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When do you realize you are getting sold (Scammed)

ambrosinibello

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Hopefuly this is right section for this.

You know what I mean, for the very beginners think your average new MLM cult member, for the advanced people think Grant Cardone.

Want to hear how other people snap out of it and become aware.

For me, anytime I read something, or hear someone talk and want to take action IMMEDIATELY. I then stop and revaluate wtf I am being sold. I realize that, the kind of action I am getting isn't true aspiration, but motivation and transformation of emotion into action taking (In this case, sign up for their program)

What's yours?
 

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Zcott

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Interesting thread!

For me, it's whenever someone I don't know asks me more than one open ended questions about myself. It's clear they're trying to get me to talk and probe for something to talk about as part of a sales pitch. Not to be rude, but we don't know each other, stop pretending like we're best mates straight off the bat.
 

jpanarra

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Once they start referring me to other materials of theirs to buy.

Robert Kiyosaki is notorious for this, outside of Richdad poor dad and cashflow quadrant, don't bother with the rest of his content.
 

Jeff Noel

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Once they start referring me to other materials of theirs to buy.

Robert Kiyosaki is notorious for this, outside of Richdad poor dad and cashflow quadrant, don't bother with the rest of his content.
That's a really good example.

As much as I enjoyed reading RDPD, I've been flooded with emails from him trying to upsell 15 other books.

Unless they say "I say X in my other book" where they still give you what you're looking for, but mention their other material, in which case my scam alert doesn't ring yet.
 

DonTriumph

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Once they start referring me to other materials of theirs to buy.

Robert Kiyosaki is notorious for this, outside of Richdad poor dad and cashflow quadrant, don't bother with the rest of his content.
Robert Kiyosaki is my first "mentor" to entrepreneurship and money through his book, RDPD.

Sadly, after RDPD and Cashflow Quadrant, none of his content (books) had added any value - his message just gets repeated and repeated, again and again, though with a few additions here and there.

Who Took My Money, Before You Quit Your Job, and Why "A" Students Work For "C" Students are interesting though.
 

DonTriumph

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Hopefuly this is right section for this.

You know what I mean, for the very beginners think your average new MLM cult member, for the advanced people think Grant Cardone.

Want to hear how other people snap out of it and become aware.

For me, anytime I read something, or hear someone talk and want to take action IMMEDIATELY. I then stop and revaluate wtf I am being sold. I realize that, the kind of action I am getting isn't true aspiration, but motivation and transformation of emotion into action taking (In this case, sign up for their program)

What's yours?
I learned not to listen too much on "motivational" or "inspirational" talks. I also don't buy their book just because it's a bestseller.

I learned to always look on the content, what will I actually learn here rather than the feel-good motivation it brings.

Sure, feel-good stuffs boost you from time to time. But if all you're offered is some feel-good stuff AND their "Sign up here!" or "Buy my book", I'd be wary and think twice.

Moral lesson (based on very personal experience): Don't get hooked to some guru. It's not that they're always lying or deceiving you into something - though that's a case for many of them. It's that, at some point, you have to find and create your own way. You have to decide which of their content/ideas fit your situation.

For example, just because this famous guru is a dropout doesn't mean you'll dropout.

Or, just because this guru invests heavily on stocks doesn't mean you'll put all your money on stocks.

In the end, you'll have to find your own answer and create your own way.
 

Lex DeVille

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Start by reading my GOLD thread about this exact topic. It's in my signature. The only way to avoid getting scammed is to become aware of scammer tactics and be able to recognize them instantly.

Keep in mind, just because someone makes an offer doesn't make it a scam. There are valuable insights and opportunities in courses and coaching programs. I say this as someone who runs both low and high-ticket courses and coaching.

My low-ticket Udemy courses offer a basic version of my training. It's way more than enough to get someone started, moving, and earning. But what I find is people often have MORE questions for me even though I've laid out the training. In fact, I've even laid out exact processes on this forum for free and STILL I get questions every day.

So...

Should I answer every question for free? Should I trade my valuable time for nothing? Should I help you at no cost and give you free answers and insights that took me YEARS to learn and perfect on my own without anyone else's help?

Those are the questions I find myself asking when I consider offering other programs, trainings, or even just consulting and coaching. You want what I have. I give it to you for a price you can afford (free or extremely low cost). If you want more, there's a cost for that too, but I'm happy to make it available for those who want it.

Grant Cardone might be a scam. Maybe he isn't. I don't know. Never took his courses. But I know if you were in his personal network, you'd have more connections available to you. Chances are, people don't follow Grant because he's full of shit. They follow him because at some point, be it now or previously, he created huge value for someone. Then people wanted more, and so he made it available to them.

That's just my guess though.
 

ExaltedLife

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You basically said it in your OP. If you stop and think about anything before you act, you'll usually figure out if it's a scam or not.

Time share: "Don't you love it here? Buy a time share and you can get a piece of this great property!"

Do I get ownership of the property?

"Not entirely, but for two weeks of every year, it's yours!"

How much does that cost?

"Well the costs can vary depending on blah blah blah"

How much does that cost?

"Uhh...$20,000".

That's for two weeks a year?

"Well, there are all kinds of opt-"

Yeah I'll pass.
 

Mark Fobo

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Interesting thread!

For me, it's whenever someone I don't know asks me more than one open ended questions about myself. It's clear they're trying to get me to talk and probe for something to talk about as part of a sales pitch. Not to be rude, but we don't know each other, stop pretending like we're best mates straight off the bat.
What about they are good sales and actually by exchanging with you succeed to find an issue you have or something you dont realise you do the hard way and could prove you that you would benefit from this solution? No (good) sales can do that without making you talk first, it would not be listening and go for a pushy sale likely to fail or meet some heavy push backs.
 

lejus

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To me, Grant Cardone actually offered amazing value in his books and decent value in his videos. It's not like this information is not available anywhere else to some level or another but I certainly like a guy. I am not sure about his other materials or speeches, I've never got past his books and yt videos, their price or value but his yt videos and books are good imo. If I am missing something, by all means, let me know.

I usually follow a simple rule if it is more than $25/hour you can find the same information cheaper you just either didn't look or you were lazy on your research stage (local library should be the first place to start) . And with books you can find some amazing information for next to nothing.

In general, they follow a pattern: first training free, where they give you a little bit of information and a lot of promises, second training few hundred, not the magnificent amount but reasonable, so you sign up for second and.... you get the same little bit of information and a lot of hype for next level for few thousand bucks, which is definitely not worth it.
 

Kevin88660

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Hopefuly this is right section for this.

You know what I mean, for the very beginners think your average new MLM cult member, for the advanced people think Grant Cardone.

Want to hear how other people snap out of it and become aware.

For me, anytime I read something, or hear someone talk and want to take action IMMEDIATELY. I then stop and revaluate wtf I am being sold. I realize that, the kind of action I am getting isn't true aspiration, but motivation and transformation of emotion into action taking (In this case, sign up for their program)

What's yours?
I am a salesperson of financials so I can see from both sides.

Unless there is misrepresentation, it is not a “scam”.

For MLM business, no one can make the decision for you except yourself. You want to do your own due dilligence before investing your time into a direct selling business. If it makes money for you it is a winner. If not it is a scam...well then anything could be a scam.

Regarding buying programs, as a consumer I think you gain most bucks by buying the book of the gurus. It is cheap and contain a lot of value. If you want to dig further you can sign up the programs.

Recently I just bought three books from amazon for sales skills development. Worth the very cent spent without signing up those high premium courses.
 

Kid

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For MLM business, no one can make the decision for you except yourself.
I've enough. So you say that all those scam techniques, fake endorsement, fake lines to "buy a course" table, the music, the colors, the highly enthusiastic people right beside you that clap whatever is said on stage are there just to help you make decision for yourself?
 

Kevin88660

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I've enough. So you say that all those scam techniques, fake endorsement, fake lines to "buy a course" table, the music, the colors, the highly enthusiastic people right beside you that clap whatever is said on stage are there just to help you make decision for yourself?
In my opinion Most MLM business are bad business model, but that dont make themselves scams.

Just like slowlane jobs suck, but no one gets scammed.

What do you mean by fake endorsement? If something is fake then that would make it a scam.
 

NC Bidniss

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My rule is this: if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
 

lowtek

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Hopefuly this is right section for this.

You know what I mean, for the very beginners think your average new MLM cult member, for the advanced people think Grant Cardone.

Want to hear how other people snap out of it and become aware.

For me, anytime I read something, or hear someone talk and want to take action IMMEDIATELY. I then stop and revaluate wtf I am being sold. I realize that, the kind of action I am getting isn't true aspiration, but motivation and transformation of emotion into action taking (In this case, sign up for their program)

What's yours?
@458 has made a boatload of money using Grant Cardone's sales system so.... not a scam.
 

Kak

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@458 has made a boatload of money using Grant Cardone's sales system so.... not a scam.
Put me down as another fan of Grant Cardone. Though I have kept it to his books.
 

Neng Her

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Hopefuly this is right section for this.

You know what I mean, for the very beginners think your average new MLM cult member, for the advanced people think Grant Cardone.

Want to hear how other people snap out of it and become aware.

For me, anytime I read something, or hear someone talk and want to take action IMMEDIATELY. I then stop and revaluate wtf I am being sold. I realize that, the kind of action I am getting isn't true aspiration, but motivation and transformation of emotion into action taking (In this case, sign up for their program)

What's yours?

Have you purchased or tried Grant Cardone's content?
 
OP
OP
A

ambrosinibello

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I've spent circa 9-10k with Grant Cardone. Scam was a strong word, manipulate fits better.

I mean you are all probably right, and it's my lack of intelligence applying his program. Truth of the matter is, I used it, put in the work( over 60,000 dials and 3000+ contacts), used all his material and didnt see success.

Maybe in a different industry (roofs, cars, etc) I'd have made a killing. Either way that's my experience and I trust what I know.
 

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Xeon

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When people start providing value to me (excluding this forum).
Because after they've finished delivering the value, the next thing that happens is the initiation of the sales funnel.
 

Kevin88660

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When it comes to coaching and seminars my conclusion is no one ever regrets buying a book, and very often thousands dollar training packages are disappointments.

Especially with amazon kindle nowadays my buying treshold for super low. Only thing that stops me from buying is having no time to read since I still have several unfinished books.
 

SquatchMan

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I usually follow a simple rule if it is more than $25/hour you can find the same information cheaper you just either didn't look or you were lazy on your research stage (local library should be the first place to start) . And with books you can find some amazing information for next to nothing.
...
If a consultant/coach charges under $25/hour, then they're gonna suck. 100% guaranteed.
 

Yzn

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When the course price ends with $7 or $9.
 

458

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I've spent circa 9-10k with Grant Cardone. Scam was a strong word, manipulate fits better.

I mean you are all probably right, and it's my lack of intelligence applying his program. Truth of the matter is, I used it, put in the work( over 60,000 dials and 3000+ contacts), used all his material and didnt see success.

Maybe in a different industry (roofs, cars, etc) I'd have made a killing. Either way that's my experience and I trust what I know.
I've spent at least $100,000 USD.. Has returned 10x that..
 

lejus

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If a consultant/coach charges under $25/hour, then they're gonna suck. 100% guaranteed.
Dude university lectures cost under $25/hour , books cost waaaaayyy under $25 an hour, udemy.com or lynda.com courses cost under $25/hour, are you saying all university lecturers, all books and all udemy/lynda courses suck? I disagree.
 

Fassina

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Skepticism, scientific method, Bayesian inference, basic statistical knowledge..
 

Fassina

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@458 has made a boatload of money using Grant Cardone's sales system so.... not a scam.
Anecdotal evidence doesn't equal disconfirming evidence.. I read Grant's book, and he tells you his entire life story and business career there, if based on that not at all impressive track record imho, you believe he's somebody worth learning from cool, I think differently though.

He basically did his same spiel for 20+ years iirc, teaching sales and giving motivational talks in businesses, then he wrote a sales book with good marketing and good content that sold well, went all in on the marketing and blew up.

That isn't very impressive to me, and it sure as F doesn't qualify him to charge what he charges for his courses and seminars. But that's the business he's in, he sells himself and people buy it, he makes himself into a celebrity with marketing and PR and people believe it, he's got a short simple and easy to remember catch phrase (chant) that people love (10X)...

Dan Kennedy has an entire course on this stuff, Grant is just a popular and successful example of somebody doing it at a high level.

He probably isn't a scammer, very few of them exist. To be a scammer somebody has to promise results, and not deliver them without using any legal protection against being sued.

i.e If X sells a weight loss course that guarantees you'll lose X pounds, and you don't you can sue him/her. If instead X has a warning or legal notice on the bottom with small text saying results may vary depending on how closely you follow the program, how motivated you are, how hard you work etc.. he's legally not a scammer and you won't win a lawsuit against him/her. It's a fine line that differentiates both though..
 

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