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Free registration at the forum removes this block.I don't know that there will be a consensus on that, as some people have different levels of comfort when it comes to the loss of life. This is certainly going to bring everyone's view on that to the forefront. The world is about to get really cold, and many will be tested.Furthermore does flattening the curve save THAT MANY more lives? Not to sound heartless, but is one person's life worth 10,000 out of work? Would they have died anyway? The economy suffers the consequences of the policy whether they live or die. That is an ethical and moral dilemma in the highest form.
But this virus isn't the only thing that contributes to loss of life.I don't know that there will be a consensus on that, as some people have different levels of comfort when it comes to the loss of life. This is certainly going to bring everyone's view on that to the forefront. The world is about to get really cold, and many will be tested.
I’m getting skeptical
About? The pandemic itself?I’m getting skeptical
Trump Says Coronavirus Cure Cannot ‘Be Worse Than the Problem Itself’ (Published 2020)
The president, who has watched the economy plunge amid social distancing measures, says restrictions will be reassessed.www.nytimes.com
Of what? You have to be a bit more detailed.
The media?
Government response?
The WHO?
The CDC?
I am starting to question as to the catastrophe that is being inflicted on the economy and if the trade-off is known or if it is speculative. The loss of life in Wuhan China was not even close to the catastrophe that was projected.
in the United States, the partisan responses to the pandemic seem to illustrate that it’s more of an ideological strategy than a medical one.
You have the capitalists saying all is well, and you have the liberals saying the world is ending. The truth is somewhere in between.
I’m growing skeptical that the solution is more harmful than the cause.
I wonder what the models have been here in the US - we all know they've been running these models based on the data. These models won't be shown to us of course. Curious what the estimated loss of life would be if we did what @Kak suggested, directing everyone thought to be at highest risk of death or severe illness to self quarantine and give them aid, but pushing everyone else to go back to work. Are the models saying it would it be in the hundreds of thousands in the US? Would it be in the millions? Wish we could see those projections.I think in the UK that was modelled at causing something like 500,000 deaths
I am starting to question as to the catastrophe that is being inflicted on the economy and if the trade-off is known or if it is speculative. The loss of life in Wuhan China was not even close to the catastrophe that was projected.
True, but it has the ability to be the single biggest contributing factor in the shortest period of time when you start comparing the options. Or have there been estimates and/or models that conflict with that assumption?But this virus isn't the only thing that contributes to loss of life.
I’m growing skeptical as I wonder if the solution is more harmful than the cause.
That's why I'm curious what the models have shown. You know the nation's leaders have run through different models based on the available data. If they shared those with us all, I wonder what the votes would be for the best approach.I think this depends on whether you feel that there is an acceptable loss of life sacrifice in order to save the economy.
I think this depends on whether you feel that there is an acceptable loss of life sacrifice in order to save the economy.
For those of us in AZ, don't get a false sense of security.
Looks like we've only tested 352 people.
The state health department's reporting is absolutely dismal.
Well there's one nuance to take into consideration. The Rural/Urban divide. Republicans tend to live in rural areas, while Democrats tend to be city dwellers. Cities are getting hit much much harder. And that's where all the liberals hang out.You have the capitalists saying all is well, and you have the liberals saying the world is ending. The truth is somewhere in between.
Catch 22, right? As with any virus, there will be loss of life. Mortality rate among the most vulnerable that are susceptible to any aberration. I'd never choose death over life, but if you literally use that litmus test, this is then just a dry run for an annual shut down.
I think this depends on whether you feel that there is an acceptable loss of life sacrifice in order to save the economy.
Not even that though. I laid out my town’s scenario. The local economy is completely halted and getting worse every day with lasting damage. ALL TO FLATTEN A CURVE.
Yet we literally have more hospitals than hospitalized coronavirus patients.
In our town in particular, business as usual would have caused no more deaths.
For those of us in AZ, don't get a false sense of security.
Looks like we've only tested 352 people.
The state health department's reporting is absolutely dismal.
Yea, this is absurd. Places like NYC are a different story, but not everywhere is getting hit like that. Not sure why you guys even have a lockdown.In our town in particular, business as usual would have caused no more deaths.
If you go around flattening curves that don’t need flattened you are going to flatten the economy too.
Kyle you remember how sick I was?
for the 3 weeks leading up to the forum event in February, I have never been as sick in my LIFE as I was then. For just over three weeks. Brutal. Tested, non-flu. Hypothetically, this was earlier than known virus in the USA, but I am in regular contact with people from the heart of the manufacturing districts in China. So... is it possible I had it (and my whole family, inflicted with the same shit in January). Brutal. Crazy sick. Unidentified. Antibiotics ineffective. Checked off several of the symptoms (in retrospect) from this. This knocked me out. I remember the feeling (as I communicated to my wife) that I would never get better. It was that bad, that long.
But it's not "indefinite." The idea behind social distancing and shelter in place is to flatten the infection curve so medical facilities can try to keep up until the vaccine is available (12-18 months). The combination of vaccinations and exposure/survivor related immunities will eventually create herd immunity and we can get back to life more like what we knew. I know a year sounds like a long time and most likely we would not "lock down" the country for a year. But making some changes to our life for a while will gives us time and limited impact on medical capacity. Sure there will be surges of infections, but if we work together we can lessen the impact of those surges. We can also move resources around as needed to handle local surges as they occur. The critical thing here is to try to NOT crash our medical capacity.A new virus comes around and suddenly we're supposed to shut down life as we know it indefinitely?
Yea, I mean Italy is already starting to see a decline, only 12 days after the lockdown.But it's not "indefinite."
Such idiots would be funny if it weren't for the risks they present to countless other innocent people.View attachment 31436
View attachment 31437
Population control at it's finest
The interviews with everyone are hilarious
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