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NOTABLE! The 4 Hour Work Week Vs. Millionaire Fastlane

LiveEntrepreneur

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I prefer TMF to 4HWW. It resonated more with me.

But here is what I will say about the 4HWW:

I have never seen a book successful entrepreneurs have attributed to their success more than the 4HWW.

I could name more than 30 successful big hitters online that has attributed a lot of their success or the fire that started it all to the 4HWW.

I'm not saying TF isn't full of bullshit or a fraud.

I'm not saying 4HWW was not full of fluff.

But to say all those big hitters don't know what they are talking about is stretching it too far.

So take what you will from this thread but the 4HWW was a phenomenon.

Read this:

http://www.tropicalmba.com/4hww-10-year-anniversary/
I have no doubt his methods work, but just saying its hard to get anything out of the book, maybe if read it another 5 times. But his lifestyle isn't for me anyways just picked it up because started some passive income ideas but now I am thinking differently again, just can't make up my mind lol.
 

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Moneydluffy

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I prefer TMF to 4HWW. It resonated more with me.

But here is what I will say about the 4HWW:

I have never seen a book successful entrepreneurs have attributed to their success more than the 4HWW.

I could name more than 30 successful big hitters online that has attributed a lot of their success or the fire that started it all to the 4HWW.

I'm not saying TF isn't full of bullshit or a fraud.

I'm not saying 4HWW was not full of fluff.

But to say all those big hitters don't know what they are talking about is stretching it too far.

So take what you will from this thread but the 4HWW was a phenomenon.

Read this:

http://www.tropicalmba.com/4hww-10-year-anniversary/
I think the phenomenon and the success with the 4 hour work week you are speaking about isn't necessarily that it gave people the tools or the hows but it made them aware that there is a possibity to make money online, an alternative to the 9-to-5 rat race.

It made them aware of something like the Fastlane, similarly how TMF didn't really gave you a step by step how to guide but a concept.
 

banjoa

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I think the phenomenon and the success with the 4 hour work week you are speaking about isn't necessarily that it gave people the tools or the hows but it made them aware that there is a possibity to make money online, an alternative to the 9-to-5 rat race.

It made them aware of something like the Fastlane, similarly how TMF didn't really gave you a step by step how to guide but a concept.
That's exactly how I view the 4HWW. It was the mentality change it gave people.

That a book written 10 years (that's like a century nowadays) ago still creeps up constantly on a forum dedicated to another book speaks volume.
 

RHL

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So, I've read both of MJ's books and most/all of his posts on here. I also recently read 4HWW and have tooled around on the 4-Hour Blog a bit.

Takeaways:

Although Ferriss never says it outright, it's pretty obvious that his FTE, supplement brand, and subsequent liquidation event were the real mojo behind his 4-Hour life. While people who still work can enjoy a pale imitation of what he has as a result of a fastlane enterprise that has matured and been liquidated, their retirements are "mini," and when it comes to freedom and autonomy, they're worshiping a false idol. What comes as an optional goal in the middle of the book, to start your own time independent business, should really be the heart and soul of the book. That's where his freedom came from.

4HWW is a mass-market book (hence the huge sales figures) for working stiffs that want to get a bit more freedom in life. It succeeds in that goal. But it doesn't hit all the right notes.

Some major drawbacks:

If you want to be really free, 4HWW is inimical to your lifestyle. Nobody launching a successful first business works only 4 hours a week on it. If you do, your competition is either going to crush you now or carve you up and devour you later.

4HWW is probably inimical to your advancement in the working world. You'll get more freedom if you're never in the office and always expensing crazy trips, but you're unlikely to move up in the ranks. You have to decide whether it's worth it. It will be for some. It won't be for others.

Ultimately, it sells the dream of full time retirement with part time work. But full time retirement can only happen after super-human effort, both on the part of the creator, and then on the part of the productocracy/fastlane.


That said, it is absolutely a must-read for Fastlaners for the following:

Most of us hire slow. A lot of us should be outsourcing/hiring much sooner to grow faster and not die after the initial burst of popularity. He hits that note hard.

He gives straight talk about meetings and emails. Most of them are useless.

He sets up liquidation as the goal of business ownership, which is spot-on.

Ultimately I wouldn't class him as a normal "Do-As-I-Say-Not-As-I-Do" guru because he mentions his business and advocates that readers start their own, but it isn't the sort of life-changing reading that TMF is/was.
 

amp0193

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Most of us hire slow. A lot of us should be outsourcing/hiring much sooner to grow faster and not die after the initial burst of popularity. He hits that note hard.
Learning this now. My first business was time-independent soloprenuer stuff. Paid the bills.

Now I want to scale a new business and am quickly hitting the barrier of time. Not enough time. I'm nervous to take the plunge of paying someone a salary, but it's something I'm thinking about now.

He gives straight talk about meetings and emails. Most of them are useless.
This was a big takeaway for me too. After that part of the book, I told my sister (my customer service person) to "never email me with a customer question, unless it costs more than $50 to solve their problem, or they have gone "nuclear" and have potential to deface and end my business. She went from asking me about multiple customers a week, to like 10 total in the last year.

I only check my email once, maybe twice a day.

He sets up liquidation as the goal of business ownership, which is spot-on.
Yes. While I don't have the plan mapped out 100%, I really liked this as well, and it's always in my mind. I make choices that are aligned with the goal of an eventual exit event.
 

Maxboost

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You can use martial arts to compare both books.

4 hour work week=Taekwondo

Fastlane=Brazilian Jiu Jitsu

Both martial arts bring something to the table. One provides fitness, confidence, looks flashy and improves flexibility. The other shows you how to F*cken fight.
 

Supercar

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An acquaintance at a party strongly recommended the 4-hour Week to everyone. I was skeptical, but I still bought it on Audible.com. Then, maybe an hour later, I was calling customer service to ask for my money back. I did get the money, but not the 1 hour that I wasted listening to it.
 

NewManRising

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I've heard of 4HWW but never bothered to read it. There are tons of books out there. But, you really only honestly need to read a few good ones. Between MJ's books, and a couple others I have read, plus posts on this forum, is all I really need.
 

loop101

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Tim Ferris's only real product is Tim Ferris. His advice on "doing the least to get the most", is tangential to TMFL's advice of "serve the most to get the most". To improve a product, Tim would tell you to do it cheaper, while MJ would tell you to add value.
 

Knugs

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I have absolutely no respect for Tim Ferris. Not because of the 4HWW but because of the 4 hour body. Hence I cant read something from an author who claims this in another book:

  • How to prevent fat gain while bingeing (X-mas, holidays, weekends)
  • How to increase fat-loss 300% with a few bags of ice
  • How Tim gained 34 pounds of muscle in 28 days, without steroids, and in four hours of total gym time
  • How to sleep 2 hours per day and feel fully rested
  • How to produce 15-minute female orgasms
  • How to triple testosterone and double sperm count
  • How to go from running 5 kilometers to 50 kilometers in 12 weeks
  • How to reverse “permanent” injuries
  • How to add 150+ pounds to your lifts in 6 months
How can you take somebody like that serious?
 

Fpm9

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RANT

I have absolutely no respect for Tim Ferris. Not because of the 4HWW but because of the 4 hour body. Hence I cant read something from an author who claims this in another book:

  • How to prevent fat gain while bingeing (X-mas, holidays, weekends)
  • How to increase fat-loss 300% with a few bags of ice
  • How Tim gained 34 pounds of muscle in 28 days, without steroids, and in four hours of total gym time
  • How to sleep 2 hours per day and feel fully rested
  • How to produce 15-minute female orgasms
  • How to triple testosterone and double sperm count
  • How to go from running 5 kilometers to 50 kilometers in 12 weeks
  • How to reverse “permanent” injuries
  • How to add 150+ pounds to your lifts in 6 months
How can you take somebody like that serious?
I gained 150lbs on muscles in two days without food and in eight minutes of total gym time, what's your excuse ?

I agree I enjoyed reading 4HW, I think theres some good ideas in there but this 4 hours body book sounds like a lot of BS.

People underestimate what it takes to gain even 1lbs of muscle. If someone believes that book, I advice him to go buy 34 lbs of lean ground beef and stick it to his body to see the difference.
 

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Arthur Redline

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4 hours of workweek. Yeah right. That is only possible AFTER you are a fastlane millionaire. A friend of mine was talking about that book not too long ago. He said why not let other people work on things so you can have more time. And while he is saying that he makes just enough money with his business to get by. He has 30 employees doing everything for him but in the end he does not make any money and his business does not grow. But he does have free time. It is like being unemployed and broke. Nothing special there. Everybody can do that.

Meanwhile I work 50 hours a week and make 30times more than him. While he will be nowhere in 5 years, I will have a million bucks to invest and only then work 4 hours a week. After I sold the company for big bucks.

The road is logical, yet people seem to like dreaming things that seem easy. It is just action faking and your mind screwing with you.
 

MJ DeMarco

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I'm actually astounded by the # of people who claim FHWW is their favorite book, as if they're recommending some piece of literature that no one knows about. But it is proof that people will always gravitate to "least effort, most results" type of trope. The truth is, people want to get rich in maximum comfort and with minimal effort, and what better title than T4HWW?

When it comes to books in self-development/business, Think and Grow Rich used to be the default recommendation. Then Rich Dad. And now it's FHWW. So it is in esteemed company.

Oddly, a book I always recommend isn't even in print any longer and is nearly impossible to find.

The best books typically don't get to the mainstream consciousness, if they do, it's usually a combination of marketing and network effects through the influencer's reach. Then the bandwagon effect takes over.

Again, I couldn't get through 4HWW and quit after a few chapters. That's not to impugn Tim's body of work which is of a freakish nature and downright impressive, especially if creating a personal brand is your thing.

However at this point, the book feels too much a part of the "in crowd", the guru "Ill scratch your back if you scratch mine" circle-jerk. And I don't trust that circle.

[GALLERY=media, 97]Recommends by MJ DeMarco posted Dec 8, 2017 at 9:55 AM[/GALLERY]
 

Greg R

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Oddly, a book I always recommend isn't even in print any longer and is nearly impossible to find.
[GALLERY=media, 97]Recommends by MJ DeMarco posted Dec 8, 2017 at 9:55 AM[/GALLERY]
I"M DYING TO KNOW!
 

JM35

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I'm actually astounded by the # of people who claim FHWW is their favorite book, as if they're recommending some piece of literature that no one knows about. But it is proof that people will always gravitate to "least effort, most results" type of trope. The truth is, people want to get rich in maximum comfort and with minimal effort, and what better title than T4HWW?

When it comes to books in self-development/business, Think and Grow Rich used to be the default recommendation. Then Rich Dad. And now it's FHWW. So it is in esteemed company.

Oddly, a book I always recommend isn't even in print any longer and is nearly impossible to find.

The best books typically don't get to the mainstream consciousness, if they do, it's usually a combination of marketing and network effects through the influencer's reach. Then the bandwagon effect takes over.

Again, I couldn't get through 4HWW and quit after a few chapters. That's not to impugn Tim's body of work which is of a freakish nature and downright impressive, especially if creating a personal brand is your thing.

However at this point, the book feels too much a part of the "in crowd", the guru "Ill scratch your back if you scratch mine" circle-jerk. And I don't trust that circle.

[GALLERY=media, 97]Recommends by MJ DeMarco posted Dec 8, 2017 at 9:55 AM[/GALLERY]
Think and Grow Rich is a brutal read. I gave it a shot, and maybe it has something to do with it being written so long ago, but it was so hard to follow and it doesn't provide any actionable advice. If I had to rewrite the whole book in one sentence it would be:

"Visualize success and work hard and you will achieve it."

I do have one question that I am curious as to how people tackle...mostly people who work a day job and grind at night as I am trying to do.

How do you decide whether to spend your time reading a book verses working on your business/website?

By the time I get home at night I have 2-3 hours to put my head down and work, or read. I've been having a hard time finishing books in a reasonable amount of time because I am more focused on working on my sites. So I end up reading a night or maybe two a week and am moving at a slower pace with reading than I want to be.
 

MJ DeMarco

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JM35

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IMO, you shouldn't be reading any books unless it helps you tackle the problem in front of you.

Notable! - The absolute BEST book you MUST read!
That's a great way to put it. I'm a big believer in operating on what I call a "lean information diet" - if I don't need to know something to get my job done well, then I don't want to know it. Albeit, most of the reading I do is on forums such as this and on blogs about SEO, internet marketing, etc. but I do also find value in some of the "self-help" books I read.
 

MJ DeMarco

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Kung Fu Steve

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Not to be a fuddy duddy here but did anyone actually READ these books?

The 4 Hour Work Week was not about working 4 hours per week... it's silly to take it's title and say that's the whole book. It was about maximizing per-hour work capacity (getting more done in an hour) with tools like automation, delegation, and elimination.

The goal was not to work 4 hours per week but was to eliminate "work for work's sake" and learning to redistribute the enjoyment of life (i.e. retirement) over the course of it instead of waiting until the end.

Think and Grow Rich was not about only about "visualizing success" -- it was the culmination of interviews with some of the wealthiest people in American history. How did they become so successful? It dealt with the basics of goal setting and visualization, sure. But there were so many valuable concepts within that book to boil it down to these what the assholes who created "the secret" says it is is ludicrous.

But before ANYTHING why is anyone comparing 4 Hour Work Week to Fastlane? Apples to Oranges? 2 different books about COMPLETELY different subjects?

C'mon guys -- everyone on here is brighter than this. I can't believe I'm saying this but stop judging a book by it's cover. I'm curious to see how many of you actually read MJ's book. What do you think it's about?
 

MJ DeMarco

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I can't believe I'm saying this but stop judging a book by it's cover.
C'mon Steve, straw-man argument.

I bought it, read multiple chapters (and scanned the later ones as well) and then stopped reading it when I had enough. If I judged by cover/title, I would have never have picked it up to being with.

If someone reads several chapters of TMF and they toss it, I respect that.

They tried. I tried. No harm done.

They gave me an opportunity to speak into their world and rejected it. I did the same for 4HWW.

Sounds like the detractors here actually did read 4HWW, or started to read it and couldn't finish.

So this goes beyond judging by a cover and/or a title.
 

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Kung Fu Steve

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C'mon Steve, straw-man argument.

I bought it, read multiple chapters (and scanned the later ones as well) and then stopped reading it when I had enough. If I judged by cover/title, I would have never have picked it up to being with.

If someone reads several chapters of TMF and they toss it, I respect that.

They tried. I tried. No harm done.

They gave me an opportunity to speak into their world and rejected it. I did the same for 4HWW.

Sounds like the detractors here actually did read 4HWW, or started to read it and couldn't finish.

So this goes beyond judging by a cover and/or a title.
I'm of the opinion if I want to debate something I actually take the time to learn the other side but maybe I'm alone here.

I still think 4HWW was an incredible read and deserves a spot right up there with Fastlane AND Rich Dad (even though he's a douche)
 

million$$$smile

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Ya know, maybe its just me, but I have bought quite a few self help books and I start to read them and many of them remind me of a MLM meeting.

A lot of RAH RAH RAH but little meat. I get bored quickly if it doesn't help me to APPLY some form of application in developing into a better entrepreneur or individual. Maybe it's just me, and where I am at in my journey, but most of these books have only one or two, at most mediocre points to deliver and the rest of the book is FILLER.

So my dilemma is do I waste my precious time reading through all of the filler to gain 1 or 2 possibly valuable points? I'm beginning to think not. I have nearly discontinued reading altogether as it seems most are too generalized for me to waste the time to pick the gems from the dross.

I do listen to audible books as I'm working out only because I am able to learn as I burn so to speak, but taking the time to sit down and READ, it just seems mathematically (regarding time) to not be beneficial because there just isn't enough to APPLY within the pages, at least for me.

Perhaps if I needed a kick in the butt to start something, ya maybe. But how about when one is already down the road and looking for that 'process' to develop better in their endeavors?

I have found very few books that I have a kinship to rereading for the information found therein.

I utilize the core of TMF (CENTS) nearly daily in my evaluation of my time and efforts, and I'm not saying this to laud MJ, but it did help me immensely. Another book that helped me exponentially for the time involved in reading it was E-Myth Revisited by Micheal Gerber. These are nuts and bolts books for the entrepreneur in the trenches. Perhaps Good to Great, but I still haven't finished the hard copy yet.

Where are all the self help books that are APPLICABLE to our journey??? Not something that feels good but is forgotten 10 days after reading? Give me application that can stay with me and continue in my endeavors, that is all I want.

rant over
 
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Fpm9

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Think and Grow Rich is a brutal read. I gave it a shot, and maybe it has something to do with it being written so long ago, but it was so hard to follow and it doesn't provide any actionable advice. If I had to rewrite the whole book in one sentence it would be:

"Visualize success and work hard and you will achieve it."

I do have one question that I am curious as to how people tackle...mostly people who work a day job and grind at night as I am trying to do.

How do you decide whether to spend your time reading a book verses working on your business/website?

By the time I get home at night I have 2-3 hours to put my head down and work, or read. I've been having a hard time finishing books in a reasonable amount of time because I am more focused on working on my sites. So I end up reading a night or maybe two a week and am moving at a slower pace with reading than I want to be.
I never read at home during the week, only sometimes on sundays afternoon. But I take the train every day to get to my day job, so I have plenty of time to read.
 

OMDA

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I wish Fastlane was around when I bought 4HWW, but checking the publish date, it was years later.

Ferriss got me thinking about executing on a plan, but it wasn't as thorough as either of DeMarco's books.
 

DaveC

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Most of the tactics and references in 4hww are pretty outdated now...and its clear that he is way more willing to promote himself than MJ and that can rub people the wrong way. His writing has gotten better though and he is still the guy you think about when you talk about lifestyle design, lifehacking, etc.... He is one of those guys that is good to see how he works, vs what he says. Its clear that he has high discipline and fanatical attention to detail (logs every workout, blood tests weekly, etc...) and a way of breaking down and solving problems "outside of the box" that all lends itself well to entreprenuership.
 

MattR82

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I couldn't believe how many people treat the 4hww like gospel. It sucks a$$ except for one or two sections. Meanwhile TMF is gold all the way through.

One person at the coworking space I spent a lot of time at, that is probably in the top 3 of sth east Asia for western digital nomads, bothered to read TMF when I told them about it. And he thought 4hww was better because it gives a step by step blueprint on how to start and run a business remotely lol (he has an Amazon business). Everyone was raving about it being the book that inspired them and helped them make money, except for a small handful. The main protagonist of the argument saying Tim Ferris is shit, was the co space owner.

Guess which side in the argument was worth millions and which wasn't lol. But they couldn't see that. Brilliant marketing by Tim anyway.

Ps he lost most cred with me when I heard how he "won" his muay thai tournament or whatever it was, by basically cheating via a loophole that allowed him to push people out of the ring. Lame.
 
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Andrzej Sotnik

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I've read 4HWW maybe 5 times or so. And I find it's extremely valuable!

Of course, it did not make me a millionaire or have the ability to work for 4 hours per week (no book can do that). 4HWW is about efficiency, not "working less". The title itself was just a marketing trick, not a promise or book description (Tim talked about this in one of his videos).

Before embarking on my entrepreneurship journey I was a web developer and many ideas from 4HWW really helped me. On my last job, I was making more money than ever, while working fewer hours than ever. Tim Ferriss is all about fast learning and efficiency (which are crucial skills for me as a programmer).

The 4HWW was my favorite book up until I read UNSCRIPTED (which I found accidentally in suggestions on Amazon Kindle). Now the UNSCRIPTED is my favorite book and I'm on my second reading right now (while implementing its ideas in my small software-related business).

My point is: these books are for different people! Not everyone will hustle and work long hours. Not everyone ready to pay the price of huge success (I'm not even sure that I am ready for that)! But everybody can increase efficiency in any activity he's doing!

For me, UNSCRIPTED is like 10X improvement of the 4HWW way (but it does not make 4HWW useless).

Recently, I bought 2 more copies of UNSCRIPTED and 4HWW as gifts for 2 of my best friends (UNSCRIPTED for the friend that shows more potential for hard work, while 4HWW for the friend that stuck in the "mediocre existence" and need new options in life). I even asked my mother (53 years old) to read the 4HWW to become more efficient in her daily stuff (and I already see some improvements in her mindset and attitude).

That's why I think BOTH books are very good sources of new ideas and approaches, just for DIFFERENT kind of people! And I'm a bit sad that just because UNSCRIPTED is so much better, people can't see any value in 4HWW.
 

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