Need help with pricing/negotiating

[DVU]

Recently I contacted a company that does video home tours

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPgJ6lekEutiDFIOpyhSwbw

because they had a sh*t website, and they got back requesting some background and a quote.

The thing with this site is that they have a HUGE "database" of house listings and realtors(could be more than 400) and every single one of those has a page on the website. So you can imagine the size of the project.

As this is huge I reached out to @Fox for some advice and he told me that this is a 30-50k project(in my mind unthinkable amount, for now) and with that In mind, I sent a quote of 18-30k.

In my mind, it was too much, but I listened anyway to fox's advice(BTW, what a great guy, altho we talked before, he had no idea it was me and just gave me his skype and shared some solid advice, if you are reading this, thank man)

They got back to me saying that it was too much and after asking what is their budget they said that the biggest quote they received was half my price. Of course I in someway expect that.

I want to lower the price to 7k(I know that is it worth 7 times that, but from my point of view this would bring me to 90% of my goal in my thread, and I really want to do this just for the experience and to have something huge like that under my belt and I would tap into a huge network of potential clients.)


My question now is how do I justify going from potentially 30k to 7k without looking like I am desperate for work.

"I talked with my partners and we can bring it down to 7000$ USD because (insert a reason that doesn't sound stupid/desperate)"

Any advice on how to win this client would be much appreciated, thanks!

 

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[Fox]

Recently I contacted a company that does video home tours

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPgJ6lekEutiDFIOpyhSwbw

because they had a sh*t website, and they got back requesting some background and a quote.

The thing with this site is that they have a HUGE "database" of house listings and realtors(could be more than 400) and every single one of those has a page on the website. So you can imagine the size of the project.

As this is huge I reached out to @Fox for some advice and he told me that this is a 30-50k project(in my mind unthinkable amount, for now) and with that In mind, I sent a quote of 18-30k.

In my mind, it was too much, but I listened anyway to fox's advice(BTW, what a great guy, altho we talked before, he had no idea it was me and just gave me his skype and shared some solid advice, if you are reading this, thank man)

They got back to me saying that it was too much and after asking what is their budget they said that the biggest quote they received was half my price. Of course I in someway expect that.

I want to lower the price to 7k(I know that is it worth 7 times that, but from my point of view this would bring me to 90% of my goal in my thread, and I really want to do this just for the experience and to have something huge like that under my belt and I would tap into a huge network of potential clients.)


My question now is how do I justify going from potentially 30k to 7k without looking like I am desperate for work.

"I talked with my partners and we can bring it down to 7000$ USD because (insert a reason that doesn't sound stupid/desperate)"

Any advice on how to win this client would be much appreciated, thanks!

Hey I still think its that amount. If you don't have to redo that backend stuff them maybe less but that is a big job.
I do 6 page websites for 7k. That has at least 100.

You could bring it down to match the competitors, I wouldn't do 7k - It might seem like a big amount now but it won't be profit.

Figure out what is going on with that database first before you proceed. But still this is way off what I do - I don't ever price on price. You are entering the price game and usually the only way that can go is down. Personally I would stick to the original price and tell them thats what it needs to be done right.

If you drop to 7k I highly suspect they will go with a competitor unless they are strapped for cash (and then expect a lot of trouble finishing that job).

 

[DVU]

Hey I still think its that amount. If you don't have to redo that backend stuff them maybe less but that is a big job.
I do 6 page websites for 7k. That has at least 100.

You could bring it down to match the competitors, I wouldn't do 7k - It might seem like a big amount now but it won't be profit.

Figure out what is going on with that database first before you proceed. But still this is way off what I do - I don't ever price on price. You are entering the price game and usually the only way that can go is down. Personally I would stick to the original price and tell them thats what it needs to be done right.

If you drop to 7k I highly suspect they will go with a competitor unless they are strapped for cash (and then expect a lot of trouble finishing that job).

I have it all figured out about how I would do the database, that's not the problem.

What I think I will do is offer 5k to redo everything except that database(So just the static website) and see if they are going to have someone else do it or something.

The thing is they are not going to accept that price, no matter what I offered as ROI.

 

[Utopia]

This is just a business negotiation. I love this shit.

Your price wasn't too high for them or they would have just balked and left.

A counter-offer would have been better, but the next best thing is them showing you another offer that they have on the table. They are in the market and must have some interest or they wouldn't have talked to you more.

I am with Fox on the pricing of the job and if you truly believe it to be higher, then I would advise you to stick true to yourself before all others, but if you want to continue negotiations you can definitely do so.

You have to set a minimum price you would accept and a goal price. This could be Goal=$15k Minimum=$13k
-Be specific because your mind goes fuzzy in negotiations.

Then talk to them about it and offer high. I would come back with something such as $22k. They will possibly counter somewhere at $10k or $12k, maybe they didn't even have an offer before and that was just their form of a counter offer? Doesn't matter.

I would counter again for something like $18k or $19k. Act like you are willing to walk away and they might just agree then, or they counter offer at $15k or $16k.

Again I state that knowing your worth is first, but if you do negotiate this, understand you have power and could win here depending on your outcome.

 

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[DVU]

This is just a business negotiation. I love this shit.

Your price wasn't too high for them or they would have just balked and left.

A counter-offer would have been better, but the next best thing is them showing you another offer that they have on the table. They are in the market and must have some interest or they wouldn't have talked to you more.

I am with Fox on the pricing of the job and if you truly believe it to be higher, then I would advise you to stick true to yourself before all others, but if you want to continue negotiations you can definitely do so.

You have to set a minimum price you would accept and a goal price. This could be Goal=$15k Minimum=$13k
-Be specific because your mind goes fuzzy in negotiations.

Then talk to them about it and offer high. I would come back with something such as $22k. They will possibly counter somewhere at $10k or $12k, maybe they didn't even have an offer before and that was just their form of a counter offer? Doesn't matter.

I would counter again for something like $18k or $19k. Act like you are willing to walk away and they might just agree then, or they counter offer at $15k or $16k.

Again I state that knowing your worth is first, but if you do negotiate this, understand you have power and could win here depending on your outcome.

Solid advice.

"
"
The best we can do for the whole project is 13000$ USD. If you are interested we can do everything except that huge search feature for 5000$ USD. That is the minimum we can go and deliver the maximum quality.

As for the other offers, you might have issues with the project that big not being properly done by another agency because projects of that size go for a lot higher price.

Good luck with the project in the future.

--
Best regards,
Domagoj
DotComSolutions.org
"
"

About to send this. Any thoughts?

 

[Fox]

The best we can do for the whole project is 13000$ USD. If you are interested we can do everything except that huge search feature for 5000$ USD. That is the minimum we can go and deliver the maximum quality.

As for the other offers, you might have issues with the project that big not being properly done by another agency because projects of that size go for a lot higher price.

Good luck with the project in the future.

--
Best regards,
Domagoj
DotComSolutions.org

They have the money, talk about value. Sell them you first - the price comes afterwards. I don't see that email working.


I someone is watching my kid (I don't have one) I want to make sure they are the right choice, then price comes later.

If someone is doing heart surgery on me I want to know they are the right choice, then price comes later.

If someone is doing my business website for me I want to know they are the right choice, then price comes later.


Would you hire a doctor who tried to sell you on price? A babysitter? A lawyer?
"I can do that heart surgery for $1,997"


Call these people up, or do a highly detailed email, and start selling on value. @SinisterLex is the best guy on the forum for this type of thing.

 

[DVU]

They have the money, talk about value. Sell them you first - the price comes afterwards. I don't see that email working.


I someone is watching my kid (I don't have one) I want to make sure they are the right choice, then price comes later.

If someone is doing heart surgery on me I want to know they are the right choice, then price comes later.

If someone is doing my business website for me I want to know they are the right choice, then price comes later.


Would you hire a doctor who tried to sell you on price? A babysitter? A lawyer?
"I can do that heart surgery for $1,997"


Call these people up, or do a highly detailed email, and start selling on value. @SinisterLex is the best guy on the forum for this type of thing.

I get what you mean.

I have already sent an email like that.

I put emphasis on adding value and making sure every visitor(in short) has the easiest time seeing the quality of their services and contacting them. Plus the additional services I offer like CDN, Hosting, domains, SSL, SEO etc...

The first part of the email was just how much value I will add and then I put the portfolio and then the quote in the last place.

But if they won't bite they won't bite, we will see.

I have yet to go trough all of lex's posts. Thanks for the tip.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

I get what you mean.

I have already sent an email like that.

I put emphasis on adding value and making sure every visitor(in short) has the easiest time seeing the quality of their services and contacting them. Plus the additional services I offer like CDN, Hosting, domains, SSL, SEO etc...

The first part of the email was just how much value I will add and then I put the portfolio and then the quote in the last place.

But if they won't bite they won't bite, we will see.

I have yet to go trough all of lex's posts. Thanks for the tip.

If you're lowering your price, don't lower all the way to $7k.

You quoted at $18 to $30k, so offer something in there.

Then let them choose a lower price. If they say $7k then you say, I'm sorry, but the lowest I can go is $18k.

Then back it up with value as you were discussing above.

If they're about to ditch the call...then MAYBE drop to like $13k, but only if they agree to pay right now. This is a flash sale price. Last resort only. You wanna be a BOSS gotta charge like a BOSS. You decide your worth.

 

[MidwestLandlord]

Disclaimer: I know exactly jack about website building.

But my favorite counter offer line is: "I can't go below $xxx, but I can also give you [insert additional value offer here] for the same price"

 

[GMSI7D]

"I talked with my partners and we can bring it down to 7000$ USD because (insert a reason that doesn't sound stupid/desperate)"

Any advice on how to win this client would be much appreciated, thanks!

insert a reason : because your client is the smart guy and you are the dumb one

this is called the columbo strategy . everybody laughs at this " dumb lieutenant" until they are arrested by the smart lieutenant

find a way to make your client think you overlooked something and that he is making the deal of the year

 

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[Jon L]

Definitely agree on selling value.

On the pricing side, I'd trust Fox. You've already halved his price. That's not good. The worst case scenario is that you'd win this project at some low dollar amount, and then starve for the months it takes to finish everything.

Run, don't walk from clients that expect you to work for peanuts. You'll find that you'll loose some deals to people that offer lowball quotes. Those people fall into one of two camps:

1) They live overseas where $10/hr gets you a 3000 sq foot house with live-in servants (not exaggerating ... I'm talking 2 maids and a driver, full time).
or
2) They don't know what they're getting into and think they honestly could do it for that price. I know a guy that went with a series of developers like this...for FOUR YEARS ... and still doesn't have a working product.

You'll also win some ... and the ones that you win will be really good clients...the kind of clients you'll have for many years, if you treat them right.

 

[Andy Black]

Disclaimer: I know exactly jack about website building.

But my favorite counter offer line is: "I can't go below $xxx, but I can also give you [insert additional value offer here] for the same price"

This is what I often do.

They say €1,500/mth is too high and we settle at €800/mth. We just go slower that's all.

Oh, you've only got $7k? Let me see. We can do a logo. your home page, and your contact us page for that...



The Egyptian's are great at this with tourists. We were haggling over the price of a rug and my friend wouldn't budge upwards. They then showed smaller rugs for her price range.

 

[DVU]

If you're lowering your price, don't lower all the way to $7k.

You quoted at $18 to $30k, so offer something in there.

Then let them choose a lower price. If they say $7k then you say, I'm sorry, but the lowest I can go is $18k.

Then back it up with value as you were discussing above.

If they're about to ditch the call...then MAYBE drop to like $13k, but only if they agree to pay right now. This is a flash sale price. Last resort only. You wanna be a BOSS gotta charge like a BOSS. You decide your worth.

That's what I ended up doing. Said the best I can do is 13k for the whole project or 5k for the static website without the database.

Told them not to go too low if they end up going with someone else because they might end up with a half-assed product and "good luck with the project in the future"

--

When you go from charging 200$ for a website to this it takes some time to digest it. But thanks for the advice.

insert a reason : because your client is the smart guy and you are the dumb one

this is called the columbo strategy . everybody laughs at this " dumb lieutenant" until they are arrested by the smart lieutenant

find a way to make your client think you overlooked something and that he is making the deal of the year

Some harsh truth but you are probably right. Have never negotiated a deal like this and the guy probably knows what he is doing.

Thanks for the advice.

Definitely agree on selling value.

On the pricing side, I'd trust Fox. You've already halved his price. That's not good. The worst case scenario is that you'd win this project at some low dollar amount, and then starve for the months it takes to finish everything.

Run, don't walk from clients that expect you to work for peanuts. You'll find that you'll loose some deals to people that offer lowball quotes. Those people fall into one of two camps:

1) They live overseas where $10/hr gets you a 3000 sq foot house with live-in servants (not exaggerating ... I'm talking 2 maids and a driver, full time).
or
2) They don't know what they're getting into and think they honestly could do it for that price. I know a guy that went with a series of developers like this...for FOUR YEARS ... and still doesn't have a working product.

You'll also win some ... and the ones that you win will be really good clients...the kind of clients you'll have for many years, if you treat them right.

To me, it's not and the way I am thinking about it yes it is going to be a big project but I could probably finish it in a month or two and I am climbing from 200$/website to this so it is defiantly an improvement, but thanks for the help.

 

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[GMSI7D]

why don't you search the internet about your problem ?


there are dozens of forums on money and so on.

google is your friend

 

[DVU]

why don't you search the internet about your problem ?


there are dozens of forums on money and so on.

google is your friend

What are you referring to by the "problem" ?

I just needed some tips on how to handle this from someone more experienced than me

 

[Waspy]

I know nothing about pricing a website, however strongly agree with what utopia, and a number of other members said.

1. They would have walked if they weren't interested in you at the price you quoted, the fact they replied shows they are still on the hook.

2. Never (IMO) jump to accommodate on price without adjusting what you are offering. It shows you don't value what you are offering.

3. Always try and meet their budget by adjusting your offering. They want you to half the price, half the content. Sounds harsh, but if you truely beleive your prices represent value, then why cut them?

4. This isn't the only client you will ever get. The fact you have interest from someone wanting a 100 page website shows you have something to offer. If there is one, there will be many!

 

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[Utopia]

Oh wow there is a lot here. I didn't think I knew so much about negotiation, but you guys have a lot of bullshit on the concept so here:

The best we can do for the whole project is 13000$ USD. If you are interested we can do everything except that huge search feature for 5000$ USD. That is the minimum we can go and deliver the maximum quality.

Way too low. This is a sign of a guy trying to just get the negotiation phase over. Take your time and stay closer to your original offer. $17-25k. If a guy comes to me with an offer like this I know he has no idea what he is doing in negotiation and likely he is uncomfortable. I would counter your offer with something like $8k in the hopes of getting it to $10k if I am the other guy.

I put emphasis on adding value and making sure every visitor(in short) has the easiest time seeing the quality of their services and contacting them. Plus the additional services I offer like CDN, Hosting, domains, SSL, SEO etc...

Careful, as this often comes off as begging. When you walk up to a woman at the bar, you don't get her to come home with you by telling her all the things that she will get (great sex, cuddle afterwards, etc.) Instead you stay firm to your offer of conversation and your ability to walk away and the value proposition works on an unconscious level. The most valuable thing you can offer to this potential client is you believing in the price that you gave him. Because if you don't believe the price you originally told him, then why should he believe anything you are saying?

Then let them choose a lower price. If they say $7k then you say, I'm sorry, but the lowest I can go is $18k.

No. You choose the price. You only set up the conditions for them to make the choice you want. IE. I want $15k so I propose $20K, they say $12k and then I say $17k. Finally they say what about $15k and you say deal. You decide before even negotiating. In a world where people can't decide, you make the decision.

Also do NOT say, "I'm sorry, but the lowest I can go is x." For two reasons, this shuts off the conversation and because you are a lier if you have anything more to say after they came back to you. This strategy can work because the other person feels the scarcity, "Oh no I have to make a choice now and I don't know if it will be any better." But it is not an effective strategy if you really want to win. I say again:

But my favorite counter offer line is: "I can't go below $xxx, but I can also give you [insert additional value offer here] for the same price"

Do not F*cking say, "This is the lowest I can go.", "I can't go below x dollars" or any other bullshit. You want to be genuine, real, and confident in your negotiations which is also why you don't say:

"I talked with my partners and we can bring it down to 7000$ USD because (insert a reason that doesn't sound stupid/desperate)"

Again this is short term strategy with short term success. This is a web development project and you want to gain, keep, and do more business with this client and people like this client. This strategy wins because of human psychology, "Oh shit what a deal I better act now." But in the long term they don't have respect for you and the 'deal' that you just gave them. What happens next time they want something to get done and there isn't a set price for it? Or if they have a friend that they want to point toward your services. They will want a deal similar to that of which you gave them before and when you can't do that what are you going to say? I can't do it because it was a one time thing and I was desperate for business? "My partner (boss) said I can't do that anymore." I don't want to negotiate with you, give me your boss who has some balls. Good luck finding and keeping more clients with that strategy.

They say €1,500/mth is too high and we settle at €800/mth. We just go slower that's all.

Oh, you've only got $7k? Let me see. We can do a logo. your home page, and your contact us page for that...

I also vote against this. Back to the doctor example, if you tell him you only have x amount of dollars, he is not going to do a half check up on you. The same should be true for your business. "I told you what you needed, you either want to do it the right way or not at all." You undervalue your services when you start price cutting. And if you only want to deal with winners this communicates that you are winning in business and don't have to have their business.

3. Always try and meet their budget by adjusting your offering. They want you to half the price, half the content. Sounds harsh, but if you truely beleive your prices represent value, then why cut them?

You look cheap in doing this and it becomes hard for you to go the extra mile with your client. In addition there is a standard that you set with your clients, if you won't settle for anything less, than why should they. Half the price and what you give your client and you are half-assing them.

Aim add value into your offer rather than cutting price. "I can do this price, oh and you remember that other thing we talked about earlier, I will throw that in as well." Back to our doctor example, he does this when he gives your child a lollipop at the end.

Would you hire a doctor who tried to sell you on price? A babysitter? A lawyer?
"I can do that heart surgery for $1,997"

This is beautiful advise.

As an added thought, this is long-term web development relationship. Coming to them with any bullshit communication or anything less than genuine is going to set you up for more of a shitty relationship. If you compromise in one area they will expect you to do it in another area. If you give them poor advise or don't demand them to put what it really requires into the project then they are going to do more of the same throughout the project.

 

[Jon L]

That's what I ended up doing. Said the best I can do is 13k for the whole project or 5k for the static website without the database.

Told them not to go too low if they end up going with someone else because they might end up with a half-assed product and "good luck with the project in the future"

--

When you go from charging 200$ for a website to this it takes some time to digest it. But thanks for the advice.


Some harsh truth but you are probably right. Have never negotiated a deal like this and the guy probably knows what he is doing.

Thanks for the advice.


To me, it's not and the way I am thinking about it yes it is going to be a big project but I could probably finish it in a month or two and I am climbing from 200$/website to this so it is defiantly an improvement, but thanks for the help.

@Fox How many hours do you think this project would take you?

 

[Fox]

@Fox How many hours do you think this project would take you?

Without the backend stuff only a week but I wouldn't like to split it as such. I'm not criticizing this job selection (and the clients did say they want it fixed) but it's not the type of project I would personally target. I hope he does get this job, it would have huge profile, but I think at 7k there won't be much money made on it.

With the backend stuff I would have to outcourse, it's beyond my ability.

 

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[Jon L]

Without the backend stuff only a week but I wouldn't like to split it as such. I'm not criticizing this job selection (and the clients did say they want it fixed) but it's not the type of project I would personally target. I hope he does get this job, it would have huge profile, but I think at 7k there won't be much money made on it.

With the backend stuff I would have to outcourse, it's beyond my ability.

Thanks Fox.

Domagoj: If you've never done a project this size before, I'd recommend that you find a back-end developer that you TRUST that can quote you a fixed price for the back end. If you can do that, and you think you can match Fox's time of 40 hours for the front end work, then you can quote based on that. Otherwise, you're setting yourself up for a world of hurt on this project. A $200 project is orders of magnitude easier than this thing. Not saying that you shouldn't take this on, but from what you've said so far, you don't know what you don't know yet.

 

[MidwestLandlord]

Disclaimer: I know exactly jack about website building.

But my favorite counter offer line is: "I can't go below $xxx, but I can also give you [insert additional value offer here] for the same price"

Aim add value into your offer rather than cutting price. "I can do this price, oh and you remember that other thing we talked about earlier, I will throw that in as well." Back to our doctor example, he does this when he gives your child a lollipop at the end.

Adding value instead of lowering price is what I meant. Your wording is MUCH stronger and more likely to get results than mine is though. Good post @Utopia.

 

[Andy Black]

They say €1,500/mth is too high and we settle at €800/mth. We just go slower that's all.

Oh, you've only got $7k? Let me see. We can do a logo. your home page, and your contact us page for that...

The Egyptian's are great at this with tourists. We were haggling over the price of a rug and my friend wouldn't budge upwards. They then showed smaller rugs for her price range.

I just wanted to expand on this in case it wasn't clear.


Someone walks onto your car lot and says they like the Mercedes at the front.

You say it's $25k.

They say that's too much, they only have $15k.

You say, oh, we have a lovely Toyota Corrolla for $15k over here.



Other pricing tips:

Walk away from someone who doesn't see the value and just sees the cost. They will be a PITA to deal with throughout your relationship with them.

Keep one eye on building a long-term relationship.

But price it so you'd be happy (delighted?) if you just did this piece of work and no future work materialised (like when they promise all sorts of cr@p if this project goes well - blah blah).

Be prepared to walk away if they don't bite. Be completely neutral about the outcome.


Control the silence. When it comes to the crunch, state your price/offer and then stfu. If they're any good they will prolong the silence too, and whoever speaks first will typically "lose". (Mind you, you should be creating win-win situations anyway.)

Get comfortable with the silence and don't start yabbering and undermining yourself. This is hard, especially if you talk a lot (like me!).

(@JScott had some stories about using the silence in another sales/pricing related thread somewhere.)


Lastly, get it wrong. Don't get too precious about pricing. So long as you're not losing money, then it's just more learnings.


Just the 2c from someone who gets it wrong constantly.

 

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[Jon L]

I just wanted to expand on this in case it wasn't clear.


Someone walks onto your car lot and says they like the Mercedes at the front.

You say it's $25k.

They say that's too much, they only have $15k.

You say, oh, we have a lovely Toyota Corrolla for $15k over here.



Other pricing tips:

Walk away from someone who doesn't see the value and just sees the cost. They will be a PITA to deal with throughout your relationship with them.

Keep one eye on building a long running relationship.

But price it so you'd be happy (delighted?) if you just did this piece of work and no future work materialised (like when they promise all sorts of cr@p if this project goes well - blah blah).

Be prepared to walk away if they don't bite. Be completely neutral about the outcome.


Control the silence. When it comes to the crunch, state your price/offer and then stfu. If they're any good they will prolong the silence too, and whoever speaks first will typically "lose". (Mind you, you should be creating win-win situations anyway.)

Get comfortable with the silence and don't start yabbering and undermining yourself. This is hard, especially if you talk a lot (like me!).


Lastly, get it wrong. Don't get too precious about it. So long as you're not losing money, then it's just more learnings.


Just the 2c from someone who gets it wrong constantly.

yup...my advice above comes from doing exactly this kind of project, waaaaaay under-quoting, and then vowing to never do that again.

 

[FastNAwesome]

To me, your proposed counter offer sounds too needy. To shred the price so much, and exactly to their wanted amount. If I was a client, I couldn't take it seriously, and would wonder what if I ask for even lower price.

One way to go about it is to stay firm on price, but fragment it into 2 parts:

- Front end for close to their asking price (but not the exact match!)
- Back end for whatever price I feel is needed to comfortably and with quality do the job

Oh, and sometimes (always?) jobs can look simpler when looking from the outside, and then when you get into it you realize there's actually plenty of work and you earned your every dime

That said, good luck!

 

[Utopia]

One way to go about it is to stay firm on price, but fragment it into 2 parts:

- Front end for close to their asking price (but not the exact match!)
- Back end for whatever price I feel is needed to comfortably and with quality do the job

More sketch advise on how to be un-genuine and dupe the person in paying for more the job. Again a short term win.

 

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[Andy Black]

More sketch advise on how to be un-genuine and dupe the person in paying for more the job. Again a short term win.

Depend why it's done, and how it's communicated I guess.

I consider our sevices "sticky". I'm happy to get in for a low initial price, provide value (especially visible value), and then have them buy more and more from us.

A recent example came from having a coffee with a business owner looking to get a new website.

I told her she didn't need a website, she needed sales, and that she didn't need to spend €3k on a website just yet.

She was delighted to spend €200 on a landing page and then €500/mth ongoing for AdWords campaign build and optimisation.

We now have our hat in the ring for their website build, and I think it's for us to lose since we already have a relationship with her.

We got a chance to "show don't tell" how diligently we worked, how we communicated, and the quality of our output.

She's happy enough to go into their second month of AdWords management with us.

It's all to play for.

 

[Utopia]

Depend why it's done, and how it's communicated I guess.

I consider our sevices "sticky". I'm happy to get in for a low initial price, provide value (especially visible value), and then have them buy more and more from us.

A recent example came from having a coffee with a business owner looking to get a new website.

I told her she didn't need a website, she needed sales, and that she didn't need to spend €3k on a website just yet.

She was delighted to spend €200 on a landing page and then €500/mth ongoing for AdWords campaign build and optimisation.

We now have our hat in the ring for their website build, and I think it's for us to lose since we already have a relationship with her.

We got a chance to "show don't tell" how diligently we worked, how we communicated, and the quality of our output.

She's happy enough to go into their second month with us.

It's all to play for.

Fair enough, I equate your example with the same thing as a tripwire in business. They aren't yet willing to buy your big project, but just to get in with them you give them a low priced product, when they see the amount of value offered then they convert on the higher product.

This works when you are giving a ton of value and what they need, not when you had the plan all along of under delivering until they paid the appropriate price. Often times I see people going far away from people who have those annoying additional offers (think spirit airlines, they are always doing this and I will never fly them again.)

So yeah good perspective.

 

[FastNAwesome]

More sketch advise on how to be un-genuine and dupe the person in paying for more the job. Again a short term win.

I didn't propose unfair pricing anywhere, or even a change of offer, but merely fragmenting the offer into 2 pieces. I only consider a win something that's win-win.

I want $15k so I propose $20K, they say $12k and then I say $17k. Finally they say what about $15k and you say deal. You decide before even negotiating. In a world where people can't decide, you make the decision.

How is this negotiating, and my post is duping?

Genuinely asking. I liked your post, so maybe there's something I don't understand.

 

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[Andy Black]

Thread title changed from "Need help/advice" to "Need help with pricing/negotiating".

Nice viewpoints and input so far.

Good examples of people responding well to counter viewpoints too. I guess that shouldn't come as a surprise considering it's a thread about negotiating...

 

[Andy Black]

Fair enough, I equate your example with the same thing as a tripwire in business. They aren't yet willing to buy your big project, but just to get in with them you give them a low priced product, when they see the amount of value offered then they convert on the higher product.

This works when you are giving a ton of value and what they need, not when you had the plan all along of under delivering until they paid the appropriate price. Often times I see people going far away from people who have those annoying additional offers (think spirit airlines, they are always doing this and I will never fly them again.)

So yeah good perspective.

Thanks.

It all comes from this belief:

• www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/the-first-purchase-is-a-test.71227