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Free registration at the forum removes this block.This thread had no intention of adding value. Just discussion. Wanted to discuss before I tried again. I have had numerous products in the past.
None, I mean who would invest in another private label brand? An investor for a better toaster oven?
Thanks for input. I realized to really have control over product development, it needs to be in house. Because if you pay a 3rd party for each iteration (trial and error) paying a substantial markup. But with the in house, equipment and tooling is not cheap either...Higher quality materials usually require expensive equipment to work with. For example, English bridle leather needs the best tools. You can't take shortcuts with this. Even developing a product as small as a watch band can be expensive. think Hermes. But I guess they are a little over engineered kekeke
At what point did you get the idea that product development is cheap?Thanks
This thread had no intention of adding value. Just discussion. Wanted to discuss before I tried again. I have had numerous products in the past.
My apologies
None, I mean who would invest in another private label brand? An investor for a better toaster oven?
I have actual done the leather belts and it is actually high capital. What you are missing is the equipment and tools to make the leather. High quality leather require high quality tools and equipment. They ain’t cheap at all. Good luck using regular tools to cut full grain or English bridle. It can get very expensive. Speaking from experience. Take a look at r/Leathercraft or maybe it’s called leatherworking. Ask if their hobby is cheap, you will get a resounding no.
Are you implying that these watches required no capital to get started? To get to Kickstarter point with marketing video, prototype, etc. is costly. Ask anyone that tried.
This entire argument is nonsensical. I launched a VERY high quality hand crafted product on Amazon about 5 years ago. I did very well for a while. Then the Chinese items entered the market full force. It was impossible to compete with this high of quality. My costs were a little higher, but my item was way better. In photographs that is hard to differentiate. To the customers, you could get "more value" for less money with a competing product. Set them side by side and you would never buy the Chinese one.
The consumers are ABSOLUTELY moving to the lowest cost, shit quality end of the spectrum. Look up any item on amazon. The number #1 result will be within 10% of the lowest price for that item. The first second and third best selling wrist watch on amazon are under $15. They are ALL rated 4 stars or better. You need to go 7 items back to even get to $30. There isn't a watch on the first page under $100... Tell me again why TOP QUALITY is the paramount ingredient to a successful business?
I just met a guy a few days ago. He makes high quality leather belts from his home. Sells them for alot of money online. Is there alot of capital needed? Not that much. Go buy good quality leather. Have good skills in cutting, hole punching and stitching. Buy high quality buckles. Put them together. Most of the quality comes from the labor, not that actual cost of materials.
So I just looked on my desk and I see my wallet. Nothing special, a nice leather wallet. I don't know much about wallets, but I'm going to imagine that a top tier wallet uses nicer leather and stitching. How much product development would go into this?
BTW, just a coincidence that both my examples happen to use leather. I have at least 10 other examples that I can think of... but I can't divulge the products.
Your problem is that you think that just because you can't do it, that it is impossible. Then your mindset reinforces the thought and it eventually becomes a fact in your brain and out pops a thread titled... "Agree? You can't build a top tier physical product without Money" or "Agree or Disagree: Entrepreneurship is a privilege". You hope that people agree because then it means that you were right and the failures were not your fault.
I can't dunk, I tried to alot when I was younger so... Agree? You can't dunk unless you are over 6' tall
What type of leather? Full Grain at least? English Bridle? Look at Sedgwick leather.
Leather Belt Materials
1) High Quality Leather (English Bridle)
2) Stainless Steel or Brass Buckle
3) Attaching the buckle, either rivets or Stitching (Waxed Linen is good)
4) Edge Finish: Either Burnishing or Edge Paint
5) Labels/Packaging
Tools
1) Leather Round Hole Punches (C.S. Osborne)
2) Belt End Punch (C.S. Osborne)
3) Edge Paint Roller
4) Leather Maul/Hammer
5) Healing Cutting Mat
6) Rotary Cutter
7) Skiver - thins out leather at bend
9) Pricking Iron - to make holes for leather thread
10) Leather Needles
11) Fileteuse (if edge painting) and for edge creasing
12) Leather Strap Cutter
13) Brass Logo Stamp
14) Brass Number Stamp Sizing
15) Heat Gun - to warm up Brass stamp
16) Leather Hole Template
17) Arbor Press
18) Stitching Pony
When using high quality leather, cheap tools are unable to even cut high quality leather. A better way for consistency is a clicker die press with a custom die made.
Agree with this exactly. People buy different products for different reasons, quality, price, marketing, photos, branding are all value skews and reasons someone picks a product to buyI don't owe you an explanation. You are wrong in several ways.
First of all you don't need to self finance every business you start. That notion alone is ridiculous.
Second of all, it does not need to be top tier quality to be a thriving business with happy customers.
Which company would you rather own Rolls Royce or Kia? Citizen or Patek Philippe? Walmart or Bergdorf Goodman? Amazon or James Edition?
This entire argument is nonsensical. I launched a VERY high quality hand crafted product on Amazon about 5 years ago. I did very well for a while. Then the Chinese items entered the market full force. It was impossible to compete with this high of quality. My costs were a little higher, but my item was way better. In photographs that is hard to differentiate. To the customers, you could get "more value" for less money with a competing product. Set them side by side and you would never buy the Chinese one.
The consumers are ABSOLUTELY moving to the lowest cost, shit quality end of the spectrum. Look up any item on amazon. The number #1 result will be within 10% of the lowest price for that item. The first second and third best selling wrist watch on amazon are under $15. They are ALL rated 4 stars or better. You need to go 7 items back to even get to $30. There isn't a watch on the first page under $100... Tell me again why TOP QUALITY is the paramount ingredient to a successful business?
You are staying within the Amazon ecosystem only which is why this happens. Depending your entire business on the Amazon Algos. Sales platforms have commoditizing effects. Look at any top tier brand with quality, most aren't even on any 3rd party sales platform. Get off Amazon and market outside.
Example: I am building a watch brand. I want to build the best offering for customers.
What type of leather? Full Grain at least? English Bridle? Look at Sedgwick leather.
Leather Belt Materials
1) High Quality Leather (English Bridle)
2) Stainless Steel or Brass Buckle
3) Attaching the buckle, either rivets or Stitching (Waxed Linen is good)
4) Edge Finish: Either Burnishing or Edge Paint
5) Labels/Packaging
Tools
1) Leather Round Hole Punches (C.S. Osborne)
2) Belt End Punch (C.S. Osborne)
3) Edge Paint Roller
4) Leather Maul/Hammer
5) Healing Cutting Mat
6) Rotary Cutter
7) Skiver - thins out leather at bend
9) Pricking Iron - to make holes for leather thread
10) Leather Needles
11) Fileteuse (if edge painting) and for edge creasing
12) Leather Strap Cutter
13) Brass Logo Stamp
14) Brass Number Stamp Sizing
15) Heat Gun - to warm up Brass stamp
16) Leather Hole Template
17) Arbor Press
18) Stitching Pony
When using high quality leather, cheap tools are unable to even cut high quality leather. A better way for consistency is a clicker die press with a custom die made.
What type of leather? Full Grain at least? English Bridle? Look at Sedgwick leather.
Leather Belt Materials
1) High Quality Leather (English Bridle)
2) Stainless Steel or Brass Buckle
3) Attaching the buckle, either rivets or Stitching (Waxed Linen is good)
4) Edge Finish: Either Burnishing or Edge Paint
5) Labels/Packaging
Tools
1) Leather Round Hole Punches (C.S. Osborne)
2) Belt End Punch (C.S. Osborne)
3) Edge Paint Roller
4) Leather Maul/Hammer
5) Healing Cutting Mat
6) Rotary Cutter
7) Skiver - thins out leather at bend
9) Pricking Iron - to make holes for leather thread
10) Leather Needles
11) Fileteuse (if edge painting) and for edge creasing
12) Leather Strap Cutter
13) Brass Logo Stamp
14) Brass Number Stamp Sizing
15) Heat Gun - to warm up Brass stamp
16) Leather Hole Template
17) Arbor Press
18) Stitching Pony
When using high quality leather, cheap tools are unable to even cut high quality leather. A better way for consistency is a clicker die press with a custom die made.
How long did you do the leather belt stuff??Thanks
This thread had no intention of adding value. Just discussion. Wanted to discuss before I tried again. I have had numerous products in the past.
My apologies
None, I mean who would invest in another private label brand? An investor for a better toaster oven?
I have actual done the leather belts and it is actually high capital. What you are missing is the equipment and tools to make the leather. High quality leather require high quality tools and equipment. They ain’t cheap at all. Good luck using regular tools to cut full grain or English bridle. It can get very expensive. Speaking from experience. Take a look at r/Leathercraft or maybe it’s called leatherworking. Ask if their hobby is cheap, you will get a resounding no.
Are you implying that these watches required no capital to get started? To get to Kickstarter point with marketing video, prototype, etc. is costly. Ask anyone that tried.
I had exact the same experience.I don't owe you an explanation. You are wrong in several ways.
First of all you don't need to self finance every business you start. That notion alone is ridiculous.
Second of all, it does not need to be top tier quality to be a thriving business with happy customers.
Which company would you rather own Rolls Royce or Kia? Citizen or Patek Philippe? Walmart or Bergdorf Goodman? Amazon or James Edition?
This entire argument is nonsensical. I launched a VERY high quality hand crafted product on Amazon about 5 years ago. I did very well for a while. Then the Chinese items entered the market full force. It was impossible to compete with this high of quality. My costs were a little higher, but my item was way better. In photographs that is hard to differentiate. To the customers, you could get "more value" for less money with a competing product. Set them side by side and you would never buy the Chinese one.
The consumers are ABSOLUTELY moving to the lowest cost, shit quality end of the spectrum. Look up any item on amazon. The number #1 result will be within 10% of the lowest price for that item. The first second and third best selling wrist watch on amazon are under $15. They are ALL rated 4 stars or better. You need to go 7 items back to even get to $30. There isn't a watch on the first over $100... Tell me again why TOP QUALITY is the paramount ingredient to a successful business?
I think by definition keychains & fridge magnets--and most mass-market souvenirs--aren't something where people care about high quality. They just want a simple trinket.I had exact the same experience.
My friend and I were doing the wholesale business with his uncles’s contact. His uncle owns a sourvenir manufacturing business in Malaysia. Fridge magnets and keychains. His products are better than those lower priced made in China gifts. He has a few loyal business customers in Singapore. They are zoos, museum and entertainment parks where high-end souvenirs are sold.
We tried to pitch his products to the mass market souvenir shops and it was a total failure. These are places where tourists buy food, drinks and trinkets. We tried to get into consignment deals but the sales were very poor.
Most average people are not just not willing to spend money on quality sourvenir. It is not that they do not see the quality. It is more of they do not see the need to pay for the quality premium when there is a cheaper alternatives.
We saw things like two dollar T shirts in the souvernir shops. Two dollar T shirts? Is that a T shirt or a piece of rag? The shop owners told me that they were one of the best selling items! Crazy!
I just conclude that this is the wrong market to get into. Fierce competition with very low margin in the mass market products. Very small demand for quality products.
What I have noticed about the best physical products, is simple. It is mainly just a money pump. Physical products quality is solely limited, by how much money a person has. My unpopular opinion.
Example: I am building a watch brand. I want to build the best offering for customers.
The crystal of a watch can be made of different materials. I will just go over two materials to demonstrate the point. Mineral and Sapphire. Just a basic search, and sapphire is clearly superior. With that in mind, sapphire is more expensive.
When there is a bad product on the market, it is just because the entrepreneur didn't have enough money to build a solid offering. I can have the intention to develop the best product, but the follow through is by having capital. I am just speaking about the product building step. No way around it. Normally, these products have to be built in house as well.
This is probably why you see businesses that max out of product development, but then have no cash to do marketing. Or the other type of business where they max marketing and have a poor product. Most people don't have money to max both. If you do max both, you are most likely a powerhouse/monopoly in your industry.
Yes. Simple lesson but it took me a few months of huslting to figure that out.I think by definition keychains & fridge magnets--and most mass-market souvenirs--aren't something where people care about high quality. They just want a simple trinket.
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