Hello from a 15 years old guy :D

[Matt Sun]

Seems anybody can tell you what they think you should do. I think you should trust yourself and drop out if you think that's best. School is just indoctrination anyway.

 

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[Vairavan]

@Vairavan
1. Both, I've got one Philippino designing for me, but I also do few myself... (outsourcing that later on)
2. Yes, I've sold 7 shirts now (I just do it for 2 months) and that is growing
3. Traffic source in only organic at the moment... (there's no sense to do FB ads if I don't know what's selling)

You got it upside down kid. You should use FB ads to test which products sell. Here are my action steps for you:
1. First go to websites like Amazon Merch, Teespring, Threadless, etc and view popular designs.
2. Ask your Philippino friend to make similar designs or do it yourself.
3. Test them with your fb ads and Find the winning design.
4. Find a manufacturer in Alibaba and mass-produce them. Also, create a logo for your brand and put them on the neck of your t-shirt.
5. Then sell them on different platforms.

 

[Levin]

How is the Swiss welfare state is funded, do you know? Is it off of income taxes from people who are working in regular jobs?

I suggest making a serious study of the business you go into, while experimenting with it. Study successful brands in the wild. Read any related threads you can find here in the forum. Read business books and talk to people who've done similar things to what you want to do. Keep in mind that you are competing for people's attention and their resources. It's good to have fun with it, but put the serious work in too. Your 20, 30, and 40 year old selves will thank you.

@Rabby
Swiss welfare system is based on taxes from working people, yes.

I already do that. I investigate further every day...
Thanks for your tip with talking to successful people. I think I should do that more often...

 

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[Levin]

In my country, if you didn't pass History and Malay (the national language), you wouldn't get the high school certificate and would be unable to even find a McDonalds' job.

I didn't find that a problem to even score decently, as the studying was manageable- I found interest in Malay literature and even a bit of Islamic history. But even then the markers have always tried to pull down the minimum grade thresholds for A, B, C and D grades, so I might never know whether the letter grade on my transcript was legit haha.


Well, from the top of my head, project management, accounting and communicative/leadership skills would be great for business.

Sure, you might not pick them up in the classroom, but if your school had lots of clubs and societies for you to join, and learn up skills, it would be useful to build up basics.

If you haven't been a regular attendee to at least some of these extra activities, well, of course people see the lack of track record, and have their doubts.

For project management and accounting though, I needed a few college classes to truly understand how they worked together- and especially how the finance world works (important for getting into the minds of future investors). Online courses somehow just confused me.


I almost dropped out of normal high school to become home-schooled, as my mum was disgusted at the crap of the high school system.

But when I looked at the home school she was pointing out to, it didn't feel like a very good place. Didn't have as many students to help out in co-curriculum clubs, to mingle with. Even the teachers themselves were too green to be even seen as reverse-role models.

So it took some pushing for her to drop the idea.

The last two years of my high school life were awesome.
-Got involved in a school-wide theatre performance, doing lots of stuff from publicity photography, to acting and band.

-Ramped up my senior year serving in the Drill section for the Boys' Brigade.

-Somehow started talking more to my girl, which eventually formed a baseline for my later FTE.
I didn't intend to have a relationship with her...it just eventually melted in when she saw how I was always getting 'into the fray'.

Had I left school, I would have missed A LOT.
So I don't think high school is that bullshit. You just have to find your resources and activities within school itself.

I had 1-2 teachers who were not formally trained as educators, but they had lots of 'school of hard knocks' experiences that made them kick-a$$ folks. I could write a thread on them lol!

But if you are still harping on dropping out, there's much the folks here can say, but probably a very important thing to do is to find a networking base.

Local, not just online. Face-to-face.

It can be a regular meetup.com group, a workplace ministry group (I'm attending one such soft opening soon in my city), or just a whatsapp group....a local group of people who are great in their industry, who have faced against adversity one way or another, and have sound moral values.

You don't need to mention your education unless asked, but you need to have a dominant skill to offer to the group.

Since you have mentioned lots of activities you are doing, that shouldn't be a problem.

Go find 1-2 people in the group that stand out, follow-up with simple offers to help with what you can, ask them how/who they are, and just get to know more about them.

Make friends, simply.

I've used this approach not as a high-school dropout, but as a 21-year-old guy going to meetups populated by late 30-50 year-olds mens'. Very sharp age difference, and eyebrows raised and comments exchanged, but it was fine.

Hey @ZF Lee
Really like your comment!
To my plans with school dropout... I just think our cultures are too different and the whole system and the main conditions are different.
Here, I hate the environment and people are negatively tuned...
I know I need to build a network of people, I joined two clubs in my city, and I'm expanding this. I'll also need people to give me VC/loans for business (which I won't get that easy with no further education)
And I'm really working on my skills, EACH AND EVERY DAY.
Thank you for the comment!

 

[Levin]

You got it upside down kid. You should use FB ads to test which products sell. Here are my action steps for you:
1. First go to websites like Amazon Merch, Teespring, Threadless, etc and view popular designs.
2. Ask your Philippino friend to make similar designs or do it yourself.
3. Test them with your fb ads and Find the winning design.
4. Find a manufacturer in Alibaba and mass-produce them. Also, create a logo for your brand and put them on the neck of your t-shirt.
5. Then sell them on different platforms.

@Vairavan
Thanks for your suggestion.
But in this business, this isn't the way.
I have a "Mentor" who's earning about 15K a month with that.
If I directly start with paid traffic, I'm likely going to waste a lot of money.
The thing is, you DON'T KNOW what's selling, you can't just build best selling designs.
There are 3 levels:

1. Organic - Learning what's selling and learning the process
2. Paid traffic - Learn Google/FB ads and promote on social media
3. Brand building - Build a brand and go fastlane.

The one with the logo on the neck isn't that nice because you pay extra if you print both sides of a product.

I'm in level one. It may take about 1-2 years before I really can build up a brand, to stay realistic.
But, yes, I'll do it similar as you described

 

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[Vairavan]

I just bought his online course

So, he is a guru.

Just think for yourself. If he is making so much money doing it why should he teach others? Is he training his competitors? Why does he want to give away his golden goose?

Believe me, I've spent so much money on gurus and courses. It's not worth it. I bet he is making more money teaching you how to start a POD business than from his own POD business.

Find someone in that business and ask for advice. Don't follow a guru. Runway whenever someone gives you a formula for success in a particular business.

 

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[Tullygetsfree]

I was thinking about this thread this morning, and something crossed my mind.

He's already this smart and skilled at this young age, can you guys imagine what he could do if he had the titles? I bet he could pick any major and slay it.

 

[Levin]

Lol... The biggest thing I am shocked about is @Levin is actually making a very rational argument for ditching school... AND he is doing it with proper grammar and coherent language skills. On top of all of this, he apologizes for any error because english isn't even his first language.

Language skills that many college graduates I know do not have.

He talks about continuous improvement like someone that actually continously improves themselves. Even his avatar is professional.

@Levin, to me you seem like the rare kind of person that can rise above instutitionalized learning and actually be smart. Kudos to you. Whatever decision you make, I have confidence you will do very well.

My only caution to you is your inexperience. Things RARELY go as planned, but it seems like you already know that... Which makes you very mature for 15.

Remember this is YOUR decision. No one else's.

@Kak
Thanks for your comment, really like that. hehe
I know that, even if I don't know how it feels to fail massively and get up again...
But I'm trying my best for preparing me for this...

 

[Tullygetsfree]

But that’s just it. It’s not about a major.. it’s about becoming the best human being he can be who will grow up and help other human beings.

Of course. I was just thinking about the possibilities/experiences that he could make (scholarships, clubs, Erasmus program and so on).

As I wrote in a reply yesterday, he should do what he thinks it's best for him.

 

[Suzanne Bazemore]

@Levin, I have a nephew who just graduated from high school at age 15. Is there any way, in Switzerland, that you can perhaps take an alternative route to speed things up for yourself, but still graduate?

Also, consider that if you stay in traditional school, you might be able to help your business by leveraging your connections and promoting your t-shirts. Could you design and sell t-shirts to your school or your friends?

 

[Levin]

Hey Man

it's all really impressive.

The only thing I can suggest is to have close relatives/friends supporting you. And not even financially, but mentally. It can become tough and it is important to have support.

How do your parents feel about it?

Are you living with them? etc etc

Btw at your age the advantage is nobody expects from you to earn an adult salary and parents will support you...

---------------------------------------------

You shouldn't worry about formal education unless you want a path that everyone takes. And if you need a piece of paper to get you somewhere, you can always buy it, by hiring a person that has it or by just buying a diploma.

Not once in my life have I been asked to show my college diploma, or even secondary school, in a business situation. But I have been assessed by the value I can add and my professionalism (the way I present myself e.g. communicate). You will learn it faster and better in business situations. Most probably, if you are in a public school, you will learn how to memorise stuff and things that are counterproductive in business. Also Mon-Fri, 9-5 routines which are detrimental.

Swiss passport is really powerful and you can change countries as you wish (probably). Travel and meet people... You probably know 4 languages? German, French, Italian, English?

--------------------------------

If your parents are supporting your ideas then don't even hesitate. I love your attitude.

@Everyman
I'm currently trying to build my environment in the right direction...
My parents stay behind me and yes, I'm living with them.
I know German as my native language, English I can speak on a conversational level and French also a little bit. Italian isn't taught in school and neither I've learned it myself...
Thanks for your comment!

 

[Levin]

@Levin, I have a nephew who just graduated from high school at age 15. Is there any way, in Switzerland, that you can perhaps take an alternative route to speed things up for yourself, but still graduate?

Also, consider that if you stay in traditional school, you might be able to help your business by leveraging your connections and promoting your t-shirts. Could you design and sell t-shirts to your school or your friends?

@Suzanne Bazemore
Yes, there is a way but it's too complex...
Don't worry, I'll find other ways to expand my t-shirt business.
That can't be the reason for staying in school for 3 years.

 

[ZF Lee]

So, he is a guru.

Just think for yourself. If he is making so much money doing it why should he teach others? Is he training his competitors? Why does he want to give away his golden goose? believe me, I've spent so much money on gurus and courses. It's not worth it. I bet he is making more money teaching you how to start a POD business than from his own POD business.

Find someone in that business and ask for advice. Don't follow a guru. Runway whenever someone gives you a formula for success in a particular business.

I'm actually fine with a 'guru', as long as I don't rely 100% on him for my education and ultimately, my success. (and of course, if you can pay for the course, and use the info to get your ROI)

If they have other students, who share stuff that happens differently than expected with the tricks they were taught by the master, then it might be fine to listen not only to the guru, but also the students.

Of course there are better ways for networking and learning new angles to your skill or business, but getting the right courses and gurus is just one pathway.

Not really black and white.

The dude is a mini swiss banker/hedge fund manager.

Swiss banker?
Hope he can solve the liquidity/credit crunches within the finance system.

I didn't know the brutal extent of the regular war that financial intermediaries fight all day long to keep liquid and make loans all at the same time, until I took up a Commercial Banking unit in college.

 

[guy93777]

So, really, what the F*ck are those people thinking that tell me each and every day "HEY LEVIN, you're too young and the thing you wanna do is too risky!"

you are this card in the tarot :





i explain :

the fool is what stands above common sense . above reason

it means that either you are a genius above most people

or you are crazy and life will punish you for your arrogance

 

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[Rabby]

the fool is what stands above common sense . above reason

it means that either you are a genius above most people

or you are crazy and life will punish you for your arrogance

Or he's the Hanged Man, seeing the world around him very differently from how his peers in age see it.

 

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[Levin]

you are this card in the tarot :

View attachment 28209



i explain :

the fool is what stands above common sense . above reason

it means that either you are a genius above most people

or you are crazy and life will punish you for your arrogance

@guy93777
Haha, I like that!
I‘m not the second one, I‘m not arrogant in my normal life...
In the first post I provocated a bit, hehe

 

[guy93777]

Seriously, where's the risk??? I mean I don't have a problem living below my means if i have to for reaching independence!

so as i said, you have to do things the right way


you are here ( the fool ) but this is only for genius people who are already succesful and have to reinvent themselves above the known

this is called " freedom from the known " : the wisdom of the fools who are above logic

the power of the TAO that is beyond logic : the miracles

---> but YOU ARE TOO YOUNG FOR THAT since you have achieved nothing so far


the fool is the end for new beginnings ,not the start from scratch!!! ( a 15 years old guy like you)

the number zero means new beginnings after success .








so instead :


you have to master things and become that card FIRST :

the powerful magician who master earthly things ( the fool is the ultimate master because he is beyond earthly power )

 

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[guy93777]

so lets 'take an example :

NEO from the matrix

he starts by mastering earthly power : the magician

(which means you have to master business skills, manly skills first )



and then he becomes the fool who fight against the logical matrix

this is the power of miracles ( love whatever ) above logic and earthly power






so you have to do your homeworks first : becoming a man before becoming the fool



.

 

[Levin]

ç'est quoi ce merde...
(Pardon my French)



Being homeless.
Only do this if you're already making money. Don't be stupid.

#Landfill

Hey @UnrealCreative
I know... But being homeless in Switzerland isn't possible!
And I have the highest degree possible after nine years of school...
Also, my income isn't zero
So, like I said, I wouldn't have a problem to live few years at minimum
Thanks for your reply, really appreciate it!
Have a nice day!

 

[Levin]

I can't comment on 1 and 2.
For POD,if you can answer this questions I can give my 2 cents:
Is it your own design or you get your designs from freelancers?
Have you sold anything? What is your traffic source?
Do you have enough margin to cover the traffic costs?

@Vairavan
1. Both, I've got one Philippino designing for me, but I also do few myself... (outsourcing that later on)
2. Yes, I've sold 7 shirts now (I just do it for 2 months) and that is growing
3. Traffic source in only organic at the moment... (there's no sense to do FB ads if I don't know what's selling)

 

[Levin]

Hey Levin,
I'm happy to see a person even younger than me.
First of all I can understand that you don't like school because I hate it aswell.
We learn things that we won't need in our life and we don't even get paid.
But you have to do your A-Levels not for yourself but for your future. Under 18 it's really hard to open up a buisness in europe and you can use the time to go to school and develop a skill which is marketable, or even better come up with an idea for a company. (PS: Stop using so many emojis people can't take you serious)

@YoungnBroke
How old are you? (if I may ask)
As I said, I have plan B,C, and D if everything fails...
Here in Switzerland it's not that bad if you haven't a job...
Yeah, the one with the emojis, like you see, I'm negatively affected by toxic classmates (removed them from the post now, thanks for the info)

 

[Ismail941]

Love your Height of Confidence
Go For it man!

 

[Levin]

Thanks for all the explanation!
Would using the social care system now affect the chance to use it in the future?



7 is better than 0 for sure, but I would wait and see if the numbers increase.

Another question! Could you enter some post-mandatory-school school and drop it later if you wanted, before finishing it? Does that level of study require fees? Is it expensive?

@Tullygetsfree
No, social care system ALWAYS counts... so that isn't an issue.
Yes, Print on demand, I'll have to do much more. But I think 7 sales for the first 2 months (I haven't done anything with E Commerce or SEO or something) is not that bad.
Yes, I could, it also isn't expensive. The only thing is that it would be a bit stressful because normally when you do that, you work beside the school and go to lessons in the evening, but also that, isn't a big issue i think.

 

[Levin]

I am 17 from USA. I am a freshman at university. I had similar thoughts to you, and man am I happy that I did not actualize them. Complete your basic schooling. I don't know what that consists of in Switzerland, but do all the schooling you can for free. Whatever you plan on pursuing can, without a shadow of a doubt, be pursued while you're in school. What are you doing at 15 that takes this much time? What qualifications, knowledge, or work is there?

@NickP
I understand that. If I were in the USA, I wouldn't consider that until I'd have really security income streams...
If I do all schooling for free possible, I can study for the next 10 years hehe...
And like I said in other comments, I have plan A, B, C and D...
So there is really 0 risk of becoming real trouble...

 

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[Levin]

Levin,

I’m on your side. I had a similar path. I ended with three years of University, but I did leave school for awhile at 16.

What did I learn? High school was unimportant and University was only good to prove to myself that I could do it. I could have left after a year with the same satisfaction.

What was my most sobering lesson later on? Entrepreneurs do not require education, but VC and Grant money is often controlled by education. You’re unlikely to receive business loans, grants or capital investments without more school.

@fvcorp
Interesting!
I think this point is one of the crunch points and I also thought about it many times...
If I need a loan I really need a good network of people... I have to build that up. I'm really engaged at local meetings with businessmen and other entrepreneurs.
So I think I have to go other paths...
But that was the main reason I doubted it a bit. Really worth a concern!

 

[Primeperiwinkle]

I was thinking about this thread this morning, and something crossed my mind.

He's already this smart and skilled at this young age, can you guys imagine what he could do if he had the titles? I bet he could pick any major and slay it.

But that’s just it. It’s not about a major.. it’s about becoming the best human being he can be who will grow up and help other human beings.

 

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[Bertram]

Hey @Tullygetsfree
Here in Switzerland, you can easily start working with 15, after your 9 year school experience, so if I wanted, I could go working, just the first 3 years I wouldn't earn much (about 1200 Swiss Francs per month), but that would be enough for me.
Like I said, I'm ready to live far below my means if i have to.
And I don't COMPLETLY drop out, I still would visit some english and computer science...
And also the social care system is one ob the best ( they give you about 600 Swiss francs plus an appartment for free)

Please don't drop out of school and rely on handouts from the Swiss social care agencies like you're an uneducated beggar. It's not good for your character.

Along with possibly useful information, a formal education teaches you to use your mind.

Good luck with your enterprises.

 

[Johnny boy]

My only regret is not dropping out earlier. I say do it.

 

[Champion]

Hi Levin, welcome to the forum

You need cashflow to build a business.

As others in the thread have suggested, I would advise you to enjoy the next 3 years in school and dont get ahead of yourself by dropping out with 15 lol.

Get a job and work on the weekends or after school if you are really burning for it.

Also, join an entrepreneurs club or find other creative ways of earning money (i.e. host parties and market them to your fellow students. Charge for entry to the party, make profit). Things like that.

Best

 

[Bertram]

j

you are this card in the tarot :

View attachment 28209



i explain :

the fool is what stands above common sense . above reason

it means that either you are a genius above most people

or you are crazy and life will punish you for your arrogance

@guy93777
It's nice to see you back. Don't you think the message in this Fool Tarot card applies to you and me as well? And a bunch of others here?
I think I'm the Fool on some of my better days.
The Fools have honesty, balance and humor, and they know how much they don't know.

I mentioned it before, but you could be a miraculous hit in the graphic novel industry.
Niches like YA gothic metaphysics and Jungians spiritualists would go ga-ga over your gaming, secretive, agenda. It comes off sometimes as passive aggressive, but that approach is the norm among fiction-writing elitists.

I hope you'll give it some thought, @guy93777 .