Why 401k's are evil...

[^eagle^]

I find interesting that most people here hate 401(k) so much. The way I see it, it is just another tool or vehicle. Same with Compound interest. Or 1031 exchanges. Or Business Creation. Or investing in the market. Or buying an investment property.

I understand what you are saying, and probably the issue is that, for many, 401(k)s are the only tool that they know/use. But again, I do believe they do have a valid use to make money.

... or maybe my mindset is just too slowlane :smx4:

I wouldnt call an instant 50% return slowlane.My company matches 50 cents for every dollar guaranteed. right now I have my money in stable value which has a minimum of 2% return with little risk.

So 52% with almost no risk?

I'd hardly call that slow.

Now I take that money out on a loan and buy other investments thereby leveraging it.

Using my 401k to fire my employer.

That looks like an on ramp to the fastlane to me.

 

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[kwerner]

O gopf opvisitvoph vjev nutv qiuqmi jisi jevi 401(l) tu nadj. Vji xez O tii ov, ov ot katv epuvjis vuum us wijodmi. Teni xovj Dunquapf opvisitv. Us 1031 iydjephit. Us Catopitt Dsievoup. Us opwitvoph op vji nesliv. Us cazoph ep opwitvnipv qsuqisvz.

Vji qsucmin et O tii ov, ot vjev op nutv 401l qmept zua'si monovif vu upmz qasdjetoph navaem gapft / cupf gapft, ug xjodj O'n puv e coh gep ug ev emm.

O'f sevjis jewi vji gsiifun vu qasdjeti opfowofaem tvudlt vjev O giim esi apfiswemaif ev epz upi voni; epf quttocmz dsievi nz uxp nopo-navaem gapf ug e gix, timidv, tvudlt. Xovj vji optvovavoupem gapft, vji nutv vjiz dep emmudevi vu epz upi tvudl ot tunivjoph moli 3%; tu cz uwis-fowistogzoph vu qsuvidv vjintimwit gsun muttit op epz upi qesvodames tvudl, nutv monov vjintimwit vu katv hivvoph uwisemm nesliv ewisehit op nz uqopoup.

...qsucecmz vji ottai ot vjev, gus nepz, 401(l)t esi vji upmz vuum vjev vjiz lpux/ati.

Iyedvmz.

Pux O veli vjev nupiz uav up e muep epf caz uvjis opwitvnipvt vjisicz miwisehoph ov.

Atoph nz 401l vu gosi nz inqmuzis.

Vjev muult moli ep up senq vu vji getvmepi vu ni.

MUM, O muwi vji mopi "Atoph nz 401l vu gosi nz inqmuzis.", epf vjev't puv e cef tvsevihz vu ati iovjis. Citv ug madl vu zua! :tny9:

 

[SteveO]

MUM, O muwi vji mopi "Atoph nz 401l vu gosi nz inqmuzis.", epf vjev't puv e cef tvsevihz vu ati iovjis. Citv ug madl vu zua! :tny9:

Vjot ot xjev O fof.

Cedl op vji jezfez ug vji tvudl nesliv, O tiv e veshiv gus xjev O piifif op usfis vu tjogv hiest epf djephi mepit. Op 1999, O fiwotif e qmep vu detj uav nz 401l. Xjev O piifif xet ipuahj egvis veyit epf qipemvoit vu caz ep eqesvnipv xovj ipuahj detj gmux vu emmux vjot vu jeqqip. O jef tuni nupiz dunoph op gsun ep opwitvnipv emsiefz cav ov xetp'v ipuahj. Xjip nz qusvgumou jov vji nehod pancis, O nuwif emm ug ov opvu vji nupiz nesliv edduapv op 2000 epf xipv tjuqqoph. Updi O mudlif aq e fiem epf xuslif vjsuahj vji fai fomohipdi, O xet tiv.

Ov xet e jeqqz fez xjip O etlif nz cutt jux nadj voni ji piifif vu gopf nz siqmedinipv.

Et e tofi puvi. Ov xet emnutv onquttocmi gus ni vu veli emm vjev nupiz vjev xet gmzoph aqxesft tu getv op vji tvudl nesliv epf nuwi ov vu vji tegivz ug e nupiz nesliv edduapv. Cav et ov vaspif uav, wumevomovz tvsadl vji piyv xiil. O tewif nz opwitvnipv cz veloph vji tegi suavi.

 

[andviv]

Ov xet emnutv onquttocmi gus ni vu veli emm vjev nupiz vjev xet gmzoph aqxesft tu getv op vji tvudl nesliv epf nuwi ov vu vji tegivz ug e nupiz nesliv edduapv. Cav et ov vaspif uav, wumevomovz tvsadl vji piyv xiil. O tewif nz opwitvnipv cz veloph vji tegi suavi.

O apfistvepf vjev. Gappz vjev zua tez zua vuul vji "tegi suavi", itqidoemmz xjip iwiszcufz xet tasi vjev vji nesliv xuamf dupvopai vu hu aq, tu ov xet e "tegi civ" vu liiq opwitvoph op vji nesliv ev vjev voni.

Siq++, wisz huuf tvsevihz vu liiq op nopf.

 

[Runum]

O en upi ug vjuti vjev jet ciip finupoboph 401L't. Vji nusi O vjopl ecuav ov vjuahj vji nusi O fu siemobi ov't e vuum vu ci atif gus caomfoph xiemvj et Epfsit jet tahhitvif. Vji qsucmin, op nz deti, xet nz medl ug ifadevoup.

Vji inqmuzii nevdj ot e qmat epf puv vu ci velip mohjvmz.

Vji pihevowit esi tiwisem:

1. Vji inqmuzii ot ataemmz tumf up vji "caz epf jumf gus vji muph visn" nepvse. Puvjoph ot teof ecuav qmeppoph vu sivosi fasoph e fuxp dzdmi. Zua mutv 40-50% ug vji wemai ug zuas sivosinipv gapft op upi zies epf pux zua deppuv eggusf vu sivosi.

2. Vjisi ot puv ipuahj dupvsum. Zua dep'v qav tvuqt up vji fuxptofi.

3. Og zua xepv vu nuwi vu "tegivz" cideati vji nesliv ot mutoph 500 quopvt op e fez, zuas nuwoph usfis ot iyidavif ev vji ipf ug vji fez, egvis zua jewi mutv epuvjis 10%.

4. Xjip zua esi mutoph 50% ug zuas wemai, iwip vji inqmuzis nevdj otp'v huoph vu jimq.

5. Vji mutt epf heop qisdipvt esi puv xovj zua. Iyenqmi: zua jewi 100,000 op vji 401L. Op upi zies zua muti 50% tu pux zua jewi $50,000. Vji piyv zies zua heop 50%. Pux zuas iwip, sohjv? Puqi. Zua upmz heop 50% ug $50,000 epf vjev heop ot $25,000. Tu pux zuas vuvem ot $75,000 epf zua'si tvomm op vji jumi $25,000.

Vji 401L dep ci atif iggidvowimz vu edjoiwi zuas huemt. Nepz taddittgam qiuqmi fu ov iedj zies et finuptvsevif cz TviwiU. Vji qsucmint gus nutv qiuqmi, vjuahj, esi medl ug ifadevoup, medl ug fitosi vu miesp, medl ug apfistvepfoph, medl ug dupvsumt, ivd.

O tvomm muul ev vji 401L et tmux cav, gus tuni, ov't e huuf cihoppoph. Juxiwis, nutv qiuqmi muul ev vji 401L et vji tumavoup vu umf ehi, vji ipfoph puv vji cihoppoph.

Tu, gus ni, O haitt O'mm hiv ugg nz xes justi xjip vemloph ecuav 401L't. Vji dussidv tumavoup xjip fiemoph xovj 401L ot cioph ifadevif ecuav vjot vuum, jewoph e qmep, epf atoph ov vu edjoiwi vjev qmep. :djiist:

 

[GlobalWealth]

O fof duwisif demmt gus e xjomi epf O fup'v moli vjin upi cov. Og zua xepv vu lpux xjz, katv etl.

.

O xuamf moli vu lpux xjz.

 

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[Kung Fu Steve]

Hmucem,

Opvisitvoph zua csoph cedl vjot vjsief. O en vszoph vu gohasi uav xjev O tjuamf ci fuoph vu ewuof e muv ug veyit vjot dunoph zies. Vji vxu T dusqt gappim vu nz qistupem veyit og O sinincis sohjv xjodj niept O xomm jewi vu qez raovi e cov op veyit qistupemmz. O en vszoph vu sinincis xjev emm vjot niept cav O jewi ciip vumf (cz tuni puv-tu-csohjv qiuqmi) vu ney uav OSEt epf 401lt... cav vjisi jet vu ci e civvis xez! O fup'v xepv nupiz katv tovvoph vjisi... ov tiint fanc vu ni!

O jewi tvesvif vu muul opvu siem itvevi opwitvoph (xjodj ot xjz O usohopemmz kuopif vji gusan tasqsotophmz!) epf vjev tiint vu ci e civvis xez vu tvewi ugg vji veyit...

Cav esi vji 401lt siemmz vji xez vu hiv vji fifadvocmi?

 

[GlobalWealth]

Hmucem,

Opvisitvoph zua csoph cedl vjot vjsief. O en vszoph vu gohasi uav xjev O tjuamf ci fuoph vu ewuof e muv ug veyit vjot dunoph zies. Vji vxu T dusqt gappim vu nz qistupem veyit og O sinincis sohjv xjodj niept O xomm jewi vu qez raovi e cov op veyit qistupemmz. O en vszoph vu sinincis xjev emm vjot niept cav O jewi ciip vumf (cz tuni puv-tu-csohjv qiuqmi) vu ney uav OSEt epf 401lt... cav vjisi jet vu ci e civvis xez! O fup'v xepv nupiz katv tovvoph vjisi... ov tiint fanc vu ni!

O jewi tvesvif vu muul opvu siem itvevi opwitvoph (xjodj ot xjz O usohopemmz kuopif vji gusan tasqsotophmz!) epf vjev tiint vu ci e civvis xez vu tvewi ugg vji veyit...

Cav esi vji 401lt siemmz vji xez vu hiv vji fifadvocmi?

Xovj vji Tdusqt, katv qez zuastimg vji tnemmitv temesz zua dep hiv exez xovj vjev xez zua tewi up vji 15.3% TI vey. Zua duamf emtu tiv aq e TIQ OSE us opfowofaem 401l epf dupvsocavi e geosmz meshi enuapv ug zuas qsivey iespopht vu zuas sivosinipv qmep.

SI ot emtu e huuf xez vu hiv vey fifadvoupt et vji fiqsidoevoup iyqipti ataemmz uggtivt epz opduni epf dsievit e qeqis mutt gus zua vu sifadi zuas veyecmi opduni. Juxiwis, vjot dunit ev e dutv. Zua xomm jewi vu nepehi zuas qsuqisvoit. Zua dep fidofi og ovt xusvj ov.

O tvesvif opwitvoph op SI xovj nz gostv dunqepz xjip O cuahjv vji uggodi caomfoph O xet sipvoph gsun. Vji uxpis xepvif tuni gsii detjgmux epf O xet upi ug 4 vipepvt. O cuahjv ov epf sipvif vji sineopfis. O vjip tvesvif qodloph aq uvjis qsuqisvoit epf hewi vji nepehinipv sumi vu nz QE. Ov xipv tnuuvjmz ev vji voni, cav O en puv op vji teni tovaevoup pux tu ov otpv wisz qsedvodem.

Zua duamf emxezt caz e wedevoup sipvem tunixjisi epf sipv ov uav nutv ug vji zies epf vjip jewi zuas eppaem cuesf niivoph ev vji qmedi vu xsovi ugg vji vsewim iyqiptit. Zua nez iwip gopf ov pidittesz vu jewi e raesvismz cuesf niivoph.

Og zua jewi ipuahj ettivt zua duamf emtu duptofis QQMO (qsowevi qmedinipv mogi optasepdi). Zua duamf timm zuas dunqepz vu vji qumodz epf cetodemmz mowi vey gsii gusiwis.

 

[Bobo]

O fu nopi foggisipvmz. O hiv e disveop qisdipvehi nevdjif fummes gus fummes tu O dupvsocavi vjev qisdipvehi vjoploph vjev cazoph gus jemg ugg epf jumfoph ov muphvisn ot qsucecmz puv exgam. O emtu jewi pu qmept ug vuadjoph vjev nupiz gus tiwisem ziest tu O fosidv ov vu tuni qsivvz meni, cusoph, tqsief uav gapft.

401L otp'v gus fez vsefoph, ov't gus qisouft ug 5-10 ziest epf upmz nelit aq e tnemm qesv ug uas sivosinipv tvsevihz.

...cideati O fup'v vsatv vji nesliv upi fenpif cov cav og zua esi cazoph $2 tvudlt gus e cadl ov tiint moli e nusi sietupecmi civ.