Arguing With a Sidewalker

[Josh Harmsen]

There’s nothing better than arguing about a topic that you know better than the back of your hand. In this case, I was sitting in my math class, reading Unscripted when my friend came up to me and asked what I was reading. I basically told her the gist of it and she seemed puzzled. She told me how life isn’t about taking risks and how you should stay in your comfort zone and such. I told her to think about the people like Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, how they took a risk and jumped out of their comfort zone. She did have a point on how not everyone who takes a risk succeeds but I then told her that you’ll never become a successful entrepreneur if you never take a risk. She actually walked away from me in disbelief and it kind of just shocked me how our school system teaches the ways of the Script.

 

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[Charnell]

Mistake #1.

 

[C-Jay]

I find that it's not worth arguing with 98% of people; you just become dumber for it.

"Never argue with an idiot (or in this case, a preacher of the script); they will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience."

 

[Bearcorp]

I find that it's not worth arguing with 98% of people; you just become dumber for it.

"Never argue with an idiot (or in this case, a preacher of the script); they will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience."

Came to say the same thing, its not worth the energy.

 

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[WJK]

There’s nothing better than arguing about a topic that you know better than the back of your hand. In this case, I was sitting in my math class, reading Unscripted when my friend came up to me and asked what I was reading. I basically told her the gist of it and she seemed puzzled. She told me how life isn’t about taking risks and how you should stay in your comfort zone and such. I told her to think about the people like Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, how they took a risk and jumped out of their comfort zone. She did have a point on how not everyone who takes a risk succeeds but I then told her that you’ll never become a successful entrepreneur if you never take a risk. She actually walked away from me in disbelief and it kind of just shocked me how our school system teaches the ways of the Script.

Next they'll make fun of you and tell you to get a life. For me, the issues were that I worked all the time and I knocked myself to learn as much as possible in my classes. My fellow students felt sorry for me, and told me so. The next step is that when you become successful, your friend, or someone like her, will come around and tell you how lucky you are. That's what they told me when I met up again with some of these same people from my early years They summed up all my work and education in that little word -- luck! I learned that they can stand right there and watch your struggles, but they can't see what and how you're making things happen. They have a bright, white, blind spot -- especially when it comes to understanding the price of success.

 

[lowtek]

Never argue with a stranger, ever, for any reason. You stand to gain literally nothing, will lose valuable energy and time, and will only alienate yourself from those around you. Worse yet, you will never convince them.

Never out yourself as someone with entrepreneurial aspirations, around normies. They will only react the way you experienced. Again, this drains your energy, makes them feel bad, and makes you look like an a$$.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

She actually walked away from me in disbelief and it kind of just shocked me how our school system teaches the ways of the Script.

How dare you question the Monday-thru-Friday, 9-5 system! Don't you wanna be like everyone else? And be a slave to a job, to a TV, and to a new iPhone?

 

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[AfterWind]

How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie is a book I recommend you read for this topic. Basically, arguing with people is never ever a good idea since the moment you tell them you're having a different opinion, they go into defensive mode and, from then on, they just start solidifying their beliefs instead of trying to believe yours and now they are more convinced about their belief and less about yours. You just did the opposite of what you intended.

 

[BrooklynHustle]

How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie is a book I recommend you read for this topic. Basically, arguing with people is never ever a good idea since the moment you tell them you're having a different opinion, they go into defensive mode and, from then on, they just start solidifying their beliefs instead of trying to believe yours and now they are more convinced about their belief and less about yours. You just did the opposite of what you intended.

Fantastic book

 

[TonyStark]

 

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[Fpm9]

Sometimes its hard to argue because you don't have the same standards. One of my coworker told me that he knows some guy got "rich" by saving money on everything he could, while earning 3k a month. After a years of working hard and never going out or buying non-vital stuff, he had 70k in the bank. He thought I was crazy when I said that I don't consider someone with 70k on his bank account rich.

 

[Josh Harmsen]

How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie is a book I recommend you read for this topic. Basically, arguing with people is never ever a good idea since the moment you tell them you're having a different opinion, they go into defensive mode and, from then on, they just start solidifying their beliefs instead of trying to believe yours and now they are more convinced about their belief and less about yours. You just did the opposite of what you intended.

I️ just wish more people on this planet could be more open to thinking about other types of beliefs and ways of thinking instead of consolidating themselves. Anytime I️ have to settle an argument with my friends (which is a lot) I️ always try to look at it in both perspectives, which is probably why they ask me so much!

 

[Chitown]

She did have a point on how not everyone who takes a risk succeeds but I then told her that you’ll never become a successful entrepreneur if you never take a risk.

@Josh Harmsen,
Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Next!

 

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[lowtek]

Here's my own example, from yesterday/today on Facebook. Apparently I don't follow my own advice.

A friend of mine posts some meme about credit card rewards not creating financial security for people. Dave Ramsey type stuff.

One of his Fbook friends asks the question: "what’s your recommendation to build capital to begin to do things like flip homes?".

Total noob question, so I reply with a noob answer:

Me - direct quote: "flipping homes is not all it's cracked up to be. The TV shows only show the successful, not the thousands of people who bust out because they mis-timed the market or bought the wrong neighborhood or ran into unforeseen issues that blew out their budget.

So many moving parts to a flip ... If you really want to go that route, your best bet is to find other people doing it and put in the sweat equity for a few flips to see how it's done. Don't put your whole pile of loot on something you don't really understand."

Him - direct quote: "since you really don’t know anything about me, the next time you feel like lecturing me, you should probably look at how you are talking to people. I didn’t say I wanted to be like HGTV or that this was a decision being made on a Saturday morning after watching rehab addict or something. I already understand a lot about the market and the hidden costs, which is why the first house I would flip if I were going to do it, wouldn’t be some crack house. This is something that I plan to look at over the next year or so while I continue to build capital.

I have already done plenty of contract type work in my home from two bathroom renovations, a kitchen renovation, electrical and plumbing work, and all kinds of drywall work as well as laying floors, and renovating the rest of the 1400 square feet in my home, I’m fully aware of hidden costs and their effects on budgets."

There you have it folks - renovating your bathroom and kitchen makes you qualified to flip houses. Never mind your originally stupid question to begin with.

I look like the a**hole and get F*ck all for my sage advice. I'm such a dumbass.

 

[Chitown]

There you have it folks - renovating your bathroom and kitchen makes you qualified to flip houses. Never mind your originally stupid question to begin with.

@lowtek,
If there is one thing that I have learned in my 46 years on this planet, it is this: You can't fix stupid. And there is a veritable cornucopia of stupid mickey-fickeys taking up valuable space on this mass of matter we call Earth.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

After a years of working hard and never going out or buying non-vital stuff, he had 70k in the bank. He thought I was crazy when I said that I don't consider someone with 70k on his bank account rich.

Sad. A lifetime of soul-sucking mediocrity and all you get to show is $70K? 2 nights in the hospital would wipe that out.

Very important when arguing with sidewalkers is to define subjective terms... "rich" can be $1K in the bank and a Lexus with a $699/mo payment for 72 months.

 

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[SteveO]

I would lose every argument with a sidewalker. Why? Because... don't care...

 

[G-Man]

I'm currently writing this comment to look busy while my coworkers argue that it shouldn't be a big deal that Kevin Spacey molested teenagers, because "it was years ago" and... "I don't want them to cancel House of Cards".

*** Unleash the Irony Kracken!****

EDIT: The key is fastidious avoidance of eye contact.

 

[The Abundant Man]

R7 is a genetic mutation of the genome DDRM in the Human DNA. This mutation is associated with risk taking. It's in our very DNA to take risks.

I say it's a waste of human potential not to take risks.

Sir Edmund Hillary was the first man to climb up Mount Everest. People thought he was crazy. When he climbed down they asked him why he did it even though he almost died. His reply, "Because it's there."

 

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[Mattie]

I️ just wish more people on this planet could be more open to thinking about other types of beliefs and ways of thinking instead of consolidating themselves. Anytime I️ have to settle an argument with my friends (which is a lot) I️ always try to look at it in both perspectives, which is probably why they ask me so much!

I don't think it matters if you can see from different angles, step into their shoes, or even try to educate them. There convinced their way should be your truth. Things happen a certain way for them, they expect it to happen the same way whether it was positive or negative. Follow the example, equals same results and same outcome. This comes down to not what they say, but the fruits of their labor. The by product of their choices.

 

[Mattie]

Sad. A lifetime of soul-sucking mediocrity and all you get to show is $70K? 2 nights in the hospital would wipe that out.

Very important when arguing with sidewalkers is to define subjective terms... "rich" can be $1K in the bank and a Lexus with a $699/mo payment for 72 months.

Let's not forget the artificial persona of I have wealth, but a lot of debt behind the scenes. No one sees the loans, debts, and perhaps even borrowed money from partners who paid for materialism to make it look like a nice view at face value.

 

[Xeon]

Don't argue, execute and show them! People need to see real results of people they personally know succeed right in front of their eyes, before they'll believe. And even then, some will say it's "luck".

 

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[WJK]

Arguing gets you less than nothing. Winning an argument is not winning --even IF they concede. You haven't forged an agreement -- just unleashed their hatred for your dominance. Then expect a war. It will usually come in waves of passive-aggressive behavior against you. What have you won, but a pocket full of problems?
The challenge is to create an agreement where the other party and you feel like each has won something that is worth the price of the agreement. I worked to find that sweet spot when I was a professional mediator.

 

[WJK]

Here's my own example, from yesterday/today on Facebook. Apparently I don't follow my own advice.

A friend of mine posts some meme about credit card rewards not creating financial security for people. Dave Ramsey type stuff.

One of his Fbook friends asks the question: "what’s your recommendation to build capital to begin to do things like flip homes?".

Total noob question, so I reply with a noob answer:

Me - direct quote: "flipping homes is not all it's cracked up to be. The TV shows only show the successful, not the thousands of people who bust out because they mis-timed the market or bought the wrong neighborhood or ran into unforeseen issues that blew out their budget.

So many moving parts to a flip ... If you really want to go that route, your best bet is to find other people doing it and put in the sweat equity for a few flips to see how it's done. Don't put your whole pile of loot on something you don't really understand."

Him - direct quote: "since you really don’t know anything about me, the next time you feel like lecturing me, you should probably look at how you are talking to people. I didn’t say I wanted to be like HGTV or that this was a decision being made on a Saturday morning after watching rehab addict or something. I already understand a lot about the market and the hidden costs, which is why the first house I would flip if I were going to do it, wouldn’t be some crack house. This is something that I plan to look at over the next year or so while I continue to build capital.

I have already done plenty of contract type work in my home from two bathroom renovations, a kitchen renovation, electrical and plumbing work, and all kinds of drywall work as well as laying floors, and renovating the rest of the 1400 square feet in my home, I’m fully aware of hidden costs and their effects on budgets."

There you have it folks - renovating your bathroom and kitchen makes you qualified to flip houses. Never mind your originally stupid question to begin with.

I look like the a**hole and get f*ck all for my sage advice. I'm such a dumbass.

I totally agree with you and your analysis. (I was flipping houses in the Los Angeles ghettos when we still called them Equity Purchases.) I too can't tell people what I know because it's way over their heads. But, like you, sometimes I make the mistake of chiming in when I should shut my mouth. We're not going to change their minds with our experiences, methodology, and data.
So, now my policy is to get out of their way. The most I'll do is to point them in the right direction or let them watch. That usually doesn't work. I just don't want them to blame me and my advice for their pending failure. I have had people come back mad who thought I should have stopped them or helped them. Oh well. I figure that experience is a good teacher.

 

[Mattie]

I have had people come back mad who thought I should have stopped them or helped them. Oh well. I figure that experience is a good teacher.

I absolutely agree 100 %. I used to think that way, but have learned differently. Still in the process I've found the answers outside of the circle of individuals and there's a time where you bypass them intellectually, emotionally, mentally, and it becomes foreign language to them and then they get angry at you because they don't understand language your speaking now. There's a sense of humor I've found in growth and development. It goes back to a video I watched several years ago. And I do laugh now because I didn't know at the time if it would work, but I applied it anyway.

I watched this video in 2013 after an entrepreneur told me to study Bear Bryant.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVzETb9FSMw

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ql_D3WvmT3U

 

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[Zcott]

Arguing with sidewalkers is pointless. And the irony is they spend time complaining that they never have enough money but do nothing to change it.

 

[Denis from BE]

The feeling when you talk to someone like that and you realize that the conversation it's steril and endless... and you just let it go to finish asap.

I'm unfortunately still working on a 9-5job for now and pissed off by some people mentality. My direct co-working seen me working on reseller researchs this morning and asked me what I was doing. I just replied I'm working on a new business idea. He just looked at me with big eyes (like a dad teaching life to his 4yo son) and told me I shouldn't take risk again as I already have a side business and already invested money on it, because for him "it takes time and money"

But F*ck I couldn't argument more as him and I haven't the same standard. I just say "you know, you're partially right" And close the conversation.

 

[Lauryn]

It's amazing how short-sighted we are, when we stick to the rules. Hopefully you shell-shock her to wake up and see things differently.

 

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[WJK]

The feeling when you talk to someone like that and you realize that the conversation it's steril and endless... and you just let it go to finish asap.

I'm unfortunately still working on a 9-5job for now and pissed off by some people mentality. My direct co-working seen me working on reseller researchs this morning and asked me what I was doing. I just replied I'm working on a new business idea. He just looked at me with big eyes (like a dad teaching life to his 4yo son) and told me I shouldn't take risk again as I already have a side business and already invested money on it, because for him "it takes time and money"

But f*ck I couldn't argument more as him and I haven't the same standard. I just say "you know, you're partially right" And close the conversation.

It costs you nothing to tell your co-worker that he is right and then carry on with your plans. Your co-worker was correct about his situation from his point of view. He couldn't take the risks that you are taking and sleep at night. It's not in his nature. We need people like him to work for people like us when we get to that point in our businesses. It's it wonderful that the people around us are so diverse.

 

[Mattie]

It costs you nothing to tell your co-worker that he is right and then carry on with your plans. Your co-worker was correct about his situation from his point of view. He couldn't take the risks that you are taking and sleep at night. It's not in his nature. We need people like him to work for people like us when we get to that point in our businesses. It's it wonderful that the people around us are so diverse.

I thought this video kind is what he talks about certain people follow the rules, regulations, and are not quite like some Entrepreneurs who are designed to create, be innovative, and some of his video's kind of do explain on the Big 5 while some people are geared to Entrepreneurship and why they make clash with others who just can not understand the language.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q15eTySnWxc