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Random Chat, Thoughts, Posts, and/or Rants Thread

Xeon

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Fleeting random unpopular opinions of the day:

- Email marketing is overhyped and even if it's effective, it probably only works for B2B and/or people from the Gen Y / Baby Boomers generation. Who still actually open up email newsletters from companies, read it entirely, then click the "Shop Now" link? LOL I certainly have never done that in my life. I subscribed to newsletters in exchange for free ebooks / free stuff, and never clicked on any of them. I open 2 - 4 email newsletters a year, and those were all from potential competitors - I wanted to see how they design and market through email lists.

- It boggles my mind why there isn't a new challenger to Instagram. Not Mastodon or Twitter, but a social app that does what Instagram did in the 2014 - 2016 golden era. Perhaps Meta signed anti-competitive laws to prevent other big tech companies from coming up with a true Instagram alternative. There is literally a Need in this hole right now.
 
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Lex DeVille

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- Email marketing is overhyped and even if it's effective, it probably only works for B2B and/or people from the Gen Y / Baby Boomers generation. Who still actually open up email newsletters from companies, read it entirely, then click the "Shop Now" link? LOL I certainly have never done that in my life. I subscribed to newsletters in exchange for free ebooks / free stuff, and never clicked on any of them. I open 2 - 4 email newsletters a year, and those were all from potential competitors - I wanted to see how they design and market through email lists.
Overhyped in what way?

There is no question of email marketing being effective. It is effective for B2B. It is effective for B2C. It is effective for every generation that uses a computer to buy stuff online.

There are B2C businesses on this forum that generate huge sales through email marketing. @AllenCrawley

The behavioral patterns of a single freebie seeker mean nothing on a scale of eight billion potential customers.
 

biophase

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Fleeting random unpopular opinions of the day:

- Email marketing is overhyped and even if it's effective, it probably only works for B2B and/or people from the Gen Y / Baby Boomers generation. Who still actually open up email newsletters from companies, read it entirely, then click the "Shop Now" link? LOL I certainly have never done that in my life. I subscribed to newsletters in exchange for free ebooks / free stuff, and never clicked on any of them. I open 2 - 4 email newsletters a year, and those were all from potential competitors - I wanted to see how they design and market through email lists.

How is it overhyped if it’s effective? It’s not effective enough for you?

Every time I send an email out I make money.
:smile2:
 
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Guest-5ty5s4

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Saw a video for a new sink on Instagram with 2 million likes. It has a sloped bottom and a special side where you can attach all sorts of objects to make cleaning and food preparation easier.

It's amazing what entrepreneurs come up with and the potential for invention and innovation, even with the most mundane, simple objects, even in 2022!
 
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Andy Black

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Microsoft Clarity is incredible

And it’s free

How are more people not talking about this? How did I not know about this sooner?

Here I was paying for Hotjar like an idiot

Hotjar is worse in every single way and slows your site down and costs money, and it can be really expensive depending how many visits you want

Microsoft Clarity has features that make doing what you’d use hotjar for 1000x easier and faster

Bing ad manager absolutely sucks and all they had to do was copy google.

So strange they just absolutely knocked Clarity out of the park and it’s free when Bing ads is so bad and actually makes them money.

Also what a strange situation for hotjar. Just sit there collecting money from people who haven’t discovered clarity yet and pray they don’t.

Their offer now is to literally pay for something worse than what you can get for free from Microsoft. Ouch.

If you’re doing ecom set clarity up.

You can filter recordings by JavaScript errors, angry clicks, quick back button presses, dead clicks, and then go and fix all those issues with your site.

You can also watch recordings live while they’re on your site, a frustrating but helpful experience for launching new offers like I did today for Black Friday. You can see and make changes in real time based on what people are doing.
Thanks for sharing. We switched from HotJar to LuckyOrange. Seeing people click fancy bullet points thinking they were buttons was an eye opener.
 

Vinz

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Why do you believe you have a lack of psychological stability? What makes you think that? Identifying a problem means you know that is a problem. If you know it’s a problem, it’s probably because you hold some kind of value that you are contradicting.
I know this is a business forum, but now I'm talking mainly about what improves my life. So not strictly related to business. And I look at what can practically improve my life. I tried reading 12 rules for life but after an entire chapter of him rambling on lobsters I dropped it.
And as I said I liked the idea of philosophy at the start, but it was never too useful to me, and I stopped at stoicism.

It's hard to explain at words, so I will try my best.
When I read Brandon's book, every word of what he described resonated with me.
He cites one of his patients : "I feel like I miss something everyone else has. Like I don't know something everyone else knows"
That's how I felt, and still feel a bit.
For the longest time I condemned myself whenever I made a little mistake. Every little thing would have me drowning in self-pity.
I had / have this constant sense of inadequacy. A constant inner tension.
When I did the Self Authoring program, after writing about key moments in my past, I literally felt lighter. Physically and mentally. Felt less burdened.
To respond also to @Black_Dragon43 , I'm not avoiding action by reading woo-woo magic self help books.
Trust me.
Before this , I tried a LOT of shit.
I pushed myself out of my comfort zone A LOT. And it did improve "Situational Confidence", what I would call the confidence you described.
Through the entirety of high school, I was VERY AFRAID of speaking and interacting with people. Could only open up with the few friends I made after a long time. But with others, and in class I literally didn't say a word.
Then after high school, as a first job I got a sales job. Then worked as a waiter.
Did almost only sales jobs until now, so almost 4 years.
Yet, I still have trouble affirming myself in normal everyday conversation. Stating opinions, defending myself. Or just approaching people.
I did improve massively on this aspect, can't deny it. But when I see friends my age that can speak to people without any problem I ask myself why it took so much for me.

These years were also VERY hard. Can for sure say I went through a lot of "life experience".
Had to step up and provide for myself and my mother.
Yet, I can't help but compare, again, with friends or people my age, who I know didn't have to do all that. Don't have that responsibilities, didn't have to "step up" or "grow up".
And they still are evidently more confident than me.


HItting the gym for years now. Achieved great results, I'm building a great physique. Put on lots of muscle.
Yet I still don't feel that basic confidence. Still scared to step up myself.
Again, it improved my confidence in a "situational" way. But It went in waves.

Following your Andrew Tate example, what if you prepare as much as you can, you go fight and loose ? If you are basing your self esteem on that, you will be shattered. Same with making money, can't base my entire self worth on making cash, because it can go up and down.
We all know there are rockstars who achieved all the success in the world, everything, but still can't help to kill themselves with drugs because they really don't feel right with themselves.
Are they missing life experience ?

Thought precedes action. To train in the right way, to act in the right way as to get the proper growth, mindset and self-belief will be very important.
Self belief will be importan in you thinking that YOU CAN even have a fight with Andrew Tate, if you train enough.
I guess I lack the foundation you talk about, and this book (mainly the exercises) are helping me in developing that.
If by improving my "mental", taking action is easier, then why not ? I can handle risk more.
I feel more solid. More real in myself. More likely to handle mistakes or failure.
Also, I'm acting on the side. And thanks to this direct work on my self esteem, I feel much less need to consume self improvement advice after self improvement advice. I feel I can trust myself to figure it out, by actually doing it and experimenting, much more.

I guess someone who didn't have experience with this kind of issue will likey simplify it. Appreciate the perspective and advice though

Hope someone that struggles with this will listen to my experience and at least check the book.

Edit : I know this post sounds like a frustrated rambling. And it is.
 
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Vinz

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This is a luxury belief. If you were conscripted by the roman army to fight against the Gauls you'd be too busy fighting to stay alive to analyze your own psyche.

Most of the thoughts in your head are useless and you should ignore them.
Lol. I'm not a roman fighting against the Gauls or in punic wars. And you aren't too.
Does that mean I shouldn't strive for growth ? Shouldn't work to make my life better ? Just survive and that's it ?
If I should ignore most of thoughts in my head then wtf should I do ? Go monkey-mode ? (not monk-mode)

To me it feels you are making bold claims just for the sake of it.

Our mind differentiates us from animals. It's how we grow. Yet I should ignore most of it ??
If I was living in a third world country situation , I would just act to survive and get tf out of there. Sure.
I'm not. You're not.
Isn’t that the truth!
If you support that, why then did you say in MTF's post :
"The biggest problem in the world is that people rarely think"

Not trying to pick a fight. Just curious as I see a contradiction here
 
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Black_Dragon43

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Hey buddy appreciate your answer and I’m enjoying our discussion @Vinz . Hope you find this productive too.
Thought precedes action.
So I’d say this is one of the core beliefs that you’re currently functioning under. It’s the whole “cognitive” approach to psychology. Change your beliefs/thoughts first and your actions and feelings will follow. But is it true?

Scroll to 1:06:00 and watch until 1:13:40 of this video:
View: https://youtu.be/SwQhKFMxmDY


Dr. Andrew Huberman who is a neuroscientist argues that research into the brain actually suggests that it’s the other way around… thoughts and feelings follow action, not the other way around.

So long as you have a scapegoat in your thoughts, your attention is diverted away from what matters - how you act.

It’s no different than procrastination - instead of dealing with the real issues which cause anxiety, one prefers to deal with a substitute, a scapegoat that “fools” one into believing they are somewhat productive when they’re really not.

We’ve been trained to think almost from birth about mind > matter, your mind controls your body and so on. But the truth that sets you free may very likely be closer to a bodily truth, of a being who does not think so much, than to a heady truth.

The prison people woth mental distress find themselves in is largely mental in origin. And you’re trying to solve it by the same mental means - which just makes the bind stronger.

To respond also to @Black_Dragon43 , I'm not avoiding action by reading woo-woo magic self help books.
Trust me.
Before this , I tried a LOT of shit.
Didn’t mean to suggest this as a criticism of you, obviously if you know it’s working for ya, keep doing it.

What I meant is simply to give you some food for thought. Maybe there is some truth in this that you should think about. Or maybe there isn’t. You be the judge.

When discussing something like this, we need to set some objective criteria for judgement. How you feel about doing a certain action or sets of actions isn’t very objective. For example, what if you feel like crap, scared, anxious blah blah while doing your sales job, but you’re the top producer in your city?

What I’m trying to say is that instead of optimizing for feeling better, like your mates, while doing these things, it may be better to optimize for success. Results.

In fact, that’s the only way we can actually be scientific and objective about this. So did practicing the self-esteem work using Nathaniel’s blueprint lead to changes in your results that are statistically significant? Went from underperforming to overperforming at your sales job? Or is it just changes in how you feel about it, but no changes in performance?


HItting the gym for years now. Achieved great results, I'm building a great physique. Put on lots of muscle.
Yet I still don't feel that basic confidence. Still scared to step up myself.
Ok so once again, give us something objective. “Lots of muscle” can mean many different things. How much can you bench press atm?

Following your Andrew Tate example, what if you prepare as much as you can, you go fight and loose ? If you are basing your self esteem on that, you will be shattered. Same with making money, can't base my entire self worth on making cash, because it can go up and down.
We all know there are rockstars who achieved all the success in the world, everything, but still can't help to kill themselves with drugs because they really don't feel right with themselves.
Are they missing life experience ?
If I prepare and I lose then I will be sad and disappointed after. And I will probably analyse video footage of the fight to see what mistakes I did and how I could’ve acted differently. But this is a normal experience - feeling bad when things go wrong is natural.

My point here is that if you don’t prepare, you cannot feel confident the night before the fight. And if you were to somehow feel confident you’d be deceiving yourself and fall even harder when reality hits you. Instead if you train and do everything you can, then the night before the fight you’ll be at peace - because deep down you’ll know you did what you had to do to be ready. As ready as you can be.

Rock stars and whatever may have achieved success defined narrowly as fame and money. But maybe they really wanted a romantic relationship with a person who doesn’t share their feelings. Who knows? Maybe they hate themselves for stepping on their values in the process of getting to success. There’s a lot of factors there that can influence it. But we’re still talking in terms of success and failure. Success in relationships, success in morals and so on. Objective criteria.

If by improving my "mental", taking action is easier, then why not ? I can handle risk more.
I feel more solid. More real in myself. More likely to handle mistakes or failure.
Also, I'm acting on the side. And thanks to this direct work on my self esteem, I feel much less need to consume self improvement advice after self improvement advice. I feel I can trust myself to figure it out, by actually doing it and experimenting, much more.
If it gets real results for you, then keep doing it! In my experience though, no amount of work on the cognitive side really helps.

I’ve dealt with anxiety. Went from having panic attacks to 1-2/10 anxiety level. And the things that made me anxious, guess what, they made me JUST as anxious after changing my thoughts. It was only by repeatedly doing them that my anxiety lessened. Driving for example made me anxious. Did “visualizing myself” driving, changing my beliefs about it and all that help? No! I got behind the wheel and I was just as anxious as before. The only thing that helped was doing it over and over again despite how I felt.

My experience strongly suggests that action precedes thought. I cannot change my negative thoughts by just thinking positive. The moment I’m faced with that which causes negative thoughts, they come back. It’s only by facing that thing over and over again that this changes.

Why do your mates have no trouble talking with strangers? Because they were just conditioned like this when they were small. Maybe their parents had a lot of people come into the house. Maybe they had to talk with people more frequently and stand up for themselves. They got conditioned to be like that. You’ll have a very hard time conditioning yourself to be like them without going through the same (traumatic) experience which conditioned them to be that way.

Pain is memory. Your brain memorizes through pain. The more painful an experience, the more you’ll remember it. For Andrew Tate, it was painful to be locked by his father in a room over the night with no light while he was scared of the dark. But he remembers that he got to the morning and nothing happened. He was CONDITIONED by the pain to remember the success. That the dark is nothing to be afraid of.

You can’t really do that to yourself as an adult. That’s why adults change with greater difficulty than kids.
 
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inputchip

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- Email marketing is overhyped and even if it's effective, it probably only works for B2B and/or people from the Gen Y / Baby Boomers generation. Who still actually open up email newsletters from companies, read it entirely, then click the "Shop Now" link? LOL I certainly have never done that in my life. I subscribed to newsletters in exchange for free ebooks / free stuff, and never clicked on any of them. I open 2 - 4 email newsletters a year, and those were all from potential competitors - I wanted to see how they design and market through email lists.
Says email marketing is overhyped and only works on baby boomers, but goes on to say how he studies email marketing from competitors.

$100k in one hour through email marketing doesn't sound too bad to me, and I can tell you @JasonR is not b2b and most customers are under 50.
 

Antifragile

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Not trying to pick a fight. Just curious as I see a contradiction here
If you think about it, there isn’t a contradiction ;).

One speaks to the fact that most people rarely stop to consider how else they could love their lives. Or “rarely think outside of pre-scripted habits”. Which is why people hardly ever change!

The other speaks to the fact that most of our thoughts are about shit that doesn’t even matter.
 
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Guest-5ty5s4

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This is a luxury belief. If you were conscripted by the roman army to fight against the Gauls you'd be too busy fighting to stay alive to analyze your own psyche.
Thank God we aren't in that scenario.

Doesn't mean it can't happen again though - which is why a bit of reflection is good.
 

WillHurtDontCare

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Lol. I'm not a roman fighting against the Gauls or in punic wars. And you aren't too.
Does that mean I shouldn't strive for growth ? Shouldn't work to make my life better ? Just survive and that's it ?
If I should ignore most of thoughts in my head then wtf should I do ? Go monkey-mode ? (not monk-mode)

To me it feels you are making bold claims just for the sake of it.

Our mind differentiates us from animals. It's how we grow. Yet I should ignore most of it ??
If I was living in a third world country situation , I would just act to survive and get tf out of there. Sure.
I'm not. You're not.

If you support that, why then did you say in MTF's post :
"The biggest problem in the world is that people rarely think"

Not trying to pick a fight. Just curious as I see a contradiction here

Thank God we aren't in that scenario.

Doesn't mean it can't happen again though - which is why a bit of reflection is good.

My point was that if you were in dire circumstances and had no other options, you'd stop psychoanalyzing yourself and just handle business. You'd probably be damn efficient at it to.
 

GPM

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Here is some news out of Canada:

"Bill C-21 also now prohibits ALL CENTERFIRE SEMI-AUTOMATIC firearms with removable magazines."

So yea, pretty much everything other than tube fed shotguns, and bolt actions rifles are about to be banned. Wow. Not a gun grab at all...

Meanwhile "conservation officers" who need firearms due to potential animal encounters order up scary AR15 platform firearms whenever they want up here. Rules for thee...
 
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Guest-5ty5s4

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My point was that if you were in dire circumstances and had no other options, you'd stop psychoanalyzing yourself and just handle business. You'd probably be damn efficient at it to.
Yes that’s true. It’s like this quote:
“The healthy man has 1,000 wishes. The sick man has only 1.”

It’s a little more than psychoanalysis. Call it preventative medicine.
 

Xeon

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Says email marketing is overhyped and only works on baby boomers, but goes on to say how he studies email marketing from competitors.

$100k in one hour through email marketing doesn't sound too bad to me, and I can tell you @JasonR is not b2b and most customers are under 50.

Most people are using Gmail nowadays. All email newsletters from companies end up in the users' Promotions tab, and push notifications aren't sent for mail in the promotions tab. You mean people actually login to their email and click the Promotions tab to go through the list of marketing emails from Company X and Y?

That would be like someone sitting down on the couch after a day of work, and the first thing they do, is to switch on the TV and binge watching infomercials.
 

MitchC

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Most people are using Gmail nowadays. All email newsletters from companies end up in the users' Promotions tab, and push notifications aren't sent for mail in the promotions tab. You mean people actually login to their email and click the Promotions tab to go through the list of marketing emails from Company X and Y?

That would be like someone sitting down on the couch after a day of work, and the first thing they do, is to switch on the TV and binge watching infomercials.
Are you trolling? This is the dumbest thing I’ve ever read

You are replying to a post that has a thread where someone made 100k in an hour from email

My Black Friday email had a 48.8% open rate yesterday

Also infomercials are highly profitable

So is junk food

So are high interest loans

So are drugs

Just because doing something is dumb doesn’t mean people don’t do it

Edit: probably a little harsh but come on dude. If your product provides value people will buy it, if your email provides value people will open it.
 
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inputchip

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Most people are using Gmail nowadays. All email newsletters from companies end up in the users' Promotions tab, and push notifications aren't sent for mail in the promotions tab. You mean people actually login to their email and click the Promotions tab to go through the list of marketing emails from Company X and Y?

That would be like someone sitting down on the couch after a day of work, and the first thing they do, is to switch on the TV and binge watching infomercials.
Yeah, you're right... advertising has never worked. :rolleyes:

No point in dismissing a marketing channel that could actually be very profitable for your business. Test and iterate.

For every $1 you spend on email marketing, you can expect an average return of $42 (DMA, 2019). $1 in, $42 out. Sounds like a good ROI to me.
 

Xeon

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Yeah, you're right... advertising has never worked. :rolleyes:

No point in dismissing a marketing channel that could actually be very profitable for your business. Test and iterate.

For every $1 you spend on email marketing, you can expect an average return of $42 (DMA, 2019). $1 in, $42 out. Sounds like a good ROI to me.


What would be the best way to grow an email list from 0 for a new site? I assume it would be to run FB lead ads and get their emails from there?
 

Vinz

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My point was that if you were in dire circumstances and had no other options, you'd stop psychoanalyzing yourself and just handle business. You'd probably be damn efficient at it to.
Not to keep rambling, but I don't think striving to survive will make me more efficient than being solid all around..
At least that is the consideration given my experience. And it probably describes myself and how I'm different. Again, I've gone through hard times were I just thought on how the fuk I could keep going .
Maybe in retrospect it doesn't feel that tragic, but it felt like that at the time
 
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What would be the best way to grow an email list from 0 for a new site? I assume it would be to run FB lead ads and get their emails from there?
Define "best"?

I'd say it depends on where the audience hangs out, who they already follow or buy from, what your skillset is, what your preferences are, what resources you have access to, who you know who can help, etc.

Maybe people search on Google and you can run ads straight to an opt-in page?

Maybe your niche lends itself to short videos? Or maybe longer videos?

Maybe you can create some lead magnet everyone loves and share?

Lots of ways to grow an email list.
 

Lex DeVille

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Define "best"?

I'd say it depends on where the audience hangs out, who they already follow or buy from, what your skillset is, what your preferences are, what resources you have access to, who you know who can help, etc.

Maybe people search on Google and you can run ads straight to an opt-in page?

Maybe your niche lends itself to short videos? Or maybe longer videos?

Maybe you can create some lead magnet everyone loves and share?

Lots of ways to grow an email list.

Yup.

Recipe to grow an email list fast:

1. A source of continuous traffic flow
2. An offer people can't refuse

Recipe to make an email list profitable:

1. Have a list
2. Segment the list
3. Send relevant offers based on the segment
4. Tend to your metrics

Fastest predictable way to grow an email list from scratch is paid ads.

Cheapest way to grow an email list from scratch is social or publicity marketing.

Questions worth asking:
  • What is my product/service?
  • What stage of the buying cycle is the viewer in?
  • What lead magnet makes sense for that stage?
  • What offer makes sense on the other side?
There's more to it, but I think that's a good start. You don't get good at copywriting in a day and you don't get good at email marketing in a day either. Takes practice, learning, and trial and error (or just have a really really big list haha). In the end, it's a numbers game.
 

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Yup.

Recipe to grow an email list fast:

1. A source of continuous traffic flow
2. An offer people can't refuse

Recipe to make an email list profitable:

1. Have a list
2. Segment the list
3. Send relevant offers based on the segment
4. Tend to your metrics

Fastest predictable way to grow an email list from scratch is paid ads.

Cheapest way to grow an email list from scratch is social or publicity marketing.

Questions worth asking:
  • What is my product/service?
  • What stage of the buying cycle is the viewer in?
  • What lead magnet makes sense for that stage?
  • What offer makes sense on the other side?
There's more to it, but I think that's a good start. You don't get good at copywriting in a day and you don't get good at email marketing in a day either. Takes practice, learning, and trial and error (or just have a really really big list haha). In the end, it's a numbers game.
I've just remembered this short lived thread (my MailCheat(Chimp) account got suspended, and my Google Ads account got suspended because I had Google Ads in my Google Ads).

When I was Head of New User Acquisition in a startup years ago we used Google Ads to get 15k email signups a day - with a super simple landing page (and 120m keywords and ads I might add).

 
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You can’t create luck. But you can up the odds of having more luck.
  • Prepare for the opportunity you want.
  • Be in “the room” where you are more likely to find people who can help you
  • Plan on paper; by outlining what you want you’ll start to notice things you’d otherwise miss. Like when you buy a car and suddenly see same model everywhere… same with opportunities.
  • Take care of your health, clear mind sees things better.
  • Have positive attitude, it attracts.
 

Kak

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You can’t create luck. But you can up the odds of having more luck.
  • Prepare for the opportunity you want.
  • Be in “the room” where you are more likely to find people who can help you
  • Plan on paper; by outlining what you want you’ll start to notice things you’d otherwise miss. Like when you buy a car and suddenly see same model everywhere… same with opportunities.
  • Take care of your health, clear mind sees things better.
  • Have positive attitude, it attracts.
Suddenly, luck becomes less lucky.
 

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Antifragile

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There's an old Israeli joke about a man who gets banned from a public swimming pool. He goes to the manager's office and asks, "Why was I banned?!".

"You peed in the pool," says the manager.

"So what?" says the man, "everyone pees in the pool."

"Yes," replies the manager. "But you peed from the diving board!"

 

Vinz

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Hey buddy appreciate your answer and I’m enjoying our discussion @Vinz . Hope you find this productive too.

So I’d say this is one of the core beliefs that you’re currently functioning under. It’s the whole “cognitive” approach to psychology. Change your beliefs/thoughts first and your actions and feelings will follow. But is it true?
Thanks for the full, thought out response !
I'm not advocating for "mind totally over matter". I care about both things.
My argument looked like mind > matter, but I find it to be both way. They influence eachother.
My point in showing those examples is giving a general picture on how I felt. Not in particular situations which I would need the "experience" for
You said my mates might be more conditioned to talk to strangers. I doubt it. Adding to the years of sales / waiter jobs, I have a very large family, my father is a very social person and was an entrepeneur, used to get me to work with him and so I would meet lots of people.
The mind can in a substanstial amount influence action. That's what my experience strongly tells me.

What I tried to describe is more like a "filter" in which every action you take, the way you experience the world goes throught. For the longest time I looked at the world throught the lens of fear.
It's more like a mental fog. Which I can properly recognize now, because I feel lighter, clearer, more lucid.
Nathaniel Branden's blueprint is helping me really much without a doubt.
Other content on self esteem is a joke.

It isn't an approach to target "certain" insecurities. It's a look at self-concept as a whole, and it's influence on our life. I know from the title it looks like another one of these books that told you to "visualize" , to say affirmations. I would have dropped it right there and then if it were like this.

If you want, you can read the first 2-3 chapters of the book, as he describes the issue much better than I ever could. Especially what high self esteem vs low self esteem look like, the chapter on consciousness, and the cases of his patients.

No doubt it is helping me very much, and I will continue to do it while taking action in the meanwhile !

Again, I want to also take care of the body. And I do. I do what I can within reasonable terms to increase testosterone and key hormones and health. Both the mental and physical side have their limits.
Why not take care of both ?
Also, what's the point in having objective success if you don't even feel good about it and can't enjoy it ?
 
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Black_Dragon43

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Also, what's the point in having objective success if you don't even feel good about it and can't enjoy it ?
You have a good attitude. My point above really was that unless we talk about objective success, we have no accurate measuring stick for determining effectiveness.

Let’s talk just about self-esteem as an example. You’ll have people like Napoleon Hill, Maxwell Maltz, James Newman arguing that the way to raise it is affirmations and visualization. You’ll then have thousands of people telling you in their case it worked.

Now how can you determine if those practices merely changed their feelings, or actually produced real, measureable results for them?

You need to have an objective criteria. I’m not saying that attaining objective success and being miserable is the goal. My point is that objective success is the only thing we can accurately measure and use as a criteria for our judgements. Many people will claim to be helped by techniques, but unless we see real, physical changes, then it’s hard to determine a link between the two vs it being just placebo or self-deception.
 

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