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OFF-TOPIC Whats the point of life?

PizzaOnTheRoof

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You always need to insult everyone @guy93777 . Why?
With 2000 visitors per day here, there should be around 20 "initiates" perusing this forum at any given moment, by your own estimate.
One percent of the people are higher beings and the 99 percent remainder are losers, eh?
How can it possible that no one here is an "initiate" besides you? Your assumption has been off for a very long time, even obvious to a mere commoner like me. How can a visionary be so mistaken?
Right, look at the numbers.
So, regarding the other nineteen "initiates" who are online here now, what do they make of your rudeness and this gigantic mistake you keep making? Insult you? They don't.

What gets me about your message is that you deploy a truly primitive take on intelligence. You think that an intelligent insight has to be understandable only to an entitled few.
In fact, wisdom is always meaningful to the many.
If you haven't pieced together this logic so far - a span of years - and you've also overlooked what 1 percent means in term of the numbers of "initiates"you might meet meet in your "life," then it seems unlikely that you could still be the official spokesman for Team Initiates.

It further appears that, based on statistics, I follow three or four of the "initiates" here and often, including at least three "initiates" on this very thread.

They're coherent and have good social skills.
But you keep confusing politeness with complicity. Another mistake!
They seem to have discernment, empathy. But now where is yours?
Ya think?
No use replying to him. He’s a drive by troll.
 

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Black_Dragon43

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The Bible and the Catechism (if you are Catholic).
Thanks! Yeah, I am already reading from the Bible, but having some larger context helps. I've read and really enjoyed Mere Christianity for example, so I'm always looking for what others recommend when it comes to Christianity.

I'm a Christian, but I'm at the beginning of my journey. I don't think I adhere to any denomination. Technically, I was born an Orthodox Christian, but I can't say I identify with it. The way I see it Christianity should be an open brotherhood, and I don't find the whole denomination thing very helpful. So I'm looking to deepen my knowledge of God and Christianity through whatever sources other people have found useful.

That's why I've asked @Kak and anyone else really who is more experienced in the faith :)
 
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Bertram

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Thanks! Yeah, I am already reading from the Bible, but having some larger context helps. I've read and really enjoyed Mere Christianity for example, so I'm always looking for what others recommend when it comes to Christianity.

I'm a Christian, but I'm at the beginning of my journey. I don't think I adhere to any denomination. Technically, I was born an Orthodox Christian, but I can't say I identify with it. The way I see it Christianity should be an open brotherhood, and I don't find the whole denomination thing very helpful. So I'm looking to deepen my knowledge of God and Christianity through whatever sources other people have found useful.

That's why I've asked @Kak and anyone else really who is more experienced in the faith :)
What an amazing thread.
Have a look at this great book on the physical embodiment of Christian experience during The Middle Ages in Europe.. The focus is eating and fasting:
You're understand why eating lentils or eating on Friday was as invigorating as the 75 Hard Challenge care of @Fox .

Christian and Jewish traditional practice involves physical, empirical, bodily experience on a fundamental level.
For Jews the spirit is pure, and thus purifies the body that's dirtied in everyday life.
For Christians the spirit is born into sin and or contaminated even earlier in the moment of conception, and so the body brings purity to the spirit (as in baptismal purification or communion).
Orthodox Jews say a prayer over the washing of hands - pure spirit blessing physical existence.
Christians perform righteous acts or penance, acts of forgiveness or prayers to cleanse the soul of sins. Christian behavior cleanses the soul. Christian deep sea fishermen or hunters often pray before the event so that the experience will be cleansing. Judaism has the opposite: soulful prayers protect trees. crops, newborns, homes.
Orthodox Jews perform good acts, mitzvah, to correct the imperfections the world's they are responsible for causing. Spirit drives evil from the world.
These dynamics of purification mostly flow in completely opposite directions depending on whether you are Jewish or Christian, but G-d is the same for both.
Cool, right?
 
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Walter Hay

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Like @Primeperiwinkle and @Kak, I think it reasonable in the midst of a throng of atheists to answer the question posed by the OP.

I am saddened by the air of doom and gloom pervading this thread, dominated by philosophies that allow anyone to choose whatever idea suits their fancy, with the overriding result appearing to be a feeling of hopelessness or at least, resignation. That same air prevailed in the thread:
O/T: HEALTH A Conversation about death...

I am at peace, and do not fear death. I have read the entire Bible 59 times (enjoying working towards the 60th,) and because I approached it without any preconceived ideas I very quickly discovered that Church teachings bear only a passing resemblance to Bible teachings.

I was never an atheist because unlike many Bible critics I am not cynical enough to disbelieve, ridicule, or discard anything about which I know nothing. I was an agnostic, which I believe is a far more honest and productive approach to any subject.

One of the world's most quoted atheists, Mark Twain, at least read the Bible once, but that hardly makes him an expert, not least because he only read it because he was obliged by his parents to do so, and his reading was colored by their extreme views. Having familiarized myself with what the Bible actually says, I am inclined to agree with most of his dedicated railing against Christianity.

Unfortunately Christianity has acquired a bad name due to the teachings of most Christian churches that contradict what the Bible actually teaches.

I believe that the purpose of God is to fill the earth with his glory, and He will do it through those who respond to what He requires - not to what they imagine.

It may seem surprisingly business-like in this thread, but my life has a mission statement:
Micah 6:8 "He has showed you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?"

Walter
 

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so maybe i can help you :

View attachment 28431



View attachment 28432




people like me know why they are on earth because we are initiates


you don't know and 99 % of people don't know either because they are the energy of society

not the mind


society is a giant human being with a mind ( rational masterminds ) and a body ( emotional masses )

AS ABOVE SO BELOW


human level : mind and emotions
society level : mind and emotions


View attachment 28434





by the way most people can't understand what i say because:




View attachment 28433
giphy (1).gif
 
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Bertram

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...He will do it through those who respond to what He requires - not to what they imagine.

Like @Primeperiwinkle and @Kak, I think it reasonable in the midst of a throng of atheists to answer the question posed by the OP.

I am saddened by the air of doom and gloom pervading this thread, dominated by philosophies that allow anyone to choose whatever idea suits their fancy, with the overriding result appearing to be a feeling of hopelessness or at least, resignation. That same air prevailed in the thread:
O/T: HEALTH A Conversation about death...

I am at peace, and do not fear death. I have read the entire Bible 59 times (enjoying working towards the 60th,) and because I approached it without any preconceived ideas I very quickly discovered that Church teachings bear only a passing resemblance to Bible teachings.

I was never an atheist because unlike many Bible critics I am not cynical enough to disbelieve, ridicule, or discard anything about which I know nothing. I was an agnostic, which I believe is a far more honest and productive approach to any subject.

One of the world's most quoted atheists, Mark Twain, at least read the Bible once, but that hardly makes him an expert, not least because he only read it because he was obliged by his parents to do so, and his reading was colored by their extreme views. Having familiarized myself with what the Bible actually says, I am inclined to agree with most of his dedicated railing against Christianity.

Unfortunately Christianity has acquired a bad name due to the teachings of most Christian churches that contradict what the Bible actually teaches.

I believe that the purpose of God is to fill the earth with his glory, and He will do it through those who respond to what He requires - not to what they imagine.

It may seem surprisingly business-like in this thread, but my life has a mission statement:
Micah 6:8 "He has showed you, O man, what is good; and what does the LORD require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?"

Walter
There's the rub. Really interested people of faith might not hear that requirement, ever. I know a terrific young woman who teaches Bible school in her teens and says she has never felt the Spirit, never heard an answer, never noticed anything beyond empirical everyday life. I wonder how long she'll hold out. It's no one's fault.
The choice is to know what's required of you by what you have learned and just leave it at that. But that's not enough for someone who really wants to receive a sign, goes on a mission, and is still in the minority as times goes by.
What would you tell her @Walter Hay .
 
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socaldude

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If you are asking this from an existential perspective then the answer has already been found by many individuals; philosophers, scientists and influential people.

The point of life is knowledge and unconditional love.

Happiness is when we experience our connection with the whole the of nature. We experience a love for the world and for ourselves.

Of course not easy. Because our temporal world is driven by the ego. Where we experience negativity almost daily. Its possible to be happy and still experience negativity but negativity doesn't have as much power and influence over us.
 

Kak

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Unfortunately Christianity has acquired a bad name due to the teachings of most Christian churches that contradict what the Bible actually teaches.
I believe that the purpose of God is to fill the earth with his glory, and He will do it through those who respond to what He requires - not to what they imagine.
Love both of these. Very well put.

PEOPLE are the ones that are to blame for the reputation Christianity has gotten. People are the church and people are flawed. That concept is as biblical as the day is long.

For those of you that are wondering why Christians are all hypocrites, that is because we are. Perfection is unachievable.

Most Christians that take their faith seriously land on a calling. What they feel their God given purpose is in this world. It becomes their life's work and their life's work means more because of it. Ever wonder why I get things done pretty quickly and effectively? The God given meaning I find in my work is probably responsible for 85% of my motivation.

What is that meaning? God has blessed me with the ability to build businesses and subsequently give... And I do. I help fund worldwide efforts to help people. I can only do that as an effective businessman.

I also have a nonprofit plan that I am as excited about getting started with as I am with any of my current businesses. My foundation will outlast my businesses and live on for generations. I think it has potential to affect change on a simillar "think bigger" scale that I like in business.

My golden geese (businesses) go to my future children. My golden eggs (cash) go to the foundation.
 

Walter Hay

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The Bible and the Catechism (if you are Catholic).
A good suggestion, but with one reservation:

The Bible tells you how God thinks.
A catechism, (whichever religion) tells you what men think.

Walter
Cats are never mentioned anywhere in the Bible. So why?
There are many animals not mentioned in the Bible. The Mosaic law identified animals a clean or unclean, meaning suitable or unsuitable for human consumption. To the best of my knowledge every clean animal is named, but a much smaller number of unclean.

Sorry to tell you this, but cats would come within the unclean category, because they don't meet the Bible definition of clean. Therefore it might be a good idea to not eat your cat.
They all stayed behind in Egypt during the exodus, is my best guess.
Cats were deified in Egypt, and large numbers of mummified cats have been unearthed, but they still get no mention in the Bible. It is highly unlikely that the Israelites took any cats with them, because the Egyptians were already somewhat angry with them, and departing with living symbols of their gods and goddesses would have stirred them up even more.
Christian and Jewish traditional practice involves physical, empirical, bodily experience on a fundamental level.
......... Cool, right?
Maybe it's cool, but Jesus condemned the traditions of the Jewish leaders because they were teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.

Christian traditions surely can't be an improvement on the Jewish approach.
There's the rub. Really interested people of faith might not hear that requirement, ever. I know a terrific young woman who teaches Bible school in her teens and says she has never felt the Spirit, never heard an answer, never noticed anything beyond empirical everyday life. I wonder how long she'll hold out. It's no one's fault.
The choice is to know what's required by what you have learned and just leave it at that. But that's not enough for someone who really wants to receive a sign, goes on a mission, and is still in the minority as times goes by.
What yould you tell her @Walter Hay .
I would say don't ask for or expect what the Bible doesn't promise, and if you want to find the answer that you have never yet heard, read the Bible. The answer is there in clear language, not found in theological traditions.

Walter
 

Kak

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Can I take you up on it?

I'm not having a weird life crisis, but that sounds like a decent way to spend a Sunday morning when I'm in Houston.
Any time bud.
 

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Bertram

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I'm an atheist, and I'll admit it sucks not having answers. Just because religion can offer some answers, doesn't mean those answers are correct, and I can't force myself into believing something that I don't think is true. I don't want to start a religious argument here though, I'm not anti-religion and have nothing against people who find value in it.

One thing that I've found to give meaning is helping others and providing value. I've also found that meditation can help increase awareness in that respect.
I think you'd like Jordan Petersen. He'll fix you right up.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V52RLZFGHUM


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NX2ep5fCJZ8


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU64s0_38AE
 
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G-Man

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Thanks! Yeah, I am already reading from the Bible, but having some larger context helps. I've read and really enjoyed Mere Christianity for example, so I'm always looking for what others recommend when it comes to Christianity.

I'm a Christian, but I'm at the beginning of my journey. I don't think I adhere to any denomination. Technically, I was born an Orthodox Christian, but I can't say I identify with it. The way I see it Christianity should be an open brotherhood, and I don't find the whole denomination thing very helpful. So I'm looking to deepen my knowledge of God and Christianity through whatever sources other people have found useful.

That's why I've asked @Kak and anyone else really who is more experienced in the faith :)
Honestly just read your Bible. Read it slow. Read what it says. Read it out loud, as the authors intended. If you absolutely can’t resist reading commentaries, etc. then the below is a good place to start. Learn the Bible in 24 Hours: Chuck Missler: 9781418549183: Amazon.com: Books

This is a very civil and informative thread for such a touchy subject.
 

Bertram

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@Walter Hay
Walter Hay said:
Jesus condemned the traditions of the Jewish leaders because they were teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.

A good suggestion, but with one reservation:

The Bible tells you how God thinks.
A catechism, (whichever religion) tells you what men think.

Walter

There are many animals not mentioned in the Bible. The Mosaic law identified animals a clean or unclean, meaning suitable or unsuitable for human consumption. To the best of my knowledge every clean animal is named, but a much smaller number of unclean.

Sorry to tell you this, but cats would come within the unclean category, because they don't meet the Bible definition of clean. Therefore it might be a good idea to not eat your cat.

Cats were deified in Egypt, and large numbers of mummified cats have been unearthed, but they still get no mention in the Bible. It is highly unlikely that the Israelites took any cats with them, because the Egyptians were already somewhat angry with them, and departing with living symbols of their gods and goddesses would have stirred them up even more.

Maybe it's cool, but Jesus condemned the traditions of the Jewish leaders because they were teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.

Christian traditions surely can't be an improvement on the Jewish approach.

I would say don't ask for or expect what the Bible doesn't promise, and if you want to find the answer that you have never yet heard, read the Bible. The answer is there in clear language, not found in theological traditions.

Walter

Click to expand...
I'm not sure why you wasted my question on a false debate. Bowing heads and holding hands to pray is not about religious leadership. Tradition must be a trigger word. Tradition may be about one's beliefs only.
Walter Hay said:


Sorry to tell you this, but cats would come within the unclean category, because they don't meet the Bible definition of clean. Therefore it might be a good idea to not eat your cat .
Dogs are unclean too. Leopards and lions are spoken of eloquently.
That questioned was posed as comedy by the way.
I think the omission of the cat was an effort to erase ancient Egyptian worship.
The Nobel poet T.S. Eliot converted to Christianity. Then he wrote a poem about the difficulty of naming of cats:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXkLgtusza4



Walter Hay said:

I would say don't ask for or expect what the Bible doesn't promise, and if you want to find the answer that you have never yet heard, read the Bible. The answer is there in clear language, not found in theological traditions.
This is a very interesting point.
Too much doctrine can dull mind, body and spirit. Perhaps this is one reason why yoga instructors are the among least likely people ever to experience spiritual bliss.
Thank you.
 

Bertram

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Walter Hay

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Honestly just read your Bible. Read it slow. Read what it says. Read it out loud, as the authors intended. If you absolutely can’t resist reading commentaries, etc. then the below is a good place to start. Learn the Bible in 24 Hours: Chuck Missler: 9781418549183: Amazon.com: Books

This is a very civil and informative thread for such a touchy subject.
Yes I am also pleased to see how civil this thread is. Reading aloud can be very helpful. For a long period in Israel's history, there were very few copies of the written Bible, and the people learned by listening to it being read, as well as large parts of it being sung.

I would question the ability of any person to teach someone to learn a 1200 page book in 24 hours.

It took me four years starting from total ignorance of the subject, and now after reading the 1200 pages in their entirety every year for the past 59 years I still do not profess to know it all.

That reading is only part of the story. I have closely studied large sections of the Bible, and I have presented more public lectures and seminars than I can take the time to count. These included weekly radio broadcasts which led to a challenge from an atheist to an on-air debate about the veracity of the Bible.

I accepted the challenge, including his requirement to read his favorite philosopher's exposition of life. His wife was the adjudicator (I know, I'm too soft to say no,) and she sat the other side of the glass frequently giving me the thumbs up, and even jumping up and cheering on one occasion. I don't know how long their marriage lasted after that.

Sadly, like many atheists, all of his arguments were based on what little he knew of what he regarded as ugly aspects of the Bible. These ideas he based on what he had heard of the doctrinal traditions of Christianity which have largely superseded what the Bible actually teaches. Combined with his total ignorance of the Bible, he was at some disadvantage.

Far from feeling triumphant, I felt deeply sorry for him.

Walter
 
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Walter Hay

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@Bertram you asked several questions, so which one did I turn into a false debate?

Your questions:
  • "Cats are never mentioned anywhere in the Bible. So why?" I simply gave a factual and historically correct answer. You say "That questioned was posed as comedy by the way." I got it. That's why I jokingly suggested that it might not be a good idea to eat your cat.
  • "What yould you tell her @Walter Hay ." My reply to your question was intended to be helpful to the young woman you seemed concerned for, and was not argumentative.
  • "Christian and Jewish traditional practice involves physical, empirical, bodily experience on a fundamental level. ........................................ Cool, right?" I did not disagree with the lengthy statement that preceded the very brief question. All I did was to provide an account of Jesus' response to the Jewish leadership's practice of overriding sound laws with unsound traditions. I was neither debating nor inviting a debate.
Walter
 
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Fastlane Liam

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This is very much a matter of opinion, of course.

But if you refuse religious answers (and make no mistake, any philosophy that ascribes a higher meaning to life is essentially a religion) there is no intrinsic meaning to life.

The world is a cold, dark place governed by chaos.

Now, faced with this, there are three possible ways you can go.

You can go nihilist, and decide that nothing matters.

You can go existentialist, and decide that it is your responsibility to create your own meaning.

You can go absurdist, and decide that the best course of action is to rebel against the meaninglessness.
This is a good response and from what you're saying its down to perspective. I prefer to not delve into being a nihlist because thats just empty and depressing. Never heard of absurdist, looked into it and from what I understand you just accept life is random, chaotic and well absurd. I guess accepting life just is sort of puts you at peace
 
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Fastlane Liam

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purpose is felt, u can't really intellectualize it imo.
This is kind of my problem, I have no feelings. Im in my head and logical. But I understand and agree with you sort of, you have to be drawn to your purpose without mapping it out or analysing it, you sort of just "know" I guess
 
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Fastlane Liam

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so maybe i can help you :

View attachment 28431



View attachment 28432




people like me know why they are on earth because we are initiates


you don't know and 99 % of people don't know either because they are the energy of society

not the mind


society is a giant human being with a mind ( rational masterminds ) and a body ( emotional masses )

AS ABOVE SO BELOW


human level : mind and emotions
society level : mind and emotions


View attachment 28434





by the way most people can't understand what i say because:




View attachment 28433
You're crazy but I kind of love it
You're the kind of guy I find deep in youtube conspiracy video comments writing a 3000 word essay on "sheeple"
 
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Fastlane Liam

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I feel the real question you have is how do I not feel stuck and lost in life?
I thought about your response for a few days and you're right. You have a good judge or character and reading people. What Im actually asking is how to not feel or be lost in life. Thats my problem. I do take action and know whats best for my future, but that empty unknown scares me because I guess I don't know myself or what makes me happy.

you got to try it rather than just read about it. Some stuff from your list will be more difficult and/or take time.
This scares the F*ck out of me, but I guess the point of the exercise to learn more about yourself and what you like, which will take stepping outside of your comfort zone

Thanks for the reply :)
 

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Fastlane Liam

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First of all, what does it mean for something to have a purpose?

A tool has a purpose. A hammer puts nails in a wall.

That’s because humans designed a tool to meet their end goals.

Do you want to be a tool for the end goal of a higher being?

If so, then what is the purpose of that higher being? What would God be a “tool” for.

My point here is that somewhere down the line there is creative intelligence that ascribes a purpose and then tools to that end. There can be no ultimate purpose because the idea of a purpose leads to an infinite regression.

I prefer to believe that there is no purpose ordained to us and that we are not tools for a higher goal.

From my point of view, We are the highly unlikely yet inevitable result of the total infinity of “time” and “space.”

The greatest gift that you have is that you’re not a tool. You ascribe purpose.

Regardless of whether you believe in free will or determinism (and I believe in neither) - you have deep desires that you want to see manifested.

Whether it’s the desire for love, giving, legacy, or creating great things and putting them out into the world.. it’s your vision and your very existence that will determine how those things are manifested.

Our lives have much greater spheres of influence than we realize, and it’s a terrible loss that so many of us downplay the purpose and meaning that there is within our own relationships.

The impact that we have on eachother and our connection to the world is pregnant with possibilities for how your own purpose will play out.
This was written like a book and I have nothing to add. Thank you
What is purpose? To fulfil an end goal. A tool fulfils an end goal. The fact we don't have an end goal or purpose is actually beautiful and freeing. Mind blown
 
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Fastlane Liam

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I assume you ask for your Self.

to quote:
"I warn you, whoever you are, Oh! You who want to probe the arcana of nature, that if you do not find within yourself that which you are looking for, you shall not find it outside either! If you ignore the excellences of your own house, how do you pretend to find other excellencies? Within you is hidden the treasure of treasures! Know thyself and you will know the Universe and the Gods." incription of an old temple

To find your answer, you'll have to search in the inner world. Any external answer won't be yours, even if you find some of them "interesting" to take it as yours. Many writings of hundreds of years tried to lead readers to their way of finding it. But I never heard from anyone who found their individual answer that it was possible to skip inner search during the search for meaning.

I found two ways to find mine: One is meditation. The other one is contemplating by writing. Good luck.
You're right. Thank you
 

Bertram

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@Bertram you asked several questions, so which one did I turn into a false debate?

Your questions:
  • "Cats are never mentioned anywhere in the Bible. So why?" I simply gave a factual and historically correct answer. You say "That questioned was posed as comedy by the way." I got it. That's why I jokingly suggested that it might not be a good idea to eat your cat.
  • "What yould you tell her @Walter Hay ." My reply to your question was intended to be helpful to the young woman you seemed concerned for, and was not argumentative.
  • "Christian and Jewish traditional practice involves physical, empirical, bodily experience on a fundamental level. ........................................ Cool, right?" I did not disagree with the lengthy statement that preceded the very brief question. All I did was to provide an account of Jesus' response to the Jewish leadership's practice of overriding sound laws with unsound traditions. I was neither debating nor inviting a debate.
Walter
Walter, all is well, let's nevermind. You were keen on discussing laws and traditions, but my topic was about spiritual practice exclusively in terms of one's relationship with G-d. Derailment removed. You know what though, my spiritual life has been extremely malnourished compared to yours. Putting two lifespans side by side, a stranger might not tell the difference, however the individual chooses which immoveable ingredients make a life.

How did you wind up having a debate over the radio with a shaky atheist in a rocky marriage? Where was this? Details would enrich this thread.
 
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guy93777

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by the way, i 've been studying hundreds of documents for 10 years about social engineering and so on

but people here still believe they know better than me while they do absolutely nothing to understand this world

this is how stupid people are and this is why they are so easily manipulated by the masterminds


maybe you should read this book :

this is not a chess book. this is a book about life


28456



in case you don't know , you are at war against the masterminds and they win all battles

in this giant chess game , their elo is 2800, yours is 1100 at best





you are pawns in the game as explained here :



28457 28458







.
 

SteveO

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Personally, I feel that we all take life way too seriously. We are here to experience regardless of our situation. We have a blank slate in front of us. We then color it as we wish. Even when we feel that the world is doing us so much harm and the victimhood starts to kick in.... We are still splattering colors on our slate.
 
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IlseVdG

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I did not intend to post another comment on this thread. I was fully satisfied; I had learnt my personal lesson from it and today I was very happy to read that Liam got something out of the thread.
But then, just now, I had this inspiration to type in Google "ways to god are infinite". Just because that's essentially my conviction, and I wanted to know what Google had to say (a bit like when you randomly flip a book, using it as an oracle). The first hit is an article titled "God, Man, and Money, or How to Succeed in Business Without Going to Hell | Michael Novak" See http://www.ignatiusinsight.com/feat ures2005/mnovak_money_sept05.asp NO kidding. You can check on google. What do ya'll think about it?
 

IlseVdG

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I did not intend to post another comment on this thread. I was fully satisfied; I had learnt my personal lesson from it and today I was very happy to read that Liam got something out of the thread.
But then, just now, I had this inspiration to type in Google "ways to god are infinite". Just because that's essentially my conviction, and I wanted to know what Google had to say (a bit like when you randomly flip a book, using it as an oracle). The first hit is an article titled "God, Man, and Money, or How to Succeed in Business Without Going to Hell | Michael Novak" See http://www.ignatiusinsight.com/feat ures2005/mnovak_money_sept05.asp NO kidding. You can check on google. What do ya'll think about it?
okay, let's redo this link: God, Man, and Money, or How to Succeed in Business Without Going to Hell | Michael Novak
 
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Fastlane Liam

Fastlane Liam

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I was referring to the post above mine. Sorry if you thought I was dismissing your post, this thread is very interesting and I'm all for good discussion about it, it's just that the "guynumbers" poster is very...passionate about his ideas.
Oh sorry, my apologies!
 
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Fastlane Liam

Fastlane Liam

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Exactly! I totally agree.

If I may add: people tend to only really start that inner search either when they fail greatly or experience great loss in the outer world OR when they succeed greatly in the outer world and then realize that this success doesn’t provide the promised inner fulfillment. Either way: they’re doing 'great'. They're just pushed to begin a new journey, at a certain moment. This moment is different for everyone.

@Fastlane Liam
From what I see, by posing the question, you already gave the answer. You’ll start an inner journey (or you'll deepen the one that you already have). Because it seems that it doesn't go away, that feeling that this can't be it AND you're already taking brute action to get answers: you're even posting that question on the Fastlane forum! :)
And as already said, that journey can be: getting inspiration from outer sources + having an inner search (+ translating it all into personal action, but that comes naturally from insight, it does not require an extra 'step'). But of course, you need not to strategize about all this too much, it all comes naturally and in its own time. About inspiration: there are tons and tons of inspirational messages out there, wrapped in a zillion different forms, all pointing (in their essence) at the same truth. It’s up to you to pick up these message forms that resonate with you. Nobody can tell you what these forms exactly will be, and how their contained message will be embedded in your personal understanding and in your personal life. It's all very .. personal. The same goes for the practices that help you get in a more contemplative, meditative state (meditation forms, physical exercise, ...) You just have to reach out and discover them for yourself, feel what works for you. It’s a never ending journey that you embark on, but if you dive deep (and you will do so if you're pushed enough), it will certainly and irrevocably change your way of viewing life.

Thank you for the question, by the way. I take that everyone who felt the need to react to your message is also searching, and is - in some or other way - happy with your reminder of the need for searching. :) In any case: I am. We’re all in the same boat.

FYI I'm a person who has it not easy with letting go, and I recently got seriously challenged in that area. And just today I was contemplating about the importance to put the inner journey first, whatever happens in the professional life etc. It helps me to cope with my anger, to put things in perspective, and to take personal responsibility. So I couldn't leave this question unanswered.
Hey more importantly thank you for replying to my thread. You are right, posting this has made me start to look within for the answers, and to not be too logical or strategical about it. Try and feel it I guess. But introspection has definetly started, the answers are within. Thanks :D
 

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