The definitive guide for MFG/QC issues and what you ecommerce sourcers and inventors must know

[Niptuck MD]

 

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[Niptuck MD]

Some more easy to understand concepts about validation and quality inspection methods.

 

[SYK]

How is the quality of resin? Have you already dealt with residues and the consistencies of the molds etc

Going through this with my engineers at the moment. And will be doing checks straight from molds and tools will be 'tool safe' so we can refine to exact needs.

Ahead of time during batch runs. Plastic is a unique substrate because there is a lot of varying polymers that have different properties. When these polymers are machined, it can go in several directions etc (dont want to confuse people by getting into the intricacies of machining/manufacturing of polymers/plastics etc)

Tell me about it! We've gone through dozens of plastics to narrow it down to two with the specs we need. They have similar shrink rates so tooling should allow us to test with both.

What else do you keep in mind when testing polymers in molds (warping etc)?

 

[Niptuck MD]

What else do you keep in mind when testing polymers in molds (warping etc)?

@SYK

Warp in injection molded parts is caused by uneven stress.
There are only 4 primary plastic processing variables in the injection molding process – cavity pressure, melt temperature, fill rate, and cooling rate. All of them can contribute to injection molded part warp but the cooling rate of the plastic in the mold is by far the most important. The general rule is the plastic that cools the slowest shrinks the most.

 

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[Niptuck MD]

Some generic info to help new product developers and or sourcers perhaps

Manufacturing Acceleration | DETEKT Platform

(Reputable advising)

Doing your design without close interaction with the China vendors means you’re missing a lot of information, which leads to sub-optimal design decisions. The further you advance in the design process, the more expensive it gets to change anything. So if 98% of a product’s design is already done and validated in testing, you can hire a really smart China manufacturing consultant, but there is only so much they can do because most aspects are frozen already.

Another important tenet of Design For Manufacturing (DFM) is early supplier involvement. If you need custom parts better make sure that the factory who will make them actually feels comfortable manufacturing them. This requires a lot of communication in the design stage.

 

[Niptuck MD]

@Vigilante or @AllenCrawley can you move this to the main forum? I think the rest of the FLF should benefit (i dont want to hold anything back)

Thanks

 

[Niptuck MD]

Many LCC suppliers provide pre-determined, well-tuned customer tours of their facility. Make an effort to get off the beaten path to see additional areas; other buildings or, out back — where scrap is sorted — to find out what’s really happening. Some suppliers try to present only the latest high tech portions of their factories that may have nothing to do with manufacturing processes required by your products.


Work closely with suppliers from prototype and new product introduction (NPI) through first article unit inspection and production volume increases. Develop a working knowledge of product test yields (focus on first pass yield) and reasonable rates for product field returns. Product export documentation requirements; freight consolidation, and other aspects of supply chain management through product end of life (EOL) are also each equally important to understand.

Good suppliers of various products anticipate problems. From general experience, Japanese and South Koreans companies are typically good at anticipating problems. Taiwanese organizations are becoming more like the Japanese in this area. However, many mainland Chinese suppliers sometimes run off the edge of a cliff and do not see it coming with regards to problems that surface.

My experience has proven this to be particularly true when planning future raw material requirements. Additionally, I’ve seen many Chinese suppliers lose control of internal manufacturing processes for no apparent reasons.

 

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[Niptuck MD]

Another area for those of you sourcing non technological products.

Sourcing products from Asia is often a popular path. Items are comparatively cheaper than American products for similar quality. To keep the price low and margins high, many successful Amazon sellers source products from Asian markets.

Thanks to the internet, you don’t need to physically visit the Asian markets to source products. With Alibaba and AliExpress reigning in the Chinese wholesale market, it is very easy to source Chinese products. But most of the products on these sites are already available on Amazon.com, and with news about the U.S. government planning to add a tariff on Chinese imports, the future doesn’t look bright. For better prices, look for items that haven’t already saturated the eCommerce market and come from countries that comply with U.S. policies and standards. One of the best options is the Indian market. Still unscathed and comparatively cheaper (if you know where to shop) than the Chinese markets, India is one of the best places for sourcing products.

What to Source from India
In recent years, India has developed as a manufacturing hub and raw materials source. Many global organizations outsource their work to India and import Indian goods. With labor charges less than 10 times the cost when compared with the U.S. and Europe, Indian products are significantly cheaper with few, if any, compromises in quality.

Here are few categories to consider sourcing from India:

Leather products: Indian leather is world famous, as are Indian leather products. Many multinational companies in this niche get their goods manufactured from India. (I have personally seen this.) The manufacturing cost of one high-quality leather belt is around $1 and its wholesale rate is around $2. I’ve seen belts like these sell for around $20-$30 on Amazon.com. Leather jackets are manufactured at the cost of $12-$25. So sourcing leather products like belts, shoes, jackets etc. is a great way to get started.

Textiles: The textile industry is also very well known. Products like stitched and un-stitched clothes, bed sheets, curtains, etc. can be purchased cheaply, thereby preserving a higher profit margin. The interaction with Indian textile factories is much more streamlined then that of other nations.

Jewelry: About 20% of the world’s gold production is consumed by India. Much of that amount goes into manufacturing jewelry. India’s jewelry sector is backed by the government and banks. If you want to try to manufacture jewelry, then India is a prime sourcing location. Imitation jewelry also plays a huge role in the Indian jewelry sector. The manufacturing cost of imitation jewelry starts with as low as Indian Rupee (INR) 10-15 – or well under $0.25 – for items which can be easily sold on Amazon.com for more than $5.

Other product categories to consider sourcing from India include kitchenware, handmade items, toys, bags and stationery.

 

[amp0193]

Develop a working knowledge of product test yields (focus on first pass yield) and reasonable rates for product field returns.

Is first pass yield something a factory would normally keep track of?

Why does first pass yield matter to me? As long as it's right before it ships to me... should I care if it passed on the first try?

 

[Niptuck MD]

Is first pass yield something a factory would normally keep track of?

Why does first pass yield matter to me? As long as it's right before it ships to me... should I care if it passed on the first try?

Normally a medium to high batch factory (that is one that produces well over 1000 units per day will. They will have a first piece sample and or a first part verification process; (all manufacturing sites that manufacture parts that involve 2 or more processes) have some sort of checks and balances in place between processes (stations).

They may or not may not keep track of it but it cant hurt to ask. Again more and more manufacturers are beginning to realize the importance of this initial sample measurability and are taking proactive steps and action to reduce downtime of production.

 

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[Eskil]

Solid thread with very valuable information! +rep

 

[Niptuck MD]

Solid thread with very valuable information! +rep

thank you sir @Eskil

 

[Niptuck MD]

its been a really busy weeks.
but here are two infographics to help you ALL regardless of what you are sourcing or manufacturing;

WASTES. there are 8 main wastes in your respective supply chain (ALL companies big or small have wastage) its targeting and monitoring and reducing it is what differentiates you from the latter.



If you guys and gals are having an issue more then likely it is in one of those 8 areas.




the folowing is just a simple approach to tracing (issues or the commonmost issues that are reoccuring that you create a "system" to ensure it doesnt happen again)

 

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[amp0193]

WASTES. there are 8 main wastes in your respective supply chain (ALL companies big or small have wastage) its targeting and monitoring and reducing it is what differentiates you from the latter.

That first infographic was awesome, I'm going to print that one and hang it up somewhere.

Lots to improve.

 

[Niptuck MD]

That first infographic was awesome, I'm going to print that one and hang it up somewhere.

Lots to improve.

When you scale up in a couple of years bro you will begin to realize the finite points of wastage and then also WIP (work in progress) and other parts from the second infographic....

Scaling is great ONLY if the systems put into place are efficient and are capable of the scaling process.

The more you know the more it will (and you) grow

 

[Niptuck MD]

Solid thread with very valuable information! +rep

Lol maybe @Eskil and @amp0193 can convince @Vigilante to making this notable

 

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[amp0193]

When you scale up in a couple of years bro you will begin to realize the finite points of wastage and then also WIP (work in progress) and other parts from the second infographic....

Scaling is great ONLY if the systems put into place are efficient and are capable of the scaling process.

The more you know the more it will (and you) grow

This is an aspect of scale I hadn't considered, and it may be a reason for me to grow slower and more organically.

Quality is one factor in limiting my scale right now, but as I'm learning in this thread, quality is really just a system.

 

[TKDTyler]

Damn @Arun Siva! I just caught up with this thread and wished we got to talk a lot more at the summit! Pure gold here learned only through experience! New importers that read through this are going to cut their problems in half before they even begin.

Rep++

 

[Niptuck MD]

quality is really just a system.

Yep; basically a system that helps the other systems you put into place run fluidly.

 

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[Niptuck MD]

Damn @Arun Siva! I just caught up with this thread and wished we got to talk a lot more at the summit! Pure gold here learned only through experience! New importers that read through this are going to cut their problems in half before they even begin.

Rep++

Yes agreed. thanks man

 

[Niptuck MD]

if anyone needs any analysis regarding their samples or defects of whatever they are sourcing feel free to pm me.

i will try to update when I return from my current trip.

 

[Niptuck MD]

Guys/gals, a thorough pdf that was compiled by me over the years that may be of help breaking down this science/process.

@amp0193 @SYK @Eskil @TKDTyler

 

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[TKDTyler]

Guys/gals, a thorough pdf that was compiled by me over the years that may be of help breaking down this science/process.

@amp0193 @SYK @Eskil @TKDTyler

Solid! You couldn't have posted this at a better time - I'm in the middle of sketching out a couple new products and a lot of these concepts I haven't taken into consideration yet (mostly DFA).

I wish there was a way to have gold posts. I wouldn't mind seeing a full presentation on the subject at the next summit that goes into better/personal details either...

Rep++

 

[Niptuck MD]

Solid! You couldn't have posted this at a better time - I'm in the middle of sketching out a couple new products and a lot of these concepts I haven't taken into consideration yet (mostly DFA).

I wish there was a way to have gold posts. I wouldn't mind seeing a full presentation on the subject at the next summit that goes into better/personal details either...

Rep++

Lol tell them staff members to turn it gold

 

[Niptuck MD]

Guys/gals, a thorough pdf that was compiled by me over the years that may be of help breaking down this science/process.

@amp0193 @SYK @Eskil @TKDTyler

@AllenCrawley @Vigilante can this thread be switched over to public

 

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[amp0193]

I wouldn't mind seeing a full presentation on the subject at the next summit that goes into better/personal details either...

Second this. The crazy things you've experienced first hand to amass the knowledge have got to make for some good stories and a very interesting presentation.


Just downloaded the pdf... skimming it, it looks awesome. Gonna read through it this weekend. Thanks for the continued knowledge bombs @Arun Siva

 

[Niptuck MD]

thanks for the words @amp0193 and the reps+ wonder how long it will take for it to be notable lol

 

[Niptuck MD]

here is a useful guide I received in part of a supplier paid training; hands down one of the best modules i have encountered in dealing with potential suppliers/manufacturers and the negotiations

 

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[SYK]

Hey @Arun Siva how do you approach pricing when you get quotes? Do you always presume there is room to move? Is it worth making a small <10% saving if it has a potential impact on the working relationship?

 

[Argin Gerigorian]

Golden Thread! Everyone in ecommerce business this is a MUST READ!

Let’s say you have done your DD, Now, what

Is there something you really don’t want to forget??

Here is a somewhat lucrative checklist:

Describe the product

• Write down precise product specifications

Identify and pre-qualify supplier(s)

• List potential suppliers that offer the right kind of product
• Communicate your standard terms (about payment, QC…)
• Ask a rough quotation
• Do a background check on the supplier and an audit of the factory

Share product information with potential supplier(s)

• Ask the supplier to sign and chop an enforceable NDA
• Share product specs with supplier(s)
• Send a sample to supplier(s), if applicable
• Get feedback about product specs

Develop special tooling/molds with supplier(s), if necessary

• Find a price agreement
• Get a development agreement signed and chopped by the supplier
• If necessary, wire money

Develop samples with supplier(s) [for a new product]

• Supplier sends 1st sample
• Client comments about 1st samples
• If necessary, supplier sends more samples
• Approval of golden sample
• Comments for production

Develop samples with supplier(s) [for a new labeling or packing]

• Supplier sends 1st sample
• Client comments about 1st samples
• If necessary, supplier sends more samples
• Approval of golden sample
• Comments for production

Finalize product specs

• Confirm with supplier that product specs are correct

Issue PO, confirm 1 supplier

• Select 1 supplier
• Make the product spec sheet an exhibit of the purchase order

Authorize the supplier to start production

• Get a manufacturing agreement signed and chopped by the supplier
• Launch the payment process (transfer of deposit / opening of letter of credit)
• Remind the supplier to book the materials/components immediately

Comment on production samples

• Supplier sends samples taken from mass production
• Comment on samples
• If necessary, supplier sends samples again

Inspection/testing during production

• Share PO & share product specs with inspection firm/staff
• Get an estimate of the price/time necessary, and confirm
• Tell supplier about inspection plans
• Supplier proposes timing of inspection
• Get report & give feedback to supplier

Book shipment with a forwarder

• Get quotes and compare them
• Confirm a quote
• Start tracking shipment with forwarder

Approve quality before shipment

• Share PO & share product specs with inspection firm/staff
• Get an estimate of the price/time necessary, and confirm
• Tell supplier about inspection plans
• Supplier proposes timing of inspection
• Get report & give feedback to supplier
• If necessary, proceed to re-inspection and issue a debit note to supplier

Shipment

• Forwarder advises closing date
• Authorize shipment
• Forwarder confirms the products were made available in time
• Forwarder confirms the products were shipped out
• Supplier sends a copy of the documents
• Confirm that the documents are all correct

Final payment

• Check the quantity of shipped products
• If payment by bank wire: transfer the balance
• Supplier sends all original documents
• Confirm receipt of all original documents

Customs clearance

• Forwarder/agent applies for clearance
• Payment of import duties

Domestic transport

• Arrange domestic transport
• Confirm receipt of products

Warehousing

• Arrange sufficient manpower and space

QC on incoming products

• Share PO & share product specs with internal QC staff
• QC service checks conformity & quality
• If necessary, give feedback to supplier and inspectors

@Envision @amp0193 @Hyrum

Feel free to share ya’lls take