The Entrepreneur Forum | Financial Freedom | Starting a Business | Motivation | Money | Success

Welcome to the only entrepreneur forum dedicated to building life-changing wealth.

Build a Fastlane business. Earn real financial freedom. Join free.

Join over 80,000 entrepreneurs who have rejected the paradigm of mediocrity and said "NO!" to underpaid jobs, ascetic frugality, and suffocating savings rituals— learn how to build a Fastlane business that pays both freedom and lifestyle affluence.

Free registration at the forum removes this block.

The biggest landing page mistake

Azure

Perpetual Motion
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
189%
Mar 12, 2016
439
829
32
It shouldn't feel fishy.

Someone searches for an "emergency plumber in Dublin" because they're trying to find someone to help them with a plumbing emergency they have.

The landing page in that case is as simple as a big headline asking "Looking for an emergency plumber in Dublin?".

Relevance/targeting trumps fancy sales copy IMO.

Give people what they're looking for.

" give people what they're looking for".

Too often people get caught up in the next big thing or little ancillary details like landing pages or what type of email follow up to pursue.

Deliver what the customer wants and you never have to worry about the little details, they'll fall in place afterward.

Don't try to trick mislead or conceive. Be honest and just do a good job, that's one of the more overlooked parts of the fast lane equation.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Almantas

Nothing to Lose
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
475%
Dec 21, 2015
887
4,210
32
Ireland
Thanks Andy, this post is a goldmine. Bookmarked!
 

Marquin Brewer

Contributor
Read Fastlane!
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
105%
Oct 18, 2016
41
43
54
A sure sign you still don't get it


You talk about "traffic".

... I need to generate more traffic.

... where can I get cheaper traffic?

... where can I get traffic that converts?


You talk about "clicks".

... how many clicks did I buy yesterday?

... how many clicks did I send through each ad in the split-test?

... how many clicks do I need before I know this business is a dud?




Seriously?

WTF is "traffic"?

WTF are "clicks"?



Traffic?

Is that what's hitting your website?

Are you "buying traffic"?



Clicks?

Where do I buy them?

Can I buy them in packs of 100, or is the smallest order size 1000?

What's their expiry date?

Where can I store them?




Guys...

Traffic and clicks are VISITORS.

They're PEOPLE, just like you and me.

People with hopes and dreams.

People with fears and worries.



They sat down and did a search on Google a few seconds ago.

Or they were thumbing through Facebook amusing themselves with funny videos, or catching up on friends and family.



Get it?




You know something else that bugs me?

"Users", "subscribers", and "signups".

How many users signed up yesterday?

How many subscribers do we have at the moment?


Errr... those people didn't come to your site to USE your site.

That's a bit presumptuous isn't it?

They came to your site to solve THEIR problem.

They signed up to your newsletter to solve THEIR problem.



For the love of God... please stop calling them users/signups/subscribers.

They're PEOPLE. Not users.



At the very least, if you've built a directory for plumbers, then call them plumbers.

Or if you've built a blog for cyclists, then call them cyclists.

But even then, remember they're only a plumber on your site.

They're a van owner, dog owner, dad, son, husband, holiday maker, or gambler to other people.

And a person like you and me at the end of the day...
Andy, what I really hear you saying is stop looking at people as cattle and really get back to the essence of relating to others like ourselves who have issues and are looking for solutions. If we move out of the way so we can see someone else and not ourselves. Look to give value and look for nothing in return which is impossible in wiifm syndrome we will see other's become champions for us.....
 

Sanj Modha

Platinum Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
315%
Feb 16, 2016
1,024
3,226
42
In Your Newsfeed
The easiest and simplest way to approach this is take notes the next time you buy ANYTHING online from Amazon, eBay or whoever you like to shop with. What did you like? Was the checkout process easy? How can it be easier? What did you hate?

Now take this research and apply it to your own website, product or service. We're all customers - I'm constantly buying from my competitors from Amazon etc to make sure I can apply both the good and remove the bad from their customer experience and make mine the best that it can be.

There's no need to reinvent the wheels guys. Find what works and use it. I always use Amazon as my benchmark because (and IMO) they do a lot of things wrong but when it comes down to testing conversion optimization and user interface - Amazon is second to none.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
Andy, what I really hear you saying is stop looking at people as cattle and really get back to the essence of relating to others like ourselves who have issues and are looking for solutions. If we move out of the way so we can see someone else and not ourselves. Look to give value and look for nothing in return which is impossible in wiifm syndrome we will see other's become champions for us.....
Bingo.

If we truly served our fellow man, then we'd not see them as clicks or traffic.

It all boils down to the astonishing secret @IceCreamKid revealed here:
 

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
(Originally posted here.)


If your worried your bounce rate is too high, then you've still got it wrong.

I want my bounce rate as high as possible.

Visitors hit exactly the right page, see exactly what they need, and call my client(s).

There's no links to other pages to distract them (except links to Disclaimer, Terms, and Privacy in the footer).

Job done.



WHY do you want to reduce your bounce rate?

If your visitors need more information before they contact you or buy, then why is that information not on the page they landed on?

If they need to navigate to another page to find what they're looking for, then why didn't you send them to that page in the first place?

If they don't want what you're offering, then why did you get them to your site?



Bounce rate isn't a metric I'm interested in. I literally don't look at it. I don't care about Key Performance Indicators. I just care about Performance.

This thread explains it:
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

TheDillon__

Silver Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
151%
Apr 11, 2016
421
634
27
DFW
Fantastic thread Andy - thank you for sharing! I love the treating of people like people - not as numbers.

I'll be keeping this in mind as I try out my further projects!
 

TheDillon__

Silver Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
151%
Apr 11, 2016
421
634
27
DFW
On that note - what landing page software do you all recommend? Or should I try and just hack something together with wordpress?

Every site I've tried (Unbounce, LanderApp, LeadPages, Instapage) all want at least $40/mo. for their software - that's a little rich for my blood!

I'm looking to see if people interested in learning Afrikaans like my solution enough to pre-order it.
 

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
On that note - what landing page software do you all recommend? Or should I try and just hack something together with wordpress?

Every site I've tried (Unbounce, LanderApp, LeadPages, Instapage) all want at least $40/mo. for their software - that's a little rich for my blood!

I'm looking to see if people interested in learning Afrikaans like my solution enough to pre-order it.
I've always thrown something up quick using Wordpress and if the numbers justify it then I pay to get a prettier page built, still in Wordpress.

I found Optimizepress pretty handy when I was using it a couple of years ago.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Departed

Contributor
Read Fastlane!
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
157%
Jul 15, 2017
42
66
Europe
hey man...this is just too much value....incredible. Today, I came to the forum to do research on a specific topic...I got answers to all my questions just by reading this thread... 100 new questions came up on things I have never even thought of and I have now 10 more browser tabs open with content that I am going read in the next days. Currently listening to your radio interview. Thank you for all the great advice!!!
 

RogueInnovation

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
170%
Jul 28, 2013
1,278
2,177
Great post I read it a while back I think and took away a random idea of impressions being important. Its actually not that different than what you said about it being about the people behind the clicks.

You get one good first impression with people, and you need to be upfront about what you are doing in front of their face, who you are, and what the outcome of going further is likely to be.
In the case of a green light buyer - you just need to show credibility, efficiency, familiarity, so they can get it going
In the case of an orange light visitor - you want to actually impress them a little (not too much) so they get curious and more interested in your company
In the case of red light visitor - you just want to acknowledge to yourself that it isn't always sales first, and have some "here you go" stuff for them to be like "oh nice"

Sizing up your competitors on google and comparing yourself is pretty crucial, because no matter how well you THINK you are doing on your page, you gotta test it and it has to beat competitors, simple as that.

Those are my more random take aways.
 

Elio

New Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
100%
Sep 18, 2018
1
1
Andy,
I signed up just to tell you that I loved your view on this.
I am working a website and I was kind of thinking about their homepage: there's nothing in there..no words, no colors, just one big B/W image. I think that from a "conventional marketing" perspective, it might not be really catchy but my guess is they were going after the
anonymity of the service....which I guess is what people are going for in this case. So the landing page in itself might be "weak" but the message is quite strong I think. Thanks for sharing this!
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
A couple of tips about TRAFFIC and CONVERSIONS:
  1. You’d do better not to call it traffic. Remember that those "clicks" are real life people visiting your site. People with dreams, fears, hopes, and worries.
  2. Websites and landing pages don’t convert. People do (into subscribers, buyers, etc). Sales happen when you get the right person to the right offer at the right time.

Remove the words "traffic" and "conversions" (and even "clicks") from your vocabulary and you'll stop thinking of shuffling electrons around, and focus on serving people instead.

Do this and good things will start to happen.
 

Jeff Noel

Go all in.
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
219%
Oct 26, 2018
699
1,534
Quebec, Canada
Andy, Your original post is really helpful ! Thank you !

I'm wondering what you think about CTAs written from the point of view of the person (example of a button text for an ebook preorder landing page):
"I want to monetize my blog >>" (the >> is actualy an arrow icon)

I feel like the other way around, it feels redundant when looking at the competition:
"Click here to monetize your blog >>"

Does it really have a big effect on the decision-making process of the person ?

Thanks in advance.
 

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
Andy, Your original post is really helpful ! Thank you !

I'm wondering what you think about CTAs written from the point of view of the person (example of a button text for an ebook preorder landing page):
"I want to monetize my blog >>" (the >> is actualy an arrow icon)

I feel like the other way around, it feels redundant when looking at the competition:
"Click here to monetize your blog >>"

Does it really have a big effect on the decision-making process of the person ?

Thanks in advance.
I'd say that's split-testing fodder, and the one to start with will depend on how the sales page is written. Just looking at the two of those in your example I'd prefer the second one because it says what's going to happen, whereas the first just says what I want? I like CTAs to tell people what to do. "Request a Callback" is one we use a lot, but then most of my clients are local service businesses.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

ChrisV

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
225%
May 10, 2015
3,141
7,055
Islands of Calleja
Lol I love this post. Yes, sometimes people get too caught in the details. You can’t see the forest because you can’t see past the trees.

shuffling electrons around

Lol, I’m totally stealing this for whenever someone micro-manages.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
Bump
 

PureA

Winners never quit
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
348%
Dec 24, 2013
810
2,819
29
Bali
Hey guys, made some notes on the thread, hopefully useful to someone.

---

Notes:

* Lander is only as good as the quality and relevance of the traffic hitting it. Targeting is king.
* Best ad (top) is likely the top ad, we should study there campaigns and landing pages.
* A person has a problem they are looking to solve, its as simple as that. Can you solve it for them?(WIIFM) These are HUMAN people looking for solutions. NOT CLICKS/TRAFFIC etc.
* Mobile landers are 50-60% of the traffic and are often NEGLECTED. Ensure mobile lander hits on notes discussed here. They SUCK (a lot of the time - huge opportunity here)
* The biggest ad agencies in the world are making these mistakes because each person involved is pursuing there own selfish wants and needs (awards, recognition, money from big client, ego, CV accolades, ‘innovator tags’, notoriety etc) Optimise for solely for the client and solving the clients problem.
* "Long-tail to me just means to more specific searches with lower volume, but often a more specific intent."

Landing page 1 :
* Try images on the left as images catch the eye first, and we read left to right.
* Be specific with imagery. (If just laptop image, the thought is, is this just laptop insurance?
* Artificial fold good (to get customer to focus)
* Split test CTA button with something super specific (e.g. instead of ‘get an instant quote’ try ‘click here for your instant gadget insurance quote’)
Landing page 2:
* Congruent search to landing page is a must.
* Headline of page should echo back search term.
* Page makes visitors ask so many questions. Too many distractions, make it so its a slippery slope to the CTA
* Dont make the visitor ask ANY QUESTIONS - it should be very straight forward and clear what the next action should be.
Landing page 3:
* Dont use crazy colours elsewhere on the page that distract from what you want the user to do. The CTA should be the star of the show.
Landing page 4:
* The above the (artificial) fold is very clear and direct (how it should be)
* Site should look pro and trustworthy. Not like a bedroom project.
* IMAGES TO THE LEFT of CTA’s.

Overall Thoughts:
* The goal of the landing page is simple: drive visitors to the CTA.
* The goal of each focal point on the landing page is to get people to look at the next focal point (until they get to button).
* The purpose of the headline is to get people to continue reading the page. It does this by letting them know they are in the right place.
* Images draw the eye, and we read left to right, top to bottom.
* Images should be used to move the eye towards the next focal point.
* The “Button” (CTA). Should explicitly be about what the visitor needs to do, and what they will get in return. Assume people did not read anything else on the page, what would the button say? For our example the best CTA button would read “Click here to get your gadget insurance quote"

2 styles of campaign:
* "If I was to run +washing +machine +repairs +dublin then it would be throughout Ireland. Even if they’re down in Cork typing that in, I want the ad to show."
* "The other style is to have a campaign IP targeting the city of Dublin, where the keyword is +washing +machine +repairs."

On Landers:
* You can have one page with dynamic headlines. So you dont need to build a new page for every term.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Esquire

Divorce Shark
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
244%
Oct 13, 2012
776
1,890
Connecticut
Outstanding Thread, Andy. Enjoyed your posts. Took away some great ideas ... and I'm putting them to work.

Two questions ... if you don't mind:

The first was ... what are your thoughts on adding the names of your direct competitors as exact match keywords? I haven't done that (yet) but I'm thinking to myself ... why not? What has been your experience in this regard?

The second question speaks to targeted geographic locations. Suppose there are six cities in your region. AB&C which are affluent. And DE&F which are poor. Also assume that these are completely distinct communities - DE&F are not subdivisions of AB&C. If I target my ads to display in AB&C ... is there any additional benefit to "excluding" DE&F? Or is it enough that that DE&F are not part of AB&C ... so excluding them would afford no additional benefit ...? Curious ...

Cheers ~ Z
 
Last edited:

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
Outstanding Thread, Andy. Enjoyed your posts. Took away some great ideas ... and I'm putting them to work.

Two questions ... if you don't mind:

The first was ... what are your thoughts on adding the names of your direct competitors as exact match keywords? I haven't done that (yet) but I'm thinking to myself ... why not? What has been your experience in this regard?

The second question speaks to targeted geographic locations. Suppose there are six cities in your region. AB&C which are affluent. And DE&F which are poor. Also assume that these are completely distinct communities - DE&F are not subdivisions of AB&C. If I target my ads to display in AB&C ... is there any additional benefit to "excluding" DE&F? Or is it enough that that DE&F are not part of AB&C ... so excluding them would afford no additional benefit ...? Curious ...

Cheers ~ Z
Thanks @Esquire. Glad you enjoyed the posts and got ideas to implement.

To your questions:

1) Yes, you can bid on competitor brand and product names. Just be aware you’re potentially burning bridges with those businesses. Also, if they’re not bidding on your brand name then maybe they’ll retaliate, in which case the winners are Google.

2) Check your location options in the campaign and ensure it’s the middle option where people are “in or regularly in” your targeted locations.

If someone is regularly in location A for work and does a search from home in location D then you may want exclude people in location D.
 

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
I've always thrown something up quick using Wordpress and if the numbers justify it then I pay to get a prettier page built, still in Wordpress.

I found Optimizepress pretty handy when I was using it a couple of years ago.
Our developer builds (non Wordpress) landing pages using our templates. If I want to knock up a landing page quickly I use Carrd.co. It’s great for non-techies and dirt cheap.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

NeoDialectic

Successfully Exited the Rat Race
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Rat-Race Escape!
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
685%
Feb 11, 2022
402
2,754
Phoenix, az
Great thread as a crash course on the mindset needed for a successful advertising campaign. I think one of the harder skills to build is a good Theory of Mind. Getting into the customer's head seems obvious, but for some reason it is very difficult for most.
 

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
Great thread as a crash course on the mindset needed for a successful advertising campaign. I think one of the harder skills to build is a good Theory of Mind. Getting into the customer's head seems obvious, but for some reason it is very difficult for most.
I think it's difficult because the marketing industry and most marketing education out there uses terminology that makes us forget we're serving people.

Impressions, clicks, conversions, prospects, leads, sales, customers, repeat purchases, AOV, LTV, ROAS. These are very dehumanising words.

Then everyone talks about how *parts* of the marketing funnel convert. Landing page conversion rates, email conversion rates, etc. When it's the people reading the page or email who converts.

I think the average person and business owners thinks in terms of people, but the marketing industry convinces people it's a numbers game and that we make money shuffling pixels or electrons.
 

Johnny boy

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
620%
May 9, 2017
2,929
18,173
27
Washington State
Andy's clients after hearing him rant because they asked for a performance summary and asked how many clicks they got on their campaign:

"Okay you little dickhead....how many people, with hopes and dreams, came to our site to 'try and solve their problem' yesterday?"

"4"

"F*ck!"
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
Andy's clients after hearing him rant because they asked for a performance summary and asked how many clicks they got on their campaign:

"Okay you little dickhead....how many people, with hopes and dreams, came to our site to 'try and solve their problem' yesterday?"

"4"

"F*ck!"
Lol.

Now I think about it I've less patience with clients. I'll not let them talk about traffic or clicks.

I'm quite happy pushing back.

Would you rather go back to 100 visitors looking for "how to fix a leaking toilet" instead of having 4 visitors looking for "water damage restoration companies near me"?

If they prefer "more clicks" then they're gone.




Client communication every week doesn't include the word "clicks". It starts with:

Hi <client>,

36 visitors for $220 last week:
• 3 leadforms.
• 3 answered calls (plus 1 abandoned and 1 unanswered call).

How did you get on?

<Screenshot of weekly trading>


They rarely reply.

It's me who chases them for a performance summary, which I always find odd.

Trying to find out if we're profitable or not is like pulling teeth.
 

William Ainslie

Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
109%
Dec 13, 2016
57
62
44
South Africa
I felt insecure and protected my product and service, ignoring that it isn't how you help your clients.

Give people solutions that they like and that work for them.

I've been unsuccessful in building a fastlane business because of this action.

I've changed my ways. Will I QUIT when I get uncomfortable?

Thank you, @Andy Black
 

Saad Khan

Amazon Ads Guy
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
174%
Mar 14, 2021
686
1,191
20
Pakistan
I work as a PPC manager in the verticle of Amazon Ads. We deal with a type of landing page called "product page" or "product listing". Our "landing pages" have images, title, bullet points and A+ content. And we always make sure all these elements lead the customer to the solution (which is our product)

In essence, you need to get 3 things right for paid ads to work:

Your offer (the solution to the customer's problem)
Your creatives (landing pages, product pages)
Your targeting (the people who need your solution)


But we still need to make sure that the people or "keywords" we're targeting are looking for a solution to their problem and our product is a solution.

Great points Andy!
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Andy Black

Help people. Get paid. Help more people.
Staff member
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
370%
May 20, 2014
18,566
68,699
Ireland
That was a great interview, thank you!
Glad you liked it. Maybe you can add your takeaways to the thread with the interview in?
 

Post New Topic

Please SEARCH before posting.
Please select the BEST category.

Post new topic

Guest post submissions offered HERE.

Latest Posts

New Topics

Fastlane Insiders

View the forum AD FREE.
Private, unindexed content
Detailed process/execution threads
Ideas needing execution, more!

Join Fastlane Insiders.

Top