The Entrepreneur Forum | Financial Freedom | Starting a Business | Motivation | Money | Success
  • SPONSORED: GiganticWebsites.com: We Build Sites with THOUSANDS of Unique and Genuinely Useful Articles

    30% to 50% Fastlane-exclusive discounts on WordPress-powered websites with everything included: WordPress setup, design, keyword research, article creation and article publishing. Click HERE to claim.

Welcome to the only entrepreneur forum dedicated to building life-changing wealth.

Build a Fastlane business. Earn real financial freedom. Join free.

Join over 90,000 entrepreneurs who have rejected the paradigm of mediocrity and said "NO!" to underpaid jobs, ascetic frugality, and suffocating savings rituals— learn how to build a Fastlane business that pays both freedom and lifestyle affluence.

Free registration at the forum removes this block.

Education System FAIL!!!

sswift

New Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
7%
Mar 11, 2010
98
7
Miami
I can't post links (not enough speed yet) but I read an article the other day about the out-dated state of the american school system. In the article, it talked about how the American education system has not been drastically reformed since the industrial age, And how it still focus's on developing "conveyor-belt workers" or people that can be told to do a certain job, and do it well, over a period of long hours. :coco:

Everything from the structure of Homework, to the lesson plans that teachers are being told to follow, all focus on the same style of education that was taught in the 1900's and before! It's crazy! The education system train's you to become a sheep. not a Shepard.

Interesting topic, just wondering what your idea's and opinions are on this. Being a form with ton's of successful people, Im curious to see where you stand on the state of education system in america, or anywhere else for that matter. Did you do good in school? Did you feel it helped you get to where you are now? Do you have kids in school?
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Oracle

New Contributor
Read Fastlane!
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
17%
Aug 25, 2009
23
4
53
Newberg, OR
My high school education was inadaquate to say the least.
Indoctrination trumps all else.
In my MBA program, I am learning financial ratios, accounting, and all that good stuff.
I agree with your statement about sheeple.
 

LondonLife

Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
35%
Jan 8, 2010
88
31
London
Those of us who are succesful need the 'sheep'. The products of this educational system form 99% of the population and are our employees, our doctors, the people who serve us our coffee and keep our streets safe. They are honourable people, and without them we wouldn't be successful.

Then there is the few who see beyond this system and excel beyond what they have been taught and become the shepards regardless of the system of education in place.

If we were all shepards, it would be chaos.
 

GlobalWealth

Legendary Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
225%
Sep 6, 2009
2,582
5,818
Latvia
I can't post links (not enough speed yet) but I read an article the other day about the out-dated state of the american school system. In the article, it talked about how the American education system has not been drastically reformed since the industrial age, And how it still focus's on developing "conveyor-belt workers" or people that can be told to do a certain job, and do it well, over a period of long hours. :coco:

Everything from the structure of Homework, to the lesson plans that teachers are being told to follow, all focus on the same style of education that was taught in the 1900's and before! It's crazy! The education system train's you to become a sheep. not a Shepard.

Interesting topic, just wondering what your idea's and opinions are on this. Being a form with ton's of successful people, Im curious to see where you stand on the state of education system in america, or anywhere else for that matter. Did you do good in school? Did you feel it helped you get to where you are now? Do you have kids in school?

we need to be cautious here (I am really just talking to myself). This can easily escalate into a political discussion. with that said...

I would like to see the government completely step out of the education business. The average cost to keep a child in public school is about $9000/year. The average cost for private grade school in the US is just over $3000/year. (feel free to google these stats, I am too lazy to find them again). Of course we all contribute to this public tuition through our tax dollars whether we have kids or not for our entire lives. I would prefer to pay a much lower direct tuition for the years my kids are in school to a institution of my choice.

from an economic perspective, the presumption is that we wouldn't put our kids in school if we had to pay for it and allow our kids to grow up without any education, thereby destroying the social fabric of the nation. I personally think this is absurd as the human species has somehow managed to survive and thrive for thousands of years without the necessity of state provided education. but this is political propaganda to make us believe that we really need the government to educate us.

Again, IMO, I believe if the private sector took over education, we would see a much higher quality of education due to the efficiencies entrepreneurs always create. public officials aren't really concerned about creating efficiencies, but only concerned with spending their annual budgets to that they get them again next year. of course you can always send your kids to private school now, but you will only be paying double for your kids' tuition due to the direct tuition and your tax burden. this is a government influenced intervention that prevents the free market to operate properly.

in addition, the public schools could be auctioned off to local entrepreneurs and the kids could continue to go to the same schools. this would generate revenue from selling the real estate and ongoing property taxes as the private sector would now own the RE. this could be a huge boost in govt revenues and would be hugely benefiical to the public as long as the tax rate was reduced to take out the public school education from the budgets.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

GlobalWealth

Legendary Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
225%
Sep 6, 2009
2,582
5,818
Latvia
Those of us who are succesful need the 'sheep'. The products of this educational system form 99% of the population and are our employees, our doctors, the people who serve us our coffee and keep our streets safe. They are honourable people, and without them we wouldn't be successful.

Then there is the few who see beyond this system and excel beyond what they have been taught and become the shepards regardless of the system of education in place.

If we were all shepards, it would be chaos.

I tend to disagree here. I believe the intelligence and productivity breed more intelligence and more productivity. human nature will always be present that makes some people more ambitious than others, and we will always have the sheep regardless of education. but maybe we will just have smarter sheep.
 

sswift

New Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
7%
Mar 11, 2010
98
7
Miami
globalwealth, I couldn't agree with you more!

And it's not just the fact that schools breed robots, its also the fact that there is the internet now. I can realistically learn absolutely anything I want, at any time, practically for free.

Schools should focus on increasing the motivation to learn. Instead of drilling BS into the heads of our young.

I'll never forget, I was in 11th grade marine biology, and the teacher actually assigned us a "coloring" project. I found it to be very insulting, so I did the assignment 2 min. before it was due, and Got an F because my colors were not "in the lines". :wtf: ***Note*** This was the same teacher who once lectured her class about her own belief on Evolution. She said that all human babies have evolved to have 12 fingers (6 on each hand) and that all doctors cut off the 2nd pinkey finger before the mother notices, so that the parents don't freak out. And she was dead serious.:smx6:

Regardless, I'm not about to let one or 2 bad apples spoil the bunch. This does make one wonder...

What the hell is going on!

I had a great American History teacher that year. I would discuss world issues with him after class during lunch. He told me he never followed a lesson plan, and it was in his class that I can honestly say I got the most out of, intellectually speaking. He actually let his class's watch the documentary "loose change" about a 9/11 conspiracy, and made us (his students) all promise not to tell anyone where we originally saw the movie because he could get fired. He said he felt he needed to show the video, we as humans have the right to choose our belief's, and that when our own children go to school, they will not be given the opportunity to choose. History books will be printed with chapters on this era, and terrorists will be force feed to our children.

We need more of this type of learning, and less color in the lines or fail!

Y'all ever have an amazing teacher or mentor that helped you become who you are today? You ever have an completely awful teacher, who you swore was clinically mentally inadequate?:thumbsup:
 

Runum

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
101%
Aug 8, 2007
6,222
6,309
DFW, Texas
American public school teacher here(by choice). Generalizations are correct and incorrect. The public school system must be doing some things right, most of us can read and perform basic math. Most of us have some sense of reasoning and a sense of history.

I think one has to really be careful of listening to the populist, news message. Political sound bites come off great, the delivery usually stinks. Who among us is not for a better education system? Sounds good on the face, what does it look like in reality. Most of us would not want to pay the money it would take to individually educate each kid in his/her own way.

The education system was designed to provide for a basic, general education for all citizens. It has grown to include extra curricular activities, specialized needs education, gifted/ talented education, etc.

I contend that the education system is fine on the whole. There are things that need to be tweaked. I'm all for getting rid of standardized testing. I also contend that you can get out of the education system what you want to. I have never held a student back that wanted to learn more. How many have expressed an interest in learning more? Less than 1%.

Also, I have seen private, for profit schools that are prosperous and I have seen some that are major failures. Who suffers when the for profit schools fail? The kids.

IMHO, I don't think there is a one size fits all answer here.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

sswift

New Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
7%
Mar 11, 2010
98
7
Miami
runum, very interesting POV.

I have never held a student back that wanted to learn more. How many have expressed an interest in learning more? Less than 1%.

My question is. How can we turn that 1% into 10%. And then into 50%?

You being apart of the system directly, is there a way to increase the amount of interest a child has in learning, not in any particular field, just in general.

I still dont know if the internet, or Google, has increased or decreased that number. I know I learn a lot more everyday by having google at my fingertip whenever my brain says "I wonder" but I also find myself being distracted much easier.

Like MJ would say ... I smell a biz-op somewhere around here! :banana:
 

kurtyordy

Bronze Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
12%
Aug 28, 2007
2,365
282
46
PA
funny, I just came across this video today. Three years old, but still relevant I believe.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx4pN-aiofw&NR=1]YouTube - Stupid in America[/ame]
 

Rem

Silver Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
81%
Sep 14, 2009
1,216
984
48
Maine
Human nature is human nature is right. Why is it hundreds of thousands of people can flock to Darren Rowse's blog and he can publish free endless advice on how to make 6 figures online, yet only STILL a small percentage do?

Teaching our kids to be shepherds doesn't make them shepherds. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.

With that said... I believe providing the most accurate and relevant education possible and let the chips fall where they may.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

andviv

Gold Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
40%
Jul 27, 2007
5,361
2,143
Washington DC
We have discussed this same topic in the past as it is very important.

At least a couple of people have thought of creating a private school to offer a curriculum that fits our beliefs and be more independent from the other system.

Do a search for Education System and see what comes up...

examples:

http://www.thefastlanetomillions.co...5044-kiyosaki-we-need-two-school-systems.html
http://www.thefastlanetomillions.com/off-topic-discussion/6687-questions-about-homeschooling.html
http://www.thefastlanetomillions.com/off-topic-discussion/4782-why-isnt-money-taught-schools.html
 
Last edited:

andviv

Gold Contributor
Read Fastlane!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
40%
Jul 27, 2007
5,361
2,143
Washington DC
The average cost to keep a child in public school is about $9000/year. The average cost for private grade school in the US is just over $3000/year. (feel free to google these stats, I am too lazy to find them again).
I hope this is NOT the source of your information...
What Would A School Voucher Buy The Real Cost Of Private Schools
Cause it is from 1996 and I am willing to bet the numbers have changed. A lot.

In my area, even a decent kindergarten is around $1,000 a month, so that makes it $10K a year for tuition.

Edit:
Another study, same organization, from 2003
http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=3231
 
Last edited:

EastWind

Bronze Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
34%
Oct 31, 2009
685
231
USA
People always find something wrong in everything. Nothing is perfect. US schools may not be perfect, but they are decent. Think not? Why don't you go to school in another country and experience what it is like to have no clubs or have teachers go on strike for months straight.
 

sswift

New Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
7%
Mar 11, 2010
98
7
Miami
whoa now. of course, you can not expecting anything to be perfect.

Although, I am not going to be the person who say's

"ehh, it's not that bad, let's just keep it at that."

Strive to make things better! Evolution & Adaptation is in our DNA.
 

Runum

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
101%
Aug 8, 2007
6,222
6,309
DFW, Texas
runum, very interesting POV.



My question is. How can we turn that 1% into 10%. And then into 50%?

You being apart of the system directly, is there a way to increase the amount of interest a child has in learning, not in any particular field, just in general.

I still dont know if the internet, or Google, has increased or decreased that number. I know I learn a lot more everyday by having google at my fingertip whenever my brain says "I wonder" but I also find myself being distracted much easier.

Like MJ would say ... I smell a biz-op somewhere around here! :banana:

That is the golden question. I wish I knew the answer. Let me share some of my challenges and it may shed some light on our dilemma.

In a typical day I see 70 kids at the school I am at now. 70% of them are on subsidized lunch programs. I get 90 minutes to motivate them to learn science. I pride myself on being edgy and goofy enough that my students bang my door down to get into my class. Now, add to that a certain percent have come to me that are present physically but not there mentally. Some have just had a major fight with mom or dad. Some have just seen mom and dad beat the crap out of each other. Most have not seen dad for an extended period of time. Some have just seen a relative or friend take drugs or drink alcohol to excess. Some have not eaten, even when free food is furnished. Some have just bought a new video game or cell phone and that is all they are thinking about. Some have had a fight with their best friend or their girlfriend/boyfriend dumped them. Some are so hung up on the latest thing that Mylie Cyrus did that they can't bring themselves to think of anything else. Some of the kids have physical, cognitive, emotional, or social challenges.

So while I am trying to present a challenging, engaging lesson to 70 kids, I am also constantly monitoring, adjusting, and managing all these other distractions.

If I could just have their brains engaged on what they need to be focused on, the whole minimum state required lessons would take far less time. Then we could go on, as a group to even higher level stuff. It would rock theirs and my world.

Overall the kids are conditioned, before public school, for immediate, material gratification. Most will not focus unless they can see what's in it for them, NOW.

I don't want it to sound like my experience has been all bad. I started 2 after school clubs this year. I have a chess club that was up to about 30 kids. It has settled at about 20 now. Most of these are guys that aren't well adjusted socially(nerds). They are so cool to talk to. I learn a lot from them and I work to teach them about winning and losing with grace. My latest club is a science club. There are 100 11 year olds signed up. Due to required tutoring there are about 50 that show up. I have another teacher that works with me. We are running this as a discovery/challenge club. It's awesome giving them a challenge and watching them work together to find solutions. Some of the kids have a real hard time adjusting to not having a set "right" answer. We are building toothpick bridges right now. They should be finished in a month, then we can stress test them.

As far as opportunity, jump on in, the water's fine. Learn what the requirements are and open your own private school . Maybe you will have the breakthrough success that we are all looking for. I have no problem learning from others.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.
Last edited:

sswift

New Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
7%
Mar 11, 2010
98
7
Miami
I'm talking about getting into the ADD pill business.....j/k

I am forever grateful for teachers like you. Keep up the amazing work!
 

Red

Nigerian Lottery Prince
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Fastlane!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
353%
Feb 23, 2010
1,135
4,009
Phoenix
In a typical day I see 70 kids at the school I am at now. 70% of them are on subsidized lunch programs. I get 90 minutes to motivate them to learn science. I pride myself on being edgy and goofy enough that my students bang my door down to get into my class. Now, add to that a certain percent have come to me that are present physically but not there mentally. Some have just had a major fight with mom or dad. Some have just seen mom and dad beat the crap out of each other. Most have not seen dad for an extended period of time. Some have just seen a relative or friend take drugs or drink alcohol to excess. Some have not eaten, even when free food is furnished. Some have just bought a new video game or cell phone and that is all they are thinking about. Some have had a fight with their best friend or their girlfriend/boyfriend dumped them. Some are so hung up on the latest thing that Mylie Cyrus did that they can't bring themselves to think of anything else. Some of the kids have physical, cognitive, emotional, or social challenges......

Runum- I just wanted to say that you have my whole-hearted respect. I knew I liked ya from the start with your balanced and practical presentation on your take of the current financial state of this country at B&P!

It makes me smile to know that you're out there impacting kids in a positive way because you CARE. My hat is eternally off to you and to others like you who invest time, energy, money and heart into kids that need it the most, you have my unending respect.


:tiphat:

Danielle



I just wanted to interject that in there... :)


:eek:fftopic:
 

Runum

Legendary Contributor
EPIC CONTRIBUTOR
Read Fastlane!
Read Unscripted!
Summit Attendee
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
101%
Aug 8, 2007
6,222
6,309
DFW, Texas
Thanks Danielle and sswift. I have found that working with kids, especially underprivileged kids, is what makes me get up every morning with a smile on my face. There are tough days but the good days outnumber the bad.

I don't want to be a thread killer here. The question was asked about how to get the kids motivated. I think that may need to be explored more, perhaps on a personal level. How many of us, when we were kids, asked to go faster or learn more? i know I didn't. I learned the system and gave what was asked of me. My kid, who is number one in her class, does it. She learned, what are the minimum requirements I have to do to get the A that I want? I don't want to do anything extra, I don't want to learn anything extra.

How many of us did the same thing? As adults we do it in things that we are not interested in but we have to do. Examples: defensive driving, professional development, college courses. We all learn the minimum that we need to get by. However, the difference is we are adults now, we can make that choice and suffer the consequences of our lack of motivation. Kids, though, do not have the background to make that determination. Some call for kids to be the sole person to set their own learning pace. We all know that there are kids that will never learn anything productive if we leave it to them.

So, if Johnny graduates and can't read, who failed? I do know many of his teachers failed. However, they probably tried and Johnny wasn't the most agreeable student. The teachers surely had 60-100 other students to work with that cared enough to try. Did his parents fail? Sure, his dad left, his mom worked 2 jobs and was preoccupied with the soaps and cigs to care. Did Johnny fail himself? Sure, he failed himself in first grade when he didn't care enough to try. After that year it was all downhill as he grew bigger and more agressive. Who failed and who is responsible? Who is to blame?

These are all rhetorical questions because I really don't have the answers. I do know kids now that refuse to do the math work asked of them. Their parents apologize for their kids behavior and make all kinds of promises that they will do better. The new improved kids behavior lasts maybe one week and then we are back to the usual behavior. Then the parents get mad at us for not letting them know that their kid isn't doing their work. The parents can check their kids grades online but still don't.

I have had some heated discussions with educated parents. I fully believe that your kids education is your responsibilty. You are welcome to partner with me, as a teacher, to make that happen but I cannot MAKE your kid learn anything. I do not beleive it is my job to MAKE your kid behave or learn. I do what I can within my limits to make kids want to learn but I can't reach them all. It is a shame.

Anyone else have any answers? RCardin, where are you?
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

LondonLife

Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
35%
Jan 8, 2010
88
31
London
I had a great American History teacher that year. I would discuss world issues with him after class during lunch. He told me he never followed a lesson plan, and it was in his class that I can honestly say I got the most out of, intellectually speaking. He actually let his class's watch the documentary "loose change" about a 9/11 conspiracy, and made us (his students) all promise not to tell anyone where we originally saw the movie because he could get fired. He said he felt he needed to show the video, we as humans have the right to choose our belief's, and that when our own children go to school, they will not be given the opportunity to choose.

sswift... I would have to say that this teacher was more damaging than good. Having your own beliefs is fine, but showing a "documentry" (i.e a factual piece) based on pure speculation than actual hard facts is not what children should be taught. This guy does not deserve his job. He is furthering his own agenda through the malleable minds of children and that is scarey.
 

PaulRobert

Gold Contributor
FASTLANE INSIDER
Read Fastlane!
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
146%
May 15, 2009
1,024
1,500
31
New Jersey
People always find something wrong in everything. Nothing is perfect. US schools may not be perfect, but they are decent. Think not? Why don't you go to school in another country and experience what it is like to have no clubs or have teachers go on strike for months straight.

Could you name the country please? From my travels and experiences, schools in Eastern Europe tend to be more advanced in their subjects than American public schools. In Eastern Europe, if you are a senior in high school you are probably taking advanced calculus. Learning a different language is also mandatory.

I have a few friends that lived in South Korea and went to elementary school and 2 years of high school. I asked them what they were learning in elementary school and high school. In elementary school they were learning algebra and by the time they entered high school they were going straight into Pre-Calculus as freshmen.
 

LondonLife

Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
35%
Jan 8, 2010
88
31
London
I have had some heated discussions with educated parents. I fully believe that your kids education is your responsibilty. You are welcome to partner with me, as a teacher, to make that happen but I cannot MAKE your kid learn anything. I do not beleive it is my job to MAKE your kid behave or learn. I do what I can within my limits to make kids want to learn but I can't reach them all. It is a shame.

I agree wholeheartedly with this. Despite my initial comments in this thread being a bit dismissive I come from a family of teachers. My mother is a teacher, my aunts and uncles are teachers. All within the English school system (My knowledge of American schooling is limited, having never studied at one, or even visited one... so this entire post is from my perspective of the English system).

Every single one of my family give it there best to further the kids under their care. Every single one of them will further a child if the child comes to them, or asks questions. Classes are in the region of 25-30 in size, so each child gets as much attention as they require. The problem is that kids don't see the big picture. They don't see what learning will give them. It's just something they have to do. The eduction system in the UK is set up to provide everyone with good literacy and maths skills as these are the things every person requires. Everything else you are taught, sciences, history, economics, computer studies, geography etc is studied to give you a more rounded education and give you a step up to further education. High school is the first step in a persons education. Once the initial study of all these things is over with every single child in the UK gets to choose what they wants to learn. Everything else after that level is of their choosing.

I imagine the American school system is similar to this. It's not a terrible system by any stretch of the imagination. The weak link in this chain is the brain of a child. Children who do what they have to do, and nothing else. Its human nature at the most basic level. It's easy for kids to moan about school not being fun and not teaching them relevant things, yet I'm yet to see a child come up with a good alternative.

I hear examples of this all the time such as "Argh, why are we learning mathematical integration, I will never need this. Its useless." So what, we should stop teaching it? Of course not! What about the kids who want to be electrical engineers, or rocket scientists, or physicists? Its useful to them! And yes you may say, well why don't the teachers tell em this? It's because they don't know, teachers are teachers, not rocket scientists, and engineers and every single other profession under the sun. It's impractical for them to be able to give relevant examples.

I'm not saying improvements can't be made. But I personally see improvements every year in schools. It's never going to happen overnight though. At the end of the day, schools are just schools, they teach you the basics of things which allow you to start making your own decisions.

If people have a better way of doing it, then go ahead. I am listening.
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

rcardin

Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
10%
Oct 30, 2007
501
48
Arlington, TX
Anyone else have any answers? RCardin, where are you?

I have been recouping on the coast for the last week. Gotta get recharged for the rest of the school year.

There are some good questions that need to be asked. Unfortunatley most of the questions come from people who have never been in the classroom as a teacher. If you want to know why the American school sytem is the way it is go volunteer at your childs school or any school for that matter. Hang out with your kid for a day and you will see what is wrong first hand.

#1 problem I have with the district I teach at is for some stupid reason our philosophy is "Every child is college bound" This is utter Bullshit. Some won't be able to afford college, some just flat out don't have the smarts for a college education, and some just don't care. Teaching Middle School, you can see which ones are going to be riding the back of the garbage truck because that is all they will ever be able to handle intellectually. We have gotten away form the trades in public education. Short of Ag classes and auto shop there really aren't any classes geared towards a trade.

My personal opinion is that they need to start to weed out the kids that aren't college material and offer an alternative. I tell my kids every year you don't have to go to college to make it in life. Go be a mechanic, but be the best BMW automatic transmission mechanic you can be. Specialize.

#2 problem I see: there is no longer any discipline left in the schools. If I write a child a discipline referral the first thing out of administrations mouth is "Did you call the parent?". IF I wrote the child up we were way past calling a parent.

#3 problem I see: When I go throught the lunch line I see kids on free or reduced price meal plan with 150.00 Jordans on. Some of these same kids have I-phones. Hell I don't even have a texting plan! Take away the welfare. If kids are brought up to expect these things how are they ever going to make it in society?

You grow up based on your environment. If you are brought up in the system you learn how to work it.

Being in Texas we have a bunch of fresh over the border children and parents. My friend who is the Spanish teacher has had many conversations with me about the immigrant mentality. Most don't value education but value hard work. They earn an honest living but work long hours to do it. We came to the conclusion that it takes at least 3 generations over the border for education to be valued. This does not hold true in all cases but most.

The end product is a combination of teachers, students, and parents. Without all three on board the best you can expect out of the kid is 66%. It takes 70% to pass so who is failing who?

Is American education failing the child or is the child failing the education system. Our system is built to produce non-thinkers. We don't encourage out of the box thinking. Even in upper education we want you to learn it one way. I had an American Lit teacher tell us "this is what Mark Twain meant in this passage". I was the one who asked if she had talked to him about the subject.

Are there solutions? Yes and no. The education system is so political you can't change it easily.
 

theBiz

Silver Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
46%
Jul 9, 2009
1,162
535
NY
school is WRONG if you want to be an entrepreneur. i went to hs/college i would not take it back.

It taught me to seek success, see potential businesses, and work hard.

as far as money goes i have learned, which is stressed hard in "rich dad, poor dad"

just have one particular skill, do it very well, and you will be "successful"
 

Fennec

New Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
3%
Oct 16, 2010
29
1
My first reaction is to immediately agree that the current educational system was totally useless for me, but in a way, it probably did help me develop some qualities that I otherwise wouldn't have. Qualities that make it possible for me to put my ideas and vision to practical use.

I'm naturally the enthusiastic, "big idea", initiative-taking sort, but organization, detail-orientedness and sticktoit industriousness don't really come naturally to me. So I've had to develop it in school, and that's the attitude I've tried to hold. That I shouldn't take the education system as a crafting of the "ideal" person, but a place to pick up and strengthen my weaknesses.

Then again, I'm in college right now majoring in Accounting. Which I hate. That DEFINITELY requires supreme "sheep" skills (not to insult the profession, just sayin'), but I'm not learning something that I want or plan to use after all. I hastily majored in it because I wanted a "practical" major. I'm minoring in Economics though, and I absolutely love the subject. So in college, it's really dependent on WHAT you choose to study.

So yeah, nothing's perfect, but nothing's completely bad either.
 

Rickson9

Gold Contributor
Speedway Pass
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
101%
Sep 4, 2010
1,682
1,699
Canada
I'm curious to see where you stand on the state of education system in America, or anywhere else for that matter. Did you do good in school? Did you feel it helped you get to where you are now? Do you have kids in school?

From my perspective and only speaking for myself I went through the public school system in Canada and found it useful. I did well in school and I do feel that it helped me get to where I am today.

Speaking more re: school's contribution. Everybody has something or someone that created the 'spark' that changed an individual's direction. This inspiration could have come from school or outside of it. I'm not sure that we can predict how this happens, but if school helped a person achieve their dreams then I'm all for it. The bottom line is that I don't think anybody knows where inspiration will come from so the best thing is to be open minded to learn from a variety of sources.

Further I don't believe that the purpose of school is to train individuals to be sheep. Individuals decide whether they will use the information taught in schools to become sheep or not. To blame traditional schooling is to take away individual responsibility. That's only my opinion of course.

The education system can always be improved, but I don't think it is a simple matter. I don't think that being an entrepreneur can be taught. I say this because I don't believe that passion can be taught. Again, my opinion only.

For me, accounting was the most important course in school. I don't believe that lasting success can be achieved without the ability to read and interpret financial statements.

Best regards!
 
Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

Fennec

New Contributor
User Power
Value/Post Ratio
3%
Oct 16, 2010
29
1
From my perspective and only speaking for myself I went through the public school system in Canada and found it useful. I did well in school and I do feel that it helped me get to where I am today.

Speaking more re: school's contribution. Everybody has something or someone that created the 'spark' that changed an individual's direction. This inspiration could have come from school or outside of it. I'm not sure that we can predict how this happens, but if school helped a person achieve their dreams then I'm all for it. The bottom line is that I don't think anybody knows where inspiration will come from so the best thing is to be open minded to learn from a variety of sources.

Further I don't believe that the purpose of school is to train individuals to be sheep. Individuals decide whether they will use the information taught in schools to become sheep or not. To blame traditional schooling is to take away individual responsibility. That's only my opinion of course.

The education system can always be improved, but I don't think it is a simple matter. I don't think that being an entrepreneur can be taught. I say this because I don't believe that passion can be taught. Again, my opinion only.

For me, accounting was the most important course in school. I don't believe that lasting success can be achieved without the ability to read and interpret financial statements.

Best regards!

I think everyone SHOULD take AN accounting course, for the life/financial skills. Majoring in the subject in university is a whole different can of nasty worms.

Unless the person is inclined to be HIGHLY methodical, organized, detail-oriented and OK with following precise rules and regulations as they are. I wish I was like that, but I'm not. So it's my own fault. haha
 

Post New Topic

Please SEARCH before posting.
Please select the BEST category.

Post new topic

Guest post submissions offered HERE.

Latest Posts

New Topics

Fastlane Insiders

View the forum AD FREE.
Private, unindexed content
Detailed process/execution threads
Ideas needing execution, more!

Join Fastlane Insiders.

Top