Lex DeVille's - I Deleted My Upwork Account...

[Invictus]

Thanks for the reply man

I got some courses regarding VSL's, Google Adsense and Social Media platforms

What do you think of doing those courses with deep research then 'up-selling' to copywriting?

Maybe specializing in technology as I know lots about it and science background helps with research

Must be good dough for those established in Copywriting though, damn!

Not SinisterLex (I'm too sane), but this could be a good move.

You'll want to make sure you can actually help them out. If you can't write an article to save your life, maybe don't offer blog posting (unless you've got someone to handle that).

If you can provide the value, there's nothing wrong with offering to help out more. Hell, that's how the best turn a few product descriptions into a thousand dollar contract.

 

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[Rishi]

Not SinisterLex (I'm too sane), but this could be a good move.

You'll want to make sure you can actually help them out. If you can't write an article to save your life, maybe don't offer blog posting (unless you've got someone to handle that).

If you can provide the value, there's nothing wrong with offering to help out more. Hell, that's how the best turn a few product descriptions into a thousand dollar contract.

Thanks bruv,

Can definitely write an article, poetry, scientifically, content, business plans etc.

The Social Media, Marketing (VSL, AdSense etc...), and Technology - I got good grasp off but I can learn shit VERY quickly....willing to do so

Still got that feeling though that it won't happen somehow!... I know it's fear

Got a slight problem in now choosing what to put on - I don't wanna learn multiple unrelated courses and book then practice with nothing to focus on.

I'm thinking of just matching high demand skills, and willing to go over and above to make sure the client is happy

 

[Lex DeVille]

Thanks bruv,

Can definitely write an article, poetry, scientifically, content, business plans etc.

The Social Media, Marketing (VSL, AdSense etc...), and Technology - I got good grasp off but I can learn shit VERY quickly....willing to do so

Still got that feeling though that it won't happen somehow!... I know it's fear

Got a slight problem in now choosing what to put on - I don't wanna learn multiple unrelated courses and book then practice with nothing to focus on.

I'm thinking of just matching high demand skills, and willing to go over and above to make sure the client is happy

If I were you, I'd pick a high demand skill you don't mind doing.

Practice that skill a lot. Get really good. Once you're really good, almost great, then start looking for a niche.

Preferably a niche where people are already used to paying high rates.

Then become THE expert in THAT niche. Over-deliver. Expand. Charge whatever you want.

 

[Lex DeVille]

Update

For May I stepped things up a bit. I niched down and pulled 4 clients worth a combined total of between $5,000 and $8000.

As of today I took my first niche referral and closed it on retainer.

It's my second $1,000 retainer of the month, so now I have guaranteed full-time income for a couple emails a week.

I built 3 niche websites that help prove to clients why I'm the ONLY choice.

Oh, you thought I was just applying to gigs? No. I do what others don't.

The blog I started last year is gaining real traction. This is good because it links back to my agency site.

I started connecting with my niche on linkedin and offering to let them guest post. Secured one guest post today.

Lastly, I posted a job on Upwork. I decided to outsource some of the work so I can focus on sales.

It's almost a $10k business again.

A few more referrals and a couple good team members and the sky's the limit.

 

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[Argue]

Update

For May I stepped things up a bit. I niched down and pulled 4 clients worth a combined total of between $5,000 and $8000.

As of today I took my first niche referral and closed it on retainer.

It's my second $1,000 retainer of the month, so now I have guaranteed full-time income for a couple emails a week.

I built 3 niche websites that help prove to clients why I'm the ONLY choice.

Oh, you thought I was just applying to gigs? No. I do what others don't.

The blog I started last year is gaining real traction. This is good because it links back to my agency site.

I started connecting with my niche on linkedin and offering to let them guest post. Secured one guest post today.

Lastly, I posted a job on Upwork. I decided to outsource some of the work so I can focus on sales.

It's almost a $10k business again.

A few more referrals and a couple good team members and the sky's the limit.

Legendary.

 

[Rishi]

It's so obvious!.....you make this shit look easy....

And I'm supposed to be the ideas guy! - thank you Lex

Would this be a possibility:

Instagram, Facebook, YouTube Marketing (Keep some improving and offering Content, Copy and Research)

Actually been planning a future technology blog for a while....but I am published in a book, have my top ranked dissertation, could probably get a speech given as well or gain some publicity

Is my niche 'SM Marketing for Tech firms' or 'Instagram Marketing for Robotics'

Latter is night and tight but possibly too niched....I mean, am I to miss out on a Facebook Marketing for A.I?

I got a new focus at least - Think I can get in with SM ....... (ain't quitting on the copy just yet though)

Update

For May I stepped things up a bit. I niched down and pulled 4 clients worth a combined total of between $5,000 and $8000.

As of today I took my first niche referral and closed it on retainer.

It's my second $1,000 retainer of the month, so now I have guaranteed full-time income for a couple emails a week.

I built 3 niche websites that help prove to clients why I'm the ONLY choice.

Oh, you thought I was just applying to gigs? No. I do what others don't.

The blog I started last year is gaining real traction. This is good because it links back to my agency site.

I started connecting with my niche on linkedin and offering to let them guest post. Secured one guest post today.

Lastly, I posted a job on Upwork. I decided to outsource some of the work so I can focus on sales.

It's almost a $10k business again.

A few more referrals and a couple good team members and the sky's the limit.

 

[amp0193]

Lastly, I posted a job on Upwork. I decided to outsource some of the work so I can focus on sales.

Was this a job that you applied for and accepted on Upwork?

And then turned around and posted it on Upwork for someone to do for you?


If so, that's hilarious and awesome.

 

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[Rishi]

Was this a job that you applied for and accepted on Upwork?

And then turned around and posted it on Upwork for someone to do for you?


If so, that's hilarious and awesome.

That would be F*cking raw!!!' LOL

 

[Lex DeVille]

Was this a job that you applied for and accepted on Upwork?

And then turned around and posted it on Upwork for someone to do for you?


If so, that's hilarious and awesome.

It's not for 1 specific job, but for ongoing future work so I'm free to focus on sales.

But yes, it will be for work from Upwork too.

At this point it's time to expand beyond Upwork. I started over back in February.

Now I have enough credibility to grab all of the high-paying jobs in my Upwork niche.

Anyone who's serious about their business won't choose any other freelancer over me.

Because I've rebuilt myself as the "go-to" expert.

Referrals are starting to come in so I have my exit path from Upwork too.

So now Upwork is just another lead source while I add outside channels.

 

[Lex DeVille]

Gained "Top Rated" status this week.

Pulled another 2 clients + in talks with a 3rd. All in my niche. So that's 7 clients for the month.

Got everything set up in my new rental home.

Preparing to step things up in June and hand more work over to the new freelancer.

Met my neighbor today. She knows everyone in the surrounding area. This will come in handy soon.

Decided I'm getting one of these in a week or two.

Whisper Room

Will prove useful for writing in silence, meditation, and a bunch of other stuff.

Thanks freelancing.

Also ordered Unscripted . Started reading. Loving it.

 

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[pbellot]

I'm deleting my Upwork account to start over from scratch to prove the freelance market isn't as saturated as everyone believes. The reason you can't get work isn't "market saturation". It isn't "fake" clients. It isn't Upwork's algorithms being "mean" to you or that you're brand new and don't have any feedback or a portfolio. It's that you aren't doing the work to stand out and help people.

You can still go from $0.00 to $1,000+ per month or more and get your first taste of sales and entrepreneurship fast. But it won't happen by spamming applications hoping something sticks. It won't come from getting mad at Upwork because you feel entitled to gigs. It won't happen by doing anything other than helping other people get sh*t done.

So I'm going to delete my Upwork account in about a week when I finish work on my copywriting crash course. For now this thread is a placeholder. I'll video document progress through YouTube and post here, so if you want to tag along, feel free to watch this thread and maybe pick up some pointers that help you in some way.

Later.

@SinisterLex I was so inspired by your progress thread that I went to clean up my Upwork id. I'm working on the skills I need now to get the work. Great motivation!

 

[Lex DeVille]

Free Upwork 4 Part Training Series

Hey guys, here's a quick announcement about a free 4 part training series I'm hosting this week.

I won't be sharing individual videos here because they'll have an offer at the end for those who want to work with me.

The video below doesn't have an offer. It just shares the details.

If there's stuff you want me to address, post it in a comment on the video to let me know.

Each of the 4 vidz will be high value material probably 30 minutes to an hour long.

 

[Rishi]

Hello SinisterLex,

I'll definitely be following! (I'm trying to get in with Social Media but still am purusing copy as my main skill...I assume this is what it will be on?)

Suggestions:

- Nefarious Niche: How to find your highly profitable Upwork Niche

- Crowded Copywriter Syndrome: How to get copywriting gigs if it's too saturated...

- Hunted Expert: How to position yourself with the Status of a Gold Medallist!


Lol....I did say I was still working on copy skills

 

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[Lex DeVille]

Sooo .. The WhisperRoom came today.

Felt totally boss having a semi drop a pallet in the middle of the street.

Neighbor was all up in my shit wanting to know wtf was going on lol!

Around 1,500 lbs total. MASSIVE pallet. Hardest thing I ever moved .. EVER.

Will post a new pic once it's set up in the office.

 

[Lex DeVille]

Demoing my WhisperRoom!

Holy shit, just realized I've come a loooonnngggg way from when I first arrived at this forum.

 

[Sanj Modha]

I'm doing a similar case study but I can't get approved. I'm applying your tips by submitting various job types.

Nothing is ever tapped out. You can always go that extra mile and beat the competition.

 

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[natbag]

@SinisterLex I'm late to the party, but I just want to say that this thread is legendary! I just responded to my first invite for an interview on Upwork (within my first 24 hours!) after utilizing your techniques. Not an answer to one of my proposals, but an invite.

I believe it really does come down to mindset. The second you stop thinking "what's in it for me?" is the second you really set yourself apart from the crowd. Almost everyone's in it for themselves -- and when you demonstrate that you're not, people start to notice.

 

[RockyP]

@SinisterLex I'm so torn right now man. I've been doing Upwork off and on for 2 years now. I stopped doing it for almost a year because I got one bad review on a $9k+ contract (funny how he forgot about the first $8.5k of "phenomenal work" and just wasn't happy with one $500 project, he gave me a 3-star review) and it dropped me to 85% job success score and out of Top Rated status. I saw a drastic difference in response rates and job invites when I wasn't Top Rated.

Anyways, now my profiles back to Top Rated with ~$20k in earnings, ~300 hours worked, 100% job success. I don't really get how Upworks rating system works and why it went back up but it did. I have one small client right now so I'm trying to figure out what to do before I really start pushing on Upwork again. I got a slowlane job after dropping off Top Rated and it really made me remember why I prefer working on my own time, from my computer. I don't want to screw this up again.

My main question has to do with this: I do copywriting on Upwork but I feel no passion for it and essentially dread having to sit down and write. I know I can "suck it up" and grind and make $60k+/year solely from Upwork but I'm also thinking about totally changing direction. I have no family to support and am fresh out of college. Other potential skills I could do on Upwork I've thought about were:

• Wordpress Development (6 years experience)
• Clickfunnels (6 months experience)
• Facebook Advertising (1 year experience)

I know MJ talked about doing website development in his book while he was building his fastlane business and I just wonder how passionate he was about THAT while he was building his real fastlane. I have my own fastlane business Im building now and I obviously need whatever income I can get to invest into that. The companies formed, the website and application is virtually finished, and now I need to maximize my income source to pour into this. Buy traffic, etc. What's your thoughts on the passion vs. opportunity argument when it comes to making the money to build your fastlane? I know Upworks a great opportunity but I don't feel any passion, maybe even the opposite.

(Now after writing this I feel like it's the "redline" point MJ talks about. I need to man up, not be a bitch, and do whatever it takes to make the money I need to grow my fastlane but really I don't know)

 

[Kane9]

@SinisterLex I'm so torn right now man. I've been doing Upwork off and on for 2 years now. I stopped doing it for almost a year because I got one bad review on a $9k+ contract (funny how he forgot about the first $8.5k of "phenomenal work" and just wasn't happy with one $500 project, he gave me a 3-star review) and it dropped me to 85% job success score and out of Top Rated status. I saw a drastic difference in response rates and job invites when I wasn't Top Rated.

Anyways, now my profiles back to Top Rated with ~$20k in earnings, ~300 hours worked, 100% job success. I don't really get how Upworks rating system works and why it went back up but it did. I have one small client right now so I'm trying to figure out what to do before I really start pushing on Upwork again. I got a slowlane job after dropping off Top Rated and it really made me remember why I prefer working on my own time, from my computer. I don't want to screw this up again.

My main question has to do with this: I do copywriting on Upwork but I feel no passion for it and essentially dread having to sit down and write. I know I can "suck it up" and grind and make $60k+/year solely from Upwork but I'm also thinking about totally changing direction. I have no family to support and am fresh out of college. Other potential skills I could do on Upwork I've thought about were:

• Wordpress Development (6 years experience)
• Clickfunnels (6 months experience)
• Facebook Advertising (1 year experience)

I know MJ talked about doing website development in his book while he was building his fastlane business and I just wonder how passionate he was about THAT while he was building his real fastlane. I have my own fastlane business Im building now and I obviously need whatever income I can get to invest into that. The companies formed, the website and application is virtually finished, and now I need to maximize my income source to pour into this. Buy traffic, etc. What's your thoughts on the passion vs. opportunity argument when it comes to making the money to build your fastlane? I know Upworks a great opportunity but I don't feel any passion, maybe even the opposite.

(Now after writing this I feel like it's the "redline" point MJ talks about. I need to man up, not be a bitch, and do whatever it takes to make the money I need to grow my fastlane but really I don't know)

With your accumulative experience, in writing copy, clickfunnels, facebook ads, wordpress... perhaps you could look at building complete sales funnels for people?

You're massively increasing your value then. Instead of being the guy who is hired on Upwork to do the copy part of the funnel, you can be THE guy hired for everything - especially if you choose one niche and can demonstrate great results in that area.

You don't even necessarily need to write the copy if you dislike that part of the project. You could outsource that part, and with your experience with writing copy you'll find it easier to find someone who knows what they're doing.

But merging all of your experience and even outsourcing parts of the project seems like a good way to increase your value, get higher pay, create time and earn the money that allows you to persue your fastlane idea.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

With your accumulative experience, in writing copy, clickfunnels, facebook ads, wordpress... perhaps you could look at building complete sales funnels for people?

You're massively increasing your value then. Instead of being the guy who is hired on Upwork to do the copy part of the funnel, you can be THE guy hired for everything - especially if you choose one niche and can demonstrate great results in that area.

You don't even necessarily need to write the copy if you dislike that part of the project. You could outsource that part, and with your experience with writing copy you'll find it easier to find someone who knows what they're doing.

But merging all of your experience and even outsourcing parts of the project seems like a good way to increase your value, get higher pay, create time and earn the money that allows you to persue your fastlane idea.

This ^

Whether you want to stay on Upwork or move away from it, copy is just one way to open doors.

Get hired for copy (foot in the door) and ask questions about those other areas.

I do this with clients. Usually they come to me for something specific like emails or blogs or whatever.

Then after we do a little work together I start prodding with questions like:

"Hey do you already have a way to get traffic to this page?"
"Hey, will you need Facebook Ads to get people on the page?"
"Do you already have a funnel in place to guide people through your site to the sell?"

Just plants little seeds.

Gets them thinking about other services they need and they almost ALWAYS ask if it's something YOU can do.

That's an easy way to start expanding without completely ditching your current money maker. >D

 

[Lex DeVille]

A little update:

Lost 2 clients last month. They were best friends and each was worth $1,000/mo. Both swore up and down they loved my content and one had already thanked me for generating $8,000 in her business with a single email. But I guess an "agency" talked them into focusing on building their lists through FB Ads (and somehow this meant the copywriter had to go?!). I could have fought to keep them, but if you can't see the value in $8k from an email .. well .. no thanks.

I'm not worried about losing them. Replaceable within a day. A hypnotist reached out by FB offering a profit share for copy. I was flattered realizing how easy it is to replace clients once you become the expert in a niche.

My favorite client also got on a call this weekend. She pays a couple grand each month depending on her needs. On this call she reminded me that the more she grows, the more I can grow with her, because she's all in with finding ways to be valuable to people she works with. One way she wants to do that is via profit share or a commission structure.

This ^ is why I don't mind searching all month long for the exact right client. Even if I lose a few along the way, I only really need one to hit 6-figures. Then having more than one just becomes a way to diversify and scale.

 

[Nicoknowsbest]

This ^

Whether you want to stay on Upwork or move away from it, copy is just one way to open doors.

Get hired for copy (foot in the door) and ask questions about those other areas.

I do this with clients. Usually they come to me for something specific like emails or blogs or whatever.

Then after we do a little work together I start prodding with questions like:

"Hey do you already have a way to get traffic to this page?"
"Hey, will you need Facebook Ads to get people on the page?"
"Do you already have a funnel in place to guide people through your site to the sell?"

Just plants little seeds.

Gets them thinking about other services they need and they almost ALWAYS ask if it's something YOU can do.

That's an easy way to start expanding without completely ditching your current money maker. >D

Many people won't realize that copywriting (web design, landing pages, etc.) is just one part of a bigger picture.

Once you educate your clients about the other parts of their funnels, the game is on.

If your clients are good operators, they'll understand that @SinisterLex's copy will work best with his favorite web designer's layout.

They'll understand that Lex's copy as part of his favorite web guy's design will work best when the right eyes read it.

That's why he'll suggest a paid search guy who he worked with before.

Like a good operator, you should always regard your service as one part of a bigger picture and have answers ready once your clients ask for more.

That doesn't mean learning Facebook ads yourself though

 

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[Sanj Modha]

I was highly sceptical at first but I followed @SinisterLex and thought why not try it myself?

I created a new profile on June 19th. It took a few revisions before they approved it but as of today. I have 2 clients and I'm talks with 2 more and I'm not even replying to much. I've applied to 18 listings to date which 1/2 per day max.

This stuff works. You just need to put the effort in.

 

[Liberty T. Vance]

First of all thanks @SinisterLex for this thread.

I taught myself web design over the last few months and following @Fox advice set out to build my portfolio.

I first tried using a friend to build my portfolio by building him a 10 page website which took a couple of months. It was my first attempt at building a site and to be honest my friend was terrible to work with, I was a beginner (time consuming learning on the fly) and it finally fell apart because he went out of business.

So I thought Upwork here I come.

I followed Lex's advice back in January when this thread was first posted.

I had my profile accepted instantly and then I proceeded to take a few of the tests in order to get my profile to 100%.

Next I applied for a few jobs but nothing came of it (shitty proposals and wrong mindset) and my slowlane job ended up sucking up all of my time.

But now I currently have 4 weeks left of a 6 week break from work and I thought this is my chance to change my current path.

The first two weeks I traveled and while in airports and on planes read UNSCRIPTED which kicked me in the a$$.

So this week I decided it was time to get back to my plan and get myself out of my slowlane job.

I thought, I need to get my portfolio built, so Upwork here I come again and Lex to the rescue. I remembered this post and the advice and....

I just got my first job... Dropped my quoted price, you focused application and you focused communication.

I have no reviews and haven't made a dime on Upwork.

It's amazing how excited I got over a job that will only pay me around $50 and I'm excited to help this person (changing my mindset to helping others has been really difficult for me I'm used to thinking about how to make money and frankly not giving a F*ck about anyone else).

Upwork is not my end game I'm simply using it to get a portfolio built but also wouldn't complain if I pull clients from it and they refer me to other clients off of Upwork.

It's not teaching, I'm not in China and I feel awesome!!! I will quit my slowlane job this time next year!!!

Again thanks Lex....

 

[EarlOfChina]

@SinisterLex this thread is gold - thank you!

I have a question. You've talked about withdrawing applications a couple of times. Would you be willing to talk us through the main benefits of that?

It's not something I had ever considered doing.

Again, thank you so much for the incredible content and advice. It's seriously appreciated.

 

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[Lex DeVille]

@SinisterLex this thread is gold - thank you!

I have a question. You've talked about withdrawing applications a couple of times. Would you be willing to talk us through the main benefits of that?

It's not something I had ever considered doing.

Again, thank you so much for the incredible content and advice. It's seriously appreciated.

When you apply to gigs one of two things happens:

A) You get a response
B) You don't get a response

If it's A, you get a chance to meet with the client. Sometimes you start a chat, but then they disappear. Or maybe they give you the interview, but then they disappear. In this case you can still message them, but it doesn't do much good if they don't respond.

In this instance I:
1. Message the client to see how they want to move forward
2. Follow up a day or 2 later to check in
3. Let them know I'll withdraw my proposal if I don't hear back by xx/xx/xxxx to create a sense of urgency
4. Follow through on my withdrawal and share my email in the message so they know can get in touch later


If it's B, you don't get the chance to send all those messages. Once you apply, you can't talk to the client unless they interview you. For most people that means the end of the line.

In this instance I:
• Wait 7-10 days to see if they respond, or hire someone else
• If they haven't hired someone, I withdraw and let them know how to contact me if they decide they need my help
• If they did hire, I wait a few more days, withdraw and let them know how to contact me if the freelancer they chose doesn't work out

(there's a good chance the freelancer they hired will suck, so if I wait a few days, I give the freelancer time to prove he sucks, and my withdrawal reaches the client just as he's getting annoyed and doubting his selection) >)

As for benefits ..

For clients who aren't responding, suddenly I've removed myself as a choice. I took a choice away from them, so now they want me more. Some of these clients reach out by email and they're ready to pay any price because I have standards which means I'm a professional.

For clients who don't respond at all, it's another chance for my message to be seen, and to get their attention. Plus I plant a seed to remind them to hire me later if they ever need me. That saves them from having to go through the whole hiring process again.

 

[Jamiethion]

I just visited upwork's page and there is a section that asks what skills are offered to the client, for writing I have none in terms of a software program. Any suggestions? Thanks to those with advice.

 

[Jamiethion]

I just visited upwork's page and there is a section that asks what skills are offered to the client, for writing I have none in terms of a software program. Any suggestions? Thanks to those with advice.

Silly question I did not read the other comments

 

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[ToraBro]

Aloha Lex,

Let me just start off by saying thank you for providing amazing value on this forum for people like me who want to learn copywriting.

 

[kaqm]

This thread is amazing, thank you Lex! I've been off the forum for a couple of years, got back into things, saw this thread and set up a new Upwork account straight away.

A few years ago when it was e-lance I'd started getting some work for music jobs, which there seemed to be less of. My college tutor gave advice about proposals which again was about VALUE.

This time around, within about an hour of setting up a profile I had a request to submit a proposal for a job putting eBay listings up. There were some system errors and I couldn't submit so I got straight onto the help forum. I received another invite for a proposal to do some front end web stuff and social media marketing. I got the job and the work is ongoing.

Next, I applied for a transcription job, $25 for a couple of short youtube videos. They responded to my proposal asking for a sample. It was 4 AM and I'd been working since about 6 PM. I really wanted to go to bed. My eyes were aching. I was knackered.

I stayed up and did it anyway because I thought of the time difference and since they were 5 hours behind they might have hired someone before I'd woken up and had a chance to do the sample.

I sent it and went to bed. I woke up to a message saying they were really impressed with the quality and turnaround time and asked when I could interview. I replied saying I could talk on Skype that day, but they responded saying they'd since hired someone.

I suppose they just wanted the work done asap. I think I'd pushed myself quite a lot just to get a $25 job but I couldn't listen to any excuses in my head and I thought I've been awake this long I might as well wait another half hour.

Going to ignore all the naysayers that think I should get a real job! Can't wait to watch Lex's videos now! Now I'm off to make my profile about the clients and not about me. Thanks again and to all other contributors that are not naysayers