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HOT TOPIC The Worldwide Covid-19 Coronavirus Pandemic Discussion Thread...

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MoneyDoc

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In Canada, the people that want the lockdown to stay for as long as possible are the people that have deferred their mortgages for 6 months, credit card payments for 2 months, even though no one has lost their job in their household. At this point, more people are worried about getting as much free money as possible than they are about COVID-19. Then these are the same people that are all of a sudden advocating for "lives over economy". It's hilarious.
 

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MTF

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In an op-ed that was published in The Washington Post last week, Gates added: “To bring the disease to an end, we’ll need a safe and effective vaccine. If we do everything right, we could have one in less than 18 months—about the fastest a vaccine has ever been developed.
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Seems like it might end up being the same thing as with Zika and other viruses (including SARS). Before it's ready, nobody will need it anymore.

Also consider this: The global food supply chain wasn’t designed for this | Sovereign Man (the part in bold is mine)

Then there’s shingles– an infection caused by the varicella-zoster virus– which is brutally painful for older adults.

GlaxoSmithKline produces a vaccine for this virus called Shingrix that took them more than 10 years to develop and test. And the company has stated repeatedly that they are overwhelmed with demand: hundreds of millions of people want the vaccine.

A few months ago, Glaxo announced that they already reached maximum production capacity of the vaccine, and they’ll have to build a new bioreactor facility just to increase production to ~20 million units per year.

That new facility won’t be online until 2024.

Obviously the novel Coronavirus is different. Its biology is different, the circumstances are different.

But there does seem to be a prevailing attitude worldwide that there will be a vaccine ‘within 12-18 months.’

We can certainly hope so. Fingers crossed.

But this “12-18 month” estimate has been repeated so many times by politicians, reporters, etc. that the public now views it as a foregone conclusion.

And there seems to be zero consideration given to the possibility that, maybe just maybe, vaccine development could take a lot longer.

Or perhaps, even if a vaccine is rapidly developed, that it would take at least five years to produce, transport, and administer BILLIONS of vaccines.

Think about it– Glaxo will spend the next four years building a new facility just to be able to produce 10-20 million annual units of its Shingles vaccine.

How many biotech facilities worldwide will be needed to produce billions of coronavirus vaccines?

And even if existing production centers are able to quickly switch from producing other drugs and start producing coronavirus vaccines– what will be the opportunity cost?

If the world manages to be able to produce billions of vaccines, who will be left to produce cancer drugs? Or antibiotics? Or the countless other life-saving drugs that people depend on?
 

WillHurtDontCare

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Vigilante

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TheCj

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I noticed here in Canada that the new's outlet has quietly updated there chart to display new cases a day vs the "Cumulative" cases they were using. When toggle it the difference is quite dramatic as can see which provinces are still getting more new cases a day vs which provinces look like they are on a downward trend. Again non of this will make the headlines until the powers that be deem it worthy.

Of course the question that no one wants to talk about is what happens when the cases go to zero.

If our "old normal" reacted and avoided millions of death's world wide, why would we need a "new normal". Will the governments have enough fear instilled to bring in mandated personal tracking of it's citizens like they are doing in China.

An example of how ridiculous these numbers are being reported is a Premier announces over 1200 total cases now in the province. When look at the break down 443 cases are infected and 805 are recovered :|

With this reporting they will report a new high of 1300 total cases with 1 new infected case and 1299 recovered cases.

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Here's the link can see the stark differences in new cases vs the misleading Cumulative cases across all of Canada.
 

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ChrisV

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I also should mention my conflict of interest. I've mentioned this before but if people start doing more things from home, I think that the implications will be historic.


My position on the lockdown is somewhat biased because I think it's going to have enormous long-term benefits.

Personally my life has never been easier. My doctor calls me, My groceries are delivered right to me, I had a mechanic come right to my house. Churches are doing teleconferences.

I dunno... I don't mind the quarantine at all. But then again I've worked from home for years.
 

pmaloneus

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I also should mention my conflict of interest. I've mentioned this before but if people start doing more things from home, I think that the implications will be historic.


My position on the lockdown is somewhat biased because I think it's going to have enormous long-term benefits.

Personally my life has never been easier. My doctor calls me, My groceries are delivered right to me, I had a mechanic come right to my house. Churches are doing teleconferences.

I dunno... I don't mind the quarantine at all. But then again I've worked from home for years.
Agreed with essentially all of what you said, but I also question what impact all this non-interaction will have on the fabric of society and connectedness, the bonds we form. Part of the reason I think the political climate is where it's at (among other things) is because of lack of connection to others.
 

GPM

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@Vigilante we are not out of the woods yet, stop being so rosey! Up here the government keeps getting bolder and bolder with their power grab. Alberta just passed some new laws which essentially gives them unlimited power if they deem it to be in the peoples good.

While the virus may still turn scary, to me what is more frightening is the extra power these government types are grabbing. Think the world changed after 911? That will be but a pleasant dream after this.

I just read that they are pushing to close the AB BC border. They are also either already doing it, or are wanting to cancel all backcountry permits. You got that right, people are no longer going to be able to legally go out into the woods by themselves... Isn't that social distancing to the extreme?
 

GIlman

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So 29% of listeners to the podcast with @Kak are from Nigeria, no prior listeners from Nigeria. What’s that about @Kak . Lol

@MJ DeMarco any idea how many FLF members are from Nigeria
 

NovaAria

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My position on the lockdown is somewhat biased because I think it's going to have enormous long-term benefits.
Exactly what I have been thinking.
Yes, the economy in its current state is hurting bad. But it always finds a way. New needs will rise and old ones will become obsolete. What pretty much everyone agrees on, right now, is that there was a before-Covid world, and there will be a post-Covid world, and the economy will change and adapt accordingly.

Just an anecdote, but I am in the electronic entertainment business (Think video games, streaming,..). I was also, just 6 months ago, eyeing a new venture. I was planning on opening my own bar in a location that had a lot of need, and no real servicing.
Well, you can guess where that bar idea went, right now. As for my other work? It's booming like no tomorrow.
I don't know when I will be going through with the bar idea, but I am seeing a lot of new opportunities now in the entertainment world. If the Social distancing "Attitude" lasts after this whole ordeal is done, I would be looking at really different numbers and projections for both ventures.
 

msufan

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You all seem to be patting yourselves on the back, saying we've got this thing under control. But remember, this is with K-12 schools closed, colleges sending students home, no major sporting events, bans on social gatherings in most states, churches closed, movie theaters and malls closed, etc. Won't we be back to square one as things open back up, particularly whenever schools resume?
 

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ChrisV

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You all seem to be patting yourselves on the back, saying we've got this thing under control. But remember, this is with K-12 schools closed, colleges sending students home, no major sporting events, bans on social gatherings in most states, churches closed, movie theaters and malls closed, etc. Won't we be back to square one as things open back up, particularly whenever schools resume?
I dont know where anyone is getting this idea that we're done. We're maybe in the second inning.
 

MJ DeMarco

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So 29% of listeners to the podcast with @Kak are from Nigeria, no prior listeners from Nigeria. What’s that about @Kak . Lol

@MJ DeMarco any idea how many FLF members are from Nigeria
Not sure, but I know TMF is a huge hit in Nigeria and can be found in your neighborhood Lagos bookstore. :)
 

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biophase

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So I just found out that I can’t go to my second home. Even homeowners that don’t reside their must leave.

I highly doubt that this is legal.

 

cmor16

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Agreed with essentially all of what you said, but I also question what impact all this non-interaction will have on the fabric of society and connectedness, the bonds we form. Part of the reason I think the political climate is where it's at (among other things) is because of lack of connection to others.
Perhaps the benefit would be an increased sense of community.
How connected are we when we are in our cars 2+ hours/day driving to and from work?
How connected are we to our families when we are away for 10+ hours/day?
I've seen more of my neighbours in the last 3 weeks than I have in the entire year that I've lived here.

I think at the very least, a hybrid option will be available to most employees who can work from home i.e. 3 days home and 2 days in the office or some variation of that.
 

GIlman

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So I just found out that I can’t go to my second home. Even homeowners that don’t reside their must leave.

I highly doubt that this is legal.

I’m sure you are going to see lots of lawsuits after this is over challenging the legality of a lot of what happened. Not that I put a lot of faith in the courts in today’s world. It’s largely a crapshoot based on the political ideology of the judge.

A similar example of this type of behavior was police seizing guns from citizens after hurricane Katrina in violation of the second amendment.
 

NovaAria

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So I just found out that I can’t go to my second home. Even homeowners that don’t reside their must leave.

I highly doubt that this is legal.

We saw something similar in China where townspeople and villagers barred their villages and didn't let any "stranger" in.
After the Red Scare, we're settling in for a Covid Scare.
 

reedracer

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I dont know where anyone is getting this idea that we're done. We're maybe in the second inning.
I think people are seeing the first peak and thinking that's it. Thre'll be more down the line.
I'm seeing huge moves to home working just in the companies my day gig works with. The shift from manufacturing to information this country has been going through the last 30 years has a silver lining.
The economy will come back. Maybe not today...
As one who has found himself unemployed 3 times during an economic downturn for periods of 1-3 years, it is tough, one has to reevaluate their value in order to get interim work, and chances are you will survive and rebuild on the other side.
 

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Kak

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I’m sure you are going to see lots of lawsuits after this is over challenging the legality of a lot of what happened. Not that I put a lot of faith in the courts in today’s world. It’s largely a crapshoot based on the political ideology of the judge.

A similar example of this type of behavior was police seizing guns from citizens after hurricane Katrina in violation of the second amendment.
Agreed! This needs to happen. There will, as usual, be a lot of this still left in place unnecessarily. Especially since a lot of it is unnecessary now.

So I was on the phone with @Vigilante yesterday... He said he was at a park with his young daughter, kicking the soccer ball around, not hurting anyone, minding their own business. A cop literally drove up and forced them to leave. The question is why? Vig said they were 400 yards from the nearest person. Way to go... Protect and serve? Nope. Traumatizing little girls... Yep.

There are also curfews at night in many places across the country... Including where I live. Why exactly does that help? I can't be in my car, alone, after midnight? Why?

@GPM is talking about not being able to go camping in the wilderness. Alone. Why?

@UnrealCreative mentioned not being able to go on a walk. Alone. Why?

The remedy stopped fitting the problem and a lot of this is terrifying. Our rights don't come from government. Freedom is a human right. Many forget that. If you have to beg for your freedoms, you aren't free. Even if you have to ask nicely, you aren't free.

That meme I posted about how the government wants everyone to stay home so they can change the batteries in the birds... While funny, it is starting to look like some alternative agendas and unnecessary seizing of power are going on.
 
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Kak

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Then, there's this... WTF?!!!!


“Land of the free, home of the brave.”

More like land of few brave subject to the heavy hand of the cowards.

“Government of the people, by the people, and for the people.”

More like, don’t question us or disobey our most nonsensical commands and orders or we will arrest you. And if you don’t go quietly, we might just shoot you.

The world will start to look like hunger games if we look the other way.
 
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James Klymus

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@UnrealCreative mentioned not being able to go on a walk. Alone. Why?
Because they said so. They're the government and they make the rules. Now go back to your room until the end of April (maybe longer) and think about what you did.

I jokingly said to one of my friends that I feel like I'm 16 again and got grounded for a month.

I will say that around me, this stay at home order has been a joke. Still plenty of traffic and lots of people out. Even at the "closed" parks and trails. By the way, how do you even close a public trail? Do we get a tax cut since most publicly funded areas are "closed"?

And don't you think its kind of ironic that the bureaucrats who are spouting off these stay at home, and "essential" businesses only orders, are not the ones who will face unemployment or having to shut down their business that they spent their life and money on?

Isn't it easy to tell someone to shut down their life's work, while you sit in a cushy government job with no risk of losing your income?

What happens when people get tired of "flattening the curve" and want to get back to their damn job/business? Or even worse, what happens when your bank account is cleaned out, and your stomach is growling, But the government says you're not allowed to go to your job?

Sit down your little non essential, and wait for us to say it's okay to get back to work.
 

MTEE1985

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So I was on the phone with @Vigilante yesterday... He said he was at a park with his young daughter, kicking the soccer ball around, not hurting anyone, minding their own business. A cop literally drove up and forced them to leave. The question is why? Vig said they were 400 yards from the nearest person. Way to go... Protect and serve? Nope. Traumatizing little girls... Yep.
Could have been worse:

 

GPM

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That is making my blood boil. Someone needs to go arrest those police officers for not following social distancing... oh wait...

WTF is this coming to?
 

GPM

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@Vigilante wow that place is packed! Good thing "the law" was there to make sure you were following the rules and keeping society safe. How do these people sleep at night? They probably actually believe that they are making the world a better place with the dumb shit they pull.
 

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