How Do I [NOT] Scale My Personal Training Business Significantly?

[Simon Angel]

@Simon Angel can you get me a Christmas cheesecake or no?
You'll have to ship it, of course........ lol

Sure. That'll be $193.68. For the shipping, that is.

 

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[LightHouse]

The only way to get @LightHouse to answer a question is to not ask that question. My bad. He's told us a few times how that was really THE book that got him going at the point he was at in his life. I'm sending @JLE that book, so wanted to get a testimonial from @LightHouse ..... who is an amazing real world version of Lisa Simpson and will answer the question not asked. Love you, Chris!!

He isn't going to read it. An average person generally will never finish it.


People resist change to their core beliefs. Handing an average person that book is like handing a 'bible' from a different religion than one's own and expecting it to create change. It won't, those beliefs are walled to the sky.

I highly value my time, this thread is not the place for it. I could (maybe should) write an independant thread on it, when the time becomes available.

Everyone here going in circles on this fella, has now wasted copious amounts of time that can't be recovered. One of the great skills, that I saw MJ had posted pages prior to my response that I didn't see, is the ability to know when the help is actually warranted.

Otherwise it's wasted and a tick box to not recurring in the future. That future opportunity may be the right person that's actually willing and ready.

This guy doesnt need to hear anything from any of you and you are kidding yourself if you think you have the right words, you don't. He needs lots and lots of therapy, that he will likely think he is above for the next 20 years.

See em come, see em go. No Thanks.

@ZCP Your mission is commendable, but stop dying on the wrong hill. Imagine all that energy wasted, utilized on your own bix, or on the right person. Far more focused power to create lasting change.

 

[ZCP]

@LightHouse heard. it is hard to know which ones will turn out. i went a little further on this because i had some free time and it was some content i planned to put out on the channel. i'm also procrastinating on some shit i need but don't have to do.

 

[LightHouse]

@LightHouse heard. it is hard to know which ones will turn out. i went a little further on this because i had some free time and it was some content i planned to put out on the channel. i'm also procrastinating on some shit i need but don't have to do.

I somehow can tell 'most' of the time, but can't put it to words as good as @MJ DeMarco probably can.

@MJ DeMarco You are far more talented with words than I am, If you had to put it into a stepped formula... what would you say?

 

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[MJ DeMarco]

If you had to put it into a stepped formula... what would you say?

A stepped formula for what? Determining if someone is beyond saving?

 

[LightHouse]

A stepped formula for what? Determining if someone is beyond saving?

Yes, how do you determine where your time and replies in threads like these should be spent.

We know the majority is in the patterns, efforts(or lack of), and the language used.

(edit, stepped formula was the wrong term, doing two things at once here!)

 

[BizyDad]

Everyone here going in circles on this fella, has now wasted copious amounts of time that can't be recovered.

Wasted is relative.

If the goal was to help the guy, maybe you are right. Time will tell.

If the goal was to help others, then some people have admitted to being helped, and you are wrong.

If the goal was to become a better helper, then speaking for myself, I got out of this thread what I put in. You can choose to believe I wasted my time, but I see this as a limiting belief. Frankly I get to decide if my time is wasted. I am better for having contributed to this thread.

That said, you are an excellent helper of people, so maybe you don't need the practice I do. Lololol.

And when it comes to points 2 and 3, that is why I get offended at people's requests to delete threads. They make the thread all about their own wishes at the expense of others' benefit.

JLE thought this whole time that the only thing we all wanted was to help him. Your assessment seems to perpetuate that myth also, hence my response. We did/do want to help, but many of us respond for the sake of the reader, not the OP.

 

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[LightHouse]

Wasted is relative.

If the goal was to help the guy, maybe you are right. Time will tell.

If the goal was to help others, then some people have admitted to being helped, and you are wrong.

If the goal was to become a better helper, then speaking for myself, I got out of this thread what I put in. You can choose to believe I wasted my time, but I see this as a limiting belief. Frankly I get to decide if my time is wasted. I am better for having contributed to this thread.

That said, you are an excellent helper of people, so maybe you don't need the practice I do. Lololol.

And when it comes to points 2 and 3, that is why I get offended at people's requests to delete threads. They make the thread all about their own wishes at the expense of others' benefit.

JLE thought this whole time that the only thing we all wanted was to help him. Your assessment seems to perpetuate that myth also, hence my response. We did/do want to help, but many of us respond for the sake of the reader, not the OP.

Oh, here is a great point that might illustrate the difference in our views. (this is more open ended, not a statement.)

The reason why I think it's wasted... is not because I do not think it benefits others. I know reading things will highlight things for other people.

The big reason it's wasted is because you are throwing tactic after tactic on a problem you can't actually see. It's like throwing all the troubleshooting steps out there hoping one is the answer. The reality is, you have the wrong manual.

Then, what you are highlighting, is others see that and think... "Wow, look at all these solutions, these are the answers to my problem too.... but which one" Well.... that may be true, and it also may not be true. Esp if they too are an unknown or unclear problem and now applying the wrong steps or the wrong order of steps to overcome any specific challenge.

They may also skip over the hard but needed step for the one that seems most easy since it was tossed out as a solution or tactic in the thread.

que chatgpt for a great analogy here....

Let me give a simple one a shot. Imagine JLE came to a board of therapists on the internet and said, " I have OCD, fix me ( <-big issue in the first place). In the real world, this wouldn't exist, but in theory here.... all those therapists just started throwing the book at him without examining and uncovering the entire "math problem" before attempting to solve it.

You would have a ton of tactics that solves parts of a problem in a random order.

I am not so sure that is actually as helpful as it seems... though it is great content.

(I want to reiterate that this post is on the fly, this isn't a hard statement of truth, open to discussion!)

 

[Jon822]

I was going to comment to the OP but could tell from the first page he isn't ready for help in his current state. I'll be the first to admit this list isn't perfect but I would say 3 telltale signs are:

1. Asking for advice or help on simple tasks -- almost all of the time, to me this proves they haven't tried to do anything themselves or they want others to do their work for them.

2. Moving the goalpost -- if someone is given advice and they repeatedly move the goalpost, they are more interested in maintaining a self-defense mechanism that protects them from failing than they are of taking risks and learning.

3. Action faking -- I think we've all action faked at some point, but repeated action faking (especially when being called out on it) is very telling of the work they are willing to do for what they claim to "want". After 17 pages, the OP's big step was making business cards which could be done in less than an hour? Clearly, he is more content reaching his dreams in his sleep than working for them in the real world.

I'm sure others could add to this list (again, it's by no means perfect) but I do think the above 3 are highly correlated with someone who is not ready for actionable advice.

 

[WillHurtDontCare]

Random brain dump:

I've spent something like $2K on personal training in my life, and here is a brain dump of various questions / problems I've had while lifting. I'm not asking for answers since I've solved most of them, but here's a list of specific problems that I've faced that you might be able to help clients with.

• What can I do to consistently get good sleep so that I consistently feel good?
• What supplements are actually worth my money? And which supplements actually cause harm?
• Is there something that I can eat after weightlifting so that I don't crash?
• How can I incorporate running / sprinting into my weightlifting routine without seriously impacting my lifts?
• How can I avoid tearing my biceps during preacher curls?
• Why does my right should hurt while using the chest press machine?
• What is the right depth to use on the leg press machine?
  • Hell, which leg press to even use? My gym has like 7 variations
• Which handle should I use for tricep exercises?
• How can I hit my macros without stuffing myself and losing productivity?
• How can I fix my ankle tightness?
• How can I lift weights without impacting going to martial arts classes?
• How often should I take rest weeks? Should I skip exercise entirely, or just scale things down?
• How often should I change routines?
• How do I know that I've set up machines like the leg curl, leg press, chest press, shoulder press, etc to know that I'm getting the maximum potential muscle gain?

Also, young upper middle class moms are good clients because they want to look hot again and they have money.

 

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[ZCP]

His problem was his own brain in the way of him doing anything. That was clear from the get go. He is the heroin addict that cannot stop. Takes a 'shock' / FTE / rock bottom to get them OUT of that environment and on a new path.

I've gotten a LOT of people started from that point. I had a clear plan and worked it forward. Then posted it for others. And it's not done. 1/2% chance he comes back and posts that vacation picture.

I'm with @BizyDad , this thread helped me a LOT.

I honestly don't like people coming in and saying the 'you are wasting your time' IN the thread. If you are saying it for THEM to fight back against, I like it. If you are saying it as some holier than thou authority, keep it to yourself. If you are saying it to save me from being a dumbass and wasting my time, appreciate the love. Do it in a DM.

 

[ZCP]

I was going to comment to the OP but could tell from the first page he isn't ready for help in his current state. I'll be the first to admit this list isn't perfect but I would say 3 telltale signs are:

1. Asking for advice or help on simple tasks -- almost all of the time, to me this proves they haven't tried to do anything themselves or they want others to do their work for them.

2. Moving the goalpost -- if someone is given advice and they repeatedly move the goalpost, they are more interested in maintaining a self-defense mechanism that protects them from failing than they are of taking risks and learning.

3. Action faking -- I think we've all action faked at some point, but repeated action faking (especially when being called out on it) is very telling of the work they are willing to do for what they claim to "want". After 17 pages, the OP's big step was making business cards which could be done in less than an hour? Clearly, he is more content reaching his dreams in his sleep than working for them in the real world.

I'm sure others could add to this list (again, it's by no means perfect) but I do think the above 3 are highly correlated with someone who is not ready for actionable advice.

I think people in this thread miss the back and forths that @BizyDad and i had in DMs with the dude. It actually sounded better and seemed like we were close a few times. Then panic would set in once the obstacles were cleared. He'd pipe off in the thread and then we'd all dogpile.

If I was JUST corresponding in the thread, I'd have bailed a long time ago. He reached out directly with clear desire to do something. I'll keep throwing life preservers in that case until it is clear they have been swept out to sea. And I'll circle back a few times to see if they have washed up somewhere.

@Jon822 to me 2. is a key one. That tells you the stage they are in and how the mindset / prison is the issue. If you can't get to a clear why very quickly, they are going to be tough to save. The ones i HAVE gotten started, we got to a clear undeniable WHY quickly and used it to drive action.

 

[BizyDad]

Oh, here is a great point that might illustrate the difference in our views. (this is more open ended, not a statement.)

The reason why I think it's wasted... is not because I do not think it benefits others. I know reading things will highlight things for other people.

The big reason it's wasted is because you are throwing tactic after tactic on a problem you can't actually see. It's like throwing all the troubleshooting steps out there hoping one is the answer. The reality is, you have the wrong manual.

Then, what you are highlighting, is others see that and think... "Wow, look at all these solutions, these are the answers to my problem too.... but which one" Well.... that may be true, and it also may not be true. Esp if they too are an unknown or unclear problem and now applying the wrong steps or the wrong order of steps to overcome any specific challenge.

They may also skip over the hard but needed step for the one that seems most easy since it was tossed out as a solution or tactic in the thread.

que chatgpt for a great analogy here....

Let me give a simple one a shot. Imagine JLE came to a board of therapists on the internet and said, " I have OCD, fix me ( <-big issue in the first place). In the real world, this wouldn't exist, but in theory here.... all those therapists just started throwing the book at him without examining and uncovering the entire "math problem" before attempting to solve it.

You would have a ton of tactics that solves parts of a problem in a random order.

I am not so sure that is actually as helpful as it seems... though it is great content.

(I want to reiterate that this post is on the fly, this isn't a hard statement of truth, open to discussion!)

Great analogy.

For me, there is value in throwing out tactic after tactic. Through the virtual trial and error I tested different approaches, overcame objections, it was not unlike a marketing split test to me but with a business consulting type of twist.

But those months ago, once I realized the underlying issue was 100% mental, I stopped. This kind of mental I have no clue how to help.

But I became a better helper and business consultant overall for having spent my time here. Along the way I also learned more about the personal training industry. Complaining to my current trainer about this thread opened up conversations with him. which means now I am helping my currently personal trainer with his business. And my trainer referred me a client. And at some point that dude and I might start a completely new business together. We've been kicking around ideas for a month or so.

Not sure any of that would've happened if this thread had never happened. But I'll admit, I'm also not the usual forum contributor.

Also, I just have fun here. Even the difficult convos here beat the pants off scrolling my socials to discuss someone's trip or wedding or dinner or sports team.

Random brain dump:

I've spent something like $2K on personal training in my life, and here is a brain dump of various questions / problems I've had while lifting. I'm not asking for answers since I've solved most of them, but here's a list of specific problems that I've faced that you might be able to help clients with.

• What can I do to consistently get good sleep so that I consistently feel good?
• What supplements are actually worth my money? And which supplements actually cause harm?
• Is there something that I can eat after weightlifting so that I don't crash?
• How can I incorporate running / sprinting into my weightlifting routine without seriously impacting my lifts?
• How can I avoid tearing my biceps during preacher curls?
• Why does my right should hurt while using the chest press machine?
• What is the right depth to use on the leg press machine?
  • Hell, which leg press to even use? My gym has like 7 variations
• Which handle should I use for tricep exercises?
• How can I hit my macros without stuffing myself and losing productivity?
• How can I fix my ankle tightness?
• How can I lift weights without impacting going to martial arts classes?
• How often should I take rest weeks? Should I skip exercise entirely, or just scale things down?
• How often should I change routines?
• How do I know that I've set up machines like the leg curl, leg press, chest press, shoulder press, etc to know that I'm getting the maximum potential muscle gain?

Also, young upper middle class moms are good clients because they want to look hot again and they have money.

This forum can't stop helping this guy.... Lolololol.

 

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[ZCP]

this is the spot where @biophase comes in, follows the advice to a tee, and buys a new mclaren in 30 days .... SO many personal training businesses could be started today from this thread!! Get to it! Start a progress thread!

 

[BizyDad]

this is the spot where @biophase comes in, follows the advice to a tee, and buys a new mclaren in 30 days .... SO many personal training businesses could be started today from this thread!! Get to it! Start a progress thread!

Who wants to be the forum's next biophase?

 

[Aidan04]

Nah F*ck that age is just an excuse to wait. He has a whole wife. You’ll be “ready to act” if you really want it.

"The world was built by the young, but they only got credit for it later."

 

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[Jon822]

Who wants to be the forum's next biophase?

I accept and will henceforth be referred to as mathphase.

 

[ZCP]

I accept and will henceforth be referred to as mathphase.

not until you start this business and buy a ferrari with it

 

[MJ DeMarco]

Just think, somewhere here in my city there is a string bean guy who can't bench press 135, training people at $250/hour... and he's booked solid for six months.

Yes, how do you determine where your time and replies in threads like these should be spent.

When the simplest things are turned into rocket science, combined with a bunch of "buts" ... but this, but that.

There's an old saying, "What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?"

When I say that a few times, I leave.

 

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[Timmy C]

Just think, somewhere here in my city there is a string bean guy who can't bench press 135, training people at $250/hour... and he's booked solid for six months.



When the simplest things are turned into rocket science, combined with a bunch of "buts" ... but this, but that.

There's an old saying, "What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?"

When I say that a few times, I leave.

Go to any gym worldwide and you will see trainers with not even a fraction of OP physique making money by training clients.

This is most personal trainers in my area, this isn't an outlier event.

Most of these personal trainers would kill to look like OP.

 

[Black_Dragon43]

LOL! This was a giant fiasco wtf…

But… what’s this “book” that @LightHouse @ZCP @BizyDad keep talking about? Please DM me the secret knawledge immediately, so I can become a billionaire! (Don’t worry, I promise to keep your secret so that only we will be billionaires)

 

[BizyDad]

LOL! This was a giant fiasco wtf…

But… what’s this “book” that @LightHouse @ZCP @BizyDad keep talking about? Please DM me the secret knawledge immediately, so I can become a billionaire! (Don’t worry, I promise to keep your secret so that only we will be billionaires)

I'm sure you've already read it.

Awaken the Dragon Within by Rony Tobbins or something like that...

 

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[Andy Black]

Meanwhile, today, @Spenny had a breakthrough:

https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/building-a-physical-products-business-utilising-e-commerce-social-media.106168/page-3#post-1095561

I'm all for helping people, but there's a great line by Amy Hoy:

"Help the people in motion."

Gym instructors find clients down the gym, not on couches.

Anyone care to cheer on Spenny and give him some feedback and suggestions?

 

[Black_Dragon43]

I'm sure you've already read it.

Awaken the Dragon Within by Rony Tobbins or something like that...

Actually I have. I much prefer his first book though, Unlimited Power. Imo Awaken the “Dragon” is a cheap attempt to create a unique mechanism / position as different from NLP (it’s not) through a cheesy thing called NAC and the effect of that is that the book became less effective and more diluted as Rony tries to take you on a trip that makes you forget the beginnings.

I was never a fan of forgetting the beginnings, but sometimes that is required in business and in life, and I can see why Rony did it. It’s better for you to drink an elixir that you THINK is unique to him, than one that you can find elsewhere!

 

[WillHurtDontCare]

man, he deleted his account

it's one thing to try and fail, even multiple times. But to just quit when you have people telling you that they believe in you (and even @ZCP actually pulling out his checkbook to help the guy out), makes you an a**hole. Don't make people regret believing in you.

 

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[Aidan04]

My takeaway from this ordeal:

This guy had the biggest people on the forum helping him and didn't take advantage of it.

I would kill for support like that.

I don't know if you remember this at all @BizyDad but I briefly had a similar moment where I posted my first big action on the forum and could not take the heat- and lashed out a bit.

It's almost like a test to see if you're coachable or not.

Eventually, I caved and learned to accept the wisdom of those who had a lot more experience compared to (then) 18-year-old me. Young people like me can be stubborn, and teaching yourself to be teachable is important.

It's good to not accept and rebel against scripted society's standards, but lashing out against the absolute MOST unscripted people you can find? That's just dumb as F*ck.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

Meanwhile, today, @Spenny had a breakthrough:

https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/building-a-physical-products-business-utilising-e-commerce-social-media.106168/page-3#post-1095561

I'm all for helping people, but there's a great line by Amy Hoy:

"Help the people in motion."

Gym instructors find clients down the gym, not on couches.

Anyone care to cheer on Spenny and give him some feedback and suggestions?

LOL, what a contrast to this clusterfuck of a thread.

Someone talking himself into failure...

And someone working himself into success...

 

[Andy Black]

LOL, what a contrast to this clusterfuck of a thread.

Someone talking himself into failure...

And someone working himself into success...

@Spenny writes about what he's done and the results, not what he's going to do, not doing, or why he's not done something.

I've not been following this thread. When someone's clearly in their own way then I Iike to give a few breadcrumbs and leave it up to them to follow if they want to and when they're ready.

There's lots of people on the forum quietly taking action and making great progress. I appreciate it when they leave breadcrumbs in their progress threads for the rest of us and I like drawing attention to those threads.

 

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[Hsolo23]

I don't wish to turn my personal training services into an e-book. I'm fine with sacrificing my time.

However, how can I market myself efficiently in order to attract clients for personal training services both online + offline?

I'm a Certified Personal Trainer living in the middle of Ontario and an aspiring competitive heavyweight bodybuilder.

I'm presently getting business cards printed.

Any advice?

A few Questions for you and things to consider as you start your PT journey. Please do not be discouraged or take them negatively. This field is very competative but that doesnt mean it's not possible for you to succeed.

You just recieved a personal training certification. What are you going to focus on? Weight-loss,Hypertrophy, strength, endurance, over all health and wellbeing?

Do you have knowledge in nutrition? Metabolism?
what are your workout focused on? HIIT? Hypertrophy?Group Training? Agility and Speed? Strength? Endurance?

Who is your target age? 18-24 25-31? etc...

As a personal trainer appearance and raporrt is everything, and you have to practice what you're willing to preach.
Appearing approachable and being knowledgeable in the gym definitly boosts credability. Smiling, dressing appropriately and smelling good is a plus.

When you say aspiring heavyweight bodybuilder- what exactly does this mean? Are you going to be competing? Do you have knowledge in PED's? training cycles, offseason cycles, caloric metrics for these cycles,Blood work and postcycling? All good information you should post about or prepare to answer questions on if thats going to be your target.

Have you trained with a personal trainer before? or have you always trained alone? Training or side branding along side a vetted personal trainer could help you show you the ropes on the various aspects of the trade.

Sometimes if you find a Very experienced freelance personal trainer thats growing their brand they will pass off some of their overflow clients for you to watch over their workouts he'll watch over you as you learn the trade. But like a new barber in a barber shop youll need to pay a cut. He passes you clients and you pay a share for marketing much like a big box gym providing you with a client.

Where will you be training your clients? Some big box gyms arnt to fond of freelance personal trainers taking buisness from their personal trainers. Research some gyms that dont make it a huge deal, eg.Planet Fitness.

Research some online training platforms to post your programs-trainerize, trainingpeaks, everfit, trainheroic for starters.

With all that being said,
Places with the cheapest ads are Athena, Nextdoor,Thumbtack,Bark, Meta Reels,Youtube Reels, TikTok, Meetup. If you have time, talk to people in the gym and make friends then provide them with a few workouts. " Hey bro can you give me a spot" "Could lead to "yeah man so here is your workout schedule for the next month" but dont seem desperate. Everyone is a "Personal trainer" now a days, stand out.

Remember you are your brand, So Aspring bodybuilder needs to show some credability as in "Im competing next month follow me and I can get you there too"

Things I've thought about and done as im slowly building my brand as well.

 

[Roli]

A few Questions for you and things to consider as you start your PT journey. Please do not be discouraged or take them negatively. This field is very competative but that doesnt mean it's not possible for you to succeed.

You just recieved a personal training certification. What are you going to focus on? Weight-loss,Hypertrophy, strength, endurance, over all health and wellbeing?

Do you have knowledge in nutrition? Metabolism?
what are your workout focused on? HIIT? Hypertrophy?Group Training? Agility and Speed? Strength? Endurance?

Who is your target age? 18-24 25-31? etc...

As a personal trainer appearance and raporrt is everything, and you have to practice what you're willing to preach.
Appearing approachable and being knowledgeable in the gym definitly boosts credability. Smiling, dressing appropriately and smelling good is a plus.

When you say aspiring heavyweight bodybuilder- what exactly does this mean? Are you going to be competing? Do you have knowledge in PED's? training cycles, offseason cycles, caloric metrics for these cycles,Blood work and postcycling? All good information you should post about or prepare to answer questions on if thats going to be your target.

Have you trained with a personal trainer before? or have you always trained alone? Training or side branding along side a vetted personal trainer could help you show you the ropes on the various aspects of the trade.

Sometimes if you find a Very experienced freelance personal trainer thats growing their brand they will pass off some of their overflow clients for you to watch over their workouts he'll watch over you as you learn the trade. But like a new barber in a barber shop youll need to pay a cut. He passes you clients and you pay a share for marketing much like a big box gym providing you with a client.

Where will you be training your clients? Some big box gyms arnt to fond of freelance personal trainers taking buisness from their personal trainers. Research some gyms that dont make it a huge deal, eg.Planet Fitness.

Research some online training platforms to post your programs-trainerize, trainingpeaks, everfit, trainheroic for starters.

With all that being said,
Places with the cheapest ads are Athena, Nextdoor,Thumbtack,Bark, Meta Reels,Youtube Reels, TikTok, Meetup. If you have time, talk to people in the gym and make friends then provide them with a few workouts. " Hey bro can you give me a spot" "Could lead to "yeah man so here is your workout schedule for the next month" but dont seem desperate. Everyone is a "Personal trainer" now a days, stand out.

Remember you are your brand, So Aspring bodybuilder needs to show some credability as in "Im competing next month follow me and I can get you there too"

Things I've thought about and done as im slowly building my brand as well.

This is post is from a deleted user, MJ added the word (not) into the title because he asked questions, got answers, but kept on asking the same questions. He was an action faker who kept on about his instagram and building his muscles instead of getting sales.

Then when we didn't all agree with him, he deleted his account. Hopefully nobody else wastes time answering him.