I want to start a Digital Marketing Agency

[Andy Black]

I have a website idea. I want to build an e-commerce site for a high-end Italian cermaics shop that is 100% brick and mortar. I have this vision in my head about how I want the site to look, but I"m not sure how I want it to look. The site has to be be trendy, yet appeal to the demographics of women in their 40's-late 60's..Ohh but I also want to start appealing to young kids on Facebook. I need to use colors that represent the Tuscany Italy areas. And I would love to include a cobblestone street somewhere on the website! Oh and my budget is only $3.5k.

Lol. Nice example. "Ideas are bullshit." Who are you going to help? How do you know you can help them? Will they pay you for it? etc etc You just want to point them to the book and this forum. There's a reason many small businesses are small.

The other problem is when you deal with employees within a much larger company. Then you're dealing with company hierarchies, red tape, numerous egos and political infighting, etc. The guy who's signing off has many competing worries, and more often than not, making the most sensible decision for the company that makes the company the most revenue/sales/profit/etc is NOT what's foremost in his mind.

Honestly, I'm glad I've taken the route I have. I want out of it now, but I've learned a lot from it too... and damn, I am so much more motivated to build my own business so that I can have customers and not clients.


EDIT: I don't mind taking on a small bricks and mortars client, just to learn their niche. I know the headaches I'm going to get, but I am more patient with them now, and I'm not doing it for the short-term money. My goal is to learn their niche, then find other brick and mortars in other locations who I can sell leads to. That way I'm leveraging the knowledge gained with one client, and using that knowledge to gain customers. This is a work in progress and I'm still mid-change, but it's another way you can do the same thing (help businesses get more leads), but with a different model. Food for thought maybe?

 

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[Gymjunkie]

I think most of them are morons b/c, well jeez:

• What about the time one client insisted on using her Amex to pay her invoices for a full year and then on the 13th month charge backed all the payments. When asked why, she stated, "I thought it was fraud, I didn't recognize the name on my Amex statement". Our name had been the same the whole time she was client.
• The client that ended their relationship with us after we took them from $0 in revenues to $12MM because they hired a VP of digital marketing. When we congratulated them on their growth and did our exit with them, we found out the newly hired VP was the brother of the owner and the qualification he had for the job was he had put up a band page on Myspace. 6 months later this company was out of business.
• How about the client that despite all the reputation management we did for them to clean up their brand name in the SERP, routinely picked fights with people each time a negative review popped up for their name?

Jeez, I could go on and on.. but I don't have to time to "enlighten" people on here that have either never worked at an agency or have any clue what they are talking about because they simply assumed I said certain things or meant other things entirely.

Like attracts like, simple law of life..

 

[eliquid]

You just won't give it up will you @Gymjunkie.

Well, all the proof I need is everyone in this thread is talking about how horrible agency life is and about clients and SEO and you're the only one not. I'm the only one you singled out for your attack as well for some reason even though others agree and confirm what I have said.

I have all the information and confirmation I need from this thread and from others that have actually been involved at a real agency.

I don't take my financial advice from people that are not successful in finance, just like I don't take my digital marketing agency advice from people who haven't been involved in successful digital agencies.

 

[Semmy]

I'd hire someone to do it for me? I honestly thought owning an agency would be mostly hands off and finding clients

Why would they go through you? Don't you think people with marketing skills that you are looking for know how to market themselves already without the need of an agency? I think you fell into the trap what MJ calls "looking for a wealth chauffeur".

If it would be just so easy finding clients and matching them with low paid workers.

Well people are doing it on Fiverr - they find people they pay only $1 or $2 and then resell those jobs for $5. This might work with low paid jobs, but if you want to "resell" higher quality services the people you are looking for are not dumb.

As an example: ad copy writers fall over each other at Facebook via:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/copyjobs/ for example.

(Even I play along with them a bit.)

Now what beats me is that in the relating face group:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/cultofcopy/

People constantly ask for input for CURRENT work they do.

HUH, someone got a copy writing job and posts in the group for feedback
and tries to get OTHERS to do the work for them - for free?

That is quite ridiculous to watch.

Also as soon someone asks for someone to write ad copy for them they get flooded
within minutes by a gazillion people who most of them are clueless how to write ad copy
at all.

Personal insight for you: while I love writing and like "marketing" and have actually the proper education coming out from the publishing business... I absolutely hate to trade my time for money (I was at a point where I could have freed myself from that equation, but unfortunately back in 2000 MJ De Marco was not around and I "spend" my first million like him in a similar fashion, just that I had way too many detours as a sidewalker before I understood what went wrong in the past.)

You must be good at SOMETHING. Look at something that is in demand that you are good at already, that is a huge time saver.

And: respect yourself and don't offer yourself for $5 on fiverr (unless you have a killer backend that you can hit happy customers that then want to spend $100 + per month for ongoing services with you), that is why you need to be GOOD at it. Pretending to be good at something never works, people will talk about the experience with you if your business involves "yourself".

P.S.: People being morons - the only way is to charge them for every change they want to have, and they quickly act like morons
or just leaving you as being the time consuming customer that is not willing to pay for all their extras they demand.

 

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[Ronnie]

No you don't.. I ran a small one in the underground hip hop niche a few years ago. I made a whomping $250 in a year and an alcohol and tobacco addiction for a good year.

TL;DR It'll make you angry and frustrated enough to become a junkie.

 

[Semmy]

No you don't.. I ran a small one in the underground hip hop niche a few years ago. I made a whomping $250 in a year and an alcohol and tobacco addiction for a good year.

TL;DR It'll make you angry and frustrated enough to become a junkie.

You are replying to what exactly?

 

[LightHouse]

My advice, no service business is ever really fastlane unless the only thing you are good at as CEO is hiring an incredible team and selling like a mad man. I would avoid starting an "agency" not to mention you do not have the credibility anyway if you do not know marketing so it sounds like a huge waste of time to have a cool "title".

 

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[Ronnie]

You are replying to what exactly?

The thread title.. lol

 

[Eos]

Why does everyone slam things that require dealing with people?

Would the success stories of the marketing / advertising agnecy world that created world class companies, wealth and their own huge legacies have thought in the same way?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Saatchi
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Ogilvy_(businessman)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hegarty_(advertising_executive)

 

[seoflipper]

Why does everyone slam things that require dealing with people?

Would the success stories of the marketing / advertising agnecy world that created world class companies, wealth and their own huge legacies have thought in the same way?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Saatchi
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Ogilvy_(businessman)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hegarty_(advertising_executive)

The examples you listed are all born pre 1950.

Not that you can't build a highly successful agency in this day and age, but you can't follow the same path of people who built their legacy when computers still needed punch cards. Who are modern names you recognize in advertising / marketing these days?

In 2015, a single highly skilled marketer can build a multi-million dollar business in a few years, from scratch, with no outside investment. They can build themselves a personal brand with reach that Don Draper could have only dreamed of.

Its one thing if managing people, growing a sales team, and building large organizations is something you excel at and are passionate about. Its one thing if you see an opportunity to service a large, growing market and you have the connections and expertise to capitalize on the opportunity. Gary Vaynerchuck with VaynerMedia is someone who comes to mind here. But even he didn't start with an agency, he built his expertise and personal brand growing a multi-million dollar business, and saw an opportunity to use his platform to do something he loved.

But a lot of people here (including OP) don't have any of that background and are simply looking at starting an agency as a means to an end, with the end being accelerated wealth creation and early financial freedom. If that's the case, then building an agency is almost certainly not the best way to achieve that end.

With that being said, focusing on mastering an extremely niche marketing discipline and getting paying clients is a nice way to get started. That might be a better way to approach it for the OP.

Here's a resource you might find helpful: http://wpcurve.com/the-7-day-startup-resources/

 

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[DennisD]

I hate doing marketing for other people and I'm slowly working myself out of it.
It's a bad game to be in.

All the time I spent marketing client products could have been spent marketing my own product.
It's a bad idea to start a marketing agency because you love marketing and want to live in in it.
You'll be up to your neck in marketing tasks in ANY business you enter.

I'm entering the board-game space right now. I have in the works:

• Video SEO to target keywords
• Email list with autoresponder
• Kickass sales pages optimized to convert
• Upsells
• Cross-sells
• Social Media Direct Response Campaign

There's only TWO other people in the industry really destroying it with marketing right now and I'm not even competing with them directly.

Why get clients to pay you to promote their shiz when you can spend the same time promoting YOUR stuff?
By promoting your own stuff you'll build a brand, get loyal customers, and rapidly grow. By promoting client stuff, you're just being paid to take on THEIR headache.

 

[Silverhawk851]

"What I hear, I forget.
What I see, I remember,
What I do, I understand."

OP just hasn't had the experience with those massively irrational clients yet.
Those "Yeah but can you create my entire business for me for $2K and get me 10,000 customers?
...I'll be over there eating a jelly sandwich, just let me know when I'm a millionaire, OK? "

Best idea I'd recommend, go make 200 sales calls, get a couple clients and manage for a few months
then come back and tell us the war stories.

Learning experiences are good in the long run.

Just Do it.
You'll understand what these guys are saying at another level.

BTW, agree with @Andy Black , I take on clients more as a learning experience in that specific industry,
I get paid to learn, blow up businesses and help people, which I enjoy to be honest.
But it's a mean to an end when you want to go fastlane. I can't automate as easily, it's a highly skill and time-intensive for sure.

Eventually...
Ownership of funnel/business + Mean-a$$ marketing skills = Laughing All the Way To The Bank

 

[StayPositive]

Great first-hand knowledge shared in this thread!

Helping other people is what it is all about. No matter what service or product you sell.

I do not call my business agency but I like help other people improve their businesses. At the very moment I work with 4 clients charging them monthly retainers.

Most of the times, we can choose the people we work with. Or maybe I had dumb luck so far in this area.

Anyway, I have some rules which help me stay cool:
1. Pick your clients carefully. You do not have to work with every client who wants you. Avoid customers with high demands and low budget.
2. Say NO from time to time. If you are an expert, client should let you do your job.
3. Do not do too much work for free. If there is too many changes in the website, charge for them.
4. Charge upfront at least 50%.
5. If you use contractors, save at least 50% in margin.

A few things I like about that 'digital marketing' business:
- it gives me a cash flow
- it does not require big investments
- it allows me to work from home
- it is a business based on relations so you have opportunities to meet business owners. Two of my clients (that is 50%) have already offered me joint ventures.
- you can learn their niches and problems/chances within them, as @Andy Black and @Silverhawk851 mentioned above. It is totally up to you what you are going to do with this knowledge.

 

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[Gerome Soriano]

wow! this thread is great! i've been looking at doing the outsourced digital marketing agency stuff from Sam Ovens

 

[Kevin Peter]

One needs to be super creative to understand and build a website, at the sametime be intelligent enough to tweak it as needed as per his expertise without letting the client know about the changes you suggest is not actually what he requested, and not have him look out for another agency.

You need to be up-to date with the changes in the industry everyday. Have your social presence felt to people.
Showcase your talent in some way or the other to the outside world hour by hour.

Almost every individual out here does market himself online. But, how different are you to stand across matters.
Andmost importantly, do you know about every industry, every business type out there in the world?
Can you master them all to ensure the pros and cons are explained to the client who comes to you with the requirement?

Example -
You do digital marketing for an product based IT MNC, B2B scenario.
I come to you requesting for a digital marketing plan and execution for my B2C car servicing garage.
Andy comes to you with a requirement for the mom and pop store he owns.
Brady needs you to help him for the clothing line he started sometime ago.

How are you going to tackle this?

 

[lowtek]

thread necro +1

Quite a few of you fine intelligent people expressed concern over this individual's desire to start a digital marketing company.

Mainly, it boils down to people having unrealistic expectations and not really knowing what is feasible.

Doesn't this apply to many service industries? Aren't unrealistic expectations a problem no matter what service or product you're selling (as long as it's not some commoditized product)?

 

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[seoflipper]

thread necro +1

Quite a few of you fine intelligent people expressed concern over this individual's desire to start a digital marketing company.

Mainly, it boils down to people having unrealistic expectations and not really knowing what is feasible.

Doesn't this apply to many service industries? Aren't unrealistic expectations a problem no matter what service or product you're selling (as long as it's not some commoditized product)?

Yes, unrealistic expectations are going to be a problem in any business - but its also not knowing anything about the business model, not knowing anything about the service you're providing, and not having a clear plan to gain traction.

Service businesses in general are tough: no barriers to entry, very difficult to remove yourself from the day-to-day, and you're usually not building much asset value.

Add in the fact the OP admittedly didn't have any experience or expertise in the service he would be providing, and you have a recipe for the disaster.

There are advantages to starting with a service business as well if you niche down and find an underserved market, but "I'm going to start a marketing agency with no marketing knowledge" isn't a good plan.

Credit to the OP though for taking the feedback constructively!

 

[lowtek]

Yes, unrealistic expectations are going to be a problem in any business - but its also not knowing anything about the business model, not knowing anything about the service you're providing, and not having a clear plan to gain traction.

Service businesses in general are tough: no barriers to entry, very difficult to remove yourself from the day-to-day, and you're usually not building much asset value.

Add in the fact the OP admittedly didn't have any experience or expertise in the service he would be providing, and you have a recipe for the disaster.

There are advantages to starting with a service business as well if you niche down and find an underserved market, but "I'm going to start a marketing agency with no marketing knowledge" isn't a good plan.

Credit to the OP though for taking the feedback constructively!

Ah, I understand your point.

What is considered the minimal viable knowledge necessary? Is deep domain expertise required? Couldn't an entrepreneur augment their limited capabilities by outsourcing? This is assuming they have some knowledge base.

I ask because the summit this year brought up something similar. One of the presenters offers a Udemy course where he lays out his business model (for internet marketing) and allows others to copy it. One of the recurring themes in the summit was that people should outsource more.

When I put these two together, it seems like the following would be possible:

1) Know enough about one service (say paid advertising) to offer some basic value, and to sell to customers
2) network locally to gain your first customers
3) Outsource to fulfill your knowledge gaps
4) over deliver by leveraging your freelancers and learning more on the job
5) get referrals for new business

Do you feel this is unrealistic?

 

[Gymjunkie]

Ah, I understand your point.

What is considered the minimal viable knowledge necessary? Is deep domain expertise required? Couldn't an entrepreneur augment their limited capabilities by outsourcing? This is assuming they have some knowledge base.

I ask because the summit this year brought up something similar. One of the presenters offers a Udemy course where he lays out his business model (for internet marketing) and allows others to copy it. One of the recurring themes in the summit was that people should outsource more.

When I put these two together, it seems like the following would be possible:

1) Know enough about one service (say paid advertising) to offer some basic value, and to sell to customers
2) network locally to gain your first customers
3) Outsource to fulfill your knowledge gaps
4) over deliver by leveraging your freelancers and learning more on the job
5) get referrals for new business

Do you feel this is unrealistic?

That's viable.. esp. if person is great at marketing even and loves to learn that side of the biz. I wouldn't do it personally as first biz but it's quite simple arbitrage stuff. So it can work.. As long as you find good freelancers.

 

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[Andy Black]

You don't need any knowledge to get started providing a service. You just need a willingness to roll up your sleeves and get stuck in.

The fact that you, dear reader, are even a member of a forum puts you ahead of many small business owners and tradesmen who don't know their way round a keyboard.

Back in 2009, I offered to build a website for an electrician who was out of work. I'd never built one before, but he still bit my hand off down to my ankle.

To build long term relationships, you're going to have to deliver of course, but there's many a piece of work I've got by just being keen to do it.

I bet if you've done ANY work on a computer, then people assume you can build websites and do marketing.

Being known as a problem solver will open many doors.

 

[Andy Black]

Oh yeah, and start with people you already know.

Maybe you don't know as much about paid search as me, but your advantage over me is that Uncle Jimmy the Locksmith knows, likes, and trusts YOU, not me.


EDIT: Now why did my brain randomly think of Jimmy as a name for a Lock(smith)?

 

[Gymjunkie]

You don't need any knowledge to get started providing a service. You just need a willingness to roll up your sleeves and get stuck in.

The fact that you, dear reader, are even a member of a forum puts you ahead of many small business owners and tradesmen who don't know their way round a keyboard.

Let's not get too positive and optimistic.. would you hire someone for marketing who doesn't know marketing? Or someone to design stuff who doesn't know design. I highly doubt it... There must be some learning. You have to learn things before you can actually provide value. Luckily these days there are TONS of places to learn for free or cheaply..

Otherwise, we get the bad side of the Internet.. people proclaiming themselves to be Gurus (or in this case experts in particular skill) and that is just BS.

 

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[illmasterj]

Oh yeah, and start with people you already know.

Completely agreed. When it comes to digital marketing, trust goes a long way.

A few side notes on possible methods to make digital marketing fastlane-ish:

• Pay per lead
• Pay per subscriber
• Commission on sales
• Automated fixed price products (potentially using SaaS or private products)

 

[Andy Black]

would you hire someone for marketing who doesn't know marketing?

Yes, I did. The CEO left the decision to me. I went with the guy with the least amount of marketing knowledge, but who I thought was the keenest and would fit into the team the best. He was one of my best ever hires, not because of his prior knowledge, but because he got up to speed quickly and was super productive.

If I knew someone close to me was interested in graphic design, I'd be interested in testing them out with some work.


I've certainly seen this situation (it happened for me for instance):

Person with no web skills: "I want to learn how to create a website and ..."

Tradesman who needs more work: "Yes please!"

(Here's the story.)

 

[Andy Black]

Honestly, I'm glad I've taken the route I have. I want out of it now, but I've learned a lot from it too... and damn, I am so much more motivated to build my own business so that I can have customers and not clients.

Interesting that EXACTLY a year (to the day) after I wrote the above I'm actually going all-in on being an agency instead.

My thinking is that having an agency and clients isn't my end goal, but it's a damn fine way of building a team and building relationships with business people.

With that team and relationships, I can then later build out other, non-agency, models.

 

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[Gymjunkie]

Yes, I did. The CEO left the decision to me. I went with the guy with the least amount of marketing knowledge, but who I thought was the keenest and would fit into the team the best. He was one of my best ever hires, not because of his prior knowledge, but because he got up to speed quickly and was super productive.

If I knew someone close to me was interested in graphic design, I'd be interested in testing them out with some work.


I've certainly seen this situation (it happened for me for instance):

Person with no web skills: "I want to learn how to create a website and ..."

Tradesman who needs more work: "Yes please!"

(Here's the story.)

If the person wants to learn, he will not wait for you or anyone to learn and take action. 100% people say they want to learn something, 5% actually do it. If you got lucky once, doesn't mean it is a good practise. Also, it's a bit difference to hire an apprentice and have him guided than have someone who has no knowledge to start a business and run client's stuff without some control.

 

[illmasterj]

Interesting that EXACTLY a year (to the day) after I wrote the above I'm actually going all-in on being an agency instead.

My thinking is that I having an agency and clients isn't my end goal, but it's a damn fine way of building a team and building relationships with business people.

With that team and relationships, I can then later build out other, non-agency, models.

This is exactly my thinking right now. I never planned to start an agency but it is happening because I need more time. It's not my end goal, but I now realise I am building a killer team for my own future businesses.

 

[Andy Black]

This is exactly my thinking right now. I never planned to start an agency but it is happening because I need more time. It's not my end goal, but I now realise I am building a killer team for my own future businesses.

Very interesting. I hope you're writing this up somewhere in a progress thread so I can subscribe!

 

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[illmasterj]

Very interesting. I hope you're writing this up somewhere in a progress thread so I can subscribe!

Thanks Andy. I'll let you know when it happens. I'm not one to talk about things before they are a success though, so give me a couple of months to get my house in order.

 

[MarcUK]

Thanks Andy. I'll let you know when it happens. I'm not one to talk about things before they are a success though, so give me a couple of months to get my house in order.

Hi there, appreciate I am a little late to the discussion but interested to how you got on?

Around 10% of my personal income is working directly with clients as a digital agency (one man band admittedly)... mostly doing SEO for them. If there's one thing I can say after 4 years of doing this, is that it can work quite well if you specialise as a digital marketing agency in a particular industry. I have done this to a certain extent and it works quite well.

Reason being is that I find converting customers is a lot easier if you can say (and prove) that you are a specialist for a particular industry. I believe that businesses are more inclined to pay more if you position yourself as a specialist in their industry... and evidently you will understand their business challenges a lot more if you specialise. Not saying you should do this, just perhaps another angle that might generate some ideas.