I'm going to go from bankruptcy/£240,000 personal debt to a life of freedom using Facebook ads.

[Paul David]

Update.

So I have 28 clients in total. I'm about to start referring customers to them this week.

Woke up this morning and one of my new VA's who's role is to call any leads and book appointments has quit before he's even begun! I went through an agency to find him - never again.

The second VA (also from the same agency) was told via skype that we would begin training at 3.30pm UK time, when I contacted her on skype at that time she didn't reply. I thought that's two new VA's I now need to find.

She's actually just contacted me on skype an hour or so, she got the time mixed up. She thought it was 3.30am Philippines time.

This part of the system I've created is very important to the success of the business. We aim to call every new lead within 5 mins between 9am and 9pm 7 days a week. Getting the lead on the phone as fast as possible increases the chances of them converting massively. Studies have suggested by 400%!

Therefore I need VA's who I can trust to turn up for their shift and make these calls. As I thought I needed two (as both had vanished) I decided earlier today to source my own which I've done before from onlinejobs.ph.

Literally within in an hour of posting the job I've got 11 candidates who've passed two stages of the application process. Tone of voice and accent is the most important, I can train them on anything else.

By tomorrow I should have the VA's in place and the campaigns to attract new customers for some of my 28 clients begins.

 

[Paul David]

Nice thread, good luck mate.

I'm sorry but I think I didn't get quite well what you doing right now. You went from an ecommerce (laptops batteries/chargers) and now you're running a digital marketing agency focused on FB ads? Is that right? How do you look for new clients?

Good luck man, specially in the UK. Damn,I lived in Lodon for 3 years, one word: EXPENSIVE

at the same time, so much money flowing, it's ridiculous. You dont understand how people manage to live in such wealth although at the same time it's so hard to earn good money. Definetly a place of opportunities, good luck mate

Yes it's been a journey.

I get clients quite easy as it's a pay per show model. The clients don't pay me until the customers I refer arrive.

London is very expensive. I live 4 hours drive away from there where it's so bad!

 

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[RazorCut]

That is excellent news Paul. And a great return for your first client. Will make a great testimonial.

Onwards and upwards

 

[Bigguns50]

Just read through your thread. Congratulations on pushing through all your challenges ! Fantastic progress ! One suggestion. Put this

ensuring the current clients are getting regular booked appointments.

before the profit target. If you do this, you will blow by your financial target. IMO

 

[Paul David]

I'm amazed at how you're managing to make it all work with all the different packages, booking appointments, then chasing payments, etc.

From that point of view, my model is totally different and a lot more simple. My end goal is to generate a phone call and from there onward, the client can quote whatever they want for the job, schedule a date that's convenient for them and deal with a customer directly.

I take one full payment in advance for 4 weeks, which includes the ad spend and my fee, then just generate calls throughout the month until end of the agreed period. If they want to continue, we just repeat as many times as they like.

Mind you, the closest I've got to the above was securing 2 clients who agreed to pay the ad cost only, while I managed their campaigns for free. The idea was to build some trust and show them how it all works, then charge my fee for the 2nd month, but for whatever reason both of them didn't want to continue...

How do you find clients or pitch to them? Any cold calling? Or it's all through Facebook and LinkedIn messages/emails?

What you're trying to do is what every marketer as done for years. They pay you up front and you in return promise x amount of leads.

And probably a reason why you're maybe struggling to convert clients. Every man and his dog is sending messages to the same clients. You have to do something different, think out side the box.

My model sounds complicated but it's actually very simple.

I run the same offer for every single client. I duplicate the same facebook ad and just change the radius for my targeting. I have a bot which qualifies the leads and my own team (in the Phillippines) to provide human answers if required. My clients give me access to their calendars and we book the leads in. We then book them on our internal calendar which then sends follow ups etc to the leads with appointment reminders.

Payments are all automated. As soon as we book an appointment it get's added to an invoice. If a lead cancels or the client marks them as no show they are automatically removed from the invoice. Then every Monday morning the money is taken from the clients bank. Nothing manual.

Clients I've signed up from various places. The best method I found was facebook ads. I sign clients with a 10 minute phone call. No zoom, no online presentations with slides etc. Just a phone call.

 

[Fastlane Liam]

The best you can do is learn from those misstakes and keep going. I must say i made a simar misstake with FBA but luckey for me i only invested 4000€ of my own money in French presses. iv still got most of them at home (anyone want one? ) but lucky ive never know debt.

Haha made me laugh. In all seriousness well done for starting, are they still listed on Amazon? Whats the main keyword, pm me if you like and maybe I can help you sell them. Can't make any guarantees though

 

[MHP368]

Ok I was just curious because I know sometimes we can "catadtrophize" so to speak worrying about unknowns.

 

[Paul David]

Is this similar to a CVA?

CVA is applicable for dealing with debts and keeping the company going. It doesn't apply in my instance because I've already placed the old company into liquidation.

 

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[Paul David]

Hope it helps you getting it out there. I’m in a very similar situation and had to write down all my mistakes a few days ago just so I could stop a negative thought cycle in my head. It seems a bit easier once you own it.

Similar story but not quite as much £ as you. Have a relatively good e-commerce business in a nice niche but over the past year or so I’ve spent £10,000 migrating a website with a developer I didn’t trust, it’s a flop so we’re cutting our losses and doing it in house. I bought a car from company money when we had no company money (£12,000) I stupidly started another company and spent £15,000 and a lot of company time building an app that we haven’t actually had time to launch yet even though it’s really good. And also spent time creating other websites and ideas.

A month ago I deleted almost all websites except our main profitable three. Stopped all side projects.

But we’re now out of cash, the business is -£50k and I’m -£25k whilst struggling to pay the bills. Sales have crashed partly due to the rubbish new site and the market in general right now.

Did I mention I have a £10k family holiday booked to Florida in Feb? Need to pay that in Nov! (Or not... can’t wait to tell the kids!)

Currently trying to sell the car, sell the app, get the new website live and may have to borrow £30k just to keep the bills paid whilst we hopefully catch up over Black Friday and Christmas.

Hope you hit your goals and sort your situation out whilst avoiding bankruptcy. Keep going. Keep fighting. In a year or two when you have loads of money and freedom you’ll look back and wonder what you were worrying about.

I got the same anxiety feelings reading your post and the circumstances as I do when I think about the situation I'm in.

I can certainly identify.

Thanks for your kind words and I hope things work out for you also.

 

[Tourmaline]

Have you validated the different design with your market and that they care about the accessory?

 

[Paul David]

I'm not sure you're seeing the pattern mate.

You're selling the same thing, over and over and over and over and over and over and over again.

Let me start selling batteries because of XYZ reason.... fail.

Well, let me start another business selling batteries because of ABC reason.... fail.

Perhaps if I start another business selling batteries and I rebrand it .... fail.

Maybe if I start another battery accessory business and I import it from vietnam instead of China for BBC reason.... fail.

I don't think you're seeing the pattern. Get the hell out of that niche/industry. NOW.

The competition is fierce, those with resources have already consolidated the market through mergers and acquisitions. Then there are a few people that have managed to carve a nice little niche out of the market. But by and large, the marketer is already catered to. We don't need another battery reseller.

You've got no competitive advantage. Even with your branding... why would anyone buy from your little brand when they can buy from an established brand that has thousands of reviews and a lower price point?!

--------------------------------

Stop buying products and getting into costly new ventures. Learn facebook ads and sell other people's products/services using FB ads. Or just help people run their fb ads for a fee.

I’m not selling batteries anymore! And I only ever tried to sell them for a short period of my twenty year story so I think you may be getting your wires crossed somewhere.

I sold power adapters for the majority of my time alongside a computer repair shop but also tried other similar niches. I have now exited all and the niche I’m currently in is completely different to anything I’ve done before.

 

[Paul David]

Facebook ads could be losing money and just a customer acquisition tool. Do they sell other things? Sell on other channels?

You just never know.

They don’t sell other things and promote the fact that their products are only available via their website.

They do google ads also and influencer marketing.

 

[100k]

I totally disagree with that advice. That is going backwards in my opinion. If you spend any time with people who run their own successful FB ad agency you know that they all want their own product. They have seen how much success they have created for their clients and want the same for themselves. In fact many are running other peoples products as well because they don't have their own.

Going down the route of affiliate marketing (other peoples products) is a retrograde step for anyone who has a viable product. Why share the profit and not have overall control when you don't have to?

Focusing on finding out what makes people want to buy YOUR product is extremely powerful and can be extremely rewarding both financially and intellectually, (you can gain a lot of insights from that knowledge that can propel your business forward at lightening speed).

Yes, but creating a product that people really love can be very costly - where as learning facebook ads / generating sales/leads won't cost nearly as much. And once you've learned that skill and saved up some money - then you can invest some of it into creating your own product that people really love.

But, there's more than 1 way to skin a cat I guess, so whatever. Its all good.

 

[Blu H]

I've always thought that I could get through anything and that I was strong-willed and confident.

However I've really struggled mentally with the situation and level of debt I have. I've felt like a complete failure. I've let my Wife down, my children, my parents and also myself. I've had massive sleep issues and ended up on sleeping tablets. I see other Fathers at the school when I collect my children and think to myself I wish I was them. In fact, I was I just wasn't me.

I'm also not ashamed to admit I've contemplated suicide on numerous occasions. I think the fact that I didn't was because I couldn't do it to my children. It's a selfish thing to do. Not so long ago I even googled whether it was possible to kill yourself but then have the Doctor tell your family it was a heart attack or something. Madness.

I have a loving Wife and Children and just by them being them I'm beginning to get through this. It's not nice having companies chasing you for debts every week. I get a horrible feeling inside when I hear the post coming through the letterbox, is this another debt letter. I could file for bankruptcy but I need to ensure we don't lose our house. It's jointly owned and there's not a great deal of equity compared to my debts and luckily my wife has a good job.

I may still have to file for bankruptcy but I'm going to give it everything I've got to get out of this. The thought that after all the work I've done over the years to end up bankrupt upsets me. Especially for someone with my traits, I'm the one who was always saying I'm going to earn this or do that but to put things bluntly without my wife or help from my parents I'd be homeless and living on the streets now.

I have recognized however though that negative thoughts aren't going to get me anywhere. I've been reading self-help books to reinforce some positivity into my mindset and I've certainly gone past my F*ck You moment. No more negativity and punishing myself for the mistakes I've made in the past.

I can't change anything that I've done, there are some expensive lessons there but I can control where I end up the future and that's where I begin.

If anyone feels like they can offer any help or advice feel free. I'll try and update whenever something meaningful happens but for now, if anyone wants me I'll be mastering facebook ads and growing my brand and I hope that this helps people to NOT make the same mistakes as me.

"If you try chasing two rabbits you won't catch any." This is what I would tell my 20 year old self.

Other than having a family... your situation sounds eerily familiar! While you've received some fantastic advice on the business front... I'd like to talk about your psyche. Some powerful & deep stuff you've told us there, so congratulations on that. Since you're a Go Getter, I doubt Depression could be it.

However I recently read a book from Dr Gabor Maté who works in the downtown core of Vancouver in Canada, and he clearly explains in his Book In the real of hungry ghosts that un-diagnosed and untreated ADHD can wreak havoc due to the brain founding numerous ways to heal itself. If your debt was generated solely due to your business, that might not be you. But if you have an habit that you can hardly control... and made this debt ballooned up... then that ADHD right there! (mine is food) He also wrote another book called scattered mind more guared towards ADHD that I didn't read yet.

But if beside it there's something that you literally can't control by however means you tried... then ADHD might be it! My way of coping was with massive amount of food. But due to being a bodybuilding expert, I was able to never get obese even tough I was eating a lot. My intellect simply delayed the inevitable... and you seem wayyyy smarter than me... so it might apply to you as well. Please keep in mind that I'm not a doctor, so this might not apply to you. In my case, thanks to my bodybuilding route, I went the supplement way instead of the pharmaceutical way to solve my issues. PM me if ADHD applies to you, and you'd like to try what supplement I'm taking!

But if you do have undiagnosed ADHD... you can't fight this without mediation (supplement in my case) Got nothing to do with you... but your brain is finding whichever ways it can get at it's disposal to heal itself. A battle against the Brain is a battle that cannot be won without reinforment. It sucks... but hey there could be worst!

Whatever you do... make sure to get checked out!

 

[Paul David]

I see a couple of patterns that you are probably already aware of. Just my two cents so take it for what it's worth.

1. You're jumping into businesses based on what you see others doing. Essentially copying them. They appear profitable on the outside, but I would venture to say that they are in the same boat as you. I would even go as far as betting that by the time you jump into the market, it is already saturated. I think Facebook marketing will be much the same VERY soon. I can't even watch a YouTube video without seeing an annoying ad with fake gurus telling you how you can make 10,000 per day working 15 minutes per week selling Facebook ads. Everyone and their brother is jumping into this market which will, in my opinion, cause a race to the bottom.

2. It appears you are selling commodity items. My dad had a very large company growing up that marketed produce. He had 400+ employees, 3 packing sheds, a ton of B2B customers in multiple countries, and huge operating costs. There were some months where he would spends $250,000 just in phone bills from his 25+ sales guys (the days of long-distance phone bills charged by the minute). Some years it was very profitable, some years it wasn't. The problem was, and is, produce is a commodity. There isn't much that separates one tomato from another. They are 100% market-driven. When supply is down, prices go up, you make money. Vice versa, when supply is up, prices are down, you lose money. One brand that has somewhat overcome this obstacle here in the stated is Wonderful Brands. They have clever marketing and patented varieties that make them stand out amongst a sea of fruits and veggies in the produce section. They've figured out how to effectively brand and make a commodity feel more exclusive and valuable. Whatever you endeavor to do, be different, be bold.

I would encourage you to read Blue Ocean Strategy (or the synopsis because it is pretty lengthy and I'm not a particularly fast reader).

Thanks for your reply.

On your first point I wholeheartedly agree. Guilty as charged. I have jumped into businesses before that I've seen others doing and I like the thought of. Some have aligned with my main goal but others haven't.

Regarding Facebook Ads they aren't going away anytime soon, you're right however that there's a lot gurus trying to "coach" people into doing facebook ads. With most things a lot of people who are interested never make it and they're off chasing the next shiny new thing.

I'm doing facebook ads primarily to grow my e-commerce brand which isn't a commodity product like the power adapters I used to sell are. To supplement my income I will be looking to help others struggling with running facebook ads. I have knowledge of Google ads but not enough so that's something I may look into down the line.

I don't envisage myself becoming a "Digital Marketer" full time, more learning as much knowledge as possible to grow this brand and others in the future. Building eCommerce brands that last is main objective.

 

[Captain Acidhead]

Is it any wonder i'm anxious? And instantly trying to think positive doesn't fix that.

That's right.

Advice from people telling you 'how to think' is well-intentioned, but it doesn't work.

Why? Because negative or positive thoughts are a very late consequence of subconscious processes (feelings and beliefs).
By the time you're aware of your negative thought, it is too late in a sense. Trying to replace it by something else doesn't work, because there is no root in your subconscious to support that foreign thought.

Think of your subconscious beliefs as the seeds, with roots buried deep, and the thoughts you're noticing as leafs above ground. Cutting them off and replacing them with the leafs of a more 'positive' plant won't work, will it

My recommendation is to do a process that helps to follow the 'negative' leafs all the way down to the seeds, and challenge those.

Still with me? I recommend you try a process that was described by Byron Katie, she calls it "The Work." She wrote a book about it too. But you can also just download her one-page worksheet, watch an instruction video, and spend some time with it every day.

 

[GSF]

You don’t have the cash/time to do two things! Why are you trying to help people run ads and run an e-commerce company?!

Stop with the e-commerce company and just find clients to run ads for. It will be much cheaper for you to go that route. With e-commerce you have to worry about product costs, shipping etc. and there are many more costs you have to factor in that could lead you to lose money that you cannot afford. Just stop it with e-commerce for now and get out of debt!

Also if you’re a Facebook ads expert (I’m assuming since you feel you can charge others) why is someone else running your Facebook ads?


Why are you continuing to spend your time on this? You’re $250,000 due to running poor e-commerce companies and now still a company you haven’t profited off of... just stop with e-commerce for a bit, get some clients and get some money coming in

I'm with 1 step. Focus on the facebook clients. Don't use Facebook ads to get clients though. Get out their meet call email network with business owners. Target a niche, focus on high value niches like home improvement co's and other service providers with high ticket sales.

 

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[1step]

At the moment i'd say there's a 90% chance i'm going to lose everything and 10% chance that i'm not.

This is the direction I want go down and has massive potential.

This is insanity.

Let's just pretend you are successful and able to make profit on your products. Then what? I have been in e-commerce long enough to know it requires a TON of cash, who is going to lend you money to take advantage of the "massive potential" How are you going to continue to fund re-orders without going even further into debt?

 

[RazorCut]

Be realistic, the bank and that lending company aren't in the business of losing money, and your low ball offer won't cut it. They'll aim for the whole lot and when you can't deliver they'll collect the insurance.

Actually he is being realistic. Banks will take whatever they can get. If there is no personal guarantee then the bank will send out threatening letters then sell the bad debt on for a fraction of the total amount owed if they get nowhere.

Part of the percentage you pay on a loan covers bad debt so it’s already calculated in.

 

[Paul David]

Be realistic, the bank and that lending company aren't in the business of losing money, and your low ball offer won't cut it. They'll aim for the whole lot and when you can't deliver they'll collect the insurance.

There's no insurance to collect and there are numerous instances were the bank will accept a lower payable amount in comparison to someone filing for bankruptcy because if I do that they won't get a single penny.....ever.

 

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[Stevekins]

Congratulations for not giving up, failures are steps to success. What I see you need is PERSISTENCE to build and steer this new company to enviable heights.

 

[MHP368]

Thats good you gota new dtsrt , I feel like "maybe a babkruptcy" while trying to start a business is kind of like a mental ball and chaon. Sending yourself mixed signals yah know? "Am I abundant or a failure?"

Interesting to here that taxis are still a viable job , here in the US lyft and uber sort of gutted that industry and turned it into a shitty below minimum wage job for the desperate.

 

[Paul David]

Thats good you gota new dtsrt , I feel like "maybe a babkruptcy" while trying to start a business is kind of like a mental ball and chaon. Sending yourself mixed signals yah know? "Am I abundant or a failure?"

Interesting to here that taxis are still a viable job , here in the US lyft and uber sort of gutted that industry and turned it into a shitty below minimum wage job for the desperate.

I have to get rid of the financial "baggage" and the only way to do that is to file for bankruptcy. The new company is up and running and we've got two clients already.

Taxi isn't a great job. To earn "decent" enough money you have to put the hours in and do nights/weekend usually. As long as for now i'm putting a minimum £2k into our family account each month it doesn't matter where it comes from at the moment. If i can afford to take £1k from my business then i only have to 10-12 days a month on Taxi etc. I hope i never have to drive a taxi but like i said it's there to fall back on.

 

[guidaccio05]

Good luck in your venture!

 

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[Paul David]

This.

Have you ever had a job long-term? If not, I'd start there.

Get a job. Take a salary. See if you like it. Negotiate down your debts. Get your mind right.

From the sounds of it, you're not in the right state of mind to take on the stress of starting a new business. No offense, but you also don't have the track record to "push through it".

Man up and take care of your family first. Run your business evenings and weekends once your mind's right. Grow from there.

Thanks for your reply.

I've never had a job at all. I've had my own businesses since 1998. I'm starting as a taxi driver which means i can earn money to take care of my family and still be able to work on my business. I wouldn't last two minutes working for someone else and it goes against everything i believe in. Doing taxi work means I can work when i want, bring in regular income and work on my business without the added pressure of needing to earn money fast.

Regarding the debts, i'm filing for bankruptcy once i get started as a taxi driver and starting again. It's been hanging over me for 2 years now and I the stress is getting too much.

 

[Paul David]

Mate.... if you do pull it off, please don't pay yourself £20k/month. Continue to live on £3k/month and SAVE, SAVE, SAVE, SAVE, SAVE, SAVE....

You just never know. And I'm sure retirement age isn't too far off in the distant is it now?

Good job on pushing through the negativity - keep at it. Rooting for ya.

Absolutely correct. I wouldn't pay myself that much anyway because the chances are that anything I earn over £2.5-3k a month and I'd have to pay the rest back towards my creditors for a period of up to 3 years.

 

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[StrikingViper69]

Correct. I can't be a Director for 1 year. I can only be an "employee" of a Ltd company.

Nice!

Loving the attitude. Keep pushing!

 

[Paul David]

Your mindset is a trap. You're registering income before having the income. You need to have the income before getting into that frame of mind.

One of your posts is diminishing your wife's hard work to highlight how what she's doing is stupid, and what you're doing is far superior since it "[only took you] 3 months to get to this point"...

I don't want to be a dick and knock you down a peg, but your mindset is really shitty - especially for the person that's likely covering your bills and paying for the kids today. There's nothing wrong with having a job - some people don't want the entrepreneurial life, just stability. If they work hard for that life then it's admirable.

I wish you the best, but until you get an income coming in from those clients, your posts are just posts. There's no substance until you actually create that substance and there's money in your account.

I'd also caution against deluding yourself that in three months you'll be "working 2 hours a day for £20,000 a month"...

Right now your mindset is: This is the right choice because it's super easy and a lot higher payoff.

The correct mindset is: This shit is gonna be hard. I'm going to grind to make it and keep executing until I get that first pound. Then after that first pound, I'm going to keep grinding until I reach the point where I'm making £20,000 a month off of 2 hours of work per day. Need to keep pushing.

Best of luck, but keep your focus on the prize, not on the dream.

I agree and disagree.

Firstly I didn't highlight that what my wife is doing is stupid, and what I'm doing is far superior. I said that I don't believe that £4500 a month is "great money". And that's my personal opinion. I don't and I never will do.

I also did not say that there was anything wrong with having a job and wanting stability. If everyone was an entrepreneur the world not be a better place and diversity is a good thing. I stated that it's not for me and never will be. My wife likes the stability of a job but certainly doesn't want to work another 30 years and I'll repay her by making that a reality.

I know how hard it's going to be because in 20 years of business nothing has ever been easy, I do however have as much as I can in place to enable the business to grow and scale without my input if required. I proved that my system works by signing these clients in the space of a couple of days without any real automation in place, it was only then (and having the extra time with lockdown) that I set up all the automation so that handling 50-100 clients is possible without any bottlenecks.

I do however agree with you that until I'm making money from these clients these are just words in a post. They won't be soon.

 

[CrimsonNight]

I wish you good luck, Paul.

I am sure by this time around next year your situation is going to be a lot better than now if you keep this momentum going and have a laser focus on one area. (FB Ads)

And thanks for reminding and teaching me about a few pitfalls that I should avoid with the best of my abilities in the future.

 

[Paul David]

Of course everybody is raving about your insane goal after you hit rock bottom, but just my 2 cents:

You have a crazy goal of making £20k/month in a couple of years months WEEKS, which you apparently never made in your whole life. I sincerely hope you'll make it, but... what if you don't? Is your wife gonna stay if you don't get it and you still refuse to find a job? Do you have another money chase plan ready by then?

Seems like your pride is standing in the way of what you really should consider.

I’ve explained in my previous posts that I have a taxi licence now (ie a job) if I have to earn money whilst waiting for my business to take off. At the moment in the U.K. it’s extremely quiet in that industry and there’s not a lot of work on.

It certainly has nothing to do with pride. If it was I certainly wouldn’t consider driving a taxi for living. However I can work the hours I want and still be able to work on my business.

The goal isn’t to make £20k in just a couple of months either. I believe it’s certainly achievable but if it takes 2-3 years so be it.

EDIT: I was already earning £2k a month from the two clients I had before lockdown began. And I’ve also got someone paying me $250 for an hour of time on Thursday to help him with setting up my system for his niche.