The Ukraine War, implications, outcome?

[Black_Dragon43]

Because it's all a pile of bollocks. We're but pawns in a terrible game. I'm not going to debate with you because it's more than clear where you stand on the whole thing. You're so convinced you know. It's very interesting to watch.

I’m not trying to debate, I’m trying to understand your position. And I’m not convinced I know EVERYTHING, but I am convinced I know SOMETHING, much like you, I might add.

You say that we’re all but pawns in a terrible game. That seems to be a knowledge claim, that you do not doubt. So what’s the game, who is playing it, and what’s the purpose?

 

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[Kevin88660]

Personally I’m more concerned about the people dying than the money lost. Money ultimately means little, what matters is the effects on PRODUCTION, which can affect whether we all have enough food etc.

But I can care less if a Russian oligarch loses a few billion dollars or they get confiscated from him. That means nothing to the rest of us. The assets are still there, producing, just not his anymore.

All investment implies risk, if you don’t want to assume risk, don’t make investments. I’m a pragmatic business person, at that level you should take such risks into account.

The west and free world gets a premium in treatment because there is at least in theory, (despite the deteriorating condition over the years), that property rights are sacred. And non-western wealth are willing to park in the west, to hedge against the domestic political risk at home.

This gives the west the elevated standard of living, through the exchange rate, that even someone who makes minimum wage can have a reasonable standard of living.

If Euro and U.S. dollar lost 30 percent of the value, this is as good as the entire two region residents losing 30 percent of their wealth and income, as their purchasing power to procure raw material and manufactured goods oversea diminish.

The West is punishing Russia by having a rock throwing contest within a glass room.

 

[biophase]

I was talking to another fastlaner about wealthy people in Ukraine who are now refugees. Imagine the difference between one person who had $1m in real estate and another who had $1m in crypto. One is worth nothing and the other can start a new life in another country. Makes you think about your assets in a totally different way.

 

[MTF]

I was talking to another fastlaner about wealthy people in Ukraine who are now refugees. Imagine the difference between one person who had $1m in real estate and another who had $1m in crypto. One is worth nothing and the other can start a new life in another country. Makes you think about your assets in a totally different way.

That's what I keep telling my friend who has like 90% of his portfolio invested in rental apartments in the same city. "It can't happen here" until it does...

 

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[Black_Dragon43]

That's what I keep telling my friend who has like 90% of his portfolio invested in rental apartments in the same city. "It can't happen here" until it does...

But no asset is 100% safe. Even cash is trash in periods of high inflation. Real estate can be victim to war. Crypto can always be made illegal, etc.

No form of wealth is 100% safe or 100% in your control. Some do give you better control though, but you’ll never be able to be an independent island 100%.

And this will always be the case because who guarantees your ownership of your wealth if not your society? Society is gone, you have no wealth aside from production capacities that you’re able to defend by yourself. And the only way to do that is to become your own country.

 

[MTF]

But no asset is 100% safe. Even cash is trash in periods of high inflation. Real estate can be victim to war. Crypto can always be made illegal, etc.

No form of wealth is 100% safe or 100% in your control. Some do give you better control though, but you’ll never be able to be an independent island 100%.

And this will always be the case because who guarantees your ownership of your wealth if not your society? Society is gone, you have no wealth aside from production capacities that you’re able to defend by yourself. And the only way to do that is to become your own country.

No asset is 100% safe but it's very rare, if not impossible, that all asset classes go to zero at the same time. With just real estate, your risk of going to zero is probable compared to having real estate, crypto, stocks, your own business, and precious metals (everything diversified globally) where your risk is close to zero.

IMO the best asset class is your own skills. I've never calculated this exactly but probably well over 50% of my expenses are for education. This you do take with you whatever happens (assuming your brain works).

Also, if society is gone everywhere, you'll have WAY bigger problems than worrying about your investments.

 

[Black_Dragon43]

No asset is 100% safe but it's very rare, if not impossible, that all asset classes go to zero at the same time. With just real estate, your risk of going to zero is probable compared to having real estate, crypto, stocks, your own business, and precious metals (everything diversified globally) where your risk is close to zero.

Agreed, if you look at the richest families historically, the reason why they’re able to maintain their wealth generation over generation is due to diversification. Over time, diversification leads you to becoming more and more intermingled with the state of the overall economy of the world.

IMO the best asset class is your own skills. I've never calculated this exactly but probably well over 50% of my expenses are for education. This you do take with you whatever happens (assuming your brain works).

Also agreed. I do something similar and am always working on developing new skills and broadening my understanding. I always tell people who are new to entrepreneurship, that if you spend 2 years developing a high value skill, you’ll never run out of money or struggle with money, so long as you remain healthy of course.

 

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[Xeon]

Wait till the West takes those $600bn dollars from Russia which are in the EU and hands them over to Ukraine.

Yes, the West may take those $600bn but Ukraine will not get a single cent. Most likely it'll end up in the pockets of Uncle Sam, who will then splurge it on war and weapons.

Ukraine-Russia war day 16: Volodymyr Zelenskyy signs law to confiscate Russian property, WATCH

Ukraine-Russia war day 16: Volodymyr Zelenskyy signs law to confiscate Russian property, WATCH - Zelenskyy approved a new law that allows Ukraine to confiscate Russian assets. He has also signed a law allowing civilians to use weapons during war.

www.dnaindia.com

Insane escalation.

I cannot believe this in 21th century.

Time to open leveraged position to long gold.

Latest news is that the Russian convoys are closing in and only 10 - 15 miles away from the center of Kyiv. Since Zelensky wants to escalate wantonly without a care for the consequences and his people, I can only hope that Putin captures him asap, forces him to sign whatever agreement they want him to, take him back to Russia, then withdraw all the troops out from Ukraine so the war can end and people can start going back to their normal lives.

And Putin bombing a maternity isn’t insane escalation?

Check my link in one of the posts I posted above, the waronfakes website, where there's an article talking about this. There's so much fake news from the Ukrainian side that it's actually harming Ukraine more than anything. It's backfiring.

Sure, it's all 'propaganda'. But one clear event happened: Putin started invading Ukraine.

No, I'm not a "20 year old Russian living in Singapore". Here's my stand:

I sympathize with Ukranians, I understand Putin's actions and point of view, and I hope the war ends fast.

I doubt this war can be avoided since all sides refuse to compromise, it's only a matter of time it happens, and it's now. The only thing I disagree with regards to Putin's actions, is that he's not ending the war fast. During the first couple days when he took the world by surprise, he should have sent his strongest forces to take out Zelensky in the shortest time possible so that there won't be this long drawn out fighting, and loss of civilian lives can be kept to a minimum.

2 years ago people were falling down dead in the streets of China with covid.

Those are all fake videos pulled from random sources lol. I've seen those, where people were standing on the streets and suddenly dropping like flies

If Euro and U.S. dollar lost 30 percent of the value, this is as good as the entire two region residents losing 30 percent of their wealth and income, as their purchasing power to procure raw material and manufactured goods oversea diminish.

When I read this, I feel very happy that I can hire freelancers there for less.

 

[DayIFly]

My best friend is in politics, tried to become a mayor of our city, and some of my friends are also part of Azov. So let's say I do have some insight on what's going on. But none of them predicted Putin bombing country.
Yeah, men are not allowed to leave the country as of right now. Not sure about the AK47 part lol, but they gave out guns to civilians who were ready to fight.
How we all see this: Putin wants USSR back. Belarus and Kazakhstan. Now to complete the puzzle he needed Ukraine. Unfortunately for him, we didn't give up in a few days like he anticipated.
That's the only positive thing on my mind now. He already lost. He's f*cked. Russia's f*cked.
(Obviously, I am also sure West plays a huge role in this whole situation, being passively aggressive heh.)

Why did nobody predict the invasion though? Is the geopolitical situation not known at all among the Ukrainian citizens and Azow? I ask this because it was knows for 20 years that sooner or later US/NATO would cross the red line and Russia would either become a vassal state or they would go all in. Like do you really not grasp nuclear weapons, first strike capability, assured mutual destruction, etc?

This is like the Cuban Crisis. The US provoked the Soviet Union by placing missiles in Turkey. The Soviet Union reacted with placing missiles in Cuba. Then Kennedy removed the missiles from Turkey and the Soviet Union removed their missiles from Cuba. End of conflict. Now the US mocks Russia by basically proclaiming that Ukraine will get a NATO base with nukes, maybe not tomorrow but the trajectory is clear, the Ukraine WILL become a NATO state. Unfortunately Russia didn't have their Cuba this time, so they invaded to make it impossible for NATO to ever place missiles there.

I ask this because the majority of people here are posting daily propaganda which is irrelevant because the real issue is the above. Btw I expect Russia to come out of this conflict in a stronger position than before, as paradoxical as some may think. Russia will start building their own stuff. Up until now their oligarchs preferred to buy and sell, because it's easier than to create something. Well now, they will start creating and innovating.

 

[Silverfox148]

The decision was simple for Russia as has been written countless times including above, either become a vassal state to the West(like Germany, France, UK, etc) or fight for your sovereign independence now before it is too late and your are completely surrounded. This war was going to happen sooner or later but the timing favors the Russia which is why they acted now.

They chose not to become a vassal state to the U.S and are now paying the price in Russian lives. I actually think Russia comes out of this stronger and in the long term, the Oligarchs were a western creation and were mostly parasites with little to no allegiance to the concept of Russia as independent sovereign state, Putin allowed them to stay on in order not to rock the boat, but he has little love for them.

I see Russian embarking on a nationalistic drive the next few decades with a goal of becoming self sufficient while becoming firmly rooted in the Chinese sphere. All of those in the West wishing for a Russian collapse are dreaming, China will not allow it to happen because that would put a vassal U.S nation on its northern borders. The timing is right for this as their is little support for direct U.S involvement in Ukraine, a confused president at times, inflation is high, recession around the corner, etc. The only threat to Putin was direct U.S intervention and that's off the table.

All those thinking this is about freedoms/rights/Ukraine/etc. are drinking kool aid, this is about who will rule the world for the next 100 years and who will be vassal state to whom and who will remain independent.

 

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[DayIFly]

Oh, you really think those guys are capable of that? Really?

Maybe I should have worded that differently. Russia will have to innovate rather than their present oligarchs. How this reshuffle will look like, e.g. promoting newcomers, etc. I don't know, we'll see.

 

[otek]

I've not seen anyone complaining about Ukraine and turning a blind eye to Russia. I see a lot of people in this thread quite rightly refusing to believe what they're told on MSM and realising that none of us can know what's really going on.

Regarding distrust to MSM. Can relate to this train of thought. MSM has completely managed to lose its trustworthiness for many.

Have watched USA media more intently for couple years. And managed to "red pill" so to speak myself. Trump was interesting eye opener for media bias. Comparing what the orange man said on full interview on context himself and how the media somehow twisted every time "The orange man Bad" Angle. Not unbiased news reporting. For example The "disabled reporter mocking" was actually just Trump's mannerism, that he had used on many other interviews also.
Then the Corona virus thing. Critical race theory etc. Seems that media is very biased.

Would probably also be little bit more hesitant to believe "The Russia bad Ukraine good" line from MSM, If I imagine myself living on USA and the MSM media being so biased.

But living in Finland it's easy to see the Putin's invasion mainly from the angle that Ukrainians have. We could have been in Ukraina's situation now. Bombs exploding in Helsinki. We are not in NATO and small country with lesser forces, so we are good target for Putin. And he knows we don't have article 5 from NATO as defence quarantee.

 

[srodrigo]

Ukraine-Russia war day 16: Volodymyr Zelenskyy signs law to confiscate Russian property, WATCH

Ukraine-Russia war day 16: Volodymyr Zelenskyy signs law to confiscate Russian property, WATCH - Zelenskyy approved a new law that allows Ukraine to confiscate Russian assets. He has also signed a law allowing civilians to use weapons during war.

www.dnaindia.com

Insane escalation.

I cannot believe this in 21th century.

Time to open leveraged position to long gold.

Even more insane is that there'll be a good amount of Russians who live in Ukraine because they hate Putin, yet now they can get their assets confiscated. How mental is this?

 

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[MattR82]

That is good news. Seize the assets of all these cancel-culture companies and teach them a lesson.
If I were Putin, I would have done that long ago and arrest the top management of these companies as a signal to the West.

wtf?

 

[DayIFly]

Who said it will become a vassal US nation? China is waiting to finally take Russia over in my opinion. It will be the Dragon who slays the Bear in this equation.

It’s pretty much an impossibility for the US to turn Russia into a vassal state. It will never happen.

China won't take Russia, this is laughable. How would they accomplish this? You think they'll subdue 145 million people? And what about nuclear weapons? China as a boogey-man is mostly propaganda. Russia can only become a vassal state from the inside. Just like the Ukraine did in 2014 or like Germany did after the war. They'll orchestrate a coup, a Western agent like Navalny comes to power and then they'll open the gates for all kinds of advisors, NGOs and Western companies. New and "free" TV and newspaper stations will be opened to pacify the population. They did the same thing in the 90s, US advisers basically rewriting every law, they had whole teams in the Kreml "restructuring" everything they could get their hands on. The Soviet Union was divided up. In the same way they'll divide up Russia, due to "administrative issues" and through "democratic elections". This is a soft approach. For Chinese to do something similar isn't possible, they also can't use slogans like freedom, democracy, wealth, etc. This is what the sanctions are for, you can conquer a country without war but through economics.

 

[Xeon]

Oh, you really think those guys are capable of that? Really?

Why not? I also agree that now is the time for Russia to walk out from their Western dependency. When other countries see that Russia can do it successfully, they'll follow.

The solution? China.

Whatever the West has, China has an equivalent with a bigger base.

Ditch WhatsApp, FB, Instagram, and you've WeChat which can do the equivalent of all these in 1 app. This is on top of their Vkontakte which is Russian.

Russians use Pinterest? Well, there's Huaban lol Amazon? Well, Taobao and AliExpress!

And if there's something they want but China doesn't have, the Factory Of The World can build it!

The only thing would be to translate the language into Russian, that's not a hard task.

The West bans all car sales in Russia? Well, good cheap ones from China. The West <insert action/sanction here> in Russia? Solution: China. Russia has gas and oil, China has everything else.

If China is not enough, Russia has another ally in India. Each of these country alone has a bigger population than the entire US + Europe.

wtf?

Yup, I said it. This is nothing compared to what the West is doing to 148 million Russians. Instead of 44 million Ukrainians' lives affected, it's now 44 million + 148 million lives + whatever population in Belarus affected.

 

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[BizyDad]

That is good news. Seize the assets of all these cancel-culture companies and teach them a lesson.
If I were Putin, I would have done that long ago and arrest the top management of these companies as a signal to the West.

Oh please. Such a tough talker.

Seriously, Zelensky needs to surrender immediately.

Screw all that patriotism and ideals...

Honestly, if the world really wants to help Ukraine, stop donating or funding their military and let Putin end this quick. ... This sounds very unpatriotic and spineless

If you were Putin, you'd surrender to Ukraine.

Why not? I also agree that now is the time for Russia to walk out from their Western dependency. When other countries see that Russia can do it successfully, they'll follow.

The solution? China.

Whatever the West has, China has an equivalent with a bigger base.

Ditch WhatsApp, FB, Instagram, and you've WeChat which can do the equivalent of all these in 1 app. This is on top of their Vkontakte which is Russian.

Russians use Pinterest? Well, there's Huaban lol Amazon? Well, Taobao and AliExpress!

And if there's something they want but China doesn't have, the Factory Of The World can build it!

The only thing would be to translate the language into Russian, that's not a hard task.

The West bans all car sales in Russia? Well, good cheap ones from China. The West <insert action/sanction here> in Russia? Solution: China. Russia has gas and oil, China has everything else.

If China is not enough, Russia has another ally in India. Each of these country alone has a bigger population than the entire US + Europe.

Shoot, you're already ready to swap Russia participation in dozens of different markets and replace it with a single Chinese source for everything. You want to sell all Russia's oil to China too?

After everything that gets taught in this forum about good business, you want to give Chinese a monopoly on Russian markets.

This sounds ... spineless.

Your obvious genius wouldn't be appreciated by the Russian people. If you were Putin, you wouldn't survive your first assassination attempt.

 

[daivey]

I was talking to another fastlaner about wealthy people in Ukraine who are now refugees. Imagine the difference between one person who had $1m in real estate and another who had $1m in crypto. One is worth nothing and the other can start a new life in another country. Makes you think about your assets in a totally different way.

oh gawd, please don't pull a michael sailor.....

 

[Cyberthal]

I don't sympathize with the Ukrainians. They should've helped the Russians liberate their country from the Nazi globalist Satanists, like the Russians expected them to. Now they're going to suffer higher civilian casualties and a longer war.

The rest of the West will face a similar lesson, for similar reasons. Sanity always reasserts herself, one way or another.

 

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[daivey]

I don't sympathize with the Ukrainians. They should've helped the Russians liberate their country from the Nazi globalist Satanists, like the Russians expected them to. Now they're going to suffer higher civilian casualties and a longer war.

The rest of the West will face a similar lesson, for similar reasons. Sanity always reasserts herself, one way or another.

lol K Alex Jones

 

[biophase]

oh gawd, please don't pull a michael sailor.....

I don’t know who that is.

 

[daivey]

I don’t know who that is.

BTC god.

 

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[Xeon]

Here we go again. While the world is dealing with the UA-RU war, The Meddler, The Chaos Lover, The Regime Changer, The Lord of Freedom & Democracy, The WarMonger, has turned its sight on Asia!

New US Indo-Pacific strategy includes a stronger presence in Southeast Asia

Many of the strategy’s provisions appear aimed at countering China’s economic clout, military power and Belt and Road Initiative.

www.scmp.com

This is worrying. We don't want to become the next Middle East or Ukraine! Please don't give us "freedom and democracy"!
Pray! Some of us already know what's going to happen : pick a country, regime change that, that country becomes a vassal state, use that country to plant missile bases and the rest of it is taken straight out from the NATO / Iraq / Ukraine Playbook!

This is what Asian cities and skylines look like now:

When The WarMonger, The Meddler comes, Asian cities will look like these:

Please let us off, Sam!

 

[Vas87]

What do you mean by “what’s really going on?”

Do you have doubts about the Russian bombings, for example the bombing of the maternity, do you think that’s fake news, what exactly are you in doubt about?

I have family in Mariupol who I haven't heard from in the last week now. One of the last messages they sent was the Ukrainian army put rocket launchers near their apartment building.

In the maternity hospital situation: What do you think Russia could've been aiming at and accidentally hit a hospital?

 

[Marigold]

I have family in Mariupol who I haven't heard from in the last week now. One of the last messages they sent was the Ukrainian army put rocket launchers near their apartment building.

In the maternity hospital situation: What do you think Russia could've been aiming at and accidentally hit a hospital?

I don't know if a maternity hospital was bombed or who bombed it.

Remember the incubator stories?

I don't relish the fact we live in a post-truth world. But here we are. The OP above was right, MSM has absolutely destroyed any semblance of trust. For a long time now.

It's a very sad situation. Terrible things are happening but because millions of people don't know who or what to believe, we're likely to become desensitized and even pooh-pooh real actual events.

I expect the number of conspiracy theorists to have exponentially grown in the last two years and to continue. It will work in the favour of a lot of people in power (aka sociopathic monsters) to have everyone doubt everything.

 

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[Cyberthal]

What do you think Russia could've been aiming at and accidentally hit a hospital?

Bioweapons lab in basement. The ones that don't exist, but do exist, but aren't dangerous, but can't fall into Russian hands.

Man is wolf to man. Wolves have a religion. Many historical elites have used cults and violation of taboos to increase their cohesion against the sheeple. Even if you don't believe there is anything supernatural and the ghost inside your head is merely meat simulating thought, there is still plenty of reason to worship Satan. Many are happy to explain why, even. They believe it absolves them of responsibility, if they tell you.

Ukraine was a pen of unguarded sheep, easily purchased but loosely held. Such are slaughtered to maximize profits.

Sheep that are securely owned, on the other hand, are sheared. And independent sheep grows horns and live on Swiss mountains.

Individualism is an easily exploitable paradigm by groups acting in concert.

 

[Xeon]

Children going missing amid chaos at Ukrainian border, aid groups report

Cases of human trafficking and exploitation also reported as more than 2.5 million refugees try to escape fighting

www.theguardian.com

Sick and disgusting. This is the so called taking in of refugees?

In the maternity hospital situation: What do you think Russia could've been aiming at and accidentally hit a hospital?

Ukranian troops told by Zelensky and his evil government to deliberately take positions around civilian buildings and hospitals etc., with their artillery setup all around these areas, to bait the Russians to attack them at these spots. Some of the shelling are going to miss for sure, and end up hitting these civilian buildings.

 

[Xeon]

 

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[WillHurtDontCare]

Food & fuel supply & prices are probably the most consequences from the Ukraine war to Americans.

Ukraine: War will destabilise food supply in Europe, Africa, says Macron - Punch Newspapers

French President, Emmanuel Macron, has warned that the ongoing war in Ukraine will "deeply destabilise" food supplies in Europe and Africa as some of the world's most fertile agricultural lands have been left uncultivated.

punchng.com

 

[Chapas]

Looks like Iran just bombed the US consulate in Iraq. Fun times ahead.

In the meantime Pelosi just had a 50 minute conversation with President Kurensky of Ukraine. How in the world are these people in charge of our future?