Back pain after a "good" night’s sleep.

[WestCoast]

Do you exercise and lift weights weekly?

I've found if I don't exercise my back hard, it starts to hurt after 1-2 weeks.
Just starts to get weak.


If I do squats and all that stuff, it stays strong, and feels great.
If I don't work it out aggressively, it hurts.

 

[MTF]

Yes, I workout 4-5 times per week for about 1.5-2 hours.
I have a routine, so I always hit the back at least once per week.

Could it be caused by inflexibility/tightness in your back muscles?

 

[Matt Sun]

3 things you could try:

CBD oil, Magnesium, yoga. Even if you didn't have such problems those are good for you to relief pain and help sleep better.

 

[alexkuzmov]

Thank you all for the suggestions and advice.
To summurize:

1. Try a harder/firmer mattress and knee pilows.
2. More stretching with yoga like exersices.
3. Check with a doctor to confirm/rule out Bechterew‘s disease and make sure its something/nothing structural.
4. CBD oil (crystals I assume, but I already tried those)
5. Physical therapy
6. Hot shower and stretching in the morning.
7. Visit a chiropractor who specializes in subluxations/misaligned atlas bones.

----------------

I`ll try all of them one after the other (some at the same time)
And I`ll share results.

 

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[alexkuzmov]

You should get 8 hours of sleep, bla bla bla.
Its f!cking impossible!

I`ve been putting real effort into trying to get my sleep in order.
Eating earlier in the day, staying away from coffee, make sure that I dont work pass 12:00 AM as I usually did, getting up early so I can do most of my work in the morning.
Bought a new thick memory foam matress, new pillows, put a timer on all the routers, no electronics of any kind in the bedroom etc.

Basically I try to follow all the advice I find here and there.

HOWEVER.

While making a habit of going to bed earlier and making time for 8 hours of sleep is the easy part.
Its the actual sleeping thats sh!t.
Anything pass 5-6 hours and when I wake up I feel as if I was kicked in the back all night.
Like what the hell!?
If I sleep 5 hours I feel tired, if I sleep 7-8 hours I have to unfold myself like origami for 2 hours in the morning.

It wasnt always like this, I remember when I used to be able to sleep in my twenties.
Now its just a sh!t experience.
Maybe its because I`m approaching middle age, but there has to be a way to deal with this.
I hate the choice of either not sleeping enough or having backpain.

 

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[AceVentures]

This sounds like a New Age hippie lesson for people with too much time on their hands… don’t you have to buy some crystals too before you lie down?

Yes. Find the sharpest crystals, quartz ideally, and shove them up the a$$. Helps bring the chakras in order as you transcend into Brahman.

Many new age hippy bullshitters have exploited the words "yoga" and "meditation" to the point that the suggestion of a holistic approach gets bucketed into guru nonsense.

But what I'm suggesting is not esoteric or mysterious in nature. It is bounded by hard sciences. We quite literally are our muscular contractions. Physical pain is an interoceptive sense input, which is tied to the nervous+musculoskeletal systems and every other part of the fabric.

Chronic pain is reflective of habitual patterns of faulty muscular contraction. Consider the second law of thermodynamics, conservation of energy, and think about our antigravity muscles. How we hold ourselves in space determines how we use our energy. Faulty patterns of motion (psycho and somatic) result in discontinuities within the fabric, and the resultant effect we perceive is pain (which serves as a cue for change).

So back to my point: if OP is experiencing chronic pain, there is something in his habitual patterns of motion that are causing discontinuities in his body. If he can't identify the physical pattern, then, as I suggested, there is a likelihood that it is a psychological one he is neglecting. To identify the stressor, he can reduce the number of stimulations in order to magnify his kinesthetic senses.

Lying down = reduction of muscular contractions deployed for the purposes of balance in 3D space.
Closing eyes = reducing of muscular contractions from the input and interpretation of light input.
Focus on breathing = narrowing in on how sense input turns into perception
Resisting the urge to move = linking the attractor formations within nervous system to the psychological perceptions of them (biofeedback)

 

[Move the chains]

You should get 8 hours of sleep, bla bla bla.
Its f!cking impossible!

I`ve been putting real effort into trying to get my sleep in order.
Eating earlier in the day, staying away from coffee, make sure that I dont work pass 12:00 AM as I usually did, getting up early so I can do most of my work in the morning.
Bought a new thick memory foam matress, new pillows, put a timer on all the routers, no electronics of any kind in the bedroom etc.

Basically I try to follow all the advice I find here and there.

HOWEVER.

While making a habit of going to bed earlier and making time for 8 hours of sleep is the easy part.
Its the actual sleeping thats sh!t.
Anything pass 5-6 hours and when I wake up I feel as if I was kicked in the back all night.
Like what the hell!?
If I sleep 5 hours I feel tired, if I sleep 7-8 hours I have to unfold myself like origami for 2 hours in the morning.

It wasnt always like this, I remember when I used to be able to sleep in my twenties.
Now its just a sh!t experience.
Maybe its because I`m approaching middle age, but there has to be a way to deal with this.
I hate the choice of either not sleeping enough or having backpain.

Currently traveling is SE Asia and at first I thought the bed was like sleeping on concrete, it was so hard. Took a couple of days to get used to it but it's so much better for my back. (I didn't have a back injury until a chiropractor for a quick alignment that went horribly wrong).

I do lift weights most days and think it helps. Yoga is another activity that really helps for back pain.

Not sure if it's part of the question about how to get more sleep...for some, caffeine can be a factor and stays in the system for several hours.

 

[ZCP]

first go to the doctor to make sure nothing structural
then hit the physical therapist and get some exercises for any unbalances / issues
then feed those to your trainer and do the work

Wait, you just switched mattresses? so a story .... i bought the purple mattress on the recommendation of a few other fastlaners. the first week was AGONY! i woke up in the weirdest positions and in major pain. see, the mattress eliminates the pressure points that make you move around during the night. so i would wake up like a pretzel and in massive back and core pain. i had to 'learn' how to sleep on the new mattress. start on back, pillow between knees when on side, blankets to hold me in a spot. be patient. if still in pain in two weeks, do the items at the top of this post.

 

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[AceVentures]

You're very likely stressed. Chronic pain is a result of chronic stress, they're two sides of the same coin.

The sleep isn't what's causing the pain, it's revealing to you what you need to pay attention to.

I'm afraid there's no simple answer or simple solution. What you need is awareness. You've likely not been paying attention to some factor of your being that is calling for adjustment, or change.

Here's what I would suggest: take a few days to do something out of your routine. Take a notepad with you and take inventory of the things you think about, what you worry about.

Try to lie down on a flat ground. Close your eyes to reduce sensory stimulation. Try to have continuous breathing cycles. And follow your thoughts, along with the urges to get out of your position. If you feel the sudden need to get up, to change position, to "adjust" yourself all of a sudden, take note of what thought preceeded the urge. Resist all urges to move, and practice surrender. If you can stay flat on the ground for about an hour, you will begin to identify the neural links between the physiological hold and the psychological reflection of it. And then you can release it.

All the best.

 

[AceVentures]

I don’t doubt what you’re saying, but how much difference does it REALLY make?

It makes all the difference. Please allow me to explain.

For example… a lot of people nowadays are doing things like meditation for better performance in business. Maybe meditation does increase your performance… but the gains are marginal.

I thought this too at some point - this was when I was practicing using "headspace" app, guided "meditations" and a host of other nonsensical things that never made a noticeable difference in my life.

Consider a stressed person: he will hold his body tight, shoulders up in a knot, head forward, sitting in an uncomfortable position, hating their life and their boss all day, and then go "meditate" for 10 minutes and wonder why their life is not different. The reality is: how you do one thing is how you do everything.

When you do "meditation" or "yoga" the right way - you're doing it always. It's not a 10 minute break to "let go", it is a continuous level of self-awareness that provides immediate feedback and corrective functions to somebody that's present. Any stressor is made obvious, and can be addressed. Some of the benefits of this mode of operation: for example, I can focus for hours on end without getting distracted, I can exercise for 3 hours every day without getting sore, I can meander difficult conversations, controversial subjects, and neurotic people with less issues. The list of what I can do continues to grow with my awareness of HOW I do things.

The practice I described in my previous post is to help someone become aware of their habitual pattern of being. I have many other practical approaches that I'm turning into a coherent structure to offer people that struggle with chronic pain.

And the better ways are just practicing the basics. Diet, fitness, you know, the boring stuff. It’s same like in sales… maybe there are some esoteric techniques that increase your persuasiveness, but if there are, the gains are marginal. You’re better off just hopping on more and more sales calls and practicing the basics… building rapport, identifying needs, relating needs to solutions, convincing the buyer, etc. of course, all these things are boring.

I agree with you: the basics are of utmost importance. Diet, fitness, and the boring stuff, like how you exist every moment. This is neglected. Think about this:

How long can you go without food? Maybe a week or two (diet is important)
How long can you go without water? I would suggest a week at most (water is important)
How long can you go without moving? Trick question - it's impossible. We are always moving. (movement in important)
How long can you go without air? 60 seconds? Yet - this most important aspect of being is completely neglected and considered woowoo bullshit. (breathing is importantest)

So back to the basics: HOW we move. HOW we breathe. HOW we exist in this moment, determines the shape of our being. If we hold our breath subconsciously, we will feel angst, and we will "move". The physical displacement of ourselves can affect the activities we can sustain. You can't do real work if every 2 minutes you quite literally move your hand, finger, click away, get up, look at the ceiling, etc. If you hold yourself in a mathematically definable suboptimal pattern, you will literally deplete your energy trying to hold yourself in space, and whatever you could accomplish otherwise if you could just be, is gone before your eyes.

I'm committed to helping people become self-aware - the promise of what we can accomplish if we don't get in our own way is immense. The benefits seem elusive at first, yet they determine everything about our experience of life.

If this seems incoherent today, please excuse my earnest and early approach at synthesis of over 2 years of work behind the scenes. Further clarity will ensue as this is the main body of my work for the foreseeable future. Feel free to DM me if you're curious but don't want to derail from OP's request for help.

 

[Happyheart]

You should get 8 hours of sleep, bla bla bla.
Its f!cking impossible!

I`ve been putting real effort into trying to get my sleep in order.
Eating earlier in the day, staying away from coffee, make sure that I dont work pass 12:00 AM as I usually did, getting up early so I can do most of my work in the morning.
Bought a new thick memory foam matress, new pillows, put a timer on all the routers, no electronics of any kind in the bedroom etc.

Basically I try to follow all the advice I find here and there.

HOWEVER.

While making a habit of going to bed earlier and making time for 8 hours of sleep is the easy part.
Its the actual sleeping thats sh!t.
Anything pass 5-6 hours and when I wake up I feel as if I was kicked in the back all night.
Like what the hell!?
If I sleep 5 hours I feel tired, if I sleep 7-8 hours I have to unfold myself like origami for 2 hours in the morning.

It wasnt always like this, I remember when I used to be able to sleep in my twenties.
Now its just a sh!t experience.
Maybe its because I`m approaching middle age, but there has to be a way to deal with this.
I hate the choice of either not sleeping enough or having backpain.

If you have that amount of stiffness or pain in the back in the morning, you may want to visit your doctor to exclude Bechterew‘s disease. Especially if it has been going on for a while and your efforts with other sleeping arrangements did not help.

 

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[loop101]

I had similar problem, fixed it with a more firm bed.

You can also try one of these knee-pillows:

 

[Dan webb]

Sounds like The new mattress is the issue.
your old mattress would of had a “you” size dent in it! The new one will support you differently so give it a couple of weeks to adjust.

In the mean time keep to your normal bed/waking routine as best you can.
If you have a bad night try a hot shower as soon as you get up to loosen off your muscles.
Maybe a dynamic stretching routine for 10 mins or go for a walk if you have the time.

Good luck.

 

[Temerity]

You should get 8 hours of sleep, bla bla bla.
Its f!cking impossible!

I`ve been putting real effort into trying to get my sleep in order.
Eating earlier in the day, staying away from coffee, make sure that I dont work pass 12:00 AM as I usually did, getting up early so I can do most of my work in the morning.
Bought a new thick memory foam matress, new pillows, put a timer on all the routers, no electronics of any kind in the bedroom etc.

Basically I try to follow all the advice I find here and there.

HOWEVER.

While making a habit of going to bed earlier and making time for 8 hours of sleep is the easy part.
Its the actual sleeping thats sh!t.
Anything pass 5-6 hours and when I wake up I feel as if I was kicked in the back all night.
Like what the hell!?
If I sleep 5 hours I feel tired, if I sleep 7-8 hours I have to unfold myself like origami for 2 hours in the morning.

It wasnt always like this, I remember when I used to be able to sleep in my twenties.
Now its just a sh!t experience.
Maybe its because I`m approaching middle age, but there has to be a way to deal with this.
I hate the choice of either not sleeping enough or having backpain.

Sorry to hear about the aggravating pain.

Have you considered seeing a chiropractor who specializes in subluxations/misaligned atlas bones?

I go to one locally and it has been magic for me. Years ago, I went running and sprinting. When I got home, my back was like that of a 93 old with arthritis - completely stiff. It took me 5 minutes just to get out of bed and 2 minutes to go up one flight of stairs. It was scary!

I went to see this chiropractor and all he did was press down on my neck briefly. Almost instantly, the pain and stiffness was gone. I've been a regular customer of his for nearly 10 years now for maintenance purposes but I never had a repeat of that awful situation.

And the cool thing is he never does all of these weird contortion-type things where you fold your leg over your head while he lies on top of you like a horny bear and cracks something. It's just a simple push of the neck and you are done.

Suggested is to look up "chiropractor atlas adjustment" or "atlas subluxation chiropractor" for your area and set up an appointment. Could really help you out!

 

[2dads]

I believe I had the same issue as yourself, I drive a lot and have no lower back support in the car I use (I am a sales rep - see customers face to face)

I purchased a memory foam pillow for my car seat and saw a massage therapist who worked in the area of sports medicine and cupping.

I saw huge results after the season (within two days) - I also now do some simple streches through out the day and before bed / wake up.

I am a large boi - the added weight [overweight at the moment] doesn't help and with my height of 6ft 4, getting in and out of a car all day caused this pain for me.

My suggestion is see a massage therapist (not one of those dodgy ones with happy endings) but one with sports medicine and deep tissue as a specialist (I did cupping but I know this may be a bit out their for some)

Best of luck

 

[Black_Dragon43]

I have the same as you, but mine is upper back pain. Has nothing to do with mattress or sleeping position. I’m beginning to think mine is an inflammatory condition that just triggers at night when the back relaxes.

It’s worsened by weight lifting. If I do back exercises, next morning I will barely be able to breathe and it will wake me up. If I don’t, it’s a light pain. In both cases, the pain goes away within 20-30mins of waking up and getting out of bed.

It started after a 1-year + of serious weight lifting, where I guess I overtrained my chest compred to my back. Haven’t yet been able to figure out exactly what it is or how to solve it, but I’ve dialed down on all the weight lifting. I’ve had it for about 3 months now… it has slowly reduced as I’ve reduced weight lifting.

Stretching, especially at night greatly helps. If you have a back stretcher use it for 30mins ofn the spot. If I do that, pain goes completely or almost completely the next day.

 

[olli_23]

I`m 37 and struggled with lower back pain for about 10 years. (I`m tall and rather skinny) Went to dozens of osteopats, chiropractors, got an MRI done with a medical physician, took "back revalidation classes" at the hospital etc. I had a bit of degeneration of my lower 2 discs, but nothing that would really explain the pain I had when sitting for more than 5 minutes or even when sleeping.

What helped me a lot was when I started doing Pilates with a really good private instructor every week. Pilates focuses completely on using your core for exercises and also daily movements. Very slowly things started to get better. Now 3 years later I`m still doing matt exercises (including stretches) and I would say my issues disappeared for 70-80%. I still feel it but it is a lot more manageable.

Also, what helps me to feel better is to do a lot of exercise. (i.e. cardio, walking fast, elyptical, swimming)

Hope that helps. Let me know if you want to know more

 

[Johnny boy]

Do more core exercises. Doing situps, leg lifts and russian twists helped when my back randomly started hurting.

Work your posterior chain. Glutes, hamstrings, lower back, etc.

Then, go for a run.

 

[Black_Dragon43]

So Ive went through the whole list.

Aint got no bones missaligned or Bechterew‘s disease.
Tried a firm bed for a week, on vacation I made sure to sleep on a "hard" bed. It was a little better, but still not the cause.
The pillows, harder and bigger wre of help, I can say for sure that soft and small pillows are not for me.
Found a chiropractor, but that did nothing, just relief for a few days.
The biggest problem with chiropractors is that no ine is available when you need them. The mornings when I'm most in pain no one can take me because they already have people lined up for the day, and I have to wait for at least a day to get "adjusted". So its hard to tell if there iw anny effect outside of placebo.

Most effective so far is:
1. Cutting my sleep short at about the 6:30 mark so I dont get sore.
2. Stretching right after I wake.
3. Larger and firmer pillows.

Nothing really helps all the way, 5 days ago I overslept and it hurt so bad I couldnt sit for an hour after I woke up, I could just stand straight and walk.

I have literarily the same problem as you. Only in the morning then goes away, and nothing seems to help. Mine has being going on for 6 months.

So here’s what has actually helped:
• Pushups - do at least 100 per day
• Pull ups - 10/day at least
• This self-massage:

View: https://youtube.com/shorts/fYy-9dUd1-s?feature=share


With these 3 things I have reduced it to the point it’s minimal now and I can get a good 8 hours sleep with minimal pain when waking up, which goes away really quickly, in less than 15min.

 

[Primeperiwinkle]

You need an orthopedic massage therapist who has studied Erik Dalton. Ask them to check your intercostals, diaphragm, and subscapularis. His website rill give you a list of practitioners in your area, they are NOT all the same. Ask them confidently to describe what a diaphragmatic release looks like before you pay. If they launch into a big geeky description you've found the right person.

In addition, order the BLUE pack of Miracle Ball by Elaine Petrone. Do the exercises working from the neck to middle back. You can get these delivered immediately they will probably do more for you than you can imagine BUT ONLY if you stick with it for at least fifteen minutes a day WITHOUT stress. You need to zen the f out on them while listening to music. They work but a lot of time Big Tough Intelligent Men need to be bossed and cajoled and comforted and cared for before they will settle down and relax.

My current working theory for you is that you have a sympathetic nervous system cycle that you can't get out of without at least a major daily time investment or someone who knows what they're doing or both.

I think it was probably triggered by a bench press or something with a curving forward clenching movement, maybe an an crunch. I think you might have strained one of the deep core muscles that attaches to your spine a while back.

Basically , every time you sleep you're inadvertently relaxing the fascia sheath (soft tissue surrounding all your muscle fibers) long enough for it to "reset" but it's resetting at the wrong length. If a muscle or fascia heals in a shortened condition you can't use it correctly until you stretch it out. So you're stuck in a cycle. We need it to reset its length to the correct amount and it can only do that when you're perfectly relaxed... which I think you never are?

If you could lie down perfectly flat and stretched out every night for a few months it would probably fix itself. But now you're probably stressed out about this even in your dreams and the fascia which links the muscle with your nervous system is gonna keep everything tight in a kind of protective fight or flight cycle. Fascia is very smart. It has 32x more nerve enervations than muscle. Some scientists believe it holds memory since the nerves connect to the brain stem and constantly send messages of every action we experience.

Since everybody's front muscles (for the most part) and therefore fascia are stronger than the back you *could* work the back line two or three times as much with light weights while ALSO stretching the front with poses like cobra, pigeon, warrior triangle etc. But I think the relaxation and breath work is the way to go for you since you're such a get it done personality. (I think. It's impossible to be certain online.)

Last but not least, it's a mental game. Fear triggers the sympathetic to heightened contractions in readiness for battle. You're not battling your body, it's trying to help you. It's just a bit stuck, protecting that one tiny knot somewhere.. we just gotta find the knot and let it go.

Good luck.
Sorry for typos and spelling I was typing as fast as I could while little ppl explained a problem with Roman numerals and division. Oi.

 

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[Temerity]

So Ive went through the whole list.

Aint got no bones missaligned or Bechterew‘s disease.
Tried a firm bed for a week, on vacation I made sure to sleep on a "hard" bed. It was a little better, but still not the cause.
The pillows, harder and bigger wre of help, I can say for sure that soft and small pillows are not for me.
Found a chiropractor, but that did nothing, just relief for a few days.
The biggest problem with chiropractors is that no ine is available when you need them. The mornings when I'm most in pain no one can take me because they already have people lined up for the day, and I have to wait for at least a day to get "adjusted". So its hard to tell if there iw anny effect outside of placebo.

Most effective so far is:
1. Cutting my sleep short at about the 6:30 mark so I dont get sore.
2. Stretching right after I wake.
3. Larger and firmer pillows.

Nothing really helps all the way, 5 days ago I overslept and it hurt so bad I couldnt sit for an hour after I woke up, I could just stand straight and walk.

What kind of chiropractor did you see? They specialize in adjusting your atlas bone or did they do all of those strange contortions and play Twister with you?

Saw something several months ago which I found very interesting. I forget what the technique is called but it's taught by a doctor and supposedly gets rid of back pain quickly. Couple of videos about it:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABeBPHyW9H0&ab_channel=WBAL-TV11Baltimore


This one is a bit more comprehensive, but looks like it was filmed underwater (sorry):

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jQtmSZetJM&ab_channel=YvanCampbell


Hope it helps you out.

 

[Kirk84]

Have you tried not sitting during work? I got a standing desk which made a huge difference for me.

 

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[alexkuzmov]

P.S.
Yes, I did try multiple types of sleeping beds.
This is why I bought a new mattress AND I tried the couch, which is pretty comfy.
So in total 3 different sleeping locations, same result.

 

[alexkuzmov]

Do you exercise and lift weights weekly?

Yes, I workout 4-5 times per week for about 1.5-2 hours.
I have a routine, so I always hit the back at least once per week.

 

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[fridge]

Thank you all for the suggestions and advice.
To summurize:

1. Try a harder/firmer mattress and knee pilows.
2. More stretching with yoga like exersices.
3. Check with a doctor to confirm/rule out Bechterew‘s disease and make sure its something/nothing structural.
4. CBD oil (crystals I assume, but I already tried those)
5. Physical therapy
6. Hot shower and stretching in the morning.
7. Visit a chiropractor who specializes in subluxations/misaligned atlas bones.

----------------

I`ll try all of them one after the other (some at the same time)
And I`ll share results.

If you're just waking up sore/sleeping wrong these are good places to start. For the most part how is your sleep in general? Do you sleep through the night or wake up multiple times? Do you generally wake up feeling refreshed mentally (obviously not physically)?

I'd avoid the chiropractor - the whole field is founded on witch science from the 1800s (I was going to school to be a physical therapist a few years ago before I dropped out). Physical therapy is a great place to start. Massages and a foam roller could help too!

 

[Simon Angel]

Does it feel like you got kicked in the lower back/kidney area? If so, this happens to me if I sleep on my back with my legs leaning on one side.

If I sleep on my back with my legs flat and extended, it's fine. Ditto if I sleep on my side. But laying on my back with my legs bent and leaning on one side? Pretty bad pain in the morning.

 

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[alexkuzmov]

Ok, so here are the results so far:

Hot showers did f!ck all. My guess is there is no tightness in the muscle to loosen.
CBD(I use crystals), while it helps me fall asleep, doesnt do anything for the pain in the morning.

Morning stretching kind of did the trick.
It just reduces the time of the pain, which is very good, but still, doesnt address the source I think.
But again, 1 hour less of pain in the morning is a big win in my book!

My GP gave me a "medical direction" (which has no direct translation in english) for a physical therapist for next week, so we`ll see how that goes.

I havent found a chiropractor yet, I dont just want to go to someone from an internet ad, still asking around friends to see if anyone has info on a good one.

 

[heavy_industry]

You seem to have checked most of the boxes.
Make sure the room is dark and cold, and try a different mattress and see if you notice any difference.

Other than that, make sure your health is on point. If you don't breathe properly during the night, or you eat food that you have mild allergies to, that could totally interfere with sleep.

If you're serious about this I would suggest getting a sleep tracking device to measure the progress when changing things up.

 

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[Temerity]

Ok, so here are the results so far:

Hot showers did f!ck all. My guess is there is no tightness in the muscle to loosen.
CBD(I use crystals), while it helps me fall asleep, doesnt do anything for the pain in the morning.

Morning stretching kind of did the trick.
It just reduces the time of the pain, which is very good, but still, doesnt address the source I think.
But again, 1 hour less of pain in the morning is a big win in my book!

My GP gave me a "medical direction" (which has no direct translation in english) for a physical therapist for next week, so we`ll see how that goes.

I havent found a chiropractor yet, I dont just want to go to someone from an internet ad, still asking around friends to see if anyone has info on a good one.

I've found Yelp to be fairly reliable and Facebook group reviews are helpful as well. You can search for a chiro on either in your area and see what they say. As I'd mentioned previously, I'd suggest looking into one who specializes in adjusting your atlas bone. No weird contortions or devices - they just press on your neck briefly and it aligns everything else!

 

[James90]

Could be strengthening and stretching the of related muscles that support the back.

This

View: https://youtu.be/DWmGArQBtFI

 

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