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Jake

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Ok, Why would someone order from you then? Unless your customers live in Thailand the shipping time is going to be way way way longer? Or is it something im missing? Or what Amazon are you selling on?
You're missing something. The products don't come to Thailand
 

Dicky Dee

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I actually did this exact method a little over a month ago except i ran ppc (care to elaborate why you didnt) @biophase ?

Im now sitting on page 1 and 7 spots down from the top for my main keyword, the guys above me will be coming down soon enough.
 

Rudynate

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They'll probably contact their supplier and ask if they can get this "improved" version. Of course, they would not be able to (unless my factory backstabs me) without the 1000 MOQ and tooling costs.

I have a client who spent nearly three years developing an innovative hair care device which is selling briskly on Amazon and their own website. They have issued patents and registered trademarks in every important market in the world. Recently, their manufacturer in China notified them that an importer in Canada contacted them about producing knockoffs.
 

Dave510

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I have a client who spent nearly three years developing an innovative hair care device which is selling briskly on Amazon and their own website. They have issued patents and registered trademarks in every important market in the world. Recently, their manufacturer in China notified them that an importer in Canada contacted them about producing knockoffs.

There are ethical Chinese manufacturers who actually notify their customers of knockoff requests?
 
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Walter Hay

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There are ethical Chinese manufacturers who actually notify their customers of knockoff requests?
Yes there most definitely are. I have met many very ethical business people in China.

Relationships are of great importance, but the low personal standards of the individual might override those relationships if there is a lot of money involved. Personal standards have to be high if the relationship is to prove more important than money.

I have had similar experiences to the one mentioned by @Rudynate . I have had advertising removed from an associated company's literature when it showed a design that was exclusive to my business, and over the years I have been contacted by several manufacturers when they were contacted by a competitor of mine.

In one such case, the competitor thought the mold was an "open" mold, i.e. one owned by the factory and open for use by all customers. It was not, it was one that I had paid for. The manufacturer was not prepared to allow others to use it, and informed me of the decision as a matter of courtesy so that I would know what my competitor was doing.

Walter
 

Dave510

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Yes there most definitely are. I have met many very ethical business people in China.

Relationships are of great importance, but the low personal standards of the individual might override those relationships if there is a lot of money involved. Personal standards have to be high if the relationship is to prove more important than money.

I have had similar experiences to the one mentioned by @Rudynate . I have had advertising removed from an associated company's literature when it showed a design that was exclusive to my business, and over the years I have been contacted by several manufacturers when they were contacted by a competitor of mine.

In one such case, the competitor thought the mold was an "open" mold, i.e. one owned by the factory and open for use by all customers. It was not, it was one that I had paid for. The manufacturer was not prepared to allow others to use it, and informed me of the decision as a matter of courtesy so that I would know what my competitor was doing.

Walter

Thank you for your insight.

In your experience, if I were to try to find a manufacturer for my own product, is there anything I should look out for? Are there cues that would suggest the manufacturer is/is not truth worthy or someone I should build a business relationship with?
 

Walter Hay

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Thank you for your insight.

In your experience, if I were to try to find a manufacturer for my own product, is there anything I should look out for? Are there cues that would suggest the manufacturer is/is not truth worthy or someone I should build a business relationship with?
One of the things you should look for is how polite, helpful, and prompt they are in responding to your early contacts.

If they seem difficult to get on with in the early stages, they are likely to continue that way.

Be cautious about accepting what they say. If it is something you can check, then check it out. Of course I guess you know that if they ask for payment via WU you should go elsewhere.

It is worth searching their name and its possible variations on Google. Most names will not be found there except for their listings on B2B sites, but if there are bad reports they will often turn up on Google.

If you have a copy of my book have a look at Chapter 12 which is all about Assessing Suppliers.

Walter
 
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GuestUser141

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I am glad there is someone who realizes that AZ is being flooded with new sellers on items as you described

Not like it matters for me though, i am already blacklisted on amazon in terms of being a seller and buyer

Amazon is just a website,a retail search engine, if your blacklisted just create another.
Here's how?
think of any car and how it's identified, now invest in a very cheap car and drive to amazon,never ever use the cheap car on the road to amazon you drove before being blacklisted.

Rinse and repeat,choose a niche not in the top 1000, and compete in less competitive markets using 2 or 3 cars.

Any competitor gets overly competitive in your niche's,bump them of the road,through amazon.

Thank You
 

BlakeIC

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Amazon is just a website,a retail search engine, if your blacklisted just create another.
Here's how?
think of any car and how it's identified, now invest in a very cheap car and drive to amazon,never ever use the cheap car on the road to amazon you drove before being blacklisted.

Rinse and repeat,choose a niche not in the top 1000, and compete in less competitive markets using 2 or 3 cars.

Any competitor gets overly competitive in your niche's,bump them of the road,through amazon.

Thank You
:) It is not as simple as "creating another"

Its not like it matters anyways, even if I had the chance, knowing what I know now I would not utilize AZ or eBay
 

Oztrepreneur

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The hard way is to tackle a tougher product. One that AMZsellers would absolutely avoid mainly because they are lazy, not underfunded.
Bio are there any examples that would spring to mind. I am trying to look for products that I can improve and that also are difficult / restrictive in some sense as a barrier to competition entering. We always read keep it simple (no moving parts etc) but seems that may be no longer the best option for brand longevity! Always great to get your perspective.
 
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biophase

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Bio are there any examples that would spring to mind. I am trying to look for products that I can improve and that also are difficult / restrictive in some sense as a barrier to competition entering. We always read keep it simple (no moving parts etc) but seems that may be no longer the best option for brand longevity! Always great to get your perspective.

MJ used an example of selling mirrors. They are big, bulky and prone to breakage during shipping. If you just look at size and weight there are cushions, kettle bells, glass objects, etc. These are tough to ship so many people would avoid them.

Other products like shoes have so many sizes and are somewhat complicated to design.
 

amp0193

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Other products like shoes have so many sizes and are somewhat complicated to design.

Is this just a hypothetical example or do you some experience with designing a shoe?

I've got a friend who just started worked on a custom shoe line
 

biophase

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Is this just a hypothetical example or do you some experience with designing a shoe?

I've got a friend who just started worked on a custom shoe line

Purely hypothetical.
 
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JuliaLV

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Thanks a lot for sharing!
I had very similar experience with Kindle publishing (Stefan's K Money Mastery 2.0 course).
Great example for commandment of entry :)
 

MakeMoreMoves

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In the process of developing a complicated product, hopefully it sells. But since the initial cost is so high for tooling, custom logos, etc. Is it normal to be losing money per piece in the beginning? If I try to make a profit from each piece from the first order I'm overpriced compared to all competitors. The price per piece is very expensive right now. Also, since this is a very custom product, if I deal with many manufacturers to make these samples, should I feel like an a$$ that I made them do all this work and not even going to start an order? I feel like if I keep doing this, one by one every manufacturer will know my name that I cause them time and money making these samples, but I don't pull the trigger for full sample, but only on one.

I use example of a boat for my product. So if I am making a boat, there are infinite number of modifications, but at the end of the day its still a boat and I have to compete with all the other boats.
 

biophase

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JasonR

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Look through these listings and tell me which product you would buy? How does the public choose? Does any one stand out in this sea of same products, same photos, tons of fake reviews and giveaways.

Amazon is coming down hard on fake reviews. They aren't necessarily removing them, but they are giving very little weight to reviews to products purchased for a fraction of the price of the product. They know shitty products and review manipulation hurts their marketplace, and I'm glad they are correcting them.
 
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doinkdedoink

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Here is a great example of an Easy product. Who here wishes that they are in this niche right now?

I wanted to get one and can't figure out if any are actually any good.

Look through these listings and tell me which product you would buy? How does the public choose? Does any one stand out in this sea of same products, same photos, tons of fake reviews and giveaways.

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=kaisr&rh=i:aps,k:kaisr

They all look like a gagglefuck of bad copy and fake reviews, I am curious what you would do to improve these if you were to sell them? I am not interested in selling them but it's nice to have an actual product that I could see your feedback on.

Off the top of my head I could see maybe adding a puncture repair kit? Other then that I see a whole lot of complaints about how they don't stay inflated for more then an hour, so would you contact the manufacture and try to change the material it's made of, or using different liners for the inside so it doesn't leak?

I can see how this post may come off as me trying to get your advice so I can implement your ideas, but I am just trying to see how your thought process works. Thanks!
 

MakeMoreMoves

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Here is a great example of an Easy product. Who here wishes that they are in this niche right now?

I wanted to get one and can't figure out if any are actually any good.

Look through these listings and tell me which product you would buy? How does the public choose? Does any one stand out in this sea of same products, same photos, tons of fake reviews and giveaways.

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias=aps&field-keywords=kaisr&rh=i:aps,k:kaisr

Try garlic presses and lemon squeezers those are better ;)
 

biophase

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They all look like a gagglefuck of bad copy and fake reviews, I am curious what you would do to improve these if you were to sell them? I am not interested in selling them but it's nice to have an actual product that I could see your feedback on.

Off the top of my head I could see maybe adding a puncture repair kit? Other then that I see a whole lot of complaints about how they don't stay inflated for more then an hour, so would you contact the manufacture and try to change the material it's made of, or using different liners for the inside so it doesn't leak?

I can see how this post may come off as me trying to get your advice so I can implement your ideas, but I am just trying to see how your thought process works. Thanks!

Yes, I would figure out why they aren't holding air. I bet the seal flap is bad and probably needs a better material or some type of rubber. Then I'd make the material thicker and more resistant to punctures. If I'm going to do all that, I'd probably change the shape a little. I personally think it's too tall, there's no reason it needs to be that tall unless you are trying to make a chair. If you want to lounge on it, it could be several inches lower.

All this will add cost, so the product might end up being $75-$100. But if you had an $99 product which 500 4-5 star real reviews and your product was noticably different, you wouldnt care about all the knock offs. Customers would be able to clearly see which one is head and shoulders above the rest.

EDIT: So I just took a closer look at the product. They are using the exact same seal as dry bags. The material looks like a lightweight nylon. In fact, I import a product just like this one, except I use it as a bag and it's much smaller. Someone just needs to make a better sealing flap. I can bet that the ones that don't seal are using plastic edges instead of letting the material overlap the seal. Also, a thin double rubber strip would fix it and I bet some use it and some don't.
 
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biophase

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Hard Way

If I wanted to modify this product. The MOQ becomes 1000 units, $6/pc and tooling costs of $1600. It will take me probably 2 months to get this product going and I'll need to spend $7200 up front. But when my product hits Amazon, it will look different and be much improved over the 3 sellers currently selling. My product will rise to the top organically, no giveaways needed. It will also stay there. In 2 months, I'll rock their AMZ world. They'll probably contact their supplier and ask if they can get this "improved" version. Of course, they would not be able to (unless my factory backstabs me) without the 1000 MOQ and tooling costs.

* side note: My product will have name brand name built into the new mold. So if the factory screws me, the other seller's product will have my brand name on it. I'd have a much easier time filing a claim against them.

* side note: You never want to improve a product without adding your brand into it. Else you may have just paid the tooling and R&D for every other AMZseller.

Do you think the other 3 sellers will go spend $7200 to compete with me? I doubt it. They will just carry on spending $600 per 100 pcs. They won't even try to compete because they aren't willing or don't have the funds to improve the product.

So yesterday I finally shipped 1000 units of this product to Amazon. I made this post on Dec 26 2015, it is Sep 1 2016 and I FINALLY got this product delivered and on its way to FBA. This is an example of how long it can take to make your own product vs. a slapping a logo on off the shelf product.

Just checked the competitor and a few more have arrived since then. So now I have 7 competitors to deal with, but my product is different. I don't even worry about them. My product is not really competing against 7 competitors, its competing against 1 (because all the other 7 are the same).

I guess this will be a good case study on my method. I'm throwing it up against these guys with no launch or reviews. Will check back in a month.
 

JokerCrazyBeatz

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So yesterday I finally shipped 1000 units of this product to Amazon. I made this post on Dec 26 2015, it is Sep 1 2016 and I FINALLY got this product delivered and on its way to FBA. This is an example of how long it can take to make your own product vs. a slapping a logo on off the shelf product.

Just checked the competitor and a few more have arrived since then. So now I have 7 competitors to deal with, but my product is different. I don't even worry about them. My product is not really competing against 7 competitors, its competing against 1 (because all the other 7 are the same).

I guess this will be a good case study on my method. I'm throwing it up against these guys with no launch or reviews. Will check back in a month.
You got me excited to see what happens next!
 

Walter Hay

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So yesterday I finally shipped 1000 units of this product to Amazon. I made this post on Dec 26 2015, it is Sep 1 2016 and I FINALLY got this product delivered and on its way to FBA. This is an example of how long it can take to make your own product vs. a slapping a logo on off the shelf product.

Just checked the competitor and a few more have arrived since then. So now I have 7 competitors to deal with, but my product is different. I don't even worry about them. My product is not really competing against 7 competitors, its competing against 1 (because all the other 7 are the same).

I guess this will be a good case study on my method. I'm throwing it up against these guys with no launch or reviews. Will check back in a month.
I am so pleased to see this post. It puts a touch of reality into the area of new product development. Starry eyed new entrepreneurs tend to be impatient, but you have been doing this for long enough to take a realistic approach, and that should help those new to the scene.

There are many factors that can result in this long lead time from concept to delivery, but the Chinese tendency to not want to be rushed is often a factor. It might not have been in your case, but I mention it so that others will appreciate that rushing a Chinese business person into decisions and action can be counter-productive.

Walter
 
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Jean-Pierre

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So yesterday I finally shipped 1000 units of this product to Amazon. I made this post on Dec 26 2015, it is Sep 1 2016 and I FINALLY got this product delivered and on its way to FBA. This is an example of how long it can take to make your own product vs. a slapping a logo on off the shelf product.

Great post and love it even more because you started it a couple of days after Christmas!

That "FINALLY" feeling of FINALLY completing something you've spent months CREATING is the best feeling in the world.

Look forward to hearing how well the launch went
 

biophase

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I am so pleased to see this post. It puts a touch of reality into the area of new product development. Starry eyed new entrepreneurs tend to be impatient, but you have been doing this for long enough to take a realistic approach, and that should help those new to the scene.

There are many factors that can result in this long lead time from concept to delivery, but the Chinese tendency to not want to be rushed is often a factor. It might not have been in your case, but I mention it so that others will appreciate that rushing a Chinese business person into decisions and action can be counter-productive.

Walter

Hi Walter,

I ended going with 3 different factories and they just couldn't get things right. Not big things, but tiny little things like I'd spec 150cm and the samples would come back 148cm. They'd agree to fix it in production and I'd tell them no, I want another correct sample, then it would be 149cm. The problem with textiles, is that when I ask for 150cm, they'd cut 150cm, but on the edges they need to fold it over and hemmed the edges making it shorter.

They either couldn't grasp that they needed to cut 152cm, or I suspect that they quoted based on 150cm of material and were trying to skimp out on the material, after all, 2cm x 142cm x 1000 pcs equals alot of extra material.

I never did get the 150cm, I just agreed to 149cm. I needed to get this out and if it sells well, I'm going to get my 150cm on the second order! LOL
 

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