Building a Second Income Before the Second Kid

[Joe Cassandra]

SELF-EMPLOYED ---> NEEDS MORE AUTOMATED SALES:

I was talking with a client last week...he had just gotten back from a 2-week vacation in Maine (beautiful state!). He was a bit flustered.

Right now, 90% of his revenue each month comes from doing LIVE webinars. These webinars work great...but, it's manual work. After his vacation, he was 'back in the grind' because "Sales sucked ---we didn't do any live webinars."

I thought about my own business. Right now, if I stopped working...besides some residual royalties...we'd be sunk. My wife stays at home. We have a 2-year old. I'm the sole breadwinner.

To thicken the plot, my wife is due in January with Kid #2. Last time we had a kid, I quit my job. For this kid, it's build another freakin' income stream to free up my time!

-----------

You can read my initial journey in my NOTABLE post here.

I've gotten PMs asking the 'hows' and 'whats' about what I did. Plus, some great feedback in the post itself.

I started writing copy 'as a business' in August 2015. I quit my job February 1, 2016 with student loans, mortage, CC debt, you name it. Still, I created a new life for our family.

I believe others could do the same if they knew what to do.

THUS....

I've decided to create a course around what you can do to get the same results:

Course will be based around:
1) Making full-time income writing copy
2) Being able to quit your job in 6-12 months
3) Get better at your copy as you work with clients
​

INFO MARKETING IS FOR SCAMMERS:

Yes, there is a ton of junk out there. Hopefully, you see in every post I write, there is value coming across. I take each post I make on this forum very seriously.

I believe this course could be one to last for awhile. I'd add new content to it at no-extra-charge to existing members.

For copywriting, there are some Udemy courses that are cheap and general. There's also AWAI. They have courses and conferences. But, their customer service sucks. Plus, their courses are generally not neatly packaged. Typically the modules are just webinars they recorded with experts. Unrehearsed etc. Good stuff. But believe they miss some major pieces (including mindset).

@jkennedy got major flak for his recent post. But, I believe his post was an opportunity window that opened in my head. That day, I was stressing because work was a bit slow and when we have more kids, I can't always be stressing about work. Else, I'll miss out on time with them. Even now, I'm not always checked in when I'm around my wife and kid.

I needed to find a new income stream that's automated. I know very few people who quit their job to write like I did...

------------------
ACTION STEPS:

1. I purchased David Siteman Garland's "Awesome Courses" training. ($1,000). Won't link here for fear of post-banning. David was one of the first online dudes I ever listened to. I finally got to pay him for the help he didn't know he gave.

2. I need your help. Based on the PMs and regular questions I get...the need is there. Not to mention, content is king in this age of the internet. Companies need writers. Good writers.

But, to create the best content possible, I need some outside perspective. See, I live in a bubble working in my spare bedroom everyday. I need other ideas from those who have jobs, who want to quit, who need help, etc.

That's why I've put together a survey. It takes 2 minutes. And, NO you don't need to put your name or email if you don't want.

[Click here]Your expert feedback is most needed at this time.
**YES you can be 100% anonymous in your answer
**NO you don't need to put your info if you don't want
**NO there is absolutely nothing to buy​

I'll keep progress of the course as it goes.

I'm not afraid of anyone ripping me off because to build an info-product --- a genuine one --- you need to experience the journey and result yourself before teaching. A scammer can't do that, and people sniff that out fast.

 

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[Joe Cassandra]

LAUNCH UPDATE ---> BIG FAILURE:

Just packed up launching my course last night. The course was $997 for lifetime access with a 5-day window it opened.

By the end of it, I didn't even get within a mile of my 50 sales goal. I had mega-high hopes with all the emails I was getting, and the interest my free info was garnering.

RECAP:

On Tuesday (last week), I released a 3-part video series going from: picking a niche --> mistakes to avoid ---> 5 steps to close your first client in 30 days.

I had high hopes for the video series thinking it would be a slam dunk. Like I mentioned above, I ran FB ads during the 3-part video series. Essentially, someone would see ads for the video series rather than the free book (as I was doing before).

The FB ads for the video were much more expensive. The cost-per-lead higher. However, the landing page conversion was on par with the free book. I targeted similar audiences, so it must come down to the copy of the ad:


(The green portion is the 3-part video series ad. Notice the large spikes in costs with less leads). I didn't expect to sell more books as the opt-in didn't go to an upsell page.

In the end, I essentially started the launch with about 2,450 subscribers. Some from the free book and now being pushed to the 3-part video...others solely to the 3-part video series (they never received a free book)

Again, I thought this free video series would bring home the bacon because I packed mega-value (for free) in it. Unfortunately, not too many people took part:

(snapshot from this morning...5 days after the last video launched)

As you can see, not too many folks even watched the videos. Granted, they weren't 5 minute videos. Each video was a 20-60 minute value piece, so I can understand people not having time to watch them.
I'm betting most of the "349" were from those who watched from the FB ads, not from my actual list who got the free book.

I'm not sure why that is... Could those who opt-in for a free book be "non-video" people?

As you can imagine, this was a foreshadowing of what was to come. If no one is getting value, why would they give me value ($$$).

---------------
On Friday, I kicked open the doors to ELITE. I had visions of the 50 sales I was going to hit (as that was my goal above).

I now chuckle to myself for all the wide visions I had...

At the end of Day 1, I thought I had failed. We were out eating pizza and my phone buzzed. Customer #1! (it was nice to see, because the sale was to a forum member here).

Then, later that night *ding* another one! Okay now we're rollin'...

That was it for Day 1.

Day 2 (a Saturday) saw another sale come in! Woop. Still 47 off my goal, but it was great to see at least I was selling something, right?

Day 3 (Sunday)....0
Day 4 (Monday)...0

Just to give you an idea, here was my email sequence:
- Day 1 of ELITE - (1) email -- open email
- Day 2 of ELITE - (1) email -- open email
- Day 3 of ELITE - (1) email -- scarcity email
- Day 4 of ELITE - (2) emails --- (1) bonus video they can watch (2) price justification for the course
- Day 5 of ELITE - (3) emails --- (1) scarcity email (2) price justification (3) Game over

As you can imagine, I'm shedding subscribers left and right here...unsubscribes everytime an email goes out (sometimes up to 25 people unsubscribing at once).

In the end, I'm left with about 2,300 subscribers after this launch.

------------
During this launch, I'm getting emails from folks with encouraging words:

"You put out great information, but I just can't afford this"
"I lost my job and making $8 per hour...can you help me for free?"
"I'm unsubscribing...this isn't relevant to me" (wtf?)

Here's my favorite one:



Those are hilarious. Oh, and the person who wrote me this email was one that asked "Hey, can you give this to me for free. At some point, I can repay you...I'm struggling with my bills now."

------------
Okay...yesterday saw the biggest sales bump.
But, don't get your expectations high.

The morning of Day 5 went with 0 sales. Then, I logged into my email yesterday and saw another sale! Fast forwarding, in the end, I saw 3 more sales come in.

For a grand total of...7. Way off from my 50 goal. Somewhat discouraging. At the same time, I'm very grateful for the 7 who took the plunge with me.

With the course, I'm offering a 60-day guarantee...thus, I expect at least 1-2 of those as that's fairly common with higher ticket courses.

I had one lady reach out this morning saying she missed the deadline and she wants in. I could've had sale 8, but my word throughout the launch is "this is it". If I start slacking on my word there, where would it stop?

In the end, after ad spend and merchant fees, I'll make about $1,000 . A lot of work for a $1,000! But, now I have some assets to leverage, plus an email list that may buy in the future.

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WHAT DID I LEARN & OPEN QUESTIONS:

1.) I started my course (and this thread) basically August 1st. About 2 months later, I had a business launched and profitable. Yes, it's an info-product which many frown upon here. However, I picked up many skills about email marketing and FB ads.

2.) It seems I can get cold traffic folks to buy a cheap $7 book, but for higher ticket items, it's going to be a longer sales cycle. I reached out to a popular online marketer asking him, and this is what he said:



What's your experience with cold traffic?

3) I was too cocky in terms of what I believe I could do in a short period of time. I figured with all the people asking about writing that it'd be a walk in the park to make sales of a high ticket course. WRONG! Patience is key.

4) I really enjoy the process of a product and seeing "passive" income roll in vs. my current business of writing. It's a fun contrast to each other.

5) There's nothing like getting people to invest in a product from someone they barely know. They trust me enough to pay $1k to learn from me despite never meeting, etc.

--------
I'll probably take a break from this thread for a bit as I have many client projects and new ELITE members to tend to (not to mention a pregnant wife!).

Thanks!

 

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[Joe Cassandra]

UPDATE:

- Finished recording 2 of 8 modules this week...should knock out 2 more by the end of the week [4 hours of content after 2 modules]
- Working tonight on an upsell for the initial free book optin (help pay for the ads)
- Created all the bonuses
- Website is up [not going to post link now]



GAMEPLAN:

1. Finish the Modules this week and the next 2 weeks
2. Finish upsell funnel this week
3. Record 3-part launch series video by EOM
4. Create 5 value emails to send to opt-ins
---
LAUNCHING:
5. Driving traffic to my opt-in page. Strategies I'm considering:
- Facebook ads (could get expensive)
- Guest posting (could take forever)
- Sponsored ads (as BusinessBen mentioned above)
- Getting interviewed somewhere
- Posting on Linkedin + Groups

6. Create launch emails
7. Create sales page
8. Set up membership pages
9. Launch the 3-part video series
10. LAUNCH COURSE!!

-------
Tech still need set-up

- Vimeo
- Amazon storage
- I have an old license for OptimizePress...I might be able to skirt past having to buy a software like Course Cats. Will need to try it out first.
- Stripe payments
- Deadline Funnel (?)

 

[Andy Black]

Following. Didn't see I was tagged earlier. Don't know much about SEO.

I've a course, and am just now looking to promote it outside of the forum.

It's hosted on Thinkific, just for speed of getting it online. It doesn't really have a sales page, the sales page is the Marketplace Ad in the forum.

I know @Fox is using Optimizepress to host his course. I actually have OP but bought Thrivethemes last week to use to build my optin page.

I'll probably start with AdWords paid search to try and build a list. I want the consistency of paid search traffic, and if I can build it so that the CPC matches the EPC then it can run fly-wheel like.

Then I'll look to other channels.

I'm looking at Drip as my email service.


Looks like we're both at the marketing / promoting stage... only difference is I don't have another baby on the way so wasn't under the gun. I also went for a short-sharp course with only one hour's worth of videos.

From my Marketplace Ad you can see it's priced at $399 with a discount voucher for $100. It could really be priced at $499 ish.


I may create a $99 offering and maybe something even cheaper (monthly email(s) for $9/mth?).

I can definitely see some more advanced courses that could either be bundled with the Jumpstart course or sold separately.

We'll see.



My *plan* (will change as soon as I take action) is to get people to a page where they optin to get a report and/or a daily email course.

Immediately after they optin I'll send them to a Thank You page showing the course and an option to Hire Me.

If someone wants to buy a course or hire someone there and then I feel I'm doing them a disservice to not immediately give them the option.

Then each email that gets sent out has a standard footer with links to the course and the hire me page. It's there all the time. I'm not going to wait till the seventh email to tell them there's a course.

Similar to you, I don't have to build an email list then ask them what they want. People already asked me if I have a course, so I created one, have sold it enough times, and have enough good feedback to know it helps people and there's a market for it.

I realise that people ending up on my list may not want to buy the course at all... so yeah, I might end up surveying them, maybe right on a page prior to the Thank You page.

The main reason I'm doing this even though it's a distraction from my main DFY business is that I think some DFY work might come out of it. It's a possible lead gen system that pays for itself with the DIY offerings, while bringing DFY leads. This will likely help the service side of your business @Joe Cassandra...

 

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[Andy Black]

I forgot to mention...

I get automated emails telling me of Stripe or PayPal money coming in from clients on monthly plans. They're great to see.

The ones that come in from sales of the course always surprise me because they average about one a week and are so random. Getting a payment notification for my course always has me looking at my phone wondering who that client is that's just paid, till I realise it's my course.

I've actually forgotten I've got a course, and apart from mailing people who signup for the free trial, I don't do any work on it now.

What makes these payments even more special is that I don't have to do any additional work once paid. The work for the course was already done. The work for the clients still has to be done that month.

I get a little buzz each time an email comes in. I can't imagine what it must be like averaging one a day, and then multiple a day. (Just to put that in context... say I get one $300 sale per sale, then that is an extra $9k per month... and it's pretty damn passive.)

Hmmm... maybe I should also create a progress thread just on this part of my business?

 

[Joe Cassandra]

Done and Submitted.

Thanks for this Joe, I appreciate you taking the time you put into writing this and responding to my PMs.

Yep, I'm gonna answer your question (from the PM) tonight or tomorrow in a post on my main thread. It's a fairly common question so thanks for bringing it to the light so I can answer it.

Thanks for filling out the survey. It really helps because I know what content to put into the main thread (and eventually in the course I'll create and market on Facebook, etc.)

This has absolutely something I have been thinking about as well. I am working a full-time job while working on my side business at this time. My wife has been very supportive while we have a newborn and she gives me time to work on the business. We are a few years out from having our second child, but I am working like mad to ensure that I have a solid foundation for when that day comes

EDIT: After doing the survey @Joe Cassandra, I am very jealous by that mortgage amount. I am coming to your house and bunking up lol lol.

Here's why I think learning how to write copy for businesses is such an incredible opportunity now --- even if you don't want to do it for a living...

1) Whatever business you start, you'll need copy: That's a given. Especially online. Why not learn in the trenches with real businesses, get paid and keep the experience for life?

2) You can leverage the knowledge into doing anything: My wife isn't interested in starting a business anytime soon (2-year old and another on the way)...but she loves to bake. If she was in a job right now, she could start writing copy for 'baking magazines,' 'bakers selling products/courses' on the side...so she'd get to write about what she loves. While she does that, she could create a course on baking. With her copy chops, she'll be able to market the hell out of it and automate her income. Then, use that money to open a bakery.

To get more specific, for me, I want to get into TV writing. Writing stories is fun, and the demand for great TV scripts will skyrocket the next 10 years.

Here's the rub --- breaking into this industry is (duh) very difficult. I know it's going to take 5-10 years of toiling, "NOs" and such before a good producer picks up my script and says "Yes".

In the meantime, I'm making my own hours, leveraging my time with a course like this --- all to OPEN UP time to work on this venture without a boss peeking over my shoulder.

Best part of writing copy for businesses...(okay maybe not the best, but a good perk)... it costs virtually $0. Besides books and courses to learn, all you need is Google Drive, email, and your smartphone (your phone you're paying for anyway)!

------------------

@Dunkafelics I heard Canadian real estate is going nuts. Actually, we sold that house ($168k mortgage) as we moved out of Texas to Georgia. Got a better,bigger house now, plus just remodeled the kitchen. Both times, funny enough, I used my copy skills to write the owners a letter during the offer phase. Both times we had worse offers than the top-bidders and got the house

 

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[Joe Cassandra]

Rolling along with this...

Been a bit slower than I want as I have tons of new client work from my copy business coming in. So, this is a "1 am project" at the moment.

- Finished recording all the modules/lessons [about 16 hours of content before bonus materials]

- I remember I bought OptimizePress last year. I didn't realize they have a membership area. So, I spent hours yesterday trying to sort that out and setting up all the different 'locked' content areas [still haven't figured it all out including how people actually log-in]

BIG TIME NEXT STEPS:

So, many would disagree with this...

But I'm building my course first, then promoting my site afterwards. Many recommend doing both at the same time. For my sanity (with juggling my business and a pregnant wife), it's easier for me to get the course stuff out of the way, figure out all the hiccups with that, and then concentrate 100% on promotion rather than 50/50.

The reason being: if someone optins in now, I don't time to write cultivating/nurturing content to keep them engaged. I'd rather have the course done and spend all my time cultivating.

1.) Figure out how to lock all the content up in OptimizePress
2.) Upload videos to VimeoPro
3.) Set up 3-part video series for launch promo
4.) Write Sales Letter
5.) Then, 100% focus on promotion
6.) At 500 optins --- Launch course!!!

 

[Joe Cassandra]

Okay, update time...!

Been running FB ads for 4 days. That's pretty much been the extent of what I've worked on.

I didn't set up the pixel correctly, so I can't provide a screenshot (fixed it so can provide it next time).

I spent around $1,000 in ads. Subscriber count at 269.

For the $7 book upsell, I've sold 18 [one guy had to pay through Paypal]. So, net sales of $126.70


Thus, net cost of ads = $874.
Cost per new subscriber = $3.25

I'll take that! I expected around $5 per new lead, so this is on the right path for me.

Already got great feedback on the $7 book, so that's a sure sign.
Unfortunately, it's not converting at near the percent I'd like. Right now, it's around 7%.

I'd ideally like to see 10 - 15% for an upsell. 8% is the standard conversion, but I'd like to see higher.

One thing I did was if they missed the $7 upsell, I pitch the book later for $12 (because it was a one-time offer) and gotten a few sales from that. I'll take it!

Upped the ad budget. The idea is to launch the course around Sept 30th and be at around 1,000 subscribers when I do. Work to do!

 

[Joe Cassandra]

Update time!

So, for now I've been ramping up FB ads and it's been going great to bring leads into the funnel. For now, I've put my "content strategy' on the backburner right now (the opp. mentioned on Sep 12th)

I've put it aside for now because I'm looking to launch this course next week, so need all my focus there rather than organic building.

Here's my list right now:


Since September 12th, I've spent $2,942 on FB ads. However, some of that is mitigated by my $7 book sales. Thanks to @Invictus advice, I added a Paypal button. Now, it seems everyone is only paying through Paypal!!

Yesterday, I doubled my normal sales of the book! And today, I woke up to 7 new sales after only 55 opt-ins...that's a freakin' 12.7% conversion on a cold funnel which is above average...

Problem is: I'm having trouble implementing Paypal into my site. For awhile yesterday, I had to manually send the books to people as the site kept breaking when they ordered! I found a work around for the moment, but for the course launch, I might not be able to pull that off!

-----------------
Here's the metrics so far:

This is where it gets exciting:



Notice how the CPC dropped a ton. I can only correlate adding Paypal as the reason for the spike in sales yesterday (hat tip again to Invictus)...then look at the cost per lead on the right....

Look how fast it's dropping!!!Cost per lead is calculated by: [ADSPEND - SALES (from book)] / LEADS].

How did that happen?

Optimizing like mad my FB ads. I'll probably share a whole post on my FB ads method another time. [To be honest...1 ad is stomping every other ad I wrote by 100X...I'll share it in the future]

-----------------------------
NEXT UP: ...Worries...

So, I was reading a post by Ramit Sethi yesterday. He talked about spending $2 MILLION on Fb ads (here: it's actually a sales letter but in the middle he talks about it) and it resulted in tens of thousands in subscribers but only 2 sales. I don't know how much he's stretching the truth to make his point so I'm not sure.

So, obviously I'm worried all these subscribers will result in 0 sales. As you can see, I'm getting entry level buyers, which should increase the chances of backend sales. Who knows....we will know in 2 weeks!
---------
On the work-side...it's simply pumping out more ads and then finishing writing the sales emails. Then, cart open!

Stay tuned!

 

[Joe Cassandra]

CRUNCH TIME ---> LAUNCH OF THE COURSE THIS WEEK

Alright, today marks the first day of the launch of the course...
What does that mean?

Well, the plan is to lead into the course sales page with a 3-part video series packed with value. I mean, these are 2-3 hours of content given away for free...no fluff. All as a way to build credibility, excitement and trust.

Here's the link to the opt-in page if anyone wanted to watch the launch from the inside.
------------------
How am I looking leading into this...

SUBSCRIBER COUNT (up to right now): 2,329

$7 BOOKS SOLD: 208 [conversion rate at a hair under 9%. my goal was 10% so on-par]

GROSS SPENT ON FB ADS: $5,786.
TOTAL SALES FROM BOOK: $1,491 [a few purchased the $12 second chance offer]
NET SPENT ON FB ADS: $4,295

My goal was to spend $5k or less, so right on par with that.

However....

----------
Leading into the 3-part video launch, I'll be launching fresh new ads for the next 2-3 days to send folks right to 3-part video (no book/upsell). That'll come out to about another $1,500 in ad spend. So, I'll be a bit over in my goal. But, I wanted to test if sending people from cold-traffic ---> 3-part series ---> sales page converts better or worst than those who read my free book/buy the upsell, etc.

I don't expect them to do better, but I want to see how far off in conversions it will be.

WHAT'S LEFT TO DO?

Really, it's watching the FB ads and tweaking the delivery of emails so everyone who gets the video series is also getting all the emails until we close. I'll be responding to emails from folks, banning people who write "scammer" and correct my grammar on my FB ads, then crossing my fingers for the actual sales page launch on Thursday night (eastern time).

I have a major goal of at least 50 sales (about $50k in gross). Talking to other course creators, they say to expect your first course launch to do around $5,000.

Am I overreaching?...haha...we will see. I expect one of us to be right

 

[Joe Cassandra]

Exactly a week ago I started this thread.

Wow! I'm up to almost a dozen responses to my private survey (Click here to take it). Many great responses from Forum members ... some fairly detailed and personal. They helped a bunch.

-------------------

I have a white board in my home office where I put "expected deadlines" to wrangle all the content together for this course:
- lead magnets
- modules in course
- bonuses
- sales page

My expected launch date would be around the end of October.



Well, this week I've been on a tear. I had little client work this week, so I've been head-down, up until 2am working on this...and I've blown through an October deadline.

I've already outlined and put together the deck for:
- Lead magnets
- 4 of 8 modules

I expect to knock out the next 4 modules this week. Record them all the following week. Put up website. Then, go full marketing ninja building a list. Could be building list by the 20th.

"Oh, if you put the content together so fast...it must be fluff stuff like those affiliate scammers"

Actually, I've put it together fast because I've worked 14 hours a day on it, plus I'm pulling from content I've produced before. I'm really seeing a vision for the value this course provides.

If anyone has any recommendations for:
- where to store video (best place)
- Autoresponder/email services​

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If you've thought about making money learning copywriting....take this 2-min. survey so I know what content to produce on the Forum and in the course. You'll be helping many people.

CLICK HERE TO TAKE SURVEY [nothing to buy, cross my heart]

 

[JustKris]

For straight up video hosting, I like Vimeo. The Vimeo Pro option is pretty reasonable (200 bucks/yr). Wistia is also nice, but pricey.
Another option is using an online course site like Thinkific or Teachable, which I'm also looking at. (They seem pretty similar, so I can't really comment on the quality of either one.)

For email automation, I've used a ton of options. MailCheat(Chimp) is free and actually has added some very basic automation. Active Campaign is really reasonable ($9/mo to start). My favorite right now is Convertkit, b/c it's so easy to setup automations. The more expensive options (Infusionsoft, etc) are very powerful, but honestly a bit of a nightmare if you're doing everything yourself.

Good luck, man! I'm in a similar boat---2nd child arriving in a couple months, turning my "gun for hire" skills into a scalable solution.

 

[Joe Cassandra]

Try to get a press release published on a blog. I did this and got around 50 emails using a pop-up after my press release got published. The reason for only getting 50 subscribers was because the blog wasn't that popular. I'm sure if you find a popular blog, you can get over 100 emails - 200 emails. Other than that, facebook ads is how I built my list. Comparing both options, I find the people from the blog were a lot more responsive to opening emails than the people from facebook. Keep up the progress!

Thanks BB! I don't see many sites that publish press releases. Many do "contributor" posts (like I've done on Business INSIDERS etc.), but they wouldn't accept a pure, direct press release. Do you have an example of a site that does this. Maybe we're not thinking of the same thing. Thanks!

For straight up video hosting, I like Vimeo. The Vimeo Pro option is pretty reasonable (200 bucks/yr). Wistia is also nice, but pricey.
Another option is using an online course site like Thinkific or Teachable, which I'm also looking at. (They seem pretty similar, so I can't really comment on the quality of either one.)

For email automation, I've used a ton of options. MailCheat(Chimp) is free and actually has added some very basic automation. Active Campaign is really reasonable ($9/mo to start). My favorite right now is Convertkit, b/c it's so easy to setup automations. The more expensive options (Infusionsoft, etc) are very powerful, but honestly a bit of a nightmare if you're doing everything yourself.

Whoa, just looked at Wistia...$2200/year. Shizsters...

I'm looking at VimeoPro.
Also heard about Vidello VIDELLO [anyone have experience with that?]

Definitely didn't want to do YouTube as that cheapens the videos.

Good luck, man! I'm in a similar boat---2nd child arriving in a couple months, turning my "gun for hire" skills into a scalable solution.

Progress thread, brah?

*Poundcake* for two kiddies!

I'm very happy and excited that you are taking the time to write a course like this Joe. Freelance copy writing is also my full-time income but I'm not yet operating at the same level that you are at this moment in time. It's always nice to learn from others who are ahead of you on the same/similar paths. Do you have a timeline and price point for when the course will be released?

I have also discovered the major problems with divorcing time from income in this sector but I'm actively trying to get into Real Estate as my second income method.

Thanks Jordan. Real estate's down the list. To be honest, I want to be a screenwriter. Copywriting now and making a bunch now allows me to free up my time to pursue those passions. This thread allows me to free up my time EVEN MORE. See where this is going?

Copywriting today is a HUGE opportunity out there for regular peeps to break the chain of a happiness-sucking job by writing because the need's there. Companies need AWESOME WRITING more than ever because:
- More content consumption from social media...blogs..etc.
- Customer's are as skeptical as ever. Just tacking "50% OFF" on stuff doesn't work as well anymore. You need to convince.

Just got a direct mail piece in the mail trying to get me to donate to their school because the Pope is corrupt! It was a fun read. Not long enough to persuade me though...

Another was a "FREE" offer with a $4.95 's&h' cost for buying their rosary. An obvious front-end offer to sell me some Holy Family life-size statues on the back-end! [Christian marketing is BIG now...huge OPPs]


Anyway...
-----------------
What do I plan to price this course for?

That's a tricky question. I'm in a battle royale with my mind right now. 'Sensible Value vs. Greed'. If you close just ONE client (doable) for $1,500 - $3,000/month as I have done with a select few...what would you pay?

Or, if you were getting $5k - $10k projects + commission regularly (I just closed a client 1 hour ago for $6500 plus 4%)...what would you pay???

My thoughts:

Tiered pricing:
$497
$997
$1497

Each would have little extras including webinars, private calls, etc. I'm basically giving away everything I've learned. If I had started doing all of this 2 years ago when I started (rather than starting 10 months ago)...I'd be in a bigger house for sure.

 

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[Joe Cassandra]

That's a lot of content---good job!

Doing the same thing (creating the course first and then focusing on promotion). I don't know how people pre-sell a course and then create it in a couple days. It's just not enough time if you have work/family responsibilities.

Yeah, for many they'd say "oh, you're afraid of selling and doing the real, rough advertising stuff". Nah. I just don't want to rush a great course. Plus, I'm having to figure out all this tech crap that I don't want to be stressed about later on. Thanks for the encouragement.

-------------
Trying to keep the updates weekly at minimum...

What I've worked on:
- Figured out the OptimizePress stuff (took some time...plus dumb SSL troubles as well...fixed after hours with programmers)

- Uploaded my videos yesterday and today. Not with Vimeo. Trying out Vidello. Seems smooth so far. My process was recording my screen with the Screentastify Chrome plugin ($20 and works awesome!). Then, upload to Vidello. With over 16 hours of premium content, you can imagine this takes up a lot of space and takes forever to upload.

- Finished writing an upsell letter after someone optins and putting together the sales page. Had to figure out the tech for this too.

KEY POINT: The best time to ask for a small sale is right after someone opts in to your list. I'm upselling a $7 ebook I wrote. It also gets someone BUYING. A BUYING CUSTOMER is worth WAYYY MORE in the long-term than a non-buyer.​

- Opened my Amazon S3 account and uploaded all the downloads/slides

WHAT I'm DOING NEXT:

- Linking up all the Vidello videos with the course pages. Plus, the downloads from S3. Plus, writing the content on each membership page. This is very "repetitive/manual-labor" intensive, so not looking forward to this, but happy when it'll be done.

- After this, it's really marketing time. I'll do my blog outreach method above. Plus, start FB ads.

- Have NOT written the sales letter for the product itself, but I'm a bit burned out right now and don't believe I'll write a good one at this point. Will wait until my head clears after some subscribers come through and I get motivated again.

-------------------------
I've managed to squeeze in this stuff while juggling new clients and projects. I can't wait to finish this 'upfront work' portion and then simply open the cart and see what happens.

I'm working fast as lightening and into the deep hours of the night. Doing this because I know a few new copy clients are about to get kicked off and I'll get sidetracked by my actual business. Thus, this would stall. Need to get this grunt work done ASAP.

 

[Joe Cassandra]

Hey Joe, looking forward to watching your progress. Your thread reminded me of a similar company called Proofread Anywhere. You might be able to pickup some ideas from them. Keep up the good work!

Thanks man! This actually could be a great partner to work with. Sending the CEO an email ASAP! If you know of any other good sites like this that are indirectly correlated, feel free to leave them in this thread (may help others interested).

Following. Didn't see I was tagged earlier. Don't know much about SEO.

I'll probably start with AdWords paid search to try and build a list. I want the consistency of paid search traffic, and if I can build it so that the CPC matches the EPC then it can run fly-wheel like.

Looks like we're both at the marketing / promoting stage... only difference is I don't have another baby on the way so wasn't under the gun. I also went for a short-sharp course with only one hour's worth of videos.

From my Marketplace Ad you can see it's priced at $399 with a discount voucher for $100. It could really be priced at $499 ish.

I may create a $99 offering and maybe something even cheaper (monthly email(s) for $9/mth?).

My *plan* (will change as soon as I take action) is to get people to a page where they optin to get a report and/or a daily email course.

Immediately after they optin I'll send them to a Thank You page showing the course and an option to Hire Me.

If someone wants to buy a course or hire someone there and then I feel I'm doing them a disservice to not immediately give them the option.

Then each email that gets sent out has a standard footer with links to the course and the hire me page. It's there all the time. I'm not going to wait till the seventh email to tell them there's a course.

The main reason I'm doing this even though it's a distraction from my main DFY business is that I think some DFY work might come out of it. It's a possible lead gen system that pays for itself with the DIY offerings, while bringing DFY leads. This will likely help the service side of your business @Joe Cassandra...

Thanks Andy!

My current funnel:

FREE EMAIL OPTIN --> $7 UPSELL (get buyers asap) --> Push to video series --> Open cart for course (thinking of $997) --> UPSELL $197 copy critique of 5 pieces --> UPSELL to 1-on-1 coaching ($997).​

At some point will add on more UPSELLS to the $7 product, but that's done the line once this machine gets running. After initial LIVE launch, hook up DEADLINE FUNNEL (product) and let it run evergreen.

I'll simply be plugging in new content to emails/site while the rest runs on auto-pilot. Each email would have a "insert ad" or "CTA" to a product/service.

My goal IS NOT to find "copy clients" from it as the audiences are too dissimilar. I fully expect to keep building my copy business. This (as I mentioned in OP) is to get some passive income so I can take time off from writing.

I know many "info-marketers" want to build businesses around "info" rather than their service. I feel I can do both. This course isn't meant to be a $10 million/year thing. Maybe $250k/year to pay all the bills. Then, my copy business I can pick and choose my clients without "worrying about the bills."
-------------
I'd recommend FO SHO getting a lower priced offer in there. $99 if not lower. Much easier to sell your DFY or DIY services if they've already bought. My $7 product took me 3 hours to put together. You could do the same.

I forgot to mention...

What makes these payments even more special is that I don't have to do any additional work once paid. The work for the course was already done. The work for the clients still has to be done that month.

I get a little buzz each time an email comes in. I can't imagine what it must be like averaging one a day, and then multiple a day. (Just to put that in context... say I get one $300 per sale, then that is an extra $9k per month... and it's pretty damn passive.)

Hmmm... maybe I should also create a progress thread just on this part of my business?

Yep, automated income!!! Woop!

Progress thread, baby!

 

[Joe Cassandra]

Things moving along...

I'm backlogged with client work, but I can't seem to put this project to the side. I just want to get to the launch phase and get it done with.

I'm ready to share the site and all its glory with you...

Make a Full-time Living as a Copywriter in Under 10 Months -

As you'll see, the site doesn't have a zillion pages. Most of the work has been done in the course itself, behind hidden links you won't find on the site.

------------
THINGS I DID:
- Hooked all the videos up
- Got ConvertKit set up, email sequence plugged in
- I actually did write the sales letter for the product. Decided to pump it out

---------
THINGS LEFT:
- Create a few intro videos for the course (will be done in a week or so)
- BUILD A HOT LIST!

Right now, I'm setting up FB ads and expect to put a good $5k - $10k towards it to build the list.

I'm feeling very lazy and haven't attacked my "organic" growth piece where I reach out to content marketers, rewrite their stuff, then hope they promote it.

FB ads may be the easy way out, but I'm so backlogged with client work, I'm afraid of dumping so much more time into the grunt work.

Maybe I should hire someone to do that part of the marketing for me. They rewrite the article, I simply pitch it to the content marketer. What do you think?

 

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[Joe Cassandra]

Joe, just bought your book. Looking forward to starting this afternoon. Thanks!

You're helping fill a dream I've always had of passive income.

I write copy and do well...but it's not fastlane. You gave me the first taste of the fastlane, so you've made my week. Thanks

 

[Invictus]

Okay, update time...!

Been running FB ads for 4 days. That's pretty much been the extent of what I've worked on.

I didn't set up the pixel correctly, so I can't provide a screenshot (fixed it so can provide it next time).

I spent around $1,000 in ads. Subscriber count at 269. View attachment 16379

For the $7 book upsell, I've sold 18 [one guy had to pay through Paypal]. So, net sales of $126.70
View attachment 16380

Thus, net cost of ads = $874.
Cost per new subscriber = $3.25

I'll take that! I expected around $5 per new lead, so this is on the right path for me.

Already got great feedback on the $7 book, so that's a sure sign.
Unfortunately, it's not converting at near the percent I'd like. Right now, it's around 7%.

I'd ideally like to see 10 - 15% for an upsell. 8% is the standard conversion, but I'd like to see higher.

One thing I did was if they missed the $7 upsell, I pitch the book later for $12 (because it was a one-time offer) and gotten a few sales from that. I'll take it!

Upped the ad budget. The idea is to launch the course around Sept 30th and be at around 1,000 subscribers when I do. Work to do!

Just a thought I had, as I don't recall everything about your Upsell page. Not sure how valuable it will be.

Is it a standard option on your site to pay through Paypal? I paid for your book with my card, but when you mentioned that one person paid through Paypal I realized that I don't think I had that option. Since I know and trust you, I didn't mind giving you my info. But, if I had just stumbled upon your site, I may have been more hesistant, especially if there wasn't a Paypal choice. I might start thinking, "Shit, why can't I use Paypal. Is this person trying to steal my card?"

Not exactly the most logical thought process, but many of us are especially hesitant when it comes to payment details online.

-

Also, your book was a damn good purchase. Definitely worth the money! If you need a review or anything, just let me know!

 

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[Joe Cassandra]

Great progress! You've definitely inspired me to dive into the FB funnel. $1.17 per lead is great. Even a 1% conversion would still put you at, what, 800% ROI? Awesome, man.

Are you using anything like Ad Espresso to optimize your ads?

Thanks! I use Qwaya to hit more ad sets in a faster timeframe. Because each ad set takes 3-4 ads, multiplied by 25 ad sets and you got a lot of grudge work.

Qwaya offers a 14-day free trial. So, I just jumped in there when i was about to start, rip off the ads, and see how the first launch goes without paying them a dime. If the course sells great, Qwaya's worth the investment, if not (meaning the leads generated from FB are mush) then no sweat.

 

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[Dunkafelics]

This has absolutely something I have been thinking about as well. I am working a full-time job while working on my side business at this time. My wife has been very supportive while we have a newborn and she gives me time to work on the business. We are a few years out from having our second child, but I am working like mad to ensure that I have a solid foundation for when that day comes

EDIT: After doing the survey @Joe Cassandra, I am very jealous by that mortgage amount. I am coming to your house and bunking up lol lol.

 

[Joe Cassandra]

This weekend, I've been up outlining what I expect the course to look like.

For those new to the thread, I quit my job in 2016 after only a few months starting my copy business. I've made over 6-figures since then and have written promotions for my clients that have brought in 6-figures in under a week as well.
Thus, I know what I'm talking about. No theory here.

The plan is to use this course as a 2nd income stream that's automated as we have another kid coming...The plan isn't to turn myself into a "info-marketing" guru. ​

In the info-space it's easy to rip someone's content off as your own. Thus, in this thread, I'll detail my entire process. However, I'll pull back on super-duper details until the launch.
----------
With that said, I've gotten some great responses from my Survey. (See it here). It's been mega-helpful as I shape this.

Thus, the outline I'm going for in the course:

1. Opening Day towards your path as a full-time, 6-figure copywriter
   
   
   1. One tweak to 'dial-up' your mindset [without this 'copywriter' calibration method, you'll be spinning your wheels the next 10 years]
   2. The gold rush by 2020 [starting today lets you gobble up the top clients before the freelance rush peaks]
   3. Myth buster [won't share right now]
      
2. Quick copywriting skills to learn in the next 1-2 weeks
   
   
   1. The most valuable skill that could start ANY business you like
   2. Fastest strategy to get to 6-figures writing copy full-time
   3. Daily 5-minute habit turns you into a copy 'wizard'
   4. Copy basics that pick up client starting next week
   • Write up to 10 killer headlines in 10 minutes
   • Short copy: Bite-size bits clients clamor for 5x a day
   1. Myth buster --[won't share right now]
      
3. Prospecting with ZERO contacts
   
   
   1. 3 places to find your ideal client... forget inbound!
   2. Proven word-for-word scripts to see 20-30% positive responses to your cold emails
   3. The memorable LinkedIn strategy that generated my first $10,000
   4. Myth buster --- [won't share right now]
      
4. Master the sales process without being a salesmen (or an extrovert)
   
   
   1. My "apples to oranges" trick for when someone asks for samples and you have none
   2. 5-part sales script to go from "hello" to "I'll have the accounting department mail-out the check today"
   3. Myth buster --- [won't share right now]
      
5. Leaving the cubicle and tie behind...Quit!
   
   
   1. How to make the leap to full-time with the least amount of risk?
   2. "How much money do I need?" "How do I get my spouse on board?"
   3. Quitting
   4. READER QUESTION I HEAR ALL THE TIME?
      
6. Advanced copy skills that land 5-figure projects (plus commission!)
   
   
   1. Dominating long copy & making clients 6-figures
   2. Bullet-proof outline blueprint to massively increase your shot at a winning ad
   3. My useful step-by-step system to generate BIG IDEAS clients drool over
   4. This section of the ad makes or breaks it [how to make it sing]
   5. How to close anyone without ever meeting them or knowing their name
      
7. BONUS MODULE
   
   
   1. When to expand?
   2. Taking care of clients
   3. Pursuing bigger clients?
   4. Personal finance questions (insurance etc.)

**I expect this modules and course marketing to take about 300-500 hours of time to put together. If you want to steal this outline, good luck putting together a kick-a$$ course. But, I bet if you're too lazy to do your own outline, you're too lazy to put in the work like I already do.***

[ HOW YOU CAN HELP (FREE): I'm currently collecting survey data about those who want to write copy full-time from home. I need your expertise and opinions. See what I mean -- Click here for survey.(Nothing to buy or spam)]

 

[mikey3times]

Nice progress.

From what I hear, Vimeo is a great video host for courses. I was planning a course and was going to use them, but I shifted gears a bit so I don't have any actual experience with them.

Compare Vimeo membership plans | Vimeo

 

[Joe Cassandra]

Glad to be of help. Your original Notable thread was one of the reasons I wanted to join up here. I'll be keeping an eye out for the program, as you're in the position I'd like to be a year from now.

Thanks a bunch. Hard at work at it! Thanks for the motivation.

Nice progress.

From what I hear, Vimeo is a great video host for courses. I was planning a course and was going to use them, but I shifted gears a bit so I don't have any actual experience with them.

Compare Vimeo membership plans | Vimeo

Yeah, bouncing around from Wistia to Vimeo. Looking at Camtasia now for recording, but there's a ton of free options out there. I'd rather dump $200 into ads than into software, so looking at those now.

------------------------
Up to now:
- Prepared outline and modules for ALL parts of the course [way ahead of schedule]
- Prepped bonus report for opt-ins
- Prepared outline and modules for 3-part launch video series

WHAT'S NEXT:

Record these things:
- If anyone has suggestions for screen recording/voice/video editing software (besides Camtasia) let me know. (see my quick comment above)
- Plan is to record 1 MODULE per week. There's 8 modules. I expect this course to be between 12-15 hours of content + written bonuses to read

Set up website:
- Working on this now
- Quick opt-in page with free bonus
- About Page
- 3 blog posts
- Using CourseCats to house my course
- Using Wordpress for main site with a basic theme

LIST BUILD LIKE A WILD MAN [Goal: 1,000 - 2,500 subscribers on list]:
Haven't decided the best strategy to approach this. My initial thoughts:
- FACEBOOK ADS: Fastest way for new subscribers. Could be expensive to test.
- GUEST POST: Find relevant niches needing content and provide killer posts
- GIVEAWAY: Could attract attention if promoted correctly

>>ANY SUGGESTIONS WELCOME FOR FAST LIST-BUILDING<<​

EMAIL SOFTWARE:
I'm not 100% sure who to go with. Others have recommended Ontraport. But, it's around $300/month when your list hits 1,001. Seems pretty excessive.
Ones I've looked into:
- Active Campaign
- ConvertKit

>>ANY SUGGESTIONS WELCOME FOR EMAIL SOFTWARE<<​

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Why build the course first rather than spend time building a list then course later?"

1. ) Based on PMs here, comments, the survey I put up, I'm fairly confident there are plenty of people who need training like this. They want to quit their job and have regular cash coming in. Even if writing isn't what they want to do forever, it's a way to free up their time. Just like I have free time to create this course. Thus, I don't need to build a list and 'figure out' what they want.

2. ) I don't want a hot new lead to hit my email list...get emails for 30 days...cool off...and stop opening emails. While they are excited for new, awesome content, I want the sequence to be:

OPT IN [GET BONUS] ---> 1 DAY LATER ---> VALUABLE CONTENT PIECE ---> 1 DAY LATER ---> VALUABLE PIECE ---> 1 DAY LATER ---> PUSH TO VIDEO #1 OF TRAINING (free) ---> 2 DAYS LATER ---> VIDEO #2 ---> 2 DAYS LATER ---> VIDEO #3 ---> 2 DAYS LATER ---> OPEN COURSE + SALES LETTER + CART DEADLINE.​

Optin ---> 7-10 DAYS LATER ---> CART OPEN FOR BIZ​

Will keep updating.

--------
If you see writing copy-from-home as a way to break the chains of a 9-5, let me know your thoughts. Many that fill out the survey say "Making between $4k - $6k would be the ticket to freedom from a job". I find this incredibly interesting as I fell in this same range when I quit. It's definitely doable even if you're not a 'writer' per se.

Fill out this 2-minute Survey [nothing to buy]

 

[Joe Cassandra]

QUESTION FOR ANY SEARCH-ENGINE-OPTIMIZATION (SEO) EXPERTS:

I'm thinking of using this as a secondary strategy to generate traffic to my site:

1. Find an older post by an influencer in my niche that is killer content
2. Reach out to author of influencer
3. Ask them if I can re-post their 'old' post on my site, give them credit, link back to them, in the footer link to their store/products
4. [If necessary] offer them $50-$100 to do so
5. [If necessary] rewrite article so it's not word-for-word but same ideas, same links

My angle here is:
- They do ZERO work
- They could get clicks over (including to their store...sales)
- Content writers love being shared on other sites
- I'm not some wantrepreneur, I work for myself

HOPE: I would get a small percentage of them to share the post on my site to their audience (traffic for me)
---------------
SEO GENIUS INPUT:

1. Would this harm the influencer's SEO?
2. I'm sure my post wouldn't rank, but I don't care as I'm looking for traffic. Will my site get blacklisted?

Thanks for the help!

[@AndyBlack you do Adwords, any experience in this arena?]

 

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[inputchip]

Hey Joe, looking forward to watching your progress. Your thread reminded me of a similar company called Proofread Anywhere. You might be able to pickup some ideas from them. Keep up the good work!

 

[Andy Black]

Things moving along...

I'm backlogged with client work, but I can't seem to put this project to the side. I just want to get to the launch phase and get it done with.

I'm ready to share the site and all its glory with you...

Make a Full-time Living as a Copywriter in Under 10 Months -
View attachment 16313
As you'll see, the site doesn't have a zillion pages. Most of the work has been done in the course itself, behind hidden links you won't find on the site.

------------
THINGS I DID:
- Hooked all the videos up
- Got ConvertKit set up, email sequence plugged in
- I actually did write the sales letter for the product. Decided to pump it out

---------
THINGS LEFT:
- Create a few intro videos for the course (will be done in a week or so)
- BUILD A HOT LIST!

Right now, I'm setting up FB ads and expect to put a good $5k - $10k towards it to build the list.

I'm feeling very lazy and haven't attacked my "organic" growth piece where I reach out to content marketers, rewrite their stuff, then hope they promote it.

FB ads may be the easy way out, but I'm so backlogged with client work, I'm afraid of dumping so much more time into the grunt work.

Maybe I should hire someone to do that part of the marketing for me. They rewrite the article, I simply pitch it to the content marketer. What do you think?

Make sales one at a time?

Engage the market in hand-to-hand combat?

Are there people who already know, like, and trust you that this course would help? Sell it to them first?

E.g. I released my course into the forum. I didn't heavily promote it, just got it rolling. Then I sat and watched to see if it would sell.

I could have also emailed people I already knew, but I didn't feel comfortable selling to friends. Instead I gave them a copy if they were interested. And watched to see if they spent their *time* by going through the course.

Sales have trickled in of their own accord, so now I'm going to sell to people who don't know me yet (aka "cold traffic"). Which, as you know, means getting them to know, like, and trust me first. I.e. Replicate what I did in TFLF somehow, via an automated email sequence.


Maybe (just maybe) you're getting to the point of releasing it into the wild and the lizard brain is starting to dig his heels in?


Happy to have a chat sometime Joe. A copywriter and a media buyer is a powerful combo and a potentially interesting chat that other forum members might get value from.

 

[Grok]

Joe, just bought your book. Looking forward to starting this afternoon. Thanks!

 

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[Andy Black]

Joe, just bought your book. Looking forward to starting this afternoon. Thanks!

Woohoo! One in a row!


Great to have a ringside seat as someone gets their first taste of "passive income".

 

[Five Star]

Joe, thanks for sharing your progress.

This recent post might have some gold nuggets to help on your journey:

https://copyhackers.com/2017/09/course-launch-tech-stack/

 

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[Joe Cassandra]

Woohoo! One in a row!


Great to have a ringside seat as someone gets their first taste of "passive income".

Up to 6 at the moment ...

Just to be clear to all readers...this book is $7 and is simply an upsell after someone requests the free report. This IS NOT the course I'm creating, fyi.

The course won't be launched until I reach a certain amount of subscribers.

Joe, thanks for sharing your progress.

This recent post might have some gold nuggets to help on your journey:

https://copyhackers.com/2017/09/course-launch-tech-stack/

Thanks a bunch! Definitely agree on their recs about doing 'just enough' for your software. Don't look for perfect. If I did that, I'd still be at the beginning.

I'm also using ConvertKit as they recommended. Enjoy it so far especially the automated sequences. Allows me to focus on other stuff and let it run in the background.

Most email providers have this, but CK is so simple to use after you've played around with it for an hour, it makes sense. Plus, super easy to implement into OptimizePress, as I've done.

-----------
UPDATE:

Had a couple people interested in my "job opp" for writing influencer posts. Will see how they turn out. This piece is important as they won't be writing "blog posts" in a traditional sense.

They will be lead magnets to get influencers affiliated with my site. As I mentioned above, I've connected with a handful of influencers in the past, so they've chatted with me. About 20-30 of them. If I could get a few of them to share a post, it could bring in a few dozen subscribers, which would work awesome.

Also, got FB ads running right now. Will let them sit for 3-4 days before making any changes, so will update once those are out.

I already screwed them up.

I put the "conversion pixel" on the landing page, not on the page after they opt-in. So, I'm having trouble gauging how many optins I get from FB and from those probably here on the Forum opting-in.

I've been advised not to touch anything in the first few days or it messes up the ads. So I'll have to change it afterwards.

Budget for those is about $250/day.