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Impossible to get digital marketing job without degree?

Discussion in 'Ideas, Needs, Concept Feedback' started by LiveEntrepreneur, Apr 3, 2019.

  1. LiveEntrepreneur
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    LiveEntrepreneur Bronze Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    Hi everyone, so I have been looking for a digital marketing job for a while but it seems impossible without a degree. I don't see the logic behind employers, when marketing degrees teach nothing about SEO for example, what is it exactly they are looking for in a degree? Anyways... my real question is there any tips that you guys can give me to increase my chances of getting a job that requires a degree when I don't have one?

    I think my CV and resume is pretty good, I've mentioned for example in my CV, the online courses and that on digital marketing that I have taken, my own projects that I have worked on, and I wrote I was willing to work from home and put in the extra hours. Has anyone here ever gotten a job where it required a degree but you managed to convince the hiring manager somehow that even without it you are a good fit for the role? I've also tried to apply for copy-writing jobs but no luck there.
     
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  2. Andy Black
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    Andy Black Any colour, as long as it's red. Staff Member Read Millionaire Fastlane FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass LEGENDARY CONTRIBUTOR

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    Curious why you don’t spend that time trying to get a paying client?
     
  3. ZF Lee
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    ZF Lee Platinum Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    1. Do a marketing A/B test with a REAL email or ads. You do this by asking others on forums, your meetups or workplace whether you can do them a FREE service.

    That way, you show folks you can give ACTUAL results.

    For me, I didn't do an A/B testing experiment, but I just went to Inspect element and edited web copy on the fly, screenshot it and voila...actionable samples.


    2. Even if the results of the A/B test aren't great, take that snapshot of your results, and write up a short case study on the goal of the test, what went right and what didn't, and how you can make it better.

    3. Go to clients on freelance websites or ring people up or hit meetups. Show them that track record.

    I went this route to sell services for writing copy and resumes. They gave me jobs without asking about my degree.

    Consistency of sorts.

    They try to make marketing into a turn-key operation, which isn't.

    Marketing is full of testing and learning. Can't be just put into a bunch of formulas.
     
  4. LiveEntrepreneur
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    LiveEntrepreneur Bronze Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    Because I am already working on an idea, and I wanted digital marketing as a job.
     
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  5. ZF Lee
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    ZF Lee Platinum Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    Hmm semantics....

    When you look for a 'client', you might find yourself working long-term with him.
    The nature of digital marketing is that you have to test and break stuff.

    So that long-term contract might very well last as long as an average job, although it doesn't need to last for years.

    So all things will be even out, whether its a 'job' or 'client'. Anyway, you have to fulfill peoples' expectations in both a job or hustle.

    Ask the client or whoever is hiring you whether both of you can go for a test run for a few weeks' and see if you can run well with their marketing goals. And then, if it works, you keep working with them. If not, it's fine to say bye-bye. If the client was still happy with your work, he'll be more likely to pay, but if otherwise, best say 'no fee'.
     
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  6. LiveEntrepreneur
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    LiveEntrepreneur Bronze Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    I get what you're trying to say, it doesn't just make sense to me in terms of doing that idea along with my current idea. The reason is by the time I get home I have only a few hours to work on something and if I am splitting it on 2 ideas, I won't really have that much time to put the effort that I think is required.
     
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  7. eliquid
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    eliquid ( Jason Brown ) Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass LEGENDARY CONTRIBUTOR Summit Attendee

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    I know plenty of people who do ( or did ) digital marketing at jobs without a degree.

    I was one of them once.
     
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  8. LiveEntrepreneur
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    LiveEntrepreneur Bronze Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    How'd you do that lol? Legit every listing I look at wants a degree (which I am pretty sure doesn't really teach digital marketing). Though I applied for a job recently, it's a startup. I pretty much manage their business, their online presence so I am pretty excited about that.
     
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  9. ZF Lee
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    ZF Lee Platinum Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    Good for you!

    Yup, startups are good places to pump up experience, and if you do it right, they'll earn more dough to pay you lol.

    On listings, I have said already that they want a certain fixed benchmark to pick the best man from the masses.

    IMO, I'd rather just book a face-to-face appointment with the hiring guy, and then come in blazing with my portfolio or a live webinar/case study of a past marketing project.

    On creating great portfolios for digital marketing, there's a tip from Reddit I found recently...

    To practice and build up a track record of results, find an affiliate product from places like Clickbank and promote it using what skills you have, be it copywriting, SEO, graphic design, etc.

    Then check the dashboard or data stats for how many click-thru rates/ opt-ins/ conversions/ whatever measure of performance, take a snapshot of it, write a short and sweet report on it, and you have some results to show.

    I haven't tried it yet, but sounds feasible, although it's no Fastlane. Just a more proactive means to an end.
     
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  10. eliquid
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    eliquid ( Jason Brown ) Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass LEGENDARY CONTRIBUTOR Summit Attendee

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    I just applied for the jobs, same as you.

    My resume never included college ( although I have SOME college experience ) and in the interview it was never asked if I have a degree.

    I've done this several times in the past when I was working for others. I was able to land some pretty high end jobs doing this. I can count at least 8 jobs this same exact process happened.

    Never once did anyone ask about a degree.
     
  11. Thiago Machado
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    Thiago Machado Silver Contributor I've Read UNSCRIPTED Speedway Pass

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    Get this:

    The #1 Digital Marketing Career Guide - From $0 to $60K in 1 Year

    It’s $90 and he teaches you how to do that.

    On a side note:

    1. Do digital marketing for yourself or a client and document every step of the process. That will give you a solid case study to show employers. It's much better to SHOW instead of tell.

    2. Get certified: companies know that colleges do a bad job of teaching people real world skills. All major digital marketing certifications are free too. I recommend you get the following.

    Hubspot Inbound marketing: Courses & Lessons | HubSpot Academy

    Google AdWords: Google Academy for Ads - Digital Training from Google

    Google Analytics: Google Analytics Academy

    If you have proof that you can do the job and certifications from Google and Hubspot, you’ll stand out from 99% of people who are applying for an entry level digital marketing job.

    Note: I would also focus on getting a role in PPC. There’s a lot of job openings, not many people are good at it, and it’s one of the best skills you can have.

    There’s tons of stuff from @eliquid and @Andy Black here on the forum.
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2019
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  12. LiveEntrepreneur
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    LiveEntrepreneur Bronze Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    I see what you're trying to say. I did mention courses that I did take, but I don't think they see it as valuable but I'll check out that. The problem is for a lot of listing it says in the description like this:

    * Marketing degree (required)

    Maybe in terms of jobs in America it's different to Australia?
     
  13. GoodluckChuck
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    GoodluckChuck Grateful Member Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    I run a digital marketing agency without a degree.

    I hire people to do parts of the business and a degree isnt even a thought.

    A lot of the digital marketing job ads I've seen explicitly say degree or applicable experience...

    Not sure where you're looking but jobs are everywhere and easy to get If you can prove past results...
     
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  14. amp0193
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    amp0193 Legendary Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass LEGENDARY CONTRIBUTOR Summit Attendee

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    I need to hire a digital marketer sometime in the next year.

    I don't care if you went to college. It won't even be on the job posting.

    I do care that they are clearly competent in all areas of digital marketing (with experience and references to back that up). As well as being able to answer every question that I grill you about.
     
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  15. Thiago Machado
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    Thiago Machado Silver Contributor I've Read UNSCRIPTED Speedway Pass

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    What @amp0193 and @GoodluckChuck said...

    They put "marketing degree required" just so they can stop getting B.S. resumes.

    You'd be surprised how many people apply with no credentials, results, and nothing to show for. They just spam job boards and hope something sticks.

    By putting "marketing degree required" they eliminate a lot of these people.

    Just remember this:
    • Digital marketing is based on results.
    • If you have proven results and show that you know your stuff- nobody cares if you have a degree.
    • Colleges do a terrible job of teaching these skills (SEO + PPC)

    • Most of them don't even teach these things...
    If you're still in doubt, just get the course I linked above.

    The guy literally shows you how to get a job in this field without a degree.

    That pretty much solves your problem...
     
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  16. rogue synthetic
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    rogue synthetic * Not actually Rutger Hauer Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    They say this to filter out the people who don't have the creativity or the drive to come up with a solution to this obstacle.

    Think about this from the hiring manager's point of view.

    Most of the applications are lukewarm to awful. Bland CVs, sleep-inducing generic lists of accomplishments and degrees and hobbies nobody cares about. But they've got a degree.

    You find a way to demonstrate that you can not only do the job but blow it away...and you show the manager that you are the best candidate on the list, that you've got experience and the skill, and that he's going to have zero problems turning you loose on his problems.

    Do you think you won't get the job?

    Disclaimer: there are corporate HR goons out there who actually won't hire you or even consider you without the degree. But if you're playing the numbers game like you should be, if you really are qualified for the job and show this in your application then you'll get interviews.
     
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  17. NewManRising
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    NewManRising Bronze Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED Speedway Pass

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    Start freelancing. I have no degree and only like 4-5 months experience and I write ads, social media posts, emails and a whole bunch of other things for companies. I have a guy right now wanting me to create and run his social media accounts for him. You're trying to go through the slow lane route.
     
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  18. NewManRising
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    NewManRising Bronze Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED Speedway Pass

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    Hey LiveEntrepreneur,
    If you would like some tips and strategies now to get started like I am, I'd be willing to give you some pointers.

    My degree is in Biology and I was building a career with that. I decided to do something else and learning copywriting and marketing is starting from the ground up for me.

    I have had some success. And after just a few months I am making money and gettting better. Bigger things are on the horizon I can just see it.

    Right now I am just hustling and learning. But I am trying to actually move more into a building stage to where I have an actual business. Anyway, if you would like some insights and some strategies to get moving, I am here to help you with that.
     
  19. amp0193
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    amp0193 Legendary Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass LEGENDARY CONTRIBUTOR Summit Attendee

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    There's other ways to eliminate people too, if you're hiring and don't care about the college thing.

    My customer service position I recently hired included 2 gotchas in the posting.

    1. Send me a direct email at email@url.com with subject line XXXX.
    2. Include a video introduction explaining why you're a good fit.

    Any applications sent through Indeed/Glassdoor/FB... auto-delete.

    Any emails with incorrect subject line, auto-delete.

    No video? auto-delete.


    Brought 1200 applicants down to about 40-50. And most of those were deleted within 3-5 seconds because they couldn't type a coherent email. Was left with maybe 10 I looked at more carefully. Interviewed 3. Hired 1.



    For the digital marketing application, my "gotcha" requirement would be something like: "Attach a one page summary of the measurable results of how you improved someone's digital marketing". For example: Took conversion from X% to X% by doing [blank]. Reduced acquisition cost from $X to $X by doing [blank]. Increased instagram followers from X,XXX to XX,XXX by doing [blank].

    If you can't provide it, I don't want you.
    If you won't take the time to provide it, I don't want you.
    If you know what you're doing, and are excited to work for me... you'll have no problem putting it together.



    However, if you're applying for jobs, and the degree is a requirement... just make up a one page sell sheet like the above, and I bet people would pay attention to you.

    Better yet, make a video presentation, of you on a whiteboard or easel or powerpoint, doing a presentation on how awesome you are and what you've done.

    You think that would make you stand out?
     
  20. Thiago Machado
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    Brought 1200 applicants down to about 40-50. And most of those were deleted within 3-5 seconds because they couldn't type a coherent email. Was left with maybe 10 I looked at more carefully. Interviewed 3. Hired 1.


    That's insane...
     
  21. Chipstix
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    maybe in an employed "marketing" role, in a big corporate, they'll be asking for a degree. But those are real "jobs" and definitely do not bring the sort of lifestyle that you can have with freelance work or running your own agency. A job, even if well paid, is not scaleable and definitely not a fastlane aspiration.

    I've been freelancing in digital marketing for 12 years, and not a single client asked nor cared that I left school with only flakey GCSE's and no college/university. I left school and got practical experience, first in sales and later in IM. In fact, most of what I'm doing now in marketing is stuff I highly doubt they would teach at uni anyway. Uni for marketing would be a timewaster, you'd still need to start from square one when you actually started doing it for real, rather than in a textbook.

    The best way to get a high paying client(s) in marketing is simply by doing. Market yourself: SEO? Anyone can build a website or two - but not many people can actually rank them. So do it - if you can demonstrate that you have currently ranking sites, its any easy proof of skill and a quick way to get hired. PPC? run a clever targeting/retargeting campaign that will catch the eye of your audience and follow them around. Content creation? Write articles that the people you want to work with would love reading.

    All of this can be done without university. You can learn everything you need from the right corners of the interwebs, in a fraction of the time.
     
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  22. Chipstix
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    Chipstix New Contributor

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    The prop trading firm I worked with in London had an interesting trader applicant filter:
    1000 applications on the desk. Divide by two, pick one pile, chuck straight into the bin... because, in financial trading, you don't want to hire someone who's unlucky!
     
  23. James Klymus
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    James Klymus Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED

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    I've gotten multiple interviews with marketing agencies and no college experience. They were small to medium sized agencies, So don't expect to apply to somewhere like Oglivy without some sort of credentials and past experience.

    With that being said, write a solid resume (that doesn't mention anything about college), Make sure to only put things that are relevant to the potential position. A lot of people put hobbies and other irrelevent things.

    At the end of the day, the reason a company hires you is the same reason a customer buys a product. We solve a problem for a company, and you are a product that will do so. As long as you can solve the problem for the company, then its irrelevant where you received education.

    Any company that is so far up their a$$ that they require a college degree to work there no matter what, probably isnt a good company to work for anyways.
     
  24. NewManRising
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    The cool thing is, when you're self-taught you can create your own "curriculum". When you go to college most of the shit is general ed and lame stuff you won't use anyway. For my biology degree, there were only like 6-7 classes out of like the 30 I took that were focused on my major.

    I've learned so much in 4-5 months of learning copywriting and marketing that I would at any university. I can choose the material I want to learn, at my pace, and I can freelance and earn money at the same time.

    I'll tell you, the more complex the problem the bigger the rewards. Instead of just writing a few emails, social media posts, or product descriptions, I can take it a step further and offer to build people's email campaigns (templates, automation, segementation, etc). Or, take over someone's whole social media account.

    This is when things start getting good and good money starts rolling in. Right now, I am just a small time freelancer that gets a few jobs weekly. It is basically people outsourcing boring tasks to me.

    My next step is learn email marketing or social media management really well. Then, I will focus on big projects.

    You just have to start out small. Have the minimum skill and put yourself out there. You gotta hustle your a$$ for small pay in the beginning but then it starts to grow. You also learn a ton during the process.
     
  25. Sanj Modha
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    Sanj Modha Gold Contributor Speedway Pass

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    Proven results > degree.

    My degree is useless now because I earn 10 times as much without it.
     
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