Sure, let’s blame capitalism

[Scot]

So this post came across my Facebook news feed today.



The post title was something to the effect of

“This is capitalism for you. Actual job posting...”

The comments section was full of people complaining about minimum wage, how they had jobs with low pay but high qualifications, etc.

The only thing I could think was, “ god, I hope they found the sicko who held a gun to their head and forced them to apply to this job”

Everyone saw this as an example of why capitalism was horrible.

But we all know the other side of this story, being entrepreneurs.

What actually happens is this employer won’t get qualified leads. They’ll either get applicants who are bad fits for this position or just need a paycheck while they look for another, better paying one.

The end result is the employee will put out bad quality work and produce less profit. In the end, the employer will suffer because they did not want to pay market value for qualified employees. They will either suffer on the P&L sheets or learn their lesson and increase salary offering.

That is how capitalism works. What the comments want is socialism, where you get paid whatever some agency seems fit, not based on merit or skill level.

I know this is common sense to us, but I had to vent to people who actually get this concept.

 

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[Longinus]

 

[CycleGuy]

The majority of people who are already poor/impoverished/unemployed/underemployed tend to believe they are special and deserve $25/hr or higher starting out. Especially people with non-stem bachelor's degrees. It doesn't work that way.

In 10 years, it won't be minimum wage we're fighting. It will be universal basic income...
People aren't advancing at the pace of tech and the cognitive abilities required to function as a successful member of society will continue to rise.

 

[LeoistheSun]

The majority of people who are already poor/impoverished/unemployed/underemployed tend to believe they are special and deserve $25/hr or higher starting out. Especially people with non-stem bachelor's degrees. It doesn't work that way.

In 10 years, it won't be minimum wage we're fighting. It will be universal basic income...
People aren't advancing at the pace of tech and the cognitive abilities required to function as a successful member of society will continue to rise.

Well I had experience and did not have a bachelors or associates (im a dropout) and I DID get a $25/hr job starting out...

 

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[CycleGuy]

Well I had experience and did not have a bachelors or associates (im a dropout) and I DID get a $25/hr job starting out...

That's great, you're not the majority I'm talking about. We have lots of general laborers and coal miners doing similar but the key word is experience. You have a skill set employers are willing to pay for.

edit:
Location: Southern California

Don't dog walkers in Southern Cali make $75k/year?
(I keed, I keed)

 

[Scot]

Well I had experience and did not have a bachelors or associates (im a dropout) and I DID get a $25/hr job starting out...

I had a bachelors and was a veteran and I washes dishes at Red Lobster. But then I went to job fairs and got a job with Verizon. There I developed a skill, sales, and at my day job I make a really good living. It’s all about what you do to improve your own lives.

That’s why we’re all on this forum. We’re here to improve our lives, something most people don’t seem to actually want to do.

 

[PedroG]

People aren't advancing at the pace of tech and the cognitive abilities required to function as a successful member of society will continue to rise.

Interesting comment. I was just thinking the other day about how members of my family are so much worse off than they were 20 years ago when I was a teenager.

Maybe it's just how I remember things being back then, but it seems there are so many people that I know that just haven't done what it takes to just survive, let alone thrive in society.

It's like they're all in a big bubble waiting to burst. They're one economic crisis away from being out on the street. And it's all because they went through life like it was just about being biologically alive, and nothing more.

 

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[MidwestLandlord]

Optometry techs are gonna get replaced by machines anyway...

 

[mike24601]

I work in a unionized job that doesn't require very much skill and where all employees in the work group are equal in qualifications. Assuming enough caloric intake and you don't do anything get fired, you can progress to a very high pay rate in a relatively short period of time. As a result, I work with a lot of petty, uneducated goobers that get paid 4x what I make for the same job and have a complex because of it, even though the guy/gal starting on day 1 has no less skill or actual value than the most senior employee. Makes me want to puke

 

[CycleGuy]

Interesting comment. I was just thinking the other day about how members of my family are so much worse off than they were 20 years ago when I was a teenager.

Maybe it's just how I remember things being back then, but it seems there are so many people that I know that just haven't done what it takes to just survive, let alone thrive in society.

It's like they're all in a big bubble waiting to burst. They're one economic crisis away from being out on the street. And it's all because they went through life like it was just about being biologically alive, and nothing more.

It's happening as we speak. While tech is helping our economies grow and most of us on this forum are benefiting from it, the lower functioning portion of society continues to struggle.

Your observation of your family is correct. I've noticed a similar pattern in my family. Some members of my extended family are the types of people I truly despise. Using every type of handout and assistance available instead of working hard and bettering their situation.

The thing is, none of them are "African Poor". They all have phones/tvs/housing/cars. I think that's what the future points towards. A large section of the population with low cognitive abilities, who never thrive in society, but have all of their basic needs provided for them.

It's sad and against everything I believe in, but I think it's going to happen.

 

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[Niptuck MD]

i hope robots take over so then I can implement quality control on those robots to do menial tasks like janitorial and button pushing at automotive plants lol

 

[MJ DeMarco]

OMG, just look at this from a mathematical perspective...

You've graduated from college with an optometry specialization. In doing so, you've spent 4 years of your life and approximately $150,000 for WHAT?

An extra $2 an hour more than minimum wage!
Does this sound like a good investment?

No, capitalism doesn't suck.

Your brain sucks at questioning authority and making economic decisions about your life.

But yea, everyone in the world from grandma to your guidance counselor said "Go to college!" and you did, without question, without pretense, and without foresight.

 

[CycleGuy]

OMG, just look at this from a mathematical perspective...

You've graduated from college with an optometry specialization. In doing so, you've spent 4 years of your life and approximately $150,000 for WHAT?

An extra $2 an hour more than minimum wage!
Does this sound like a good investment?

No, capitalism doesn't suck.

Your brain sucks at questioning authority and making economic decisions about your life.

But yea, everyone in the world from grandma to your guidance counselor said "Go to college!" and you did, without question, without pretense, and without foresight.

 

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[C-Jay]

The majority of people who are already poor/impoverished/unemployed/underemployed tend to believe they are special and deserve $25/hr or higher starting out. Especially people with non-stem bachelor's degrees. It doesn't work that way.

In 10 years, it won't be minimum wage we're fighting. It will be universal basic income...
People aren't advancing at the pace of tech and the cognitive abilities required to function as a successful member of society will continue to rise.

Exactly. This all relates back to the script. The advice kids receive to "do what you love and everything will work out". That then gets twisted into "do what's easy". The thing about STEM is that it's F*cking hard. No surprise that the highest paying jobs are in those fields. I can't count how many friends/acquaintances I have, or fellow students in university, who got their degree in liberal arts, English, sociology, or (insert 90% of useless degrees here) and to this day, years later, work unskilled labour, server, or retail jobs making the minimum wage or slightly higher. No disrespect meant to that portion of the workforce.

Intense disrespect to the ones that then have the audacity to complain about it and how it isn't their vault that they've topped out. They blame the job market. They blame the job-stealing immigrants. They blame the boomers. They blame their boss. Their coworkers. Everything and everyone gets blamed.

My degree was fairly useless too, but I've done just fine in spite of it. And the only person who receives any blame for that is this guy.

I'm in Canada, and the job market here isn't that bad. When I hear people complain about, say, the housing market? Okay, yeah I'll grant them that. It's absurd, and even responsible slowlaners earning respectable wages are being priced out of major cities (try living in Manhattan on 100k; that's Toronto with 80k). But complaining about your job? Give me a break. There are well-paying jobs for everyone willing to learn the required skills to get them. If you refuse to divorce your connection with the useless bachelor's degree you got...well, that's your problem.

edit: the reason I mention the housing market is because my grandparents, on unskilled labour salaries (before my grandfather started a business), were able to comfortably afford buying a house. In fairness to unskilled wannabe homeowners today, that's simply impossible in the majority of medium+ cost of living cities, and that fact is a larger economical issue.

 

[JAJT]

Want to know what almost nobody wants to hear from you?

"Have you tried calling the places you've applied to and speaking to someone about the position?"

I've asked this to a bunch of folks and "resentment" is the best word to describe the response.

The mere idea that maybe they might have to speak to someone and do a little hunting and selling of themselves is insulting to them. "I don't want to work at any place that requires candidates to go that far out of their way to work for them" is one of the funnier answers I've heard. "I don't want to annoy them and ruin my chances" is another funny one.

You're jobless.
You're broke.
Pick up the F*cking phone.

I swear, everyone agrees with the statement "insanity is doing the same things and expecting different results" until it comes to job hunting. Then it becomes "I've applied everywhere and nobody is hiring me, I better find more places to apply to".

No F*cking wonder you ended up at a shit job.
Instead of looking for the needle in the haystack you went looking for the peanut in the shit pile.

 

[C-Jay]

The mere idea that maybe they might have to speak to someone and do a little hunting and selling of themselves is insulting to them. "I don't want to work at any place that requires candidates to go that far out of their way to work for them" is one of the funnier answers I've heard. "I don't want to annoy them and ruin my chances" is another funny one.

I have a few "friends" who are constant complainers. Every word they say with regard to money or finance is laced with resentment at the luck or good fortune of others. And then, when you try to give them the practical advice of "here's an idea for you..." - you get the mumble response of why it wouldn't work, or that they'll do it someday. It's laziness and nothing else. They're the exact people who will let you believe they know what they're talking about when they say "I know I shouldn't follow up on that application too eagerly; I don't want to look desperate"

Well, you should be desperate. But you clearly are not. And that's your problem.

 

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[luniac]

As long as there ARE jobs and affordable food and housing, i got no complaints.
if u want an iphone 10 too, well that's a luxury buddy...
I do believe all U.S. citizens are entitled to a job that can support basic needs.
12 an hour is enough for a decent existence in a shit neighborhood, or roomate in a better neighborhood.
of course 40 hours a week is wage slavery but that's what the fastlane is for.
and if neither sound appealing, can always move to the third world i guess?
The system ain't perfect, but 150 years ago there weren't even hospitals around, people need to keep things in perspective.
The bachelor requirement is pretty funny though lmao!!!!

 

[LeoistheSun]

The things that got me my job when the requirement was a bachelors was:

- Being sociable (I heard stories about the other candidates I was competing with. Most were highly introverted)
- Sending handwritten thank you letters to everyone in the interview and even not (like the head boss)
- Follow up calls 1x a week
- Knowing someone who knew the IT guy doing the hiring

Im pretty sure that a bachelors has nothing to do with it. Bachelors just signifies you go for what you want (more than people who dont have it), you've got good work ethic and some other qualities.

 

[rc08234]

Half the guys I bounce with have bachelors. We all kick the same amount of a$$, and we all get paid the same. I don't really think the guys a$$ we are kicking cares if one of us has a bacherlors or not?

I called this 6 years ago when Obama wanted everyone to go to college. When everyone goes to college the new "G.E.D." is a bachelors. If the trend continues we will have PHDS flipping hamburgers.

 

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[socaldude]

Part of the problem is our stupid government.

Give an 18 year old who has no clue $100K in loans guaranteed by taxpayers cause he is supposedly being held back. Genius.

Way to hold him even more back cause now he has $100k in useless debt and no job.

If it was a free market, nobody would loan $100k to some kid to go to school and not even get a good paying job.

Or our education system who is in denial wants everyone to think that college is the prime path to success. Insane.

All of this denial reminds of how an alcoholic looks at you in the face and says "What are you talking about? I'm not an alcoholic. I can stop drinking whenever".

This wouldn't happen in a purely capitalistic environment.

If you walked up to private investor and asked for $100k to go to school he would say hell no. How is he gonna get his money back?

 

[MJ DeMarco]

This wouldn't happen in a purely capitalistic environment.

If you walked up to private investor and asked for $100k to go to school he would say hell no. How is he gonna get his money back?

Excellent point. In a free market system, it wouldn't happen because risk, demand, and economics would come into play.

But instead, we have millions of clueless kids signing their debt-to-death-warrant all because they're told to.

 

[MJ DeMarco]

I went to college so I can get an extra $2 more than minimum wage!?

[GALLERY=media, 93]Con by MJ DeMarco posted Dec 1, 2017 at 12:34 AM[/GALLERY]

 

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[inputchip]

Just going to leave this here.

 

[CycleGuy]

The swing is happening towards more middle class youth working towards skilled trade professions. Electricians, plumbers, carpenters, welders, HVAC etc

I believe it's a great fit for a large portion of kids who were preached "go to college!" for their entire lives. Many types of trade positions are secure, pay a decent wage, and have room for growth. Especially considering if a fast lane minded person gets into a skilled trade position, then creates a large successful business from it.

 

[Mr.Brandtastic]

"I don't want to annoy them and ruin my chances" is another funny one.

As if a place that would be that annoyed at a phone call of you wanting to work, that they wouldn't hire you, would even remotely be a good job to work at.

“This is capitalism for you. Actual job posting...”

Yea because jobs were so great and meaningful under communism apparently.



I never understand people's eagerness to be a better wage slave. I want communism! So what? So you can be a better authoritarian bootlicker and jail those who engage in wrongthink? Wow. What a great revolutionary you are!

 

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[luniac]

Was there ever a 100% communist country? the USSR was socialist right. The average joe in the US vs USSR probably lived very similar day to day?
except US had more upward potential vs USSR guaranteed social services.

Would i sacrifice the potential to get rich to pursue my passion and have guaranteed housing,healthcare,work under the system?
Depends on the work i guess and on the uhhh "human spirit" around me so to speak?

 

[Azure]

Bud

Was there ever a 100% communist country? the USSR was socialist right. The average joe in the US vs USSR probably lived very similar day to day?
except US had more upward potential vs USSR guaranteed social services.

Would i sacrifice the potential to get rich to pursue my passion and have guaranteed housing,healthcare,work under the system?
Depends on the work i guess and on the uhhh "human spirit" around me so to speak?

I fail to imagine any period of the USSR when quality of life standards matched the USA or any well developed Western European nation. Even during economically prosperous time periods of the Stalinist era industrial build up, the average citizen still had to contend with poverty, famine ridden living conditions - and the ever present threat of being killed by the state for....well, whatever they said you did.

Sounds like a great time

 

[luniac]

Bud


I fail to imagine any period of the USSR when quality of life standards matched the USA or any well developed Western European nation. Even during economically prosperous time periods of the Stalinist era industrial build up, the average citizen still had to contend with poverty, famine ridden living conditions - and the ever present threat of being killed by the state for....well, whatever they said you did.

Sounds like a great time

of course there was poverty, u wanna drive a Lamborghini down Nazi Bombed Stalingrad Lane?
the whole country was a wreck, millions upon millions dead, not very fair to compare that to "well developed western european nations"
I honestly think the way USSR bounced back after WW2 to be worthy of praise, going from a literal wasteland to putting the first human in space. I mean that's goddamn incredible!

as far as killed by the state, no worse than the CIA i say.

 

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[Thoelt53]

of course there was poverty, u wanna drive a Lamborghini down Nazi Bombed Stalingrad Lane?
the whole country was a wreck, millions upon millions dead, not very fair to compare that to "well developed western european nations"
I honestly think the way USSR bounced back after WW2 to be worthy of praise, going from a literal wasteland to putting the first human in space. I mean that's goddamn incredible!

as far as killed by the state, no worse than the CIA i say.

Read up fam: 20th Century Democide

And as for your previous post about the USSR being “socialist right,” it’s all bullshit. In the bitter end there is only collectivism and individualism. Collectivism is responsible for tremendous bloodshed. SIX TIMES more so than all wars fought, both foreign and civil, in the entire world, during the 20th century.

It’s no secret that the US has killed hundreds of thousands of people during war. That number, however, is dwarfed by the 61 MILLION people slaughtered by the USSR alone.

Democide is horrifying and most people are completely unaware of it.

 

[StevieB]

Your brain sucks at questioning authority and making economic decisions about your life.

Psychological studies have proven this over and over. Authority holds a HUGE sway over our decisions.

Even in an experimental environment the 'authority' can make people literally shock someone to death, just because they have a clipboard and doctors coat.

https://www.simplypsychology.org/milgram.html

"
Conclusion:


Ordinary people are likely to follow orders given by an authority figure, even to the extent of killing an innocent human being. Obedience to authority is ingrained in us all from the way we are brought up.

People tend to obey orders from other people if they recognize their authority as morally right and/or legally based. This response to legitimate authority is learned in a variety of situations, for example in the family, school, and workplace."