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27, Fed Up, Ready to make some changes.

Bytesunfish

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My family is a huge proponent of the slow lane. My mom is a nurse and works long hours. She is just over sixty and is finally starting to do what she likes. She's spent most of her life in a fixer upper raising myself and my sister.

I worked my a$$ trying to get through school and eventually graduated with an engineering degree. I was promised by my professors that I'd be able to get a good job and be able to support myself. The way they described it is I'd walk across the stage at graduation to get my diploma, a job offer, keys to a new car, the arm of a hot chick, and a puppy (I'm obviously exagerating, but they made it seem like all those things would be just over the horizon). Unfortunately, jobs in my field are rare unless I'm eager to move half way across the country. I was lucky enough to "score" a 16 dollar an hour job at a large international company that has been unfulfilling. I had to work a few months as an assembly line worker before I the position I needed even opened. I still see my classmates on the line and know I'm one of the fortunate ones. I work between 50-60 hours a week with everything after 40 hours being without pay. I know it isn't legal, but I have no leverage to improve my job conditions. I'm good at what I do. I was nominated for a 15,000 Euro prize for innovation. I can't help but think that even if I do get the prize, I'll still be just trying to survive and pay off school debt. This is no way to live.

I listened to The Millionaire Fastlane when I was still in college and loved the idea of starting my own business. I had it in my head that I'd look into my own fast lane once I graduated. I didn't. I went straight to the slow lane. I worked terrible hours from 2AM to 10:30 in the morning resetting grocery store shelves for months before I even got the factory lineworker position. When I got my current job I thought I was going to be free. I wasn't. I've been looking for a way out since 3 months into my engineering position. I started picking up side gigs, and I rent a home that has a built in side "business" to save on rent. All this time I've been thinking about my possible businesses and a certain invention. Last week I reread the book. I'm ready to stop thinking and start doing.

I'm twelve thousand dollars in debt, I barely scrape by every month, and I'm ready to make some changes. I have some experience with web design, an engineering background and I'm a darn hard worker. I feel like this puts me at a good start. Now it's time to start pulling triggers.
 
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AgainstAllOdds

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Unfortunately, jobs in my field are rare unless I'm eager to move half way across the country.

Unless I'm missing something, most engineers start at $60k+ out of school. You're currently making about half of that. Would moving half way across the country be that big of a sacrifice?

What's keeping you from moving?

Friends, family, do you really, really like where you grew up? Or are you keeping yourself from moving because you don't believe that you deserve a better quality of life?
 
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Ninjakid

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My family is a huge proponent of the slow lane. My mom is a nurse and works long hours. She is just over sixty and is finally starting to do what she likes. She's spent most of her life in a fixer upper raising myself and my sister.

I worked my a$$ trying to get through school and eventually graduated with an engineering degree. I was promised by my professors that I'd be able to get a good job and be able to support myself.
I think you owe your mom more credit seeing as she put herself through school to become a nurse and give your a better life. She's the real hustler here.
 

Lex DeVille

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What kind of engineer? Did you graduate with some sort of specialty?

FYI I don't know anything about how engineers move into various specialties.
 
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#nowhere

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Hello and a warm welcome ...

If you are a graduated engineer you could

-freelance
-work for another startup (learn basics)
-get time restricted contracts

... if it has to be the classic slowlane. (You can do it anyway, all conviction aside..)

Other way round you could throw in your engineering background and develop some kind of product thats beneficial for some.
(Doesn't have to be the next atom smasher) ...

All the best

#N
 
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Bytesunfish

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Unless I'm missing something, most engineers start at $60k+ out of school. You're currently making about half of that. Would moving half way across the country be that big of a sacrifice?

What's keeping you from moving?

Friends, family, do you really, really like where you grew up? Or are you keeping yourself from moving because you don't believe that you deserve a better quality of life?
It used to be that way, but unfortunately those kinds of numbers are rarely seen since 2008. Civil Engineers still see them since their projects are tied to infrastructure. I'm a mechanical engineer with a minor in electrical engineering. My passion lies in industrial automation, but I'm willing to do just about anything. The other issue is most of the jobs for engineers are in very high cost of living areas. My cost of living is proportional to what most of the jobs in other areas with higher costs of living are.

All that being said, there are still gold nuggets of jobs out there. They are just incredibly competitive to get into. Once I have enough experience to look beyond entry level positions, moving is definitely the right choice. I mainly haven't moved because I like my city and my girlfriend who is tied to the area. Another thing that's been on the back of my mind is that Fresno is a great place to start a company. Labor and real estate are cheap. The pool of workers is relatively skilled so I have a real chance at being successful here. It's a calculated risk.
 

Bytesunfish

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I think you owe your mom more credit seeing as she put herself through school to become a nurse and give your a better life. She's the real hustler here.
No doubt about that. My mom is an amazing woman. I don't have anything against the way she did things. She sacrificed a lot for me and my sister. That being said, I don't want to live the life she did. It wasn't enjoyable for her and she didn't get the benefit of seeing her hard work amount to anything more than the fixer upper that is now only marginally better than it was when she moved in. Because she was at work so much, she didn't see much of me or my sister while we were growing up.

That's not the life I want.


As to finding that well paying job. Unfortunately it is that hard nowadays. People who normally would have retired didn't when they lost their pensions and companies aren't designing as many new products in recessions because there isn't as much cashflow coming in (and that's what engineers are for).
 
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Bytesunfish

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-freelance
-work for another startup (learn basics)
-get time restricted contracts

... if it has to be the classic slowlane. (You can do it anyway, all conviction aside..)

Other way round you could throw in your engineering background and develop some kind of product thats beneficial for some.
(Doesn't have to be the next atom smasher) ...

Thanks for the welcome!

I've been doing freelance work and I've learned a lot from that. I've done everything from remotely operated sex toys to a design for a guy who wanted a vibration damped seat for his ocean fishing boat. It's because of these weird odd jobs that I'm even keeping afloat.

The time restricted contracts I'm less familiar with. Working for another startup isn't a terrible idea, but they are hard to find and give very low security. I spent the first couple of years in college as a business major and I'm getting a heck of a manufacturing education working where I am today. I'm trying to soak up everything I can while I'm here for when I go out on my own.

Invention with my engineering background is EXACTLY where I want to go with this. I have my ideas (a short term and a long term one) and I'm slowly refining my project scope before I start design.
 

conquer

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1st, change your mindset. If you feed your mind restraint, you become restrained. Feed it growth and progress and you become that.

Degree with no experience?

*Build a LinkedIn profile, add managers and employee and employers. Build relationships and ask around for positions.

*Apply to all jobs on Indeed.com that fit what your looking for or even closely related. Still apply even if under qualified.

*Cold call companies of interest, get a hold of the person who hires new talent. Convince them to give you a position. If they don't budge, offer to work for free for a few months to build experience than get on board.

*Contact engineering recruiters and let them know your criteria. Search through they're exclusive job postings (some post their own jobs on thier site)

*Look for networking/engineering meet ups at www.meetup.com and network.

*Contact your professors and ask them if they know of any positions.

*Read "Relentless" by Tim Grover, Mastery by Robert Greene, Win Friends and Influence People by Napoleon Hill
 
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Bytesunfish

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1st, change your mindset. If you feed your mind restraint, you become restrained. Feed it growth and progress and you become that.

Degree with no experience?

*Build a LinkedIn profile, add managers and employee and employers. Build relationships and ask around for positions.

*Apply to all jobs on Indeed.com that fit what your looking for or even closely related. Still apply even if under qualified.

*Cold call companies of interest, get a hold of the person who hires new talent. Convince them to give you a position. If they don't budge, offer to work for free for a few months to build experience than get on board.

*Contact engineering recruiters and let them know your criteria. Search through they're exclusive job postings (some post their own jobs on thier site)

*Look for networking/engineering meet ups at www.meetup.com and network.

*Contact your professors and ask them if they know of any positions.

*Read "Relentless" by Tim Grover, Mastery by Robert Greene, Win Friends and Influence People by Napoleon Hill

I did nearly all of those things to get to where I am today. The only ones I didn't do were use Indeed (although I did use other sites) and read "Relentless." Most people I know who didn't take all those steps are still flipping burgers. I don't disagree with any of the information you proposed, but I'm looking to go a different path. I am willing to tolerate my current job because I am learning a lot and I like the area. My end goal is to have my own business, not work for someone else.
 

Bytesunfish

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Okay... So I have the basis of my plan. I have two businesses that I want to start. One is easy to start while the other is quite difficult and requires startup capital that I simply don't have.

With my engineering background, design and manufacturing are my strong suits. I can muscle my way through the other aspects of business, but it will be considerably more difficult for me. I've ordered some samples of some consumables that are needed in my manufacturing process. They won't ship until Monday. While I'm waiting, I'm going to study up on writing copy and start the foundation of my website. Once my samples get here, I'll make some functional prototypes that are photo ready. From there I can capture some images for the website. I feel like this is a good first few steps to my starter business.
 

Bytesunfish

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Just pulled in $475 from one of my side gigs yesterday evening. It's not really a business and it isn't scalable, but it gives me reliable cash flow (200-475) on a monthly basis for a few short and enjoyable hours of work. A good portion of this is going to funnel into my business. I know these are small numbers, but they will do wonders to promote my other business interests.

At this point, my thread is going to be more of a progress thread, but that's okay with me. I may have to change the classification if it's possible.
 
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OldFaithful

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Welcome to the forum @Bytesunfish. There are a couple other physical products guys here as well.

You have an engineering degree, and you live in Fresno, it is really that hard to find a well paying job?
Manufacturing in California has been in decline for years. I believe that per capita, the biggest manufacturing areas are in the Midwest and the South. So yes, perhaps it is difficult to find a good mechanical engineering/manufacturing job in CA. (BTW, please don't confuse the presence of a company HQ with the location of their engineering or manufacturing.)

Invention with my engineering background is EXACTLY where I want to go with this.
Yes, do this!!!

Like was mentioned before,
Doesn't have to be the next atom smasher
You could innovate in an area that has a real CENTS need! The discovery process is entirely up to you.

Best wishes & Godspeed.
 
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i literally just think you would fit in the security/automation business. massive market with huge returns.

welcome aboard
 

Bytesunfish

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There are a couple other physical products guys here as well.
That's extremely encouraging to hear. I was beginning to wonder if I was the only guy not reselling on Amazon here.

Manufacturing in California has been in decline for years.... So yes, perhaps it is difficult to find a good mechanical engineering/manufacturing job in CA.
Sad, but true.

Best wishes & Godspeed.
Thanks!!

i literally just think you would fit in the security/automation business. massive market with huge returns.
I've worked in a home security/automation/home theater company for a while. It's a fascinating field. I was on the retail side of things. There is definitely a ton of room for growth there. I know the company that I worked for went under a few years ago due to the housing collapse, but if I see a need I could definitely see myself revisiting that industry.
welcome aboard
Thanks!
 
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how i have always seen it is, if someone else is doing it, there is a need as it stands.

think facebook, it wasn't ground breaking or revolutionary(in my opinion, we had xanga and myspace and whatever other social networks prior) however, it filled what those other brands where missing, a place to truly connect people, places and friends with one another simply.

the companies in your area are doing similar things at a smaller scale, the mom and pop coffee shop that people frequent instead of starbucks is still in business(maybe) because people like the atmosphere and the people around.

no need to reinvent the wheel, just polish that bitch and smile.
 

Bytesunfish

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how i have always seen it is, if someone else is doing it, there is a need as it stands.
...
no need to reinvent the wheel, just polish that bitch and smile.

I don't disagree with the strategy. For the type of work I am good at, I want to see a clear gap in a market before I look to focus my efforts on a project. Jumping into a "me too" company can definitely be profitable (facebook being a clear example), but I don't want to create a product or a new iteration of a product with an uncertain need for whatever my improvement might be.

I'm keeping my eyes open. I have one project in the works that I have a good deal of faith in. I also have one other project that has the potential to really shake up an industry if my simulations pan out and I can execute it well. Unfortunately the second one needs significant capital to start it up. Right now my game plan is to put 90% of my focus into plan one while working out some engineering on the second one. Success with the first option can get me a good deal of income especially considering the margins are high and failure would be fairly trivial (only a few hundred dollars). The time to start up is also fairly short which is great for digging me out of my school debt. From there I want to look into the higher risk/higher reward plan.
 

Bytesunfish

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Samples arrived today! I got about six samples in the mail. They arrived a bit sooner than I expected which is great! I'm seeing that I've been a bit overambitious with my timeline. It will take me a bit longer to test my samples out than I originally planned. I'm hoping by this time next week I'll have everything tested. In the meantime, I'm still listening to copy vids while at my slowlane job.

I took a bit of time to look at the competition last night. Their product is solid, but lacks the features I seek to provide. The biggest player charges about 36-50 dollars a unit. There are some Etsy guys doing basically the same thing for half the price, but they aren't my main competitors. I figure I can sneak in with a $40 price tag and snag a decent bit of the market share. It's a niche market so if I'm not expecting to make millions with this one, but it should definitely be able to fund my fastlane. I'm hoping for profits of about $1500 a month after 8 months to a year. I'm thinking pessimistically, but I am probably thinking realistically as well.

Where my competition KILLS me is in distribution. They have a solid reputation, are sold in several brick and mortar stores, online, etc. I'm going to need to really need to learn to sell when I'm a bit closer to launching. There are definitely some untapped advertising avenues that I may be able to exploit when that time comes. I'll need every angle I can get.
 
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OldFaithful

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I'm seeing that I've been a bit overambitious with my timeline.
That's no surprise to me. Happens to the best of us...and me too. It's happened so many times that I've come up with my own rule of thumb regarding INITIAL ESTIMATES of project duration and/or cost: "It will always cost twice as much and take twice as long as initial estimates."

When a customer initially tells me that they plan to order 10,000 units I actually expect them to order 5,000. When a supplier first tells me that a part will cost $5, I expect it to actually cost $10 once the bugs have been worked out. (And the quantity is half of initially quoted so the volume discount is gone.) When we plan a project to take 1 year, I casually set aside 2 years for completion. Works every time.

Later on, once the project has begun to take shape and the initial estimates have given way to actual written quotes & documented schedules...my rule of thumb has proven more accurate than not.

Your mileage may vary.
 

Bytesunfish

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"It will always cost twice as much and take twice as long as initial estimates."
That sounds about right.


I ran a batch of samples earlier. I think it came out really well, but doing a full batch exposed me to some sustainability concerns. My process uses a fair bit of water and wastes a fair bit that cannot really be recycled. There are some easy adjustments that I can implement, but it will necessitate some added (thankfully cheap) equipment. It doesn't solve the whole issue, but it probably solves about half of it. I'll need to keep this in mind as I go forward. I don't want to run up any bills or attract the attention of any environmentalists if this blows up. Issues aside, the samples came out awesome!

I need to order some raw materials to finish going through my samples. Those should arrive on Tuesday. Slow but good progress.
 

Bytesunfish

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Just checking in. I have been running samples most nights except for a few where I was working on the house or had my girlfriend over. I approached an influential friend about a sponsorship opportunity. She travels a ton and is very particular about the product I'm offering so I'm surprised she said yes. I'm excited. She'll be a great advocate for my product!

I mentioned my business and the product I've been working on to a friend. He's very eager to work for me. I am nowhere near ready to hire employees (and hiring friends sounds like trouble), but it's encouraging to hear others excited for what I'm doing.

I still have a ton of manufacturing work ahead of me. I haven't done much work on the website yet. Gotta keep focus!
 
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Bytesunfish

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This is definitely a long overdue update. I have shifted gears quite a bit since the last update. I put my business on hold in favor of a more lucrative opportunity. A friend of mine from engineering school referred some guys to me who were looking for some electrical engineering work for a business they were starting. To make a very complex thing short, we're all partners in the business and our contributions determine our ownership of the company. We're basing the equity distribution on the model in Slicing Pie by Mike Moyer. It's a good book for setting up agreements between owners for startups. If you can find a synopsis online, it could probably be summed up in a few short pages, but it's a quick read.

We've written the bulk of our code, designed our PCBs, done a fair bit of testing and have an informal "we're interested in buying your stuff" from a big corporation. It's scary and awesome at the same time. The corporation that is interested is big enough that many people live in a 3 mile radius of a few of their franchises. I can't say for sure if this will take off, but I'm constantly fluctuating between enjoying the ride, hating life, stressing out, and just holding on. All that being said, I like where I'm going. Having partners helps keep me motivated and we're developing the company far faster than I could have if I had tried all this on my own. I'm too busy to really be giving this blog the attention to give a blow by blow the way I had originally envisioned, but I'll try to pop on every now and then to give an update.

For what it's worth, @SmittyMcdougal our product is related to automation. :)
 
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Bytesunfish

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I also wanted to add that I found myself a workout buddy and have been consistently going to the gym for the last two months. I know it's not finance related, but it's something I've needed to do for me. I was 195ish pounds at 5'10" That was not acceptable to me. It was the most I had ever weighed. I've only dropped a pound or two, but I've pretty clearly gotten more muscular. More importantly, keeping my body in better shape has helped my morale and let me feel like I'm accomplishing something on the toughest of days. I think trying to keep one facet of my life under control has a good affect on the other facets that I'm working on. Just something I noticed.
 

MJ DeMarco

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More importantly, keeping my body in better shape has helped my morale and let me feel like I'm accomplishing something on the toughest of days.

Probably the endorphins which is a chemical response likened to drugs -- working out gets them going.

Sticking to a health regime (diet / gym) is probably the BEST thing you could do for your entrepreneurial life.

Thanks for the intro and returning for an update! Most folks post intros raving about "Fastlane" and go back to their job the following day, LOL.
 
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My family is a huge proponent of the slow lane. My mom is a nurse and works long hours. She is just over sixty and is finally starting to do what she likes. She's spent most of her life in a fixer upper raising myself and my sister.

I worked my a$$ trying to get through school and eventually graduated with an engineering degree. I was promised by my professors that I'd be able to get a good job and be able to support myself. The way they described it is I'd walk across the stage at graduation to get my diploma, a job offer, keys to a new car, the arm of a hot chick, and a puppy (I'm obviously exagerating, but they made it seem like all those things would be just over the horizon). Unfortunately, jobs in my field are rare unless I'm eager to move half way across the country. I was lucky enough to "score" a 16 dollar an hour job at a large international company that has been unfulfilling. I had to work a few months as an assembly line worker before I the position I needed even opened. I still see my classmates on the line and know I'm one of the fortunate ones. I work between 50-60 hours a week with everything after 40 hours being without pay. I know it isn't legal, but I have no leverage to improve my job conditions. I'm good at what I do. I was nominated for a 15,000 Euro prize for innovation. I can't help but think that even if I do get the prize, I'll still be just trying to survive and pay off school debt. This is no way to live.

I listened to The Millionaire Fastlane when I was still in college and loved the idea of starting my own business. I had it in my head that I'd look into my own fast lane once I graduated. I didn't. I went straight to the slow lane. I worked terrible hours from 2AM to 10:30 in the morning resetting grocery store shelves for months before I even got the factory lineworker position. When I got my current job I thought I was going to be free. I wasn't. I've been looking for a way out since 3 months into my engineering position. I started picking up side gigs, and I rent a home that has a built in side "business" to save on rent. All this time I've been thinking about my possible businesses and a certain invention. Last week I reread the book. I'm ready to stop thinking and start doing.

I'm twelve thousand dollars in debt, I barely scrape by every month, and I'm ready to make some changes. I have some experience with web design, an engineering background and I'm a darn hard worker. I feel like this puts me at a good start. Now it's time to start pulling triggers.

If you can't sacrifice a little by moving for a solid job, starting a business isn't the solution. Much more is required of you to get a venture off the ground than simply moving to a new location.
 

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