playing live poker you are **** outta luck. I always find it hilarious when people claim they are live poker pros, with my expertise and understanding of the game & studying / playing with the greats, the people that play live are delusional gambling addicts that go on a short run of luck believing they are pokers next gift. A Pokerstars pro at microstakes posted up some graphs with a 10bb+/100 winrate with 6 figure hand samples and in that sample, there were MULTIPLE breakeven or even losing stretches of 20-30,000 hands.

For the live players, that is equivalent to playing for years potentially. At 30 hands per hour on average for a live game, take the 30 and x it by 1000, that's only 30,000 hands. Anything can happen in 30,000 hands (over a 1000 hour period)

1,000 hours / 6 months > = 166 hours, just above the average work week would be 41 hours of playing a week, remember the Pokerstars pro example? How can he be the best player and still post a losing graph at a 30k hand sample? (30k hands means nothing online) You could do it in a few days, the point is for playing at a casino where the amount of volume you can play is capped really is a hindrance. Again anyone that says they are a pro player at the casino is a delusional gambling addicted bum unless they are a fish on a heater that scored a few tournament runs for 6+ figures, straight up.

Even Nanonoko an online legend can't beat the higher stakes online. Right now there is 35 people playing 2/5 zoom on stars, I've played with these guys before and they are insanely good, I can't imagine playing higher up like 10/20 + where the field is even smaller.

Woo what a way to start the day, I feel like firing up a game... It has no effect on me whether or not you quit the game, but I'll tell you that with your mindset you are not cut out for this. Then again, since I'm 99% sure you will just ignore everything I said, the way the poker economy works is people like you that tilt of cash to the gto nits online (or the nits that play live) So regardless of your decision you either benefit yourself or others.

Enough poker talk, lets talk about something more fun than poker, creating a business. What can you start with today? Let's provide some value to people in the form of services of products, get compensated for it, and then after making lots of value vouchers, you can become the big whale (which is what I would rather be) and sit at the highstakes table 50k+ triple barrelling all the pros off top pair.

Do yourself a favor and quit, or at the very least make it a hobby on the side to enjoy. Cheers

This is what I was going to say. The OP thinks he’s a winning player. But he’s not. He’s winning due to variance. Guys crush him after they learn his tendencies which takes a few days or weeks. See example of him meeting the same guy at higher stakes.

OP should post his graph and stats.

OP also seems to play poker with too much emotion.
 

ChrisV

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if you've been playing for 12 years and have no savings with debt, yes, you are a losing player.
Wait.. but do we know that his debt is from Gambling? The way I read it it sounded like his debt was from elsewhere.

Sadly I have lots of debts because of a family and business problem, I have to pay money loans (which is a few months behind).

It doesn't sound like his debt is from gambling.

Now that being said...

The cycle I mentioned has been repeating for years.
But sadly since my family lost our business, I have to live with my poker money. And it is affecting me a lot from the last 365 days.
I always loose a lot more than I win, because the lack of my self control.
The money I can make playing this game would be more than enough to have any life I want, but I never had the discipline to achieve.

Dude, you have a gambling problem. You lose more than you win. There are random elements to playing poker and duh you're gonna win some hands. You see yourself win some hands (which is probably due to random luck) and you're like "if I could only do that more and the other thing less, I'd make so much money!" and you sound like every other guy in Vegas losing their shirts.

I'm not sure why you're posting hardcore gambling threads to this forum, this is an Entrepreneurship forum. You need to be writing this message on a Gambler's anonymous forum or something, or see my thread on addictions


Gambling gives you a squirt of dopamine and if you could get the dopamine problem under control you'd automatically get the gambling problem under control.
 
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Kevin88660

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I think the problem is not so much about being a losing player, but recognising that zero sum game is not a business, is it strategically and fundamentally deeply flawed way of making money.

Extremely gifted and lucky and hardworking players who can make a living from zero sum games such as poker/stock forex trading largely built a fan base and make money from other coaching, selling “shovels” and milking money from publicity. They deeply understand that how difficult it is after being profitable (which itself is rare to begin with).

The good news is that if you can survive ten years with that, business is going to be a lot easier.
 

gallagher99

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Thanks for all the answers guys.

I'm not playing on poker stars.
I play mostly on PPPoker (local clubs) or PokerBros on american club.
I play mostly PLO5 cards $1/$2,$ 2/$4 or $3/$6. But I already played $5/$10, $10/$20 and $15/$30 when table was good (and I had bankroll). I play mostly heads-up and 6max (vpip tables)

My debts doesn't come from poker, it was from a family business that pretty much got out of hand.

32900
32901
32902

some random graph when I did a good mental week:
32903

> rakeback not included (which is a lot)
> live games not included obviously.
> MTT not included
> other softwares like pokerbros not included.
> that winrate has all those meltdown I had in the past 2 years, so I can pretty much increase A LOT the profit.
> I have already bigger winrate than this picture, since it was taken in february.

I know that sample size is not enough, nor the graph is complete or updated.
In my opinion $0.01/$0.02 on PokerStars is more difficult than $1/$2 on the PPPoker mostly. LOL


I just wanted to address that the reason I lose is because of my mental game, my self sabotage... And if possible we should focus on that and not on whether I can win money or not by playing poker.

At the time I wrote the topic I was in the middle of a mental crisis and was a bit emotional.
And since English is not my mainly language I didn't explained the way I wanted.
 
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gallagher99

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This is what I was going to say. The OP thinks he’s a winning player. But he’s not. He’s winning due to variance. Guys crush him after they learn his tendencies which takes a few days or weeks. See example of him meeting the same guy at higher stakes.

OP should post his graph and stats.

OP also seems to play poker with too much emotion.


The example of the high stakes guy was because the loop repeated:

> I win $
> I should stop the session, but I can't
> I KNOW that I'll lose money if I play.
> I continue to play and make me suffer.
> I play terribly bad
> I lose everything that I won in the day.
> Try to fight back
> It is not enough
> Lose more than I should have, and didn't use my stop loss.

It is not about the guy learning my tendencies, he had about 80% vpip or whatever.
Honestly 95% of the time it is because of my terrible decisions.
 
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sparechange

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7,000 hands lol. That's 1 day of playing online, you are just a delusional fish.

Enjoy dumping the bankroll

32904
 

Andy Black

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Please chat with a professional to check you’re not suffering from an addiction.

I wonder if you’re currently only motivated when the tiger is chasing you. When you outrun the tiger you slow down to let it catch up so you can get motivated again.

Being motivated only when something is chasing you isn’t ideal. It’s better to be motivated by something in front of you that draws you forward.

I get comfortable all the time and, like everyone, I’ll spring into action if revenue gets too low. My own hack to keep me moving forward when there’s no tiger chasing me is to think of helping other people. If I don’t do XYZ then I’m doing people a disservice and other people will suffer.

I also love what I do, which helps of course. I can’t NOT do what I do. Is there anything other than poker that you’re drawn towards, and that you can’t NOT do?

Maybe the second radio interview in my signature might help?
 
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Deleted78083

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Honestly buddy, there are times when it is good to go and see a professional therapist that can help you, not some random strangers on an entrepreneurship forum, especially if you "truly need help". It may be gambling addiction, it may be low self-confidence, low self-esteem, I have no clue, I don't know you and I am not a therapist, neither of us are.


I myself followed a cognitive behavioral therapy for 2 years and half and i wouldn't be here if I hadn't. Good luck! : )
 
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gallagher99

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7,000 hands lol. That's 1 day of playing online, you are just a delusional fish.

Enjoy dumping the bankroll

View attachment 32904

I just posted whatever I found in my cellphone.
I didn't know you guys expected a full report on my poker life (since 08) to check if i'm lying or not.
Yes you are probably better than I am, I make thousands of mistakes, whatever.
But in the end I'm a lucrative player, just take my words.

The point is not if I can make money playing poker or not.
The point is when I burn money by what I assume is self sabotage.


I'll read all the answers tomorrow. Thanks guys.
 

drpeppehr

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“I just wanted to address that the reason I lose is because of my mental game, my self sabotage... And if possible we should focus on that and not on whether I can win money or not by playing poker.”

No dude, you lose because poker isn’t soley based on your skill, there’s other factors like luck. It’s cool you’ve won sometimes but dude have some self awareness, you’re seriously addicted to gambling.
 

sparechange

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I just posted whatever I found in my cellphone.
I didn't know you guys expected a full report on my poker life (since 08) to check if i'm lying or not.
Yes you are probably better than I am, I make thousands of mistakes, whatever.
But in the end I'm a lucrative player, just take my words.

The point is not if I can make money playing poker or not.
The point is when I burn money by what I assume is self sabotage.


I'll read all the answers tomorrow. Thanks guys.

You have no savings, and play from 08. You are insane! That is 12 years of playing, and you have no savings!!?

People like you are the reason games run. Do yourself and walk away and enjoy poker as a hobby.
 
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Last edited:

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I can get what I want in my life with this game, but I can't live doing this things over and over, my health is terrible right now.

1. You will not get what you want in life with this game. You have done it for 12 years - didn't get you where you want to be. Time to adapt and quit playing for a living.

2. This is unpopular around here, but I think for you it might be the right advice: Get a job. One that covers your expenses and the debt you have to pay. This will provide you with some security and structure. As you might already know from therapy - structure and something to rely on is important when feeling depressed. Choose something that keeps you busy, so you don't have time to think too much.

3. Start exercising and eat healthy - this will also help feeling less depressed, keeps you busy and lays a better foundation for your mental state. Also you train your self discipline muscles.

4. Help others - volunteer somewhere. Again less time to think depressing thoughts. You'll build confidence and feel needed. And might put you into perspective that others have it much worse than you.

5. If you have fixed all this - in a year or so, you can start again to persuit your dreams with entrepreneurship, with some good habits and confidence in the backpack. In the state you're in right now, you won't stand a chance. Build yourself up first.
 

Andy Black

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1. You will not get what you want in life with this game. You have done it for 12 years - didn't get you where you want to be. Time to adapt and quit playing for a living.

2. This is unpopular around here, but I think for you it might be the right advice: Get a job. One that covers your expenses and the debt you have to pay. This will provide you with some security and structure. As you might already know from therapy - structure and something to rely on is important when feeling depressed. Choose something that keeps you busy, so you don't have time to think too much.

3. Start exercising and eat healthy - this will also help feeling less depressed, keeps you busy and lays a better foundation for your mental state. Also you train your self discipline muscles.

4. Help others - volunteer somewhere. Again less time to think depressing thoughts. You'll build confidence and feel needed. And might put you into perspective that others have it much worse than you.

5. If you have fixed all this - in a year or so, you can start again to persuit your dreams with entrepreneurship, with some good habits and confidence in the backpack. In the state you're in right now, you won't stand a chance. Build yourself up first.
Agreed with all your points. Well said.

This is unpopular around here, but I think for you it might be the right advice: Get a job.
That's actually not unpopular around here. MJ and others have often said the best route for someone is to get a job and take it from there.
 

ZCP

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The ZCP Challenge:
DO something different. Change it up. Eat different stuff. Hang out with different people. Do different things. Make it a 2 week physical / mental / spiritual / business bath in OTHER stimuli.

Put a 1/2 day a week into intense reading and study. Doesn't matter the topic. Use it to load the brain for the week. (I do mine on Saturday mornings).

Get your sleep and diet right. It's two weeks. You can do it!

Then sit down and write out what you want to do, your outcome, what matters to you.
Report back and tell us the three things you will do to MAKE THAT HAPPEN.

You got this!!
 
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Online games are pretty dry atm

As a long time winning online poker professional that also stakes a variety of players and runs an affiliate company so I see average player volume per month for different sites, I guarantee you you are using outdated info here. During quarantine these games are the best they have been in the last decade and it's not close. There's a second poker boom going on right now. If OP can't win during this time period then he shouldn't be doing this for a living full stop.

Things that stuck out to me as I teach a lot of people the soft skills necessary to succeed:
OP should use more restrictive bankroll management
OP should play sessions no longer than 30 minutes each
OP should make sure he exercises regularly and spends time away from screens to rejuvenate
OP should consistently and repeatedly exercise positive mental thinking by verbalizing the opposite of any negative thoughts that drift into his stream of consciousness. E.g. "80-20 i'm obv losing this since I'm running so bad; lost another flip no duh I never win in this game; what a luckbox how do I lose to these guys" etc. If you first acknowledge and then speak out loud to yourself to correct these negative repetitive thought processes, within 2-3 weeks your overall mental health and positivity when grinding will improve dramatically and the results will follow.
OP should spend roughly 30% of his poker time studying using a subscription like Runitonce essential vids (disclaimer: i'm a runitonce elite coach now but also learned from that material to get where I am now so I am super supportive of its usage).
OP shouldn't take $$ out of his bankroll for as long as he possibly can to allow him to responsibly raise his average BB and increase his yield from his efforts for a sustained period of time before taking $$ out for life purposes.

If OP listens and makes these adjustments, I think he'll see a world of difference. GL

Also p.s. if you actually have a legit gambling addiction you're drawing stone dead to being successful long term and should run not walk away to do yourself and your family a favor. I find many players with the hard/technical skills don't have the soft skills either emotionally, psychologically or from a business POV to make it as a pro poker player. That doesn't mean they necessarily have a gambling addiction although that is one flavor of the failure to have sufficient soft skills that inevitably leads to failure.
 

sparechange

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A poker coach & staker + an ''online winning poker professional''

You are probably just another broke bum looking to sell some crap
 

Numismatist

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First of all you are running an affilate program which is hilarious, and no I'm not out of date, winning player online? I'd bet you are a bum that plays microstakes, y
There is 35 people on 2/5 zoom right now
A poker coach & staker + an ''online winning poker professional''

You are probably just another broke bum looking to sell some crap

I actually run an affiliate platform == a site where other people can become subaffiliates under us. I've played 500-2k plo for the last few years and made over 150/hr since then so sorry, no not a microstakes bum.
500z is a bad measurement for the heartbeat of online poker. Have you seen party poker, gg poker, chico or bodog's games? They are exploding, we saw a 40% increase in rake driven the first month after corona started. That also fails to capture that app games have also exploded with many club operators making mid six figures monthly off of their high rake structures and revolving door of players looking for somewhere to play since live games have all stopped.

I wouldn't ever stake this guy and I definitely don't want money from him, I was giving him the legitimate advice that I pass on to my own players. He really should listen and try to implement, it would help him a lot.
 
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