Andy shoots the breeze with eliquid

[Andy Black]

Me and @eliquid have been meaning to chat for years, and finally got round to it.

Here's 90 minutes of us chatting, knowing we're probably going to drop it into the forum.

Apologies that at about 30 mins it starts lagging. We turned off our videos and it gets a bit better. There's some periods in the middle where we lose Jason a bit, but it's great hearing his counter intuitive ideas about procrastination and other things.

> Click here to access the audio recording <

> Click here to access the YouTube recording <


What were your takeaways?

What will you do differently going forward?



(For other recordings click HERE.)​

 

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[eliquid]

The laggy parts were prob due to my connection since I live in a rural area.

If anyone wants clarification where it lags, just let me know and I will try to explain here in the forum.

.

 

[ZF Lee]

Will be listening into it! Thanks Andy and eliquid! Been a while since Andy did a fresh interview voice-over.

 

[eliquid]

Wow, I just listened to it. Ha it was so laggy. My bad, didn't realize my connection was so off.

Yeah anyone that listens that wants to know more, just let me know and I will clarify.

 

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[Andy Black]

Wow, I just listened to it. Ha it was so laggy. My bad, didn't realize my connection was so off.

Yeah anyone that listens that wants to know more, just let me know and I will clarify.

I’ll listen again and create some cliff-notes. From memory, what were your cliff-notes, and what was your main takeaway?

The main one for me was to make hay when the sun is shining / strike while the iron is hot. I’m chipping away at a nice pace, but am assuming the opportunities I see will be there forever. I could do with upping my pace a wee bit.

You also have me thinking about what my natural tendencies are. I thought I knew, but will have to think on it a bit more.

 

[BD64]

2 heavy hitters. excited to listen to this after work.

 

[Jeff Noel]

On my way home. I have to put the headphones on once I get there !

Thanks for sharing this, guys.
Whatever you two will talk about, I'm sure a lot of people will find value in it !

 

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[PizzaOnTheRoof]

The laggy parts were prob due to my connection since I live in a rural area.

If anyone wants clarification where it lags, just let me know and I will try to explain here in the forum.

.

Thanks for letting us in on the chat!

One thing that I think I understood but was very laggy was you talking about procrastination.

Would you mind expanding on that?

I do the same thing and procrastinate on nearly everything in life and I think it’s damaging certain aspects, especially getting started with my business...

I don’t know if it’s the way I work/am or if I need to change.

Thanks man!

 

[eliquid]

Thanks for letting us in on the chat!

One thing that I think I understood but was a very laggy was you talking about procrastination.

Would you mind expanding on that?

I do the same thing and procrastinate on nearly everything in life and I think it’s damaging certain aspects, especially getting started with my business...

I don’t know if it’s the way I work/am or if I need to change.

Thanks man!

@PizzaOnTheRoof

So the premise is, certain people are natural procrastinators.

Should that always be looked at as bad? I think not.

Of course, that depends on what you are procrastinating on and if it is damaging your life/career/goals too.

I can't speak for everyone, but there has been research done that shows certain types of people procrastinate more than others.

Since I have only done research on myself ( INTJ, 5w4/6 ), I can only speak on what I found personally.. which is original thinkers who are creative and love to tinker. You could call this person a "maker" which I had seen others refer to this as.

Even before this research, I knew I was a procrastinator.

I procrastinate on everything, not just things I hate/dont like/feel uncomfortable with.

Don't get me wrong, I get my shit done on time. I just wait until the last minute to do it.

But I had a nagging feeling that I must be some kind of loser. The guy that waits until the last minute and that I had a problem that needed to be fixed.

But procrastination isn't entirely about trying to get out of things you hate, don't like, or wish you had more info on before acting.

For example...

I get a rush ( adrenaline? ) from the challenge of trying to pull off the impossible at the last minute.

Some of my best work ever in my life came from procrastination.

Yeah, I knew I needed to write that speech, blog article, code snippet 7 days ago. But I wasn't interested.

Whoa, I only have 2 hours left before it's due?

I end up writing the most flawless article, perfect code snippet, greatest speech ever with no hiccups or mistakes. That wouldn't have happened 7 days ago, I would still be re-editing it and trying to make it perfect. It's like my brain was on the Limitless Pill during that 2 hour spread.

If I would have gotten started 7 days ago, it wouldn't have been a challenge.

My INTJ 5w4/6 personality craves the challenge deep down inside. It stimulates me. Anything else would be boring.

Have you ever had nothing else to lose?

Like you had hit rock bottom, nothing else stands in your way, and your back is up against the wall? All you have left is to just give it your all because there is nothing else left?

Yeah, that's similar to the feeling I get at the last minute.

Like you're 1 point down, 3 seconds left, and you got the ball dribbling past half-court so you better put everything in to making this last second shot to win the game.

But it's just not the rush and challenge, I'm actually producing some of the best output in that time crunch.

Procrastination also helps me refine and better the thoughts and ideas I have too.

I use to think acting on something now was important. Listen, I agree making hay while the sun shines is important ( I talk about it in the talk with Andy ), but some things can be left to "simmer".

However, when I procrastinate on an idea or thought.. I find myself forgetting about it while my subconscious percolates on it. It refines it, finds answers, connects the dots.. while I dump it and work on something else. Like life.

Many times I have had a problem or issue and decided to let it go. Only to find days later it pops up again in my thoughts but this time I have a solution for it that I never thought about before. Maybe I go to bed on an idea and wake up with it improved.

It's like I allowed my mind to work it out for me when I thought there was no way to improve it or solve it. Even it if has a pressing deadline and needs to be done soon, I just procrastinate and let it ferment in the back of my mind.

Does this happen with every issue and idea, no. Of course not.

Am I saying it will work for you. Nah.

All I am saying is some people are just built this way and there is no need to listen to others who might try to sway you to act or behave differently than you naturally are.

For me procrastination is a strength.

.

 

[BrandonS85]

Will watch soon , at what point does the shooting begin?

 

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[PizzaOnTheRoof]

@PizzaOnTheRoof

So the premise is, certain people are natural procrastinators.

Should that always be looked at as bad? I think not.

Of course, that depends on what you are procrastinating on and if it is damaging your life/career/goals too.

I can't speak for everyone, but there has been research done that shows certain types of people procrastinate more than others.

Since I have only done research on myself ( INTJ, 5w4/6 ), I can only speak on what I found personally.. which is original thinkers who are creative and love to tinker. You could call this person a "maker" which I had seen others refer to this as.

Even before this research, I knew I was a procrastinator.

I procrastinate on everything, not just things I hate/dont like/feel uncomfortable with.

Don't get me wrong, I get my shit done on time. I just wait until the last minute to do it.

But I had a nagging feeling that I must be some kind of loser. The guy that waits until the last minute and that I had a problem that needed to be fixed.

But procrastination isn't entirely about trying to get out of things you hate, don't like, or wish you had more info on before acting.

For example...

I get a rush ( adrenaline? ) from the challenge of trying to pull off the impossible at the last minute.

Some of my best work ever in my life came from procrastination.

Yeah, I knew I needed to write that speech, blog article, code snippet 7 days ago. But I wasn't interested.

Whoa, I only have 2 hours left before it's due?

I end up writing the most flawless article, perfect code snippet, greatest speech ever with no hiccups or mistakes. That wouldn't have happened 7 days ago, I would still be re-editing it and trying to make it perfect. It's like my brain was on the Limitless Pill during that 2 hour spread.

If I would have gotten started 7 days ago, it wouldn't have been a challenge.

My INTJ 5w4/6 personality craves the challenge deep down inside. It stimulates me. Anything else would be boring.

Have you ever had nothing else to lose?

Like you had hit rock bottom, nothing else stands in your way, and your back is up against the wall? All you have left is to just give it your all because there is nothing else left?

Yeah, that's similar to the feeling I get at the last minute.

Like you're 1 point down, 3 seconds left, and you got the ball dribbling past half-court so you better put everything in to making this last second shot to win the game.

But it's just not the rush and challenge, I'm actually producing some of the best output in that time crunch.

Procrastination also helps me refine and better the thoughts and ideas I have too.

I use to think acting on something now was important. Listen, I agree making hay while the sun shines is important ( I talk about it in the talk with Andy ), but some things can be left to "simmer".

However, when I procrastinate on an idea or thought.. I find myself forgetting about it while my subconscious percolates on it. It refines it, finds answers, connects the dots.. while I dump it and work on something else. Like life.

Many times I have had a problem or issue and decided to let it go. Only to find days later it pops up again in my thoughts but this time I have a solution for it that I never thought about before. Maybe I go to bed on an idea and wake up with it improved.

It's like I allowed my mind to work it out for me when I thought there was no way to improve it or solve it. Even it if has a pressing deadline and needs to be done soon, I just procrastinate and let it ferment in the back of my mind.

Does this happen with every issue and idea, no. Of course not.

Am I saying it will work for you. Nah.

All I am saying is some people are just built this way and there is no need to listen to others who might try to sway you to act or behave differently than you naturally are.

For me procrastination is a strength.

.

Thanks again Jason, that helps to clear things up. I think my main problem is taking the leap of faith and follow through with my plans. Instead, I procrastinate.

There's also no deadline or tangible punishment involved in improving my life. I keep procrastinating and making excuses. It's basically become a routine...research, plan, think, research some more...but never ACT.

I feel like something is wrong with me. Anyone else feel this way?

Sorry to hijack the thread :/

 

[Jeff Noel]

Thanks again Jason, that helps to clear things up. I think my main problem is taking the leap of faith and follow through with my plans. Instead, I procrastinate.

There's also no deadline or tangible punishment involved in improving my life. I keep procrastinating and making excuses. It's basically become a routine...research, plan, think, research some more...but never ACT.

I feel like something is wrong with me. Anyone else feel this way?

Sorry to hijack the thread :/

[offtopic]
I feel that too. I started taking really minor action lately, but everday I waste time and procrastinate. [I deleted a gigantic paragraph listing my latest list-of-things-I-have-not-achieved-yet]

I think the best thing to do, is to list what you need to get done (either mentally, digitally or physically). Once it's done, pick ONE thing. Do ONE step working towards the completion of that one thing. Repeat these steps everyday.
[/offtopic]

 

[Andy Black]

Thanks again Jason, that helps to clear things up. I think my main problem is taking the leap of faith and follow through with my plans. Instead, I procrastinate.

There's also no deadline or tangible punishment involved in improving my life. I keep procrastinating and making excuses. It's basically become a routine...research, plan, think, research some more...but never ACT.

I feel like something is wrong with me. Anyone else feel this way?

Sorry to hijack the thread :/

Give yourself a deadline.

"Stuff doesn't get done after meetings. It gets done before meetings." (Blaise Brosnan)

 

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[ProcessPro]

Conversation of the gods. Definitely going to listen after my work.

 

[MattR82]

@PizzaOnTheRoof

So the premise is, certain people are natural procrastinators.

Should that always be looked at as bad? I think not.

Of course, that depends on what you are procrastinating on and if it is damaging your life/career/goals too.

I can't speak for everyone, but there has been research done that shows certain types of people procrastinate more than others.

Since I have only done research on myself ( INTJ, 5w4/6 ), I can only speak on what I found personally.. which is original thinkers who are creative and love to tinker. You could call this person a "maker" which I had seen others refer to this as.

Even before this research, I knew I was a procrastinator.

I procrastinate on everything, not just things I hate/dont like/feel uncomfortable with.

Don't get me wrong, I get my shit done on time. I just wait until the last minute to do it.

But I had a nagging feeling that I must be some kind of loser. The guy that waits until the last minute and that I had a problem that needed to be fixed.

But procrastination isn't entirely about trying to get out of things you hate, don't like, or wish you had more info on before acting.

For example...

I get a rush ( adrenaline? ) from the challenge of trying to pull off the impossible at the last minute.

Some of my best work ever in my life came from procrastination.

Yeah, I knew I needed to write that speech, blog article, code snippet 7 days ago. But I wasn't interested.

Whoa, I only have 2 hours left before it's due?

I end up writing the most flawless article, perfect code snippet, greatest speech ever with no hiccups or mistakes. That wouldn't have happened 7 days ago, I would still be re-editing it and trying to make it perfect. It's like my brain was on the Limitless Pill during that 2 hour spread.

If I would have gotten started 7 days ago, it wouldn't have been a challenge.

My INTJ 5w4/6 personality craves the challenge deep down inside. It stimulates me. Anything else would be boring.

Have you ever had nothing else to lose?

Like you had hit rock bottom, nothing else stands in your way, and your back is up against the wall? All you have left is to just give it your all because there is nothing else left?

Yeah, that's similar to the feeling I get at the last minute.

Like you're 1 point down, 3 seconds left, and you got the ball dribbling past half-court so you better put everything in to making this last second shot to win the game.

But it's just not the rush and challenge, I'm actually producing some of the best output in that time crunch.

Procrastination also helps me refine and better the thoughts and ideas I have too.

I use to think acting on something now was important. Listen, I agree making hay while the sun shines is important ( I talk about it in the talk with Andy ), but some things can be left to "simmer".

However, when I procrastinate on an idea or thought.. I find myself forgetting about it while my subconscious percolates on it. It refines it, finds answers, connects the dots.. while I dump it and work on something else. Like life.

Many times I have had a problem or issue and decided to let it go. Only to find days later it pops up again in my thoughts but this time I have a solution for it that I never thought about before. Maybe I go to bed on an idea and wake up with it improved.

It's like I allowed my mind to work it out for me when I thought there was no way to improve it or solve it. Even it if has a pressing deadline and needs to be done soon, I just procrastinate and let it ferment in the back of my mind.

Does this happen with every issue and idea, no. Of course not.

Am I saying it will work for you. Nah.

All I am saying is some people are just built this way and there is no need to listen to others who might try to sway you to act or behave differently than you naturally are.

For me procrastination is a strength.

.

Reminds me a little bit of that Trey Parker and Matt Stone documentary on the making of a South Park episode. They give themselves 7 days till it goes on the air, otherwise.. it just doesn't work.

 

[PizzaOnTheRoof]

Give yourself a deadline.

"Stuff doesn't get done after meetings. It gets done before meetings." (Blaise Brosnan)

Reminds me a little bit of that Trey Parker and Matt Stone documentary on the making of a South Park episode. They give themselves 7 days till it goes on the air, otherwise.. it just doesn't work.

Absolutely guys. I NEED a deadline. Probably with some sort of punishment too if I don’t follow through.

I’ll check out that doc too

Thanks

 

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[eliquid]

I think there is a difference in someone who procrastinates on a deadline, and someone that just procrastinates.

With me, I have a deadline. Hence why I said I always meet my deadlines even though I wait until the last minute.

If you have no deadline, then yeah.. your procrastination will be the end of you.

The only cure I have found is that you just have to touch what you are procrastinating on. When that deadline is about to cross, I just touch the task I was procrastinating on and then it's the only thing I can think about.

Try just touching and working on it for 10 minutes. For me, that's what sets it off.

.

 

[BlackMagician]

I will listen this today.
As the topic on procrastination is going. I am in the same shoes. I just procrastinate. plain and simple. I just read novels. If i read novel in morning, i will just side step all my work/task and read the novel whole day. Its just like i get stuck in quagmire.

I think having a task list written down and having a deadline helps me but i stop doing this habit after some time.

Ha! Can anyone help me

 

[Andy Black]

I will listen this today.
As the topic on procrastination is going. I am in the same shoes. I just procrastinate. plain and simple. I just read novels. If i read novel in morning, i will just side step all my work/task and read the novel whole day. Its just like i get stuck in quagmire.

I think having a task list written down and having a deadline helps me but i stop doing this habit after some time.

Ha! Can anyone help me

How to overcome distractions

 

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[Andy Black]

Absolutely guys. I NEED a deadline. Probably with some sort of punishment too if I don’t follow through.

I’ll check out that doc too

Thanks

Meh to punishments. IMO, if you need a punishment then maybe you need a stronger why. My hack? Help people. Put other people first and don’t let them down.

 

[PizzaOnTheRoof]

Meh to punishments. IMO, if you need a punishment to do something then maybe you need a stronger why.

What if you don’t have a strong why?

What if you’re too comfortable where you’re at now?

Like a frog in slowly boiling water...he never tries to escape because in the MOMENT he’s comfortable...until it’s too late.

 

[Andy Black]

The only cure I have found is that you just have to touch what you are procrastinating on. When that deadline is about to cross, I just touch the task I was procrastinating on and then it's the only thing I can think about.

Try just touching and working on it for 10 minutes. For me, that's what sets it off.

.

Exactly.

“Darken the page.” (Gary Halbert)

One of the world’s best copywriters suggests you get a piece of paper out and just start. The rest will take care of itself.

Also... there’s a podcast where Doberman Dan describes how Gary Halbert wrote his copy. He’d read through all the material, then go chill for a few days... like go out on his boat fishing. Dan would start panicking that the deadline was looming. Gary wouldn’t allow any discussion beforehand on the topic. Then Gary would say... “It’s time” and they’d head back to shore and he’d start writing.

He filled up his brain with the input. Let it percolate for a while. Then he’d work on the output.

This is another reason why I don’t understand people consuming constantly. They fill up their head and don’t allow their brain to order the information and fit it into what’s already there. They’re collecting information, not knowledge, and certainly not wisdom. A book a day? Wtf?!?

Clarity and simplicity are our goals - not a never ending filling up of the overflowing glass.

 

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[Andy Black]

By the way... anyone who listens to this call, do the people following behind a favour and comment with your takeaways and what you’ll do different going forward. Commenting moves you imperceptibly from team consumer to team producer.

 

[Andy Black]

What if you don’t have a strong why?

What if you’re too comfortable where you’re at now?

Like a frog in slowly boiling water...he never tries to escape because in the MOMENT he’s comfortable...until it’s too late.

Make it about other people then?

Will you be late when you’re due to pick your elderly relative up from the airport? Or are you there on time?

Will you be late when your team leader needs that report to prevent his arse from getting kicked by senior management?

Will you be late when someone paid you to deliver X by Y date and Y date is coming up?

 

[BlokeInProgress]

Make it about other people then?

This!!!

I totally agree on this one, I think we do better (procrastinate less) when we're doing it for other people. Same as helping others even by going out of our way, that's human nature I guess. So if we make or dedicate it to others, it could move us forward more quickly.

 

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[Andy Black]

Some of my own observations:

1) I wave my hands ... a LOT! Except for when Jason is talking, when I then fold them to stop waving them around. I try not to move when someone else is talking, but I listen actively and smile and nod to encourage them to keep going.

2) Somehow we manage to “pass the mic” between us seamlessly. Not once in 90 minutes do we interrupt each other, and we’re two guys passionate about what we do, have a lot to say, and have never spoken to each other. Figure out how we do that.

3) The recording starts with me halfway through a sentence. I didn’t bother to edit that part out because it’s quicker to just upload to YouTube and Soundcloud, post to the forum, and be done with it. Would you have just uploaded it, or would you have *had* to edit it out. Do you think the recording is any worse for that half sentence?

Do you think we should redo the whole conversation because it got laggy in places?

4) Meh to click baity titles.

5) It’s so much better seeing Jason when he talks. Sure, we stop the video 30 minutes in, but you’ve got a feel for him by then. Do either of us come across as fake or over rehearsed? Do you instinctively trust Jason, and even more when he opens up and says he prefers working alone, and doing his own book-keeping? Do we come across as salesy, or as passionate techies/practitioners?

6) Do you think either of us are people you’d go for a coffee with? Why?

7) Do you think either of us are people you’d refer your friends to if they needed help with XYZ? Why?

8) If our first meeting was in person I’d shake eliquid’s hand, give him a big goofy grin, and probably a bro hug. Why though, when we’ve never met in person before?

I’d do the same with @Lex DeVille, @Fox, @MTF, @million$$$smile, @MJ DeMarco, @AllenCrawley, @Vigilante, @ZCP, @Walter Hay, and many many other forum members.

Why? Why would they shake my hand too?

Do you truly understand the biggest benefit of being in TFLF, or is this somewhere you’re taking, “building authority”, generating leads, or being snarky, negative, or just lurking?

Even if you don’t think you can “add value” (you’re wrong btw), you can still “just” support others.

 

[Andy Black]

One-liners I remember from the call:

“I’m doing it anyway.”

“Do things that don’t scale.”

“Be someone people will buy from.” (Craig Desorcy) (I’m going to write a post on that one.)

"Show them their bleeding neck." (Perry Marshall)

“Scratch your own itch.”

“Scratch your customer's itch.”

“Become a domain authority.”

“You can’t outsource passion and insight.”

“You don’t get the same insights when you’re not at the coalface.”

“I wouldn’t trust Google as far as I could throw them.”

“I’ve an idea for my eighth SaaS.”

Any others jump out at you?

 

[Andy Black]

Conversation of the gods.

Haha. Thanks.

Do we look and sound like gods though... or just two ordinary guys who are good at what they do, know themselves and how they work, and are confident enough to do it their own way?

Do you think we spend more time consuming and listening to others, or producing?

What’s the most important thing in our armories? Our skillsets, or our mindsets?

What about our sales skills? Do you think we’re classic “salesmen”? Would we get jobs selling door to door? Why? Would you buy from us? Why?

 

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[SamRussell]

Main take away: Don't accept other peoples opinions, ideas or suggestions - question them, find out the facts, form your own conclusions and take action based on those conclusions. If the data is pointing to an idea, follow it, test it and see what falls out the other end.

Secondary take away: Deadlines help get things done. I've found this in the past with creative things such as song writing. After spending 2.5 years writing an album, I booked a singer to re-work vocal parts and rewrote the vocals for 70% of the songs in 2 weeks. I'm now experimenting with a business model that has deadlines for releases throughout the year, which will boost my output if nothing else (and hopefully make a pretty penny at the same time)

It was a cool listen, thanks @Andy Black and @eliquid

 

[eliquid]

I will listen this today.
As the topic on procrastination is going. I am in the same shoes. I just procrastinate. plain and simple. I just read novels. If i read novel in morning, i will just side step all my work/task and read the novel whole day. Its just like i get stuck in quagmire.

I think having a task list written down and having a deadline helps me but i stop doing this habit after some time.

Ha! Can anyone help me

If that is what really happens, you need to replace the novel in the morning with your biggest task for the day.

Sounds like you may need a morning routine as well.