Why not take off your coat and stay a while?

[Andy Black]

Genuine question...

I've heard it said that business is mostly about building relationships.

Yet, why do some people feel they need to control the platform where they start and build relationships with people?

We see people come and go in this forum where their intention is to get members to signup to their own platform (blog, email list, forum, etc). Their goal is to build a relationship with them, offer value, and then, I guess, eventually sell something of value.

I'm curious what you guys think about this.

If these new members genuinely want to help people (or at least build a relationship with them) then why not do so on this platform?

Do they want the greater control of owning the "platform" where they engage with their followers? Even if it's at the expense of getting more followers (since their attempts to pull people over often seem clumsy and cringe-worthy)?

Plenty of people build followings on Twitter, Facebook, Linkedin, etc. They don't control those platforms.

Why are some people putting this illusion of control ahead of their end goals of building relationships, helping people, and ultimately getting paid for doing so?

 

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[jon.a]

Genuine question...

The more we help people, and the more people we help, the better our businesses will be.

I've heard it said that business is mostly about building relationships.

Yet, why do some people feel they need to control the platform where they start and build relationships with people?

We see people come and go in this forum where their intention is to get members to signup to their own platform (blog, email list, forum, etc). Their goal is to build a relationship with them, offer value, and then, I guess, eventually sell something of value.

This post isn't really a dig at those people, because they probably don't stick around long enough to read it anyway.

I'm curious what you guys think about this.

If these new members genuinely want to help people (or at least build a relationship with them) then why not do so on this platform?

Do they want the greater control of owning the "platform" where they engage with their followers? Even if it's at the expense of getting more followers (since their attempts to pull people over often seem clumsy and cringe-worthy)?

Plenty of people build followings on Twitter, Facebook, Linkedin, etc. They don't control those platforms.

Why are they putting this illusion of control ahead of their end goals of building relationships, helping people, and ultimately getting paid for doing so?

They're not ready to be members here yet.

 

[ExCubeCommando]

Genuine question...

The more we help people, and the more people we help, the better our businesses will be.

I've heard it said that business is mostly about building relationships.

Yet, why do some people feel they need to control the platform where they start and build relationships with people?

We see people come and go in this forum where their intention is to get members to signup to their own platform (blog, email list, forum, etc). Their goal is to build a relationship with them, offer value, and then, I guess, eventually sell something of value.

I'm curious what you guys think about this.

If these new members genuinely want to help people (or at least build a relationship with them) then why not do so on this platform?

Do they want the greater control of owning the "platform" where they engage with their followers? Even if it's at the expense of getting more followers (since their attempts to pull people over often seem clumsy and cringe-worthy)?

Plenty of people build followings on Twitter, Facebook, Linkedin, etc. They don't control those platforms.

Why are they putting this illusion of control ahead of their end goals of building relationships, helping people, and ultimately getting paid for doing so?

What attracted me to this forum was the fact there's ton's of great people offering advice from their experiences on how to help you help yourself get motivated. People willing to give their time posting their thoughts, ideas and experience. The last thing I want to do is use this forum as a platform to solicit business. Besides, I'm in a niche business, and there's about zero chance anyone here would be interested in my business anyway.

I'm a noob here, but after a while, I'd also like to contribute and share knowledge and experiences like so many other's here do. I've still got a lot more reading to do, especially the gold threads, which I've been doing as time permits.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

I wonder how many people don’t know better and are just following someone else’s “secret formula”?

Everyone.

It's so rare to find someone who says, "I don't care what they're doing. This is what I'm doing.. here I go!"

 

[phenom4hire]

Personally I would not use this forum as a way to drum up business for myself at least until I feel like Ive contributed enough value to do so.

It just seems tacky to me to go to a forum and immediately start hawking your list or whatever. I am more than happy to participate/help out those who put a lot into this forum.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[csalvato]

Everyone.

It's so rare to find someone who says, "I don't care what they're doing. This is what I'm doing.. here I go!"

and those are the only people who are successful, from my experience anyway

 

[Mattie]

I would say there are two different mindsets. Chasing money and not interested in relationships. Perhaps I'm going to get rich quickly over night and see the results tomorrow. Those false expectations of starting a business and becoming an overnight success. I just leave my two cents here and it will give me a lead without making any investment or creating a stable foundation.

For promoting business I think it depends on where you're at and what services you provide. The niche may not apply to many people here. As in being a writer, you're better off hanging in screen writing forums or novel platforms etc. For coaching, well you have to be at a certain level to perform with Entrepreneurs and Businessmen. So timing is also key.

Just from being in here for a year, I can tell you if they leave they're not invested in success or doing things the right way, but looking for short cuts.

 

[Sheps]

They probably bought into the "fake it till you make it" thing, but forgot you're not supposed to buy your own snake oil.

 

[JustAskBenWhy]

All I know is that people here are unlike anywhere else, so I keep coming back. I I haven't had a job in a long time, but my mind is always working. When I am here, I tend to switch gears - I get engaged by the attitudes here. I, for one, need that, because living inside my head gets old and quite taxing after a while. So - I come here. And if any of you decide to buy my course, great. All the rest of it is above my pay-grade...

 

[mws87]

Trying to take a short cut without putting in the effort may cause you to unintentionally hug a palm tree with your new Viper while taking a turn too fast (hope M.J. doesn't read this...LOL).

LOL, it's okay--the new vipers have traction control now. In all seriousness, I agree with this post a lot. People looking for a short cut, people who may misinterpret the book or simply don't read it at all.

I view this community as highly valuable to those who are willing to put in the work and effort. I'm actually happy a lot of people get put off and leave; the forum seems to have a self-filtering mechanism created by its users that keeps the forum from turning into another "everyone" forum. Not to mention the awesome staff members who work hard to maintain the forum's integrity.

 

[Cvince]

Because anything of true value takes time. Most people these days hop from one idea to the next. They don't understand the actual concept of sweat equity.

 

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[Andy Black]

I wonder how many people don’t know better and are just following someone else’s “secret formula”?

 

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[lowtek]

and those are the only people who are successful, from my experience anyway

Agreed. My own experience has been that following others' formula results in sub par results and disappointment.

 

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[Andy Black]

This makes me feel better about sticking to my own thing. The best action is imperfect and all that.

I'm doing it anyway.


In my mind there's a sliding scale of perceived value:

• Pay me to show you what to do.
  DIY courses etc.
  
  
• Pay me to help you do it
  Coaching.
  
  
• Pay me to do it for you.
  DFY services.
  
  
• I'm doing it anyway.
  I'm not waiting round for clients or customers to "approve" and pay me. I'm doing it anyway.
  OR
  I'll also just create a progress thread and log what I'm doing. I'll drop it at any time too if it doesn't work out. I don't care if people see me go down cul-de-sac's and dead-ends. I'm doing it anyway.
  
  
• I've already done it.
  Hey Mr Client/Customer. I've already built XYZ. D'you want it or not?

 

[Bekit]

Love the thread title.

I view the forum as someone's comfortable living room where I'm welcome to hang out any time with likeable people who accept me.

That's priceless. I have learned sooooo much from others here.

I can't see why anyone would throw that away and choose spammy self promotion that's only going to alienate everyone.

It would be like getting invited to a party at someone's home and just going from person to person to pitch Amway.

That's not the way to be friendly and get to know people.

Why would someone forego the relationships that are available here and focus instead on activities that are only going to get their hand slapped?

 

[Lex DeVille]

And that’s why I follow all of your progress threads. You get an idea and then go charging off. You’re more comfortable going off-piste than following someone else’s script.

Hmm, when I started was a different time. Didn't have gurus spamming my face every 10 seconds on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and everywhere in between. Didn't have TMF either. To go charging off was the only option. I'm sure it was the same for you.

Might be interesting to see stats on how that's changed. People who start their first business today have too much info at their fingertips. Too many distractions too.

When I started selling Lego portraits, I went to an employer I'd recently quit, set a meeting with my old boss, pitched him a portrait of his business logo and earned the first sale. Didn't have to think about the *right* way to do a pitch or all the ways I could mess it up because there was none of that extra crap floating in my head.

As the Cheshire cat might say, when you've got no direction it doesn't matter which way you go.

 

[Deleted74396]

Everyone.

It's so rare to find someone who says, "I don't care what they're doing. This is what I'm doing.. here I go!"

This makes me feel better about sticking to my own thing. The best action is imperfect and all that.

 

[ExCubeCommando]

I would say there are two different mindsets. Chasing money and not interested in relationships. Perhaps I'm going to get rich quickly over night and see the results tomorrow. Those false expectations of starting a business and becoming an overnight success. I just leave my two cents here and it will give me a lead without making any investment or creating a stable foundation.

For promoting business I think it depends on where you're at and what services you provide. The niche may not apply to many people here. As in being a writer, you're better off hanging in screen writing forums or novel platforms etc. For coaching, well you have to be at a certain level to perform with Entrepreneurs and Businessmen. So timing is also key.

Just from being in here for a year, I can tell you if they leave they're not invested in success or doing things the right way, but looking for short cuts.

Trying to take a short cut without putting in the effort may cause you to unintentionally hug a palm tree with your new Viper while taking a turn too fast (hope M.J. doesn't read this...LOL).

 

[tafy]

why do some people feel they need to control the platform where they start and build relationships with people?

Well isn't that one of the major teachings of MJ? Control.

Personally I don't believe in having 100% control, I would be totally happy with a thriving business on Amazon. I would be happy if I had a hugely popular video blog on Youtube. And selling courses on Udemy.

Not worrying about control can mean you can scale way faster, get much bigger and make more money.

You gotta be nuts if you want to sell courses on your own website, with all the hassle of maintaining your website, security, payments etc

 

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[evlttwin]

Genuine question...

I've heard it said that business is mostly about building relationships.

Yet, why do some people feel they need to control the platform where they start and build relationships with people?

We see people come and go in this forum where their intention is to get members to signup to their own platform (blog, email list, forum, etc). Their goal is to build a relationship with them, offer value, and then, I guess, eventually sell something of value.

I'm curious what you guys think about this.

If these new members genuinely want to help people (or at least build a relationship with them) then why not do so on this platform?

Do they want the greater control of owning the "platform" where they engage with their followers? Even if it's at the expense of getting more followers (since their attempts to pull people over often seem clumsy and cringe-worthy)?

Plenty of people build followings on Twitter, Facebook, Linkedin, etc. They don't control those platforms.

Why are they putting this illusion of control ahead of their end goals of building relationships, helping people, and ultimately getting paid for doing so?

I think Gary V says it best: Marketers ruin everything.

I think it is an Internet Marketer mindset. Spam as much as possible, and hope something sticks. If you get banned, oh well.

 

[Delmania]

Also, when I read Andy's post, my mind converted it to "Stay a while and listen". I suspect many will not get the reference, but for those that do, you are now reading this in his voice.

 

[Andy Black]

Also, when I read Andy's post, my mind converted it to "Stay a while and listen". I suspect many will not get the reference, but for those that do, you are now reading this in his voice.

Haha. Actually, you're right. Maybe I should be more explicit.



BTW, here's another thread similar to this one.

 

[Andy Black]

I think Gary V says it best: Marketers ruin everything.

I think it is an Internet Marketer mindset. Spam as much as possible, and hope something sticks. If you get banned, oh well.

I suspect this is the reason. People buying Warrior Forum products telling them to do "forum marketing".

 

[Andy Black]

You're just another person following another Script sold to you by another Script-seller.

It does look ridiculous when pointed out.

“Follow this script to get unscripted .”


Or as some smart dude once said:

“Too many people looking for directions instead of learning how to read a map.”

 

[Andy Black]

Love the thread title.

I view the forum as someone's comfortable living room where I'm welcome to hang out any time with likeable people who accept me.

That's priceless. I have learned sooooo much from others here.

I can't see why anyone would throw that away and choose spammy self promotion that's only going to alienate everyone.

It would be like getting invited to a party at someone's home and just going from person to person to pitch Amway.

That's not the way to be friendly and get to know people.

Why would someone forego the relationships that are available here and focus instead on activities that are only going to get their hand slapped?

100%. (Glad you like the thread title too!)

I imagine a business owner walking into some golf club on a Wednesday afternoon. There’s a load of businessmen & women chatting, on the phone, or working away on their laptops.

Would you announce at the top of your voice:

“Hey everyone! I’m new and wanted to know if any of you need a new bathroom? Here’s the latest bathrooms we’ve done. You can see they’re very good. Just message me if you want a bathroom done.”

OR

“Hey guys. What’s your number one problem in your business at the moment? I know I’m a stranger that you’d be wary of speaking to, but I’d love it if you’d confide in me and let me know what’s keeping you awake at night. You know, the scary stuff you’re probably not telling your wife or husband.”

No-one would dream of doing that.

So why do people act so dumb when they go online? Do they think those people in that golf club are suddenly different because they’re online too?

 

[Deleted74396]

Totally agree! The biggest value comes from staying, rather than just trying for some quick sales.

 

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[Mattie]

Trying to take a short without putting in the effort may cause you to unintentionally hug a palm tree with your new Viper while taking a turn too fast (hope M.J. doesn't read this...LOL).

Amazing how some like to hug palm trees over and over again until they've beat their head enough times, and feel the pain. Detours always take you thousands of miles in the wrong direction. Watch out for the headlights they might blind you.

 

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[Andy Black]

I really can't recall seeing the kind of posts you're talking about

That's good.

Forum members report spam when they see it, and mods delete the post/thread if it's breaking forum rules.

 

[Leo Hendrix]

Possibly, greed, short-term thinking and selfishness.

Some people are simply takers and give as little as possible but want to take as much as possible. Scarcity mindset perhaps?

 

[TonyStark]

Because my platform is moldy bananas compared to this. I know where I came from, I'm not about to ruin my greatest resource by SPAMMING it.

I think it reflects a lot about what the person is in the real world too. Are they genuinely interested in making a change, or do they just want to sell you something and get out?

 

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