The Ukraine War, implications, outcome?

[Xeon]

Once they “take over” Kyiv, all that happens is that this will turn into a guerilla warfare. Zelensky and his guys have distributed weapons to the population.

Jesus. Guerilla warfare must NEVER happen in Ukraine. It is far worse than a conventional war because it drags across generations of people without an end in sight.

If Zelensky had surrendered on the first night of bombings, he could have prevented all the casualties these few days.

A lot of Ukranian women work as hairdressers and manicurists, the guys work in media, logistics and IT. Some have their own businesses running bakeries, clothing, grocery shops and shops selling small electrical components. See those damaged buildings and shops? Ruined infrastructure? How are they even going to rebuild that and how long will it take?

I'm not sure if Russia bombed their agricultural areas. If yes, could that have been avoided if Zelensky didn't take such a stance? You know the bomb (Putin) will explode if you cut the wire, so why did Zelensky still cut it? Because of "Slava Ukrainia"?

Zelensky giving his people guns? F*ck him.
If he wants to fight, give him the rifle and let him charge at the Russians in Kyiv. He's safely inside his bunker now and coming out once in a while for a couple minutes of photoshoot to show he's "still here".

Putin is the devil just like the West, and Zelensky himself is no better.

* I just read the news that UK wants to support a Ukranian "government in exile" to continue the fight even after Kyiv is taken by the Russians. F*** *** as well Boris.

 

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[Marigold]

Sounds like Call of Duty sold too many units.

Right?!

Hey guys, let's all give our lives for psychopathic tyrants who want more money, more power and more control and certainly DGAF about any of us....

Nah, I'm good fam. The majority of people on earth just want to get on with their lives and live their lives with the people they love.

 

[Timmy C]

Good.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1497318505066160134

View: https://twitter.com/D_Tarczynski/status/1497318505066160134?t=pXrEPeOjz2t336UeXhwK7g&s=19

 

[Black_Dragon43]

That's a retarded question. I agree with the rest of what you said but I doubt you'd be as brave as you think you are if this was currently happening in your country.

Have you gone through mandatory military service?

I never implied that I'd be as brave as that. I'd hope to, but I can't say with certainty. I was just making a statement that this view is extremely modern and would be considered cowardly and a betrayal for pretty much the entirety of human history.

You have only ONE life. Losing your life is the ULTIMATE price.

I disagree. Losing your life is not the ultimate price. The ultimate price is betraying yourself and your values because you are scared to lose your life... and then living with that betrayal.

As the proverb says, better one day as a lion than a life as a dog. It's about the quality of life rather than the quantity.

Also look at Epicurus. Death is nothing to us. You cannot experience death. You cannot experience the loss of possibilities. So what if you don't live a full life? Once you're dead, there is no one left to experience the harm done by the loss of possibilities. Harm only occurs while you're still alive.

Would you really be ready to die today and throw it all away?

I don't know - even if I weren't, that doesn't mean that it's right to be like me. I don't know if war (would depend on the cause of the war) would motivate me enough to die, but there are situations when I'd choose to die rather than live, yes.

Look at Socrates - drank the hemlock and chose death over shame and not standing up for what he believed in. It's worse, in my view, to live with the regret that you lacked the moral courage to stand up for what's right. And because he chose to die, we remember him to this day.

Jesus Christ chose to die at the hands of the Romans as well. And His influence continues to this day, having shaped the whole of human history. You are wrong about thinking that only scientists, businessmen, and so on add value to the world. Jesus Christ has arguably added more value to the course of human history than any other person. No businessman can even hope to come close. No businessman has ever inspired people - but Jesus Christ has, and continues to do so. Bill Gates will be forgotten in 2-3 generations. Nobody will know about him. Just like nobody knows about Rockefeller today.

Dying in my view is easy, it's living that is hard.

Is a guy walking at night with his girlfriend a coward and a traitor if he grabs his girlfriend and runs away from a group of thugs? Or should he perhaps stay and be f*cking sliced and diced in front of his girlfriend so that someone can later call him a (dead) hero?

Well, this case is easy. Of course he should run away. It's not the same as here, since he wouldn't be fighting for his values.

But you are right, it's a personal decision for everyone. Suffice to say that I admire the Ukrainian people who chose to stay behind and fight, even if it means death. I admire those Ukrainian guys who, stranded on the island, said "F*ck YOU" to the Russian ship who asked them to surrender, and they got bombed to smithereens. They are real men - they don't cling to their life, as if they're the center of the Universe. I admire the Buddhist monks who set themselves on fire in protest against the Chinese invasion of Tibet. I think life is very sad if you don't have things that are more important than your own life/ego.

I'm sorry but this bullshit about being a coward and a traitor is just idiotic. Your only concern should be your own life and the life of your family. The rest are made-up concepts and cultural brainwashing to convince naive young men it's cool to be a dead hero (while your parents, siblings, partner, children, and friends grieve you their entire lives).

If the whole world thought like you, we'd never be where we are today. You couldn't live the life you're living now. "Your only concern should be your own life and the life of your family" sounds like selfishness to me. Yes, selfishness is the default state... but one would hope we can fight against it, or at least try to.

If Zelensky had surrendered on the first night of bombings, he could have prevented all the casualties these few days.

The ultimate goal isn't to prevent casualties... That's not more important than saving the Ukrainian people for generations to come from tyranny. If we'd all be cowards, then Hitler would have conquered the whole world. You guys value life over everything, and I think this is a very modern view, which comes out of a deep-seated fear and too much self-concern. You're literarily telling me that you'd surrender all your values to a bully, just so that he leaves you alive. It doesn't really make sense to me. I wouldn't do that.

 

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[Simon Angel]

With all due respect, only very naive and idealistic teenagers who aren't aware how terrible war and death is can say something like that.

You have only ONE life. Losing your life is the ULTIMATE price. There's no free respawning here.

You're a young, smart, successful guy with your whole life ahead of you. Perhaps you'll lift out of poverty thousands of people around the world through your business endeavors. Perhaps you'll start a nice, big family and your children will become great scientists. Perhaps you'll start a non-profit that will solve a big problem. All of these are worth way more than being yet another casualty of war.

We don't live in a tribalistic, war-mongering world anymore. You get to choose where you want to live and NOBODY should ever be told they should throw away their lives if they can cross a border and live in peace.

Would you really be ready to die today and throw it all away? I think it's very easy to say it when your life isn't in danger.

War is not only death. It's also mangled bodies. Raped women. Children killed in front of you. You killing other people. Others trying to kill you. Never-ending anxiety and fear. Hunger. Destruction. Poverty. Atrocities.

All for what? For an idiotic conflict caused by old men who can't solve their differences like REAL men (and that's not through violence but through dialogue).

That's my big problem with patriotism and why I'm a cosmopolite. People are dying trying to protect an imaginary line on the map because someone brainwashed them it's their "duty" to sacrifice their only life so that politicians can keep enjoying their lives as they argue with each other.

If somebody wants to fight out of their own volition, let them fight. They're free to choose that.

But leave the peaceful people to decide what they want to do with their lives. They have no f*cking obligation to protect a made-up place just because luck decided that's where they were born in that period of history.



And 2-3 generations ago, if you were an atheist, they would have deemed you the devil. And 2-3 generations ago, if you hit your wife regularly, they would have deemed you a cool guy. And 2-3 generations ago in many Eastern European countries if you were an entrepreneur, they would have deemed you the worst scum on Earth. Who cares how they would judge you?

Were the Jews who fled Europe before World War 2 cowards and traitors? Or should they have all stayed to enjoy with their entire families the abominable atrocities and become yet another wiped out generation?

Is a guy walking at night with his girlfriend a coward and a traitor if he grabs his girlfriend and runs away from a group of thugs? Or should he perhaps stay and be f*cking sliced and diced in front of his girlfriend so that someone can later call him a (dead) hero?

Is a father of a family of four fleeing a war-torn country to set roots elsewhere a coward and traitor? Do you really think that his wife and kids would want him to stay behind and die? Or would they want him to go with them and be an actual father and enjoy their lives in peace somewhere else in the world? It would be selfish of him to put his country (a made-up concept where he was randomly born at that period of time) over his family (real living people who want him alive around them).

I'm sorry but this bullshit about being a coward and a traitor is just idiotic. Your only concern should be your own life and the life of your family. The rest are made-up concepts and cultural brainwashing to convince naive young men it's cool to be a dead hero (while your parents, siblings, partner, children, and friends grieve you their entire lives).

Agree wholeheartedly. I was going to reply with a video where a young man and woman, along with their child, lay massacred on the side of the road with missing limbs and lifeless eyes.

The disconnect people have with reality is unreal. I remember shooting a Glock for the first time and how humbling that shit was. It felt like my hands hurled a cannonball at the speed of light. Not at all what I expected. And certainly not something I'd ever want to go against.

 

[Simon Angel]

I never implied that I'd be as brave as that. I'd hope to, but I can't say with certainty. I was just making a statement that this view is extremely modern and would be considered cowardly and a betrayal for pretty much the entirety of human history.

Since you didn't answer my question on mandatory military service, I assume you didn't go. So there's a huge likelihood you never held a weapon in your hand nor been ordered to do something you know is the wrong move against your will.

Imagine being forced to dodge bullets for someone else's agenda while being smarter than them and knowing it's going to lead to ruin anyway. You catch a stray and there's your whole life - gone. How noble.

If the whole world thought like you, we'd never be where we are today. You couldn't live the life you're living now. "Your only concern should be your own life and the life of your family" sounds like selfishness to me. Yes, selfishness is the default state... but one would hope we can fight against it, or at least try to.

If the whole world didn't think like him back in the day we'd all be dead, lmao. Our ultimate goal as a species is to survive and procreate, everything else is extra (and we have a lot of extra in today's world).

 

[Black_Dragon43]

Since you didn't answer my question on mandatory military service, I assume you didn't go. So there's a huge likelihood you never held a weapon in your hand nor been ordered to do something you know is the wrong move against your will.

I did have shooting training, there is no mandatory military training here though. I've shot pistols, glocks, makarovs, M14s, M16s, Kalashnikovs.

Yes, of course the first time you do it it's scary, but you've got to fight that fear. Over time you get used to it, as to anything else, if you don't shy away from it.

There are a couple of good shooting ranges around here, where they have a lot of weapons. For some weapons, you need more than just regular training to be able to shoot... Sniper rifles are like that, which I've never shot. Apparently those can travel really far, and it's very dangerous to make mistakes. But I've seen people shoot them.
(As an interesting story, we did have at the biggest shooting range here one student who took a pistol and was shooting the targets, and then turned around and shot the instructor in the head, before being killed by those who were watching... so all sorts of accidents can happen, it's not 100% safe. It was a big incident at the time)

Now I have never been in the military, as I have said, there is no mandatory military time here.

If the whole world didn't think like him back in the day we'd all be dead, lmao. Our ultimate goal as a species is to survive and procreate, everything else is extra (and we have a lot of extra in today's world).

How is that different from the animals haha? You'd hope that human life is about more than just survival.

 

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[Simon Angel]

How is that different from the animals haha? You'd hope that human life is about more than just survival.

Yeah, it should be. But without survival, there is no human life. You can't do anything "more" unless you survive first. I think that's why people are getting pissed at you in this thread.

 

[Black_Dragon43]

Yeah, it should be. But without survival, there is no human life. You can't do anything "more" unless you survive first. I think that's why people are getting pissed at you in this thread.

Sure, survival is important. I'm not saying it's not. But I don't think surviving as a slave is necessarily better than dying as fighting for your freedom. It's very contextual though so there isn't an iron-clad general rule. Reason being that surviving as a slave is no life at all...

 

[woken]

Guys. Stop arguing over who’s right and who’s not.

We all know war is not the answer. You must acknowledge that there’s not much we can do here.

Sure, there’s different opinions on how one should’ve handled things but that always leads to disagreement.

Stop arguing like it’s going to make a difference. There’s people actually dying and suffering, people that fled their homes and yet you still want to impose your views on the other one?

Pray for victims from both sides, help in any way you can.

 

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[Kevin88660]

The richest Ukrainians with multiple passports have already left the country.

Asking civilians without training to fight against armed professionals is suicidal. Many Russian soldiers had real combat experience in Syria. Now we know the battle hardened Chechens are coming into Kiev.

The only consequences is that Russian soldiers will view civilians with suspicion and will shoot first then to be sorry. Right now Russian soldiers are having a lot of restraint because the civilians pose no danger to them.

The only evil intention of a politician to encourage such behavior is to score political points when Russian soldiers killed the civilians.

If you want to risk your life, make sure you fight for yourself. Don't get made use as a pawn.

Russian forces can annihilate the entire Ukraine resistance much faster than current pace, and they are only doing it slowly now to cause less damage before they can reach a ceasefire deal.

Most people are delusional when they think the reason why Kiev isn't gone within 36 hours is because of the sporadic resistance outside the city.

The Russians force is pushing at current pace because they make sure they give the enemy the option to surrender first, and delivering the message over, and by doing so you actually expose yourself and put yourself in danger. In no other wars you see this. Go check on the snake island video, any other offensive country would have launched the bombardment first.

A truly offensive force wants the defendant to be killed before they even realized they have been attacked. Both parties are wearing uniform and there is nothing wrong with that conventional way in a war.

If you cannot change the outcome, at least you can protect yourself. Most civilians don't care who wins and just want the war to be over.

 

[Black_Dragon43]

Russian forces can annihilate the entire Ukraine resistance much faster than current pace, and they are only doing it slowly now to cause less damage before they can reach a ceasefire deal.

I am very doubtful of this. Putin was exceedingly angry yesterday, and it's obvious he expected Zelensky to run away to the West, so he could claim victory and put his own puppet government in place saying "Look, look, see, he betrayed you, he's a Western agent"

But the Ukrainians are opposing resistance, and Russia has no hope to control Ukraine in my opinion. They cannot annihilate the entire Ukraine resistance without causing genocide and ensuring that Ukraine will NEVER accept Russian influence again + triggering the online community to basically destroy Russia economically.

Russia is already a pariah state at this point, just like North Korea at this moment. Continuing this invasion will mean further isolation from everyone, except countries like China, Vietnam, Singapore, North Korea, Iran, Turkey. I think Putin has already failed. And his regime is now on shaky grounds.

Those Ukrainian civilians are much tougher than expected, AND Ukraine has 200K military men, ammunition and supplies from the West, the support of the international community with the Americans and Israel ready to intervene to save Zelensky if needed.

Ukrainians should oppose maximum resistence.

The Russians force is pushing at current pace because they make sure they give the enemy the option to surrender first, and delivering the message over, and by doing so you actually expose yourself and put yourself in danger. In no other wars you see this. Go check on the snake island video, any other offensive country would have launched the bombardment first.

LOL! Of course they ask them to surrender, and you ALWAYS see this. First of all it's enjoyment for the dominant party. THey're playing with you. Because they know you have no chance of opposing resistence. This isn't out of compassion or because they care about them and want to give them the option to surrender. It's because they want to rub salt in the wound and humiliate them. Break their souls.

 

[Kevin88660]

I am very doubtful of this. Putin was exceedingly angry yesterday, and it's obvious he expected Zelensky to run away to the West, so he could claim victory and put his own puppet government in place saying "Look, look, see, he betrayed you, he's a Western agent"

But the Ukrainians are opposing resistance, and Russia has no hope to control Ukraine in my opinion. They cannot annihilate the entire Ukraine resistance without causing genocide and ensuring that Ukraine will NEVER accept Russian influence again + triggering the online community to basically destroy Russia economically.

Russia is already a pariah state at this point, just like North Korea at this moment. Continuing this invasion will mean further isolation from everyone, except countries like China, Vietnam, Singapore, North Korea, Iran, Turkey. I think Putin has already failed. And his regime is now on shaky grounds.

Those Ukrainian civilians are much tougher than expected, AND Ukraine has 200K military men, ammunition and supplies from the West, the support of the international community with the Americans and Israel ready to intervene to save Zelensky if needed.

Ukrainians should oppose maximum resistence.


LOL! Of course they ask them to surrender, and you ALWAYS see this. First of all it's enjoyment for the dominant party. THey're playing with you. Because they know you have no chance of opposing resistence. This isn't out of compassion or because they care about them and want to give them the option to surrender. It's because they want to rub salt in the wound and humiliate them. Break their souls.

There is a video about a Ukrainian solider guarding a bridge. He has fired less than 16 rounds in his life.

The Ukrainian people do not like Putin, but they don't like their own government either. There is no motivation to give maximum resistance. Even before the war many young people want to move abroad to get better wage, living standard and escaping from corruption.

If people have so much enthusiasm putting up armed resistance, why bother restricting men from age 18-60 leaving the country?

They are trapped in a war, but it is not "their war".

Biden wants to Russian oil. Germany wants it too. The Russian elites' money and yacht are in Western European cities and London. And you expect ordinary boys living in a poor country of 3k per cap gdp, risking their lives and never seeing their families again, to fight for border lines and national sovereignty?

Parts of Ukraine actually welcome joining Russia aside from language affinity Russia can provide much more welfare in comparison(3x pdg per cap). Change your passport and you get low cost meat, better education and healthcare.

Putin has supporters because has been able to transform the energy revenue into state welfare and buy their loyalty. Putin's opponents are losing at the moment because they "cannot put money on the table". Aside from the Ukrainian nationalists who are scared of being charged in court and labelled as "Nazi" under Russian occupation, nobody has really any incentive to pay the prize to oppose Putin.

There is just no money on the table, and hence all talk.

Eventually Putin leadership will be under crisis in the long run because the world is moving towards electric vehicle, and hence erode his ability to buy internal support with oil money. And his support comes from older rural population so time is not on his side in the long run.

 

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[Hadrian]

I did have shooting training, there is no mandatory military training here though. I've shot pistols, glocks, makarovs, M14s, M16s, Kalashnikovs.

Yes, of course the first time you do it it's scary, but you've got to fight that fear. Over time you get used to it, as to anything else, if you don't shy away from it.

There are a couple of good shooting ranges around here, where they have a lot of weapons. For some weapons, you need more than just regular training to be able to shoot... Sniper rifles are like that, which I've never shot. Apparently those can travel really far, and it's very dangerous to make mistakes. But I've seen people shoot them.
(As an interesting story, we did have at the biggest shooting range here one student who took a pistol and was shooting the targets, and then turned around and shot the instructor in the head, before being killed by those who were watching... so all sorts of accidents can happen, it's not 100% safe. It was a big incident at the time)

Now I have never been in the military, as I have said, there is no mandatory military time here.


How is that different from the animals haha? You'd hope that human life is about more than just survival.

The second largest country in Europe is under invasion by a fascist dictator who wants to install a BRUTAL puppet regime as he has done in several other satellite states.. The time for talking is OVER my fellow keyboard Warriors...

The French just seized a Russian ship and this is only the beginning...

Lets hope for the best but prepare for the worst.

Black Dragon what was your experience PM me privately if you wish... as I'm looking at a few traing sites here and in Lithuania.

This real life game of "Risk" has begun... and yes I'm scared shitless!

 

[Deleted70138]

Here's a satire:

I have a friend who paid $8000 in order to have a guy make legal documents for him to get US visa in Kyiv. He flew there couple of weeks ago and yesterday he moved in underground bunker, sleeping on a bed made of fire hoses.

 

[Antti]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1497537193346220038

This is huge if true but as usual you have to be very skeptical. Hopefully this is true.

 

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[Kaan Gullu]

it's not her fault, but I would still like to see her carry something to defend herself with.

It does no good to watch someone being raped and say "hey don't worry, at least it's not your fault."

If a burglar breaks into my house and murders me, it's their fault. But I still want to be prepared, because I like being alive.

That's a pretty disgusting statement. Its never a woman's fault in ANY capacity if they get raped by a man. The decision is entirely the fault of the man choosing to do so. Why should women have to go around in fear with things to defend themselves and succumb to oh well a man might rape me let me be prepared just in case. Why are we focusing on that? Why not focus on educating the men to not do that vile act in the first place? Women shouldn't have to live in constant fear and defence and prepping themselves for a potential attack. We're not F*cking animals or hostile threats we're human beings who have the capacity for self control. Also, it doesn't matter how skimpy a woman is dressed thats not an invitation or right granted to men to go and violate and traumatise her simply because she looked revealing

 

[MitchC]

That's a pretty disgusting statement. Its never a woman's fault in ANY capacity if they get raped by a man. The decision is entirely the fault of the man choosing to do so. Why should women have to go around in fear with things to defend themselves and succumb to oh well a man might rape me let me be prepared just in case. Why are we focusing on that? Why not focus on educating the men to not do that vile act in the first place? Women shouldn't have to live in constant fear and defence and prepping themselves for a potential attack. We're not f*cking animals or hostile threats we're human beings who have the capacity for self control. Also, it doesn't matter how skimpy a woman is dressed thats not an invitation or right granted to men to go and violate and traumatise her simply because she looked revealing

This is the sort of dumb idealistic thinking that lead to the west being so weak.

People shouldn’t invade countries, Rob people, rape people, but the thing is, in the real world they do, however it’s a small percentage of people, a tiny percentage, a percentage that cannot be fixed with your stupid “don’t rape someone it’s bad” speech, most people are good, so how about we give those good people the option to defend themselves if and when this happens.

 

[kristkaa]

Jesus. Guerilla warfare must NEVER happen in Ukraine. It is far worse than a conventional war because it drags across generations of people without an end in sight.

If Zelensky had surrendered on the first night of bombings, he could have prevented all the casualties these few days.

A lot of Ukranian women work as hairdressers and manicurists, the guys work in media, logistics and IT. Some have their own businesses running bakeries, clothing, grocery shops and shops selling small electrical components. See those damaged buildings and shops? Ruined infrastructure? How are they even going to rebuild that and how long will it take?

I'm not sure if Russia bombed their agricultural areas. If yes, could that have been avoided if Zelensky didn't take such a stance? You know the bomb (Putin) will explode if you cut the wire, so why did Zelensky still cut it? Because of "Slava Ukrainia"?

Zelensky giving his people guns? f*ck him.
If he wants to fight, give him the rifle and let him charge at the Russians in Kyiv. He's safely inside his bunker now and coming out once in a while for a couple minutes of photoshoot to show he's "still here".

Putin is the devil just like the West, and Zelensky himself is no better.

* I just read the news that UK wants to support a Ukranian "government in exile" to continue the fight even after Kyiv is taken by the Russians. F*** *** as well Boris.

Don't know what is right or wrong, but just wanted to remind you that surrendering to russians could easily mean mass killings, deportations, living under fear. That's been their way to force obedience in the past.

 

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[Marigold]

"Putin is furious. He thought that the whole war would be easy."

"Putin's lair"

Honestly.

Does anyone take this seriously? Jesus Henry Kissinger

 

[Hadrian]

https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/t1aakn
This is basically President of Ukraine saying "we are all here with our troops". It appears he is in Kyiv.

"I need ammunition, not a ride."

Quote from President Zelensky from Kyiv, when the US offered to evacuate him.

 

[MTF]

I apologize for stupidly contributing to the needless conversation on what is right or wrong. I shouldn't have lost my temper. This isn't the place and time for it.

Just got back from a shopping center where I bought food and medical supplies to be sent in a military convoy tomorrow to Ukraine. At 1:30 pm, most shelves with dry goods were already empty. In the pharmacy, the pharmacist already had various supplies set aside that would be most useful. You only needed to tell how much you wanted to contribute and they prepared a medical supply bag for you.

It was heartwarming to see how much was already donated. And that's just one place in one city.

Over 100,000 refugees are already in Poland with thousands more waiting at the border. Both those who are here as well as those left in Ukraine need support.

All refugees can enter the country, even without any documents and even with their pets. Many businesses and organizations offer help. For example, one of the biggest train transport companies in Poland offers free tickets to anyone with an Ukrainian passport. There's even a special train from Ukraine to Poland transporting people who need medical care. Some private hospitals and clinics offer free medical care. Many small businesses offer jobs to people from Ukraine, free services or even temporary shelter. Then there are also individuals offering free transport, a place to stay, etc.

I'm now coordinating gathering clothes, blankets, towels, food and other supplies from friends and family to be donated to the refugees who are already in Poland. Looks like I'll have a full SUV of stuff already.

How You Can Help

If you have no idea what to do, here are a few options:

1. Send money to Ukraine's Armed Forces:

NBU Opens Special Account to Raise Funds for Ukraine’s Armed Forces (updated)

The National Bank of Ukraine has decided to open a special fundraising account to support the Armed Forces of Ukraine. The central bank’s decision comes after the Ukrainian gove...

bank.gov.ua

2. Support Sunflower of Peace, an organization sending first aid medical tactical backpacks to Ukraine from the US:

Sunflower of Peace | Newton MA

Sunflower of Peace, Newton, Massachusetts. 9,504 likes · 43 talking about this · 32 were here. Sunflower of Peace is a 501(c)(3) non-profit (EIN: 47-2620675), based in Boston, MA.

www.facebook.com

The first shipment to Ukraine is leaving the US on Wed, 03/02/22 so if you act now it'll be there next week saving lives.

3. Donate to the International Rescue Committee to help provide emergency kits, medical care and temporary shelter (they're on the ground in Poland):

Help families impacted by the war in Ukraine.

The International Rescue Committee helps people caught in the world's worst disasters to survive, recover and regain control of their future.

help.rescue.org

4. Support the Kyiv Independent for independent news and their fight against Russian misinformation:

The Kyiv Independent — News from Ukraine, Eastern Europe

News, analyses, investigations, opinions, podcasts and more. On-the-ground reporting from Ukraine

kyivindependent.com

5. Google "how to help Ukraine" and pick whatever appeals most to you. This isn't about choosing the "right" option, just help however you can.

 

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[Guest-5ty5s4]

Wild theory: they didn't get enough people to take their covid shot so now it's back to good old population culling; war.

more realistic theory: a bunch of our current world leaders are bumbling idiots who totally botched the diplomacy and care of this international issue, paving the way for Putin to just go do whatever he wants...

I have been following this one: https://twitter.com/i/lists/1174203958044348418

Ok, now I* get what @thechosen1 meant when he said DJT's response would be different during war times if he was the POTUS:


View attachment 42328







View attachment 42329

*Not American and not pro/anti trump.

thank you. I know he is a firebrand and he acts childish but I also know he was a better deterrent to the dictators and Napoleons of the world.

 

[Guest-5ty5s4]

That's a pretty disgusting statement. Its never a woman's fault in ANY capacity if they get raped by a man. The decision is entirely the fault of the man choosing to do so. Why should women have to go around in fear with things to defend themselves and succumb to oh well a man might rape me let me be prepared just in case. Why are we focusing on that? Why not focus on educating the men to not do that vile act in the first place? Women shouldn't have to live in constant fear and defence and prepping themselves for a potential attack. We're not f*cking animals or hostile threats we're human beings who have the capacity for self control. Also, it doesn't matter how skimpy a woman is dressed thats not an invitation or right granted to men to go and violate and traumatise her simply because she looked revealing

I literally said it is never the victim’s fault.

It is always the attacker’s fault.

Still, I would like to shoot back.

You straw manned me. Went for the lowest common denominator of thought without considering what was actually said.

It is never the victim’s fault. That does not mean that defending yourself is wrong.

 

[Hadrian]

I apologize for stupidly contributing to the needless conversation on what is right or wrong. I shouldn't have lost my temper. This isn't the place and time for it.

No need to apologise and than you for posting those links. I have contributed to them all. This thread has certainly shown up the full spectrum of human character... from the heartfelt but over-zealous to the capitulating thought process of the coward, and everything in between. Would be interesting to do a geographical analysis of all commentators.
I'll probably stop posting myself soon enough and start taking action.
Putin's war on Europe must be halted and reversed!

 

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[Lared]

I've read that the Ukraine leader closed newspapers who were talking about him and locked up his competitors and who knows, maybe he killed a few people himself. Everyone's saying we are fighting democracy but Ukraine doesn't sound much like a democracy if that is true.

Imagine Biden locking up Trump and shutting down Fox News because they were on the right.

Italian government and newspapers explained UE is not sending troops because Ukraine is not part the of NATO, the west line pursues to hurt Russia with financial sanctions.. Nevertheless italian troops still set on NATO borders in Romania and Belarus since 2014..
This morning I read most of Italian servers set in Ukraine, many agencies worry for cyber attacks..
I don't know what to think, just scared by war, I reject at all. Even in case of low Ukrainian democracy, I don't think war may be the solution

 

[Andreas Thiel]

That's a pretty disgusting statement. Its never a woman's fault in ANY capacity if they get raped by a man. The decision is entirely the fault of the man choosing to do so. Why should women have to go around in fear with things to defend themselves and succumb to oh well a man might rape me let me be prepared just in case. Why are we focusing on that? Why not focus on educating the men to not do that vile act in the first place? Women shouldn't have to live in constant fear and defence and prepping themselves for a potential attack. We're not f*cking animals or hostile threats we're human beings who have the capacity for self control. Also, it doesn't matter how skimpy a woman is dressed thats not an invitation or right granted to men to go and violate and traumatise her simply because she looked revealing

Wished one could downvote morons like you into oblivion.

 

[Simon Angel]

No need to apologise and than you for posting those links. I have contributed to them all. This thread has certainly shown up the full spectrum of human character... from the heartfelt but over-zealous to the futile thought process of the coward, and everything in between. Would be interesting to do a geographical analysis of all commentators.
I'll probably stop posting myself soon enough and start taking action.
Putin's war on Europe must be halted and reversed!

Here's your geographical analysis:

The "cowards" you refer to are all near a warzone and in immediate danger while you, one of the "heartfelt", are 3000 kilometers away from any such threat.

 

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[Hadrian]

The most ardent posters here seem to be Europeans who are calling for action on all fronts, military and humanitarian.
FYI in case of a genuine misunderstanding I wasn't condemning debate on the background to the conflict, rather those who think they should give up their democracy without a fight. That is the definition of a coward.

Perhaps people should display their country as MJ requested...

Putin's war on Europe must be halted and reversed!

 

[Simon Angel]

The most ardent posters here seem to be Europeans who are calling for action on all fronts military and humanitarian. Perhaps you could show us your country as MJ requested and maybe we can see if you're justified in being so triggered?
Putin's war on Europe must be halted and reversed!

I'm not talking about the others, I'm talking about you. You're sitting in F*cking Ireland of all places acting high and mighty and passively calling out people who are thinking about survival "cowards". Get real.

I'm in Bulgaria and the other person that you likely classified as a "coward" is in Poland. The only reason Putin hasn't landed to shore here is because we're in NATO - our relations with Russia are poor at best. But if another European country joins this war, none of this would matter and he'd occupy us overnight.