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Web 3.0 (Ethereum) is happening, and most people have no idea what it even is.

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LifeTransformer

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rogue synthetic

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Without straying into the back-and-forth here, it's worth expanding on the potential in the blockchain technology. I was originally on the fence about crypto a few years ago, and I don't think it's unreasonable to be hesitant at this point in the hockey-stick.

(Some of this may have been said up thread, and I apologize if so, but I just want to make a post about this.)

What changed my mind was realising how serious the potential is for serious upheavals from this technology. Using Bitcoin for point-of-sale transactions is like using a hydrogen bomb to light a cigarette.

Someone above said that a BTC string used in a transaction is "just" an encrypted string. That's technically true. But it's technically true in the way that finding 2 tons of gold in your deceased grandfather's basement is "just" discovering a lump of the element with an atomic number of 72.

Not technically false, but you haven't understood the meaning of the message.

The reason the blockchain should be on everyone's radar has to do with what that encryption can be used for. The blockchain enables what the technical folks call triple-entry accounting. From that article, blockchain is applied cryptography which

can be used to create trust between parties to a transaction that may be neither known to nor trusted by one another (the so-called “two generals” problem). The world economy is filled with trust problems and systems that have been developed to deal with them. If you are a lender, how do you know whether your borrower will repay you? (FICO scoring) If you are a manufacturer, how do you know that the raw materials you receive from your foreign suppliers will meet your specifications? (quality control) If you are an investor or regulator, how do you know whether the financial statements presented by a company are accurate or to what extent they are unreliable?

Translated into ordinary talk, that just means that when Alice and Bob get together and decide to exchange Good A for Service B, Alice doesn't need to trust Bob and Bob doesn't need to trust Alice. And they don't need a third-party (we call them banks) to oversee the transaction, so that one side doesn't take advantage of the other.

Maybe that doesn't sound too interesting. It's just a financial transaction, or maybe a more sophisticated contractual instrument, nothing world-shaking, right?

Not so fast.

Everybody tends to filter novelty through ideas we already understand, so it's easy to be blind to events with black swan potential.

But if any of you happen to be familiar with the range of "trust problems and systems that have been developed to deal with them" in economics and social science, well, it doesn't take a terribly vivid imagination to see what possibilities open up once you've got a technical solution for the trustless coordination of agents.

I'm agnostic about any particular coin, and I think at this stage all you can do is keep your options open.

The technology itself, though, I don't see that going anywhere. In 10 years none of these coins could still be around. Or Bitcoin could be sitting at $100K. Or one of the small-time outfits could blow up into the Facebook to Bitcoin's Myspace. Who knows?

It could turn out that the banks all snap it up, or that governments crack down and it goes underground, or we end up living in a Neil Stephenson novel.

Envisioning blockchain technology as one more way to execute current banking and financial instruments is like looking up from your desk one day in 1988 after reading an article about ArpaNet with a Tim Berners-Lee by-line, wondering to yourself how this World Wide Web thing is going to revolutionize your morning newspaper.

You're not exactly wrong, it is going to be one hell of an upset for your morning paper, but you've barely glimpsed the reality.

Nailing specific predictions about specific coins and specific uses doesn't matter very much. What matters is that you can recognize that the technology -- the concept behind it -- is capable of creating some serious upheavals in the value landscape.
 

GoGetter24

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Nailing specific predictions about specific coins and specific uses doesn't matter very much.
It does if your plan is to get rich.

According to Wikipedia, Dogecoin - Wikipedia currently has a $2 billion market cap. That is retardation.

And I'm literally laughing out loud after scrolling up and seeing DOGE on that pay-in-crypto sign.

This is going to pan out something like the 2000 tech bubble. You'll get tech companies that were actually making something of value, like Microsoft, Apple, PayPal, (and even DeMarcos limo service) coming out of it fine.

And the 99% junk that are merely byproducts of the bubble will get vaporized.
Takes a lot of restraint to avoid putting money in that 99%, as even Isaac Newton learned, but it's necessary if you want to get rich instead of making some other clowns rich.

 
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Coalission

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This is going to pan out something like the 2000 tech bubble. You'll get tech companies that were actually making something of value, like Microsoft, Apple, PayPal, (and even DeMarcos limo service) coming out of it fine.

Wow, what a riveting analogy I’ve never heard before, almost as good as the one I heard earlier today about it being like the tulip bubble. Can you go more into detail on this?

As expected, you’re learning as you go. First, it was that cryptocurrencies will end up as worthless bits on a hard drive. Now, you’re saying blockchain and cryptocurrencies will change the world like the internet did, but not all companies building on this new technology will survive, the way they didn’t survive the dot-com bubble (amazing insight).

Can’t wait until your next opinion, I’ll be here waiting on the edge of my seat.
 

Coalission

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or that governments crack down and it goes underground,.

Always a concern with new technologies, but it doesn't seem like that's the route they're taking, considering the US Government Accountability Office just added it to their Strategic Plan for 2018-2023, along with Genome Editing, Artificial Intelligence, Quantum Information Science, and Brain/Augmented Reality (no Beanie Babies or Segways?):

https://www.gao.gov/assets/700/690262.pdf

TmfjuSZl.png


I don't know if they've checked in with GoGetter24 though, so this can all change.
 

LifeTransformer

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Hyrum

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This is what gives the space a bad vibe.

(Other than ponzi's and exit scams of course :p ).

How so? You mean to say no white guy has ever done a lame rap about capitalism before? Or the stock market? And Ponzi / Pump & Dump schemes haven't occurred prior to cryptocurrencies? Why are these things only a problem with blockchain based investments?
 

Hyrum

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Cringe factor.

And the other raps aren't cringe-worthy? Or what makes the #hodlgang rap more cringe-worthy than the capitalist or stock market raps? Let's face it, in this day and age you can find a lame youtube video about anything, so using that as a basis to disregard an entire industry is a little disingenuous.
 

LifeTransformer

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And the other raps aren't cringe-worthy? Or what makes the #hodlgang rap more cringe-worthy than the capitalist or stock market raps? Let's face it, in this day and age you can find a lame youtube video about anything, so using that as a basis to disregard an entire industry is a little disingenuous.

What are you talking about? :rofl:

In my opinion, that video is solely responsible for the recent drop in the Bitcoin price.

I guess you've not read a single post of mine in this thread...
 

Kingmaker

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LifeTransformer

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DVU

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Genuine question and I might just lack the info or am missing something.

Anyway, if let's say some crypto goes mainstream and has a "stable" value, what will stop "criminals" from doing their business with it.

I need a kilo of the white, I just wire the dealer the crypto. And if it's going to be decentralized, meaning no one controls it, that can be done on a much larger scale.

Anyone care to provide some insight?
 

LifeTransformer

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Genuine question and I might just lack the info or am missing something.

Anyway, if let's say some crypto goes mainstream and has a "stable" value, what will stop "criminals" from doing their business with it.

I need a kilo of the white, I just wire the dealer the crypto. And if it's going to be decentralized, meaning no one controls it, that can be done on a much larger scale.

Anyone care to provide some insight?

Nothing. But, what stops them doing it with old fashioned cash or gold?
 
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rogue synthetic

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Genuine question and I might just lack the info or am missing something.

Anyway, if let's say some crypto goes mainstream and has a "stable" value, what will stop "criminals" from doing their business with it.

I need a kilo of the white, I just wire the dealer the crypto. And if it's going to be decentralized, meaning no one controls it, that can be done on a much larger scale.

Anyone care to provide some insight?

This was a big selling point on cryptography for some forward-thinkers back in the late 80s and the 90s.

Neal Stephenson even wrote a couple of novels around that time that involved cryptocurrencies destroying nation-states by preventing them from collecting taxes.

Then again, there's also this.
 

Parker P

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Sorry to disrupt the main debate going on in this thread right now, but has anyone here started developing any DApps? It's an area that I, along with probably a good amount of other people on this forum, am interested in. It would be cool if someone started the first progress thread, or any thread for that matter, related to DApp development.
 

DVU

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Nothing. But, what stops them doing it with old fashioned cash or gold?

Nothing, but it includes a high amount of risky moves in order to pull off.

Transfering the money(if found, you would probably be asked what is the purpose)
Having to physically meet the other person
Storing it
You cant always just go and buy things with physical cash
And a number of others

If this did to happen and there is nothing to regulate it, it would be like if the banks and financial regulatory institutions would close their eyes and you could just send money around in any amounts.

That just seems like the countries would lose a lot of control
 

GoGetter24

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No honest person thinks it's just as easy to do contraband ecommerce with non-crypto methods. It removes one of two legs of difficulty from the process. That's why it took off.

Outside of speculation, the only large scale use of crypto for actual commerce has been contraband. Simply because the more convenient standard online payment methods weren't usable due to having to provide ID.

Still waiting for my landlord to accept DOGE. Or even not to laugh when I explain what it is.
 

LifeTransformer

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Here are a couple of interesting articles relating to the dark web side of things:

Bitcoin Is Falling Out of Favor on the Dark Web

Study Suggests 25 Percent of Bitcoin Users Are Associated With Illegal ...

They're just relating to Bitcoin.

There was also one that showed that as adoption has increased, the number of illicit transactions has fallen. But I can't seem to find that I'm afraid.

There will always be a negative side to any new technology. Is 3D printing inherently bad because it can be used to make weapons? (Just an example). There are always trade offs, and cryptocurrencies have also been used for a lot of good too.
 
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GoGetter24

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3D printing is a great play. No one is calling 3D printing a bullshit investment, because it's almost impossible to. There's even companies working on printing human organ tissue. If you needed a new organ printed, how much would you be willing to pay? Everything and then some. They should be getting the investment, not this junk.

Of course, investing in 3D printing technology just isn't the same level of ease and excitement and follow the crowd.

There's a big list of compelling human needs, and crypto currencies & tokens aren't one of them.
 

LifeTransformer

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3D printing is a great play. No one is calling 3D printing a bullshit investment, because it's almost impossible to. There's even companies working on printing human organ tissue. If you needed a new organ printed, how much would you be willing to pay? Everything and then some. They should be getting the investment, not this junk.

Of course, investing in 3D printing technology just isn't the same level of ease and excitement and follow the crowd.

There's a big list of compelling human needs, and crypto currencies & tokens aren't one of them.

Where did I say it wasn't? I Merely used it as an example of a technology that can be used for bad as well as good.

3D bio-printing is an amazing technology / 3D printed weapons not so good.

(I'm sure some will argue otherwise on that point, I'm not getting into a gun control debate).

If you don't believe there is a need for cryptocurrencies/tokens, then fair enough. Tell that to the people of Zimbabwe and Venezuela.

“Interest in bitcoin has peaked as people cannot send money outside or pay for international transactions using formal banks,” Yeukai Kusangaya, a trade coordinator at the Golix bitcoin exchange in Zimbabwe, told Quartz.
Bitcoin is worth $13,500 in Zimbabwe right now

“The only reason they have survived is because they invested in cryptocurrencies,” she said.

“This is not a matter of politics. This is a matter of survival”

Cryptocurrencies have also facilitated some great charitable work too.

“I am happy to have been blessed with the opportunity to personally support SENS's efforts. Their focus on creating solutions to the diseases of aging, one of the greatest problems facing humanity, is very much in line with my goal to positively impact the lives of millions of people around the world.”

The SENS Research Foundation has already received two large donations totaling $2 million in Bitcoin (BTC) from the anonymous Bitcoin-only charity fund, Pineapple Fund — the first million dollars in December 2017 and another $1 million in BTC on Feb. 2.

https://cointelegraph.com/news/vitalik-buterin-donates-24-million-in-ether-to-anti-aging-research

Cryptocurrencies were also used for donations direct to Mexico when an earthquake hit:

Help Mexico recover: donate with Bitcoin, Ether, Ripple — Steemit
 
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GoGetter24

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But @GoGetter24, my landlord won't accept 3D prints!
Yes, because like cryptocurrency, no normal person considers them money.

Where did I say it wasn't?
Tell that to the people of Zimbabwe and Venezuela.
Cryptocurrencies have also facilitated some great charitable work too.
I feel this is a good example of, as DeMarco pointed out in his books, someone being more concerned with being right than being rich. All these things you say look like rebuttals, but aren't, and it's a waste of time getting sucked into your little game of being technically right. Hopefully you'll be able to pay your rent with that technical rightness in a couple of years, instead of having to move back in with your parents.

So hopefully your "LifeTransformer" isn't like Obama's "Change" (versus Progress). You have nothing honest or insightful to say, so I'm removing your steam of text from my sight.

Anyway I only dropped into this farce thread again to post those hilarious videos, but I got sucked back in. I'll exit. All I can say to everyone participating in this charade is: please don't gamble more than you can afford to lose.
 

Kingmaker

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Yes, because like cryptocurrency, no normal person considers them money.
If merchants start accepting it along with fiat, why wouldn't they consider it money?

And here's 9 reasons for the merchants to do just that:
64jw2DC.jpg
 

LifeTransformer

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Yes, because like cryptocurrency, no normal person considers them money.

I feel this is a good example of, as DeMarco pointed out in his books, someone being more concerned with being right than being rich. All these things you say look like rebuttals, but aren't, and it's a waste of time getting sucked into your little game of being technically right. Hopefully you'll be able to pay your rent with that technical rightness in a couple of years, instead of having to move back in with your parents.

So hopefully your "LifeTransformer" isn't like Obama's "Change" (versus Progress). You have nothing honest or insightful to say, so I'm removing your steam of text from my sight.

Anyway I only dropped into this farce thread again to post those hilarious videos, but I got sucked back in. I'll exit. All I can say to everyone participating in this charade is: please don't gamble more than you can afford to lose.

:rofl:

Thanks for proving my first point, it really is pointless arguing with you.
 

Coalission

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And furthermore, most of the talk of using "blockchain technology" for within companies, is nonsense. There is no compelling advantage over centralized databases.

I currently see no good reason to put time and money in anything related to the blockchain concept. Any money put in it just looks like gambling than investment in a compelling play, which strikes me as unwise.

Well, Google thinks your opinion is shit. But what do they know, eh?

Google is adopting blockchain-like technology
 

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