Houston we have a problem...

[Gsuz]

Part of what makes this site so great is the high amount of high quality members from all walks of life enforcing a NO B.S. policy towards those trying to undermine and steal from the community. I feel like this is something that must protected at all cost.

 

[AlexV]

It's sad to see things happen like this and it really pi..es me off big time. I usually beat the shit out of people that threat me like this..and no it is not metaphorical speaking. I hate being taken as a fool, and sometimes if your good to people you are seen a fool. I hope MJ won't close it, even if restricts access to it and puts higher selection criteria for the more valuable forum.
I'm one of the quite ones from this forum because I post only when I feel I create value. I read a lot of threads from the past because you can find solutions to most problems you encounter, different approaches which give you different choices and results. This forum gives you a mindset and it changes viewpoints. It would be a pity if it would be gone. I'm not an INSIDERS yet because I have hundreds of threads still to read here. Hope that they are not gone this weekend.
In my country there is a saying: 'There is no forest without dead wood', which shows exactly the situation here. Few guys can ruin the benefits of many.

 

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[GPM]

But...I think I've mentioned before somewhere (in the discussions about the INSIDERS section) that - I think this issue could be resolved by having a higher barrier of entry to the INSIDERS's section.

I second this. The advice that I have gotten here has been life changing. There are a few members here who do so much to help others out, it in turn makes me want to help as many people as I can with what I am learning.

When I see “INSIDERS” who signed up 6 months ago who only have like 5-10 posts it kind of freaks me out. I understand that MJ is getting paid by all of this, but I don’t like the idea of people who just take from this forum with no intention of ever giving back. I try to bounce ideas off of some friends who I think would be interested, but it has all been negative! No one cares about advancing their life. I come here and post questions and within hours I have many people trying to help me out! At this stage I NEED this, it is hard enough to keep going as it is, this place is life changing.

MJ, when I first read your post and you said that someone made “The Billionaire Fast Lane” I just about chocked to death! That has been a joke in a few other threads and if someone actually did that would be absolute insanity! Glad you threw that disclaimer in there.

 

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[minivanman]

I don't appreciate you making fun of my car!

 

[minivanman]

Good point lol
You spoke of being a hundredaire, I remember when I thought hundredaires were rich! For REAL!!

 

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[tincho1492]

I hear you!

Thanks MJ for taking care of this community and always pushing for the greatness of this forum.

Really appreciate the time and effort you and other AMAZING givers make.

 

[TK1]

The most valuable commodity I know of is information. - Gordon Gekko, Wall Street

That's the reason so many people do stuff like that and it will never change.

Machiavelli wrote, that in order to get to the top you need a very good powerful friend / mentor. And if you are on top he's the first you have to get rid of / kill etc..

This is the same reasoning people over here use the best informations by already successful mentors and then steal from them - betray them.

This results in private powerful circles where powerful people exchange private information - now the masses of people are pissed off at those people and say "those arrogant riches" etc. or call every private successful person 'illuminati'

It's all because that's how small minds "work"...

The biggest leverage has combined knowledge.

With the experience and knowledge of the maybe top 20 successful people over here you could turn 1 million biz ideas into a success.

So you could try to use this leveraged power of combined successful minds and use them for your next biz.

But what do you do instead?

Think that your mind will do it all and betray all of them.

You exchange what could be your biggest biz - success possibility in your life for the idiotic thought of stealing things.

Oliver Samwer wrote "The entrepreneur should never be in the way of the success his biz idea can have".

Still, that's what most do.

People pissing off fastlane members are the same kind of species that would be on shark tank, get an offer by all sharks for 50% of their company and still walk away with no deal, because it's 50%....

 

[LightHouse]

I think just making this a paid only club.....even if its just 5 bucks a month will weed out a lot of the vermin. This is the same problem with Craigslist. As soon as they start charging a small fee to post in the jobs section, the little scammer F*cksticks disappear. MJ, I say make it paid only.....and feel free to bump it up to 10 bucks....20 bucks a month.....100 bucks a year, or somewhere in that realm. At least then I know I will be surrounded by other forum members who arent scared to drop some of their cash to learn something. I suspect that 99% of these guys that post "please give me an idea so i can become a millionaire" will probably disappear.

Sorry man......your book and forum have been life-changing for me.

The problem with this is new members, you need new members to sustain active growth. No one will just come over and pay to get in. Think about some of the recent guys that signed on and rocketed in speed like Million$$$smile, that wouldnt happen if it was paid only. I wouldn't pay either (which is why no INSIDERS) since i feel forums should be open access. I won't pay to waste time reading things, it has nothing to do with the cost.

Just my opinion though, clearly it works in some instances.

 

[1step]

I think there are options like an invite only section where it could still be free but one is only invited once they have "proven" themselves. And I'm not talking about number of posts or a certain speed.

I agree here, i think keeping the main boards as is and then having the "INSIDERS" be invite only would be a good solution. You still charge for the inside but need to have an invite (from a mod or other respected member).

I think this could be a way for new members to use the main boards as a way to provide value and prove their worth in order to earn access to the inside.

 

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[healthstatus]

I just want to chime in here. There are people that steal at every level. Bernie Madoff was a known financial manager, but went the wrong way, ballplayers juice, Lance Armstrong doped, there are illegal drugs in prisons. As long as there are lines to cross, they will be eventually crossed. It doesn't matter what obstacles or requirements you put out there.

The only tweak I would make is the requirement for a certain "speed" before being eligible to be an INSIDERS, doesn't have to be as much as the speedway, but the visitor must show some positive contributions.

 

[Jason K]

I wonder if this stage is merely what forums experience as they go through their life cycle.

First we have the new stage, where the forum is unknown to the world and is filled with INSIDERS who share the core beliefs.

Then we have the growth stage, still filled with lots of enthusiasm, and people join but it's the right people: those who also share those core beliefs. They're attracted to it.

Third we have the mature stage, where this forum seems to be now. All kinds of people are finding out about it, including those who want a free lunch or just to advertise. The Givers become badly outnumbered by the Takers.

I know an NLP copywriter who requires you to go through an exercise and tell him the results before he lets you into his website. The cost is low, maybe you have to hand out a few $1 bills or lottery tickets a certain way, and then email him about the experience. That way, he only admits people who believe in the Golden Rule.

 

[LightHouse]

So what SOLUTIONS do you see?

As far as a higher quality area, i agree on the pay + invite. It works on other forums I have seen, rep speed may work, but you have bad apples with high rep speed as well.

As far as the rest of the forum, Do nothing, keep the information exchange wide open. These guys aren't the minority, there are tons of people that have trolled and copied business', these guys were just so dumb they posted about it on the forum. I wouldn't share anything that's sensitive data, and Kenric didn't either. This guy will never take even a slice of Kenrics business, but it will make Kenric less likely to help random people in the future.

 

[andviv]

it will make Kenric less likely to help random people in the future.

It's good for me I am not random. Weird maybe, but not random.

 

[Twiki]

Well I can understand the bitterness of the great minds here who I've learned so much from and it'd be a real shame to lose this resource.

Maybe the words of another great mind, from a long long time ago, can help bring balance to the force:

When you wake up in the morning, tell yourself: the people I deal with today will be meddling, ungrateful, arrogant, dishonest, jealous and surly. They are like this because they can't tell good from evil. But I have seen the beauty of good, and the ugliness of evil, and have recognized that the wrongdoer has a nature related to my own - not of the same blood and birth, but the same mind, and possessing a share of the divine. And so none of them can hurt me. No one can implicate me in ugliness. Nor can I feel angry at my relative, or hate him. We were born to work together like feet, hands and eyes, like the two rows of teeth, upper and lower. To obstruct each other is unnatural. To feel anger at someone, to turn your back on him: these are unnatural. ― Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

Or, as a friend of Marcus Aurelius once said, "What we do in life, echoes in eternity!"

 

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[TK1]

 

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[Runum]

Nobody stole and rewrote MJ's book...you and many others rushed through his post and missed the bolded and color highlighted disclaimer: "While my above story with respect to self-publishing isn't true"

Nope, didn't miss that at all. However, that is only one story of many over the years. It is a fact that MJ has had his website code stolen and used against him several times.

We all recognize that the world of biz is pretty tough. This forum was designed to help people in biz. For years it went well. Lately we have had some people come in, get friendly, and then piss in their mentor's cornflakes.

It makes the accomplished veterans gun shy about helping anyone else going forward. This hurts the intent and integrity of the forum.

Someone, somewhere probably helped you. Where would you be if that person didn't help you? Would life have been tougher?

 

[Marty]

I think the worst part is not that he stole an idea/product, it's that he stole methods of execution for that idea/product by ingratiating himself to Biophase and then trying to use the philosophy we all subscribe to (it's about execution, not ideas) as a defense against his unscrupulous behavior.

 

[Jonleehacker]

And Snowbank is not involved.

True, but I do think we should consider changing Bill's name from Snowbank to Snowball, much more of a poetic ring to the latter

 

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[MJ DeMarco]

Bump, since the forum is growing like a weed.

You should consider raising the price of INSIDERS subscription.

That might happen as well ... its growing in there beyond expectations as well. The INSIDE was supposed to be an intimate gathering and now it is 500 strong of mostly those who do not post.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

Is there any way of setting up an "invite only" sub-section within the inside?

We are discussing that now.

but now are complaining you are too popular with the subscriptions.

I'm not complaining -- I'm trying to maintain an environment of value and contribution. As the # of INSIDERS increases, the environment for open and willing contribution declines due to fear of theft and pilfering by those lacking integrity -- the whole reason this thread came to pass. There was a time I knew every INSIDERS and their history -- now, I do not. There are no outstanding issues going on, however, I do look at things from a statistical perspective.

I'd bump the INSIDERS subscription price but discounting based on speed (although I don't like this new like/speed system).

This is a great idea but the speed system right now is still kinda screwy and not as accurate as the last system.

 

[Late Bloomer]

I don't appreciate you making fun of my car!

What's a minivanman doing with a sedan anyway?

 

[InLikeFlint]

Hey MJ,

I am really sorry to hear about this jackass stealing your ideas. He is the lowest of the low, and doesn't deserve to sell a single copy. What I am wondering is, does he practice what he preaches? Obviously not if he needs this book in order to pay for his two kids...your book is so compelling and so popular because you started off with nothing and turned it into vast wealth. This guy obviously hasn't done anything to obtain wealth so there is no reason why anyone will believe him or believe in his book.

I do however, want to steer you away from the idea that people on this forum are thieves. This forum is extremely helpful to SO many people. For me, personally, it offers a place where I know people understand my mindset and motivation to make money. It gives me a group of people to bounce ideas off of in order to gain feedback and understand how to solve my problems. This forum is completely unique and so amazingly helpful, and I would be devastated if it were shut down. PLEASE do not let one person's actions speak for this whole community.

We are all here to support you and help you MJ, in the same way that your book and this forum helped us.

 

[CEBenz]

Seriously? He couldn't come up with a better title???? What a freakin lazy toad. There had to be titles he could have market tested that would have given better results and not offended you in the process. Did he plagiarize your book to?

My first ecommerce business repurposed the same product my mentor sold. He sold in one industry and I attempted to sell in another. I was careful not to step on his toes. I also had his permission and he would piggy back my orders with his. In the end, I wasn't successful but I learned a lot. I just wish I could get him to get into another niche as his commoditizes. The change has already cut his income in half this year.

Long story short, I never could have imagined copying his business in his market. That's insanity.

MJ, Zen, Vig, and Bio, I want to take this moment and thank you guys for your time and effort in mentoring some of us. Your efforts are appreciated.

MJ, I'll stick around as long as you'll have me even if it becomes paid members only.

 

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[Ikke]

@Inlineflink

While my above story with respect to self-publishing isn't true

Perhaps a closed of section for people who already have a running business? Although it will be difficult and cumbersome to verify. I don't know really, there must be better alternatives.

EDIT: here is an idea. I'm also on another forum which limits the buy/sell/trade section to those who have 300posts and are registered for over a year just to stop scammers. This will be harder to implement here because you would still need something to talk about on the "outside" section which is open to everybody. But that is something for the people that run the forum to fill in.

 

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[LightHouse]

Had to give ya a bad time

 

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[Amail]

What really gets me is neither of these guys thought what they were doing was wrong. On the contrary - they were fairly up front about what they were doing.

Both were younger guys, in their twenties I think. Is it a maturity thing? Will they eventually understand, or are they just damaged goods? How does someone get to that age and not realize copying someone's stuff for your own gain is wrong? Do they view business as war ("All's fair in love and war")? Whatever it takes, get ahead.

I really think the answer is a mix. They didn't realize the harm in what they were doing, but when called out on it their defenses kicked in and they got hard and tough. There's a couple of guys that do not learn from their mistakes.

 

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[cautiouscapy]

MJ,

Even with these recent incidents, there is no place like this on the web (and I am part of various communities).

Sums up why I joined...there is indeed no place like this on the web. I was thinking along that line earlier today, (before I read this thread and caught up on the other) that it's the only place I've found full of intelligent, open, supportive people with a certain business/money mindset and that's why I joined.

I live across the Atlantic Ocean and haven't been able to find anywhere online or face-to-face with the same feel, so I am SOOOO grateful that this forum exists.

I haven't even quite finished reading TMF yet, and I'm still in a slightly murky mental place about my way forward; but I paid to be an INSIDERS before I posted at all because I wanted to make a commitment to joining the community.

It was the open helpful discussions and advice all can read that showed me how valuable this community is. It's hard to see what could be done to protect against this sort of situation, perhaps a few more rules about what information can be posted outside the INSIDERS?

 

[phenom4hire]

Sucks to see this kind of stuff happen. There are always d-bags to ruin things for others. Either way, MJ thanks for the community that you have provided. Big thanks to all you folks who took it upon themselves to give back and help others succeed. Continued success to all of you and regardless of what happens this forum has been an inspiration. Biophase, I hope to be making some purchases before the next season starts, so hopefully you will get some increased business from all the time you have given to this forum.

 

[FastNAwesome]

MJ, I had this happen to me too, so I can totally understand.

this is a great example on how the idiots that make-up 1% of the world ruin it for the responsible 99%

So true, but not always. In this case...only if you let them. This place is UNLIKE ANYTHING else. All I see are replies of people who would love to pay and would love to stay.

It goes for me too, as long as I'm welcome here and can afford it.

It's not just about content, this is an amazing network and amazing community.

I'm sorry that I'm still more on the taker side, as currently stuff I'm good at are programming and dating, such advice I gladly give. But I try to balance that by not asking too much questions either.

(maybe) offtopic - things that make my experience more pleasant:

-> When someone with like 30+ posts but still parked asks yet another question, I ignore it, I don't care.
-> When someone obviously trolls, I block them right away. Because in some other thread they might seem serious and waste my time.

 

[CommonCents]

I'd also agree an invite after X amount of posts would work well to weed out the lazy cheaters.

While it is true that two complete strangers can arrive at the nearly exact same spot as for as products and ideas but as far as youngsters "not knowing" but continuing to offer same exact products as their own mentors or others here after receiving disclosure is total BS.

A good swift firm kick between the uprights in these situations gives instant feedback and does wonders for maturity.