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HOT TOPIC Are The Sharks Going Broke?

eliquid

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Kevin O'Leary is doing exactly this in my town here in Kentucky.

Saw the others too come here. All of the Shark Tank gang is making their rounds.
 

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RazorCut

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They aren't doing it because they are broke, but because it's the easiest way to capitalize on their fame.
Yes. I don't think Gary Vee is broke. I'm getting this in my feed at the moment. Pay £59 for the event, an extra £360 to get into a Q&A with Grant Cardone and/or an extra £2460 if you want to do that with Gary Vee (and get a photo with him):

27831
 

lowtek

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I went to one of these in Albuquerque back in 2015, right after I got laid off. My wife saw the ad on Facebook, and not knowing any better, signed me up.

It's precisely as described in the contrapreneur video.

Back then, it was for a real estate system taught by Tarek and Christina of flip or flop fame (yeah, the guy that would later get arrested for chasing his wife down the street with a gun). Of course, they weren't in attendance... but they had a cardboard cutout, I shit you not.

Un friggin real.

Naturally, I googled for some reviews as the plants were getting up to purchase the seminar, and then got the hell out of there.

On my way out, they made sure to tell me that the next speaker was giving away a free mp3 player. What is this? 2005?

Unswayed, I got the heck out of dodge. I regret not letting other people in on the scam, but I figure they wouldn't have believed me anyway.

I'm disappointed, though not really surprised, that Grant Cardone uses such tactics. I think we got the live stream from the first 10x growth con, and from what I remember it was actually mostly content instead of a sales pitch. I wonder if it changed in later years.
 

jon.M

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Funny thing, I went to a talk by Nassim Taleb this Monday. I had this thought in the back of my head the entire time I traveled there, "is it going to turn out a scam and upsell fest?". I mean, he was in finance and I've seen enough gurus in my day to have become a bit cynical.

Luckily enough, the only type of upselling was his publishing company asking the attendees if they'd be interested in eventually buying the Incerto Deluxe edition.
 

Champion

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If only many people could find this thread before investing into any of these programs...
 
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pkom79

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I wonder how Daymond and Robert would react if someone pitched them this business model in the Shark Tank.

Free event to get as many suckers in one room as possible by using some recognizable names, and pitch the hell out of them until they have nothing left on their credit cards! ROI guaranteed!

Providing value: optional
 

Beijing

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I wonder how Daymond and Robert would react if someone pitched them this business model in the Shark Tank.

Free event to get as many suckers in one room as possible by using some recognizable names, and pitch the hell out of them until they have nothing left on their credit cards! ROI guaranteed!

Providing value: optional
Robert would probably do what he usually does. Get emotional and virtue signal about how unethical this business model would be for the target consumer.

Then he'd get on his private jet and fly 20km to give a 10 minute keynote speech in a large conference room with "no negativity" signs on the door and two dozen audience plants ready to storm the product table when told that only 20 products are available for sale, due to overwhelming demand for the web-based course.
 

Brrr

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Seems like everyone has said what needed to be said. But here is another even more relevant video by the same Mark Winnet of contrepreneur fame on the actual event coming up in the UK.


I do think these events are going to fall in popularity soon as the formula gets "exposed".

I'll be honest, I'm 100% their target audience. Young, male, starting up in business and trying to learn and grow. I've had all the target adverts and for 60 quid and my time I thought I'd likely get some value and there might be some other interesting speakers too. If it weren't for my time on the forum and the videos from Mike I likely would have taken a punt, but now I am very happy to give it a miss.

I think we are going to see less of this, as these events start to lose credibility because they are just a long sequence of pitches, I think the gurus and social media entrepreneurs like Gary or Grant are going to see that their brand actually starts to get damaged. Events are either going to have to step up the value proposition (how can they for £50 without the sales funnel) or just book second rate appearances (who would turn up?).

Do you think people are waking up to this?
 

Grinder20

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A couple of months ago I saw this billboard advertising and event hosted by Daymond John at a local strip club (this is the image from the local newspaper).

It eventually got canceled but nonetheless it looks pretty desperate for "The People's Shark" to even consider appearances at venues like this.

Last year, I saw ads for a free wealth building summit hosted by Daymond.

I signed up to attend (as it was literally across the street from where I live), but never went after I found out it was a one big pitch fest for some get rich in real estate program for a few thousand $ + some more upsells farther down the road. I actually know someone who paid $2k for the first offer and said the event they paid for was a total waste of time.

Here is the ad similar to the one I saw. He's been doing it all across the country.
Now Robert Hejavec is doing the same thing. Read more on Reddit
Is there really so much money in these events? Aren't these guys worth hundreds of millions of dollars? Are their Shark Tank investments not doing so well and they need some quick cash.

It seems so sketchy! They're preying on struggling entrepreneurs and scam them out of their money without providing any value.
@pkom79, to be either that greedy and/or that desperate...why don't they just sell that Lambo and/or helicopter? Time is obviously running out. Sad. Notice you don't see Mark or Barbara.
 

SamuraiRod

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Seems like everyone has said what needed to be said. But here is another even more relevant video by the same Mark Winnet of contrepreneur fame on the actual event coming up in the UK.


I do think these events are going to fall in popularity soon as the formula gets "exposed".

I'll be honest, I'm 100% their target audience. Young, male, starting up in business and trying to learn and grow. I've had all the target adverts and for 60 quid and my time I thought I'd likely get some value and there might be some other interesting speakers too. If it weren't for my time on the forum and the videos from Mike I likely would have taken a punt, but now I am very happy to give it a miss.

I think we are going to see less of this, as these events start to lose credibility because they are just a long sequence of pitches, I think the gurus and social media entrepreneurs like Gary or Grant are going to see that their brand actually starts to get damaged. Events are either going to have to step up the value proposition (how can they for £50 without the sales funnel) or just book second rate appearances (who would turn up?).

Do you think people are waking up to this?

Unfortunately, I disagree with this. The current nature of the scam will fall in popularity, but the scam itself will live on. As long as humans continue to be humans (greedy, lazy, unmotivated), then someone will find a way to reach their hands into their pockets.

I'm in the same boat as you, young 21 y/o male that actively reads & watches content on business. I've began to study scams like these though because there is a process to all of it which teaches you a lot about human nature.
 

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ProcessPro

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They're leveraging their personal brand and fame by plucking low hanging fruit. I'm sure they see it as "money left on the table".

A) Hire sleezy seminar firm who will charge $10K for an event.
B) Promote "FREE" seminar, promoting $10K seminar (Boom, instant $1,000,000 (100 attendees))
C) Show up for 20 minutes to grease the sale after attendees heard a 2 hour pitch.
D) Sleezy seminar firm pays the shark a royalty to simply put their stamp on their BS "training".
E) Rinse, Repeat in 50 cities. Boom, instant $50,000,000.

Not a bad return on their time, which is why they do it.

Unfortunately this type of operation is a racket, and it's why got Kiyosaki in trouble.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dv6feHB0AE4
I would have never figured this out on my own. You're so smart.
 

MJ DeMarco

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I feel sorry for anyone who would pay $X,000 for a picture with your favorite guru. And if someone is allowing that to happen, they're taking advantage of you. To be honest, I don't know how they do it with a straight face. SMH.
 

Mr992

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I actually started getting ads on Instagram about the Gary V and Cardone seminar coming up in the UK. They advertise it for like £69. But that actually gets you the shittiest seat and no photos. It's probably useful for networking though.

Gary Vee or other Sharks will probably just tell you that it's worth it simply because you get to hang out with other like-minded people and get to do some networking.

I'm surprised Gary lets others use his name just so they can sell £2,500 tickets for a VIP seat and a photo with him.. but I guess that's just supply and demand. If people are willing to pay for it, why not? At least he doesn't outright organize premium events for 5k to pitch his Diamond Premium 50k course.

If you have 2,5k laying around, invest it in your business. Don't go to a 2.5k pitch seminar.
 

ecommercewolf

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Gary Vee isn't a saint in all of this though, He is a headline speaker for thousands of events just like these...

He allows these conferences to use his brand, to pull his fans to these events. These people attend 15 hours of Scamming Gurus just for 30 minutes of Gary Vee.

While he isn't selling the same crap as them. He is supporting their 'businesses' every time he headlines a ticket.
Yup exactly. I love Gary Vee but let's not act like he's not doing the same thing here, but in a less sleazy way and the difference is I'm sure Gary Vee can deliver on value unlike some of these other characters selling their $3997 course.


He's been pushing this lately. $12k for a full day of consulting and you probably interact with him for 1 hour of the whole day.
 

WJK

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They're leveraging their personal brand and fame by plucking low hanging fruit. I'm sure they see it as "money left on the table".

A) Hire sleezy seminar firm who will charge $10K for an event.
B) Promote "FREE" seminar, promoting $10K seminar (Boom, instant $1,000,000 (100 attendees))
C) Show up for 20 minutes to grease the sale after attendees heard a 2 hour pitch.
D) Sleezy seminar firm pays the shark a royalty to simply put their stamp on their BS "training".
E) Rinse, Repeat in 50 cities. Boom, instant $50,000,000.

Not a bad return on their time, which is why they do it.

Unfortunately this type of operation is a racket, and it's why got Kiyosaki in trouble.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dv6feHB0AE4
There is no magic plan nor secrets to be revealed at these sales-pitch-classes. They are a hoax to steal your money. The information is readily available. How-to books and on-line courses are cheap and sometimes free. Taking a local person to lunch -- who is doing what you want to do -- is also a cheap lesson. Offering your services for free to learn a business is an honorable route. You can learn a lot just hanging out and lending a hand. Attending a local investment club is another cheap way to glean information. You'll have a whole group to query. Joining an online forum is many times free, except for the value of your time to sit in front of your screen. The information is all out there for the taking. Start with asking questions. Then ask another one, and then another. Take notes. Draw yourself a picture of how it all works. Figure out the first step. Take that step. Try and then try again. Fail. Correct. Keep going.
 

ecommercewolf

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There is no magic plan nor secrets to be revealed at these sales-pitch-classes. They are a hoax to steal your money. The information is readily available. How-to books and on-line courses are cheap and sometimes free. Taking a local person to lunch -- who is doing what you want to do -- is also a cheap lesson. Offering your services for free to learn a business is an honorable route. You can learn a lot just hanging out and lending a hand. Attending a local investment club is another cheap way to glean information. You'll have a whole group to query. Joining an online forum is many times free, except for the value of your time to sit in front of your screen. The information is all out there for the taking. Start with asking questions. Then ask another one, and then another. Take notes. Draw yourself a picture of how it all works. Figure out the first step. Take that step. Try and then try again. Fail. Correct. Keep going.
This forum is AMAZING of course. If you do some digging in the subreddits of Reddit, it is another great resource for free information. Lastly, I would even say that Udemy is a great resource. I have not used it personally but have heard great things and spending $10-$20 is a very small investment/risk compared to what you would have paid for attending one of these "sales pitch seminars".
 

Dan_Cardone

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This forum is AMAZING of course. If you do some digging in the subreddits of Reddit, it is another great resource for free information. Lastly, I would even say that Udemy is a great resource. I have not used it personally but have heard great things and spending $10-$20 is a very small investment/risk compared to what you would have paid for attending one of these "sales pitch seminars".
You're not wrong but be careful with Udemy; a lot of bad advice on there from people who have NO idea what they are doing.
 

MattR82

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Yep! This is exactly it.

People are starting to catch on though and I don't see this strategy lasting more than a few more years.
Dunno about that. Kiyosaki has been known for this fir a long time yet I just saw ab fb ad for his seminar in my city in a few weeks (Brisbane, Australia).

"Please note, Robert Kiyosaki will not be attending." Lol.

People will still fall for it.
 

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Lion Identity

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Yeah, I think he’s a smart businessman, but I don’t like his focus on creating a “cult”-ure as he calls it. I’ve got one of his books but haven’t read it.
I recommend you read it, he's built a business that generates $150MM+ in recurring revenue, that is the quintessential CENTS business right there. Building a culture and a group of like minded people is a powerful way to create a CENTS business and one that is worth studying and learning from. You don't have to follow any successful entrepreneurs blue prints, but it would be foolish to call it a scam and not learn from it. I've worked with many of his clients who have become my clients and strategic partners, not one of them regrets using his products or working with his team.
 

Lion Identity

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Shocking: Rich people like to do things that make them richer :duh:

I dislike 99% of gurus who set up constant events/seminars/courses to teach people their garbage fluff, but there's a few of these internet public entrepreneurs that come to mind that actually provide valuable content (IMO) no matter what level you're at:

Patrick Bet-David
Jordan Belfort
... uh, that's it actually. Add MJ to the list but he's not even that public, in terms of making videos and whatnot. These are guys that were clearly wealthy before their internet fame (even though Belfort was a criminal, he's still a super smart guy).

Stay away from the Tai's, Grant's, Kiyosaki's, Robbins', etc. Basically, stay away from anyone who has "entrepreneur" in their bio and is explicitly advertising their courses 24/7 to you on Instagram. If you can't find any tangible success before their internet fame, they are probably definitely phonies.
Agreed, Patrick Bet-David provides amazing value, watch the videos on his youtube channel and you will learn a lot of action steps to build a business. Jordan is awesome at sales. I was one of the first to buy Grant Cardone's Cardone U, it has great sales content (better at the 1k price I paid vs the 10k price it is now though :) Russell Brunson's products at 2k to 3k and less are also good. If you provide a service like online lead gen, then Consulting.com's Sam Ovens is also solid at 2k. I've probably bought them all and honestly, I would probably not have a 7 figures business now if I hadn't read all of their books, watched all of the videos and even sponsored events with many of them.
I will say this though, none of them has created a more clear and powerful path to wealth creation and dream business building than our one and only @MJ DeMarco I consider Unscripted and the Millionaire Fastlane to be Entrepreneurial scripture, I read both every 4 to 6 months to check my progress.
 
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ADayattheRoxbury

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I saw ads similar to these and had the same question. I googled them and found that some people on reddit attended some of Robert's "events".

Of course it was a 2 hour pitch fest and Robert wasn't even the one speaking. He apparently only spoke for like 20 min at the end, and it was on canned Q&A questions and wouldn't answer any live questions from the audience.

Besides a cash grab I have no idea why well known and respected entrepreneurs would do this. After hearing about them doing events like this, I definitely lost some respect for them.

This is what happens, when they are no longer making money.

Or when they are no longer well-respected.

See it's easy to SAY you are rich, but it's another, far more difficult thing to consistently increase your revenue stores over time and deploy your capital in ways that make sense. Whether that be intellectual capital or greenbacks, we all have a finite amount. Clearly, this shows that they are going down the tubes, have made some really awful investments, and are now using their publicity to scam hard working people out of their money. That's really sad. I liked Rob Herjavec or whatever his name is. But I always thought Daymond was a creep after the way he's spoken to others previously in the show. The only people who seem like actual "Sharks" in my estimation nowadays would be Mark Cuban, far and away, followed by the woman who thinks she's the Real Estate Queen of New York and the Queen of QVC, respectively.
 

MHP368

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1. He made fubu , a hiphop apparel company. So a strip club sort of makes sense.

2. He's a motivational speaker.
 

luniac

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I feel sorry for anyone who would pay $X,000 for a picture with your favorite guru. And if someone is allowing that to happen, they're taking advantage of you. To be honest, I don't know how they do it with a straight face. SMH.
Wait.. so at the fastlane summit we can't pay you 2000 bucks for a group selfie?
what a scam!
 

Little Bo

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One thing that we are forgetting at the moment from reading the thread is the fact that you can't just blindly follow the footsteps of other entrepreneurs in hopes of creating the same results. That was pointed out very well in one of the books and it struck me very hard, which brings me back to these seminars. They may be attracting just to sheer value of how they created such a big companies, but it becomes irrelevant after a six months to a year time which means even if these people were giving real value it would still be worthless with just how things change. To add to it it's just much easier for them to do up sells since it takes way much of less their time and therefore such scams enter and exist around us.
 

Dan_Cardone

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Agreed, Patrick Bet-David provides amazing value, watch the videos on his youtube channel and you will learn a lot of action steps to build a business. Jordan is awesome at sales. I was one of the first to buy Grant Cardone's Cardone U, it has great sales content (better at the 1k price I paid vs the 10k price it is now thought :) Russell Brunson's products at 2k to 3k and less are also good. If you provide a service like online lead gen, then Consulting.com's Sam Ovens is also solid at 2k. I've probably bought them all and honestly, I would have a 7 figures business now if I hadn't read all of their books, watched all of the videos and even sponsored events with many of them.
I will say this though, none of them has created a more clear and powerful path to wealth creation and dream business building than our one and only @MJ DeMarco I consider Unscripted and the Millionaire Fastlane to be Entrepreneurial scripture, I read both every 4 to 6 months to check my progress.
Im going to play devils advocate and somewhat agree with you.

While I do HATE scammy tactics and high priced seminars that only give you 1% value and 99% upsell BS, ill also go on record as saying that some bigh priced courses a d seminars are pretty amazing.

Dan Kennedys Info Riches program made me well over six figures. I think I paid $497 for it.

Back in the day Belfort had a 10 dvd sales training program and I probably made my money back MANY MANY times over from it.

A 1k course from Eban Pagen? I actually knew most of what he taught in it but something he said gave me a really good idea that I ran with and also made a ton of money from.

When it comes to high priced courses and live events be sure to do due diligence. Some are really good, some are just stealth sell events trying to get more money from you, and some are just rehash of whats in their 9.99 kindle book. But some are truly good.

Edit: as far as these massive "pitch events" the sharks throw for like $50 a ticket... If you are a consultant or copywriter or even just want to network and look for opportunities, go buy a ticket. Ignore the presentations and spend your time, before, during, and after meeting people and networking with them. Quickly weed out the wanna bes with the real entrepreneurs, form a connection with them, and follow up with them after the event.
 
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