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WEB SCHOOL Some questions about web design

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TonyStark

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I don’t think it’s weird to want to see some of Fox’s websites. Everyone should be skeptical of people trying to sell you products over the internet. OP has a genuine curiosity of the quality of the product. Especially if he is going to drop 1K on a “web design course”, I’m sure he wants to know the quality of websites he will be learning to build.
 

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LaneMan

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Spam bots will typically automatically submit the contact form knowing the website. That doesn't work on mine.

In addition, I get around 5-10 emails of spam per day anyway, I don't care. They automatically go to spam, since my email client is set up that way.

But you know those antiquated, old businessmen how they are... they're not like us younger people. They get a spam message and freak out. So they don't like it and don't know how to deal with it.


Sure, every day I get requests for people looking for a copywriting job, web design services, SEO, people pointing that this link or that link is broken on the website, don't you want to replace it with my article and on and on.

I'm sure that if someone has $10k to spend on a website, they have a secretary or some other person to manage their communications.

On a side note, I read your landing page but I don't understand a word about what you're selling. I'll have to learn more about this sales funnels business.
 

LaneMan

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I've sold an $8,000+ website using Fox's course. It was the second website I ever sold. A wordpress template.

The site has been modified at least three times by others and looks nothing like what I delivered. Also, I am not a web designer and I haven't tried to sell any other websites since.

The company makes $50k to $100k+ on every sale they earn. So dropping $8k+ on a website wasn't a big deal for them.

That said, I don't consider myself representative of the status quo and I have experience selling other high-ticket items.

I don't doubt that a lot of people have taken his course but I'm afraid I don't trust testimonials. They definitely help but I need to see concrete work before making a purchase.

I don’t think it’s weird to want to see some of Fox’s websites. Everyone should be skeptical of people trying to sell you products over the internet. OP has a genuine curiosity of the quality of the product. Especially if he is going to drop 1K on a “web design course”, I’m sure he wants to know the quality of websites he will be learning to build.

Finally, someone who hasn't sold his soul to the system.
 

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I don't doubt that a lot of people have taken his course but I'm afraid I don't trust testimonials. They definitely help but I need to see concrete work before making a purchase.



Finally, someone who hasn't sold his soul to the system.

The work isn't going to change anything for you. If you can sell a high-ticket item using the material, then you can. If you don't have it in you, then you can't and it won't matter how good Fox's websites or training are. Some people have it. Some people don't. The sale of an expensive website has nothing to do with the quality of past websites you've built and everything to do with your mindset and how well you apply the tools at your disposal.
 

Lex DeVille

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Something else to consider is that the sale happens before the website is built, not after. Portfolio items represent delivered materials for a given client. They do not represent the client's reasons for buying. For example, my website was sold without showing a portfolio at all (because I didn't have one). A portfolio is not necessary for closing high-ticket sales. The ability to sell is necessary for high-ticket sales.
 

TonyStark

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From experience, I think his courses and groups are very sales based. At least from what I remember. It’s been a while, but everyone used Wordpress. Lol
 

LaneMan

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Something else to consider is that the sale happens before the website is built, not after. Portfolio items represent delivered materials for a given client. They do not represent the client's reasons for buying. For example, my website was sold without showing a portfolio at all (because I didn't have one). A portfolio is not necessary for closing high-ticket sales. The ability to sell is necessary for high-ticket sales.

He said he's able to charge a ton of money because his sites increase the client's sales. That's why I want to see what kinda sites he's been building.

Also, portfolios are very important imo. The only time a portfolio isn't important is when you have a very rich and naive prospect who doesn't care about losing money. It takes a lot of time to find these kind of prospects.
 

Black_Dragon43

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Something else to consider is that the sale happens before the website is built, not after. Portfolio items represent delivered materials for a given client. They do not represent the client's reasons for buying. For example, my website was sold without showing a portfolio at all (because I didn't have one). A portfolio is not necessary for closing high-ticket sales. The ability to sell is necessary for high-ticket sales.
This is not entirely true. What if they ask for clients you've worked with/for before and examples of websites you've built? Sure, you could always lie, but we're talking about doing it fairly I suppose. And you could always try to defuse the objection --> "Portfolio?" "Yes, we'd like to see what you can do", "Right, so what exactly are you interested to see?" "Oh we'd like to see the useability of the website, and how easy it is for users to navigate" "So when I create my websites..." (and you go off a tangent answering their 'real' objection)

These tricks can SOMETIMES work, but if the client wants to see a portfolio, then he wants to see it, and ultimately if that's a condition for him before he starts, you won't talk him out of it.

If you don't have it in you, then you can't and it won't matter how good Fox's websites or training are. Some people have it. Some people don't. The sale of an expensive website has nothing to do with the quality of past websites you've built and everything to do with your mindset and how well you apply the tools at your disposal.
This is outright false. It's not about having anything within you. It's about finding the right clients - prospecting. If you're talking with haircutter Joe, you could have the greatest mindset in the world, and the best tools, you won't get that guy to hand you over $10K for his website, end of story. I don't care if you're the best salesman in the world, it ain't gonna happen. Sales skills only take you so far.

Like in your own case, those guys were making $10K/sale. They didn't give a rat's a$$ if you made a terrible website (which it may have been granted they had to re-do it over 3 times).

I've sold funnels for as much as 25K -> NOTHING to do with persuasion skills imo, and everything to do with finding the right people to talk to - people who have the money, who are already thinking to do it, who can benefit from it, etc. These people are already convinced... it's sufficient to tell them, and they want to do it. What convincing are we talking about here?

It's like saying that the preacher who cons people into talking in tongues is a "great" salesman. He doesn't actually do anything... he just finds people already pre-disposed to act in a certain way, identifies them, and the prods them along a little. Imo, that's not what great persuasion is about.
 

Raja

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So many limiting beliefs in so few posts.
he started great, by asking the question of his curiosity.
after that, it turned into Belief perseverance.

I don't want to blame op as I would have done the same but he should have dm fox first.

@Fox do you want to end it by single reply
 

DayIFly

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This looks like the shiny object syndrome. I think that at some point you have to stop this. Read Unscripted and really work your way through it, don't think you can skip chapters, you need to really think about it, take notes, make checklists, and be honest with yourself, i.e. you need to really process it in your head in some way and then apply the principles. Don't underestimate the "you have to think about your thinking"-part.

I wouldn't buy any courses, especially not if your whole business is then dependent on "some method" or whatnot. I know it's not easy and you want the money now, but you'll simply waste your time and in a year's time you'll be in the same position as now. You'll need to buy books and look for information on a problem-by-problem basis, and not some turnkey, ready-for-you, play-by-numbers manual. I don't know if Fox's system is legit, I don't even care, really, but you need to get your priorities straight and you need to be ready in your head. Don't get distracted is what I mean essentially.
 

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Jon L

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Seeing Fox's websites won't get you what you want. A website can look pretty and sound nice, but may not convert. An ugly website might convert like crazy.

Check out the original POF.com website. It was ugly as sin. Profile pictures weren't even sized correctly. They were forced into a standard box, and squished accordingly. But, the guy that made it took home millions per year in profits. Craigslist seems to be doing ok, too. I know a local website here that is not at all attractive, but sells an absolute ton of stuff. It was redone a year ago, from the ground up, by an expert marketer. Prior to the redo, it was just as ugly, but didn't convert.

What you need to see on high performing/expensive websites is how well they sell.
 

Black_Dragon43

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Seeing Fox's websites won't get you what you want. A website can look pretty and sound nice, but may not convert. An ugly website might convert like crazy.

Check out the original POF.com website. It was ugly as sin. Profile pictures weren't even sized correctly. They were forced into a standard box, and squished accordingly. But, the guy that made it took home millions per year in profits. Craigslist seems to be doing ok, too. I know a local website here that is not at all attractive, but sells an absolute ton of stuff. It was redone a year ago, from the ground up, by an expert marketer. Prior to the redo, it was just as ugly, but didn't convert.

What you need to see on high performing/expensive websites is how well they sell.
A very unsettling result I have often come across is that when ugly websites are made beautiful, they lose their selling power

A strange result, but one that I have often seen, including on my own websites. Ugly sometimes implies authentic.
 

Fox

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I watched his interview with a big agency called A Nerd's World and it got me interested in the $2000 web school course that claims to have a ROI of $100k.

The agency charges $1k for Wordpress sites but Fox claims to charge $10K for websites that are much simpler but supposedly has some copywriting and stuff to increase the client's conversions.

The problem is, I haven't seen any of Fox's websites and I don't see any links to them. Where are these legendary websites?

I usually don't link to websites cause it just attracts a few weird people who go "Jason Bourne" on my business. While you might want to just check things out there are other people who will call clients, send them YT links, annoy them for weeks etc.

I am sure anyone who has a real business has experienced this before - the internet is a crazy place and personal info you put out isn't so easy to take back.

The much better way to do this is to apply for the school, get on a call, and then ask for a bunch of links. At least then we know who you are and can feel better about sending client info/websites.

What is ironic is usually these requests come from people with zero real online presence themselves - randomusername909@yahoo.com wants all my past clients info and site links or else it has to be all fake. I see where most are coming from but on my side of the fence it is just a big request when I got nothing to tell me who this person is and what they really want.

If you reach out to me on FB or IG and I can see you are a real person usually I will send links. Or if you have been on this forum for a while and dm me instead of asking on a thread.
---

As for the school itself here you go:


Or check the reviews on the thread itself:


The 100k figure is based on top students like @GuitarManDan and @GoodluckChuck who are making around 100k or more per year. As with any program this is no guarantees but we do everything we can to help you get there. The main focus though isn't to make as much as you can with web design - it is to use web design to develop skills and fund bigger ventures.

Also just on a side note we have a lot of members from this forum drop in to help teach and outside experts too like Chris from a Nerds World and Ben Burns from The Futur.
 

Raja

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Seeing Fox's websites won't get you what you want. A website can look pretty and sound nice, but may not convert. An ugly website might convert like crazy.

Check out the original POF.com website. It was ugly as sin. Profile pictures weren't even sized correctly. They were forced into a standard box, and squished accordingly. But, the guy that made it took home millions per year in profits. Craigslist seems to be doing ok, too. I know a local website here that is not at all attractive, but sells an absolute ton of stuff. It was redone a year ago, from the ground up, by an expert marketer. Prior to the redo, it was just as ugly, but didn't convert.

What you need to see on high performing/expensive websites is how well they sell.
what's is the conclusion?
 

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what's is the conclusion?

What looks good and what actually get results aren't always the same thing.

...and if you got to pick one focus on what actually matters to the business at the end of the day.
 

LaneMan

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This looks like the shiny object syndrome. I think that at some point you have to stop this. Read Unscripted and really work your way through it, don't think you can skip chapters, you need to really think about it, take notes, make checklists, and be honest with yourself, i.e. you need to really process it in your head in some way and then apply the principles. Don't underestimate the "you have to think about your thinking"-part.

I wouldn't buy any courses, especially not if your whole business is then dependent on "some method" or whatnot. I know it's not easy and you want the money now, but you'll simply waste your time and in a year's time you'll be in the same position as now. You'll need to buy books and look for information on a problem-by-problem basis, and not some turnkey, ready-for-you, play-by-numbers manual. I don't know if Fox's system is legit, I don't even care, really, but you need to get your priorities straight and you need to be ready in your head. Don't get distracted is what I mean essentially.

If a course shows potential then I don't see why I shouldn't invest on it.

Seeing Fox's websites won't get you what you want. A website can look pretty and sound nice, but may not convert. An ugly website might convert like crazy.

Check out the original POF.com website. It was ugly as sin. Profile pictures weren't even sized correctly. They were forced into a standard box, and squished accordingly. But, the guy that made it took home millions per year in profits. Craigslist seems to be doing ok, too. I know a local website here that is not at all attractive, but sells an absolute ton of stuff. It was redone a year ago, from the ground up, by an expert marketer. Prior to the redo, it was just as ugly, but didn't convert.

What you need to see on high performing/expensive websites is how well they sell.

That's why I asked to see the websites so that I can understand what he's doing differently to make them convert well.

I usually don't link to websites cause it just attracts a few weird people who go "Jason Bourne" on my business. While you might want to just check things out there are other people who will call clients, send them YT links, annoy them for weeks etc.

Fair enough and thanks for DMing me your stuff.
 

PapaGang

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What looks good and what actually get results aren't always the same thing.

...and if you got to pick one focus on what actually matters to the business at the end of the day.
Agreed. I've found the best paying clients pay me because of the business the website gives them. They aren't designers, they don't care that much about looks, as long as it makes money for them.

The gold standard is to have a site that visually provides them with credibility and makes them look slightly better than they really are as a company (good design), while providing them with qualified leads that convert to sales.
 

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I usually don't link to websites cause it just attracts a few weird people who go "Jason Bourne" on my business. While you might want to just check things out there are other people who will call clients, send them YT links, annoy them for weeks etc.

I am sure anyone who has a real business has experienced this before - the internet is a crazy place and personal info you put out isn't so easy to take back.

The much better way to do this is to apply for the school, get on a call, and then ask for a bunch of links. At least then we know who you are and can feel better about sending client info/websites.

What is ironic is usually these requests come from people with zero real online presence themselves - randomusername909@yahoo.com wants all my past clients info and site links or else it has to be all fake. I see where most are coming from but on my side of the fence it is just a big request when I got nothing to tell me who this person is and what they really want.

If you reach out to me on FB or IG and I can see you are a real person usually I will send links. Or if you have been on this forum for a while and dm me instead of asking on a thread.
---

As for the school itself here you go:


Or check the reviews on the thread itself:


The 100k figure is based on top students like @GuitarManDan and @GoodluckChuck who are making around 100k or more per year. As with any program this is no guarantees but we do everything we can to help you get there. The main focus though isn't to make as much as you can with web design - it is to use web design to develop skills and fund bigger ventures.

Also just on a side note we have a lot of members from this forum drop in to help teach and outside experts too like Chris from a Nerds World and Ben Burns the The Futur.

Excellent way of handling this.
I don't go around posting all of my client work either.
 

Wil22

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I watched his interview with a big agency called A Nerd's World and it got me interested in the $2000 web school course that claims to have a ROI of $100k.

The agency charges $1k for Wordpress sites but Fox claims to charge $10K for websites that are much simpler but supposedly has some copywriting and stuff to increase the client's conversions.

The problem is, I haven't seen any of Fox's websites and I don't see any links to them. Where are these legendary websites?

I assume you already asked for a list of 3-4 people who bought the training and continue to show success?
 

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I don’t think it’s weird to want to see some of Fox’s websites. Everyone should be skeptical of people trying to sell you products over the internet. OP has a genuine curiosity of the quality of the product. Especially if he is going to drop 1K on a “web design course”, I’m sure he wants to know the quality of websites he will be learning to build.

Ya I agree. I sent him a PM with the links and we got it sorted.
 

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''sent a PM'' :rofl:
 

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The school is obviously real so a rather odd thing to ask.

The larger sales will not be down to the sites*, so seeing them wouldn't help you. (*Within reason)

They will be down to client selection.

Cristiano Ronaldo's physiotherapist will be no more qualified than mine and if we both had an ACL injury the treatment would be the same.

The difference in income would be down to the client.

Does that make sense?

I would suspect the major benefit to the school is to get you to raise your thinking game.

Dan
 

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I saw Fox's own website with his portfolio on it years ago. I also remember when he had to start mentioning to people not to contact those in his portfolio, then eventually take the whole thing down.
 
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Menery

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I don't believe there's anything wrong in asking for proof when someone makes bold claims.

Neither do I. its a justified question to ask if you are making a purchase decision.
 

Menery

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A very unsettling result I have often come across is that when ugly websites are made beautiful, they lose their selling power

A strange result, but one that I have often seen, including on my own websites. Ugly sometimes implies authentic.
 

Bekit

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Based on your line of questioning, I suspect that you're looking for the wrong thing. If you look in the right place for the wrong thing, you could end up missing the real thing that would have helped you.

Shark's Teeth vs. Diamonds
A few years back, I went with some relatives to a place called Westmoreland State Park, where there are a ton of fossilized shark's teeth that you can find on the beach.

They're hard to spot at first. I remember feeling frustrated as I would stare at a section of the beach. It just looked like pebbles and sand to me. And then one of my cousins would reach down and pick up three shark's teeth from the exact spot where I had been looking for the last 10 minutes.

However, gradually, you get better at finding them. Once you've found a few, it's as if your brain expands. Suddenly, you can scan the ground and your brain instantly spots the unique shapes that match what you're looking for. Once this happens, you find them much faster.

The flip side of this is the fact that when you're looking for shark's teeth, you stop noticing ANYTHING else.

There could be gold or diamonds on the beach, but because your brain is scanning for shark's teeth, you're going to miss them.

Shark's teeth are great, and the really big ones are fun to find, but there's not much you can do with them except glue them to a piece of cardboard and frame them and put them on the wall. Whoopee.

Now imagine that you go to Crater of Diamonds State Park. But let's say you're still looking for shark's teeth.

Not only are you not going to find any shark's teeth, you're for sure going to miss the diamonds.

You're in the right place for a diamond. A diamond could be life-changing.

(I randomly saw an article about a guy who found a 9-carat diamond there 5 days ago. Super cool.)

But if the "pattern match" setting in your brain was calibrated for shark's teeth... bummer.


So here's where it seems to me like you are looking for the "wrong thing."

The agency charges $1k for Wordpress sites but Fox claims to charge $10K for websites that are much simpler but supposedly has some copywriting and stuff to increase the client's conversions.

The problem is, I haven't seen any of Fox's websites and I don't see any links to them. Where are these legendary websites?
I just want some examples of websites he made that provided massive value to his clients. I don't believe there's anything wrong in asking for proof when someone makes bold claims.
My goal for this thread is go get a few example sites that Fox sold for $10K and where the client made massive sales as a result. So far it's all been said and written in words without anything concrete being shown.
I need to see concrete work before making a purchase.
He said he's able to charge a ton of money because his sites increase the client's sales. That's why I want to see what kinda sites he's been building.
That's why I asked to see the websites so that I can understand what he's doing differently to make them convert well.

You can correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you want to see examples of the websites because you want to reverse engineer them. You want to see what's different about them compared to a basic site.

Maybe you can't fathom how a site could possibly charge $10k. Maybe you're picturing in your head that somehow, people "charge $10K for websites that are much simpler but supposedly has some copywriting and stuff to increase the client's conversions." Maybe it seems to you like some sort of trick.

So you don't feel like you can make a decision to enroll unless you can see examples of the work.

Now - there's nothing wrong with wondering, "Hey, what's the difference between a site that sells and provides value versus a site that doesn't?" That's a great question.

But you don't need Fox's examples to be able to decipher that. You don't need to enroll in anything. You don't need to pay anything.

All you need to do is go to clickbank, look at their offers that are converting the best, and study the best-performing ones.

Or look at companies that are advertising heavily over a prolonged time period, and study their landing pages. (Because no advertiser will continue to pour money into ads unless they're getting more money than they're spending. i.e. They're selling a lot.) Then, compare those landing pages to a few "average" or "typical" sites in the same industry.

You can get a ton of insight doing this, and it's a great exercise.

But let's cut to the chase: if you're subconsciously thinking to yourself, "If I can only decipher what makes a high-converting website, then I'll be able to make great money as a web designer," you're looking for the wrong thing.

You're looking for a shark's tooth in the crater of diamonds.

Because here's the thing.

The ability to make good money as a web designer doesn't start with knowing that you can build a high-converting website.

It starts with your potential client believing that you can solve a problem for them and agreeing to pay your asking rate.

In other words, it starts with your ability to...
  • Identify that potential client
  • Get in front of that potential client
  • Sell your services to that potential client
And to be good at all that, you have to...
  • Think like a business owner
  • Know how to solve problems, create value, and sell results (not just build websites)
  • Have the outreach skills to get a hearing and close the deal
  • Have the mindset and habits to support your efforts
This is what Lex was talking about when he said,

The sale of an expensive website has nothing to do with the quality of past websites you've built and everything to do with your mindset and how well you apply the tools at your disposal.
Something else to consider is that the sale happens before the website is built, not after. Portfolio items represent delivered materials for a given client. They do not represent the client's reasons for buying. For example, my website was sold without showing a portfolio at all (because I didn't have one). A portfolio is not necessary for closing high-ticket sales. The ability to sell is necessary for high-ticket sales.

But your ability to sell, at the end of the day, will be mostly inside your head. No one will be able to link to it. It'll be stuff like...
  • Do you decide to procrastinate because of fear? Or do you decide to go ahead and call that business owner?
  • Do you decide to quit when you face rejection? Or do you keep iterating and refining your pitch until you close a deal?
  • Do you know how to keep your pipeline full so that you always have work?
  • Do you know how to get inside the mind of your client's customer so that they want to buy?
  • Do you have the skills to keep your prospect listening and interested in what you're saying?
  • Do you have the discipline and the habits to manage your time and do the activities that move the needle?
Fox Web School won't be able to create a portfolio of the sales skill they impart to their students. But what they can do is point to the fact that their students are making good money by following the program. And they do that.

At the end of the day, if all you're looking for is, "What's the difference between a site that sells and provides value versus a site that doesn't," I'm sure you'll find that. And you don't need to join a program to figure that out.

But if what you really want is the ability to make good money in web design, just looking at the sites in Fox's portfolio is not going to get you there.

Seeing Fox's websites won't get you what you want.
^^ A shorter way of saying everything above.

I would suspect the major benefit to the school is to get you to raise your thinking game.
^^This
 

Raja

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Based on your line of questioning, I suspect that you're looking for the wrong thing. If you look in the right place for the wrong thing, you could end up missing the real thing that would have helped you.

Shark's Teeth vs. Diamonds
A few years back, I went with some relatives to a place called Westmoreland State Park, where there are a ton of fossilized shark's teeth that you can find on the beach.

They're hard to spot at first. I remember feeling frustrated as I would stare at a section of the beach. It just looked like pebbles and sand to me. And then one of my cousins would reach down and pick up three shark's teeth from the exact spot where I had been looking for the last 10 minutes.

However, gradually, you get better at finding them. Once you've found a few, it's as if your brain expands. Suddenly, you can scan the ground and your brain instantly spots the unique shapes that match what you're looking for. Once this happens, you find them much faster.

The flip side of this is the fact that when you're looking for shark's teeth, you stop noticing ANYTHING else.

There could be gold or diamonds on the beach, but because your brain is scanning for shark's teeth, you're going to miss them.

Shark's teeth are great, and the really big ones are fun to find, but there's not much you can do with them except glue them to a piece of cardboard and frame them and put them on the wall. Whoopee.

Now imagine that you go to Crater of Diamonds State Park. But let's say you're still looking for shark's teeth.

Not only are you not going to find any shark's teeth, you're for sure going to miss the diamonds.

You're in the right place for a diamond. A diamond could be life-changing.

(I randomly saw an article about a guy who found a 9-carat diamond there 5 days ago. Super cool.)

But if the "pattern match" setting in your brain was calibrated for shark's teeth... bummer.


So here's where it seems to me like you are looking for the "wrong thing."








You can correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you want to see examples of the websites because you want to reverse engineer them. You want to see what's different about them compared to a basic site.

Maybe you can't fathom how a site could possibly charge $10k. Maybe you're picturing in your head that somehow, people "charge $10K for websites that are much simpler but supposedly has some copywriting and stuff to increase the client's conversions." Maybe it seems to you like some sort of trick.

So you don't feel like you can make a decision to enroll unless you can see examples of the work.

Now - there's nothing wrong with wondering, "Hey, what's the difference between a site that sells and provides value versus a site that doesn't?" That's a great question.

But you don't need Fox's examples to be able to decipher that. You don't need to enroll in anything. You don't need to pay anything.

All you need to do is go to clickbank, look at their offers that are converting the best, and study the best-performing ones.

Or look at companies that are advertising heavily over a prolonged time period, and study their landing pages. (Because no advertiser will continue to pour money into ads unless they're getting more money than they're spending. i.e. They're selling a lot.) Then, compare those landing pages to a few "average" or "typical" sites in the same industry.

You can get a ton of insight doing this, and it's a great exercise.

But let's cut to the chase: if you're subconsciously thinking to yourself, "If I can only decipher what makes a high-converting website, then I'll be able to make great money as a web designer," you're looking for the wrong thing.

You're looking for a shark's tooth in the crater of diamonds.

Because here's the thing.

The ability to make good money as a web designer doesn't start with knowing that you can build a high-converting website.

It starts with your potential client believing that you can solve a problem for them and agreeing to pay your asking rate.

In other words, it starts with your ability to...
  • Identify that potential client
  • Get in front of that potential client
  • Sell your services to that potential client
And to be good at all that, you have to...
  • Think like a business owner
  • Know how to solve problems, create value, and sell results (not just build websites)
  • Have the outreach skills to get a hearing and close the deal
  • Have the mindset and habits to support your efforts
This is what Lex was talking about when he said,




But your ability to sell, at the end of the day, will be mostly inside your head. No one will be able to link to it. It'll be stuff like...
  • Do you decide to procrastinate because of fear? Or do you decide to go ahead and call that business owner?
  • Do you decide to quit when you face rejection? Or do you keep iterating and refining your pitch until you close a deal?
  • Do you know how to keep your pipeline full so that you always have work?
  • Do you know how to get inside the mind of your client's customer so that they want to buy?
  • Do you have the skills to keep your prospect listening and interested in what you're saying?
  • Do you have the discipline and the habits to manage your time and do the activities that move the needle?
Fox Web School won't be able to create a portfolio of the sales skill they impart to their students. But what they can do is point to the fact that their students are making good money by following the program. And they do that.

At the end of the day, if all you're looking for is, "What's the difference between a site that sells and provides value versus a site that doesn't," I'm sure you'll find that. And you don't need to join a program to figure that out.

But if what you really want is the ability to make good money in web design, just looking at the sites in Fox's portfolio is not going to get you there.


^^ A shorter way of saying everything above.


^^This
the post I need. will read it again:smile:.

[Edit] is there a way to bookmark the post in forum itself?
 

Andy Black

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is there a way to bookmark the post in forum itself?
You can bookmark posts as an insider. Alternatively, why not create a Google Sheet and grab the URL for posts you like and add them to the sheet?

More importantly, why not reply in here to Bekit and list your takeaways and aha moments from reading her post, and then list what you’ll do differently going forward?
 

Fox

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Based on your line of questioning, I suspect that you're looking for the wrong thing. If you look in the right place for the wrong thing, you could end up missing the real thing that would have helped you.

Shark's Teeth vs. Diamonds
A few years back, I went with some relatives to a place called Westmoreland State Park, where there are a ton of fossilized shark's teeth that you can find on the beach.

They're hard to spot at first. I remember feeling frustrated as I would stare at a section of the beach. It just looked like pebbles and sand to me. And then one of my cousins would reach down and pick up three shark's teeth from the exact spot where I had been looking for the last 10 minutes.

However, gradually, you get better at finding them. Once you've found a few, it's as if your brain expands. Suddenly, you can scan the ground and your brain instantly spots the unique shapes that match what you're looking for. Once this happens, you find them much faster.

The flip side of this is the fact that when you're looking for shark's teeth, you stop noticing ANYTHING else.

There could be gold or diamonds on the beach, but because your brain is scanning for shark's teeth, you're going to miss them.

Shark's teeth are great, and the really big ones are fun to find, but there's not much you can do with them except glue them to a piece of cardboard and frame them and put them on the wall. Whoopee.

Now imagine that you go to Crater of Diamonds State Park. But let's say you're still looking for shark's teeth.

Not only are you not going to find any shark's teeth, you're for sure going to miss the diamonds.

You're in the right place for a diamond. A diamond could be life-changing.

(I randomly saw an article about a guy who found a 9-carat diamond there 5 days ago. Super cool.)

But if the "pattern match" setting in your brain was calibrated for shark's teeth... bummer.


So here's where it seems to me like you are looking for the "wrong thing."








You can correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you want to see examples of the websites because you want to reverse engineer them. You want to see what's different about them compared to a basic site.

Maybe you can't fathom how a site could possibly charge $10k. Maybe you're picturing in your head that somehow, people "charge $10K for websites that are much simpler but supposedly has some copywriting and stuff to increase the client's conversions." Maybe it seems to you like some sort of trick.

So you don't feel like you can make a decision to enroll unless you can see examples of the work.

Now - there's nothing wrong with wondering, "Hey, what's the difference between a site that sells and provides value versus a site that doesn't?" That's a great question.

But you don't need Fox's examples to be able to decipher that. You don't need to enroll in anything. You don't need to pay anything.

All you need to do is go to clickbank, look at their offers that are converting the best, and study the best-performing ones.

Or look at companies that are advertising heavily over a prolonged time period, and study their landing pages. (Because no advertiser will continue to pour money into ads unless they're getting more money than they're spending. i.e. They're selling a lot.) Then, compare those landing pages to a few "average" or "typical" sites in the same industry.

You can get a ton of insight doing this, and it's a great exercise.

But let's cut to the chase: if you're subconsciously thinking to yourself, "If I can only decipher what makes a high-converting website, then I'll be able to make great money as a web designer," you're looking for the wrong thing.

You're looking for a shark's tooth in the crater of diamonds.

Because here's the thing.

The ability to make good money as a web designer doesn't start with knowing that you can build a high-converting website.

It starts with your potential client believing that you can solve a problem for them and agreeing to pay your asking rate.

In other words, it starts with your ability to...
  • Identify that potential client
  • Get in front of that potential client
  • Sell your services to that potential client
And to be good at all that, you have to...
  • Think like a business owner
  • Know how to solve problems, create value, and sell results (not just build websites)
  • Have the outreach skills to get a hearing and close the deal
  • Have the mindset and habits to support your efforts
This is what Lex was talking about when he said,




But your ability to sell, at the end of the day, will be mostly inside your head. No one will be able to link to it. It'll be stuff like...
  • Do you decide to procrastinate because of fear? Or do you decide to go ahead and call that business owner?
  • Do you decide to quit when you face rejection? Or do you keep iterating and refining your pitch until you close a deal?
  • Do you know how to keep your pipeline full so that you always have work?
  • Do you know how to get inside the mind of your client's customer so that they want to buy?
  • Do you have the skills to keep your prospect listening and interested in what you're saying?
  • Do you have the discipline and the habits to manage your time and do the activities that move the needle?
Fox Web School won't be able to create a portfolio of the sales skill they impart to their students. But what they can do is point to the fact that their students are making good money by following the program. And they do that.

At the end of the day, if all you're looking for is, "What's the difference between a site that sells and provides value versus a site that doesn't," I'm sure you'll find that. And you don't need to join a program to figure that out.

But if what you really want is the ability to make good money in web design, just looking at the sites in Fox's portfolio is not going to get you there.


^^ A shorter way of saying everything above.


^^This

Perfectly said. Thanks Bekit!

Lots of great info there for anyone struggling to get going with sales/web design.
 

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