How My Attitude Towards Leadership Held Me Back For Decades

[Sandholdt]

Something very simple, yet crucial in my opinion is to go against a common belief: "Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself"

As a leader you can't expect your employees to be of same mind that you do, and you will have to find out how each individual respond to different ways of communication.

I for instance, want the facts out cold and simple. I don't mind too much the way it's communicated.

Some people would be very demotivated and find that way of communicating too harsh. To those people you have to find out what motivates them, and then use the kind of communating best suited toward them.

Another thing than communication is the question of the whip and carrot. Some people thrive when whipped, other people (and the majority too, I believe) thrive from receiving the carrot. Again. Just keep in mind that everyone is not like you, and you have to treat different people in different ways.

 

[Sandholdt]

Pros and cons to either approach. In your example one issue is if you give a person a carrot and the other the whip, everyone can see you play favorites.

I've been called out on this exact thing actually.

I asked for feedback from my team, where a person responded, that I was treating people differently.

I then asked if he felt like I was favorizing, or if it was as he'd said it; that I treated people differently, because I know I do, but in my opinion I have to, because people respond differently to ways of communication.

I feel that after explaining the reasoning behind it, there has been a good understanding .. Ofcourse he may still be brooding and not telling. I don't feel that's the case thought.

Apart from this, I do agree with your viewpoints about a leaders job and the importance of helping your employees evolve towards better personal leadership.

 

[BizyDad]

I've been called out on this exact thing actually.

I asked for feedback from my team, where a person responded, that I was treating people differently.

I then asked if he felt like I was favorizing, or if it was as he'd said it; that I treated people differently, because I know I do, but in my opinion I have to, because people respond differently to ways of communication.

I feel that after explaining the reasoning behind it, there has been a good understanding .. Ofcourse he may still be brooding and not telling. I don't feel that's the case thought.

Apart from this, I do agree with your viewpoints about a leaders job and the importance of helping your employees evolve towards better personal leadership.

It is really good that you sought out the feedback and were open to criticism. Open communication is huge with that style of leadership.

But the other problem I discovered with that style is it doesn't scale. You'll eventually spend too much time dealing with those kinds of talks.

Great for small groups though.

 

[Lyinx]

seeing how this can turn into a book suggestions page, I'd like to put up this author's book for the running of best leadership book: How To Be A World Class Leader: Using Science To Become One of The Top Executives in the World: Hough, Patrick: 9781983272295: Amazon.com: Books

 

[BizyDad]

seeing how this can turn into a book suggestions page, I'd like to put up this author's book for the running of best leadership book: How To Be A World Class Leader: Using Science To Become One of The Top Executives in the World: Hough, Patrick: 9781983272295: Amazon.com: Books

I like that idea. Thanks for contributing @Lyinx and for the book recommendation. Can you take it one step further? What are three takeaways you got from the book? What is one surprising fact you learned?

 

[Lyinx]

I like that idea. Thanks for contributing @Lyinx and for the book recommendation. Can you take it one step further? What are three takeaways you got from the book? What is one surprising fact you learned?

the largest takeaway?
I pride myself in thinking my decisions out (not based on emotions)
He proved to me (time and again) that most of my decisions are either based on emotions, or on very weak logic, and I barely did the numbers.
By the time you are done with the workbook (it cannot really be called a book) you will have learned a lot more than a lot of MBAs will ever teach you. (notice the period, it's making a point)
My signature shows what I think of this book, FLF and Unscripted get you to become entrepreneurs, but this book will actually turn you into the next step up if your end goal is to become a leader and think things out.

do yourself a favor and buy the book

 

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[Santi M]

This was a fantastic read, thank you @BizyDad
I don't know if it is how well you write or the fact that your stories are actually impressive, or both (probably both), but your lessons are incredibly valuable.

 

[BizyDad]

This was a fantastic read, thank you @BizyDad
I don't know if it is how well you write or the fact that your stories are actually impressive, or both (probably both), but your lessons are incredibly valuable.

Thank you for the compliments. I hope the stories help you on your journey.

 

[Tiago]

Couple of things come to mind here.

Why don't you want the best college intern, is it because you really don't think that that kind of person is suitable for the role you want to fulfill, or is there something behind that?

Also, how would you have to change the company to accommodate top talent? More importantly, is this something you even want?

Also, read this again: "Or would we be better served by getting that procrastinating person who's just thankful that they got an internship.". If you were coaching a business owner wanting to expand his team, and he said that, what would you say to him?

I apologize if I don't have any answers here, but I think these questions might help you with this.

Also, a wonderful tool for hiring is the Kolbe Index. Highly recommend doing that test to see how you best take action. Once you're more familiar with it, you can build the Kolbe profile of the person you want to hire, to ensure the best fit possible for the role you're offering.

 

[BizyDad]

Why don't you want the best college intern, is it because you really don't think that that kind of person is suitable for the role you want to fulfill, or is there something behind that?

Also, read this again: "Or would we be better served by getting that procrastinating person who's just thankful that they got an internship.". If you were coaching a business owner wanting to expand his team, and he said that, what would you say to him?

Ok I think I figured it out.

It's that I want my team to lead the interns and I don't have enough faith in my team to do a good job.

Most of that is because they haven't done it. Nothing in their resume speaks to an ability to do so, and this will be the first time I am asking them to do it here.

But in order to do it, I, or we, have to set it up for success ahead of time.

But I'm not 100% sure how I want it to work. I kind of want to figure that out as we go.

If I get a type A planning personality, they'll likely want direction that my guys won't be prepared to give.

And that person is more likely to complain to the internship coordinator, potentially making it harder to get interns later.

Compare that to the laid back person, they are still seeking a writing internship but they are just more laid back about it. For this first internship, I want a go with the flow personality who will be happy with the opportunity before them, even if the parameters switch week to week.

And if I get the procrastinator, the one who waited until the last minute to find an internship, then he or she gets a chance to write 10hr/wk, and see their work actually get published, well that person is more likely to give a positive report to the internship coordinator.

And later, once we know, once we have a structure and I'm sure my guys have really owned their roles as leaders, then we can go after the talent.

Maybe this is fear talking. Or maybe this is my risk mitigation part of my brain.

In every facet of my business I try to under promise and over deliver.

And the best of the best tend to have high expectations. So how do you over deliver on high expectations?

I'm not convinced we are ready to. Yet.

 

[Tiago]

It might be both, fear and risk mitigation at the same time.

But I wonder what would happen if you did give bigger challenges and more responsibilities to your team.

I heard a podcast once, where the owner of a business went on a full year sabbatical, and decided to delegate everything to his team. They really stepped up and took full ownership of it. He said "Why didn't I believe in my team sooner?".

Maybe by you not having faith in them, it undermines their opportunities to grow.

 

[Andy Black]

Something I learned from watching the organizers of a group of young kids. They stated the behavior they want the kids to model, not the negative to avoid. I grew up with hearing don't do this, don't do that. Instead of telling the kids don't talk, stop fidgeting, it was feet on the floor, hands on your lap, mouths closed. It was amazing to see.

A few years ago, my mother in law was visiting and wanted to learn to ride a bike. More like brush up on it, she rode bikes as a kid. She lives in downtown Chicago and didn't want to practice on busy streets. We took her to an empty parking lot. Empty of cars, but had a single light pole in the very middle. As she was getting ready to go, we told her "stay away from the light pole". She made a beeline right for it.

I'm convinced even though you hear it's a negative, there's something going on in the subconscious that hears "light pole" and you get fixated on it. Should have told her what to do like "ride near the outside edge of the lot".

I see many of your "house rules" are stated in the negative. Give people the positive to fixate on.

100%.

What’s the first thing you think of when you see a sign that says “Don’t walk on the grass”?

I think of Richard Gere and Julia Roberts kicking off their shoes and walking barefoot on the grass

I reckon that sign would do better as “Walk on the path”.


What about people panicking in a smoke filled corridor?

I hope the sign doesn’t say “In the event of fire, do not use the lift.”

How many would just see “fire” and “lift”?


Kids will help you figure this out fast.

Tell kids not to run and they’ll skip.

Tell them not to skip and they’ll hop.

Tell them not to hop and they’ll dance.

Want them to walk quietly? Tell them to walk quietly.

 

[Andy Black]

On delegating/hiring, a line I like is:

“The person who’ll run with the ball is the person who catches it.”

 

[BizyDad]

But I wonder what would happen if you did give bigger challenges and more responsibilities to your team.

I heard a podcast once, where the owner of a business went on a full year sabbatical, and decided to delegate everything to his team. They really stepped up and took full ownership of it. He said "Why didn't I believe in my team sooner?".

Maybe by you not having faith in them, it undermines their opportunities to grow.

You never hear the podcasts where the person tried to step away and everything went to crap though. Those stories exist too. I suspect on this forum we can find a few where the leader took his eye off the ball and the business suffered.

It's not that I don't have any faith in them. I am asking them to step up and develop their leadership. I regularly challenge my guys to improve, and they regularly step up. I'm sure they'll step up here too.

To make an analogy, in the rodeo, they don't train bullriders to ride bulls by having them ride the best bulls the first time out of the chute, do they?

I don't have enough faith that they could ride the best bull the first time out. They've never ridden a bull before...

internship. I think you are classifying it incorrectly. Getting the best intern can be the best for your team. Best don’t need as much direction as you seem to think. Best are people who can figure out a way to work with directions or without. Procrastinating people are a show stopper for me… I just hate those types of employees. No matter what direction you give, then still do nothing. Why? They are just more motivated to play video games or stay on social media than to work. You are overthinking this brother. Go get the best!

I hear that. Maybe I have a soft spot for underappreciated people. I've been a procrastinating employee. I've been a lazy one too. There are a lot of reasons people get demotivated. Sometimes it's just an issue of structure and expectations.

Both my writers were procrastinating types who wait until right before a deadline to get something done. I think that's true of a lot of writers. One of my writers once said, it's like I need a deadline in order to get writing done.

It took a little time to help them get rid of that habit. I think it was a result of their previous work environments.

I explained the reasons I believed it hurt our chances to get something into print. Then when stories wouldn't get printed, we would discuss what went wrong, and often we'd mentioned how we got the story in right before the deadline.

We tried an experiment for a month to get them to turn their stories in early, and voila their numbers/percentages of stories printed began to improve.

My team takes great pride in a printed story, as they should. Once they saw they could get more stories this way, they no longer procrastinate on writing stories.

Sometimes you kind of find somebody who's under appreciated, or going in the wrong direction, or just stuck in life, and show them a better way to achieve their goals.

And when you do that well, when you help someone grow, they tend to stay loyal.

But I was humble enough through that whole process to say I could have been wrong. If the numbers didn't improve, I would have let them get stories in at the deadline.

And now my guys feel like they have ownership of their own process. Which they do.

I don't hire Pulitzer prize winning writers. But my writers are really good at what they do. They weren't at first. But they keep getting better. They've now exceeded my expectations. And they continue to improve every month. Every month they have a goal to hit, and 80% of the time they exceed their goal.

Maybe someday I'll hire a Pulitzer prize winner, and see if he or she could do the same. But I suspect they would quit "for something better".

Again, I always try to put myself in the shoes of somebody and assess what their expectations are. And then exceed them.

----

Anyways thanks everybody for the feedback. I kept debating it back and forth and couldn't see it clearly, so I appreciate you guys taking "one side" of the debate. You are probably right, but assuming we move forward with the internship project, I'm going to try it my way and see what happens.

 

[Tiago]

Good point. On my own first business, I did the mistake of delegating some of the most important tasks too soon, and the business suffered from it.

 

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[SDE]

Bump to one of the useful threads.

 

[BizyDad]

Bump to one of the useful threads.

Thanks for compliment.

It's funny that you bumping it gave it the "hot topic" tag. That's my first . I wonder what makes something a hot topic...

 

[BizyDad]

That's the kind of leadership I was talking about in my post. You must let your people go through the learning curve so they can make better independent decisions in the future. That's how they become good at their jobs and function well as a team. And it frees you up so you can do your job rather than trying to shadow theirs.

If I must stand over someone, they don't last very long. I must decide if the person doesn't know the job or if it is an ethical problem. When someone is struggling because of a lack of knowledge, I put them into a buddy system with someone who knows how to do the job. I give them a chance to correct their course. No one is born knowing.

I try to watch and see where people have natural talents. Also, ID their work style. When I see some singing as they work, or in the flow, I know what kinds of jobs to give them.

I've also had situations where I've had to separate people that needed a break from each other. It is amazing. Within a short time, they are back working with each other by choice. People are definitely herd animals.

Great stuff @WJK

These are all lessons I only recently started to learn for myself.

 

[Andy Black]

You must let your people go through the learning curve so they can make better independent decisions in the future.

I agree. It takes time to let people learn their own way.

I do the the same with parenting... "What would happen if you keep jumping that wall?" (keeps jumping low wall, then catches foot and trips).

I probably mentioned these parenting and leadership lines in the thread already, but in case I didn't:

"Be the man you want your sons to grow up to be."

"People listen to experts, they follow leaders."

"Praise in public, criticise in private."

"Catch them when they're good."

"Yes, and" not "Yes, but".


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[Jrjohnny]

Great thread Bizy!

I don’t know how I’m just seeing it now.

I actually have a story to share sort of like this.

My teachers would always make us do group projects, and I always had a thing for being a leader.
At the age of 8 I had figured out the difference between trying to force respect and just being able to respect.

Everyone would want to group up with me as I was good at keeping everyone in control not in a calming manner.

I once was in a group of 4

2 girls, a boy and I.

We were all deciding what to do and the girls told us an idea.

I was in the middle of saying it was a good job and it’ll definitely stand out, just some changes we should make.

And the other boy interrupted me and shot down the idea saying we shouldn’t stand out and she was dumb for that idea.

He was being an a**hole trying to force respect.

After a little he went to the washroom and the girls began to cry.

I told them that it was my fault, I had made the mistake of grouping up with him.

We brainstormed how we would do it, who would do what.

I had a vision, shared it with them and we always had a mentality of “if it’s a good idea, we can make it even better”

The girls had calmed down and the boy came back.

We told him what we’d do and he started yelling at us.

Everyone had heard, including the teacher.

Everyone avoided the boy like he was the plague.

They had all respected me.

When someone had an idea, everyone would turn to me.

Even when my title of being a leader wasn’t on me, everyone still wanted to hear my opinion.

every single report card I have says that I’m a great leader.

I think a lot of people think that leadership doesn’t matter and those who do,

Don’t know how it works.

Great post Bizydad.

 

[machinistguy]

Man I am in a season of challenge. In case you don't know, I hired a couple of Filipinos to work for me in my agency.

This has exposed several issues with my current set up. Call it growing pains. Going from 1 to 2 people on a team is hard enough, but creating a whole new team, getting all 3 to work together, and making sure that this team integrates with the other 2 teams has proven to be revelatory.

But the kicker is I am finding issues in my existing "smooth running" teams too. Both my writers are facing personal challenges. I'm being patient because hiring and replacing them and training someone new on the process and the culture would prove time consuming.

But MAN am I having to exhibit patience. I just needed to come on here and vent. Because I am putting in long hours, and not feeling like I am making sufficient progress.

I need to build better systems. I wish my team could build better systems for us, but I didn't hire systems thinkers.

In the end, when I find yet another problem, I have to stuff Bobby Knight back down and remind myself... "This is your fault for not building the right systems sooner".

View attachment 51332

My high school teacher was in favor of electing bad politicians when things are good because it exposes the flaws in the system during good times, instead of during a recession or a war where those flaws could be fatal, and gives you the opportunity to come back with an even more resilient country. Whenever my business systems start failing I try to reframe it as "This isn't a problem, but an opportunity to identify where my business is weak and come back even better. Be thankful it didn't happen after losing a big customer or a recession".

The long hours do suck. Sometimes it feels like your bed is going to leave you for not spending enough time with it.

 

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[piano]

Man I am in a season of challenge. In case you don't know, I hired a couple of Filipinos to work for me in my agency.

This has exposed several issues with my current set up. Call it growing pains. Going from 1 to 2 people on a team is hard enough, but creating a whole new team, getting all 3 to work together, and making sure that this team integrates with the other 2 teams has proven to be revelatory.

But the kicker is I am finding issues in my existing "smooth running" teams too. Both my writers are facing personal challenges. I'm being patient because hiring and replacing them and training someone new on the process and the culture would prove time consuming.

But MAN am I having to exhibit patience. I just needed to come on here and vent. Because I am putting in long hours, and not feeling like I am making sufficient progress.

I need to build better systems. I wish my team could build better systems for us, but I didn't hire systems thinkers.

In the end, when I find yet another problem, I have to stuff Bobby Knight back down and remind myself... "This is your fault for not building the right systems sooner".

View attachment 51332

I'm not working on the kind of stuff you do, but I'm sure that it's very similar to learning a piano piece.

From my experience two things can happen if you put in all you can:

1: You'll succeed after practising for hours every day.

2: Or you'll realise that you're not ready yet and need to tone it down (learn easier pieces first or work on scales, fix bad technique, etc)

The good thing, and that is something that I've observed in business, is that the 2nd point is actually much rarer in business (assuming you're giving your best).

But anyways, I'm not going to go more into detail of this, especially as I am not actually that much experienced yet in business.

Bizy, if you get demotivated, then go grab a piece of paper and write down the pros and cons of not working on it, the people you might dissappoint, etc. It's something that has helped me immensely in a few situations recently. Hopefully it'll work on you if you ever need it!

So go sleep enough, eat alright-y and take a few breaths outside every 2 hours of work.

And if you do get stuck, maybe ask someone on here! I'd bet my life on the fact that people (oh and me) would like to help you.

Anyways, bon voyage!

 

[Andy Black]

I've been riding motorcycles since I was a teen. And the first thing they teach you about target fixation. You go where your eyes are looking. If you want to avoid a pole look away from and the rest will follow. Target fixation can kill you or save you. It's also the reason why you don't tell a kid not to spill his coffee. The brain sees the action of spilling and that's what it does. The labels on coffee cups say "use caution hot coffee" for a reason.

I was going to write a series of lessons from riding motor bikes. Fixation would have been one of those. I’ve done it... ending up in a ditch 2 hours after picking up my first bike.

“Don’t walk on the grass.” just makes me think of Richard Gere walking barefoot on the grass in Pretty Woman.

“Walk on the path” is better.

 

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[Andy Black]

This Brosnan guy sounds like the 007 of leadership. if I was going to read one book of his on business or leadership is there one that you would recommend?

Blaise Brosnan is an institution amongst many business folks here in Ireland. When he launched his last book government ministers spoke at the launch ceremony.

See the video on his company website here:

Blaise Brosnan | Business Books Ireland | Business Advisor | MRI Wex

Blaise Brosnan, Author of You Are The Limiting Factor, Jack & I Dare You. Business Consultant Ireland, Business Advice Books for sale

www.mriwex.ie

Blaise has three books out and I have them all but haven’t read them. Partly because I’m just not in reading mode, but also because I found his wisdom easier to consume live at his workshops.

I went on a two series of courses that he gave and they were amazing. The guy drops little nuggets left right and center. He’s also got this calm way of speaking to that has us all hanging on his every word.

Here he is chatting about his little book of quotes that I dip into and out of:

View: https://youtu.be/6S3_3HuEB_I





I’ve learned so much about management, leadership, and management from Blaise.

I’m messing about with whiteboard videos and will inevitably do a lot of his quotes.

 

[Andy Black]

Thank you for the compliment tip.

“Praise in public, criticise in private.”

 

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[El Dorito]

I was on the same boat until I used the Cosmic Master's hypnosis.

I was a tire kicker until my intuition grew to an unprecedented level.

Never looked back ever since.

 

[BizyDad]

Great progress! It is so important so really share a vision together. One tool that I've found very important is what is called a "Vivid Vision". Cameron Herold has an interesting book and talk about this.

I've created a Vivid Vision for my company, it's a PDF document which entails all aspects of the business: who our clients are, customer service, marketing, financials, our values, our big why, how our team looks like, what the product/service does, etc...

Before talking with any prospect, or someone I want to hire for the team, I send them that document so they understand what we're trying to build. It's been very good at getting people immediately bought in or immediately out.

Maybe it could be useful to have a Vivid Vision for your company, so that everyone is aligned moving forward.

Just wanted to give a hat tip to @Tiago who made this comment on another thread but also applies here as some quality leadership/communicating a vision advice.

It been almost a year since I wrote anything on this thread and as I reflect on it, I'm not sure if I've grown any further as a leader. I suppose being quarantined for most of that time, I was solo and not working on it.

I've been back in the office for a few months now, and I'm happy to report everything has been pretty smooth sailing. We have plans to grow the team in the next year, and I've started prepping my team that they are the managers of the future.

And future is college interns/recent grads. Life should get really interesting soon...

But I did have an interesting conversation with one of my writers. He's urging me to start announcing this internship now. He says that's how we'll get the best college interns.

My response was that I don't necessarily want the best college intern. I don't necessarily want a type a driven person for the positions I'm looking to fill. It was an honest gut reaction, but now it's the weekend, and I'm playing the conversation back and forth in my head I'm wondering if there isn't some other reason why maybe I blocked at getting the best.

What I explained to him was that in all facets of my business I'm trying to under promise and over deliver.

But a type a go-getter has high expectations. Would we really be able to meet their expectations for the position?

Or would we be better served by getting that procrastinating person who's just thankful that they got an internship. Or maybe the introvert who also procrastinated, but is thankful they found an internship that is just all about writing.

Or maybe I overthink things... What do you think?

 

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