Any clever ideas for finding a competitior's supplier?

[AshanD]

I have a competitor with a good supplier (from the prices) that I would like to find out. Do you guys have any techniques you use in such a situation?

 

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[juntao65]

Order one of their products and see what the manufacturers name is? Most manufacturers throw in the name on the product.

 

[AshanD]

I'm in one of the few niches where manufacturers downplay the brand labeling (hookah) Besides that I am after the wholesale source

 

[I85]

Lots of wanna be wholesalers mixed in, but you might find something worthwhile.

Wholesale Central - Directory of wholesale products

 

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[juntao65]

Lol, go into one of their joints and smooth talk the managers? Or maybe work a month there learning the ins and outs of the trade.

You could also go with the direct approach where you promise to open up outside of their jurisdiction.

 

[Runum]

Set up your google news for it to email you any info about the retailer as it pops up on the interent as it happens. Sooner or later the info will get out.

 

[AshanD]

I was thinking of leaving a plain damaged box outside their office with a note from a generic "delivery service" mentioning that the box was damaged in transit and the return address label was sheared off. In order for the service to investigate the claim, they would need the sender's address.

Anyone know if this ploy is illegal? I would not be representing USPS but I would be imitating a large shipping service.

 

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[Knowledge Kick]

I was thinking of leaving a plain damaged box outside their office with a note from a generic "delivery service" mentioning that the box was damaged in transit and the return address label was sheared off. In order for the service to investigate the claim, they would need the sender's address.

Anyone know if this ploy is illegal? I would not be representing USPS but I would be imitating a large shipping service.

As long as they won't know and/or couldn't prove it...do what you gotta do

 

[LightHouse]

I was thinking of leaving a plain damaged box outside their office with a note from a generic "delivery service" mentioning that the box was damaged in transit and the return address label was sheared off. In order for the service to investigate the claim, they would need the sender's address.

Anyone know if this ploy is illegal? I would not be representing USPS but I would be imitating a large shipping service.

If you have to ask......

Come on now. Do you think people are that niave. leave a damamged box outside of a business with no info on it.... what would you do?

Do as greg said. getting into business isnt easy, you will have to climb the same roads everyone else does. trst me its worth the climb for the learning experience and knowledge you gain. you will be better able to assit your customers the more you know.

 

[Bobo]

OK I am sorry but in all honesty this whole thread just infuriates me.
I used to bust my butt finding suppliers, traveling across the world to them and then reworking how they did things to serve my needs and damn if a competitor didn't find just ONE of my suppliers, loudly proclaim it to my customers and undercut me on price - and it was not even close to the same product.

Take a job under false pretenses? Impersonate a damaged box?

Look, I'm not the preachy type but do your own damned work and pay your own damned dues.

Working there a month or two under false pretenses? For the first month or two an employee is worse than useless - they are an expense you have to train, teach and make productive. That is stealing folks, that is F*cking the other guy who has done his job over so that you can unfairly compete against him. They could and should sue your a$$ for that.

OK, rant over and I apologize for being so bluntly insulting about this.

There aren't a lot of shortcuts out there and most successful businesses involve a serious investment of sweat equity. I'm all for working smarter but not at the expense of another guy who may very well be a hard working member of this forum, kinda shocked nobody else hit the roof reading this one.

 

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[Runum]

Part of me agrees with you Bobo. I wouldn't want anyone taking the easy way out to undercut my biz. However, another part of me sees that finding a competitor's source and renegotiating the contract is what has been done in biz for hundreds of years. If you were in a business and could find a cheaper provider for the same quality wouldn't you jump ship? That would hang your former supplier and all their employees and whip your competitors.

I am not saying I like the cut throat nature of business. I'm seeing, more and more, that there are aspects of business that I don't appreciate even though they may be "legal". Speculating oil futures comes to mind here. Look at what speculation did to the price of oil last summer. All legal. How many of us enjoyed paying for it?

I think we have a good gentleman's(and lady's) club here. But, all of us are here for the purpose of taking care of what is ours, not the other guy. We all have different comfort zones of what is right and wrong.

Hope this disagreement doesn't get ugly. I do see where you're coming from Bobo.:cheers:

 

[Jill]

Hmmm. I've been debating for a while whether or not to join this conversation.

I was inclined to start out with quotes about ethics and morality . . . but I really don't want this thread to go down that path because this is primarily a business forum and besides, the concepts are too nebulous to be easily defined.

So, I'll just state my position this way: As trite and corny as it sounds, 1) we try to run our lives and businesses according to the Golden Rule. 2) We try to act as if everything we are doing can be read about in the paper tomorrow by our daughter. Not trying to be self-righteous here. That's just what works for me and my family. You have to find your own compass.

So off my soapbox, and onto business...

Why are you following? If the extent of your creativity is just finding out what the other guy is doing and copying it, you'll always be a step behind. What have you done to find your own supplier that is cheaper and better than HIS? Oftentimes, the amount of energy to just go out and do it yourself is far less than that required to obtain it subversively. To prove a point, I just opened another window. As I suspected, with a 20-second search, I found names and contact info for hundreds of suppliers for almost nine thousand hookah supplies. By contrast, how much time have you spent trying to be "clever"?

Despite my tone, I'm really not trying to condescend or preach. So I hope you won't take it that way. Just trying to encourage you to roll your sleeves up and do the work. Let us know what you find as YOU become the one to beat.

 

[I85]

As long as they won't know and/or couldn't prove it...do what you gotta do

Yup and if it doesn't work you can hold them and gunpoint and make them tell you. Just make sure nobody sees. Sorry, but posts like this and the one below just really annoy me. DO YOUR OWN WORK....QUIT BEING LAZY-IT"S NOT GONNA KEEP WORKING. You will end up shooting yourself in the foot or much worse. What if you need to expand to new products and need to find new sources? What if your source goes under? What if they make a big change to their prices or policies? You now have bills to pay and nothing to sell to pay those bills. And you will not be sure how to get anything to sell.

I think many need to reread these threads and really start thinking about choices they are making now.
http://www.thefastlanetomillions.co...ussion/249-life-altering-choices-yours-3.html

http://www.thefastlanetomillions.com/off-topic-discussion/20616-anyone-up-lil-chaos-theory.html

While in a way you "have to do what you have to do"...think if what you are doing is really a necessity and really the best long term decision for you. If you need some extra cash, you don't need to go rob someone or work the corner...yet others THINK they do. Hell, most the time they don't even NEED the money.

Even if what you a doing is legal, which I doubt it is(I'm no lawyer-just my opinion), it is definitely not ethical in my mind. My reputation and peace of mind is worth way more than the name of some company or a few extra dollars.
Destroying future bridges and your reputation, because you are lazy makes no sense. Also don't risk your freedom and time because of it. In the long run it just doesn't make any sense.
Maybe it's just me, but in the long term some of the morally and ethically questionable advice(which is minimal) I have seen on here just doesn't seem fastlane. Would you screw someone to make $10, when you could have been $1000 off of them over the next 10 years? Would you really rather make an enemy instead a business that is willing to co exist with you? Especially make an enemy with someone that probably has much more money, is more established and has many more loyal customers?

I was thinking of leaving a plain damaged box outside their office with a note from a generic "delivery service" mentioning that the box was damaged in transit and the return address label was sheared off. In order for the service to investigate the claim, they would need the sender's address.

Anyone know if this ploy is illegal? I would not be representing USPS but I would be imitating a large shipping service.

I agree w/ everything lighthouse, runum, and Bobo said. Except for being mad about being undercut, which is just another part of business.

The undercutting story does bring up a good point though.
A supplier alone will not make your business a success.
Why are you so worried about finding your competition's supplier? You know there are others out there right? Do you have more money than your competitor? Can you actually get cheaper prices from them? Even if you can make larger purchases than the competitor, that doesn't even mean you will be getting better pricing to start with....vs a long time customer of theirs(your competition). You may have a much lower overhead for now, but if your business takes off...you won't for long. So, having the same supplier doesn't always mean you can offer the same price. How do you even know there supplier really has the best prices if you haven't looked at all other options. It kind of seems like you are just trying to follow your competitor, which is rarely a good move.

As for your idea, I'd start spending my time finding my own sources....they would have to be complete morons to fall for something like that. Rethink your post, there are so many red flags there...would you actually fall for something that shady? They aren't missing a package, where did this come from? Why was it just left of the steps? Dont' they have the address in the computer somewhere? etc etc

I am sure there is more than one source out there that you could make profitable. What have you done to find them? Then we can tell you what else to try.

Edit: Sorry for repeating much of what was said by Jill, I had to leave before I could finish my post and hadn't seen her post before I posted this. Great post btw Jill. I feel ethics have a lot to do with business, though. I know many people who have shot themselves in the foot by trying to take the easy route. People do see and hear things and in the business world, if you are always involved in shady deals...people will find out.(this is the main reason I felt the need to say what I did above)

 

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[AshanD]

I think this thread has run its course. The last thing I will say is that I didn't start this thread with the intention of "finding the easy way" but rather to gain a competitive advantage. Maybe the ethics of my package idea are poor, I'm not sure, but I probably won't be trying it.

 

[hatterasguy]

Slit some throats and step over their dead body, being an SOB in business is how you make money.

Either budy up with an employee and find out, or bribe someone.

 

[LazyAmericano]

Ash..
Don't take the comments you have received as negative criticism but as constructive criticism. They are being given by very ethically minded people, which we should all strive to be. They may sound harsh but it is the same advise they would give to friends or strangers. I know you were not intending to take the "short cut" but the "fastlane" so maybe the rest of us here (while pointing out the wrong paths to take) can focus on the right "ethical" way to get a competitive advantage. We have all been faced with these dilemas and hopefully found positive guidance.

 

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[Jill]

I think this thread has run its course. The last thing I will say is that I didn't start this thread with the intention of "finding the easy way" but rather to gain a competitive advantage. Maybe the ethics of my package idea are poor, I'm not sure, but I probably won't be trying it.

I was hoping that you would be asking me how I found contact info for the hundreds of suppliers... I have it. And I'm willing to share it. But I don't recall you asking for that.

 

[Bobo]

No - take the comments on the fake package as a rebuke and criticism, they were meant that way because that is a deceptive, sneaky and dishonest way to do business and I would not be associated with it or anyone who tried that conniving bullshit - but that's me.

Runum - I am all about kicking the other guys a$$, business is a competition and finding the best supply chain is part of that. It's the sneaky shit that I take offense to. You I love.

So in other news, my home study course for a charm school degree didn't work out, but at least I took an honest shot at it.

 

[LightHouse]

I was hoping that you would be asking me how I found contact info for the hundreds of suppliers... I have it. And I'm willing to share it. But I don't recall you asking for that.

Jill, How do you find suppliers for hundreds of suppliers?

 

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[Jill]

Jill, How do you find suppliers for hundreds of supplies?

I already answered Ashan (who did eventually ask) via PM. But I have used www.alibaba.com for years.

 

[terrycan]

Dear AshanD,

To find your competitors suppliers; "Eliminate the impossible. look towards the probable. There your answer lies" (Sir Arther Conan Doyle)

Jill is correct if you follow your competitor you will never lead.:smx4:

 

[lu liu]

alibaba is a resource site, I been doing business with few manuf up there. If a deal is too good to be true, most likely they are scams. I found out the hard way =/. Just be careful and do your research

 

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[randallg99]

Hmmm. I've been debating for a while whether or not to join this conversation.

I was inclined to start out with quotes about ethics and morality . . . but I really don't want this thread to go down that path because this is primarily a business forum and besides, the concepts are too nebulous to be easily defined.

So, I'll just state my position this way: As trite and corny as it sounds, 1) we try to run our lives and businesses according to the Golden Rule. 2) We try to act as if everything we are doing can be read about in the paper tomorrow by our daughter. Not trying to be self-righteous here. That's just what works for me and my family. You have to find your own compass.

So off my soapbox, and onto business...

Why are you following? If the extent of your creativity is just finding out what the other guy is doing and copying it, you'll always be a step behind. What have you done to find your own supplier that is cheaper and better than HIS? Oftentimes, the amount of energy to just go out and do it yourself is far less than that required to obtain it subversively. To prove a point, I just opened another window. As I suspected, with a 20-second search, I found names and contact info for hundreds of suppliers for almost nine thousand hookah supplies. By contrast, how much time have you spent trying to be "clever"?

Despite my tone, I'm really not trying to condescend or preach. So I hope you won't take it that way. Just trying to encourage you to roll your sleeves up and do the work. Let us know what you find as YOU become the one to beat.

while I agree setting good examples for our child(ren) is important, the irony is that what you said about the golden rule meant absolutely nothing to sam walton (as just one example.)

I have ordered large purchases and had them delivered to my own home so I could compare not only the products but also the services.... how does my competitor handle complaints? how do they handle tardiness, the actual handling, the entire process? communication tactics? etc.... the more I know about what my competitors do and sell, the better I can be.

my BBB ratings for each of my locations are "A" vs. while many of my nationally recognized competitors are rated "C" or below.

I owe 99% of this to my own value system, but that other 1% credit is due to knowing how I can be better than my competitors.

but really, this thread should recognize that relationship based selling is much more effective than price based selling but of course this depends on the item.... we don't really care what kind of service we get at mcdonalds so as long as we expect some form of acknowledgement when we're handing over money in exchange for some fries, but if it comes down to marketing and selling items on the net, it appears that the more intense websites detailing the benefits of ownership or using the product/service for sale seems to be much more effective than a big price tag

 

[LightHouse]

while I agree setting good examples for our child(ren) is important, the irony is that what you said about the golden rule meant absolutely nothing to sam walton (as just one example.)

I have ordered large purchases and had them delivered to my own home so I could compare not only the products but also the services.... how does my competitor handle complaints? how do they handle tardiness, the actual handling, the entire process? communication tactics? etc.... the more I know about what my competitors do and sell, the better I can be.

my BBB ratings for each of my locations are "A" vs. while many of my nationally recognized competitors are rated "C" or below.

I owe 99% of this to my own value system, but that other 1% credit is due to knowing how I can be better than my competitors.

but really, this thread should recognize that relationship based selling is much more effective than price based selling but of course this depends on the item.... we don't really care what kind of service we get at mcdonalds so as long as we expect some form of acknowledgement when we're handing over money in exchange for some fries, but if it comes down to marketing and selling items on the net, it appears that the more intense websites detailing the benefits of ownership or using the product/service for sale seems to be much more effective than a big price tag

I could have sworn you had a thread up about the site you started, but now i can not find it. mind shooting an update on it?

 

[xcalvinx07]

alibaba.com

 

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[randallg99]

I could have sworn you had a thread up about the site you started, but now i can not find it. mind shooting an update on it?

I think it was on the private forum.... in short, I have the platform, products, art work and most of the layout completed. The severe delay is entirely my fault - I had grown my brick/mortar biz much more than I forecasted and this provided more problems and headaches regarding cash flow and personnel issues.

besides those concerns there were a couple of vacations and a lot of family obligations... but what really sucks is that my time has been focused on being inside the biz instead of focusing ON the biz.... this is changing soon with the help of newly hired assistants....

will certainly keep you informed and thanks for asking. I hope your site is up and running and making you lots of loot.... how is that doing, btw?

 

[LightHouse]

I think it was on the private forum.... in short, I have the platform, products, art work and most of the layout completed. The severe delay is entirely my fault - I had grown my brick/mortar biz much more than I forecasted and this provided more problems and headaches regarding cash flow and personnel issues.

besides those concerns there were a couple of vacations and a lot of family obligations... but what really sucks is that my time has been focused on being inside the biz instead of focusing ON the biz.... this is changing soon with the help of newly hired assistants....

will certainly keep you informed and thanks for asking. I hope your site is up and running and making you lots of loot.... how is that doing, btw?

Yeah i dug in there and could not find it, oh well. Glad to hear you figured all that out before hand, i just hit that same wall about two weeks ago. Have a bunch of different sites going all in different places of generating revenue. Lots of work and def lots of fun.