Web Design Affordability & Quality

[Knowledge Kick]

Here is my website dilemma...

-I have a website idea that I believe is a good idea that can make me money based on what I've learned from this site.

-I already purchased a catchy domain and hosting.

-I played around with their Website Builder using templates and made a fairly attractive and professional looking site that included all my content.

PROBLEMS:

-As you all know, the things you can do with the Website Builder are limited. I need to 1) Be able to have visitors sign up and become members 2) Be able to accept credit cards and PayPal 3) Have some type of code or system where upon signing up, the new member can list who referred them. 4) The referrer would then receive a bonus for the referral so they would need some type of 'My Account' tab that would keep track of their 'balance' and allow them to transfer that money they've earned into the account they signed up with.

-MY BIGGEST PROBLEM is how can I fill my needs the most afforable way possible? Is there a way to add onto or customize the site I've already created with these applications? Do I need a whole new setup if I want to have those features?

-Where is the best place to get quality work done for an affordable price? I've looked on Elance and I remember members on this forum warning against it, but do I have any other choice really? I know most of the talented (and cheap) designers are based out of India and I see them advertising on there for $10/hr but I also saw a designer from England on there charging $12/hr.

-How hard would creating the type of site be for a web designer? What kind of price range do you think I'd be looking at?

TELL ME HOW I CAN GET THIS THING UP AND RUNNING EFFECTIVELY FOR CHEAP!

REMEMBER MY MAIN OBSTACLE RIGHT NOW IS AFFORDABILITY. I want to get this ball rolling and don't want to waste any more time so all your advice is much appreciated!

If you have any more questions that need to be taken into account let me know.

 

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[Kung Fu Steve]

Website design can be done for about $300 on Elance. I really like doing my own sites even though I have no idea how to really do it. It's tough for me to explain what exactly I want until I start playing with it. I have started to see that wordpress really has a lot of options if that's something you want to check out. I am a complete moron with this stuff and it's working well for me (with a little help here and there:smxB.

Maybe there are themes you can use for wordpress that relate to what you want. You can usually find great themes for about $40.

You have some more advanced things you want to do with the site. The best thing you can do right now is draw it out on paper. Talk to a developer like Palmera Tech.

 

[Knowledge Kick]

Website design can be done for about $300 on Elance. I really like doing my own sites even though I have no idea how to really do it. It's tough for me to explain what exactly I want until I start playing with it. I have started to see that wordpress really has a lot of options if that's something you want to check out. I am a complete moron with this stuff and it's working well for me (with a little help here and there:smxB.

Maybe there are themes you can use for wordpress that relate to what you want. You can usually find great themes for about $40.

You have some more advanced things you want to do with the site. The best thing you can do right now is draw it out on paper. Talk to a developer like Palmera Tech.

I already have exactly what I want down on paper I just need someone to implement it all for me and put it together. There are people on Elance that can do this for me right? What category would I find them under? I just want to find the right people for the right price. I know Palmera Tech is very good and it's been my intention all along to use them (and probably will in the future as well) but I don't think I have enough money right now so I was hoping I'd be able to find someone on Elance to help me out for a cheaper price.

 

[mtnman]

Did you even get a quote from Andres? Never know till ya ask.

You only cry for quality once.

 

[LightHouse]

You have it drawn on paper, did you design it to look good or do you actually know how to design a sucessful layout? Like matt said you need quality. all you will end up doing going cheap is wasting time and money. even though you do not have money i would not want to waste what you have.

 

[andviv]

I'll get back to you later with something... kind of busy finishing a couple of projects that are taking all my time.

I understand your frustration with it.

The good ones are not cheap, and always busy --that's simply market forces working, my friend.

The problem with elance is finding a reputable shop/developer. Once you find a good one, stick to them.

Also, it helps to let the designers know about your budget limits in advance so they bid only if it makes sense for them as well.

 

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[Knowledge Kick]

I'll get back to you later with something... kind of busy finishing a couple of projects that are taking all my time.

I understand your frustration with it.

The good ones are not cheap, and always busy --that's simply market forces working, my friend.

The problem with elance is finding a reputable shop/developer. Once you find a good one, stick to them.

Also, it helps to let the designers know about your budget limits in advance so they bid only if it makes sense for them as well.

Yea I know, I understand.

Okay PM me ASAP so we can discuss things further and take all factors into account for an estimate, we only spoke briefly before and with limited info on my part.

Thanks Andres

 

[Knowledge Kick]

I'm also going to post some of the offers that I've received and will receive on Elance and see what you all think of them.

If it seems like a good deal you can let me know.

If it seems like a bad idea, you can REALLY let me know lol Because Lighthouse is right, I already have no money I don't want to waste my time as well.

 

[Knowledge Kick]

Here is some of the feedback I've received at Elance.

I'd like EVERYONE WITH E-BIZ EXPERIENCE on this forum to give me their opinions on what you think of the offers and what I should expect going forward IF I decided to proceed further.

Hello Mr. Steven,

We have gone through with provided details. Actually this is standard referral system where referrer could get a %age of amount of what referred member paid for subscription. Best way to register users with PayPal accounts. Getting payments and transferring payments to referral accounts via PayPal is most used way. We have some suggestions.

1- Never to save payments in system, but just transfer to referred amount to referral PayPal account immediately after calculating. It will be lower budgeted and easy to proceed ahead. If you are going to keep payments in accounts, you have to fulfill many security standards of Payment websites and authorize your website from several companies then users will trust you.

2- This is standard way and project could be completed from 5 business days to 8 business days according to existing structure of website.

We will charge $100 for one day's work and from $500 to $800 to complete this project.

Please provide us follow-up and let we proceed with detailed document of proposal.​

HERE'S ANOTHER OFFER

We are the web development company www.WebProle.com / www.ArtGoldau.com based in Switzerland with extensive development experience.

I have gone through the description and understand that you are looking for a development company to create a custom web site with a membership functionnality and a back-end interface. Software should have an affiliate program that allows members to earn money by referring site to friends. We are interested in the project and i sent a few initial questions over PMB.

To consider us, please take a look at few recent web sites we created:

* Oddhost.net (now available at artgoldau.com/work/oddhost) Site was nominated at Webby and OneClub Awards.
* www.ilabtqm.com
* www.ibcbet.com
* www.typexperience.com
* www.dogtoosmall.com
* www.54f3.com
* www.bigworldbook.com
* www.flirt1.net
* www.incorporate.ch
* www.opinionready.com
* www.betmystock.com
* www.nawtonline.org
* www.webprole.com
* www.megatel.ch
* www.betnget.com
* www.elitematch.com.au
* www.careervizion.com
* www.pairone.com
* www.demo.bettings.ch

Not yet online:

* artgoldau.com/work/welness4life/php/
* artgoldau.com/work/gohba/
* artgoldau.com/work/tcv/xHTML/

(there are several others available at www.artgoldau.com).

Due to a long time experience with European and American customers, we come to a project with a high sense of work. We work closely with you to ensure a 100% acceptance rate to improve the quality of the end products. Over the past years we have built a successful track record by serving a highly demanding clientele.

We will do our best to provide efficient, secure and confidential development, so that you are satisfied and will not look for anyone else.


Offer: $700


So...I have a few offers with the ceiling being at around $800. I could come up with the $800 but I'd want to be certain that I'd be getting everything I wanted.

A few questions for the community:

1) How would I run the site from an administrative aspect? I designed the lay-out etc. in the Website Builder application on 1and1 (IT ACTUALLY LOOKS PRETTY GOOD!)
I've never ran a site before so I'm unsure how I'd control the services that they provide me with. I'm guessing there will be some sort of back-end system? So I'd run how the site looks and how the site functions seperately right?

2) The one offer mentions just using PayPal but when I brainstormed this I had every intention to use PayPal AND Credit Cards just because I don't want anyone to backout of paying because they don't have a PayPal account. What are your thoughts on this?

3)I'm confused about how the one programmer mentioned not having accounts on the site? I wanted one of the main points and hopefully more attractive features of my site to be a 'My Account' tab where they could visually see how much they've earned ON the site. Do any of you know if or why this is a problem?

AS ALWAYS, THANK YOU EVERYONE!

AND ANDVIV DON'T FORGET TO PM ME AS SOON AS YOU FIND THE TIME! I still want to do business!
​

 

[LightHouse]

To be honest, its entirely impossible for us to give you any advice on this. This is because we have no idea what these quotes are for.

By the sounds of it, you might be way in over your head here (no offense) it is learnable though. Once they do a design... do you know what you need to do once you get the design files? are they going to slice it? who is going to connect the front and back end?

when you hire out a design, that doesnt mean the company is going to make the design slice it and change all the coding so its up on your site. Its not like getting a templete made for wordpress where you just upload the folder and wa-laa.... Just a heads up

 

[Knowledge Kick]

To be honest, its entirely impossible for us to give you any advice on this. This is because we have no idea what these quotes are for.

By the sounds of it, you might be way in over your head here (no offense) it is learnable though. Once they do a design... do you know what you need to do once you get the design files? are they going to slice it? who is going to connect the front and back end?

when you hire out a design, that doesnt mean the company is going to make the design slice it and change all the coding so its up on your site. Its not like getting a templete made for wordpress where you just upload the folder and wa-laa.... Just a heads up

I DO realize that I may be in over my head...but how else will I learn? There are a lot of things I don't know (admittedly) but that's why I try getting advice as much as I can before I do anything. I've been reading and researching as much as I can and I'm still learning everyday.

 

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[LightHouse]

I DO realize that I may be in over my head...but how else will I learn? There are a lot of things I don't know (admittedly) but that's why I try getting advice as much as I can before I do anything. I've been reading and researching as much as I can and I'm still learning everyday.

Oh i completly agree, but in this sense. you are also time concise and short on money. So if you scrape 800 together and can not figure out how to integrate... how are you going to move to step 2?

I am not trying to discourage you here, just trying to slow you a bit so you can get it right the first time. You need to take a step back and write out a plan to put this together, then research around to see if you have everything THEN post it to see if there is absolutley anything else needed. then you will have a clear vision and you will also be able to properly bid it out because you know you will have everything in the bid.'

when the bidders come back with an apples to apples bid, you can then move ahead and see if they are good to go with or not. then you will need to be able to monitor the project and make sure you get all the receivables....

 

[Knowledge Kick]

Thank you man. I really appreciate it forreal.

So when I talk to a programmer I'm going to make sure I ask them if they're going to slice it and if they will connect the front and back ends of the site.

To answer your other question, I have no idea what to do with the files once they're done with it and give it to me.

I guess I was under the impression that they actually add it to the site and make sure it works then I take over with the administrative tools? Sorry if that's naive...idk that's what I was hoping.

But Speed+ for raising this questions for me.

Anyone else have input?

 

[LightHouse]

Thank you man. I really appreciate it forreal.

So when I talk to a programmer I'm going to make sure I ask them if they're going to slice it and if they will connect the front and back ends of the site.

To answer your other question, I have no idea what to do with the files once they're done with it and give it to me.

I guess I was under the impression that they actually add it to the site and make sure it works then I take over with the administrative tools? Sorry if that's naive...idk that's what I was hoping.

But Speed+ for raising this questions for me.

Anyone else have input?

A designer typically just makes the layouts for the various pages. Dont forget that each page and button has to be congruent with the rest, some times they will chop it up with the HTML but someone needs to integrate it. its a two part process.

 

[Knowledge Kick]

Okay so I followed up with the one programmer and addressed some of the issues that Lighthouse brought up and got the following reply:

Hello Steven,

Thank you for your message and interest in ArtGoldau!

1) Yes, the following services would be provided: graphical design, HTML slicing and PHP/MySQL programming.

2) Yes, of course. You would be able to manage the content and services from the back-end administrative interface. However in order to provide a complete feedback i would like to see your existing web site and was wondering if you could send me the URL?

3) The software would be developed from a scratch based on the current one. We will reuse template you already have and integrate them into CMS.

You see it's not really that straight forward. It is not possible to add back-end features to HTML site as is, because HTML is a static content. For required functionnality you need a CMS, which would be developed by us.

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Seems pretty legit to me but I'm clueless :coco:

Feel free to comment.

 

[Knowledge Kick]

Question for the community...

The book I'm reading mentioned that if you want to accept credit card offers you need to set up a merchant account.

Do I do this after the programmer sets up the system or before? Here's the last email I got from the programmer confirming everything we spoke about.

Is there anything else I need to address?

I don't want to have the site finished and not be able to accept payments :nonod:

Steven,

I confirm our initial bid of 780.00 USD with the completion time of 2-3 weeks. The cost is fixed and final. The following services are included:

- Integration of the existing template into CMS
- Resize of the template for 1024.x768 screen resolution
- Billing and Member area with requested functionnality
- Custom Referral Module
- Withdrawal Feature

Technical support and big fix within 12 months after acceptance of the software. Number of revisions is not limited. We would able to start with the project within 1-3 business days.

Looking forward forward to hearing from you.

Thanks,

Eugene Rozum
Megatel GmbH
Business contact & sales
Mo - Fr: 09.00 - 19.00 (GMT 1)
Tel 41 79 464 5709
Fax 41 26 321 4129

 

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[BryanC]

I didn't read the whole thread but, from what I can tell so far. You're just starting out and really don't know what to do. LoL.

Saying that, I would like you to keep these two ideas in mind. It will make web design and your experience online easier.

1. It gets easier and easier as you find out more. So don't give up!

2. Focus your concentration on only expending dollars from income the site generates. When I start a site, I first want to make sure what I'm doing is in pursuit of satisfying other people's needs. And then my strategy is to put up only $1,000 of my own money (which is usually funded out of cashflow from my other sites) and put together a 5-10 page site, buy 5 years worth of domain and hosting service, and purchase the first 5,000-10,000 vistors which is about $500 @ .05c a click.

After the first $1,000, you really shouldn't need to invest anymore of your own capital if you structured your site right. And make sure each dollar expended is returned Principal with Interest.

Anyway, you'll get better as you go. Eventually it will "click" for you and you will begin to make things happen. Everybody seems to develop their own formula after 2-3 years worth of experience... For me it pretty hard to explain but, I always focus on creating an objective object that is indebted to me for life that will pay up as I snap my fingers. I don't want to have to mingle with my Machine Debtor Website for more than an hour a day. If it takes me more than an hour a day then I can't focus on reinvesting Cashflows and growing my wealth.

 

[Knowledge Kick]

I didn't read the whole thread but, from what I can tell so far. You're just starting out and really don't know what to do. LoL.

Saying that, I would like you to keep these two ideas in mind. It will make web design and your experience online easier.

1. It gets easier and easier as you find out more. So don't give up!

2. Focus your concentration on only expending dollars from income the site generates. When I start a site, I first want to make sure what I'm doing is in pursuit of satisfying other people's needs. And then my strategy is to put up only $1,000 of my own money (which is usually funded out of cashflow from my other sites) and put together a 5-10 page site, buy 5 years worth of domain and hosting service, and purchase the first 5,000-10,000 vistors which is about $500 @ .05c a click.

After the first $1,000, you really shouldn't need to invest anymore of your own capital if you structured your site right. And make sure each dollar expended is returned Principal with Interest.

Anyway, you'll get better as you go. Eventually it will "click" for you and you will begin to make things happen. Everybody seems to develop their own formula after 2-3 years worth of experience... For me it pretty hard to explain but, I always focus on creating an objective object that is indebted to me for life that will pay up as I snap my fingers. I don't want to have to mingle with my Machine Debtor Website for more than an hour a day. If it takes me more than an hour a day then I can't focus on reinvesting Cashflows and growing my wealth.

Yea I'm sure it'll click and I've only been focused on this for a few weeks and I'm already learning a lot. I am usually a fast learner so I don't see this being any different. I know a lot of the people on here might think my questions are ridiculously simple because they're so knowledgeable but keep in mind that I've only been a member for 4 months...decided to focus on E-Biz about 2 months ago...and started trying to develop this site about 10 days ago.

So I apologize if any of my questions seem absurd but I'm just trying to learn as much as possible. I also try using due diligence and researching as much as I can but I've found that the best info I usually get is right here on the forum (when people have the patience to help me lol)

But anyway, you mentioned using no more than $1,000 of your own capital. I've only spent about $25 so far on a domain and hosting package for the year + the estimate I have at $780 for the site so I'm still under that mark.

If I can get this site up and running how I want it to I believe I can definitely start generating income from it. I definitely plan to invest that money into other projects and I'm sure each one will get easier and easier for me.

Thank you to anyone who has helped me and feel free to still let me know what you think about my situation. I posted the last email I received from the programmer which basically lays out what he's going to do and for how much. To me it seems like it's everything I need but just to triple check I like to come on here and ask actual people with experience. Afterall, I can't get the right answers from the programmer if I don't even know which questions to ask :huh2:

Feel free to look at the last few email responses that I've posted. I just want to be able to easily manage my site with the specifications I've asked for. From the way he explains it it seems like I'll be able to do that so hopefully I'm not missing anything. If not, then I think I'll go through with it and assign him the job. I told him I'd get back to him soon.

 

[BryanC]

Well, it may be my philosophy but, you want to build something that is time smart and money smart. Build it for under a $1,000 and choose a model that requires no more than one human to operate, less than 1 hour a day. That way your time + monetary profit are excessively high and the on going time and monetary costs of your site are low. Also, make your site so that it is extremely liquid (meaning you can pass it from yourself to a buyer in a matter of minutes) so you can sell it quickly if you need a capital spot. That's right I said it.

But, yeah, the thing I like about the internet is that I can basically choose the goods and take them to market for under a $1,000 and own a piece of that market for ever. It generates Cashflow on going for me and I get my $1,000 about usually within a week or so. If I have chosen the right marketing material like key words, site layout, and product... and other little details here and then.

Man, I'm not trying to sound like a tycoon but, this is the formula I have developed.

But yeah, another strategy may be to get a clean sheet of paper and write down "Income:" and "Expenses:" underneath it.

Figure out what all your expenditures are going to be like: Hosting, Maintenance, On Going Domain Fees, PPC Fees, Will You Need To Outsource To A Customer Service Center to Handle Orders, Product Delivery, and Returns... How is the product produced and at what cost.

 

[neverfastenough]

Question for the community...

The book I'm reading mentioned that if you want to accept credit card offers you need to set up a merchant account.

Do I do this after the programmer sets up the system or before? Here's the last email I got from the programmer confirming everything we spoke about.

Is there anything else I need to address?

I don't want to have the site finished and not be able to accept payments :nonod:

Steven,

I confirm our initial bid of 780.00 USD with the completion time of 2-3 weeks. The cost is fixed and final. The following services are included:

- Integration of the existing template into CMS
- Resize of the template for 1024.x768 screen resolution
- Billing and Member area with requested functionnality
- Custom Referral Module
- Withdrawal Feature

Technical support and big fix within 12 months after acceptance of the software. Number of revisions is not limited. We would able to start with the project within 1-3 business days.

Looking forward forward to hearing from you.

Thanks,

Eugene Rozum
Megatel GmbH
Business contact & sales
Mo - Fr: 09.00 - 19.00 (GMT 1)
Tel 41 79 464 5709
Fax 41 26 321 4129

If you want a merchant account, I suggest you start doing it ASAP. It's a long tedious topic.

 

[Knowledge Kick]

If you want a merchant account, I suggest you start doing it ASAP. It's a long tedious topic.

That's the thing though. I'm confused about how I exactly go about it.
This the best article I've found on the topic...All About Merchant Accounts

If it helps any...I'm not selling any products. I may eventually, but right now I'm just offering a fee to be a member of the site and its services.

But anyway, should I start going through the merchant account process even if I don't have the billing area on my site yet?

Also, should I just set it up using my SS# now and into my personal bank account?

I plan on going to the county and filling out a DBA and then I'll set up a seperate bank account for the business but I assume I can always change update that info in the merchant account right?

 

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[neverfastenough]

I wish I could find an article I recently read that detailed the process.

 

[LightHouse]

That's the thing though. I'm confused about how I exactly go about it.
This the best article I've found on the topic...All About Merchant Accounts

If it helps any...I'm not selling any products. I may eventually, but right now I'm just offering a fee to be a member of the site and its services.

But anyway, should I start going through the merchant account process even if I don't have the billing area on my site yet?

Also, should I just set it up using my SS# now and into my personal bank account?

I plan on going to the county and filling out a DBA and then I'll set up a seperate bank account for the business but I assume I can always change update that info in the merchant account right?

Nope, i think i wrote it on a post here. Before you do any of this i suggest filling out paperwork and forming a company. You can not set up a merchant account as an individual. You need to be a company with a history of something. Your rates will be high. Also remember that you pay monthly to have the account and there are typical minimums so if you do not have anything now i suggest figuring that out later.

Your priorities are to get the site up and get a company together, you can incorporate all the rest of the stuff as you need it. What is the purpose of processing credit cards if you have nothing to sell and no way to sell it!

 

[Knowledge Kick]

Nope, i think i wrote it on a post here. Before you do any of this i suggest filling out paperwork and forming a company. You can not set up a merchant account as an individual. You need to be a company with a history of something. Your rates will be high. Also remember that you pay monthly to have the account and there are typical minimums so if you do not have anything now i suggest figuring that out later.

Your priorities are to get the site up and get a company together, you can incorporate all the rest of the stuff as you need it. What is the purpose of processing credit cards if you have nothing to sell and no way to sell it!

Okay my next day off I'm going to go to the county and do a DBA. Then I'm going to go to the bank and set up a checking account in the business name.

I guess I need a business license too right?

I've looked around a lot and this seems like it would probably be the best service for me to start with.

www.charge.com

 

[LightHouse]

So you are going to file a DBA for what? You need to form an actual company first before filing a DBA, then get a FEIN from the IRS. business license, county stuff etc etc.

You might want to focus on getting the site together first. the other stuff will cost money and there is no point unless you know the site will work and bring money in.

 

[Knowledge Kick]

So you are going to file a DBA for what? You need to form an actual company first before filing a DBA, then get a FEIN from the IRS. business license, county stuff etc etc.

You might want to focus on getting the site together first. the other stuff will cost money and there is no point unless you know the site will work and bring money in.

But if I can't or shouldn't put the merchant account under my name with my existing account then I need to set it up for the business like you said right?

And to set up a merchant account for my business I need a checking account in the business name right?

And to set up a checking account in the business name I need a DBA don't I?

And to make sure the business will actually bring in money I need a way to accept cc payments so I can make money right? lol

So are these the steps I should do? I obviously have things out of order.

1. GET THE SITE PROGRAMMED/FINISHED

2. FILL OUT ALL THE NECESSARY PAPERWORK TO BECOME A BUSINESS

3. GET THE MERCHANT ACCOUNT

P.S. LightHouse I can't wait to laugh with you about how retarded I was one day and how much you had to help me and explain things over and over lol

 

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[LightHouse]

But if I can't or shouldn't put the merchant account under my name with my existing account then I need to set it up for the business like you said right?

And to set up a merchant account for my business I need a checking account in the business name right?

And to set up a checking account in the business name I need a DBA don't I?

And to make sure the business will actually bring in money I need a way to accept cc payments so I can make money right? lol

So are these the steps I should do? I obviously have things out of order.

1. GET THE SITE PROGRAMMED/FINISHED

2. FILL OUT ALL THE NECESSARY PAPERWORK TO BECOME A BUSINESS

3. GET THE MERCHANT ACCOUNT

P.S. LightHouse I can't wait to laugh with you about how retarded I was one day and how much you had to help me and explain things over and over lol

You have to have a business to run a merchant account, otherwise every scammer everywhere would have merchant accounts in their pockets to screw people.

Get DBA out of your head, thats a fictitious name for doing business. You can just set your business up as the website name and not have to file a dba for it.

So yes your steps are correct. See if you can get the site done correctley and dont hate it at that point not to sell it. then work on everything else. while you are getting it everything else set up the site will start the SEO process and all of that.

Don't worry about sounding dumb, you are starting out and its tough. Just remember to exhuast all other resources first. I think i had mentioned that in another thread. We can wait to see you get to that point, so stay motivated.

 

[Knowledge Kick]

Yup...thanks man you've been a lot of help.

I guess I'm gonna go forward with this programmer then. Hopefully there's nothing I forgot to ask about ahaha

I'll keep you posted with what happens in the near future.