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Isaac Oh

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After some searching, there doesn't seem to be much discussion about the music industry that goes into depth; they tend to fade out. However, there's too much intelligence and wisdom on this forum to not take advantage of. So, let's start this thread as a sort-of mega-thread where we can introduce ourselves, network, talk about what music we like, and develop each other. Music industry or not, feel free to pitch in. @MJ, I hope this is appropriate.

Feel free to ask any questions, I intend to stay active and offer myself in any way.

A bit about myself:
I have about 3 years of experience in the industry. I work in the SF bay area. I turned 22 recently. I don't particularly like music festivals. I'm not even following something I was initially into, there was and still is just a disgusting amount of need in the market. My preferred genre is hip-hop but I work mostly with EDM.

The record label/event production company that I co-founded with my partner Johan is closing in on its first birthday. Because of its small size, it's forced me to develop multiple aspects including marketing, branding, artist development, and even design.

Many DJs/producers are in college or want to begin their careers during college but have little to no direction when it comes to actually dealing with the industry as opposed to gigs at nightclubs so our goal is to develop these talents while also hosting large-scale events and festivals to give our guys live experience.

For those looking to start anything:
I began with small-time management of my fraternity brother Johan who, along with his actual brother, had been producing EDM seriously for about 3 years prior and played second-tier nightclub gigs at major US cities like LA, SF, NY. The two were and are still very personable (my fraternity brother is one of the kindest person I know and always has the other's best interests at heart) and out going and as a result they had some following and connections within the industry to the level that it intimidated me who had zero experience.

At the time, before I took up "management", a philosophy I was toying around in my head from "Think and Grow Rich" was the idea that to earn something whether it was a job or money, you had to deserve it or else the universe would not provide it because you would crumble under the pressure, splurge on self-destructive vices, etc. Thus, when you developed your potential as a man, or woman, the universe would seek to fill the void produced by this expanded potential. Therefore, when Johan expressed to me that he and his brother were looking for someone to manage and grow with them, instead of immediately saying "yes" and falling short of those promises like so many people did, I busted a$$. I read two textbooks, one on Artist Management and one about the Music Industry, compiled a list of around 50 relevant youtube channels to which I submitted their music, and revamped several of their social media. I got the job. If you want something, don't ask for permission or come from a place of taking value but rather develop yourself to where you become indispensable and can come from a place to offer value. Many people bitch that they were laid off or whatever when all they were offering was something that could be replaced by calculators. Don't chase what you want. Develop yourself until what you want chases you.

Now, we throw events regularly. Johan and his brother have played at large events including Coachella. We are getting our guys spinning out at top clubs and released on top labels like Trap Nation.

Would love to network with anyone out there! Let's co-produce an event, collaborate with music, and otherwise disrupt this industry!
 

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The-J

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There's some stuff on the music industry in the Insiders.

I also have been in contact with some people who wanted to use my services to promote their events. Haven't gotten into it yet, but I noticed the need immediately.

My end is a bit different since I'm more on the 'get butts in seats' side of things. But events like Coachella and Ezoo don't really need much by way of promotion anymore. They have pretty much everything covered on that end.

No, it's the smaller, more experimental type stuff that really needs the help. It's also local tribute bands who are looking to put together a small pub tour.

As far as the actual production of music + 'disruption' to be found there... that's out of my element.
 

Mike Partee

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@Scot thanks for the add

@Isaac Oh

Thanks for sharing your experience so far! It seems like you have a good head on your shoulders and have a good idea of feeling out the market.

I think why you won't find much related to the music industry here is because the consensus is:

1: Music (Specifically music production/creation/performance) doesn't solve a need, but rather a want.

2: The market size is significantly smaller

3: The market is significantly more saturated

Not to say that it's impossible to make money in the music industry, but compared to anything else, it's like trying to chop down a ten-foot-wide tree with a knife versus snapping a sapling in half. It takes Executional Excellence above all else, and personally I've found that my time and energy put into a different market with better odds (Specified Need + Large Market Size + Fewer Competitors) would be more rewarding.

Here are a few threads discussing the topic:
What problem/needs can artists solve?
Is it possible to become a Fastlane musician?
Why You're In The Wrong Industry
GOLD - I have a problem with MJ DeMarco (Follow your passion gets a beatdown)

On the flipside, there's a really cool thread about throwing events (which looks like what you're doing):
How to make 15-20K in 4 hours..EVENTS!

----------

As for opportunities...

I'm not a huge fan of selling shovels, but I do like businesses that can help provide a component to a musician's success.
In this case, I have a very small progress thread on the inside about establishing exclusive license deals with musicians and selling products using their brand.
These were small to mid-size artists and labels (some of which you may be familiar with if you frequent Trap Nation).

In addition, Professional Services are still valuable if you're good - It's just not very easily scalable.
Made decent money writing custom orchestral compositions / foley art for commercial projects a few years ago:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfqgV1mxaiM&feature=youtu.be&ab_channel=JeffElkins


(The original video has no audio. All sounds were compiled and mixed. Foley sounds were sourced from public domain recordings, manipulated in a way that matched the video.)

Also, The thing I love about the music industry is they're always about 5 years behind in terms of technology.

Specifically services/software/standards that are used in every other industry. Related to management;The fact that Eventric's 'Master Tour' software is still widely used boggles my mind. It's just so ugly and clunky. Also, Bandcamp...c'mon. The site's features are so limited and the UI is ugly af.

A well versed tech entrepreneur can absolutely murder the music industry with alternatives to these abortions.

--------

Thanks again for sharing!
I'll come up with some questions soon...
 

Isaac Oh

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There's some stuff on the music industry in the Insiders.

I also have been in contact with some people who wanted to use my services to promote their events. Haven't gotten into it yet, but I noticed the need immediately.

My end is a bit different since I'm more on the 'get butts in seats' side of things. But events like Coachella and Ezoo don't really need much by way of promotion anymore. They have pretty much everything covered on that end.

No, it's the smaller, more experimental type stuff that really needs the help. It's also local tribute bands who are looking to put together a small pub tour.

As far as the actual production of music + 'disruption' to be found there... that's out of my element.
That's great The-J! Yeah those big guys are pretty much set in terms of what up-and-coming event production companies are looking for. At that point, the struggle seems to be keeping things fresh.
 

Isaac Oh

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@Scot thanks for the add

@Isaac Oh

Thanks for sharing your experience so far! It seems like you have a good head on your shoulders and have a good idea of feeling out the market.

I think why you won't find much related to the music industry here is because the consensus is:

1: Music (Specifically music production/creation/performance) doesn't solve a need, but rather a want.

2: The market size is significantly smaller

3: The market is significantly more saturated

Not to say that it's impossible to make money in the music industry, but compared to anything else, it's like trying to chop down a ten-foot-wide tree with a knife versus snapping a sapling in half. It takes Executional Excellence above all else, and personally I've found that my time and energy put into a different market with better odds (Specified Need + Large Market Size + Fewer Competitors) would be more rewarding.

Here are a few threads discussing the topic:
What problem/needs can artists solve?
Is it possible to become a Fastlane musician?
Why You're In The Wrong Industry
GOLD - I have a problem with MJ DeMarco (Follow your passion gets a beatdown)

On the flipside, there's a really cool thread about throwing events (which looks like what you're doing):
How to make 15-20K in 4 hours..EVENTS!

----------

As for opportunities...

I'm not a huge fan of selling shovels, but I do like businesses that can help provide a component to a musician's success.
In this case, I have a very small progress thread on the inside about establishing exclusive license deals with musicians and selling products using their brand.
These were small to mid-size artists and labels (some of which you may be familiar with if you frequent Trap Nation).

In addition, Professional Services are still valuable if you're good - It's just not very easily scalable.
Made decent money writing custom orchestral compositions / foley art for commercial projects a few years ago:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfqgV1mxaiM&feature=youtu.be&ab_channel=JeffElkins


(The original video has no audio. All sounds were compiled and mixed. Foley sounds were sourced from public domain recordings, manipulated in a way that matched the video.)

Also, The thing I love about the music industry is they're always about 5 years behind in terms of technology.

Specifically services/software/standards that are used in every other industry. Related to management;The fact that Eventric's 'Master Tour' software is still widely used boggles my mind. It's just so ugly and clunky. Also, Bandcamp...c'mon. The site's features are so limited and the UI is ugly af.

A well versed tech entrepreneur can absolutely murder the music industry with alternatives to these abortions.

--------

Thanks again for sharing!
I'll come up with some questions soon...

@UnrealCreative Thanks for the compliment and ask away!

And you bring to light so many things I've never considered. I've always thought the music industry was rather big and that just shows me my own naivete and humbles me. Thanks!

Not to argue but to discuss rather, aren't all needs to some degree wants? Or are we saying that music is a usually lesser want that would be less prioritized? Or is there a metric I'm ignorant of?

And I believe that the work our org would do for our guys would be more impactful to a few rather than less to the masses. What is your perspective on that?

Your composition is beautiful man. Are you still doing this?

I'm gonna have to hop on that tech idea haha! Honestly it's like musicians rely so heavily on tech but it feels like the two are on such opposite spectrums...
 

The-J

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Many DJs/producers are in college or want to begin their careers during college but have little to no direction when it comes to actually dealing with the industry as opposed to gigs at nightclubs so our goal is to develop these talents while also hosting large-scale events and festivals to give our guys live experience.

The question is, why are they not getting direction?

Why are they stuck doing gigs at nightclubs? Is it because, maybe, their names or skills can't pull a crowd?

The music industry works entirely on the ability of an artist to fill venues, sell records, and sell products. If an artist can't do that, why work with them?

Some artists can fill venues in their local city, but wouldn't be known at all the next town over. You'd think this would be less of an issue with the Internet, but that ain't really the case.

So are you managing the talent, hyping them up, getting their name out there so it fills venues, or are you doing something else?
 

Isaac Oh

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The question is, why are they not getting direction?

Why are they stuck doing gigs at nightclubs? Is it because, maybe, their names or skills can't pull a crowd?

The music industry works entirely on the ability of an artist to fill venues, sell records, and sell products. If an artist can't do that, why work with them?

Some artists can fill venues in their local city, but wouldn't be known at all the next town over. You'd think this would be less of an issue with the Internet, but that ain't really the case.

So are you managing the talent, hyping them up, getting their name out there so it fills venues, or are you doing something else?

Dude you just blew my mind. We have a strong core of self-driven and motived guys but when I look at the outer layer of members, they're really lacking focus, direction, or both. It's never occurred to me that maybe working with this group of people may not be the best path. Of course, it may be, but (now) maybe not.

We're taking aspiring or self-started music industry talent, whether that's blogging about events, photographing, or DJing. Yes, very saturated areas.

I noticed that because of the saturation, it's very difficult for these types of people to get a leg in the door of the industry. By having our own shows, we would be giving them the opportunity to get experience, develop themselves, put something on a resume to impress employers, and grow out of us by eventually working for a bigger company.

Our org on campus gives lectures on various topics from production to self-development. That way we are always on the radar for interested people.

If someone is interested in joining as an artist, we help develop their talent, hook them up with a network, and give them a jump start. Other careers, we give them something real to work with like being able to design the graphics for a large clubbing event.

My goal is to expand not unlike franchises to other campuses.

Besides that, I am focusing mostly on expanding the value we can give to our members, whether that's a stronger network or better producer teachers and also to the value we give to the community through events or entertaining videos or whatever.
 

SevenJay

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Please don't tell tales to musicians. Most of the time "music services" don't even realize they are worth less than a little piece of shit in a cd case, and they tell the world and the sky to musicians and bands just to take a percentage on the 3 more gigs they can organize for them and a monthly fee to send some useless email to other useless services, until the band realize they are not doing better than when they managed themselves and quit after a couple of months. You either give true opportunities and are good at finding the 3% of musicians that are not lunatic incompetent egos, or you don't have a business, you just have a small "stolen dreams" shop.
 

Isaac Oh

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Please don't tell tales to musicians. Most of the time "music services" don't even realize they are worth less than a little piece of shit in a cd case, and they tell the world and the sky to musicians and bands just to take a percentage on the 3 more gigs they can organize for them and a monthly fee to send some useless email to other useless services, until the band realize they are not doing better than when they managed themselves and quit after a couple of months. You either give true opportunities and are good at finding the 3% of musicians that are not lunatic incompetent egos, or you don't have a business, you just have a small "stolen dreams" shop.
Of course.
 

TKRR

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I've been a lunatic musician for a good 25 years now. I've played all over the eastern US and Europe, etc... my ideals in this industry have changed a lot over the years.

A couple key points about the music industry that make it a tough one:

  1. Musicians, like myself, are completely obsessed with music. We are obsessed with how it sounds, with how it feels, exploring it, trying things with it, playing with it. Etc… We are crazy about music. We are particularly crazy about the music we make, or plan to make. Because of this obsession, we pretty much aren’t even aware of what anyone else thinks about it. The tunnel vision is strong.
  2. Music, as a commodity, is more about social things than anything to do with the quality or type of music.
    1. People are very reluctant to consider listening to any music that doesn’t match their peer group. If your friends all love Katy Perry, Pink, and Taylor Swift, but someone asks you to listen to Slayer, you have to be careful to like it because it could literally mean, at least in your head if not more, needing to get new friends. This dissipates as you get older, but so do the number of friends you maintain.
  3. Music vs. being an Entertainer.
    1. Musicians don’t make money, but entertainers do. I used to struggle with this a lot, the thought that it should be “all about the music man”, but now I have a different attitude. When people go to shows, they want to be entertained, they want to be in another reality where they can forget their bullshit for a while. This is the VALUE entertainers/musicians bring to people. That escapism we all seek some times. We just want to have fun. Just like going to see a movie. It takes a musician, who we already know is obsessed with music, to only be pulled into music with know showmanship. That is a much smaller crowd.
  4. People basically don’t buy music online or anywhere anymore except at shows.
    1. Most shows I perform sell at least a few CDs, but I pretty much can’t even get people to sniff anything online anymore.
  5. The US, in particular, constantly devalues Art. We just don’t care about art in this country. We are a “me now” kind of place. Most people would happily never listen to music again.
  6. People are very weird about instrumental music. I don’t think people actually hear instrumental music very well, and some people don’t even consider music, ‘music” unless it has words.
  7. There are so many insanely talented musicians out there, that it is mindboggling. Seriously, your guitar heroes out there are chump change compared to even the most average guitarists out there. Skill, is not what makes people popular in this industry. Skill is in great abundance. You still have to put your time in on your instrument, but being a virtuoso is a dime a dozen.

I play a style of music jazz/rock kind of thing most of the time these days and it’s our country. This is partly because of social cues and not quality. There are stigmas to get past with regular folks that make it a tough sell. However, I get paid for every gig I play. I get good reception from the people that see me play, but it is a short lived high. Still, I’ve put out about 6 albums, with 2 more on deck and I keep creating things.

I also work as a full time engineer, so consider that, despite that, and being a father, I still am able to keep up professional level performances pretty regularly, including a gig tonight.

The question that comes to me a lot is… how do you really make money doing this thing? Sure I make a hundred bucks or so a gig (which is pretty good in my genre, even for the bigger names), and people tell me ‘oh wow, why aren’t you famous? Or wow, you could be playing in Van Halen” Or all kinds of crazy stuff. “Why are you working as an engineer?” blah blah. Since my day gig is with more “square” people, I get to ask them about art and music a lot, and it’s always depressing. They just don’t care about music at all. It’s completely secondary. This is a hard thing to understand for a musician. Even the people that “love” music will often tell me they never have actually bought any music or gone to any shows. Which is mindboggling to me. However, I’m trying to be more levelheaded about it.

But let’s gets back to the basics: We need to determine the need, and then figure out how to fill that gaps.

Here is the need I see:
  1. People want entertained. They want to forget about their lives for a few moments at least, and enjoy themselves. The performance is about them, not the music.
So how do we fill that need? If you can put on a show, or create a song that is about getting that person to forget their sorrows for a little while, or a song that helps them fill included, or exclusive, or all of the greedy things we want from anything. You can make money in this industry.

I don’t think style is really that important. Frank Zappa would still be popular if he came out today, because he was funny and an entertainer despite the music being “whacky” or whatever. I mean, look at gangster rap, the lyrics can be vial or whatever, but if the groups can entertain a crowd, they will get money for it.

So the question is how do we entertain people?

What sounds more appealing?
  1. 5 guys in jeans and t-shirts playing medium tempo straight rock tunes on stage. Lights set, no makeup or anything. No interaction with the crowd, just straight up music.
Or
  1. 5 guys in bright red leisure suits, crazy hair, jewelry, sun glasses, etc.… Jumping off of boxes, Getting in each other’s face, Lights going crazy, a video projector in the back playing a scene from a movie, while the band makes eye love with audience. Throws out picks and sticks, look like they’re having fun. Brings out props and talks with the audience telling jokes etc.… Up tempo and danceable songs.
Even if both bands played the same songs, the one that dressed the part, added theatrics and explosions or whatever will be more fun to watch.

Why is it that, I’m guilty of this, we musicians complain that we didn’t get more people at a show, when really… calling what we just did a “show.” Is a bit of an overstatement. How much did we really entertain by standing in the same place all night and dressing like everyone else in the building.

Do you know how many bands I see do that locally? None. They just complain. I just complain.

Now I know this is true, and I know it would get probably a lot more people to shows, buying CDs, etc… but I still don’t do it. Why? Cause I’m obsessed with the music, and it’s hard for put it all together like that. Help people like me, and I think a lot of people could make money.
 
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TKRR

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One last point.

I’ve known a few people who’ve gotten quite famous. What did they all have in common?

They toured the crap out of the country. They took a van, slept on floors, scrounged for food, played for pennies, talked to everyone at the bar. Saved phone numbers, did it again 6 months later, kept doing it. Not only did their performances get better all the time, but people started getting to know them. They were relentless. They got booed sometimes, they got kicked down, the got broke. But at some point things started changing for them. They started making more money, more and more people would show up at the gigs. When you play in just your town and you go from 10 people a show to 100 people a show, it’s not that big of a difference really. But when you play 50 cities in the US every 6 months and you go from 5 people to 50 people per show, it makes a huge difference. Then from 50 to 100 to 200 etc… The exponential explosion across all the cities is what changes the game. You go from 200 fans to 20,000 by having the same incremental growth across the board.


Most people, including me, aren’t willing to do this lifestyle (at least not now). But most people that I know that have stuck to this have done well for themselves.
 

TKRR

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I thought I'd harp on one of the points above so that it's not lost in the mix.

Music is a very social influenced industry. Meaning, you like what your peers like. This isn't as true as you get older, but as a young person, your peer group probably listens to the same stuff as you. To go against the grain, when they're all going to see the Chainsmokers and you want to see Cannibal Corpse, you might be committing friend suicide.

Unfortunately, according to studies, most people never listen to any real new music beyond their early 20s. They might listen to the radio, but their tastes don't change very much. My generation is full of Grunge Fans, Dave Matthew's Band Fans, Pantera, Britney Spears etc... it was what was "cool" at the time I was a teenager. Even if you play music similarly to those bands, my age group won't be interested. They're basically not interested in any new music at all. There are some exceptions, but it just doesn't happen.

There is one exception though... people of all ages will still let a little bit of the popular groups of any time, into their mix (probably for social acceptance).

The music industry is almost backwards, in a way, from other industries. Basically, we pretty much know the older you get, the more money you probably have to burn on stuff. 20 year olds almost never have any money, however when it comes to music, 20 year olds' completely determine what is popular or not. Then if that group gets popular with the 20 somethings, they can enjoy a life of continue success, since their fans will never like any other kind of music (in general).

So, to my mind, if you really want to make a long lasting well paid music career. You have to inspire the young 20 year old's with no money to love what you're doing. The odd thing is even though they might not buy the music directly, you'll take off and the trend will be set for the rest of the age groups will pick up the slack of trying to seem "Cool" to the 20 somethings.

If you try and tackle the 40 year old market, I think you'll get a lot of push back.

Unfortunately, almost no one makes it big after they turn 30. Because, what's more lame to a 19 year old than a 40 year old? So you have to somehow pepper that incredible ego of the youngin to somehow breakthrough to them.

So to really break, the question is, what do 20 year olds even like these days? Figure that out, create value for them, fit the mold, and start a movement.
 

Isaac Oh

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Yep! Appreciate the post. I've been working on developing my skills these past months to help out newer students and develop them
 

Limitless4Life

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What about making a site like this (www.strumsy.com), but that doesn't suck? I tried searching 'live music near me' the other night on Google and all I got was Yelp/restaurant pages and this. I was hoping for a site that gave me a calendar/list of all local bands playing near me (with some filters) without having to go into each individual restaurant website. Hmm....
 
G

Guest92dX

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Thanks for making this thread!

I may be interested in partnering with someone to solve a SMALL but REAL need that artists currently have.

If you are an insider and have verified your identity please PM me.

@Scot @The-J @UnrealCreative

The thread sparked a thought for me lolololololol. The idea is software.

Fwiw, if you check out my progress thread you can read about how I was bidding on competitor keywords. They ended up rolling out new products and lines to compete with what I was doing I think. I'm not totally sure though.

*Note: this idea is an actual or perceived problem that artists have*

If you're interested then we'll split the costs:

Total costs for the idea:

$70 Divi wordpress
$0 Zapier integration
$0 Stripe
$0 Wave
$0 Spreadsheets

Why I need you:

For your network of artists to verify the problem. I've only verified it 3 times. It's also going to be necessary for early sales.

Why you need me:

Because I know to how solve the problem. I also have 1 year of experience building mobile apps. I also understand the problem.

If you would rather not like to partner, but you want the idea I am willing to sell it on the INE's. The total cost is literally like $100 or less. This idea has a HUGE market as well.
 

Mike Partee

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Thanks for making this thread!

I may be interested in partnering with someone to solve a SMALL but REAL need that artists currently have.

If you are an insider and have verified your identity please PM me.

@Scot @The-J @UnrealCreative

The thread sparked a thought for me lolololololol. The idea is software.

Fwiw, if you check out my progress thread you can read about how I was bidding on competitor keywords. They ended up rolling out new products and lines to compete with what I was doing I think. I'm not totally sure though.

*Note: this idea is an actual or perceived problem that artists have*

If you're interested then we'll split the costs:

Total costs for the idea:

$70 Divi wordpress
$0 Zapier integration
$0 Stripe
$0 Wave
$0 Spreadsheets

Why I need you:

For your network of artists to verify the problem. I've only verified it 3 times. It's also going to be necessary for early sales.

Why you need me:

Because I know to how solve the problem. I also have 1 year of experience building mobile apps. I also understand the problem.

If you would rather not like to partner, but you want the idea I am willing to sell it on the INE's. The total cost is literally like $100 or less. This idea has a HUGE market as well.

Oh boy.

...sure. Shoot a pm.
 
G

Guest92dX

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That doesn't sound encouraging. I just posted an INE on the inside. It's a real problem though. You can read it when you feel. No hard feelings though. I didn't take it personally.

@UnrealCreative
 

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That doesn't sound encouraging. I just posted an INE on the inside. It's a real problem though. You can read it when you feel. No hard feelings though. I didn't take it personally.

@UnrealCreative

Soliciting like this is against forum rules. You did the right thing posting it as a INE.
 

Scot

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Thanks for making this thread!

I may be interested in partnering with someone to solve a SMALL but REAL need that artists currently have.

If you are an insider and have verified your identity please PM me.

@Scot @The-J @UnrealCreative

The thread sparked a thought for me lolololololol. The idea is software.

Fwiw, if you check out my progress thread you can read about how I was bidding on competitor keywords. They ended up rolling out new products and lines to compete with what I was doing I think. I'm not totally sure though.

*Note: this idea is an actual or perceived problem that artists have*

If you're interested then we'll split the costs:

Total costs for the idea:

$70 Divi wordpress
$0 Zapier integration
$0 Stripe
$0 Wave
$0 Spreadsheets

Why I need you:

For your network of artists to verify the problem. I've only verified it 3 times. It's also going to be necessary for early sales.

Why you need me:

Because I know to how solve the problem. I also have 1 year of experience building mobile apps. I also understand the problem.

If you would rather not like to partner, but you want the idea I am willing to sell it on the INE's. The total cost is literally like $100 or less. This idea has a HUGE market as well.

Not sure if you were asking for partnership, collaboration or investment, but I’m way too busy with my launch right now. While it’s a compliment you think I’d be a help, I just don’t have the spare bandwidth to split my focus.
 
G

Guest92dX

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Not sure if you were asking for partnership, collaboration or investment, but I’m way too busy with my launch right now. While it’s a compliment you think I’d be a help, I just don’t have the spare bandwidth to split my focus.

No, I thought you might tag other music people.

I TOTALLY see why you won't post any revealing info on this forum. There are some ruthless people with no integrity.

There are now like 4 or more advertisers on the problem and people are using black hat SEO to de-rank other people. No one even paid me the $75. It literally costs like $30 or $69 to start the idea depending on how you do it.

It's super easy to execute too. I haven't said how to get juicy nuggets though. I'll let the rest of them figure it out.
 

Kid

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All i know about music industry, business wise, is that it ,practically, stopped paying by record or single sold and they only viable way for artists to earn money is to sell tickets to their concerts.

So , (sorry if the idea was mentioned above, i didn't read it all), maybe there's opportunity in creating app/website that connects performers with clubs/arenas - TicketMaster for artists and club owners :)
 

TKRR

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There are still ways to make money using YouTube and the like, more than most records these days, which can lead to playing bigger shows and bigger money. Also, still money in merch, if you're big enough (not even huge) to support it.
 

Kid

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The music industry is earning a lot especially social media gave a real boost to this industry. Though due to YouTube and other platforms, there is a big problem of piracy or illegal use of music is here but states are making their digital laws strong and this issue would also resolve in upcoming years.

On the other hand, if we talk about the incomes of music festivals then it has tripled or forth of the actual investment. Likewise, concerts of rock band Ween doesn't only get earning from concert tickets but sponsors give a good amount. Similarly, they use the same event pictures and videos for social media accounts. They also earn good amount from social media. Even I found some artists who are charging high to promotion a single picture on their social media.

Though the CD market has been crashed but still YouTube Monetization, streaming royalties, ringtones, recordings and special appearances are not paying much to the music industry but it's the market value as well. According to experts, live performances are still on the top. See this article to get more information.

Good writeup Sharron,

There have been articles about how music money turned from CDs to live performances.

Streaming services like Spotify pay thousandth of a penny for a play so artists use them now as a promotional tool rather than earnings stream.
 

Private Witt

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Interesting thread. I host both cannabis and music events. I ended up co-promoting a sold out Twista show last year and now addicted, but have gone through the ringer with the learning curve.

My goal in 2020 is to hold a show every quarter of 500+ in Seattle. Right now going through the process of booking the first show with either a national name or local top act. Bad time to be doing this but hope to have it all sorted out with tickets for sale by January 15th.

A brutal endeavor but looking forward to getting to 1000+ venues in my city by summer if I can survive.
 

Mike Partee

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@Isaac Oh interested to see where you're at in the industry now?

Exited my first business and looking for an entry point in this industry that makes sense, considering my background, skills, lifestyle, and how I can best provide value.

Listening to a lot of EDMProdcast at the moment to examine the landscape and identify potential opportunity...first impression is producers work all the time and don't make much (at least, nobody talks about numbers). Seems commoditized, aka who's willing to fight harder for the same slice of pie? Earnings probably follow a Pareto distribution.

Management and Event Organizers seem to rake in the dough though, and seems at least more scalable.

Do you know who's objectively making the most money (aka providing the most VALUE) in this market? Which business model/operator ticks the most Fastlane boxes?
 

Private Witt

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One last point.

I’ve known a few people who’ve gotten quite famous. What did they all have in common?

They toured the crap out of the country. They took a van, slept on floors, scrounged for food, played for pennies, talked to everyone at the bar. Saved phone numbers, did it again 6 months later, kept doing it. Not only did their performances get better all the time, but people started getting to know them. They were relentless. They got booed sometimes, they got kicked down, the got broke. But at some point things started changing for them. They started making more money, more and more people would show up at the gigs. When you play in just your town and you go from 10 people a show to 100 people a show, it’s not that big of a difference really. But when you play 50 cities in the US every 6 months and you go from 5 people to 50 people per show, it makes a huge difference. Then from 50 to 100 to 200 etc… The exponential explosion across all the cities is what changes the game. You go from 200 fans to 20,000 by having the same incremental growth across the board.


Most people, including me, aren’t willing to do this lifestyle (at least not now). But most people that I know that have stuck to this have done well for themselves.

Nice post. I've seen this holding cannabis events going from 20 to 100 to 200 to now a goal of 500. Started one contact at a time and still notice my social media and other growth is through on the ground grass roots one conversation at a time.
 

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