The Ukraine War, implications, outcome?

[Black_Dragon43]

It's not as simple as that. Russia has a strong army too. This war will be different to anything we've ever seen if more countries get involved. Russia could easily drop bombs in US and US could do the same with Russia.

Putin is not stupid. If his own life would be in danger, and he knew there would be massive retaliation, he would back down. He's precisely counting on Western weakness, and our fear of war.

 

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[c4n]

Has anyone seen reports of Ukraine's armed forces resisting? So far Russia seems to be going in unopposed.

Too early for a major opposition. Most of the attacks were probably with precision-guided missiles that took out most of the Ukrainian air force, radars, army communications and alike, with Russian ground forces entering the country in pro-Russian parts of the country or using paths where they are unlikely to find fierce opposition.

Ukraine and it's armed forces are most likely in a state of shock right now, they need to make sure as much of their armed forces and equipment stay alive during the initial attacks. One of the surviving Su-27 fighters for example fled to Romania. It may take days, if not weeks, for them to consolidate, reorganize and prepare for serious opposition, let alone a counterattack. Until then, we're likely to see pockets of resistance.

 

[p0stscript]

Has anyone seen reports of Ukraine's armed forces resisting? So far Russia seems to be going in unopposed.

Ukraine conflict: What we know about the invasion

Russia has launched a large-scale military attack on its southern neighbour - here's what we know.

www.bbc.co.uk

There is some resistance it seems, how good remains to be seen.

 

[WestCoast]

I hate to be contrarian but..... why does the US need to get involved at all?

Why do the war drums beat so loudly.
Well, we know why... the military industrial complex is vast.
Afghanistan ended, so, we need a new war?


I don't get it.
I have a Russian wife.
I spent a month in Ukraine last year.

Russia and Ukraine have often been at war.
Why do others need to get involved here in national building?


What am I missing here.
This just seems like another distraction for anyone not nearby.

 

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[Tony100]

Regarding your statement about the US having one of the weakest and incompetent leaders on the planet, it is concerning who we have in the UK now at times like this.

I think we should be thankful Jeremy Corbyn wasn't elected! He wanted to disband NATO and ruled out ever using nuclear weapons, even hinting he would scrap our nuclear defences. He was opposed to the concept of having a military, deploying troops or ever supporting NATO allies.

What kind of a message would this guy have sent to Russia?

I agree with you that Johnson should resign but I'm so glad the alternative, Corbyn, didn't get in.

 

[woken]

It’s a delicate situation. Most want to avoid war and that is taken advantage of.

At some point the only way out they’ll see is through war.

Hopefully not.

 

[David Fitz]

I hate to be contrarian but..... why does the US need to get involved at all?

Why do the war drums beat so loudly.
Well, we know why... the military industrial complex is vast.
Afghanistan ended, so, we need a new war?


I don't get it.
I have a Russian wife.
I spent a month in Ukraine last year.

Russia and Ukraine have often been at war.
Why do others need to get involved here in national building?


What am I missing here.
This just seems like another distraction for anyone not nearby.

Bidens son does some shady business with the Ukrainians so he must be protecting his own interests and those who are involved with Ukraine.

Is it true that the Ukraine leader put his competitors in jail and shut newspapers who were talking about him?

 

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[woken]

My INSIDERS expired and look at what ads I get :


Soon we’ll have Fastlane Forum : War Archives

Stay safe ladies & gentlemen.

 

[TonyStark]

LOL I knew somebody would say something when I wrote the words "too close for comfort."

Liking voluntary discomfort and preferring not to suffer involuntarily in life are two different things, though.

You mean that’s just an entrepreneurial ruse ?!

 

[TonyStark]

This is all the West’s fault. If I were US President I would not allow Putin a single inch. How dare he dictate terms? I should dictate the terms to him, and he BETTER obey if he cares about his life.

But the Western philosophy is “OMG we don’t want to start a WW3, so we have to be careful” — because they have NO BALLS whatsoever. (Something that Putin knows, which is why he is doing this in the first place)

Instead what Biden should have done is said that ONE Russian soldier over Ukraine’s border means war with America. And for what Putin did last night he should’ve sent stealth bombers to take out certain key targets in Moscow. Directly. No questions asked. With the clear message that if he doesn’t pull back, it will look ugly for him, no matter the cost.

But again, the West has no balls. We telegraph to Putin that we’re not willing to pay ANY price to stop him.

Yeah let’s not try to be diplomatic at all and start a nuclear arms race lol good one

 

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[MTF]

You mean that’s just an entrepreneurial ruse ?!

Not sure what you mean. I practice what I preach through voluntary discomfort. This doesn't mean I want involuntary suffering in my life.

You can practice discomfort through wild camping but it doesn't mean you want to live in a tent.

You can practice martial artists but it doesn't mean you want to get jumped by gangbangers.

Likewise, you can practice mental resilience but it doesn't mean you'll stay in a country affected by war that has nothing to do with you.

Any sane person, no matter how tough otherwise, would choose health over disease and peace over war.

I hope it won't come to that. But the risk is there and a smart thing is to have a plan just in case.

 

[Black_Dragon43]

Yeah let’s not try to be diplomatic at all and start a nuclear arms race lol good one

Diplomacy? You've got to be KIDDING. Putin, Xi, and dictators like him look at diplomacy as WEAKNESS. You're diplomatic because you're weak and have no balls. They don't care about diplomacy. Two days ago they were saying they will not invade, and boom, all of a sudden in early morning hours there is an invasion. You cannot negotiate or be diplomatic with parties who do not hold their word. If Putin tells you he'll do something or he won't do something, you can't trust it, because he lies with every breath he takes.

Why do the war drums beat so loudly.
Well, we know why... the military industrial complex is vast.
Afghanistan ended, so, we need a new war?

Because the US is next, in due time. The only reason why the US has maintained a dominant position is precisely because it has enforced itself around the globe. Nowadays, that has started to falter, with the HUMILIATION in Afghanistan, where some savages from the desert took over the entire country with zero opposition. If I was from the US, I would be embarrassed to be humiliated on the world stage like that. What message does that send to my opponents? That some uneducated desert savages can defeat me?

 

[Guest-5ty5s4]

I’m going to get a lot of flak for this, but this is a moment where I wish Trump was still president, as flawed as he was.

That dude would not mess around. He did crazy stuff and foreign dictators feared and respected him.

He might say something that upsets people in a speech, but he's the kind of guy I'd like in the WH during World War 3, like Churchill was for Britain in World War 2.

 

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[nothingness]

My thoughts:

It feels like Russia have more right to Ukraine than the US / UK had to Iraq and especially Afghanistan. How can we whine about Russia when we did that since 2001? Then we suddenly left it and the Taliban took over anyway. Also Russia has part of itself 3 countries into Europe; Russia - Estonia - Latvia - Lithuania - Russia again (Kalinigrad).
What's the difference between Russia invading Ukraine and the UK taking the Falklands from Argentina?

Also, at times like below screenshot I feel like the West deserves to fall:

 

[nothingness]

I think we should be thankful Jeremy Corbyn wasn't elected! He wanted to disband NATO and ruled out ever using nuclear weapons, even hinting he would scrap our nuclear defences. He was opposed to the concept of having a military, deploying troops or ever supporting NATO allies.

What kind of a message would this guy have sent to Russia?

I agree with you that Johnson should resign but I'm so glad the alternative, Corbyn, didn't get in.

We don't even know if Trident works; a huge part of the launch code is "sanitized" by US coders. We don't know if we could launch without US permission, or if the US can launch "on our behalf". https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200607/cmselect/cmdfence/225/225we06.htm

 

[woken]

We don't even know if Trident works; a huge part of the launch code is "sanitized" by US coders. We don't know if we could launch without US permission, or if the US can launch "on our behalf". https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200607/cmselect/cmdfence/225/225we06.htm

They won’t start a major thing without the other one’s approval in this case I presume.

There’s only us on this planet and we cannot get along.

 

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[puredot]

If any real military tensions begin between NATO and Russia, my first plan is to drive to Switzerland. I can get there in 12 hours. Switzerland has been neutral since 1815 so it's the safest option in Europe.

Same situation here. I am in Poland and Switzerland seems appealing - some of my family lives there.

 

[EmotionEngine]

My opinion:

1. Russia takes full control over Ukraine eventually.

2. Russia starts moving further southeast.

 

[peddletothemetal]

Poland is a NATO member so that's a whole different level game than Ukraine.

Dunno man, know any western leaders with the guts to press the button?

Biden & co would be grumbling disapprovingly and talking about sanctions with their tanks parked on his lawn.

The only language conquerors understand is "if you invade, at least one of us will die" from someone believable.

 

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[Guest-5ty5s4]

Dunno man, know any western leaders with the guts to press the button?

Biden & co would be grumbling disapprovingly and talking about sanctions with their tanks parked on his lawn.

The only language conquerors understand is "if you invade, at least one of us will die" from someone believable.

Just remember that in WW2 it took Pearl Harbor before the USA got involved.

But it also ended with the USA dropping the ultimate weapon on Japan, so...

I wouldn't be here if not for that. My great grandfather was about to be sent to combat. He would have been the oldest group, being in his 30's. They were running out of 18 year olds.

It is still very sad and depressing what happened to the civilians in those cities.

 

[Trevor Kuntz]

I think this was inevitable since 2014 (Euromaiden) and I think Russia will topple the current Ukrainian government, annex more eastern Ukrainian territory into a pro-Russian buffer state (quasi-independent), install a puppet government in Ukraine, and Ukraine will once again become the buffer state it was prior to 2014.

Long-term, I'd be more worried to be a Baltic country than I'd be worried to be Romania or Bulgaria for that same reason, that Russia wants more buffer zone.

US population in 1990 was 250M and is now 320M. Russian population was 148M in 1990 and is now 144M. I don't see Russia having any internal pressure to permanently expand territorially in a modern Lebensraum, I think they just want weak, pro-Russian buffer states on their border.

Short-term, considering how many economic bubbles exist and each bubble being a domino in a long line of dominoes, I'm more worried that this event could be the one that shakes the table. I sold all my speculative investments (ie stocks and crypto) on Feb 14. I'd honestly rather hold cash for a bit.

 

[missinfinity98]

You will know if I target you with this - hello to you

You guys sit behind your screens chatting about it like old aunties gossiping by tea. You find it entertaining
Chilling.

Does it play on your ego? Do you feel a bit more superior to not being born in a country like Ukraine? You don't have to answer.
You are not better than those clapping for gladiators slaying themselves or people cheering in animal fights.

You get to comment, from your safe, cozy places. Get a look at how your own countries are rotten from the core... All the censorship, propaganda. Now I am talking about the US - the only people believing the US is great are some naive Americans and teenagers watching too many Marvel movies (some finally grow up).

The old world order starts to crumble and everyone playing the "democratic" farse will have trouble wrapping their heads around it. Because Hollywood garbage starts to stink of plastic way too hard, and the whole world knows how Disneyland is a trash place. This is a metaphor.

And you know what? Respect is earned, not given.

Repulsive

 

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[Guest-5ty5s4]

You will know if I target you with this - hello to you

You guys sit behind your screens chatting about it like old aunties gossiping by tea. You find it entertaining
Chilling.

Does it play on your ego? Do you feel a bit more superior to not being born in a country like Ukraine? You don't have to answer.
You are not better than those clapping for gladiators slaying themselves or people cheering in animal fights.

You get to comment, from your safe, cozy places. Get a look at how your own countries are rotten from the core... All the censorship, propaganda. Now I am talking about the US - the only people believing the US is great are some naive Americans and teenagers watching too many Marvel movies (some finally grow up).

The old world order starts to crumble and everyone playing the "democratic" farse will have trouble wrapping their heads around it. Because Hollywood garbage starts to stink of plastic way too hard, and the whole world knows how Disneyland is a trash place. This is a metaphor.

And you know what? Respect is earned, not given.

Repulsive

wtf are you talking about? Everyone here has been pretty critical of the US and its corruption as well.

 

[MattR82]

You will know if I target you with this - hello to you

You guys sit behind your screens chatting about it like old aunties gossiping by tea. You find it entertaining
Chilling.

Does it play on your ego? Do you feel a bit more superior to not being born in a country like Ukraine? You don't have to answer.
You are not better than those clapping for gladiators slaying themselves or people cheering in animal fights.

You get to comment, from your safe, cozy places. Get a look at how your own countries are rotten from the core... All the censorship, propaganda. Now I am talking about the US - the only people believing the US is great are some naive Americans and teenagers watching too many Marvel movies (some finally grow up).

The old world order starts to crumble and everyone playing the "democratic" farse will have trouble wrapping their heads around it. Because Hollywood garbage starts to stink of plastic way too hard, and the whole world knows how Disneyland is a trash place. This is a metaphor.

And you know what? Respect is earned, not given.

Repulsive

Oh my god you are an absolute blow-hard. Read the thread before being so dramatic.

Please, for the love of God, go back to Facebook.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

the West has no balls.

American leadership has no balls. The men are wearing dresses and the military is more worried about political correctness than actual defense or warfare. The American gov doesn't speak for its citizens. The government is its own enttity and we no longer have a representative government, except for the small towns and cities. The larger entities have been taken over by corporations and special interests.

 

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[Mathuin]

All I know is I'm set to make a fortune

 

[Xeon]

You will know if I target you with this - hello to you

You guys sit behind your screens chatting about it like old aunties gossiping by tea. You find it entertaining
Chilling.

Does it play on your ego? Do you feel a bit more superior to not being born in a country like Ukraine? You don't have to answer.
You are not better than those clapping for gladiators slaying themselves or people cheering in animal fights.

You get to comment, from your safe, cozy places. Get a look at how your own countries are rotten from the core... All the censorship, propaganda. Now I am talking about the US - the only people believing the US is great are some naive Americans and teenagers watching too many Marvel movies (some finally grow up).

The old world order starts to crumble and everyone playing the "democratic" farse will have trouble wrapping their heads around it. Because Hollywood garbage starts to stink of plastic way too hard, and the whole world knows how Disneyland is a trash place. This is a metaphor.

And you know what? Respect is earned, not given.

Repulsive

Bravo. Are you from Ukraine? I would actually want to know what's happening there from a local instead of the mainstream media. I'm getting the alternative news from Twitter and Reddit.

 

[Guest-5ty5s4]

Bravo. Are you from Ukraine? I would actually want to know what's happening there from a local instead of the mainstream media. I'm getting the alternative news from Twitter and Reddit.

There are a few users here who are from Ukraine, I'd like to hear from them. One was a girl starting a dating site. Another sent me a PM once.

 

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[woken]

Of course we get to comment. I don’t see anyone sipping tea though. Most of us are actually very very troubled about what is happening.

History taught us - war is not the solution. I am deeply sorry about the situation. We only wake up to it now because of media, but it has been going on for years.

I don’t know what Russia wants, nor Ukraine, US/UK or Nato.
Time will only tell if this will escalate to WW3.

 

[Kevin88660]

Looks like Russia is invading Ukraine now. I wonder how far this will go.

This is already 21th century. Territory expansion usually don’t end well.

Most people did not expect Putin to really launch the attacks (sending troops to recognise the separate states going independent) besides the earlier covet actions in East Ukraine fighting against Ukraine government forces.

The reason is you can invade and occupy the entire Ukraine but then so what. Ukraine gdp per cap is less than half of Russia. Are you going to do charity to lift them out of poverty? Russia can provide welfare to the small separatist region because they are small.

It is the same reason that The U.S. administration is trying to drop its global obligation in the world. It started in Obama era, accelerated in Trump administration and Biden is just doing the same thing. You just cannot run a global empire or being a world police with any hope of seeing any profit in that. You are just going to bleed the nation, bankrupting the country and sending body bags home getting involved in conflicts all over the world. We saw that in British empire and USSR.

Eventually I think it will end quickly not because of global pressure but simply because Russia’s weak economy does not allow her to carry on the ongoing military actions for too long and the worse nightmare is to pump into money into newly occupied territory to “build them”.

Putin’s official reason for the attack is Nato expansion undermines Russia’s security. I think that is a only 50 percent. I think another reason is actually with the exception in areas with strong Russian ties, the broad Eastern Europe is actually becoming more and more pro west, especially among the young people. This actually undermines his narrative of projecting Russia’s power and influnce abroad.

The reason is simple. Western Europe has higher living standard. You naturally want to live, move and associated with richer friends in the neighborhood. Better wages, better healthcare, better social safety net…”If we join them we gonna live like them”.

“If we join them we gonna live like them” is just another illusion by association. EU is held together because the only economic powerhouse Germany is still willing to pay to sustain it. The common market, common currency provide the ecosystem that made in German goods can be sold to all over Europe, and pushing German industrial standards all over the world. Once the incentive for the German to hold the big family together is gone, everything gonna fall apart. The German is not going to pay for Greece civil servants retire at age 45.

The problem with the Eastern European diplomatic and economic development mentality in general is that “they want to marry into a rich family without putting in the grind from poor to rich”. You cannot skip the sweat shop stages that Japan and Korea went through.

It is all linked together because they have such high (false hope) that joining the west will solve all the economic issues, they are paying a super high price in offending Russia which is not worth it.