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NOTABLE! Getting Blacklisted for Spam (Cold Email Lead Techniques)

Real Deal Denver

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Has anyone been blacklisted for spam?

I am sending out massive marketing emails. Unsolicited. So that makes them spam. But they're not. Anyone ever run up against a brick wall with this?

Man, emails are monitored like you wouldn't believe. It's a catch-22. There are companies (MailChimp, AWeber, Constant Contact) that will manage a drip marketing email campaign IF a customer signs up by entering their name and email to receive the emails/promotions/newsletters. But how do you let these people know about this is the first place?

I'm sending out "spam" that includes incredible incentives. Free consultation - Free nine page article just for signing up - $100 off any service ordered. It's hard to sweeten this offer more than it is. The article is a very professional article containing a TON of information that I should be selling on Amazon for $4.99 a pop. I'm giving it away free. Along with a new article, equally as valuable, every week.

I've had two people request to stop sending them emails (opt OUT). That baffles me. You give them the kitchen sink, and they spit on you. Yes, I kind of take this personally...

I do appraisals. If you ever get a bad appraisal (for a purchase, sale, or refinance) you're in a big pile of crap. What do you do? Everyone has an opinion, but nobody really knows. I've been doing this for 20 years, and I do know. My article is: "Strategies to Deal With a Low Appraisal." It could save hours - tens of thousands of dollars - and prevent you from pulling your hair out. It's inside information. And I'm giving it away. Free. I'm starting to think I'm stupid...

Correction - actually, I knew that already.

Well, I'm being about as well received as a used car salesman. And on top of this "inside information" I'm giving a $100 discount to sweeten the pot even more. And I offer free advice and consultation.

Shit - are people this hard to please everywhere? Or am I in "spoiled brat land?" This information took me years to accumulate.

I'm about ready to withdraw this entire marketing campaign and let these fools figure everything out for themselves.

Now I find out that people can flag my overly generous offer emails as spam, and I can be blacklisted. Hmmmmmmmm.

Any feedback is appreciated. At least HERE, I know I have access to great thinkers.

BTW - the people I am marketing to are no dummies. Attorneys and realtors. And not just any of them - I am targeting the best of the best.
 

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Lionhearted

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Has anyone been blacklisted for spam?

I am sending out massive marketing emails. Unsolicited. So that makes them spam. But they're not. Anyone ever run up against a brick wall with this?

Man, emails are monitored like you wouldn't believe. It's a catch-22. There are companies (MailChimp, AWeber, Constant Contact) that will manage a drip marketing email campaign IF a customer signs up by entering their name and email to receive the emails/promotions/newsletters. But how do you let these people know about this is the first place?

I'm sending out "spam" that includes incredible incentives. Free consultation - Free nine page article just for signing up - $100 off any service ordered. It's hard to sweeten this offer more than it is. The article is a very professional article containing a TON of information that I should be selling on Amazon for $4.99 a pop. I'm giving it away free. Along with a new article, equally as valuable, every week.

I've had two people request to stop sending them emails (opt OUT). That baffles me. You give them the kitchen sink, and they spit on you. Yes, I kind of take this personally...

I do appraisals. If you ever get a bad appraisal (for a purchase, sale, or refinance) you're in a big pile of crap. What do you do? Everyone has an opinion, but nobody really knows. I've been doing this for 20 years, and I do know. My article is: "Strategies to Deal With a Low Appraisal." It could save hours - tens of thousands of dollars - and prevent you from pulling your hair out. It's inside information. And I'm giving it away. Free. I'm starting to think I'm stupid...

Correction - actually, I knew that already.

Well, I'm being about as well received as a used car salesman. And on top of this "inside information" I'm giving a $100 discount to sweeten the pot even more. And I offer free advice and consultation.

sh*t - are people this hard to please everywhere? Or am I in "spoiled brat land?" This information took me years to accumulate.

I'm about ready to withdraw this entire marketing campaign and let these fools figure everything out for themselves.

Now I find out that people can flag my overly generous offer emails as spam, and I can be blacklisted. Hmmmmmmmm.

Any feedback is appreciated. At least HERE, I know I have access to great thinkers.

BTW - the people I am marketing to are no dummies. Attorneys and realtors. And not just any of them - I am targeting the best of the best.
I think you are taking it too personally. See it as feedback. The market is telling you something try and figure out what it's telling you. Are you making any money on this?
Another thing I know is that people don't value things they get for "free". They figure if it's free it must be a scam or some way to hook me. Also if it's free they figure it has no value. I know I read what I pay for because I paid for it and saw value in it. I am different also because I read the free stuff too if I think there is value in it for me or I just want to figure out why it's "free". LOL
Maybe you are right, maybe you are giving away the farm. Maybe you should sell it on Amazon and see how that goes? It can't hurt. Right? Give it a shot. All the best.
 

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There are companies (MailChimp, AWeber, Constant Contact) that will manage a drip marketing email campaign IF a customer signs up by entering their name and email to receive the emails/promotions/newsletters. But how do you let these people know about this is the first place?
Well, you are sending out SPAM.

Where did you get your list? Are you using a company like mailchimp to send it out?

To answer your question, you have to run some sort of ad, do some marketing to get them to join your list before you send them your main email.
 

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I am sending out massive marketing emails. Unsolicited. So that makes them spam. But they're not
I beg to differ. That is EXACTLY what they are. If doesn't matter what the content is, massive unsolicited email marketing is the very definition of an email spammer regardless of the content.

Now you may feel you are providing massive value but this is delusional. It is only massive value if the person has requested it and wants it and deems if of value. And you can only know that if you have a relationship with them as in they have signed up for your emails and marketing offers.

Imagine if Warren Buffett sent out his picks for great investments to all and sundry. It might seem like massive value but if you have no interest in stocks and shares or have no money to invest then the information is worthless and just spam.

Your account will get blacklisted if you continue so maybe you need a more targeted approach rather than the the barn door.
 
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cy-

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Sending unsolicited e-mails to lawyers is NOT something I would ever recommend. The fines for SPAM can be quite big.

Despite the value your content may have, I would suggest calling them instead or showing up at their offices (if you live any close).

I've only dealt with very few lawyers, and mostly as a client, but my experience tells me these more (often) old fashioned people prefer human interaction over e-mails/online ads. Also depending on your advertisement budget of course.
 

George Appiah

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I'm sending out "spam" that includes incredible incentives. Free consultation - Free nine page article just for signing up - $100 off any service ordered. It's hard to sweeten this offer more than it is. The article is a very professional article containing a TON of information that I should be selling on Amazon for $4.99 a pop. I'm giving it away free. Along with a new article, equally as valuable, every week.
The fact that you see and consider something to be valuable does not mean everyone does or should.

Big mistake.

I've had two people request to stop sending them emails (opt OUT). That baffles me. You give them the kitchen sink, and they spit on you. Yes, I kind of take this personally...
See above.

And you should really be grateful and thank these people for contacting you to stop mailing them, instead of just marking your mail as spam (which, by your own description, appears to be).

Think about this: would you rather be mailing out to a list of 100,000 subscribers who never open your mail, or to a smaller list of 1,000 hyper-responsive subscribers?

sh*t - are people this hard to please everywhere? Or am I in "spoiled brat land?" This information took me years to accumulate.
Yea, I see this mindset all the time, even here in this very forum:

"I've spent 5 years of my life building this business, so it must be worth millions." Forget that no IP has been created all these 5 years and the said business can't even pay the owner a full-time salary.

"I worked my tail off to build this website, and the client doesn't even appreciate my work." Forget that the site takes ages to open, key features don't work, and looks like piss on mobile devices.

I'm about ready to withdraw this entire marketing campaign and let these fools figure everything out for themselves.
I'm speechless!

BTW - the people I am marketing to are no dummies. Attorneys and realtors. And not just any of them - I am targeting the best of the best.
OK, I get it now: you're saying they're not dummies.. they're mere "fools." :frown:

Why bother marketing to "fools" then?

What does that say of you?

Now, if you insist you want to market to "fools" ...

Man, emails are monitored like you wouldn't believe. It's a catch-22. There are companies (MailChimp, AWeber, Constant Contact) that will manage a drip marketing email campaign IF a customer signs up by entering their name and email to receive the emails/promotions/newsletters. But how do you let these people know about this is the first place?
No, I don't think it's catch-22 at all.

Perhaps you need to google email marketing 101 and sit down to do some learning... if you want to send out broadcast email campaigns. And take to heart what @biophase said:

To answer your question, you have to run some sort of ad, do some marketing to get them to join your list before you send them your main email.
Exactly.

In a nutshell, figure out a way to get people to willingly give you their name and email to receive your deal of a lifetime. These are the only people you can safely bet that they consider your offer valuable. After all, they willingly raised their hands and said: "I want to receive your super duper special offer."

You can't randomly select people and assume they should find your offer valuable, and then turn around to berate them and call them fools if they clearly tell you they don't want it.

As a friend likes to say, when you a$$-U-ME, you make an a$$ of you and me.

Any feedback is appreciated. At least HERE, I know I have access to great thinkers.
You have some good feedback already. I fear, though, that you will not listen.
 
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Sampath

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Has anyone been blacklisted for spam?

I am sending out massive marketing emails. Unsolicited. So that makes them spam. But they're not. Anyone ever run up against a brick wall with this?

Man, emails are monitored like you wouldn't believe. It's a catch-22. There are companies (MailChimp, AWeber, Constant Contact) that will manage a drip marketing email campaign IF a customer signs up by entering their name and email to receive the emails/promotions/newsletters. But how do you let these people know about this is the first place?

I'm sending out "spam" that includes incredible incentives. Free consultation - Free nine page article just for signing up - $100 off any service ordered. It's hard to sweeten this offer more than it is. The article is a very professional article containing a TON of information that I should be selling on Amazon for $4.99 a pop. I'm giving it away free. Along with a new article, equally as valuable, every week.

I've had two people request to stop sending them emails (opt OUT). That baffles me. You give them the kitchen sink, and they spit on you. Yes, I kind of take this personally...

I do appraisals. If you ever get a bad appraisal (for a purchase, sale, or refinance) you're in a big pile of crap. What do you do? Everyone has an opinion, but nobody really knows. I've been doing this for 20 years, and I do know. My article is: "Strategies to Deal With a Low Appraisal." It could save hours - tens of thousands of dollars - and prevent you from pulling your hair out. It's inside information. And I'm giving it away. Free. I'm starting to think I'm stupid...

Correction - actually, I knew that already.

Well, I'm being about as well received as a used car salesman. And on top of this "inside information" I'm giving a $100 discount to sweeten the pot even more. And I offer free advice and consultation.

sh*t - are people this hard to please everywhere? Or am I in "spoiled brat land?" This information took me years to accumulate.

I'm about ready to withdraw this entire marketing campaign and let these fools figure everything out for themselves.

Now I find out that people can flag my overly generous offer emails as spam, and I can be blacklisted. Hmmmmmmmm.

Any feedback is appreciated. At least HERE, I know I have access to great thinkers.

BTW - the people I am marketing to are no dummies. Attorneys and realtors. And not just any of them - I am targeting the best of the best.
Hi There
Sorry, I am not meaning to come as rude!
I understand that you may be offering the best product.
However, how would you know for sure - what you providing is what they need?
Have you done a market test earlier?
Have you considered understanding how email automation software works?
Have you considered re-looking your language in your email copy?
 

Lex DeVille

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BTW - the people I am marketing to are no dummies. Attorneys and realtors. And not just any of them - I am targeting the best of the best.
If you're targeting the best of the best, why would they want unsolicited advice from a stranger on the internet? There's a reason they're the best of the best. Because they don't take unsolicited advice from strangers on the internet!

:clench:
 

Ma Co

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If you "cold"-spam prospect straight from your server/email account, your IP address gets blacklisted. Get yourself a SMTP server that keeps care of your IP reputation (Socketlabs, Port25, etc.)
 

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Dude, you need to research CANSPAM laws... because you’re playing with fire.

You also need to dial it down a notch on your ego...

If I don’t know who you are and you’re giving me a discount on your services, it means ZERO to me. It’s the same as the 60+ (yeah, 60) undolicited letters from mortgage lenders trying to refinance my VA loan. They go straight to the garbage, because I never once expressed the desire to refinance. I bet they think they’re providing value by lowering my mortgage by $300/month, but I don’t care. I didn’t ask for it. See how similar that sounds to what you’re doing?
 

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There are companies (MailChimp, AWeber, Constant Contact) that will manage a drip marketing email campaign IF a customer signs up by entering their name and email to receive the emails/promotions/newsletters. But how do you let these people know about this is the first place?
A simple landing page explaining the glorious information contained in your head from 20 years of in-the-field experience. All FREE to them in exchange for their name and email address.

Run ads to your target market on Facebook and/or LinkedIn to drive traffic to your landing page.

AND/OR

Email the people on your list individually one by one (not a mass mailing please) to introduce yourself. Greet them by name and maybe mention their business name. Probably no more than a few sentences. Do not sell or mention your freebie. This is just an introduction with a brief explanation of how you can help their business and more importantly, their clients. Let them know if they'd like more information to simply reply to your email. Then if you get any responses, you reply back with a little more information and a link to your landing page.

EDIT to add:

Remember these people don't know you. You're going to have to go old school and build some rapport with them before you starting pitching your services.
 

MJ DeMarco

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Email the people on your list individually one by one
+1.

A custom email that clearly makes the recipient feel that he is a real person, not #231 on your list of 15000. You only do this by researching the person and adding in custom components to your pitch.

For instance...

"Hey MJ, I noticed you're using Xenforo and were complaining about lack of customization, I can provide custom code Xenforo mods to you. Here's a link to what I've done..."

VERSUS

"Custom Xenforo development ... we do it all. Email your web address for more info..."


The former will get my attention.
The latter will get deleted.
 
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Real Deal Denver

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All excellent insight. Every word is appreciated!

To put in a bit more information, I have went to their offices in person and introduced myself. I have also left pamphlets of information behind. Taking lawyers, for example - a large law firm may have 20 lawyers. Nobody can just walk in and talk with them. They are usually not there, and if they are, they don't want to stop what they're doing to talk to someone. They don't answer or return phone calls either.

So I make a visit - drop off some material - and follow it up with an email that looks slick (spam) instead of being a typed message, and it mentions them by name. So they can clearly see that a lot of time and effort has went into this. They are not number 200 on a list. They are on a list - that's the nature of marketing. I want ten great customers. Instead of contacting ten, I contact 100. I have to have some kind of time efficiency. Or maybe not. Maybe I should call and follow up with all 100 one at a time? That's a months worth of work. Might work though...

Nevertheless, I think I will have to call them on the phone, one by one. I hate to not use the huge advantage of email. But this seems like the best option - based on the insight that I have received here.

But all that aside, what I am offering IS something they will need. These emails are very targeted to people that DO use these services. I don't want to waste their time - and I sure don't want to waste mine either.

At the end of the day, just know that I do offer a great service that they will use. I'm not selling something they don't need or want. How to get the message out though... that's the issue.

Thanks to everyone for their great advice. I am trying to do this the right way without spending a fortune in time and money. I guess a personal large manila envelope with a flyer would be the highest impact way of doing it.

So much technology. Yet so ineffective. The irony.
 

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AllenCrawley

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@Real Deal Denver, I've done the following before with very, very good results when I owned a digital marketing agency. I might know a thing or two. :hilarious:

Develop your 'Dream 100' list. The top 100 attorneys/real estate agents you would love to have as clients sending work your way. Be very selective when choosing who makes your dream 100 list.

Research, research, research them until you know more about them and their company than they probably do. I did this by searching google, linkedin, manta, their websites, press releases, published case studies, news articles, etc.

Put together a shock and awe package. Make it a box or at least a lumpy envelop/package. Ship via FedEx in an Express envelop or box. Include a printed out version of your report plus anything else you determine would be beneficial. Include a day and time you will call them back and be expecting your call.

That worked incredibly well for us. Some even call us first because they didn't want to wait for my call. This is just a skeleton version of the method so you should know it's much more involved. I'm sure you may need to tweak a few things considering your target market but you should get the idea.

I hope you take this idea and run with it. Report back with your results.

I believe it is the Bill Glazier book that talks about lumpy mail:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0982379307/?tag=tff-amazonparser-20

Here's a video from Dan Kennedy that explains the shock and awe package idea.


This is just a skeleton version of the method so you should know it's much more involved.
I crack myself up.
 

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@AllenCrawley This is the best suggestion yet. It is very similar to my very successful "warm calling" method in which I acted as delivery boy only, handing a package to the receptionist and if I didn't know the relevant name, I requested her/him to pass it on to the right person, whose role I knew if not the name.

The response rate was amazing, and the speed of response was sometimes breathtakingly fast - sometimes it was by the time I got back to my car.

It only worked because the package contained samples, as well as more traditional stuff like brochure and price list.

I particularly like the "Lumpy Package."

Walter
 

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Although I think @AllenCrawley 's idea is even better...nay, far better, something that's worked for me that I'll throw into the mix:

The markets you serve will definitely have all manner of industry associations. You could put together a super-valuable webinar or similar (educational only, no sales pitch!), and offer to present it for free to the association's members. It serves their members and also helps out the association without them having to do any extra work.

If they're amenable, you can (and should) even write the emails for them to send to their list.

You'll be hosting the webinar - and naturally, you'll have your webinar platform integrated with your email list. So anyone who signs up for the webinar will go into your email list - because they want to hear what you have to say.

When you've run the webinar live, you can then have the association email the list again with the recording, and get a bunch more signups.

And you'll have the undivided attention of an engaged audience for an hour to boot.

Just don't blow it afterwards by then using your email list solely as an outlet for sales pitches rather than a medium for adding value.

I used a variant of this by hosting my own webinar program and getting an industry association to sponsor my webinars and promote each one to their list, and also host the links on their website. In return I mentioned their annual conference in the intro of each webinar and noted their sponsorship on my landing pages. Built a very engaged little email community that way (35-45% open rates, 10-20% click rates, very few unsubscribes, replies from time to time).

Cold email CAN be a viable tactic, IF you use specific outbound emailing software (eg. Quickmail, Yesware) to semi-automate your outreach process. If you do that it should look as if you personally wrote them the email, and invite a reply rather than dumping a link into their inbox. Not some jazzy HTML email like you get from Mailchimp or Activecampaign that screams "email list!". Then you can follow up individually (or have a well trained VA do it). Even then - it was far more effective a few years ago because nobody else was doing it. Now, not so much.

What should never happen is importing scraped lists into inbound marketing software and then sending them drip campaigns. Outbound is outbound. Inbound is inbound. Best not to mix and match the two.
 
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Just flipping wow.

What great minds we have here.

I have since focused this into a killer technique. Sometimes I just have to tear everything apart and analyze things fresh. The input here has been incredibly helpful in doing that.

Here is what I have done.

I have decided to go with the lumpy package method for attorneys. Love it. But they are not my ideal market. They are a side market that I will develop. I have a much better main market.

I have since talked to several managing brokers (real estate) about how their people analyze the market. I explained that I have been an appraiser for 20 years, and I have a a la carte method that they hire me to do portions that they may find difficult. I am just summarizing here for the sake of clarity. To interact and get honest feedback I went into a fair amount of detail. I wanted honest feedback, and that's exactly what I got. I discussed the services I could offer, and she said that there were many agents in her office that would hire me right now to take away the analysis part of their work for them, so they could be freed up to sell more. I love smart marketing people. That's exactly what I wanted her to see.

She said to send her the detailed information and she would present it to her 110 agents. I did not suggest that, by the way - she did. So now I have a factor of 110 to 1. I contact one person, and I have an in with 110. Love it. As a side note, she told me a story about one property that is blowing up in their faces because they priced it wrong. They didn't know how to analyze the market and now the seller is eating them alive. They are trying to figure out a way to salvage the situation, and passing it off to an expert would be the ticket for them to get out of the mess. She is not only going to advocate for me, but I can also take this further by giving a seminar for her office based on the nine page report I sent people for free (that nobody wanted). Take this one step further even. I'm going to develop my nine page article into a course that is state approved (for continuing education, which is required) and then when I give the seminar they will PAY me for the information.

I have also identified a third market segment that I will be developing, but for space restrictions, I won't go into that here. That segment will also be more profitable than attorneys.

I'm finishing up my presentation material to send. Then rinse and repeat. I can identify ten more offices that I can duplicate this situation in. The REALLY funny thing about all of this is I will be making more money doing piece meal work than I was making doing the whole job. Life is stranger than fiction sometimes.

This is not my end game. Plan B is for me to step into the role of agent and do for me what I do for them. Except I'm going for the high end clientele. $30,000 paychecks per deal accounts. Four of those a month. I know agents doing that right now. It's not a dream.

I'm not staying where I am. I just need the keys to unlock the doors, and I have now found it. The brainstorming here was instrumental in rethinking this through! In addition to my new plan, I'm immediately implementing the great suggestions here as well!!!
 

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@ Real Deal Denver It is great to see that you persevered in the face of some very strong criticism, but if you allowed pride to get in the way it would have caused you to take offence at what members here were saying.

Instead you have used that criticism to improve your methods. Not many people can take criticism and come up smiling.

Congratulations. I hope you go from strength to strength.

Walter
P.S. Congratulations also to all those who contributed, including the severe critics. This is a forum truly working for mutual benefit.
 

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@AllenCrawley This is the best suggestion yet. It is very similar to my very successful "warm calling" method in which I acted as delivery boy only, handing a package to the receptionist and if I didn't know the relevant name, I requested her/him to pass it on to the right person, whose role I knew if not the name.

The response rate was amazing, and the speed of response was sometimes breathtakingly fast - sometimes it was by the time I got back to my car.

It only worked because the package contained samples, as well as more traditional stuff like brochure and price list.

I particularly like the "Lumpy Package."

Walter
Brilliant! I love it.
 

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Put together a shock and awe package. Make it a box or at least a lumpy envelop/package. Ship via FedEx in an Express envelop or box. Include a printed out version of your report plus anything else you determine would be beneficial. Include a day and time you will call them back and be expecting your call.
There's definitely some great ideas posted above. The easiest way to reach your target market is to NOT do what everyone else is doing. While everyone is flocking to online outreach with the shotgun approach (email, LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook) because of its scalability, you can be the guy targeting your top 100 by doing things that don't scale -- hyperfocusing to your ideal clients.

Play the probabilities.

How many unsolicited emails do you think realtors and lawyers get a week? What's the probability that they end up in the trash before being opened?

How many lumpy envelopes and mystery packages do you think they get in a week? How many of these end up in the trash before opening? How many of these get opened and read?

If what you are giving out is as good as you say it is, they should be happy to receive a package from you and be driven to whatever your call to action is. You are giving them a clear call to action, aren't you?
 
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Real Deal Denver

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If what you are giving out is as good as you say it is, they should be happy to receive a package from you and be driven to whatever your call to action is. You are giving them a clear call to action, aren't you?
I'm giving them an extremely clear call to action. I am offering them a nine page article (no graphics - just rock solid information) on strategies to deal with a low appraisal. All they have to do is sign up for a weekly newsletter that will have even more useful information sent to them every week. Asking a lot aren't I? Let me type valuable articles for you - free - please?

My first article covers a sensitive topic (dealing with a low appraisal). Nobody really knows how to do this. When/if that happens they call another appraiser to step in. But how do they know the one they call is any good? The majority of appraisers are not good, based on what I have seen. It's the 80/20 rule for business. 20% of the players in business get 80% of the market - because they are really good at what they do. The remaining 80% fight over the leftovers. That's certainly true in what I've seen for appraising. The lenders have turned it into a commodity - who is the cheapest and fastest - period.

This is a somewhat secret profession. You have to be on the inside to really know how to deal with sticky issues. If you're not on the inside track, it's the blind leading the blind.

I thought my article would be well received, as it is "almost" secret information. It's certainly of high value to attorneys that deal with property issues (bankruptcy, divorce, probate, etc.). But I guess I got lost in the sea of ads they are bombarded with. That's okay. Although it kind of took the wind out of my sails and left me scratching my head, the plan I now have is 100 times better.

I did pick up a few future attorney clients along the way, so it wasn't a total loss. A very few did actually listen to what I had to say and were very receptive. But it was a very few.

I am projecting doubling my business now with my new strategy, starting in about a week. Yes, it's that good. I've already tested the waters and have received complete positive feedback. I mean - "come on in we need you RIGHT NOW" kind of feedback.

But I'm not sitting back like I have in years past. I am going to pursue the attorney market, as it is a very lucrative market, although not steady. A great sideline, for sure.

I am also going to develop my article into a live course. I kind of pat myself on my back for giving a seminar on how OTHER appraisers screw up, and what to do about it. Without bragging, and while giving solid gold information, I am putting myself on a pedestal, without putting myself on a pedestal. That's like the mayonnaise I buy (forget the brand) that says "real" mayonnaise. I joke with my wife to not buy that stuff made out of synthetic petroleum by-products. I like that advertising. "Real." Must really piss off their competitors?

We'll see how things go. The content of this thread has amazed me. I can't imagine it being able to get any better... but I hope I'm wrong about that!

I really have nobody to bounce business ideas off of, so the feedback I get here is so valuable to me. Again - a big shout OUT of thanks for all the great input. True genius here ~
 

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This thread is awesome. Not so much because of the content (which is good), but because of the structure.

1. @RealDealDenver posts a business frustration.
2. Gets kind of ripped a new one (constructively) by other forum users
3. RealDealDenver accepts the advice and adjusts.
4. RealDealDenver acts on the advice.

Well done!
 

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This thread is awesome. Not so much because of the content (which is good), but because of the structure.

1. @RealDealDenver posts a business frustration.
2. Gets kind of ripped a new one (constructively) by other forum users
3. RealDealDenver accepts the advice and adjusts.
4. RealDealDenver acts on the advice.

Well done!
Yes, some good advice here on how to approach cold leads.

Love the big bulky box advice, would certainly get my attention!

Upgraded to NOTABLE!
 

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Thanks so much for this valuable thread .
 
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Walter Hay

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How many lumpy envelopes and mystery packages do you think they get in a week? How many of these end up in the trash before opening? How many of these get opened and read?
For the benefit of others I should mention that my lumpy packages were not sealed. This allowed me to show the contents to an amenable receptionist, but if not, he/she would probably peek inside out of curiosity.

I never sent them by mail, but direct mail in standard envelopes gave my business a very high conversion rate averaging 4%. The opening rate was undoubtedly influenced by the obvious presence of a sample, but the conversion rate depended on two copy techniques:

1. The headline was designed to have a psychological demand to read on, and

2. The P.S. also had a compelling message. The P.S. appeared to be handwritten, just as my signature also appeared to be.

Finally, we never used an advertising agency, primarily because they didn't know the industry and what they turned out for our competitors was a waste of money.

Walter
 

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This thread is awesome. Not so much because of the content (which is good), but because of the structure.

1. @RealDealDenver posts a business frustration.
2. Gets kind of ripped a new one (constructively) by other forum users
3. RealDealDenver accepts the advice and adjusts.
4. RealDealDenver acts on the advice.

Well done!
Agreed. I'm super impressed with @Real Deal Denver just taking it and moving forward.
 

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@Real Deal Denver

Can you become known as "The XYZ Guy"?
(Sorry... I can't figure out what XYZ is for you... lol).

Consider what I've done in TFLF:
  • I've helped people with AdWords.
  • I've been SEEN to help people with AdWords.
  • I've ended up creating evergreen content about AdWords.
  • I've spoken to lots of people to help them with AdWords, knowing full well that they won't ever hire me, but that I end up positioned as "The XYZ Guy". Many have referred me onto people who have hired me to do XYZ for them. (To be clear... that's not my main goal of chatting to people. I'm so excited to help folks I do it for fun.)
  • Oh, and I've started recording some of those calls so I can refer people to them and not keep repeating myself.
  • I've PM'd every single person who's followed me to say Thanks, and ended up in many short conversations.

I've chosen not to do this outside of TFLF, although I occasionally join a Facebook group for biz owners and make a nuisance of myself by adding value and writing stuff that flows off my fingers at this stage.


Let's say I wanted to focus on running AdWords campaigns for cleaning companies.
  • I'd find where owners of cleaning businesses hangout.
  • I'd join in, ideally as a peer (which I can and have done because a sister-in-law is trying to grow a small cleaning business and I'm helping her).
  • I can start helping folks who ask questions about AdWords (you have to do this WITHOUT being spammy).
  • I am SEEN to be helping folks.
  • How long before people start noticing I know what I'm talking about?
  • How long before the group owner(s) notice that I'm helping their members?
  • I've done this a few times in Facebook groups to see if I can replicate what I've done in TFLF.
  • I never tell people to "PM me" (sheesh... how sad!).
  • It's resulted in PM's of people who reach out to me.
  • I've been hired, and people have bought my course.

Speaking of a course... yes, create one.
  • Make it short - your target market are busy business owners who put a value on their time.
  • The people who will do the course and DIY it were never going to hire you anyway.
  • Some people will take the course and hire you because they don't want to go through the steps.
  • The course gives you more credibility for those who would hire you.
  • It's nice to offer something to your DIY as well as the DFY markets.
  • Sales from the course can cover advertising costs that get you in front of more of your DFY market.

Also... books.
  • I've not done it yet, but get something up on Amazon.
  • It lends tremendous credibility.


This isn't just about getting inbound leads rather than outbound. If you're known as "The XYZ Guy" then it can help you when you do your outbound. People you contact are going to look you up of course. Not just on Google (where I'm all over search term "andy black adwords"). They're also going to check out the website associated with your email address. I've deliberately setup my personal website to be a redirect straight to my LinkedIn profile so people can do their research easier.


Something you're already thinking about:
  • "Who already has your customers?" (Jay Abraham)
Can you help someone else's customers, be seen doing it, and get on their radar? Can you create a win-win so *they* do the outbound work for you?
 

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