To Go To College or Not To Go To College - 10 Yr U.S. Navy Sailor

[BenP]

I'm posting this thread because I want some advice for some touch choices I'm going to have to make.

First and foremost, I have already made the committed decision thatI am going to start my own business. I'm going to do this no matter what. My first endeavor is to publish e-books/programs/etc. on self-help and lifestyle choices - more specifically, the idea behind fulfillment. I've looked around and haven't noticed anyone writing a book specifically on this topic. If you have, please let me know. It won't stop me from continuing down that road but if I know about it then it can be another tool in my arsenal of knowledge on the subject.

With that being said, I am soon reaching the end of my 10 year enlistment, November 25th, 2014. I have a free ride to college utilizing my Montgomery G.I. Bill. This will also pay basic living expenses while I go to college once I am out. My question is this:

1.) Should I pursue a degree in entrepreneurship, and if so, which university do you recommend?

2.) My field I'm interested in has a lot to do with psychology, sociology, and ethology. Does anyone on the forum have any background in these fields relating to a university that you would recommend?

I know my goal. I'm just figuring out how to get there. I know that in part of my endeavors I am going to try to make as many relationships as possible to be able to help me out and increase my network. Every book that is recommended on the Fastlane Forum is in the mail on its way to me from Amazon or Booksamillion.

Getting out of the Navy is a touch decision for me. I have a young daughter who lives with her mother that is a recovering cancer patient of Neuroblastoma. The Navy's insurance, Tricare, has helped tremendously. If it weren't for them, I'd be millions of dollars in debt. However, I know that staying in the Navy is not helping my overall outcome in life. I'm not growing, I'm stagnating here. My peers act like mindless zombies who have given up on their dreams a long time ago. My time is completely out my hands. How much leverage in time do you have when you're on a submarine that is under the water for months on end with no direct contact with the world?

Absolutely zero. It is well past time to get out. Plus, I'm severly underpaid.

I'm on shore duty at the moment but will be going back to a submarine come September. I obligated 14 months service on another submarine when I re-enlisted for shore duty. Right now is when the pressure is on me to re-enlist again. I don't want to. I was originally slated to go to Hawaii for my next tour but turned that down. Hawaii is a lot warmer than Groton, Connecticut! But if I re-enlist, I'm obligated to sign on for 3 more years at the minimum. This would put me well into my mid-30's. That's a no go. I'm delaying gratification of going out there by sticking out these next 14 months and then fully pursuing my mission of the Fastlane life.

 

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[Twiki]

Greetings BenP and thank you for your service. Have you seen the Red October anywhere in Groton? I've heard rumors... Anyway, no advice to give, but a suggestion to review the decision matrix tool that MJ describes in the Fastlane book, it's quite useful. Many people apply that kind of tool in their working life, but for some reason forget that it can apply to their personal choices too. It'll help you focus on what's important to you now.

PS. Do submariners get the urge to break out into singing the Soviet National Anthem? That would be glorious.

 

[Jake]

Welcome, Shipmate

1.) Can't help you there but I'd recommend Bangkok University. I'm a bit biased though.

I was in the Navy as well and then started contracting. I took a break after some time in Iraq and went to Uni for a few semesters in Bangkok on the G.I Bill. I may go for a couple semesters more once I leave Afghanistan. It keeps my Thai visa in good order and slows down the burn rate. School wasn't demanding at all so not a whole lot of time is wasted. I'm sure a U.S Uni would take up a lot more time.

I hear what you're saying about the Zombies. It's like that in the contracting world as well but to each their own.

it's a tough decision to get out. I joined the reserves about a year after I got off of active duty and volunteered for a deployment immediately. You (or I) feel a bit out of place in the outside world.

Best of luck in your decision.

 

[AllenCrawley]

Anyway, no advice to give, but a suggestion to review the decision matrix tool that MJ describes in the Fastlane book, it's quite useful.

Here's the site created by MJ...

Got a Tough Choice? HelpMyDecision.com Helps You Make Better Decisions!

 

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[Lights]

I am really in no position to say which college is the best, since I do not believe in college education when it comes to business. The only purpose for college education to me is to earn a job, or other benefits aside like financial aid and pride.

For a job, I would say yes. But for your purposes I think you could easily get a job as a police officer depending on the county. If you're going to come home and work as a grocery clerk, then that's just sad since you way more qualified than that. But you might as well take advantage of the GI Bill if nothing else is going on.

I would not look into psychology, sociology, and ethology for a degree and only for entrepreneurship. You probably know more than the professor will know, and you could easily learn all that stuff in books. An entrepreneurship degree will be better because you will learn business from a more formal aspect. I also notice an age difference with the two crowds, and more professional/older people take entrepreneurship to further their skills such as Web Design, while psychology people are usually just fresh out of high school crowd.

I am sorry about your daughter. Do you lose your medical insurance by leaving the Navy? If so, I would really think it out more.

 

[Boston3432]

Welcome to the forum and thank you for your service. I am a recent college grad and my degree definitely has its pros and cons. You mentioned you wanted to write e-books and do delf-help programs....If you know how you want to go about doing this such as how you want to run the business, the niche, marketing, writing the e-books, whether or not you will make a sufficient income doing this etc. then I don't think college is necessary. You would probably be better off just reading some books in the area you want to pursue your business. You can gain just as much if not more this way and it saves a lot of time and money. College will give you more of a general overview of the information you need. It is definitely an investment and big time committment also. If your looking to get a regular "job" working for someone for extra income, to provide funds for your own business, or to pay the bills while you get your business started then college can definitely help with those kinds of connections and your degreee will help you get a job with that on your resume. My college degree has helped me to make more connections, and to get a job for now to pay the bills and help fund my business that I am working on. There are many ways to make connections and network with people but College is also a huge help witht that. Not just talking to professors, but colleagues and alumni who share similar interests. They are always reaching out and helping classmates and other students at the insitution. Just my opinion between the two. Good luck!

 

[JAJT]

I have a free ride to college utilizing my Montgomery G.I. Bill. This will also pay basic living expenses while I go to college once I am out.

IMHO this changes the typical argument of "is college worth doing?" to "is college worth doing for free with living expenses paid?"

I'd have a hard time saying it isn't with that kind of deal. You get your piece of paper, a free formal education, the experience of going, and free residence to boot.

Now, it can still be said that all things considered you can get a similar (or better) education for very little money and a bit of effort. But if you spend your time wisely you can actually come out ahead with this college deal.

If you play your college education smart, you can optimize your time AND money here. Go to only the classes you feel are worth going to and leave any class that is going nowhere that day. Spend your free time saved this way to work on your side business. Spend your time at home working on your side business. Use teachers who have walked the walk to mentor your with your side business - many teachers these days are teaching because they WANT to, not because they HAVE to. My sales teacher in college was a 6-figure sales professional who was teaching because her boss could no longer incentivise her with cash, for example. Don't get (too) caught up in the party life that may be newly available to you. Have fun, but don't dick around.

If you play this right, you may get a formal education and a side business going at the exact same time, for free. This is a cushion and buffer most people don't get.

 

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[Jake]

Don't get (too) caught up in the party life that may be newly available to you.

He's in the Navy. We worked hard to earn our reputation :smx6:

 

[BenP]

PS. Do submariners get the urge to break out into singing the Soviet National Anthem? That would be glorious.

Haha, no. If you really wanna know what it's like, go watch the movie "Down Periscope". Enough said.

I hear what you're saying about the Zombies. It's like that in the contracting world as well but to each their own.

I don't want to talk badly about the Navy as a whole. I'm just not into blindly following someone else's plan without an explanation or why so. The brainwashing is real. The economy is a big factor for a lot of guys that are in and is really the source of fear for anyone thinking about getting out. Ask them why they stay in and that's usually number one. As soon as you say you plan to get out then all of sudden you're under a spotlight where you're thrown into a thinkgroup of senior personnel grilling you on why, what's your plan, why not stick it out a little longer, etc. But I get pretty defensive with these talks, especially when I know that their Eval is based on their men's retention rate. It's not in their best interest for you to get out. The next thing you know, you're ostracized from the common collective and getting lower Evals - even if you're still performing top notch. The reason is, why waste good evals on a guy getting out when we can prop up this other guy who is staying in? It's a flawed, faulty system and I recognize it as such.

Here's the site created by MJ...

Got a Tough Choice? HelpMyDecision.com Helps You Make Better Decisions!

Thanks for this. I did this immediately when I came across it in MJ's book, and went and did it again just now. The answer is a resounding GET OUT. (Or rather, pursue the option that has the most LEVERAGE!)

I am sorry about your daughter. Do you lose your medical insurance by leaving the Navy? If so, I would really think it out more.

Yes. Tricare ends when I get out. I recognize this as one of the sacrifices I have to make, unfortunately.

 

[JAJT]

Look at this another way:

If you passed on this opportunity, you would need to get a job and pay rent until you could afford freedom through your side business. This likely means 8 hours every day at a chair, plus driving time, plus the cost of life-sapping, energy draining days that most jobs bring. You will make a few extra bucks along the way but your time and energy will be eaten alive.

If you went to school, you would get to CHOOSE when to go and when not to, you would ENJOY the time spent in the classroom, even if you went to EVERY class you'd be looking at far fewer hours than a job, you have no worries about paying rent, and very likely the environment will be a motivating one, not a life-draining one.

The more I think about this the more I'm thinking not taking the job is a fastlane to freedom, for your specific cicrumstance.

 

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[BenP]

The more I think about this the more I'm thinking not taking the job is a fastlane to freedom, for your specific cicrumstance.

OK! Excellent! This was my reasoning as well. So this brings me back to my original question:

What college/university would you or anyone you know recommend when it comes to pursuing Entrepreneurship?

 

[JAJT]

What college/university would you or anyone you know recommend when it comes to pursuing Entrepreneurship?

I have no school suggestions, but I do have an uninformed opinion!

I have to imagine the "best" business schools are going to be the most demanding of your time. More projects, bigger scopes, tons of studying, etc...

I'd look around wherever you want to live and see what the reviews are for that area's business programs. I'd go with a general business course over an "entrepreneur" course though - get a solid understanding of business and learn entrepreneurship by actually doing it and reading great books (like this okay one I heard of by this Demarco fella....)

IMHO the gold ticket here is in the free rent and extra time you'll get rather than the quality of the education itself. You don't want a shit school, sure, but you don't want to be spending 80 hours a week on studies either.

 

[jon.a]

Hey Ben

I was in your shoes at my 10 year mark.
My Ex-wife forced me to stick it out.
She now receives 42% of my retirement.

In your case, I'd bail asap.
Pick any school with a decent business program.
At your age and IQ as a "bubble head" you'll find the course work to be a pick of cake.
You'll make money with the GI bill and have plenty of time to work on "other things."
Take only courses that will aid you in your business endeavors.

I'm a retired Senior Chief, you can ask me about your seniors motivations.

best
jon

 

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[BenP]

get a solid understanding of business and learn entrepreneurship by actually doing it and reading great books (like this okay one I heard of by this Demarco fella....)

Exactly! The more books I read the more insight I gain. One of the cracks in my foundation that I'm working on filling right now by reading books is the whole being "financially literate" aspect. Honestly, I need to learn A LOT more about this subject. However, I just want the basics. I'm sure there are many books out there on the subject but keeping in line with maximizing my time, I want to learn what I need to know and skip what would be nice to know.

I'm a retired Senior Chief, you can ask me about your seniors motivations.

Hey there Jon! Thanks for the motivation. Us "bubble heads" are valued heavily in the Navy, at least that's what I've been told!

It's nice to see so many other fellow active/retired service members on this forum. And to see that many of you have been successful is a HUGE motivation for me.

 

[Vigilante]

Lets make this simple.

1. Do you want to do something that requires a degree? If yes, skip step 2. and jump to step 3.

2. Don't go to college.

3. Go to college.

p.s. thank you for your service.

p.s.s. your situation is more complicated than most. The fact that you can get a free education changes a lot of the dynamics though. How long until you could retire from the military?

 

[Twiki]

Exactly! The more books I read the more insight I gain. One of the cracks in my foundation that I'm working on filling right now by reading books is the whole being "financially literate" aspect. Honestly, I need to learn A LOT more about this subject. However, I just want the basics. I'm sure there are many books out there on the subject but keeping in line with maximizing my time, I want to learn what I need to know and skip what would be nice to know.

You're in luck, tomorrow (Friday) Lonnie Scrugg's book "Taking the Mystery Out of Money" is going to be free that day, someone wrote a post about it elsewhere on this forum: https://www.thefastlaneforum.com/mi...ay-january-25th-taking-mystery-out-money.html. I highly recommend that book, Lonnie is awesome at teaching practical applications of the Time Value of Money concept, which is mandatory as part of basic financial literacy. It's in Kindle format but you don't need a Kindle to read it.

 

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[BenP]

p.s.s. your situation is more complicated than most. The fact that you can get a free education changes a lot of the dynamics though. How long until you could retire from the military?

Retire? I would be eligible to retire in 2024.

End of Active Obligated Service (EAOS)? November, 2014.

Age at eligible retirement - 39

Age at EAOS - 29

One of the more pressing reasons (if not to pursue my own avenue of the Fastlane) is that it is increasingly obvious that having 20 years of faithful and dedicated service to the United States military is by no means an "in" when it comes to finding reliable and financially stable employment. If this is not the case, then it makes it (in my mind) a "no brainer" to get out and pursue the avenues that REALLY matter, like understanding the nuances of business, finances, specific knowledge needed for my intended area of expertise, and networking with people that are like-minded, positive, and goal-oriented.

 

[BenP]

You're in luck, tomorrow (Friday) Lonnie Scrugg's book "Taking the Mystery Out of Money" is going to be free that day, someone wrote a post about it elsewhere on this forum: Get a FREE Book on Friday, January 25th Taking the Mystery Out of Money. I highly recommend that book, Lonnie is awesome at teaching practical applications of the Time Value of Money concept, which is mandatory as part of basic financial literacy. It's in Kindle format but you don't need a Kindle to read it.

Thank you! I'm definitely going to be taking advantage of this.

 

[ubiquitous]

I honestly don't get the anti-college rhetoric people espouse when discussing entrepreneurship, considering if you've majored in business from a great school then you have a solid foundation and a great network + alumni group. Now, if you could go to university for free?

Pssshhaaaawwwww.

Go and do it! Just remember, just because it's already paid for doesn't mean that it's a quality education. Pick your school wisely.

Disclaimer: I went back to college as an adult. Primarily to get the student loan refund money since I was dead broke and starting a software venture and needed ad money, also to get those business classes... I lasted two weeks going online (I still can't justify cultural anthropology class).

I later ended up enrolling into a prestigious extension school program where I got my formal business to skip the whole liberal arts requirements hooplah (later started doing the free online school shindig like Udacity & Venturelab for mathematics, programming, and whatnot. Finished that mess, now I know fancy words like the best of them. lol

 

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[tchandy]

Thx for all you are doing. I don't think any school will automatically make you an entrepreneur when you graduate. I talked to someone and graduated with a degree in entrepreneurship and is no where close to working in that area. It takes hard work and a passion for what you want. Four years of college may not even do that. I recommend you start working on your business now. Jim Rohn said I'm working full time but part time on my success. I'm in the Army and a few years away from retirement. No matter where you go, there are plenty of people who will not see your way or the Fastlane way. Even those who say they like Rich Dad Poor Dad they are still afraid to take the first step to do something out of the box.

You mentioned your Tricare helped out with your mom. Do you have something to cover her when you get out? You have to look at plan B and what happens next.

Tom

 

[Kak]

Results may vary. I went to college, got a business degree from a private university. It cost me 120k, I started my current business as a junior. The proof is there for me. I didn't need it. I would probably have a few more customers today without it. I would also probably be living in a place I own right now, rather than renting.

I have since started another company with a partner. I will probably be glad I have some operations and HR knowlege under my belt, but it is nothing I couldn't have learned myself.

Since you are getting a free ride, do it. You can always drop out later if you get something going. Just don't think something magical will happen on graduation that will flood your mind with ideas and opportunity. Start working on something the day you get there.

Also, major in sales, not entrepreneurship. You can read "The Art of The Start" and learn everything they teach you in that major. (I triple majored in Entrepreneurship, Management and Marketing) I tell myself at this point that sales would have been the best bet as an entrepreneur.