Lex DeVille's - I Deleted My Upwork Account...

[Invictus]

Not gonna lie, I've even copied some proposals and still got nothing lol.

Copying proposals ain't gonna get you no where, man. In fact, it's probably one of the worst possible things you can do.

I got a client today that told me I was the only person he was interviewing because my proposal was obviously tailored to his company. He said the rest were a bunch of copy-paste jobs that immediately turned him off.

(In fact, he was curious about me because in my proposal I barely discussed myself)

He isn't the first client that's mentioned it either. They're tired of seeing obviously bullshit copy and paste text.


On another note. I'm a bit worried about competin' with Lex, but that just means I gotta up my game.

 

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[thinkandgrowrich]

Copying proposals ain't gonna get you no where, man. In fact, it's probably one of the worst possible things you can do.

I got a client today that told me I was the only person he was interviewing because my proposal was obviously tailored to his company. He said the rest were a bunch of copy-paste jobs that immediately turned him off.

(In fact, he was curious about me because in my proposal I barely discussed myself)

He isn't the first client that's mentioned it either. They're tired of seeing obviously bullshit copy and paste text.


On another note. I'm a bit worried about competin' with Lex, but that just means I gotta up my game.

I'm talking about the template and the way in which its worded.

Obviously I tailor every proposal according to the task that needs to be done.

 

[Invictus]

I'm talking about the template and the way in which its worded.

Obviously I tailor every proposal according to the task that needs to be done.

Ah, my bad.

If you're using someone else's proposal as a template, it may still take some time to get right. You won't be using your voice, and if it's worded incorrectly it can sound odd. Might just be a matter of tweaking and tweaking till you find your style.

 

[thinkandgrowrich]

Ah, my bad.

If you're using someone else's proposal as a template, it may still take some time to get right. You won't be using your voice, and if it's worded incorrectly it can sound odd. Might just be a matter of tweaking and tweaking till you find your style.

The problem with my voice is that in person I use a lot of slang and I cuss like a sailor lol.

Whenever I send a proposal or cold email I feel like a disgusting robot who just wants a sale.

I guess I gotta keep trying and tweaking till I get it right.

 

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[AllenCrawley]

The problem with my voice is that in person I use a lot of slang and I cuss like a sailor lol.

It works for middlefingerproject, lol.

 

[Sadik]

Copying proposals ain't gonna get you no where, man. In fact, it's probably one of the worst possible things you can do.

I got a client today that told me I was the only person he was interviewing because my proposal was obviously tailored to his company. He said the rest were a bunch of copy-paste jobs that immediately turned him off.

(In fact, he was curious about me because in my proposal I barely discussed myself)

He isn't the first client that's mentioned it either. They're tired of seeing obviously bullshit copy and paste text.


On another note. I'm a bit worried about competin' with Lex, but that just means I gotta up my game.

That is my experience as well. I have loads of people telling me that they don't get replies from client. And when I ask them, almost all of them use copy paste proposals. I don't get how any sane person can think a copy paste cover letter of their own qualification is going to get anyone in the world interested.

The worse part is these "Freelancers" don't want to do the work. I told some the specific persuasion triggers to use in their proposal and tailor each of them to individual clients and their specific requirements. And guess what they thought it was too much work. They would rather be sending 30-40 proposals copy pasting then put in the work to craft a few good ones.

 

[Jan Edmark]

Man this is so timely! I'm trying to do almost the same thing (not the same experience and skill tho), gonna be watching this thread!

 

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[GuestUser4aMPs1]

I'm deleting my Upwork account to start over from scratch to prove the freelance market isn't as saturated as everyone believes.

Guilty as Charged.
So Many People NEED This.
Keeping eyes peeled. Thank You @SinisterLex !

 

[Sanj Modha]

Interesting. I'll be watching closely.

 

[Ayanle Farah]

Regardless of how you sell yourself you need to prove you can do the work and then deliver.

That was my main problem, I was constantly trying to get expertise but everytime either the client was asking for way too much, offering too little, or the jobs were filled with applicants or already taken.

Let's be real here, Upwork is saturated, that's not an excuse, it is all my experience being as objective as I can from observing how it works for an entire year.

It's a waste of time and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

 

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[JAJT]

Whenever I send a proposal or cold email I feel like a disgusting robot who just wants a sale.

Have you tried keeping your proposals casual?

People like casual a LOT more than they like corporate robot talk. I try to never talk in "corporate speak" when I talk to clients.

"Hey, just read your job and think I can help here. I'll warn you up front - my account is pretty new but I have tons of off-upwork experience and I guarantee I'll kick a$$ on this for you. Obviously unlimited revisions are a given and you wouldn't pay a dime if we aren't on the same page on any given project. I'll be honest - I want to find people that are easy to work with that love the hell out of the stuff I give them, that's really my only goal here. Happy to answer any questions, hit me up if this sounds good to you, cheers"

(I would obviously tailor the above to a real job and I probably laid the casual on a bit thick to prove a point but you get the idea).

Embrace the casual. Stop talking like a robot. They need to read your offers and proposals and think you are a human. People love working with other people. People hate working with corporate america.

 

[JAJT]

Compare what I just wrote to this:

"Dear sir,

I have read your proposal over thoroughly and believe I am the right freelancer for the job. I offer 5 years of experience in the copywriting field and pride myself on perfect corporate speach. Please review the numerous examples of my excellent robot talk in my profile, found here: www.whocares.com. My rate is $boring per hour and if you could please get back to me at your earliest convenience I would highly appreciate it. Looking forward to working with you"

Who would you actually want to respond to? The guy who you could talk to, but lacks experience, or the robot who clearly comes from a different planet?

 

[Lex DeVille]

That was my main problem, I was constantly trying to get expertise but everytime either the client was asking for way too much, offering too little, or the jobs were filled with applicants or already taken.

Let's be real here, Upwork is saturated, that's not an excuse, it is all my experience being as objective as I can from observing how it works for an entire year.

It's a waste of time and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

lol, told you guys people are saying this...

The problem ain't the system. The problem is your mind.

But maybe you're right and I'm wrong. Maybe I won't get any clients and won't go any higher than a few dollars.

Guess we'll see. >)

 

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[Sanj Modha]

I use UpWork for freelancers all the time and a common misconception is that people want cheap labor. That's not true at all. Most companies want quality which is affordable. If you don't have the money to get it right - you won't have the money to redo it.

 

[jpanarra]

F*ck YEAH @SinisterLex bringing down the truth again,

I read your threads and try to keep up with you (A lot of information to take in from what you share). Like I mentioned in another thread somewhere that I don't really use Up work or any sort of freelancer site. I went down the route of cold emails and cold calls, It works but its also can be discouraging at times if you have no sales over a period of time.

I'll start a profile so I can follow your thread a bit closer so I can understand the progress you're going through. I think it can be an alternative when my sales are slow and a good opportunity to practice my skills without high expectations. I'm only doing this for my own curiosity and maybe a new approach to build my copywriting skills!

Looking forward to your ups and downs on this!

 

[Ayanle Farah]

lol, told you guys people are saying this...

The problem ain't the system. The problem is your mind.

But maybe you're right and I'm wrong. Maybe I won't get any clients and won't go any higher than a few dollars.

Guess we'll see. >)

Yeah sure..it's all in my head

I must be hallucinating, how silly of me, it's impossible for it to be anything else, right?

Yes, the problem is the system, only a small number of people will get the jobs and most people won't, that's how it's designed.

Saying you can change it with your mind is the like saying you can defy gravity.

I was VERY open-minded to freelancing when I started and I rationally deduced why it didn't work. In hindsight, it was more about the competition than anything else, the lack of control was also a major contributing factor to my failure.

But go ahead, don't let me stop you.

 

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[Waspy]

Yeah sure..it's all in my head

I must be hallucinating, how silly of me, it's impossible for it to be anything else, right?

Yes, the problem is the system, only a small number of people will get the jobs and most people won't, that's how it's designed.

Saying you can change it with your mind is the like saying you can defy gravity.

I was VERY open-minded to freelancing when I started and I rationally deduced why it didn't work. In hindsight, it was more about the competition than anything else, the lack of control was also a major contributing factor to my failure.

But go ahead, don't let me stop you.

F - Must try harder

 

[Ayanle Farah]

F - Must try harder

I don't think I was talking to you, shoosh.

 

[GuestUser4aMPs1]

In hindsight, it was more about the competition than anything else, the lack of control was also a major contributing factor to my failure.

But go ahead, don't let me stop you.

Go Ahead,
Tell us about the sales you get NOT using Upwork.

 

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[RHL]

Top lel. In the time it took action fakers to become a success nonece, SL is going to do it twice.

 

[Invictus]

I just checked my Upwork account. I have worked (or am working) 25 contracts and some were repeat clients. So around twenty contracts from unique clients.

I've submitted 135 proposals. I get rejected a lot. Sometimes the client wants to pay a lot less. Sometimes I get beat out by someone better. Sometimes the client just never responds.

Upwork is not the greatest platform. Hell, Lex has a huge number of problems with it. And I don't think he's suggesting that Upwork is your best bet if you wanna go freelancing.

But it isn't this scary, impenetrable fortress. You've gotta shift through a lot of shit, you're gonna get most of your proposals shot down, you're going to offer a $300 rewrite and not get a response, and someone is gonna give you a good review rather than a five star review and your success score will tank, so you have to build it back up. It's going to suck for awhile.

It probably isn't your best move for a freelancing career if you've got samples and clients...

But it's not impossible. And if you've got nothing else, and nowhere to go (like I did), there are worse ideas.

 

[jpanarra]

Yeah sure..it's all in my head

I must be hallucinating, how silly of me, it's impossible for it to be anything else, right?

Yes, the problem is the system, only a small number of people will get the jobs and most people won't, that's how it's designed.

Saying you can change it with your mind is the like saying you can defy gravity.

I was VERY open-minded to freelancing when I started and I rationally deduced why it didn't work. In hindsight, it was more about the competition than anything else, the lack of control was also a major contributing factor to my failure.

But go ahead, don't let me stop you.

SL has done this once and hit it out of the ballpark the first time around. Then he took on students with resounding success and people have referred to him numerous times on his talent of copywriting and how to utilize upwork. Maybe put your arrogance aside for once and accept that you're doing something wrong and not getting clients. "Open-minded" doesn't mean that you are really willing to take crap work and give to the community before you prove yourself worthy. The only lack of control you had was yourself.

I don't think I was talking to you, shoosh.

Put your arrogance aside, accept that you're doing something different and its not getting results, figure it out and pivot it. People on here get work off of up work all the time.

 

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[Ayanle Farah]

Go Ahead,
Tell us about the sales you get NOT using Upwork.

You're welcome to check out my thread here: Taking Steps into the Mobile App Business

I will post all updates on my progress there, I rarely post anywhere else unless I really think I should.

SL has done this once and hit it out of the ballpark the first time around. Then he took on students with resounding success and people have referred to him numerous times on his talent of copywriting and how to utilize upwork. Maybe put your arrogance aside for once and accept that you're doing something wrong and not getting clients. "Open-minded" doesn't mean that you are really willing to take crap work and give to the community before you prove yourself worthy. The only lack of control you had was yourself.




Put your arrogance aside, accept that you're doing something different and its not getting results, figure it out and pivot it. People on here get work off of up work all the time.

Everyone's experience won't be exactly the same, I simply gave my own two cents without discouraging his attempt, maybe it's not what he wanted to hear.

I have accepted that what I was doing wasn't working, so I stopped it, I'm no longer freelancing.

 

[jpanarra]

Everyone's experience won't be exactly the same, I simply gave my own two cents without discouraging his attempt, maybe it's not what he wanted to hear.

I have accepted that what I was doing wasn't working, so I stopped it, I'm no longer freelancing.

You couldn't discourage SL if you tried... But what you did was discourage others who's interested in the freelance route which is the whole point of this thread and lex is trying to help them understand it is possible.

You flat out said

Yes, the problem is the system, only a small number of people will get the jobs and most people won't, that's how it's designed.

Let's be real here, Upwork is saturated, that's not an excuse, it is all my experience being as objective as I can from observing how it works for an entire year.

So those two statements were plain and simple, "I couldn't do it, upwork is too hard for youse. It'll be too hard for you guys because I couldn't do it, and heres my excuse why"

 

[Ayanle Farah]

You couldn't discourage SL if you tried... But what you did was discourage others who's interested in the freelance route which is the whole point of this thread and lex is trying to help them understand it is possible.

You flat out said






So those two statements were plain and simple, "I couldn't do it, upwork is too hard for youse. It'll be too hard for you guys because I couldn't do it, and heres my excuse why"

No, I'm saying "go for it but don't be sold on bs, I hope you succeed but this is the reality of it, know what you're getting into".

I'm not going to paint rainbows and say everyone can do it, that's what happened to me and if that discourages them, then I did them a favor.

Also possible is one thing, probable is another, by your logic we should all start gambling, pissing away our money because someone succeeded doing it.

We shouldn't sell hope as a plan, aren't we all here because we're tired of that?

 

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[InspireHD]

I have zero experience with Upwork and I have zero experience with copywriting. The furthest I got with Upwork was creating an account. After that, I don't know what to do.

Reading the last few comments has made me want to figure it out to prove people wrong.

The last few comments are also why I haven't told anybody, other than a couple really close friends and my immediate family, that I am starting a business. I don't want anyone to discourage me or tell me that I'm going to fail.

 

[DesignerOne.]

We shouldn't sell hope as a plan, aren't we all here because we're tired of that?

Lex isn't someone who hopes. He's starting from scratch, and creating VALUE. He's doing something he doesn't have to, and providing value to the forum.

Also possible is one thing, probable is another, by your logic we should all start gambling, pissing away our money because someone succeeded.

Pissing away money in freelancing/upwork doesn't happen. Lex succeeded in upwork TWICE, and now starting over. He isnt gambling at this point in the game, it's counting cards and winning your way up.

 

[Ayanle Farah]

I have zero experience with Upwork and I have zero experience with copywriting. The furthest I got with Upwork was creating an account. After that, I don't know what to do.

Reading the last few comments has made me want to figure it out to prove people wrong.

The last few comments are also why I haven't told anybody, other than a couple really close friends and my immediate family, that I am starting a business. I don't want anyone to discourage me or tell me that I'm going to fail.

You won't fail, there is no such thing as failure, only learning. However don't think you can get by without learning a whole lot before you succeed.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

You won't fail, there is no such thing as failure, only learning. However don't think you can get by without "learning" a whole lot before you succeed.

Please stop spamming my progress thread and wasting other people's time. Both of those are things you said you wouldn't do in your own progress thread.

 

[LTH]

This thread spurred me into starting an upwork account. So far i'm reading through job postings for writing jobs. One thing I have noticed is that many of postings are relatively informal compared to traditional job posting and that leaves a lot of room open to striking up a conversation and negotiation. You're talking directly to the person hiring, unlike traditional online job postings.

At the moment my priority is networking and just doing whatever I can for people to build that network, so this platform should be useful.

My original reluctance to join these freelance sites was reddit. I read that it's pointless trying to compete with people in third world countries who will work for nothing, and it stopped me dead from trying it out. Stupid.