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OFF-TOPIC The Fastlane forum, a Value Meritocracy?

S.Y.

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Let's think about it.

Ray Dalio defines an idea meritocracy as a decision-making system where the best ideas win out. To have such system people needs:

"
1) Put their honest thoughts on the table for everyone to see,

2) Have thoughtful disagreements in which there are reasonable back-and-forths in which people evolve their thinking to come up with better decisions than they could come up with individually, and

3) If disagreements remain, have agreed upon protocols that get people past them in idea-meritocratic ways.
"

I was reflecting on that and it dawned on me that the concept applies to this oasis, but in a different way. The best ideas do win out, true. But if we go further, the ideas/posts that provide more value, win. Even further, the forum values people that give the most.

"What is value meritocracy then?". Great question.

Value Meritocracy: a self-regulated system that rewards givers - people that drop value for FREE, just for the sake of helping others.

How does the reward system work?
1. Likes & Rep Bank: Correlate with the amount of value added
2. Badge: Speedway Pass and Legendary Contributors
3. Authority (or Believability): The legends that come to mind when we think about one area
4. Potential business: I think @Andy Black was asked to create a course?
5. Be open minded and willing to learn & people will help you.​

How does the self-regulation work?
1. Add value and you might have a Notable/Gold post
2. Attempt to take without giving & you will get exposed
3. Be a guru and you will be eaten alive.
Hum... hum... hum....

Examples of Valutocrats:
- @MJ DeMarco - The Unscripter, has a great appetite for Bro-marketers and gurus.
- @Vigilante: well, the vigilante
- @SinisterLex: the persuasive writer.
- @Andy Black: the ad guy, EVERYWHERE on this forum, working in the shadow
- @Fox : the Web Designer guy
- @eliquid : SAAS master
- @amp0193: Ecommerce dude
- @IceCreamMan
....
(and many others)
 

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Andy Black

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Potential business: I think @Andy Black was asked to create a course?
Just for the record: MJ did not ask me to create a course and in no way endorses it.

Like many active forum members I’ve had my fair share of people asking for coaching or mentoring.

I’ve also had a few forum members ask if I had a course and a few saying they’d buy a course if I had one. That’s how I was asked to create a course.
 
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S.Y.

S.Y.

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Just for the record: MJ did not ask me to create a course and in no way endorses it.

Like many active forum members I’ve had my fair share of people asking for coaching or mentoring.

I’ve also had a few forum members ask if I had a course and a few saying they’d buy a course if I had one. That’s how I was asked to create a course.
You shared your expertise with people. They recognized you as an expert and asked for a course.

I see it as an amazing way to reward value givers.

Dont want to imply in any ways that it was endorsed by MJ. Nor that he asked you to do it. ;)
 

The-J

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That seems to have been the plan from the beginning of Rep+ bank.

GOLD and Notable threads are interesting, as they are hand picked by a mod. Your thread not only has to get the attention of a mod, but it has to be seen as valuable by one.

Certain individuals' opinions have greater weight here than others. You might see a small circlejerk form on a thread, and then a mod or high Rep+ member steps in and says 'ok, wtf?' This has consequences, both positive and negative, such as a period in 2014 where a high ranked member was outed as a charlatan. Even recently, we have had a few members whose opinions seemed to carry weight, with those members getting outed.

However, it takes a long time for those members to get outed. A certain Nietzsche fan and cold-calling enthusiast had been on the forum since 2008. A certain grumpy cat had been kicked around since about the same time, and had even posted a legendary GOLD thread which shows the creation of something out of nothing. Even when some people know the truth, it can take some time for the full story to come out.

I find Internet communities inherently fascinating, and this forum is no exception. Difference is, this forum actually does some important work; it's not a 'fan forum' or a gaming forum, it's a place where people start, discuss, and grow their careers that last their entire lifetime. This forum will still be affecting people's lives when it's dead and gone. Think about that for a second.
 

GMSI7D

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Let's think about it.

Ray Dalio defines an idea meritocracy as a decision-making system where the best ideas win out. To have such system people needs:

"
"

I was reflecting on that and it dawned on me that the concept applies to this oasis, but in a different way. The best ideas do win out, true. But if we go further, the ideas/posts that provide more value, win. Even further, the forum values people that give the most.

"What is value meritocracy then?". Great question.

Value Meritocracy: a self-regulated system that rewards givers - people that drop value for FREE, just for the sake of helping others.

How does the reward system work?
1. Likes & Rep Bank: Correlate with the amount of value added
2. Badge: Speedway Pass and Legendary Contributors
3. Authority (or Believability): The legends that come to mind when we think about one area
4. Potential business: I think @Andy Black was asked to create a course?
5. Be open minded and willing to learn & people will help you.​

How does the self-regulation work?
1. Add value and you might have a Notable/Gold post
2. Attempt to take without giving & you will get exposed
3. Be a guru and you will be eaten alive.
Hum... hum... hum....

Examples of Valutocrats:
- @MJ DeMarco - The Unscripter, has a great appetite for Bro-marketers and gurus.
- @Vigilante: well, the vigilante
- @SinisterLex: the persuasive writer.
- @Andy Black: the ad guy, EVERYWHERE on this forum, working in the shadow
- @Fox : the Web Designer guy
- @eliquid : SAAS master
- @amp0193: Ecommerce dude
- @IceCreamMan
....
(and many others)

the problem with value is that people are judging value from their current limited point of view


a child will say that candies are value instead of broccoli because they are not smart enough to understand that the adult is right and that health will come by eating brocoli ,not candies


"as above so below "

adults are playing that child who wants to eat candies in the same way because life is an never ending process

so we will shift forever between student and master

student--> master of something --> but then student again because our knowledge is limited and so on for ever


this is the yin yang cycle and evolution through life

yin ---> yang but yin again and yang again for ever


so what's the point

people will give reps on a social proof basis and their current understanding of life

knowledge that is too advanced won't be rewarded because people can't understand it

a child will not reward you for eating broccoli while it is the right thing to do

AS ABOVE SO BELOW

that's why too advanced geniuses are misunderstood

only people walking just before you on the road will be applaused, not geniuses



i suggest you think about that quote:



einstein.jpg
 

ZF Lee

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This forum will still be affecting people's lives when it's dead and gone. Think about that for a second.
Or even generations, if done right.

How does the self-regulation work?
1. Add value and you might have a Notable/Gold post
2. Attempt to take without giving & you will get exposed
3. Be a guru and you will be eaten alive.
Number 3 might be conditional. Gurus are fine as long they did, and do what they preach. And it's more of burnt alive rather than eaten alive. :playful:

For a Gold/Notable thread, usually not one Fastlaner is behind it. They usually have tons of great gems fired in, which give a holistic picture of the topic of the thread. And sometimes Gold/Notables evolve from some crap-shows lol.

I've been thinking of reading Ray Dalio's book, but it's one of those heavy books that takes me months to digest. Something like UNSCRIPTED.
 
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S.Y.

S.Y.

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Or even generations, if done right.
I've been thinking of reading Ray Dalio's book, but it's one of those heavy books that takes me months to digest. Something like UNSCRIPTED.
I skipped his background completely and went directly to the Part II - Life Principles. It is actually the only section of the book I read (about 140 pages). The last part is not relevant to me at this moment. I will eventually come back to it when needed.


the problem with value is that people are judging value from their current limited point of view


a child will say that candies are value instead of broccoli because they are not smart enough to understand that the adult is right and that health will come by eating brocoli ,not candies


"as above so below "

adults are playing that child who wants to eat candies in the same way because life is an never ending process

so we will shift forever between student and master

student--> master of something --> but then student again because our knowledge is limited and so on for ever


this is the yin yang cycle and evolution through life

yin ---> yang but yin again and yang again for ever


so what's the point

people will give reps on a social proof basis and their current understanding of life

knowledge that is too advanced won't be rewarded because people can't understand it

a child will not reward you for eating broccoli while it is the right thing to do

AS ABOVE SO BELOW

that's why too advanced geniuses are misunderstood

only people walking just before you on the road will be applaused, not geniuses



i suggest you think about that quote:

View attachment 18849
Our decisions and behaviours are limited by our cognitive abilities, the information we have access to and the time we have to make our decisions. I won't deny it. We all suffer from bounded rationality. Anyone saying otherwise is delusional or a God.

So yes, I agree. We will have situations where value is not rewarded because of a lack of understanding or where it rewarded more than necessary.

What's the point?

To give me a tool to make decision more effectively.

I don't know much about running ads. Eventually, I will have to learn how. For the sake of simplicity, say, I can only look at this forum for answers. I can:

a. Look for people that are "known" for their knowledge on how to run ads, using reps/likes and the overall consensus as proxies. And then follow their advices.

b. Look at everyone, attempt to find someone knowledgeable (based on my current understanding).​

Option (b) is less effective. There might be someone in (b) that knows way more than anyone in (a), but it is much more effective for me to look at people identified in (a). (Mind you, I don't need the best-advanced knowledge at that point; something above my comprehension level is quite enough. Missing on the absolute most knowledgeable person is acceptable)

It doesn't mean I will blindly and fanatically follow any piece of advice. Absolutely not. I will adapt as I go. And with practice, my understanding will increase - hopefully - improving my ability to filter pieces of advice I should not follow.

And so will a child rewards me for eating broccoli because it is the right thing to do? No. There is a little fallacy here, however. The goal of a child is not to be healthy, it is rather to eat something they like. I will bet they will reward me for giving them awesome sugar-filled candy.

But hey, they are many things to factor in to properly answer that question.

P.S: Whoever made it this far...:praise:
 
Last edited:

MJ DeMarco

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3. Authority (or Believability): The legends that come to mind when we think about one area
What I find fascinating however is that even some legendary posters are not immune from critique, or even being banned. We aren't afraid to call someone out on their BS, even if they have some kind of "badge" or incredible post history. Sure the reputation helps, but around here it isn't an impervious shield if one is dabbling in bro-marketing and shady dealings.
 

jcvlds

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I've been thinking of reading Ray Dalio's book, but it's one of those heavy books that takes me months to digest. Something like UNSCRIPTED.
It's a great book, I got the audiobook and you can go through it much faster to get the gist of Ray's view of the world along with the Principles he's acquired and adopted throughout his life. If you later want to focus in on any particular one that you can apply at the moment, you can go into the book for the details.
 

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