Anonymous review site to bring light to a shady industry.

[Andy Black]

Pick a direction, get started, keep going?

Also, consider testing the market instead of worrying? Be curious.

“Hmmm... what would happen if I got 10 listed for free and then went to others offering to put them up for $50/mth? Can I sell that?”

“Or maybe I’ll just speak to an owner about their listing to get more details and ask if they want a premium listing?”

Personally, I’d start at $10/mth or something. I’d make it monthly so I’m not tied in for a year, and I can drop the project later, or increase later. Etc.

Don’t spend too long wondering why your first instinct is to ask other people. That’s the way you’re programmed at the moment, or the way fear is rearing it’s head.

A coach once told me:

“F*ck why. It only holds you back.”

Just get it done. Move faster and agonise less about every decision?

 

[sonny_1080]

It has been about 4 months since I've written in this thread. I spent about a month battling my own mindset. "Why am I doing this?" "Is it really needed?" "Am I wasting my time?" "Should I just go get a job?" "I'm a loser." These are all thoughts I struggled with. I probably fell into a little bit of a depression and spent a month playing video games.

In May I worked on a significant update to the website to iron out some of the never-ending kinks to make it more useful. I wrote a downloadable pdf to build my mailing list and put it on Facebook, but only a couple people downloaded it.

After we rolled out the new update, I talked to about 10 Operators to see how I could make a better offer. This helped me narrow down where I can bring more actual value to my potential clients. I signed 1 more business up who is paying $47 a month.

In June, I spent about a week reading the E-myth which helped me take a step back from my business and look at from the business owner's perspective instead of the worker's perspective.

From this new perspective, I realized that the direction I was going in with the subscription revenue model was not going to bring the results I wanted in the long-term. That in order to reach my vision, I would need to adopt a template for operating the way that envisioned business would operate.

So I created that template. The issue I came up against was trying to find the best revenue model for my audience. Understanding that knowing my audience is critical, I was able to test the information I've been consuming alongside this newfound wisdom of who my target audience is. It's crazy to see how easy it is to veer off-track from my target.

In July, I was watching an interview of a lady who started a website similar to mine but in another industry. Her website generates 50+ million dollars a year now. I found her on Facebook, DM'd her, and she responded! We've had 2 zoom calls now. She likes what I'm doing and has given me guidance on revenue modeling in order to decide how my website should be monetized. She's also given me a sample investor deck so I can start thinking about raising money.

At this point, my site's traffic, new clients, and revenues has not changed. I'm currently planning how I'm going to apply the significant changes to my website. It is very hard to stay motivated when there is only $47 a month in revenue coming in.

Fortunately, @Andy Black taught me how to run Google Ads last year and an old client reached out to me to make a website and run some ads for him again - so that extra income is super useful.

And my friend needed some extra help at his pizza restaurant so I picked up a couple shifts. It is humbling to be 29 years old with an Economics degree and still barely scraping by working at my friend's pizza shop with an unsuccessful website, while my 22 year old girlfriend is probably going to make upwards of $80,000 this year at her sales job. She tells me I should keep at the website and reminds of all the different entrepreneurs that have had similar struggles. I don't know if I could've gotten this far without her.

This whole thing is just a never-ending process of trying stuff that doesn't work as well as I thought it would. I thought so many things would go differently and that I'd be so much further by now. At this point I've dealt myself all in - I'm just gonna keep going. Like a robot.

My biggest difficulty has been staying motivated. And the biggest tool to help me with that difficulty has been remembering and getting back in touch with my "why" - which continues to evolve.

In the words of the great @MJ DeMarco , "failure is the sweat of success."

 

[sonny_1080]

Just read this in Unscripted and it is probably my favorite part:

"What these fools can’t see is that pursuing the dream is the dream itself. It’s the process. The failures, trials, and tribulations. It’s the self-growth, the self-awareness, and the self-discovery that occur during a dream pursuit. To sell the dream is to awaken the dream—and once it’s alive, you become alive."

DeMarco, MJ. UNSCRIPTED : Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Entrepreneurship (pp. 89-90). Viperion Publishing Corporation. Kindle Edition.

Thanks @MJ DeMarco

 

[sonny_1080]

I believe this is what we here at TFLF call a graviton...

 

[BizyDad]

Ouuuuch bro.

I mean... I guess I'll pivot after I try this new pay-per-call revenue model.

Bro...

Don't let a random stranger on the internet dissuade you. If you see value, then keep going for it.

For context, I barely skimmed most of the thread. I read the first couple posts, and the last couple posts, and that left me with my question.

I was simply asking a legit business question. What's your exit strategy?

Most people think of an exit as selling a business and being rich. But more common than that is exiting a venture that isn't going anywhere. You should have a plan for that if that is what's going on here.

So I'm not saying that you should be giving up. That really is just for you to decide.

If this pay per call model doesn't work, do you have other options to explore in this venture?

If not, then yeah maybe pivot now.

Frankly, your response sounds like you still don't really know what your target market wants. "I guess... I'll try..."

What is the value that you are providing that people will pay you for?

I got a website that produces value!!

(I have now skimmed a little more.)

Everyone is happy when you have a free listing site that saves them some coin. Yeah. The website provides value. It might even be changing some lives.

But you sounds like you struggle with it because you don't feel successful yet. This sounds like it has become a labor of love.

Nothing wrong with leaving the website up while you try other things. Maybe this is a business idea that you can come back to later...

 

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[BizyDad]

$15 per call is plenty cheap.

I'm a skeptic by nature and have no experience in pay per call pricing strategies.

My suggestion would be stop trying to figure out how you're going to sell this, and start having a conversation with the market.

For example, those three criteria don't equate to qualified in my opinion. Someone in the United States who rings somebody up from your directory and tries to sell them on marketing services would meet your criteria.

As someone who listens to a lot of recorded phone calls generated from marketing efforts, I can tell you that that is the kind of phone call that is most likely to happen. My clients get more sales calls from Yelp or clutch then they do legit inquiries.

I don't really want to respond too much, because as I mentioned I'm a skeptic.

I would rather cheer you on then rain on your parade. Just go do your thing. Talk to people. Learn. Grow. Iterate.

And if all else fails, pivot. Lol.

 

[JamesAnnaLee]

Thanks for sharing...

Seems that your coming to the pay-per-lead model but at the moment with the middle man of pay-per-phone call. Reading between the lines it seems that's the focus on the phone call rather than a lead perhaps is to make you feel better about helping generate a lead for the business that you don't feel so good about? (Maybe I'm reading that wrong)

The fact is at the moment you and your website are generating leads for these businesses - although hopefully with the reviews they can make a better choice - great. And you're doing it almost for free.

A phone call, web booking form or premium listing are all there to get a lead and In the end, get their business. Is there any difference in being paid for a PRO listing or a lead - I'd suggest not?

Between somebody viewing your site and calling the number or sending the company an email and making a booking is where to money is being transferred, at the moment you're not taking a share, instead it's going into the pockets of the industry you think is shady. The people on your website will likley make a booking with or without your assistance

If I was in your shoes I'd have a form on each property page tomorrow saying "Request to book" they would enter the dates they want to stay, and their contact details and submit. I'd then take those details send them onto the owner and obsfuscate out the details... "We have a lead for your from James An***** (078544****) with a desired more in date of x/x/2022" Click here to view the full details (subject to a $X/X% lead commission upon move-in date).

Once that's working you can figure out how to monetise the call route - maybe that's like @Andy Black says providing the Pre-qualifcation & helping the customer out some more. Or maybe it's just by switching to a "Request a call back" where you can do a similar thing to the "request to book" form or just charging to have a phone number accessible.

You could have it in your terms that the business needs to confirm if the lead was successful (and needs to be paid commision) - You'll also have the leads details so you can either call or message to see if they were successful in finding a place & if they did add that commission to your invoice.

If you don't get in the middle of the customer & the end business - this transaction is going to happen without you no extra "funnelling" is required. You'll just end up linking them together for free instead of getting paid.

Apologise if my thoughts are a little scrambled.

 

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[sonny_1080]

Three days ago, @Andy Black and I chatted it up for a bit. I told him something we hear in TFLF all the time: "I'm working on building [insert latest idea]" - in my case, a website.

In true Andy fashion, he brought me back to why we are all here in the first place: to add value. You can't add value without getting in front of people. He suggested I post something on FB and start engaging the market. I immediately felt afraid of posting the wrong thing or something less than perfect. Andy helped me realize that if I'm helping people, what is there to be afraid of?

Before I spoke to Andy, I spent about a week researching, planning and sketching a website without really engaging the market.

That night, I posted something of a rant (related to the pain point I think my website can solve), and then disabled all my FB notifications. In the last 3 days, I've got about 60 comments and 10+ PMs. 95% of the responses were from people who felt the same way and thanked me for saying something. A few tried to offer a solution (not as good as my website idea).

After responding to them, the questions came: why aren't more people sharing their experiences? Why isn't this post being shared to more people?

I've asked people offline to comment and share and they said: a) "I don't want my boss knowing I'm in this conversation" and b) "I don't want the constant notifications from FB."

This information further validates my website because it solves both a) and b). I also asked people if they thought an anonymous review site would be helpful and I got nothing but positive answers.

Andy suggested I just make a list and put it on a landing page to get something started - and that's what I decided to do.

So my list is coming together. Google Forms integrated with Google Sheets on a simple Wordpress site should be good enough to start.

My post on Facebook got a way better response than I thought it would. Turns out a lot of people feel the same way I do - so far. It will be easier to get more people involved since a website link is a lot easier to share than a facebook post. And an anonymous review is a lot easier than a facebook comment.

I'm gonna make it to where only past and current residents can leave a review. Anybody can add a business to the list, all they need is the name of the business and the location. And since people will be adding businesses and reviewing them, the businesses will be incentivized to add more information (amenities, room availability, respond to reviews, etc.). This they can do by claiming the business (like Yelp). I'm gonna figure out a way to verify everybody and ensure content guidelines to avoid any fakery.

My question is: should I charge them to claim the business in the beginning? Or should I wait until the site has more popularity?

I was gonna let them claim for free in the beginning, but after reading Be Open To Receive I'm thinking about charging them like $50 to claim their business. Part of me feels like $50 is too much for the beginning since its a brand new site, but another part of me feels like that's totally fair. In the end of the day, they can choose NOT to claim their business - and people will still be reviewing them. It'll just be a little bit harder for people to contact the business because the only info they'll have is a name, location, and reviews.

On the other hand, if I start charging them in the beginning, I won't have to take any business info down if people decide not to claim their business. Come to think of it, this will probably happen regardless if I raise the prices as the popularity of the site increases.

After journalizing all this, I guess I should charge from the beginning.

My value skew for the businesses is: represent your business on the "go-to" platform for your target audience.

To my understanding, it's damn near impossible to calculate an average customer lifetime value for this niche because the churn rate is outrageous. For that reason, any PPC is just not feasible right now. A flat monthly rate makes the most sense to me.

I know this niche charges anywhere between $600 - $10,000 a month, but I think the average is $1,400. I read that in an article somewhere. However, I don't want to hurt the lesser-expensive businesses by charging too much. Besides, the expensive ones are usually the most unscrupulous.

I feel like $50 is too cheap and $300 is to expensive. But again, the more popular the site gets, the more valuable it will be to the individual businesses.

Either way, I'm probably going to have to raise the price down the road. I think I'll start with $50 a month.

Or should I allow the businesses to claim for free?

The more I think about, I think no on the free because of the idea of money being a confirmation of value.

What do you guys think?

 

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[sonny_1080]

[update]

Went from building a quick landing page to just diving into building the whole website. After watching

View: https://youtu.be/BxSruxav35k
I decided that with all the tools at my disposal, it would be best to present a website that does what is claimed instead of just a list or a LP.

This was decided because it would DEFINITELY be more helpful to people. And again, with all the tools and software out there, there is no excuse to not have something really awesome up and running and helping people by late January - early February.

Since December 12th, I've collected 30 reviews without a website. Been promoting the idea on Facebook a lot. Nothing but really positive feedback. A lot of "I really admire what you're doing" and "that's a great idea! Why doesn't that exist already?"

I've had to learn a ton of stuff on the fly and get different software tools. Theres been about two times (so far) that I built out one whole part of the website with 1 kind of software but could only get so far without needing another type of software. Only to realize the two were incompatible so I had to scrap the whole the whole thing and start over.

I've got a sticky note above my computer that reads "PROCESS OVER EVENTS" that has kept me patient.

Thank God for the money I made from running Google Ads for people. I've been able to use that money to put into this website.

I've finished the template for each listing to be displayed, the archive for the listings, search engine functionality w/ filtering & sorting, homepage (to solidify design and layout), header/footer, the single listing page template, and I figured out how to list what each business has available on their listing page. All that took about two weeks.

Promoting the idea on FB parallel to building the website has given me market feedback on how to make the website more helpful to people. It has also given me specific business data so once it's time to start fleshing out the database I will have enough content to start with.

Once all the templates are made and the dynamic interactions are set up then it will just be a matter of adding in all the content and letting the website build itself out. On track to start doing that by the end of next week.

I've come across 4 or 5 different websites that are doing something kind of similar but I'm confident in my ability to beat them simply because of the intrinsic differences in what I'm doing.

Still haven't decided if I should launch as a loss leader and focus on the following before offering a 'PRO' claim with additional features for a fee. Or if I should offer the 'PRO' claim from the time of launch.

The reason I haven't made the decision is because I'm just not sure what is BEST for the long-term vision: loss leader or value-confirmation through actual purchases.

That is all for now.

 

[sonny_1080]

[update]

I've decided to build out PRO features on the website so it can be monetized when launched.

I'm in the thick of it right now. The excitement about the idea has withered away but the feedback I get from the posts on FB promoting the idea keep me directional.

Currently I'm figuring out how to create a dynamic registration form that categorizes different users giving them each different capabilities on the site. Definitely the hardest part of the project so far.

I posted a job on Upwork to talk to a JetEngine specialist and have been reaching out to different FB groups. Figuring it out little by slowly.

I crafted a realistic timeline with the goal of launching in the first week of February.

I'm really looking forward to have something to show people.

 

[sonny_1080]

Two days ago I made 30 cold calls. Reached 10 people and booked 5 meetings.

Yesterday I met with 3 people and got everybody signed up for the free version of my website and got my first PRE-ORDER SALE FOR $800!!!

Super stoked.

Today I’m taking the presentation that worked, recording it, and posting it on social media to reach as many people as possible.

Then it’s back to making cold calls and booking meetings.

 

[sonny_1080]

I haven't taken the time to write an update because I didn't think anybody cared. But after reading @Likwid24 's https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/co...-progress-thread-the-paint-brush-cover.30969/ at the behest of @MJ DeMarco 's GOLD! - 9 'Slap-Your-Face' Lessons You Need to Learn from this Shark Tank Success Story I decided to keep going.

Since the last post I made about the $800 pre-order, I realized that if I kept spending time trying to get pre-orders, then my website would launch without any useful content. So I cold called about 150 businesses in the niche and offered the Basic Claim (Free). 50 of them had shutdown, another 50 I never spoke with, and the other 50 said yes. Saying yes meant they would have a free listing on my website that aggregated their target audience... and consumers would have enough basic information to find a provider. The rest of my time was spent trying to get attention on social media and working with my web developer to bring the site to life.

We launched February 24th with 44 reviews, 53 business claims, and 1 upgraded claim ($800 annual revenue). I've spent the majority of my time getting as much feedback as possible from users and relaying the information to the developer who has been a total life-saver. We've made a lot of changes and after the first month it really started to come together.

In the last 39 days, we've received an additional 8 reviews, 3 more business claims (the free one), and no new revenues. Here's what my analytics looks like:



Perhaps the most important thing that has happened since I started this project is I've had about 6 people reach out to me directly to help them find a provider... and I never told them to do that. I just said "hey, check out this website. And people were like, no, do it for me."

Here is where things get tricky. People hit me up, I use my website as a tool to help them (which is so awesome), they find providers to help meet their needs, I think 2 or 3 ended up closing and the providers made money.

However, I still have not made a dime other than the $800 pre-order. So last week, my friend tells me instead of doing charging for listing space, charge per lead. A few hours later, I'm on the phone with a provider explaining to them I'm thinking about doing PPL and he says "bro, this industry (medical) is all about branding and perception. I like your idea, but PPL will be looked at so negatively." He was interested in meeting with me and we spoke for about an hour where he gave me some very valuable feedback. I spoke with about 7 others in the industry and it resulted in me having a very serious moral crisis that has put a severe restraint on my "Why" and thus, for the last week, I've been totally stuck.

It comes down to this: I HATE the industry I started this business in. All of my domain experience is in this one field and I wanted to have a review website that brought transparency to the ONE aspect of this industry that I thought could be salvaged and useful. I've recently come to learn that this niche within the niche is becoming about 75% involved with a part of this industry that I just cannot have anything to do with.

It seems as though my options are 1) continue building a business focusing on the remaining 25% - which seems stupid because its like I'm choosing to build a business in a declining niche or 2) turn to the darkside.

So for the last week I've been trying to decide what to do. I know it seems complicated because it is and that is why I'm stuck.

I'm trying to get my "Why" right before I do anything else, so I've been trolling the FLF and reading hoping to stumble across something that clears it all up for me.

I got a $10,000 loan last week that I can use as a financial cushion for the business so thats good. I also have a 3-day leadership seminar this week that is supposed to drill-down into the "Why", and I really hope it helps. I'm pretty sure it will. And then when I come back, I'll have a restructured "Why" and then I can get back into making things happen.

Here's a video for anyone in a similar situation:

How great leaders inspire action

Simon Sinek has a simple but powerful model for inspirational leadership -- starting with a golden circle and the question: "Why?" His examples include Apple, Martin Luther King Jr. and the Wright brothers ...

www.ted.com

 

[sonny_1080]

Thanks for sharing...

Seems that your coming to the pay-per-lead model but at the moment with the middle man of pay-per-phone call. Reading between the lines it seems that's the focus on the phone call rather than a lead perhaps is to make you feel better about helping generate a lead for the business that you don't feel so good about? (Maybe I'm reading that wrong)

The fact is at the moment you and your website are generating leads for these businesses - although hopefully with the reviews they can make a better choice - great. And you're doing it almost for free.

A phone call, web booking form or premium listing are all there to get a lead and In the end, get their business. Is there any difference in being paid for a PRO listing or a lead - I'd suggest not?

Between somebody viewing your site and calling the number or sending the company an email and making a booking is where to money is being transferred, at the moment you're not taking a share, instead it's going into the pockets of the industry you think is shady. The people on your website will likley make a booking with or without your assistance

If I was in your shoes I'd have a form on each property page tomorrow saying "Request to book" they would enter the dates they want to stay, and their contact details and submit. I'd then take those details send them onto the owner and obsfuscate out the details... "We have a lead for your from James An***** (078544****) with a desired more in date of x/x/2022" Click here to view the full details (subject to a $X/X% lead commission upon move-in date).

Once that's working you can figure out how to monetise the call route - maybe that's like @Andy Black says providing the Pre-qualifcation & helping the customer out some more. Or maybe it's just by switching to a "Request a call back" where you can do a similar thing to the "request to book" form or just charging to have a phone number accessible.

You could have it in your terms that the business needs to confirm if the lead was successful (and needs to be paid commision) - You'll also have the leads details so you can either call or message to see if they were successful in finding a place & if they did add that commission to your invoice.

If you don't get in the middle of the customer & the end business - this transaction is going to happen without you no extra "funnelling" is required. You'll just end up linking them together for free instead of getting paid.

Apologise if my thoughts are a little scrambled.

Thank you for your feedback.

I experimented with a lead form. That was cool because I had names, and call back numbers.

The lead would come to my email. And I’d copy the lead info and text it to the service provider at no charge. Their was several times I wouldn’t hear anything back. Not a confirmation that they got the email, not a thank you; nothing. And I wasn’t sure if the lead even received a phone call back.

I’d reach out to the service provider I gave the lead to and they’d say “yeah we called them but they didn’t answer.” So I didn’t feel right charging them anything.

I know this market prefers a phone call. I think the users prefer being able to just call the place directly too. It saves everyone time and is more convenient.

With my website, people are more informed about the place they’re calling before they make the phone call.

 

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[sonny_1080]

Launched new update that makes sure users have to be logged in before they interact with the site.

Analytics stopped working for some reason and I got tied up with life stuff that distracted me.

Got fed up with my job and while browsing new job opportunities this morning I decided to check in with the forum (been like 3 months) and came across @Lex DeVille 's thread.

It simultaneously made me feel very stupid for making so little progress these past 2 years, but it also motivated me to stop looking for a new job and use the dissatisfaction from my current job to motivate me to make this thing work.

Reached out to a couple people to help with the conversion tracking stuff this morning. Hopefully I hear back from one of them and if not, then I'll just tinker with it this weekend.

 

[BizyDad]

Launched new update that makes sure users have to be logged in before they interact with the site.

Analytics stopped working for some reason and I got tied up with life stuff that distracted me.

Got fed up with my job and while browsing new job opportunities this morning I decided to check in with the forum (been like 3 months) and came across @Lex DeVille 's thread.

It simultaneously made me feel very stupid for making so little progress these past 2 years, but it also motivated me to stop looking for a new job and use the dissatisfaction from my current job to motivate me to make this thing work.

Reached out to a couple people to help with the conversion tracking stuff this morning. Hopefully I hear back from one of them and if not, then I'll just tinker with it this weekend.

I'm glad you're back, engaged, and getting after this again.

 

[Andy Black]

Where are you at with this project @sonny_1080?

Are you making sales?

What needs to happen for this to replace your j.o.b?

 

[BizyDad]

Really?

I mean… if I can have my website produce some revenue passively, isn’t that the right way to go? And since I have the money to hire somebody now who can do it better than I, shouldn’t I?

Please don't hire anyone. This idea of yours doesn't seem to be working.

 

[BizyDad]

This sounds like one of those situations where you might be providing value, but you are not providing enough value that people will pay for.

That means your only revenue stream will be ads.

If you want to make money on ad revenue, you're going to need tens of thousands of people. In order to get tens of thousands of people, you're probably going to spend a decent amount of money on SEO.

Unless you really know what you're doing, the return on investment probably won't be there.

My other concern is that any SEO will tell you they can help you get traffic, but SEOs are not often experts and ads. And the ones who are, are usually building their own properties and don't take clients. So getting the right kind of help will be pretty difficult for you to sift through since you don't know the lingo.

I think there are other business models that will work out better for you. Maybe you can come back to this one in the long run. I have a couple of business ideas like that. I wasn't able to execute on them back in the day, but maybe someday in the future I'll be able to pull it together.

 

[StrikingViper69]

Your website: makes a few cents

Your work: salary doubled in a few months

Work with what’s working. Being in your job will present opportunities. You’ll be able to find things that haven’t been tried, have been overlooked, can be improved or executed on better.

Long term, could you turn your job into an independent business that companies outsource to?

 

[sonny_1080]

[update]

Ran into some issues with the anonymous review form so i made a better one with jotform.

Spent the last week promoting it on Facebook, building authority, getting attention, and posting the review form.

I’ve gotten nothing but great feedback. So far I’ve got 11 submissions out of 54 form views.

I figure that I’d be able to get more of a buzz if people had a landing page to have some tangible evidence of my vision.

I got hosting and a domain yesterday and started building a quick landing page.

I’m focused on the promotion first and I’ll build the website parallel.

 

[Mike Stoian]

Awesome work man. From what I've heard your product sounds kinda similar to Glassdoor here in the UK. On Glassdoor people leave anonymous reviews for companies, they disclose their salaries and other stuff like that. It's mostly helpful for people to figure out if they wanna work for a company or not. However it's super annoying to use sometimes.

Even if you have exactly the same idea in your mind, You can make it SOOOOOO much better. And also exapand it into so many more other markets that Glassdoor hasn't touched yet. But I'm sure your idea is different and way more specialised.

You seem to be on the right track. Congrats!

 

[Andy Black]

Two days ago I made 30 cold calls. Reached 10 people and booked 5 meetings.

Yesterday I met with 3 people and got everybody signed up for the free version of my website and got my first PRE-ORDER SALE FOR $800!!!

Super stoked.

Today I’m taking the presentation that worked, recording it, and posting it on social media to reach as many people as possible.

Then it’s back to making cold calls and booking meetings.

Cold calls? Meetings? Signups? And revenue?

Well done!

 

[Likwid24]

What industry is this for?

 

[arguino]

Hey, just read the whole thread, personal situation is sad to hear, glad you've pulled through. Congrats on creating a website that brings value.

Perhaps the most important thing that has happened since I started this project is I've had about 6 people reach out to me directly to help them find a provider... and I never told them to do that. I just said "hey, check out this website. And people were like, no, do it for me."

Have you thought about charging the users for this? Having some kind of premium service where you help them find a place to stay. You might be against this and feel like you're benefitting from them, but I'd object and say if it enables you to help them better you're creating value for both of you.

You say you don't like the niche but I think it's a very noble one, you're helping people who want to take back control of their lives find the right place to do so. I don't know what brought you depression nearing your birthday, but you should take pride in what you built, even if financially you don't feel there yet.

Maybe volunteering locally in your niche could help you find ways to create value for your users. Have you posted your website to /r/stopdrinking or similar subreddits (maybe ask the mods there)? You could also find ways to create value there.

What about a journaling app or website that helps people stay sober? (I wouldn't go into this blindly without researching addictions further, I don't know if this could be helpful)

 

[sonny_1080]

Bro...

Don't let a random stranger on the internet dissuade you. If you see value, then keep going for it.

For context, I barely skimmed most of the thread. I read the first couple posts, and the last couple posts, and that left me with my question.

I was simply asking a legit business question. What's your exit strategy?

Most people think of an exit as selling a business and being rich. But more common than that is exiting a venture that isn't going anywhere. You should have a plan for that if that is what's going on here.

So I'm not saying that you should be giving up. That really is just for you to decide.

If this pay per call model doesn't work, do you have other options to explore in this venture?

If not, then yeah maybe pivot now.

Frankly, your response sounds like you still don't really know what your target market wants. "I guess... I'll try..."

What is the value that you are providing that people will pay you for?



(I have now skimmed a little more.)

Everyone is happy when you have a free listing site that saves them some coin. Yeah. The website provides value. It might even be changing some lives.

But you sounds like you struggle with it because you don't feel successful yet. This sounds like it has become a labor of love.

Nothing wrong with leaving the website up while you try other things. Maybe this is a business idea that you can come back to later...

Thanks man. Not gonna lie, your last post had me totally reevaluating my life for the last hour lol.

The value that people will pay for (maybe) is the phone calls they get from the site.

I won't know until I call them and offer it to them.

I have 230 places to call starting on Saturday.

If I cannot get 20 of them to agree to a 12-month commitment with a credit card on file, then I'm done with this niche industry.

I still have the underpinnings of a website that can produce value for any industry. It would just be a matter of pivoting to the right industry that would value the phone calls enough to pay for them.

What do you think?

 

[sonny_1080]

Why don't you take the calls or do the callbacks? Pre-qualify them, help them, learn more about them and how they found the site and what other options they've considered or found. Then you can make the call to the best located directory member and sell them the lead much better?

That’s an option

 

[sonny_1080]

What if you rang saying "I have a lead. Jenny is looking for X to start on Y date in Z location. Do you know someone who can help her?"

I’ve experimented with only having my number on the website so I can talk to both sides of the market. The people in need are usually in a really bad jam and don’t have a lot of money at all (that’s why they’re using these service providers). These people usually go to the first place recommended to them (hence the idea for a review site). And quite often these people aren’t a good fit for a service provider for one reason or another, so the service provider has a low conversion rate.

My phone would ring, I’d get an idea of the persons situation, and then I’d call 12 different service providers on my website, 4 would answer, and 2 would be willing to talk to the lead to schedule a tour.

I’d give the service provider the lead’s number and they’d call the lead back. I think I did this for 6 people and only 1 actually ended up moving in. I didn’t charge anybody for the lead ahead of time because I didn’t want to hear them be like… “I paid you and nothing happened.”

This was a huge hassle that was remarkably frustrating.

Not only that, but the state I live in has been trying to pass a law so websites like mine legally have to have the phone number go to the designated service provider and not a third party.

This was a huge hassle that was remarkably frustrating.

One lady called me, I set a couple tours up for her, she didn’t go to any of them.

Another kid got a tour lined up, showed up, saw the place, and left immediately. He texted me back and was like “I’m just gonna stay where I’m at.”

Another person hit me up, I told a service provider, and word got around who the guy was and all the service providers were like, “nah, we’re good.”

I remember I talked to one guy and told him to call a place and never heard anything back. Turns out, he ended up moving in and all is well.

Connecting people in this market is very difficult because there are so many variables. I don’t want to be the in-between guy, I just want to give people awareness of what is out there and let them put the effort in. My website does that right now.

The power dynamic is definitely in the hands of the service providers because the hardest part of their job is screening for the right people… and I can see why. This isn’t a one-size-fits-all kind of a thing. I just want to help their phone ring. But I don’t know how much that is worth.

 

[sonny_1080]

This market prefers to get the phone calls directly themselves without my screening them. With this law the state is trying to pass, and given how much of a hassle it is being the in-between guy, I’d prefer they get the phone calls directly too. And the users prefer being able to just call and talk to the service provider anyway. Quick and convenient.

If I say “you only get charged when you receive a phone call” they’d be more willing to do that, as long as we can agree on what a qualified call is. Which unless I have a some kind of recording, I really won’t know if it’s qualified.

But they’d definitely be willing if I said “you only pay when someone moves in.” This would be a game-changer. Which would require me following up with the caller and asking if they moved in.

I can track the phone number that called, and every Saturday follow up with them to see if they moved in and paid. If so, I can call the Operator and be like, “hey, I know John Doe found your service and contacted you through our website service. We know he moved in and paid you $X dollars.” If you would like to continue using our service, click the link below to submit your $198 placement fee. We will use the card on file for future placements. You only pay when someone moves in and places a deposit with you. Otherwise we will remove your contact information from our website.”

Funny thing is, I remember offering this to a service provider and they said they’d pay me $25 if the person moved in. I immediately decided not to do this because that’s just not enough money. I’d want at least $150 and even that’s cheap, because these people charge like $700-$800 a month per person that moves in. Granted the turnover rate is high, but some people end up staying for like 6 months.

Each service provider provides a huge variation of pricing. I’d rather have an agreed upon amount ahead of time though. I think pricing tiers is the way to go:


Pricing tiers
Under $1,000 -> $198
$1,000–$1,500 -> $298
$1,500+ -> $398

 

[sonny_1080]

I’ve had a lot of conversations directly with the market. Their responses are usually:

“I want to the calls to go directly to me.”

“I don’t want to be on a review site.”

“We don’t do this for the money.”

“We haven’t gotten anything from your site yet.”

“I can afford $30-$50 a month, but it’s not worth it if you’re not getting enough traffic.”

Good places want to help people. I require payment for the same reason they do: there is value being provided. If an Operator doesn’t see the value in my website helping them help more people, then they must not be interested in helping more people. And are therefore not as good of a service provider as I thought they were. If that’s the case, I don’t want to send people to them anyway.

After I follow up with the user to see if they move in, I can text them for feedback on the website and a link to review their experience with the service provider… and encourage them to write a review at any time.

What if a someone says they moved in and the service provider says they didn’t?

I guess I’ll just deal with that when it happens.

Value first… “John Smith deposited X dollars on this date, our commission fee is $198. If you would like to continue receiving residents, please click the link below to deposit your funds. Otherwise, ignore this message and we will remove your phone number from SLR.”

This way I don’t gotta be the middle man. I don’t gotta broker between people and deal with that nonsense. Ops get the calls directly which is what they want. Users can just call easily, which is what they want. It stays legal regardless of what the state decides to do. I can provide value first. I can deal with the lead directly to encourage reviews and get feedback and know if they paid. And the op only pays if they receive money, which is what they want. And $198 flat fee is super cheap. And I can track results easy.

 

[sonny_1080]

After talking directly with the market this past year and give it what it wants, I drafted quick plan on the changes that need to be made in order in to get it done.

#1: Need to be able to track which users call which service providers.

I already had GA4 linked up to the site and an event triggering for each time a phone call link is clicked. However, the specifics of who was clicked and by whom was not there. This week I figured out how to segment where the link the was clicked (page_title); and I learned how to create user ID custom definitions in GA4 so I can track data per user. Then I can correlate user ID's with used info submitted to the site upon registration (names and phone numbers) so I can call them up and see if they ended up using a service provider who I can THEN make my offer to (pay to continue getting people, or nah).

Problem: my visitors can call without logging in. Which leads me to step #2...

#2: Get everybody to login before they can call a service provider.

Trying to make the UI/UX as seamless as possible, I just created a staging site where I can add in the login gate that triggers up clicking an archive listing.

More updates soon.