Introducing the new Guru, Coach and Trainer category...

[MJ DeMarco]

Seems like a big topic of discussion around here is the discussion of gurus and their INSANELY EXPENSIVE coaching programs, of course, all promoted by their trusty "FREE TRAINING!" trip-wire.

If you'd like to discuss any particular guru, feel free to do so in this category.

Some questions to address:

Is the guru's program, coaching, or training actually worth the price?
What is the guru's actual background? Has he been a teacher, journalist, or academic for his entire life?
Is there another upsell after paying a price?
What is the price? (That is often hidden until the end of a long-form greasing)

Yes, there are some guru courses and programs that are worth the price.
Some are not, and are just rehashed, re-hyped, and re-packaged products from direct marketing scumbags.

Lets figure out who is worth paying for, and who belongs on the bro-marketing heap of sleezebags.

PLEASE STICK TO FACTUAL INFORMATION and make sure you identify if you have actually taken a course, or paid for it.

 

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[Albert KOUADJA]

I don't like gurus or coaches because they think they are intelligent or experts in everything. And again by their exorbitant coaching prices. It's true that you have to sell their training, but they exaggerate too much. And in their email marketing they think they're smart. they will send you an article saying that they offer you completely free training but when you click on their links, you see other things. like: ''' training of €999.9 instead of €10,000 that will change your life and make all your dreams come true'', offers valid for 2 or 5 hours....

when you pay for the training after all you will see that it is a breeze we sold you. Seriously, they piss me off the gurus.

A simple thread here on this forum is enough for a guru to make a formation and sell it

 

[Nryche]

Is there anything that you can learn in these courses or seminars that you can't find online these days?

 

[eliquid]

Is there anything that you can learn in these courses or seminars that you can't find online these days?

The problem with "find online these days" is -

1. Where do you start? You don't know if what you found online for free is the beginning, middle, end, a sidenote, etc

2. Who was it written by? Lots of auto spun AI articles and lots of rehased rehash out there. It's like the game of "whisper" in grade school. The teacher tells the first kid a story about apples and then that kid whispers it to another kid and they go around the room to the full 30 kids. At the last kid the story is all about pirates that robbed an elephant.

Some of this stuff for free online is out dated, rehased by some reporter or blogger who has never done it, or written by a machine.

3. You normally don't get any understanding or read between the lines info.

I can list a lot more.

Sure, you will find outliers. But it's far and few between.

 

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[Andy Black]

Below are some of the people I've paid to train with and enjoyed. Some of these programs may not be available any longer or new offerings have replaced them.

Ash Ambirge - TheMiddleFingerProject.org - Price: $300 - $999
Ash has a really interesting perspective on business and marketing that takes a branding-first approach. It works well for her, and she's shared some brilliant insights over the years. I've bought a bunch of her products and they were all useful and helpful for freelancers as well as copywriters. She's also who I modeled my copywriting on when I first started.

Mike Bundrant - iNLPCenter.org - Price: $300 - $500
I enrolled in his NLP Practitioner and Master Practitioner programs in 2015. I'd already studied NLP since around 2007, but it never fully clicked until I went through these programs. Afterward, I was able to leverage the NLP Communication techniques much more easily for copywriting and general purposes. Definitely worth it.

Yechezkel Madanes - School of Enneagram - Price: Around $1,000
I enrolled in their Enneagram Coach Certification program. The course could probably have been presented better, but the content was awesome. Madanes' take on the Enneagram was different from other perspectives I'd read about up until this point, and I found it useful. This program included feedback on assignments.

Bastian Ernst - Relationship Funnels - Price: Around $500. I think it's only around $100 now.
I found Bastian through a Google search that targeted my exact search term with his unique funnel approach. It pulled me in and I bought same day. The course taught me how to use ActiveCampaign for inbound email marketing, and I learned to leverage automations, tags, segmentation and more. I used what I learned from this course to expand my freelance offerings, and made several multi-thousand dollar sales with this new skill.

IncomeSchool.com - Project 24 - Price: $300 then $249/yr, but today it's $449 then $249/yr
They teach a bunch of stuff mostly centered around turning blogs into businesses. I found their blog and YouTube training helpful at least for having the ability to quickly rank new sites on Google. They also have a thriving community on the inside. A lot of people use their methods to create niche blogs that get high traffic and leverage display ads through non-Google services. You've almost certainly seen blogs created by their students around the internet because they give students access to their in-house-developed Wordpress theme and as long as students remain members, they can continue to use the theme. What I like most about Income School is that they've turned info-marketing into a bigger and more scalable business model than other coaches and course makers.

John Fealy - ShedBusiness.com - Price: Around $1,000 or $1,500 can't remember.
Provides a full shed-building business system. Although I didn't follow through on this one, the training and support were excellent. The course is well-made. John offered private support. The instructions for building his sheds are simple. The Facebook group is involved, and students regularly report success. The purchase included more than just a course. It came with a website, physical marketing materials, and step-by-step instructions about how to market and sell the sheds.

I know there are more, but I can't remember right now. I'll add the worthwhile ones to the list when they come up. There were a few that weren't worth the price, but I've mostly forgotten them completely. I don't even remember the names.

I’m genuinely curious where my courses fit into this for you Lex. I don’t have a community, and I rarely send email updates. I only redo lessons when they get too out of date.

 

[Lex DeVille]

I’m genuinely curious where my courses fit into this for you Lex. I don’t have a community, and I rarely send email updates. I’ll redo lessons when they get too out of date.

I think your courses are totally worth it, but I didn't pay. You gave me access. Same as @Fox. To me, the content is good, and I think yours and Fox's courses are valuable for those who need to learn skills.

It's not really fair for me to judge the price-to-quality value since I didn't pay. For that, we'd need to hear from someone who made the decision, put money on the line, and then went through the course.

That said, I'm pretty sure there are plenty of testimonials all over this forum for both yours and Fox's courses.

 

[Walter Hay]

I’m genuinely curious where my courses fit into this for you Lex. I don’t have a community, and I rarely send email updates. I only redo lessons when they get too out of date.

I must be a failure. I don’t even see myself as a guru, because I don’t sell any courses.... And as for email updates… I have never sent emails to any of my book buyers other than as direct responses to their emails or DMs.

Where have I gone wrong? Am I too generous? No upsells, no subscriptions, no membership costs? Am I crazy for giving free annual revisions and unlimited support to those who buy my books?

Would reversing those policies make me a guru at last?

Walter

 

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[Lex DeVille]

I must be a failure. I don’t even see myself as a guru, because I don’t sell any courses.... And as for email updates… I have never sent emails to any of my book buyers other than as direct responses to their emails or DMs.

Where have I gone wrong? Am I too generous? No upsells, no subscriptions, no membership costs? Am I crazy for giving free annual revisions and unlimited support to those who buy my books?

Would reversing those policies make me a guru at last?

Walter

I forgot I bought your importing book! It was great! Loads of good stuff that I had no clue about. Plus your support was awesome too. Definitely happy with that purchase.

 

[Walter Hay]

The problem with "find online these days" is -

1. Where do you start? You don't know if what you found online for free is the beginning, middle, end, a sidenote, etc

Thanks for raising this matter. Every now and then it pops up on the forum when something such as this current thread is under discussion.

The one and only request I have ever received for a refund came a few years ago from a member who said that a part of my Labels that Exploit book could all be found online. I refunded without question, but I can guarantee that unless a reader already knew the identity of the products that I was referring to, they would not even know what to look for online.

It was a case of not knowing what he did not know.

Walter

 

[Black_Dragon43]

Seems like a big topic of discussion around here is the discussion of gurus and their INSANELY EXPENSIVE coaching programs, of course, all promoted by their trusty "FREE TRAINING!" trip-wire.

By this definition MJ, I must be a guru too. I sell a platform (coaching, training, DFY lead gen with our own software) for $8K-20K a pop and have a free training too

I actually think most guru prices are way too low. $2-4K? Really? That's like dead broke. Gotta sell 10 customers just to make $20-40K - that's HARD.

I think price should be a matter of value provided. In my case, I guarantee results, and I only work with advanced freelancers & agency owners who already make 6-figures per year, never with newbies. I have 5 people currently going through actively with me, all of them are getting amazing results (none from Fastlane if anyone was wondering). If I didn't charge such high prices, I wouldn't be able to provide the amount of knowledge that I do, keep it updated, AND remove uncertainty for those involved. My long-term mission is to clean the coaching and training industry of scams by guaranteeing results.

I have gone through 80+ courses and 1000s of books, and have tested everything I share inside in my own agency in the past, and in fact, I'm using the same strategies I teach to grow myself. I have assembled a very vast array of knowledge, and distilled them in very practical steps that one can take to scale - it took me 10+ years to do all this. When someone is successful applying what I share with them, they don't just make more money - more importantly, they understand why it works and what they need to do next. I think this is very important, and most providers don't offer this. They just say do this, and that's it. No understanding of why it works, and hence no understanding of when it may stop working and what you need to do then.

As I say in my free training, you can find the components required to build a Tesla in the ground. But almost nobody would go ahead and try to build their own Tesla. And yet, you have business owners every day not growing out of their poverty mindset, and preferring to grow themselves than hire a specialist who can get them there faster. 90% of what's in my coaching and training can be found elsewhere... but it will not be organised in such a way, and in such a sequence as to give you the exact result you want, the way I have organised them. It took me 10 years of gathering and synthesizing this knowledge and putting it in the format I have. If you think you're better off spending those 10 years yourself, good luck. But I think it's better off if each does what they do best - the thinker comes up with tools, and the practitioner uses the tools to get results. Those are two different jobs, and each is better off by collaborating with the other.

Walter

I have bought Walter's course too, and it's really well-made. And this is coming from someone who has bought 80+ courses... very few have Walter's level of detail. Now has it been useful to me? Not really, but then I haven't done any import/export - I've just run an agency and do consulting work. If I would have, it would have been invaluable. I think you could easily sell for $500-999 for the PDFs Walter with your level of service and hard-to-find info.

 

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[Walter Hay]

I forgot I bought your importing book! It was great! Loads of good stuff that I had no clue about. Plus your support was awesome too. Definitely happy with that purchase.

Lex, I want to send you the latest version which I revised and published early this year, but I need access to send it via DM. An alternative could be for you to DM me with your email address and I will send it that way.

Walter

I have bought Walter's course too, and it's really well-made. And this is coming from someone who has bought 80+ courses... very few have Walter's level of detail. Now has it been useful to me? Not really, but then I haven't done any import/export - I've just run an agency and do consulting work. If I would have, it would have been invaluable. I think you could easily sell for $500-999 for the PDFs Walter with your level of service and hard-to-find info.

YES! I'M A GURU. Thanks @ Black-Dragon 43. Coinciding with the release of my 2022 edition of Labels That Exploit, (now called EXPLOIT The Power of Psychology, Perceptions, and Emotions), I have recently increased my prices to $275 for the three book bundle to cover the unlimited suport that I provide. That latest book revision now includes 2 chapters dealing with Tribal Marketing.

Please see Walter Hay's Business Books

As usual, anyone who has bought a previous edition of any of my books, please DM me and I will send the latest version by return.

Walter
P.S. @ Black-Dragon 43, Please keep sending your brilliant marketing videos.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

If some of you are missing posts from this thread it is because I have extracted them to their own thread.

Gurus, Coaches, and Trainers

Discuss any internet guru, coach, or trainer at The Fastlane Forum who sells their expertise at a premium price. Unsure if you should pay a hefty price for coaching or training from a self-proclaimed guru? Discuss any guru training or coaching program here from people who have actually paid the...

www.thefastlaneforum.com

 

[MitchC]

If some of you are missing posts from this thread it is because I have extracted them to their own thread.

Gurus, Coaches, and Trainers

Discuss any internet guru, coach, or trainer at The Fastlane Forum who sells their expertise at a premium price. Unsure if you should pay a hefty price for coaching or training from a self-proclaimed guru? Discuss any guru training or coaching program here from people who have actually paid the...

www.thefastlaneforum.com

This is going to be crazy for SEO. I remember the Tai Lopez thread bringing a lot of people to the forum.

 

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[ericaung]

It DEPENDS. some gurus are really knowledgeable, some are just money/time wasters.