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RANT Stay In School It's Not A Waste Of Time!

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I'm old enough to remember life before the internet-inspired post-truth era we live in today, and I can quite categorically say that stupid ideas before the internet were just laughed at and killed at birth.

However you're right, there's nothing common about sense :)
Man the struggle is real. You may be right, but I really think it just seems like there's more stupidity out there because all of a sudden a lot of these folks have a platform. And @lowtek is right, it can happen to anyone. You also have to remember that these things play on our most basic human weaknesses.

Example: I used to be really into conspiracy theories. That's not to say I trust the government now, but I mean, I was straight up watching Alex Jones all the time in the years right after 9-11. I was that guy that people avoided certain topics with. Anyway, what made me finally snap out of it was someone said something like: "For a lot of people, the idea that a malevolent cabal is pulling the strings and running everything is a lot less scary than facing the chaos of reality. Having a bad person in charge somehow more comforting than trying to cope with the reality that no one is."

I paraphrase, but you get the gist.
 

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Anyway, what made me finally snap out of it was someone said something like: "For a lot of people, the idea that a malevolent cabal is pulling the strings and running everything is a lot less scary than facing the chaos of reality. Having a bad person in charge somehow more comforting than trying to cope with the reality that no one is."
Perfect example of fuzzy thinking leading to crazy conclusions. I don't fault you, because you snapped out of it.

I had a conversation the other day with a rather intelligent friend who said some of the dumbest shit I've ever heard. I explained to him exactly this, and it made me aware of my own bias due to my agnostic beliefs. I, personally, have a bias toward randomness. I'm more likely to believe that the unlikely or negative is due to chance and that it could have happened another way. Others have a bias toward determinism, in which they believe that something unlikely or negative must have been bound to happen because someone willed it so. Others believe in destiny.

It's easy to take all these biases toward their logical extremes, and despite being 'logical' the thinking behind it is fuzzy because (1) it doesn't stand up to real scrutiny, and (2) the assumptions are based on feelings or beliefs.

On the other hand, convictions and beliefs form the basis for actions that result in wanted (or unwanted) outcomes, and many of these convictions and beliefs cannot be falsified. Despite my randomness bias, I personally do believe that there are 'right' convictions and 'wrong' convictions, and people with 'wrong' convictions are likely to have poorer outcomes and cause harm to others, either through their actions or through spreading their beliefs.

That dichotomy raises its head yet again.

Granted, I believe I'm correct in saying there's no shadowy cabal, only individual incentives, and those incentives can (but didn't have to!) lead to every single outcome we see today.

I hope members of this forum can be as self aware as you were when you listed to that person.
 

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Unpopular opinion coming in 3...2...
The point is quite simply this; today on planet earth, in our glorious system of Sol, there are millions, yes freaking millions! of people who believe that the earth is flat. There are millions of people that believe that vaccines are a government plot to give you autism. There are millions of people who believe we never went to the moon.
About those people having their own ideas and visions regarding the world based on their perceptions, let them be.

In life, there is never a guarantee, there is no certainty. A few years a lot of us would've called the Fastlane a myth. Because with the knowledge we had it could not be perceived as possible.

I always laugh when someone says "There have been scientific studies that have proven it."
There are some facts in this world, but very little.

There are scientific studies for and against everything. How is that possible? Because scientific studies are done by people. And they are just that, studies. They record facts and draw a conclusion from that.

That conclusion is then also based on their biases and their funder's biases.

Take the Nofap movement for example.
I am very much pro-Nofap. It is scientifically proven that almost all of the people with depression who do porn are freed from that depression after quitting for 90 days.

There's also scientific proof against that fact.
And doctors would laugh at you if you brought it up.

For me, it works. That's all I care about. And I share that with other people.

Hell, until a few years ago there was this big thing going on about scientific facts that the world is getting overpopulated and we won't be able to sustain it.
Now there are scientific facts against that.

It just does not F*cking matter. People will be people. There will be those with stupid ideas and those with good ones. But in the end, who the hell are we to judge those ideas?

Dumb concepts and beliefs are just a product of our exploration through the unknown.

Also, School can be useful, yes. But only to learn a vast amount of knowledge (note: knowledge, this is barely experience) about a subject without having to go through all the trouble of finding that knowledge yourself. And to meet people who are interested in the same subjects.
 

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So yeah, don't be an idiot, stay in school kids.
This is just my opinion along with Dave Ramsey. It's not so much about getting and education. But and education is crushing the masculine and feminine financially with low-paying jobs. I found out my student loan is nothing compared to some of these people. But other cultures provide education differently that is not getting people in trouble so severely.

I saved a lot of money finding the Fast Lane Forum and I am glad I didn't keep taking student loans out like some other people. I went to Harvard, Yale, Stanford online free on You Tube. May not have the expensive piece of paper to go with it, but I feel in the future if someone needs a piece of paper, they can pay for me to go back and get the piece of paper. Why should it come out of my pocket. If they want to hire me, they can pay for it.

This happen with my Nurse Aide Certificate. I believe otherwise if there isn't something in it for both sides, there's not point in getting yourself into large debt for the sake of impressing people.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMk7CKwJ8OM


This is the kind of stuff people are getting into. I thought I had debt, and I have nothing compared to some people. You're basically becoming a slave to debt these days with Student Loans.

And they use some of this money for entertainment, shopping, and not all for school. I watched people what they do going to school. Student Refunds, they take out all this extra money for fun and say, "I'll pay it back later."
 
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I always laugh when someone says "There have been scientific studies that have proven it."
There are some facts in this world, but very little.
You can laugh all you want, but when scientist say they've proven something, it is because lots of different scientists in completely different fields, have proven the original prediction from the source theory.

For instance, evolution is proven because Darwin made a number of predictions about the (then incomplete) fossil record as regards to the type and order of fossils, he then made his tree of life showing how species evolved.

Then as the years passed other geologists found the predicted fossils at certain depths, then other scientists using radiometric dating find that the rocks that the fossils were found in are exactly the age Darwin predicted.

Later still when we invented powerful computers that were able to sequence DNA, we found that Darwin's prediction about the evolution of the species matched perfectly with our findings. Hence we say science has proved evolution. (For a more complete picture, I urge you to read Darwin's On The Origin Of The Species)

Scientists don't take lightly those words, they wait until it has been proven over and over again, or rather many people try and disprove the theory and fail, this is what it means to have a proven theory. So regardless of your laughter, this is how the scientific process comes to the conclusion that something has an overwhelming likelihood to be true.

Of course we allow for the possibility the theory may one day be disproved, however with each proof, the evidence required to disprove becomes more and more extraordinary.

There are scientific studies for and against everything. How is that possible?
This is patently not true, for instance there is no credible scientist on earth who disputes what the sun is made of, or Einstein's theories of general and special relativity.

Take the Nofap movement for example.
I am very much pro-Nofap. It is scientifically proven that almost all of the people with depression who do porn are freed from that depression after quitting for 90 days.
This is correlation not causation, depression from watching too much porn has other deep psychological causes. Fapping happens when you watch porn, however many people fap without it, many loving couples take part in it without any adverse psychological effects.

What science has said about masturbation, is that it is healthy in males who do not have sex regularly, as it clears out the tubes, so to speak, and lowers the instance of testicular cancer.

Also, School can be useful, yes. But only to learn a vast amount of knowledge
Quite. That is exactly the point, knowledge and also (hopefully) the intellectual capacity to sift through said knowledge and discern fact from fiction.

I'm not saying necessarily you will understand the difference between correlation and causation just because you go to school, however you have a better chance if you do.
 
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You ever talk to your professors lol?
Lolz.

Much to my regret, I never actually went to university, I became disillusioned with education for much the same reasons that prompt people to call it a waste of time. The problem was that I had (an still have) near perfect recall, not only does this make me an annoying person to argue with (I can remember conversations word for word), it meant that I passed exams very easily without much study.

Years later I realised that I should have gone anyway, because the passing exams bit was not the important part, it was the learning and learning how to learn. I am self-taught in the disciplines that interest me, quantum physics and astronomy in particular.

I wish I had some professors to talk to now though... :)
 
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Example: I used to be really into conspiracy theories. That's not to say I trust the government now, but I mean, I was straight up watching Alex Jones all the time in the years right after 9-11. I was that guy that people avoided certain topics with.
Ha, snap! I was right there with you man! What snapped me out of it was when I showed an old roommate a video of a 'truther' exposing the truth. My roomie just laughed, and instead of getting angry I started to question my beliefs, after not too long I realised that I had been suffering from confirmation bias, and had simply missed all the bits of evidence that didn't fit in with the inside job narrative.

A couple of years ago the last niggling doubt was taken away from me when I saw the NY Fire Brigade's video of bdg 7 from the back, and it was clearly about to fall, unlike the front view which we see all the time.

Though I do still leave the possibility 9/11 was criminal negligence, i.e. someone new the attack was coming and ignored it.

Or they simply missed it, who knows?

The point is, both you and I were prepared to question our beliefs, whereas today we live in an era whereby people are not prepared to do that because they believe that everything that is from the official narrative is BS, whether that be government, media, or science, it's all lies regardless of evidence.

"For a lot of people, the idea that a malevolent cabal is pulling the strings and running everything is a lot less scary than facing the chaos of reality. Having a bad person in charge somehow more comforting than trying to cope with the reality that no one is."
I'd go even further and say that conspiracy theory is the religion for the atheist, just like in religion there is a powerful force that has a hidden plan that we can never figure out. Also like religion, there is a lot of doomsday worship, the end is nigh and all that sort of thing.

I wrote an article on it once if you're interested.

Did he quote on this post? I can't find his comment if he did, I was wondering what his contribution would be :)
 

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Ha, snap! I was right there with you man! What snapped me out of it was when I showed an old roommate a video of a 'truther' exposing the truth. My roomie just laughed, and instead of getting angry I started to question my beliefs, after not too long I realised that I had been suffering from confirmation bias, and had simply missed all the bits of evidence that didn't fit in with the inside job narrative.

A couple of years ago the last niggling doubt was taken away from me when I saw the NY Fire Brigade's video of bdg 7 from the back, and it was clearly about to fall, unlike the front view which we see all the time.

Though I do still leave the possibility 9/11 was criminal negligence, i.e. someone new the attack was coming and ignored it.

Or they simply missed it, who knows?

The point is, both you and I were prepared to question our beliefs, whereas today we live in an era whereby people are not prepared to do that because they believe that everything that is from the official narrative is BS, whether that be government, media, or science, it's all lies regardless of evidence.



I'd go even further and say that conspiracy theory is the religion for the atheist, just like in religion there is a powerful force that has a hidden plan that we can never figure out. Also like religion, there is a lot of doomsday worship, the end is nigh and all that sort of thing.

I wrote an article on it once if you're interested.



Did he quote on this post? I can't find his comment if he did, I was wondering what his contribution would be :)
Could have sworn it was @lowtek but I don't see it. Maybe it was somewhere else he said it, or maybe he didn't say it at all, and here I am mis-attributing something in a discussion about cognitive bias. Watch your head spin on that one, pal :rofl:
 

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Could have sworn it was @lowtek but I don't see it. Maybe it was somewhere else he said it, or maybe he didn't say it at all, and here I am mis-attributing something in a discussion about cognitive bias. Watch your head spin on that one, pal :rofl:
lol I think you put words in my mouth :D

It's ok, I'll weigh in later.
 

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This happen with my Nurse Aide Certificate. I believe otherwise if there isn't something in it for both sides, there's not point in getting yourself into large debt for the sake of impressing people.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMk7CKwJ8OM


This is the kind of stuff people are getting into. I thought I had debt, and I have nothing compared to some people. You're basically becoming a slave to debt these days with Student Loans.
OMG, that video puts my mouth on the ground. Apparently 2 advanced degrees didn't give them any common financial sense. 300K in student loans, 200k credit cards, nearly a $1M in debts and not even 30 yet.

So you spent a half million dollars on an "education" and clearly NO PART of that education taught you how to manage money. Is school the answer here? Apparently not.

But gawd damn, I bet they have an awesome set of new BMWs and a nicely furnished home, compliments of Restoration Hardware...
 
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So you spent a half million dollars on an "education" and clearly NO PART of that education taught you how to manage money. Is school the answer here? Apparently not.
Correlation not causation, this is not a typical case, and let's face it being good with money has less to do with whether you went to university than how you've been scripted as you grow up.

Though maybe it should...
 

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School is great for everything except an education.

I can't even remember half the stuff I did and most of what I 'learnt' is useless now.

Its great for social/communications skills, dealing with difficult/SHTF situations, how to deal with dickheads effectively, how to make friends and much more.

In my opinion, school didn't teach me two of the most important skills in life:

1 - How to learn.
2 - How to deal with failure.
 

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I think you did those kids a disservice. You just hammered another indoctrination into them, saying think like me, not like them. How about encouraging them to think for themselves? Instead you more or less ridiculed them. It's embarrassing.
Kinda hard to pull people out of the matrix. A bit of shock and maybe they will remember it.
 

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OK, so some points - my own rant incoming.

Nobody doubts climate change. It's ironic that in a rant about a lack of critical thinking you fail to accurately characterize the perspectives of those you are demeaning. To be precise, what people doubt is a) the idea that those of us in the free world that are already leading the way in sustainable living should be forced to subsidize the pollution of the developing world and b) that government can be trusted to mitigate global warming, given their dismal track record in reducing drug use, poverty, crime, terrorism, illiteracy, etc.and c) that the proposed carbon taxes won't have an immediate negative impact on those that are least able to deal with it.

What you call a dismissal of expert opinion is in fact people wising up to the fact that science isn't some noble profession. Everybody has an agenda, even scientists. In a field where you are funded by the government, those that argue for restrictions on government power are going to have a hard time being heard. Even more ironic, the same lay people who cry out about denying the "settled science of global warming" are often those who deny the reality of biology, i.e. that there are only two genders or that evolution applies to humans just as much as any other animal.

All that said, I do agree with you on your fundamental premise: we do need more critical thinking. The modern university system is not the place to do that, however.

Here in the States, we have crammed more and more people into the universities (funded by the same government that wants to tax the very air we breathe)... and yet, by your own admission, critical thinking is in the toilets. While correlation may not be causation, it's a pretty big coincidence that people are dumber than ever, while record numbers of them are going to universities.

If universities were so great at instilling critical thought, I would expect the opposite trend.
 

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OMG, that video puts my mouth on the ground. Apparently 2 advanced degrees didn't give them any common financial sense. 300K in student loans, 200k credit cards, nearly a $1M in debts and not even 30 yet.

So you spent a half million dollars on an "education" and clearly NO PART of that education taught you how to manage money. Is school the answer here? Apparently not.

But gawd damn, I bet they have an awesome set of new BMWs and a nicely furnished home, compliments of Restoration Hardware...
Oh...I love listening to that show about how stupid people are and how much debt they have. I am on the feed in Facebook as well. I do laugh though, because they're even stupid about how to budget their money, what should they sacrifice, and how to sacrifice.

For example: My coffee pot broke. Should I take it out of my emergency fund? I rolled my eyes. My response to them myself. "There's these places called second hand shops, yard sales, garage sales, and even if you can find Millennial's recycling stuff on face book in your local community.

Now first of all, a coffee pot doesn't cost that much at the regular store, and you should just be able to afford that out of your own grocery budget. Not a huge expense, but if you're where you need problem shoot there are alternatives.

Another example: Should we spend some of our wedding budget to pay for a lawyer for my fiances child, because it takes all our wedding money, and I won't have a nice wedding if we have to do go through with this custody battle.
I rolled my eyes, I'm like you can have a wedding ceremony any year of your life. The child obviously needs her father to do what's right, and family lasts long-term versus a wedding ceremony for a day. And explained you can use your $10,000 dollars for your wedding ceremony, and also spend another $10,000 dollars on a divorce lawyer a year from now if your relationship doesn't work out, because nothing is written in stone. Which is the better investment your fiances daughter that lasts a lifetime or your wedding ceremony?
 

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Ok, fair enough rant, while i agree on 1-2 points, i’ll prove that you didn’t prove shit.

First, ask yourself why people doubt vaccines, moon landing , and a shit ton of other things ? I’ll open your eyes. Because the US government is by far the BIGGEST liar, the US empire has been telling lies and creating false flags, bombing countries( libya, egypt, syria, irak and many others ) bombing their own citizens ( 9/11 ), ( pizzagate ) , ( funding and protecting ISIS ) , + a shit ton of other UGLY and INHUMAN things the US government did since it existed, that will make any SANE person doubt whether they really landed on the moon or if vaccines are really that safe( NO conspiracy theories here, plain TRUTH). You got to be with your eyes closed and living under a rock, NOT seeing all this.

Why people start doubting a lot of science and stuff ? Because the evil government we all know(backed by the highest elite), which overthrows any government it doesn’t agree with (countries who leave the petrodollar), also BACKS UP science, thus creating confusion what is actually real and what is not. If you still trust your own government after all the bullshit it has done in the world, in africa, in middle east, after all its done with american citizens themselves, if you STILL trust anything these F*ckers say, then you, my friend, are brainwashed. And school system is also backed up by government. So no, F*ck your school and F*ck your government ran institutions, i’d rather not be brainwashed by these F*ckers. In fact, in 2019, if you're informed about whats going on ( not tv ), you just can't deny most conspiracy theories, because, guess what, most turned out true.
 
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Nobody doubts climate change.
"Climate change is fake science, carbon dioxide is the building blocks of life" (sic)

Donald J. Trump 45th President of the United States of America.

I rest my case your honour.

or that evolution applies to humans just as much as any other animal.
It does (or rather did), though I am open to you showing me how it doesn't.

All that said, I do agree with you on your fundamental premise: we do need more critical thinking. The modern university system is not the place to do that, however.
Even in the STEM subjects?

First, ask yourself why people doubt vaccines, moon landing , and a shit ton of other things ? I’ll open your eyes. Because the US government is by far the BIGGEST liar,
That's my point, just because the government has lied before, does not mean that they lie on everything, this is where critical thinking comes in.

Like for instance the moon landings were tracked by thousands of non-US residents around the world, and vaccines have been in use for decades in practically every country on earth and there have been a plethora of studies backed by a multitude of organisations. Leaving the reasoned thinker to come to the conclusion that America did put people on the moon, and vaccines are safe for 99% of people.


I suppose my whole point is, that the prevailing view of school's a waste of time, is dripping down to the secondary (high) schools and thus they just believe that it's all a waste of time and leave with just about enough cognitive ability to keep them alive.

It's a multi-faceted problem basically, and it's not just as simple as schools are crap or parents need to do more
 

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Ok, fair enough rant, while i agree on 1-2 points, i’ll prove that you didn’t prove shit.

First, ask yourself why people doubt vaccines, moon landing , and a shit ton of other things ? I’ll open your eyes. Because the US government is by far the BIGGEST liar, the US empire has been telling lies and creating false flags, bombing countries( libya, egypt, syria, irak and many others ) bombing their own citizens ( 9/11 ), ( pizzagate ) , ( funding and protecting ISIS ) , + a shit ton of other UGLY and INHUMAN things the US government did since it existed, that will make any SANE person doubt whether they really landed on the moon or if vaccines are really that safe( NO conspiracy theories here, plain TRUTH). You got to be with your eyes closed and living under a rock, NOT seeing all this.
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Why people start doubting a lot of science and stuff ? Because the evil government we all know(backed by the highest elite), which overthrows any government it doesn’t agree with (countries who leave the petrodollar), also BACKS UP science, thus creating confusion what is actually real and what is not. If you still trust your own government after all the bullshit it has done in the world, in africa, in middle east, after all its done with american citizens themselves, if you STILL trust anything these F*ckers say, then you, my friend, are brainwashed. And school system is also backed up by government. So no, F*ck your school and F*ck your government ran institutions, i’d rather not be brainwashed by these F*ckers. In fact, in 2019, if you're informed about whats going on ( not tv ), you just can't deny most conspiracy theories, because, guess what, most turned out true.
Every time I hear something like this there is half truths. A lot of anger, resentment, bitterness, hate, and blame.
The trouble about this whole picture is there is always a - and + charge or side to social issues, social problems, belief systems, theories, concepts, and ideas.
You can be brain washed by any social group if you hang around the group long enough on the macro and micro level. You have business, social, and spiritual entrepreneurs with three different agendas in society and culture.

There are Villains and Hero's in every social clash, generation, and ethical and unethical masculine and feminine with or without finances. Power and Greed is in every social class.

For example: I can go hang out in the hood, become a gang member, learn the rules of social group, the way they talk, act, join their lifestyle, be packing with guns, be the Queen of the pack, have some pimps, get high, hustle off stealing, vandalizing, conquering territory, order people around, kill people to boost my ego, paint tear drops and other marks on my body. Justify my mentality, actions, thoughts, emotions, and rule a whole neighborhood with some thug that things he is a bad a$$ and King.

Not my style personally, but just making a point. You can be the boss of a company and treat all your employers like crap.

Human Nature is Complex. And of course every feminine and masculine makes their choice what kind of social groups they hang out in, what belief system they buy into, and they all have a choice how they use their money, power, and whether they're generous or greedy in every social class.

You have hoarders in every social class and social group that drain resources.

I don't watch television and I rarely listen to the news. I don't work for the government. And fortunately, if you had no civil services, you'd have the "Wild West" of murder, thieves, looting, domestic violence, riots, more social issues and social problems then we already do.

Violence is a major issue whether you have money or not. Every person has power and control issues. Even you. No one is exempt.

Through the Centuries History repeats the same mistakes.

Everyone wants to start and external revolution or war with someone else. It's maturity, growth, and wisdom to understand what you can't control and what you can control in society. The Internal Revolution is breaking out of your self-made prison of distorted belief systems, theories, concepts, and not spreading any more distorted views. The war within self is far more dangerous to society. When you are at war with yourself, is when you become the guy who you're trying to describe as the most "Powerful of the Elite" and destroys humanity like "Hitler" perhaps.

He was the brain washing expert and pulled it off. One of the most destructive human beings on the planet and had others who held a similar belief system which was quite distorted.

It happens, but it took the world to stop him from doing anymore damage to society, culture, and humanity.

There is ugliness in the world. There is also beauty. There is a lot of powerful people improving society at the same time. There is always balance.

Let's not lump everyone in the same lump of clay. We're all innovators, creators, inventors, and focusing on the negatives doesn't improve society.
 

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It depends on what you mean my school. If by school, you mean High School. I agree. If by school you mean college. I disagree.

You state that flat-earthers and anti-vax individuals are dumb because they don't go to college. This may be true. It may be false.

I do present to you... the average college student. Who believes that men/women can magically change their sex/gender just by their mere thought... or from some surgery. It take a college degree to not understand how biology works.

College is a major waste of time. I'd be hard pressed to find a college that actually teaches critical thinking. I am graduating with my Doctorates degree in 1 week. I can tell you that my critical thinking was never challenged in any of my undergraduate classes.

Learning is important, I just think it is naive to think you can only continue to learn by going to college. People are capable of reading any book. Scour the internet. Want to learn to critically reason? There are Youtube channels, books, and even college professors on Youtube that will teach you without the extraordinary cost and all at the comfort of your home.
 

dknise

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OP's post reached epic levels of cognitive dissonance.

There are millions of people who believe we never went to the moon.

...they do not have the intellectual wherewithal to question their own beliefs.
Person that doesn't believe we went to the moon questioned their belief we went to the moon...
OP believes we went to the moon. Never questioned their belief.

Well now we have got to a head where the freaking President of the United Freaking States of America believes that climate change is fake science and that noise causes cancer.
The freaking President of the United Freaking States of America questioned the status quo of climate change and relatively new, 5G.
OP does not question status quo climate change or 5G.

OP states that POTUS "believes that climate change is fake"...
OP doesn't seem to understand the complexity of climate change vs prominent man-made global warming as a sole factor, and thus can't understand other's questioning of the subject.

This is not a political post, I don't care what you think about Trump or any of the issues mentioned thus far.
*Shares political opinions*
OP: But hey, this isn't a political post (aka. don't tell me your politics, I'm the only one that can do that)

What I do care about, is the general inability of the mass populace to come to their own informed decisions via an Occam's inspired route paved with reason
*Regurgitates mainstream beliefs without question*
OP: Yeah man, people just don't question their beliefs.

Sure school probably won't teach you how to ... [xyz]

What it will do is (hopefully) give you a blueprint for reasoned thinking...
In my experience (anecdotal evidence, same as yours), people that come from school specifically don't know how to think. If I have a new college hire on my team and they liked their schooling, I know with certainty that I can't give them anything outside of their current knowledge domain. Otherwise, they're lost looking for a hand to hold because they'll have no idea how to acquire the information without a teacher.

Hey, do what you want, however my child is being taught the importance of education
Hey, do what you want, however as long as we're being pretentious, my child is being taught the importance of knowledge and the joy of learning. Not parroting what authority figures say.

at least three times a week we see young people coming on here and they're all excited after reading Unscripted or The Millionaire Fastlane and they're like that's it, F*ck it, I quit!
I dropped out of college after one year on a full-ride scholarship in 2009. TMF didn't come out until 2011 and during those two years, I was flying blind. At the time, believing that the quality of a college education had declined was an extremely unpopular opinion. It wasn't until several years ago that people started to notice, but I saw it all a decade ago. Besides Steve Job's Stanford commencement speech in 2007, TMF was the first book where I could look at my life arc and pinpoint on a journey where I was on it and see that I was on the right track.

I don't have a degree. I dropped out a decade ago. I've now sold a software business, sold several other software products, bought a $100k boat in cash, bought a condo, and am in the process of building a $1m new construction home, and I'm only 29. Being 29, I still have friends who went to college for their degree or masters and are still living at home with their parents. They call me lucky and I see with open eyes that they are completely ill-equipped for life.

So my final self-righteous conclusion:

Question everything.
Question school. Question the moon landing. Question vaccines. Question the president. Question climate change. Question reality. Question it all.

If the earth's obviously round, you have nothing to fear with asking the question.
If we obviously went to the moon, you have nothing to fear with asking the question.
If man-made global warming is the sole driving force of climate change, you have nothing to fear with asking the question.
 
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MJ DeMarco

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OK, so some points - my own rant incoming.

Nobody doubts climate change. It's ironic that in a rant about a lack of critical thinking you fail to accurately characterize the perspectives of those you are demeaning. To be precise, what people doubt is a) the idea that those of us in the free world that are already leading the way in sustainable living should be forced to subsidize the pollution of the developing world and b) that government can be trusted to mitigate global warming, given their dismal track record in reducing drug use, poverty, crime, terrorism, illiteracy, etc.and c) that the proposed carbon taxes won't have an immediate negative impact on those that are least able to deal with it.

What you call a dismissal of expert opinion is in fact people wising up to the fact that science isn't some noble profession. Everybody has an agenda, even scientists. In a field where you are funded by the government, those that argue for restrictions on government power are going to have a hard time being heard. Even more ironic, the same lay people who cry out about denying the "settled science of global warming" are often those who deny the reality of biology, i.e. that there are only two genders or that evolution applies to humans just as much as any other animal.

All that said, I do agree with you on your fundamental premise: we do need more critical thinking. The modern university system is not the place to do that, however.

Here in the States, we have crammed more and more people into the universities (funded by the same government that wants to tax the very air we breathe)... and yet, by your own admission, critical thinking is in the toilets. While correlation may not be causation, it's a pretty big coincidence that people are dumber than ever, while record numbers of them are going to universities.

If universities were so great at instilling critical thought, I would expect the opposite trend.
What he said.

I don't have a degree. I dropped out a decade ago. I've now sold a software business, sold several other software products, bought a $100k boat in cash, bought a condo, and am in the process of building a $1m new construction home, and I'm only 29. Being 29, I still have friends who went to college for their degree or masters and are still living at home with their parents. They call me lucky and I see with open eyes that they are completely ill-equipped for life.

So my final self-righteous conclusion:

Question everything.
Question school. Question the moon landing. Question vaccines. Question the president. Question climate change. Question reality. Question it all.

If the earth's obviously round, you have nothing to fear with asking the question.
If we obviously went to the moon, you have nothing to fear with asking the question.
If man-made global warming is the sole driving force of climate change, you have nothing to fear with asking the question.
Great ending to a great post. Rep+
 

Avalokite

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Classic example of identifying problems (people can't think critically!) but potentially misidentifying the solution (go to school!)

Is there a widespread trend of young adults who are dropping out of high school and college? And now we have this problem? Or is "school" as popular as it ever has been?

What if school is actually the problem which you cite as the solution?

IMO, school is NOT the answer, but parenting (as you have demonstrated).
school vs parenting...that's the topic here. I am a teacher and a parent. I see the failings of system from within, and yes it is failing to engage students. Yet on a daily basis I try toengage my high school students to think about what they want,how they can achieve this, getting them to question their own beliefs and that of others. I ask them how are they going to be different from the millions? what need to they see out there that they can fill? you would think this would create a great debate and discussion, and with a few kids yes, lots of questions inside and outside the class, yet sadly most of the time it met with a wall of apathy. I see my students for 3 hrs a week. I try best to inspire them to want more from themselves,the value of focused work. yet i have 3 hrs with them. where do they learn and develop their attitudes and habits, where they spend most of their time at home. this is where kids learn their mindset. school can be blamed for lots of failings, I understand that, but it's not the only place the finger of blame should be pointed. going to school, while not perfect, if you are willing to learn,will help set students up with a enough understanding to spring board them into their chosen path. the attitudes learnt else where will give them the incentive to learn.

just my view on schooling .
 

apacini

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So my final self-righteous conclusion:

Question everything.
Question school. Question the moon landing. Question vaccines. Question the president. Question climate change. Question reality. Question it all.

If the earth's obviously round, you have nothing to fear with asking the question.
If we obviously went to the moon, you have nothing to fear with asking the question.
If man-made global warming is the sole driving force of climate change, you have nothing to fear with asking the question.
If you understand the topic it is always advisable to question and this is how science goes forward.
Questioning vaccines without a sound knowledge in biology is like building a car without a knowledge of mechanics, maybe you forget to fit the brakes. It could be a Darwin award, or it could be an homicide.

A degree in engineering or in a hard science [generally] brings the ability to understand your own ignorance, which is the first step in critical thinking. If it is wrong, an hard science will prove you wrong, but this requires the ability to see the proof. When you learn this, you are able also to continue learning by yourself.
Again with the car example, if after the crash I blame the wind or someone that crossed the road, maybe the cause-effect relation is a bit weak.

There are problems that are more complex and abstract and therefore are counter-intuitive for a human being, partly because they are not visible. They require mathematical thinking, modelling, abstraction, approximations, analogies, ..., which means critical thinking is at its finest.
How can you deal with magnetic fields? Propagating waves and standing waves in guided structures?
Can you learn this by yourself? Probably yes, as it was done in the '800s for wealthy people. But you need access to a knowledge with a High Signal to Noise Ratio (SNR), which is provided by someone with a knowledge in the field (usually a professor, scientist, ...). Accessing a Low Signal to Noise source as internet will give a very high source of errors and therefore disbelief, if you are not trained on how to increase this SNR.

Money and religion (and laws) are not a source of truth, even if many are convinced of the contrary.
Giving a billion to gravity will not make you fly like a bird, unless you use those money to develop a plane.
 
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dknise

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If you understand the topic it is always advisable to question and this is how science goes forward.
Questioning vaccines without a sound knowledge in biology is like building a car without a knowledge of mechanics, maybe you forget to fit the brakes. It could be a Darwin award, or it could be an homicide.
I still think everyone should question everything.

When I was 19, I blew out the L4-L5 disc in my back resulting in half a decade of brutal pain. I ended up getting back surgery, but I didn't choose the first surgeon I met. If I had listened to him, my physician, and physical therapist, I would have a foot long piece of metal drilled into my spine right now. Instead, I went and got three more doctors opinions until I found a neurosurgeon who gave me hope. I went with her. I'm now pain free.

Two years ago I landed in the flats wakeboarding and instantly knew I had res lipped a disc but I didn't know how bad. When I went in, I pretty much told the doctor I had slipped a disc. He disagreed. I asked for an MRI but he was insistent that I didn't need one. I finally got one because I agreed that if I didn't need one, I would have to pay the full bill (like $1500). Sure enough, I had slipped 8 discs in my back. Same doctor then wanted to prescribe me a maximum dose of oxy codone. I told him to shove it, restarted my physical therapy program, and started doing float tanks. My theory was that I had had spinal decompression surgery. I likely compressed it again and at the very least, I could take the pressure off my back for 90 minutes twice a week. Well, 3 months later I was pain free. I went in for a follow up MRI and to all of our utter surprise, I was completely healed.

If I listened to "experts," I would quite literally be a doped up cyborg unable to make eye contact or walk without a cane.

Ray Dalio talks about triangulating opinions with multiple parties. He also did it with doctors who disgreed.

So I would still say, question everything!
 

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I'm not saying that it's this way for all colleges/universities. But, I spent a year taking a general business program in college. I felt like I was surrounded by people who weren't concerned about their future, people who only wanted to party. My classes felt really outdated, especially in marketing.

I always felt like my courses geared towards us memorizing outdated facts for a test, then repeating the process. I very rarely would find valuable information that I knew was needed for my future. I do think the accounting course was the only useful course but other than that it was a bunch of bs.

I'm not saying that it's this way for all colleges/universities. But it didn't teach any real world practical stuff. Now, I've always considered myself a self-dialect, and I really believe that's the way to go for entrepreneurs.
 

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This is a very interesting post that I've thought for some time. I'm going to tell you the truth about conspiracy people, most have college degrees (cue evil music). Sure, some toothless hick might believe in vaccines causing autism or chem trails or whatever, but a good number are college bound or college educated.

This is for a few reasons:

1) The ability to wrap your mind around a conspiracy generally takes a level of abstract thinking. That's why the toothless hick example is kind of just a bugaboo (I would argue most conspiracy theorists are in the 100-120 IQ range). The reality is many take high levels of complex thinking (doesn't mean they are right though).

2) The feeling of general intelligence and moral righteousness people receiving from knowing the "truth" vs. all those "idiotic masses"

3) Non-Stop Internet addiction and scrolling and obsession leading to boredom and eventually delving into these conspiracies

4) The general feeling that life sucks and it's someone else's fault (because why take responsibility when that's hard)

5) Isolation and alienation

Let me state that I don't believe in virtually any conspiracies. Mostly due to the fact I think through it carefully, Occam's razor as stated earlier in the thread. The problem is conspiracy thinking is that it is also a black hole, you believe in one and it sucks you in. If you believe 9/11 was a conspiracy, you're far more likely to believe the CIA shot JFK and then vaccines cause autism and so on and so on. I've seen so many people, mostly likable internet personalities fall face first into this trap. They become the most insufferable assholes imaginable and don't realize how stupid they sound. I can hardly listen to anyone anymore. It's like every thunderstorm starts with a rain drop.

If it keeps going they start to doubt the fabric of being and reality itself. This is when they start talking about aliens, magic, the occult, and other fanciful bs. And like a depressed person pushing good people out of their life, the conspiracy theorists will eventually accomplish the same. Until their lives are a nightmare of their own creation. A conspiracy against themselves.

Read number #4 again carefully. See even if you knew it was 100% true, you can't do anything. You're powerless to effect meaningful change socially or politically on it. Therefore it makes you weak and helpless.

As for the college thing, look guy, everyone goes to college now. I've met dumb people with no college who worked hard and became successful. But virtually every dumb and lazy person I've ever met has a college degree and will never go anywhere. If college was so great, do you think we would have lawyers, congressmen, judges, and government officials of such shockingly low character and integrity? With no sense of honor or even a good grip on their jobs' requirements? By your deeds you shall know them, look what American universities have produced.

From what I've seen with my college experience, for 95% of people, college isn't the start of critical thinking, it's the end of it.
 
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