OPEN INVITATION - Please find my flaws and shoot me down in flames

[RazorCut]

<div class="bbWrapper">Ok I have a question for you to find flaws in and shoot me down in flames.<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> Quite a few years ago I had a eureka moment when I thought of a way to improve an everyday consumable product by changing its packaging structure. I tested my theory out and low and behold the benefits I expected worked. It significantly extended the longevity of the product, made it easier to store and also easier to dispose of afterwards (fully recyclable). However back then I was sceptical of the facilities to create the packaging both in terms of design and ability to create it in quantity. Things have moved on a lot since then both in terms of manufacturing and in the available range of suitable product materials.<br /> <br /> Anyway I am relooking at this concept. As stated it provides 3 major benefits to the consumer and would be the biggest change to the product in more than 50 years. The small circle of people I have shared this with have been extremely enthusiastic and think it is a fantastic idea. Now I know that is no validation in itself but I didn’t big it up, I just stated ‘what if product A could now do da da and da, would you consider that worth paying extra for?’ ‘Would you be inclined to try it even if you were a fan of brand B?’<br /> <br /> Now here is my question. There are lots of large businesses in this marketplace but it is dominated, (as so often happens) by 2 major players. Bitter head to head rivals, each with an annual turnover in excess of $7-$10 billion.<br /> <br /> Now I am thinking of approaching one of these colossal companies with my idea once I have put some protection into place (I had a company do a patent search last year and there seems to be nothing in this specific design).<br /> <br /> The instant benefits my concept would give their customers would offer a major marketing advantage over their rival. So much so I would even dare to suggest that one company would have to invest in the idea even if they never used it just to ensure their rival couldn’t get access to it.<br /> <br /> There are some great minds here so I throw it open to you. So, in my position, what would YOU do and how would you go about it?<br /> <br /> I know it is probably very unlikely that I could get a dialogue opened up with a major corp but I have to do something. If you can shoot me down in flames please go ahead as one way of another I need to put this thing to bed or put it on a fast track as it continues to haunt me.<br /> <br /> Probably right up <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/1735/" class="username" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" data-user-id="1735" data-username="@StephenKey">@StephenKey</a> alley if he is checking the forums currently.</div>

 

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[Mr.B]

<div class="bbWrapper"><a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/23242/" class="username" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" data-user-id="23242" data-username="@RazorCut">@RazorCut</a> it seems like a solid idea and a smart way of approaching it. Once you have the proper protections in place, you may find that using LinkedIn to research the relevant people you need to speak with in each company will help. You&#039;ll be amazed how much easier it is to get past the gatekeeper if you know the name of the person you want to speak with (rather than just their title/dept).</div>

 

[RazorCut]

<div class="bbWrapper">Excellent idea. Thanks <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/27336/" class="username" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" data-user-id="27336" data-username="@Mr.B">@Mr.B</a></div>

 

[merc]

<div class="bbWrapper">Why do you think the 2 major players who have billions have not implemented or experimented with this idea yet to crush their rival?<br /> <br /> Also, how much research have you actually done yourself on the patent process?</div>

 

[JPHerrmann]

<div class="bbWrapper"><a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/23242/" class="username" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" data-user-id="23242" data-username="@RazorCut">@RazorCut</a> I like your enthusiasm to jump into this industry! But, many times, we have a great innovation that we think people will bow to us for. <br /> What I mean is, Companies are not looking for outside innovators to just give them an idea for packaging. <br /> <br /> First off, Don&#039;t go it alone. You NEED to have a team to represent anything if you are trying to impress big guys. Angels, CEO&#039;s, etc.. don&#039;t feel too secure when dealing with a one man army. If you are going to present a BIG idea to BIG companies, you need look like you run a tight ship.<br /> <br /> You should have a team of people that are representing said product, you need to do the market research, the product testing, financial predictions for their production, patents, potential competition to your product, and how its going to save them money. These companies don&#039;t want to do the research to see if this idea is good or not. <br /> <br /> Also, if you want to get your product to market right away, try selling this idea to packaging companies or small manufacturing companies, that can immediately implement your product. With billion dollar companies that have a heavily synchronized supply chain that move hundreds of millions of products a day, they might not want to take a chance and damage their supply chain by &quot;Testing&quot; their new marginally better packaging. <br /> <br /> You have to work your way up. Start with small companies that can prove your products and then the billion dollar companies will contact YOU to use this revolutionary product that will save them money. <br /> <br /> Its easy to come up with a million dollar Idea. But companies just don&#039;t buy ideas often, they buy proven businesses and products that have had success. <br /> <br /> I hope this helps and people chime in to add upon it, If you think you have an Idea, GO FOR IT! Make it Happen! <br /> <br /> C&#039;mon, how nice would it be to go to the store and see YOUR packaging on their products? Yea. <br /> <br /> JPH</div>

 

[RazorCut]

<div class="bbWrapper"><blockquote data-attributes="member: 24034" data-quote="merc" data-source="post: 423891" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=423891" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-423891">merc said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> Why do you think the 2 major players who have billions have not implemented or experimented with this idea yet to crush their rival?<br /> <br /> Also, how much research have you actually done yourself on the patent process? </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> Good questions. I think sometimes companies are too close to their product so see it from odd perspectives (and I&#039;m pretty odd <img src="/community/imgs/emoticons/em-wink.png" class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" data-shortname=";)" />). In some ways they may have overlooked it as they feel the disadvantage to the consumer is an advantage to them as it means the customer needs to throw out the product sooner than they could and replace it. Meaning ultimately more profit for them of course. <br /> <br /> However I think the main reason is that it is not a logical one step progression. It is more like several leaps that makes it so much harder to come up with in the first place. Talking to people about the idea and talking about the specific benefits they still couldn&#039;t guess how it was achieved.<br /> <br /> You may well be right and their may be a patent for it. I have done quite a bit of searching myself and also employed a company to do a search on my behalf and they have come up with patents that outwardly look similar but lack the key area that makes the whole thing work. Only time will tell I guess.</div>

 

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[RazorCut]

<div class="bbWrapper">Thanks <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/28213/" class="username" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" data-user-id="28213" data-username="@JPHerrmann">@JPHerrmann</a>, a lot of good advice there. I totally get where you are coming from and for the most part totally agree. I have to contact a suitable packaging manufacturer anyway to ensure it can in fact be made economically and in volume but will need some protection first.<br /> <br /> The reason I think there is a chance one of the big players would consider it is the possible leverage that exists due to the possibility that if they don&#039;t consider it their main rival could potentially take it up. I could certainly approach a small manufacture and see what interest I can drum up. <br /> <br /> As you say it would be difficult for a big corp to take a one man band seriously. It would have to be a team effort. It would be worth the work however. Sometimes you get lucky, sometimes it&#039;s persistence and sometimes it&#039;s timing. If you don&#039;t try you never know.</div>

 

[MJ DeMarco]

<div class="bbWrapper"><blockquote data-attributes="member: 23242" data-quote="RazorCut" data-source="post: 424001" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=424001" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-424001">RazorCut said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> I think sometimes companies are too close to their product so see it from odd perspectives </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> True for pretty much everything, authors, business owners, etc.<br /> <br /> <blockquote data-attributes="member: 23242" data-quote="RazorCut" data-source="post: 423883" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=423883" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-423883">RazorCut said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> So, in my position, what would YOU do and how would you go about it? </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> Definitely learn the ins-and-outs of patents, licensing, and process, and yea, Stephen Key&#039;s books would be a great start. Kinda hard to go into any detail without knowing the product solution, industry, and the players involved.<br /> <br /> The idea as you describe seems like winner. No need to &quot;shoot you down&quot; in flames.</div>

 

[RazorCut]

<div class="bbWrapper"><div style="margin-left: 20px">Thanks MJ, always appreciate your insights. If you want to PM me with a way to connect with you I&#039;ll give you more info as well as the industry and players.<br /> <br /> I have read Stephen Key&#039;s book, have the audio version too and have listened to his interviews on various podcasts. I know he recommends not pitching to the Goliath&#039;s out there as they are obviously a tough nut to crack but with two huge rivals the devil in me thinks one of them would have to blink as why risk their biggest competitor taking up the option and using it against them? They could just acquire it and then sit on it and see the purchase as an insurance policy if they wanted to.<br />&#8203;</div></div>

 

[tafy]

<div class="bbWrapper">Patent it in the UK and USA, try and license it. Maybe hire a middleman/broker?<br /> <br /> You could just go with USA Patent Pending, then they cant even see the patent to rip it off.</div>

 

[miked_d]

<div class="bbWrapper"><blockquote data-attributes="member: 17840" data-quote="tafy" data-source="post: 424020" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=424020" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-424020">tafy said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> Patent it in the UK and USA, try and license it. Maybe hire a middleman/broker?<br /> <br /> You could just go with USA Patent Pending, then they cant even see the patent to rip it off. </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/get-a-provisional-utility-patent-for-65.56064/#post-410725" class="link link--internal">Provisional Utility Patent</a> in US. <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/5468/" class="username" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" data-user-id="5468" data-username="@Likwid24">@Likwid24</a> went this route as described on <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/8202/" class="username" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" data-user-id="8202" data-username="@Vigilante">@Vigilante</a>&#039;s <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/vigilantes-mind-your-business-radio-show.55657/" class="link link--internal">MYB Radio Show</a>.</div>

 

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[Mr.B]

<div class="bbWrapper"><blockquote data-attributes="member: 23242" data-quote="RazorCut" data-source="post: 424019" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=424019" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-424019">RazorCut said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> I know he recommends not pitching to the Goliath&#039;s out there as they are obviously a tough nut to crack but with two huge rivals the devil in me thinks one of them would have to blink as why risk their biggest competitor taking up the option and using it against them? They could just acquire it and then sit on it and see the purchase as an insurance policy if they wanted to. </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> This makes me think that you might be better targeting the third largest player in this industry as this is the kind of innovation that can help them compete with the big boys. They are also likely to be a lot hungrier...</div>

 

[Silverhawk851]

<div class="bbWrapper">Is there no way you can launch it yourself, to get some sales under your belt, some growth statistics and then let the success make enough noise to make them come to you ?<br /> <br /> If it&#039;s something that you can sell online... it&#039;s quite easy to gain alot of traction real fast with a good product<br /> <br /> Alot easier negotiating when your numbers make people&#039;s eyes water.</div>

 

[RazorCut]

<div class="bbWrapper"><blockquote data-attributes="member: 17840" data-quote="tafy" data-source="post: 424020" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=424020" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-424020">tafy said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> Patent it in the UK and USA, try and license it. Maybe hire a middleman/broker?<br /> You could just go with USA Patent Pending, then they cant even see the patent to rip it off. </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> Thanks, <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/20539/" class="username" data-xf-init="member-tooltip" data-user-id="20539" data-username="@firmwear">@firmwear</a> provided me with some excellent help regarding US Patent searches and applications so I was going to go down that route. UK is a great idea too. Will have to look into the broker/middleman idea. I guess there must be specialists out there that deal in this field.</div>

 

[RazorCut]

<div class="bbWrapper"><blockquote data-attributes="member: 1859" data-quote="miked_d" data-source="post: 424070" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=424070" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-424070">miked_d said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/get-a-provisional-utility-patent-for-65.56064/#post-410725" class="link link--internal">Provisional Utility Patent</a> in US. <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/5468/" class="link link--internal">@Likwid24</a> went this route as described on <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/members/8202/" class="link link--internal">@Vigilante</a>&#039;s <a href="https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/community/threads/vigilantes-mind-your-business-radio-show.55657/" class="link link--internal">MYB Radio Show</a>. </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> Thanks for the tip. Will check it out now.</div>

 

[RazorCut]

<div class="bbWrapper"><blockquote data-attributes="member: 27336" data-quote="Mr.B" data-source="post: 424136" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=424136" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-424136">Mr.B said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> This makes me think that you might be better targeting the third largest player in this industry as this is the kind of innovation that can help them compete with the big boys. They are also likely to be a lot hungrier... </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> Unfortunately the 3rd would be so far behind they are a speck in the mirrors of the two main players.</div>

 

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[RazorCut]

<div class="bbWrapper"><blockquote data-attributes="member: 12104" data-quote="Silverhawk851" data-source="post: 424157" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=424157" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-424157">Silverhawk851 said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> Is there no way you can launch it yourself, to get some sales under your belt, some growth statistics and then let the success make enough noise to make them come to you ?<br /> <br /> If it&#039;s something that you can sell online... it&#039;s quite easy to gain alot of traction real fast with a good product<br /> <br /> Alot easier negotiating when your numbers make people&#039;s eyes water. </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> <br /> Unfortunately not. I would need a similar product to put into the packaging and a market for it. Not really viable to sell over the Web either as this product is probably available in every Supermarket and general store in every country on earth.</div>

 

[firmwear]

<div class="bbWrapper"><blockquote data-attributes="member: 23242" data-quote="RazorCut" data-source="post: 423883" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-title"> <a href="/community/goto/post?id=423883" class="bbCodeBlock-sourceJump" rel="nofollow" data-xf-click="attribution" data-content-selector="#post-423883">RazorCut said:</a> </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-content"> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandContent js-expandContent "> So, in my position, what would YOU do and how would you go about it?<br /> <br /> I know it is probably very unlikely that I could get a dialogue opened up with a major corp but I have to do something. If you can shoot me down in flames please go ahead as one way of another I need to put this thing to bed or put it on a fast track as it continues to haunt me. </div> <div class="bbCodeBlock-expandLink js-expandLink"><a role="button" tabindex="0">Click to expand...</a></div> </div> </blockquote><br /> Here&#039;s my flamethrower (and just guessing around):<br /> 1) In organizations that large, it will be hard to find a drone that can actually take your idea and do something with it.<br /> 2) Some companies like GE or Rubbermaid have some kind of idea submission webpage. If either of the companies you are thinking of do not, I would also try to find similar companies with some kind of procedure already in place for accepting outside ideas.<br /> 3) If one of the companies you are targeting buys your invention just to keep it out of circulation, you will not get nearly as much money as you would if you had successfully brought it to market some other way.<br /> 4) The only reason I could think of for a company to buy it and not bring it to market is that it is more expensive to do so? That alone diminishes the value of the invention. If you could figure out a way around this, I think there would be no way you could not find a ready buyer/licensee.<br /> 5) Is there a reason your packaging innovation would only work for either of these two companies? Would it also work for any other type of consumables?<br /> 6) Why not market your idea to packaging companies? Or find out which packaging companies supply your two companies and go there first?<br /> 7) Could your package idea itself be a stand-alone product? Such as a resealable container bin or whatnot?<br /> <br /> Out of gas...<br /> <br /> Without knowing more, I would just say:<br /> 8) Find out more about the existing packaging and packaging suppliers of the companies you are targeting,<br /> 9) Consider how you could integrate your idea into the technology already in use,<br /> 10) If you can implement your idea without making them &quot;start all over,&quot; I would file a regular patent and build a mock-up or prototype,<br /> 11) Figure out some kind of marketing name and strategy for your packaging innovation,<br /> 12) Make a big list of companies, start cold-calling/emailing the big ones and work your way down until you sign a contract.<br /> <br /> I do not have any experience marketing a new idea, and I have no idea what your intended market is, but I enjoy these types of &quot;riddles.&quot; The only thing I would worry about is sticking to countries with a reliable legal system. I hope atleast some of that helps.</div>

 

[JPHerrmann]

<div class="bbWrapper">I think this thread has made some tremendous progress so far. Great info on patents and generally we all have made similar points on how to go about this venture. <br /> <br /> But from what im noticing, youre banking too much success of this venture on the premises that you will scare one &quot;big competitor&quot; into buying your product, when you threaten them to go to their competitor. This &quot;IMO&quot; is not a very good way to approach business.<br /> <br /> Companies dont want people to play games with them, they want people to bring VALUE to the organization. Perhaps you should execute this venture by seeking ways to present to the company how your products will add value to their product, company, and overall marketplace. <br /> <br /> Also you need to research the organizations to see which which one your product might be most appealing to, try to get an &quot;in&quot; with the company, make yourself relevent. Go to linked in and connect with people on the top of the totem pole and network yourself your way in. Build credibility with influential players.<br /> <br /> Hope this helps<br /> <br /> JPH</div>