Is it possible for very rich people to hang out with poor/working class people?

[Alfie321]

It is unlikely.

I am still far away from super rich but I certainly do not hang out a lot with regular people other than at bars. I can only imagine it is the same for richer people. As others have outlined it all comes to mindset and what you want to spend your time on/what can you spend your time on.

As I work remotely I can travel often. I would love to travel with someone but that's just not possible 99% of the time with regular people. They either have jobs they need to attend or if they are on vacation they cannot afford it, so most of the time i'm by myself and instead meet locals and make friends on the fly.

Other times when they want to do X that i do not find interesting i just want to work, so we don't really find common ground most of the time and our results differ. The only times where i find common ground with regular folks is when we are partying and nobody really cares who you are.

On the other hand i tend to get along well with other people who work remotely. We can spend hours just working making jokes here and there.

 

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[WJK]

I've thought about this a lot over the years. I grew up very modestly. I do have friends of modest means. And I have a whole community of tenants who are low to moderate-income people. They come and hang out with me at my office. BUT, I do find that I "dumbie-down" when I'm dealing with a lot of them. I downplay my situation. I downplay my education, experience, and intelligence. I have a whole life that they know nothing about. I read books that they don't know exist. I see things and I think of things different from them. It's funny though. I do understand where they are coming from.

 

[Romstar]

The thread title might sound a bit simplified.

I myself don't care what others earn, and I don't care for expensive things just because they are expensive. I.e I couldn't care less about what type of brand a watch or car is. I'm far from shallow when it comes to people I surround myself with.

But when I think about very, very wealthy people, I wonder if it's possible for them to have a group of friends that are not. People that work in a warehouse, in telemarketing and so on.

When I say rich, I mean the ones that have so much money that they most likely would have to invest in a house that is more secure, and a car that is way above average. At least in my country, in Europe, you wouldn't be able to hide your wealth, because it's possible to see what others earn and it would be a security risk.

I know it's possible to wear sweatpants and still be a millionaire. But at least around here, people would still know that a person has that kind of wealth. He's not just rich, but he's wealthy.

And I think most people would like to buy a very nice house, a cool and fast car and maybe travel a bit more than others, if they had that kind of wealth.

So, my question is - would it actually be possible to socialize with people from the working class, when you are in this position?

You'd still share some interests, still have the same humour - but I would think that the huge difference in wealth and freedom would create a barrier between that wealthy person and the working class people. I imagine they would behave differently and feel differently, in a negative way. Either by being envious, sucking up or trying to exploit the situation in some way.

I just remember when I was around 17-18 (living in a poor area) one of my mates received an ok amount of money from the government. All of the sudden, people that we knew started calling him more and wanting to hang out with him more. It was absurd to see. The way people changed around him was crazy.

I still see the same type of behaviour as an adult, when a celebrity or a very rich person comes around. "Regular people "(I'm a "regular person", but not this kind) loses it. They change completely. Not just for a day or an hour, but for weeks and months. Any time that person is around they change their behaviour and manners.

Again, when I was a teenager I got some fame locally. I could then see how people flipped as well. My closest ones didn't (apart from a few), but people that barely said hello before, all of the sudden wanted to buy me pints, have my number and so on.

So, in general, is it possible for a filthy rich person to have a close social group that consists of working class people? I'm not talking about meeting your old friends once a year at the pub, but having regular meet-up with the lads.

Note: I'm not rich and I have a working class background. So this is not meant to bash on anyone.

I don't think it's possible and if it's well known and out in publish and there are several reasons for this.

1. If the wealthy person displays their wealth i.e. fancy car/house then they have already set the precedent that they're taking advantage of their wealth and will therefore modify their hobbies to do the same. When their less wealthy peers can't keep up with their social norms then they will simply migrate to newer wealthier people hence why it is actually very lonely at the top.

2. Wealthy people are almost always wealthy for a reason and it tends to do with their lifestyle. Look at Elon Musk. He has very little in common with most people, I'll bet my life he can't sit down and watch a movie. His level of consciousness is unparalleled by most of us, fun to him is building a space ship.

3. The relationship will naturally become a parasitic one because the symbiotic aspects of the previous relationship can't continue due to the financial differences. If Bill works 40 hours a week programming at his job he simply won't have the time and energy to prepare Brisket for Edward's cookout on Saturday but Edward who is semi-retired can look jacked, spend 10 hours cooking whatever fanciness he desires, and can enjoy his time.

Plus I believe everyone has a different definition of friends. Friends are kind of "business" like nowadays.

 

[Seamster]

I think it's hard to be friends with someone too dissimilar to you. The chart below shows mindsets, not necessarily current cash on hand. A man with $5 million might still be growing his business so he is still acting from the entrepreneur mindset most of the time. Or, I know someone who is divorced and disabled. She's cash-poor, but her credit score is over 800, no debt, and she works hard under-the-table. So, her mindset is still Working Class.

Take a look at the chart and below I'll show how my interactions with others go.



Personally, I'm in 3 of the categories: I could survive on my $1500/mo passive income so I'm technically by my own definition rich, but that's not a lot so I'm still an entrepreneur trying to build that to $4000/mo before quitting my day job that I have as a member of the working class.

Me vs Poor - believe it or not I have studied the poor (book recommendations below). How can they drive a brand-new vehicle, afford 3 dogs and 5 kids, and not pay their $100/mo share of a government subsidized rental house? I once was kind of seeing this cute girl who worked part-time. Then she got knocked up by a druggie and I stepped away. I continued the friendship to learn. She just did nothing all day except live with mom and sister to raise the baby. All on government assistance. All drunk or high by 3 pm. When she leaves the house she takes a) phone and b) charger. Nothing else. No cash. No ID. No purse. No pockets. For them life = whatever the day brings. Our conversations are about food or popular media. When she calls I don't even want to answer. But answering helps me learn.

Me vs Working Class - I can safely say that my ambitions to be rich and time devoted to hard work has lost me friends. After my day job 9-5 weekdays, I might go paint or fix a fence. I'm home by 11 pm just in time for beer and a little TV. What have they done all day after work? YouTube. Xbox. We can't talk about cars because they want Teslas or BMWs. They have $0 in the bank and drive those cars whereas I have plenty of savings and drive a $1000 car. They talk about granite countertops in their $250k houses with $2000 mortgage payments; I talk about scraping the gunk off my 50 year old countertops in my rentals and my $500 apartment rent. They have kids and dogs and jetskis. I have none of this. They say, "you care too much about money" although we're all sitting at the same 9-5 for the purpose of making money.

Me vs Rich - I know some people with $1 million net worth or more. But, intimately, I only know millionaire couples who have worked hard and saved for 20 years. The conversation is fine, but I can't comment too much because they're all 20 years older than me.

Me vs Entrepreneurs - I can really only be friends with people who want to talk about investing, real estate, cell phone app creation, etc. You know how someone might feel jealous if you saw a guy who was more handsome, more muscular, taller, and richer than you? Well, entrepreneurs don't feel this way. They learn from each other.



A Framework for Understanding Poverty by Ruby K. Payne
No Shame in My Game: The Working Poor in the Inner City by Katherine Newman

 

[WJK]

I think it's hard to friends with someone too dissimilar to you. The chart below shows mindsets, not necessarily current cash on hand. A man with $5 million might still be growing his business so he is still acting from the entrepreneur mindset most of the time. Or, I know someone who is divorced and disabled. She's cash-poor, but her credit score is over 800, no debt, and she works hard under-the-table. So, her mindset is still Working Class.

Take a look at the chart and below I'll show how my interactions with others go.

View attachment 35993

Personally, I'm in 3 of the categories: I could survive on my $1500/mo passive income so I'm technically by own definition rich, but that's not a lot so I'm still an entrepreneur trying to build that to $4000/mo before quitting my day job that I have as a member of the working class.

Me vs Poor - believe it or not I have studied the poor (book recommendations below). How can they drive a brand-new vehicle, afford 3 dogs and 5 kids, and not pay their $100/mo share of a government subsidized rental house? I once was kind of seeing this cute girl who worked part-time. Then she got knocked up by a druggie and I stepped away. I continued the friendship to learn. She just did nothing all day except live with mom and sister to raise the baby. All on government assistance. All drunk or high by 3 pm. When she leaves the house she takes a) phone and b) charger. Nothing else. No cash. No ID. No purse. No pockets. For them life = whatever the day brings. Our conversations are about food or popular media. When she calls I don't even want to answer. But answering helps me learn.

Me vs Working Class - I can safely say that my ambitions to be rich and time devoted to hard work has lost me friends. After my day job 9-5 weekdays, I might go paint or fix a fence. I'm home by 11 pm just in time for beer and a little TV. What have they done all day after work? YouTube. Xbox. We can't talk about cars because they want Teslas or BMWs. They have $0 in the bank and drive those cars whereas I have plenty of savings and drive a $1000 car. They talk about granite countertops in their $250k houses with $2000 mortgage payments; I talk about scraping the gunk off my 50 year old countertops in my rentals and my $500 apartment rent. They have kids and dogs and jetskis. I have none of this. They say, "you care too much about money" although we're all sitting at the same 9-5 for the purpose of making money.

Me vs Rich - I know some people who with $1 million net worth or more. But, intimately, I only know millionaire couples who have worked hard and saved for 20 years. The conversation is fine, but I can't comment too much because they're all 20 years older than me.

Me vs Entrepreneurs - I can really only be friends with people who want to talk about investing, real estate, cell phone app creation, etc. You know how you'd be jealous if you saw a guy who was more handsome, more muscular, taller, and richer than you? Well, entrepreneurs don't feel this way. They learn from each other.



A Framework for Understanding Poverty by Ruby K. Payne
No Shame in My Game: The Working Poor in the Inner City by Katherine Newman

Are people with a million dollars or a million+ really rich? There are many levels within those ranks. I'll never fit into the "trust babies" group since I've made my little nest egg like you. There's a whole segment of the population who never felt the pain of not having or going without. I can never explain my attitudes & decisions to them. They have no frame of reference -- but neither do poor people.

Old habits die hard. For example, I still drive older vehicles. Right now, I'm fixing a pickup truck for myself that we bought at an impound yard auction. What a deal -- and it runs good -- and we've made it pretty. Even with adding the costs of fixing it up to my liking, I still paid less than 40% of its current market value. And less than a tenth of what it would have cost new.

I look for bargains and watch my spending. I worked too hard for too long to waste the results. It's not IF I can afford to buy something newer and sexier. The question is, how will I feel about it down the road after the "newness" has worn off. Would it still be worth the price? What if I just charged that item? How would I feel about having to make payments on a declining-value asset? Do I have STUPID written across my forehead? It's an endless treadmill and I just not a good hamster. And that's what I can't explain to the people you are calling the working class.

 

[JordanK]

If you want to be friends with anyone then just add value to their life. It's that simple?

As an example, I'm 22 and have a 'small' real estate business. I hang out with 50+ year olds in the industry who are very wealthy and also have a wealth of knowledge.

I'll go out on a Saturday morning to help them solve an issue at a rental property or handle some of their calls when they go away for a week or two on holiday with the family. I'll also jump on a phone call with them at 11pm at night to hear about a great deal they just landed and the inner workings of how it came to be. In most cases, their wives don't really care about their business.. the kids may or may not.. but as you all know as entrepreneurs its a significant part of our lives and we all love to share our wins and mull over our loses at times.

They know I'm super interested in what they are doing. I ask the right questions and challenge them on an intellectual level. Isn't that what we all really want out of our friends? To be interested in common things, to be happy for each others success, to enjoy each others company and to offer support/guidance when things aren't fully going to plan.

I have a lot of mentors but I think when people go looking 'to find a mentor' they approach it from completely the wrong angle. All of my mentors since I started down the entrepreneurial path few years back are people who I first admired greatly, then I became friends with and we both genuinely cared about each others lives/success. I have never asked anyone to 'be my mentor', if I'm having a problem that I need support or direction on I'll pick up the phone and ask my friend what he would do in a similar situation. Often times they do the same with me as I'm more hands on so I have 'my ear to the ground' (Irish expression for knowing whats happening in the real world vs a behind a desk/internet sources) in whats happening locally. Or I'll run an errand for them, do some basic repairs when the handymen aren't available etc for free and immediately.

There is no better way to learn than to help solve the problems of people who are 20-40 years ahead of you on a similar journey.

 

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[WJK]

If you want to be friends with anyone then just add value to their life. It's that simple?

As an example, I'm 22 and have a 'small' real estate business. I hang out with 50+ year olds in the industry who are very wealthy and also have a wealth of knowledge.

I'll go out on a Saturday morning to help them solve an issue at a rental property or handle some of their calls when they go away for a week or two on holiday with the family. I'll also jump on a phone call with them at 11pm at night to hear about a great deal they just landed and the inner workings of how it came to be. In most cases, their wives don't really care about their business.. the kids may or may not.. but as you all know as entrepreneurs its a significant part of our lives and we all love to share our wins and mull over our loses at times.

They know I'm super interested in what they are doing. I ask the right questions and challenge them on an intellectual level. Isn't that what we all really want out of our friends? To be interested in common things, to be happy for each others success, to enjoy each others company and to offer support/guidance when things aren't fully going to plan.

I have a lot of mentors but I think when people go looking 'to find a mentor' they approach it from completely the wrong angle. All of my mentors since I started down the entrepreneurial path few years back are people who I first admired greatly, then I became friends with and we both genuinely cared about each others lives/success. I have never asked anyone to 'be my mentor', if I'm having a problem that I need support or direction on I'll pick up the phone and ask my friend what he would do in a similar situation. Often times they do the same with me as I'm more hands on so I have 'my ear to the ground' (Irish expression for knowing whats happening in the real world vs a behind a desk/internet sources) in whats happening locally. Or I'll run an errand for them, do some basic repairs when the handymen aren't available etc for free and immediately.

There is no better way to learn than to help solve the problems of people who are 20-40 years ahead of you on a similar journey.

You're right. I'm starting on my 45th year in the RE business. I have a lot to teach and I'm totally willing to do that. But, the student must actually do the work. It's a hands-on process. A lot of times, my best students have followed me around. By shadowing me, they can see how I think, make decisions, and how I do things. Most people on the outside can't see what I'm doing day-to-day. Expertise makes it looks easy. The student must be inside the circle to understand.

There is no better way to learn than to help solve the problems of people who are 20-40 years ahead of you on a similar journey.

I find that many younger people don't want to have a 20 to 40-year trail in front of them. They want the rewards now. BUT, that's what it has taken me. I've had wonderful mentors over the years. And I have learned my lessons in the school of hard knocks.

You also talk about the lack of support that the investor experiences from his family. I totally understand that. I can't tell you how often I have been advised by close relatives to sell out and forget the whole thing. For a lot of these years, I have celebrated with my RE friends without telling my family about what I was doing. At the moment, I have no children who are interested in working with me or taking over my business. But, they'd sure like to have the money... sad...

 

[Seamster]

I think it's hard to friends with someone too dissimilar to you. The chart below shows mindsets, not necessarily current cash on hand. A man with $5 million might still be growing his business so he is still acting from the entrepreneur mindset most of the time. Or, I know someone who is divorced and disabled. She's cash-poor, but her credit score is over 800, no debt, and she works hard under-the-table. So, her mindset is still Working Class.

Totally, that chart I made is about mindset but I think that's more relevant than cash-on-hand. A person who has "made it" will understand what entrepreneurs are trying to do. However, if they're like me, I've seen so many people jump into real estate head first and a year later they're off doing something else. I'd like to help someone who's actually bought his first house or else so how has proven he's serious.

Yup, working mindset dies hard, like you say below. My friend has an entrepreneurial mindset like us, and he got a $15,000 contract to refloor an office building. He'll pocket like $6000 of that. More jobs to come. But, he's not happy because he's actually going to do the work with a partner and one laborer. He would be happier to get $2000 and do nothing, which is what he's trying to set up.

Are people with a million dollars or a million+ really rich? There are many levels within those ranks. I'll never fit into the "trust babies" group since I've made my little nest egg like you. There's a whole segment of the population who never felt the pain of not having or going without. I can never explain my attitudes & decisions to them. They have no frame of reference -- but neither do poor people.

These people are the worst for real? I'm not from a big city but one is an hour away which was perfect for me: big city pay, small city rent! But the people there are not like the people from home. At home people value my $1000 car. When they see it they're like, "Boy, you must be saving some money!" and are proud of me. People at work near the big city are like, "I see rust. I think it's time for a new car." I'm like, "Uhh, when I start seeing rust on your car is when I ask you A-holes if you're ready to SELL IT TO ME! lolol

Old habits die hard. For example, I still drive older vehicles. Right now, I'm fixing a pickup truck .....

I look for bargains and watch my spending. I worked too hard for too long to waste the results. It's not IF I can afford to buy something newer and sexier. The question is, how will I feel about it down the road after the "newness" has worn off. Would it still be worth the price? What if I just charged that item? How would I feel about having to make payments on a declining-value asset? Do I have STUPID written across my forehead? It's an endless treadmill and I just not a good hamster. And that's what I can't explain to the people you are calling the working class.

Da truth! A pickup truck is $50k but then you have tax and insurance and registration and financing fees. That shiny new Silverado costs you about $60k, which to me DELAYS RETIREMENT BY 3 YEARS because I spend $20k/yr. Why would I buy that truck? I have an $800 truck and paid $1200 for a guy to weld on exhaust and weld the bed back together that had rusted apart. Then I paint what he welded every single year with bed coating or under-body coating (costs me $10 a year). Then I bought a $100 plastic bed liner, and got a free 5/8" 4x8' piece of plywood that toss in the bed whenever I need to haul something heavy. And yes, I've gotten loads of stone.

So, they work 3 years of their life to pay for their truck. I spend a couple hours a year maintaining mine and putting a board in to support the weak bed. I retire at 60 they work until 63, and that's only 3 years for ONE truck. How many trucks will they buy in their lives? Probably a few.

(Obvioulsy I'm shaving off retirement time in other areas too, but, since we were on the topic I had to comment. I worked in automotive and always like talking about cars, especially how people waste money on them!!)

 

[WJK]

Totally, that chart is mindset but I think that's more relevant than cash-on-hand. A person who has "made it" will understand who entrepreneurs are doing. However, if they're like me, I've seen so many people jump into real estate head first and a year later they're off doing something else. I'd like to help someone who's actually bought his first house or else so how has proven he's serious.

Yup, working mindset dies hard, like you say below. My friend has an entrepreneurial mindset like us, and he got a $15,000 contract to refloor an office building. He'll pocket like $6000 of that. More jobs to come. But, he's not happy because he's actually going to do the work with a partner and one laborer. He would be happier to get $2000 and do nothing, which is what he's trying to set up.


These people are the worst for real? I'm not from a big city but one is an hour away which was perfect for me: big city pay, small city rent! But the people there are not like the people from home. At home people value my $1000 car. When they see it they're like, "Boy, you must be saving some money!" and are proud of me. People at work near the big city are like, "I see rust. I think it's time for a new car." I'm like, "Uhh, when I start seeing rust is when I ask you A-holes if you're ready to SELL me that rusty car! lolol




Da truth! A pickup truck is $50k but then you have tax and insurance and registration and financing fees. That shiny new Silverado costs you about $60k, which to me DELAYS RETIREMENT BY 3 YEARS. I spend $20k/yr. Why would I buy that truck? I have an $800 truck and paid $1200 for a guy to weld on exhaust and weld the bed back together that had rusted apart. Then I paint what he welded every single year with bed coating or under-body coating (costs me $10 a year). Then I bought a $100 plastic bed liner, and got a free 5/8" 4x8' piece of plywood that toss in the bed whenever I need to haul something heavy. And yes, I've gotten loads of stone.

So, they pay 3 years of their life for their truck. I spend a couple hours a year maintaining mine and putting a board in to support the weak bed. I retire at 60 they work until 63.

(Obvioulsy I'm shaving off retirement time in other areas too, but, since we were on the topic I had to comment. I worked in automotive and always like talking about cars, especially how people waste money on them!!)

My girlfriend brought her brand new $60,000 white pickup truck to my office last week and parked it next to my blue truck, which I've been fixing up. I now have a total of $7,000 into my truck, which includes a new set of tires. It's looking good and running well. Her truck looked almost just like mine. Go figure!

 

[Deleted85763]

The thread title might sound a bit simplified.

I myself don't care what others earn, and I don't care for expensive things just because they are expensive. I.e I couldn't care less about what type of brand a watch or car is. I'm far from shallow when it comes to people I surround myself with.

But when I think about very, very wealthy people, I wonder if it's possible for them to have a group of friends that are not. People that work in a warehouse, in telemarketing and so on.

When I say rich, I mean the ones that have so much money that they most likely would have to invest in a house that is more secure, and a car that is way above average. At least in my country, in Europe, you wouldn't be able to hide your wealth, because it's possible to see what others earn and it would be a security risk.

I know it's possible to wear sweatpants and still be a millionaire. But at least around here, people would still know that a person has that kind of wealth. He's not just rich, but he's wealthy.

And I think most people would like to buy a very nice house, a cool and fast car and maybe travel a bit more than others, if they had that kind of wealth.

So, my question is - would it actually be possible to socialize with people from the working class, when you are in this position?

You'd still share some interests, still have the same humour - but I would think that the huge difference in wealth and freedom would create a barrier between that wealthy person and the working class people. I imagine they would behave differently and feel differently, in a negative way. Either by being envious, sucking up or trying to exploit the situation in some way.

I just remember when I was around 17-18 (living in a poor area) one of my mates received an ok amount of money from the government. All of the sudden, people that we knew started calling him more and wanting to hang out with him more. It was absurd to see. The way people changed around him was crazy.

I still see the same type of behaviour as an adult, when a celebrity or a very rich person comes around. "Regular people "(I'm a "regular person", but not this kind) loses it. They change completely. Not just for a day or an hour, but for weeks and months. Any time that person is around they change their behaviour and manners.

Again, when I was a teenager I got some fame locally. I could then see how people flipped as well. My closest ones didn't (apart from a few), but people that barely said hello before, all of the sudden wanted to buy me pints, have my number and so on.

So, in general, is it possible for a filthy rich person to have a close social group that consists of working class people? I'm not talking about meeting your old friends once a year at the pub, but having regular meet-up with the lads.

Note: I'm not rich and I have a working class background. So this is not meant to bash on anyone.

I moved to a new city some years ago. I went to a barbershop and when I was waiting and getting my hair cut all the guys were talking with this other guy and they were totally sucking up to him. I thought this was weird. One guy even said "I'll be your butler;". So something was up. Well. the guy gets a phone call and announces his name out loud. I kind of recognized it as a prominent businessman and when I got home did an internet search. Sure enough they guy was worth tens of millions. All the guys in the shop were just full of it. The businessman started out lower class but made it big. I would guess he has old friends were his wealth doesn't matter at all but I'm absolutely sure lots of people "kiss your feet" because he's got a lot money. I'm glad there's others like you and me in the world.

 

[SarahD]

Absolutely possible, but it depends on quite a few things. Usually people of that class do not tend to "be friends" with people of a lower class. But if a person was born poor and later raised to the upper class, he is more likely to have relationships with people of the lower class.

 

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[Oden]

I moved to a new city some years ago. I went to a barbershop and when I was waiting and getting my hair cut all the guys were talking with this other guy and they were totally sucking up to him. I thought this was weird. One guy even said "I'll be your butler;". So something was up. Well. the guy gets a phone call and announces his name out loud. I kind of recognized it as a prominent businessman and when I got home did an internet search. Sure enough they guy was worth tens of millions. All the guys in the shop were just full of it. The businessman started out lower class but made it big. I would guess he has old friends were his wealth doesn't matter at all but I'm absolutely sure lots of people "kiss your feet" because he's got a lot money. I'm glad there's others like you and me in the world.

Ah man, I dislike that so much.

It really annoys me when men change as soon as a rich or famous person, or a woman, is near. It's so fake. I understand that we adapt to our surroundings, but I can't trust people who suck up.

 

[husnatty]

I think it depends, we can't blame them. There is security issues as well of which Rich people are very sensitive to.

 

[WJK]

I think it depends, we can't blame them. There is security issues as well of which Rich people are very sensitive to.

You're right. Humans are all sensitive. It's a "normal" for all of us.

 

[deliux]

Interesting topic. I think main thing here is not amount of money, but mindset. Rich people if they made riches and heritage or won a lottery, they made them because of mindset. They live in completely different world, they understand world differently. The same is for people with less income.

It does not have to be massive gab, let's say in my life there were few periods that I cleared my circle of people that surrounds me. I understood that it was needed to be done for me to be able move forward and now I carefully select people in my circle. That is ain't based money wise but all about mindset. I believe that rich people think the same and I strongly believe that it is must do to be able grow and reach your life goals.

 

[Itizn]

Me vs Entrepreneurs - I can really only be friends with people who want to talk about investing, real estate, cell phone app creation, etc. You know how someone might feel jealous if you saw a guy who was more handsome, more muscular, taller, and richer than you? Well, entrepreneurs don't feel this way. They learn from each other.

Good point here, and great post overall.

 

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[simplymoto]

After what @Kak said.... man...I think you can just close the thread.


I am friends with a guy who took his company public recently.
He's the nicest guy in the world, and even though he has 10000x the wealth I do, we can sit and talk for hours and hours.

But, he also doesn't suffer fools.
If you aren't on point in life, he won't make time for you.
Doesn't mean you need to be rich, but you need to be smart, clever, working on something big, passionate.
You need to have energy to live life, and make cool things happen.

Then it doesn't matter if you're worth $10k or $10M to him, he'll share all his knowledge and information.
But, if you are a complainer, or blamer, or whatever.
He'll smile, but, he'll also move on quickly.

I respect the hell out of this guy, but our mindsets match up. So, it makes sense in a way.

--
I'll add this, when I started my business, I was 22 years old. I didn't know *anything* (still don't, but that's a different thread).
I had customers who were very wealthy, and I slept at work sometimes.... getting paid $0 to $500/month.


And they loved chatting with me.
They loved talking about the hustle and grind, giving me encouragement.

I learned so much from people so much more successful than I was.
I had an open mind, I wasn't jealous, I tried hard to shut up and listen.
And, even to today, it motivates me to keep grinding, keep growing, keep pushing.

Agree with @WestCoast , rich people like to hang out with people with directions, aka "on point in life". It matters less whether those people are rich. For example, a rich 30 yo entrepreneur will enjoy hanging out with other 30 yo that are building stuff in tech even those the latter are not rich.

Also, in countries with the old rich, some old rich are very low key which means they probably drive the same car as us. These are the majority riches.

 

[WJK]

Agree with @WestCoast , rich people like to hang out with people with directions, aka "on point in life". It matters less whether those people are rich. For example, a rich 30 yo entrepreneur will enjoy hanging out with other 30 yo that are building stuff in tech even those the latter are not rich.

Also, in countries with the old rich, some old rich are very low key which means they probably drive the same car as us. These are the majority riches.

A lot of people with money fly under the radar. They don't flash their cash. When they give or help others, it's a totally private matter. To meet them, you'd never know that they are financially independent. They lead very quiet lives without fanfare. They are shielded by blending into the herd of humans surrounding them.

 

[Seamster]

A lot of people with money fly under the radar. They don't flash their cash. When they give or help others, it's a totally private matter. To meet them, you'd never know that they are financially independent. They lead very quiet lives without fanfare. They are shielded by blending into the herd of humans surrounding them.

This is so true. I am not rich but even in my case people have no clue how much money I have saved.

They see my rusty car and think I must be broke. I see their shiny cars and think they must be broke.

Somebody is wrong. Hopefully not me.

 

[WJK]

This is so true. I am not rich but even in my case people have no clue how much money I have saved.

They see my rusty car and think I must be broke. I see their shiny cars and think they must be broke.

Somebody is wrong. Hopefully not me.

Flying under the radar is your greatest advantage. Having people underestimate gives you the space to do all kinds of things. Others cannot tell you that you are wrong or watch your every move while they don't know what you are doing.

Here's a personal example: Many years ago I started doing commercial RE appraising as a side gig for my brokerage business. It was before licensing. I didn't know there were only 7% women in that field. It was controlled by the "good 'ol boys" who thought women couldn’t do the math. By the time they noticed me, I had a good practice going. They were quite critical of me, but I ignored them. And when they licensed, I sat the test and got my license at the same time that they did. I flew under the radar, not making a big stir until I got enough business for those men to notice me.

Money can be treated the same way. When someone says something about your old car, tell them that they might be right. And don't smirk too much. Just quietly work your program. You know that you can't afford to pay for a new car and make your plan work. You'll have the last laugh in the end when you can easily pay cash for anything you want. But, I can tell you this. When you do get there, you'll want different things than you want right now. Think of how much you will grow as a person.

 

[Fordfarmer123]

I’m a lower middle class welder/fabricator with a few failed businesses under my belt now. One of my closest friends owns a big machine shop. He has 40x wealth and IQ I have. We have a lot in common we both love solving problems and learning new things, we go into deep conversations weekly and support and bounce ideas with each other.
Even though the wealth gap we have similar values and interests. My other long term friend (slow-laner) I’m growing farther away and apart from. All’s he wants to talk about is the things he own that have a (payment attached to them) he constantly tells me I need a new car new this new that…. I’m literally bored to death talking with him, and all’s he wants to talk about is money and work.
On the other end of the scale I’m high paid for what I do work my a$$ off everyday of my life in 100 degree weather to 0 degree weather and my other friends and family have become jealous of the small amount of wealth I have . People who have every same bit of a ability to do the same work as me but are to lazy. I feel separated from them. They don’t see the sweat and tears I put into my slow-lane job. Or the tears in my entrepreneurial failures and pursuits. I feel more disconnected to the complainers and people who don’t want to try.
I’m trying to talk less about money and not bring anything up unless asked. I really have never felt so isolated in me life there is much more to a individual then just what’s in his/her bank account. I think what your fundamental views and beliefs are the separation barrier not wealth itself. Most people in different classes have different beliefs on money however so it does become more difficult. Long rant sorry for the grammar….

 

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[maverick]

Lots of narrow-minded views here. You must be great friends.

 

[WJK]

I’m a lower middle class welder/fabricator with a few failed businesses under my belt now. One of my closest friends owns a big machine shop. He has 40x wealth and IQ I have. We have a lot in common we both love solving problems and learning new things, we go into deep conversations weekly and support and bounce ideas with each other.
Even though the wealth gap we have similar values and interests. My other long term friend (slow-laner) I’m growing farther away and apart from. All’s he wants to talk about is the things he own that have a (payment attached to them) he constantly tells me I need a new car new this new that…. I’m literally bored to death talking with him, and all’s he wants to talk about is money and work.
On the other end of the scale I’m high paid for what I do work my a$$ off everyday of my life in 100 degree weather to 0 degree weather and my other friends and family have become jealous of the small amount of wealth I have . People who have every same bit of a ability to do the same work as me but are to lazy. I feel separated from them. They don’t see the sweat and tears I put into my slow-lane job. Or the tears in my entrepreneurial failures and pursuits. I feel more disconnected to the complainers and people who don’t want to try.
I’m trying to talk less about money and not bring anything up unless asked. I really have never felt so isolated in me life there is much more to a individual then just what’s in his/her bank account. I think what your fundamental views and beliefs are the separation barrier not wealth itself. Most people in different classes have different beliefs on money however so it does become more difficult. Long rant sorry for the grammar….

My husband was a welder/fabricator when we met. Now he works for me fixing up my old mobile homes that we rent out. Your job is really hard work, but very creative. Do you have a shop at home or a place to build one? Or, can you find a way for you and your friend with the shop to do something together? There's a lot you can do with your skills to create a business -- especially with your friend's help. He probably got "time" problems to get everything done. How can you help solve his problem?

Here's a thought... what specialized tool can you invent? What tool or process can you tweak? What can the two of you do together with your individual assets and skills? He has the machine shop and you each have your own expertise. Can you marry them into something wonderful? I bet there's a huge opportunity right under your nose.

About your "slowlane" friend. That sounds like my best friend from high school. I cried every time I saw her. It was depressing just to see how she lives. Now she stopped talking to me. I used to try to help her and then one day I stopped. She got totally mad at me and told me off. I didn't argue. I just said no and left it there. Your friend will get mad at you for not agreeing with him if you keep seeing him. You can't live up to his expectations without betraying yourself. It's totally up to you what you do about it.

The reason you feel isolated is that you're growing as a person. You are growing out of your old group and into your new life. Your friend with the machine shop is part of your future. Your other friend is part of your past. This moment of discomfort is part of the process. Many people at the gate stop and go back. They can't take the feelings of grief and abandonment. Be strong since you know it's just part of the journey. I have news for you. The sun will come up tomorrow and shine for you just like it has every day of your life.

 

[Fordfarmer123]

My husband was a welder/fabricator when we met. Now he works for me fixing up my old mobile homes that we rent out. Your job is really hard work, but very creative. Do you have a shop at home or a place to build one? Or, can you find a way for you and your friend with the shop to do something together? There's a lot you can do with your skills to create a business -- especially with your friend's help. He probably got "time" problems to get everything done. How can you help solve his problem?

Here's a thought... what specialized tool can you invent? What tool or process can you tweak? What can the two of you do together with your individual assets and skills? He has the machine shop and you each have your own expertise. Can you marry them into something wonderful? I bet there's a huge opportunity right under your nose.

About your "slowlane" friend. That sounds like my best friend from high school. I cried every time I saw her. It was depressing just to see how she lives. Now she stopped talking to me. I used to try to help her and then one day I stopped. She got totally mad at me and told me off. I didn't argue. I just said no and left it there. Your friend will get mad at you for not agreeing with him if you keep seeing him. You can't live up to his expectations without betraying yourself. It's totally up to you what you do about it.

The reason you feel isolated is that you're growing as a person. You are growing out of your old group and into your new life. Your friend with the machine shop is part of your future. Your other friend is part of your past. This moment of discomfort is part of the process. Many people at the gate stop and go back. They can't take the feelings of grief and abandonment. Be strong since you know it's just part of the journey. I have news for you. The sun will come up tomorrow and shine for you just like it has every day of your life.

Awesome response I love the encouragement, and thank you for taking time of day to inspire me .

I am certain there is gold on this path I’m just not seeing it( yet) for the last year I have dedicated almost all of my time into building a small business in this industry with some success. At this moment I have built another (JOB) my welding business has started to make income but with the current steel prices I’m running into capital problems. I have built up a lot of equipment every job Iv done I purchase more equipment in cash never in debt. I recently got burned by a customer not paying and it really hurt me. I have learned so much however. The 80 hour physical work weeks have pushed me mentally and physically to my own limits. I know I could use my friends space but I would really like to maintain control. My biggest issue I’m running is my new union contract doesn’t allow any side work in the industry I could lose my job if they caught me. I have a baby on the way and I make 80k a year with my day job and I’m the only income for my family.

This industry is scalable but takes huge capital and Human Resources and well as a nich. Although the difficult road has built me up . I tried hiring someone to help for top dollar, I could not find anyone close to skilled enough.
I never realized how difficult finding the right employee can be. There were plenty that could just weld but none that you could give a set a blueprints and they could produce a product from it.
I’m shutting down the business for the moment until I can build more wealth.

I have new business I’m focusing 100 percent effort in now that hopefully I can scale and it’s not a conflict of interest. I’m also using my income at my (job) to fund it. I’m working at spending less money so I can invest more. I think the biggest skill I have taken away from this that I previously didn’t have is dealing with customers being confident in pricing as well as marketing and actually making a (sale) . getting a call and making a sale I have learned are two very different things.

 

[WJK]

Awesome response I love the encouragement, and thank you for taking time of day to inspire me .

I am certain there is gold on this path I’m just not seeing it( yet) for the last year I have dedicated almost all of my time into building a small business in this industry with some success. At this moment I have built another (JOB) my welding business has started to make income but with the current steel prices I’m running into capital problems. I have built up a lot of equipment every job Iv done I purchase more equipment in cash never in debt. I recently got burned by a customer not paying and it really hurt me. I have learned so much however. The 80 hour physical work weeks have pushed me mentally and physically to my own limits. I know I could use my friends space but I would really like to maintain control. My biggest issue I’m running is my new union contract doesn’t allow any side work in the industry I could lose my job if they caught me. I have a baby on the way and I make 80k a year with my day job and I’m the only income for my family.

This industry is scalable but takes huge capital and Human Resources and well as a nich. Although the difficult road has built me up . I tried hiring someone to help for top dollar, I could not find anyone close to skilled enough.
I never realized how difficult finding the right employee can be. There were plenty that could just weld but none that you could give a set a blueprints and they could produce a product from it.
I’m shutting down the business for the moment until I can build more wealth.

I have new business I’m focusing 100 percent effort in now that hopefully I can scale and it’s not a conflict of interest. I’m also using my income at my (job) to fund it. I’m working at spending less money so I can invest more. I think the biggest skill I have taken away from this that I previously didn’t have is dealing with customers being confident in pricing as well as marketing and actually making a (sale) . getting a call and making a sale I have learned are two very different things.

You've done SO well. Everything you have done has taught you something. Good job!

If you can't have a side gig, look around. Figure out what you can invent or tweak. You'll find your answer if you just keep an open mind.

I understand your hiring problems. It's horribly difficult to find the right person. They can't even think about doing stuff that you can do easily. For those kinds of situations, I like independent contractors to do specific jobs. It's a form of outsourcing. And I sure understand your capital problems since I'm in the real estate business. I own a LOT of equipment and tools.

Keep us updated on your progress...

 

[SteveO]

Lots of narrow-minded views here. You must be great friends.

I don't disagree with the statement. But the way you say it is not helpful.

I like my diverse set of friends. Of course I have a strong bond with many from the forum here that I see or talk to just a few times a year. I really enjoy being able to talk freely about business approaches, ideas, strategies, etc. Conversations can really get colorful.

But I have many other friends that share other interests as well. I love to talk about golf, jeeps, trips, and more. In these cases, I could care less what they do for a living as long as they are fun to hang out with.

 

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[WJK]

I don't disagree with the statement. But the way you say it is not helpful.

I like my diverse set of friends. Of course I have a strong bond with many from the forum here that I see or talk to just a few times a year. I really enjoy being able to talk freely about business approaches, ideas, strategies, etc. Conversations can really get colorful.

But I have many other friends that share other interests as well. I love to talk about golf, jeeps, trips, and more. In these cases, I could care less what they do for a living as long as they are fun to hang out with.

I agree. I have different conversations and different relationships with people across a wide spectrum. BUT, I am very careful of my inner circle. They are the people I can call on when everything goes right or wrong.

 

[SteveO]

I agree. I have different conversations and different relationships with people across a wide spectrum. BUT, I am very careful of my inner circle. They are the people I can call on when everything goes right or wrong.

My inner circle is tight as well. But there is at least one person from each group. I spend more time with my jeeping buddies but have close friends from the forum, golf, running partner, and so on. The closeness revolves around interests, trust, likeability, etc...

 

[maverick]

I don't disagree with the statement. But the way you say it is not helpful.

Fair point.

The way people define "success" differs. Never project your own definitions on other people.

A true friend has nothing to do with wealth, upbringing, social status or any other judgement. True friends will help you through tough times, emotional moments and celebrate achievements with you (how minor they might be).

It's like nobody watched Richie Rich.

 

[guyfroml]

Olov,

I find your subject matter and the questions you raise to be something I've dealt with for years - and it's led me to a conclusion I would have never believed when I was a younger man. Now that I'm reaching my senior years, I've come to the conclusion that it is poorer people who do not want to associate with wealthier and more successful people.

I am definitely middle class. I've done okay to survive and pay the bills, but I've never reached success on the level I thought I should have. While at the same time seeing those closest to me, even some very good friends, attain great success and wealth. The strange thing is over the years I feel less and less like doing things with them. It's a shame because they are very decent and good people, but associating with them reminds me of my shortcomings. My wife thinks I'm being silly but as a woman (in a world that does not place as much demand to become successful as with men) she doesn't understand how men compare themselves to others.

And, over the years, as I've brought up this subject in discussion with others, mostly men, who I assess as being on the same level of success as myself, I've been surprised to learn I am not the only middle class or poor person who feels this way. So, I've arrived at the conclusion that wealthy and successful people have no problem hanging out with those below them on the income, wealth and success scale. It's those who see themselves on the lower end of that scale who do not want to associate with those at the top end. To put it simply and harshly, who wants to hang around people where you will constantly remind yourself of what a failure you have been?

For example, some of my wealthy and successful friends will call to invite me to have, as you say, a pint with them - and I know they want to pick up the tab. But, here I am, far poorer then they, and I will be the one who insists on paying the tab. Why? Because it's my one and feeble opportunity to appear like I'm successful. In my mind allowing them to pay is like throwing in the towel and displaying what a failure I am.

Over many years I've come in contact with many wealthy people and I am yet to run into one who has not been kind or generous to me or others around them. I guess, in the end, the answer to your question isn't based on how you see others wealthier and more successful than yourself, but rather how you see yourself.