Sharing my lifetime experience in export/import. Product sourcing specialist.

[stealth09]

Although you don't have to get FDA approval for cosmetics there are still rules that you should check out here: You should read the whole article. In particular take note of references to color additives.

Provided you comply with those rules there shouldn't be any problem importing the product.

Walter

Thanks for the reply. Is there an article link?

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Walter Hay]

Thanks for the reply. Is there an article link?

Sorry, I forgot to include it. so here it is: http://www.fda.gov/Cosmetics/GuidanceRegulation/LawsRegulations/ucm074162.htm

Walter

 

[petkovic]

Walter,

I found an electrical product where the supplier gave me an EC Declaration of Conformity issued by Hong Kong Standards and Testing Centre (www.stc-group.org). Do you happen to know if they are trustworthy or how I can find out?

Thanks,
Michael

 

[petkovic]

Also, I got invoiced for samples and they want me to pay T/T.
I found out that there are three types of payment instructions: BEN, OUR, SHA(RE)

I learned that
- BEN means the beneficiary pays all bank charges
- OUR means I pay all bank charges
- SHARE means I pay the charges from my bank and the beneficiary pays the charges from his bank

I would transfer using SHARE but I'm concerned that they expect me to transfer using OUR and that we need to make another transfer. What is the usual way to do it?

Thanks,
Michael

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Walter Hay]

[

Also, I got invoiced for samples and they want me to pay T/T.
I found out that there are three types of payment instructions: BEN, OUR, SHA(RE)

I learned that
- BEN means the beneficiary pays all bank charges
- OUR means I pay all bank charges
- SHARE means I pay the charges from my bank and the beneficiary pays the charges from his bank

I would transfer using SHARE but I'm concerned that they expect me to transfer using OUR and that we need to make another transfer. What is the usual way to do it?

Thanks,
Michael

Walter,

I found an electrical product where the supplier gave me an EC Declaration of Conformity issued by Hong Kong Standards and Testing Centre (www.stc-group.org). Do you happen to know if they are trustworthy or how I can find out?

Thanks,
Michael

STC are an authentic testing laboratory and their Certificates should be acceptable anywhere.

Regarding T/T payment, it is most common to share the cost.

Walter

 

[petkovic]

Thank you, Walter!

 

[Money Talks]

Walter,

I have tried to negotiate FOB terms with my supplier, but they are sticking to EXW. Well, kind of. They have come back to me with new EXW terms which now include loading at their factory and carriage to the port, nothing else. They have also increased the price significantly: they are charging over 1000$ for this service! So I think I’m better off sticking to the initial EXW terms.

I have contacted a couple of local forwarders, but they don’t handle EXW shipments from China. I’m thinking of trying with a Chinese forwarder. I know you advise against using them, but there must be some reputable ones out there, don’t you think? What should I do, Walter?

Thanks.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Walter Hay]

Walter,

I have tried to negotiate FOB terms with my supplier, but they are sticking to EXW. Well, kind of. They have come back to me with new EXW terms which now include loading at their factory and carriage to the port, nothing else. They have also increased the price significantly: they are charging over 1000$ for this service! So I think I’m better off sticking to the initial EXW terms.

I have contacted a couple of local forwarders, but they don’t handle EXW shipments from China. I’m thinking of trying with a Chinese forwarder. I know you advise against using them, but there must be some reputable ones out there, don’t you think? What should I do, Walter?

Thanks.

I suggest www.mychinafreight.com/ They generally have quite a good reputation, but one of my book readers reported that their quote was high.

I would certainly accept their EXW terms. That charge is outrageous. Any EU forwarder should be able to handle the shipment.

Walter
EDIT: 5/11/2018 This was based on several good reports from members, but recent reports contradict those earlier ones, so I now cann't recommend this company.

 

[Money Talks]

Thank you, Walter. I'll keep searching for a forwarder and will definitely ask the one you suggest for a quote.

 

[Roli]

Dear Walter,

Thank you for starting this thread, it has inspired me to finally do what I've been itching to do for a while now; and just get out there and source some product to sell.

I have been attempting to follow your instructions to the letter, I am at a very early stage, I believe I have found 3 manufacturers who can supply the product I want. At the moment I am looking for 3 more; however I wanted to ask about pricing in particular.

If a company puts a price per piece, say $1-$3 fob; does that mean they are including transit to the airport/docks?

Thanks again.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Walter Hay]

Dear Walter,

Thank you for starting this thread, it has inspired me to finally do what I've been itching to do for a while now; and just get out there and source some product to sell.

I have been attempting to follow your instructions to the letter, I am at a very early stage, I believe I have found 3 manufacturers who can supply the product I want. At the moment I am looking for 3 more; however I wanted to ask about pricing in particular.

If a company puts a price per piece, say $1-$3 fob; does that mean they are including transit to the airport/docks?

Thanks again.

Strictly speaking FOB relates only to sea freight, and means delivery to the point where the cargo passes over the ship's railing. The term FOB is often misused, particularly in China, and sometimes they mean delivered to transport at their loading dock. Because of this you need to ask them what is the FOB point.

The term is often incorrectly used for air transport and usually in that case it will mean delivered to the airport, but not including loading on board the aircraft.

If the cargo is being shipped by Air Courier, that term should be door to door Air Courier, but the supplier quoting "FOB" might only be meaning delivered to the courier at the supplier's loading dock.

FOB quotes mean that you are responsible for arranging the transport, including outwards Customs documentation. To handle shipment arrangements when that is not being done for you by the supplier, you should get quotes from your nearest freight forwarders. The quotes should include all charges to your door other than Duty and Taxes. To get quotes you will need package sizes and weight, quantity of packages, and description of the goods.

Walter

 

[Roli]

Strictly speaking FOB relates only to sea freight, and means delivery to the point where the cargo passes over the ship's railing. The term FOB is often misused, particularly in China, and sometimes they mean delivered to transport at their loading dock. Because of this you need to ask them what is the FOB point.

The term is often incorrectly used for air transport and usually in that case it will mean delivered to the airport, but not including loading on board the aircraft.

If the cargo is being shipped by Air Courier, that term should be door to door Air Courier, but the supplier quoting "FOB" might only be meaning delivered to the courier at the supplier's loading dock.

FOB quotes mean that you are responsible for arranging the transport, including outwards Customs documentation. To handle shipment arrangements when that is not being done for you by the supplier, you should get quotes from your nearest freight forwarders. The quotes should include all charges to your door other than Duty and Taxes. To get quotes you will need package sizes and weight, quantity of packages, and description of the goods.

Walter

Thanks Walter for this info; and I'm assuming from earlier advice I've read from you, that if they say their sample size is 1 or similarly small; I should ask them for an international air courier quote?

Also I have another question; an audited supplier I have sourced via a reputable site is showing a product at $0.03 with a 5000 MOQ. In your opinion, is this just bait and switch; a technical glitch; or a legitimate offer?

Thanks

 

[Walter Hay]

Thanks Walter for this info; and I'm assuming from earlier advice I've read from you, that if they say their sample size is 1 or similarly small; I should ask them for an international air courier quote?

Also I have another question; an audited supplier I have sourced via a reputable site is showing a product at $0.03 with a 5000 MOQ. In your opinion, is this just bait and switch; a technical glitch; or a legitimate offer?

Thanks

Yes, air courier is the way to go, unless they will ship via EMS. It's worth asking. It's not quite as fast, but has tracking and for some weights or sizes it can cost less. The supplier will usually be able to get a better freight cost than you could yourself.

I can't comment on that advertised price without knowing what the product is, but bait and switch is common, and so are technical glitches. Don't ignore something because the price seems too low. Unless you know something about cost of manufacture in China, you can't imagine how low a genuine price can sometimes be.

Walter

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[steelandchrome]

Just bought your book @Walter Hay gotta get reading and pick a product

 

[Roli]

Yes, air courier is the way to go, unless they will ship via EMS. It's worth asking. It's not quite as fast, but has tracking and for some weights or sizes it can cost less. The supplier will usually be able to get a better freight cost than you could yourself.

I can't comment on that advertised price without knowing what the product is, but bait and switch is common, and so are technical glitches. Don't ignore something because the price seems too low. Unless you know something about cost of manufacture in China, you can't imagine how low a genuine price can sometimes be.

Walter

Thanks Walter, I will ask about EMS, and also I'll enquire about the product, if it is genuine and the quality is there (hmm) then it's worth at least a sample, as it will be relatively low cost to get them delivered.

 

[Walter Hay]

Just bought your book @Walter Hay gotta get reading and pick a product

Best wishes. I hope it works for you.

Just a note that my book gives only a little help in choosing a product, so you might look for advice on that subject with experts in that field.

Once you do make that choice, my book can guide you through the sourcing and importing part, although it does provide some suggestions on where and how to look for unique products.

Walter

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Roli]

Best wishes. I hope it works for you.

Just a note that my book gives only a little help in choosing a product, so you might look for advice on that subject with experts in that field.

Once you do make that choice, my book can guide you through the sourcing and importing part, although it does provide some suggestions on where and how to look for unique products.

Walter

Thanks Walter, I have been taking advice on choosing product elsewhere, in fact I bought the PAC course on your recommendation I believe I've found the right product, hopefully as I go through all of the steps that remains so.

Rather than clog up this particular thread, as I thought I might start to go off topic, I've started a progress thread on the inside, any comments are most welcome :-D

 

[Walter Hay]

Thanks Walter, I have been taking advice on choosing product elsewhere, in fact I bought the PAC course on your recommendation I believe I've found the right product, hopefully as I go through all of the steps that remains so.

Rather than clog up this particular thread, as I thought I might start to go off topic, I've started a progress thread on the inside, any comments are most welcome :-D

Thanks @Roli. I look forward to reading about your progress.

If anyone else thinks they might look at PAC, they could contact me for a discount link. (I don't think I should post it here.) Because it costs me to use Jim Cockrum's paid support team for my book buyers, he allows me to offer a discount on PAC, and the small commission he pays me offsets some of my support expenses.

Walter

 

[Walter Hay]

DON'T KEEP ALL YOUR EGGS IN ONE BASKET

My experience with a great supplier could be helpful to many of my readers.

When I was running my importing business until I sold out a few years back, I had a wonderful supplier that produced around 50% of the products bought by me and my franchisees.

It was a great relationship,and I had often visited them. The owner always personally picked me up at the airport and treated me like royalty. The product quality was exceptionally good and service was excellent.

Suddenly it all went pear shaped!

Orders were late. Emails and phone calls resulted in vague stories. Franchisees were getting restless. I caught the first possible flight and this time arrived unannounced.

I was received courteously as usual and later in the day was treated to a grand feast, but on my walk through the factory I could see the cause of the problem. They were flat out producing a massive order for a major international brand. Everything else had to wait. Their prize new customer had placed an order worth millions, and they were only holding orders worth a little under 1/2 million from our franchisees.

I diplomatically applied what little pressure I could exert under the circumstances, and finally told the owner that I would not go home until I could see our orders all being packed. For the rest of that week I went to the factory every day, dined with the owner in the factory's huge dining room and one by one ticked off the orders being prepared for shipment. Under pressure he had put aside one of his production lines for us.

I arranged with my franchisees to cancel the most recent orders that the supplier had not even begun to deal with, and send them to alternative suppliers we had been using for some time. I took time out from my boring days in the office and factory so that I could personally assure those other suppliers that this was just the beginning of a much expanded business relationship with them.

Just imagine the situation if I had not had the foresight to use several suppliers. My business empire would have collapsed overnight.

The moral of the story - Always be sure you have backup suppliers.

Walter
P.S. Our former supplier had put all his eggs in one basket, and is no longer in business. It is equally as risky to rely on one customer as it is to rely on one supplier.

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[j0hnh0ck3y]

Thanks @Roli. I look forward to reading about your progress.

If anyone else thinks they might look at PAC, they could contact me for a discount link. (I don't think I should post it here.) Because it costs me to use Jim Cockrum's paid support team for my book buyers, he allows me to offer a discount on PAC, and the small commission he pays me offsets some of my support expenses.

Walter

Walter, Could you please send me a PM with the discount link?
Thanks,
John

 

[Walter Hay]

Walter, Could you please send me a PM with the discount link?
Thanks,
John

On its way. For those who don't know, PAC also includes a free copy of my book with permanent free updates.

Walter

 

[Roli]

On its way. For those who don't know, PAC also includes a free copy of my book with permanent free updates.

Walter

Hi Walter,

Thanks for the advice thus far, just a quick question; I notice that you are a stickler for getting full quotes in writing; is an email quote satisfactory? Or should it be on a headed .pdf; or even faxed?

Thanks
Roli

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Walter Hay]

Hi Walter,

Thanks for the advice thus far, just a quick question; I notice that you are a stickler for getting full quotes in writing; is an email quote satisfactory? Or should it be on a headed .pdf; or even faxed?

Thanks
Roli

@Roli, Emails are even accepted these days in most legal processes, so I would be happy to receive quotes via email and regard them as binding.

Some people still use faxes, but most who do so use the internet for their faxes, so the advantage of a fax via a telephone connection is lost.

Walter

 

[Roli]

@Roli, Emails are even accepted these days in most legal processes, so I would be happy to receive quotes via email and regard them as binding.

Some people still use faxes, but most who do so use the internet for their faxes, so the advantage of a fax via a telephone connection is lost.

Walter

Cool that's what I thought, but it's always good to check

 

[Walter Hay]

CHINESE NEW YEAR ALERT!

27th January 2017. If you want orders delivered before China goes crazy to celebrate the Chinese New Year, place them urgently NOW. Orders placed in early December just might be delivered before the country shuts down

For several weeks before and at least a month after that Jan 27, dealing with businesses in China can become an exercise in frustration and futility.

Even if you don't need to place orders at this time, don't forget to send greetings to your suppliers or potential suppliers. Send them about a week ahead of the holiday.

Walter

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[Roli]

CHINESE NEW YEAR ALERT!

27th January 2017. If you want orders delivered before China goes crazy to celebrate the Chinese New Year, place them urgently NOW. Orders placed in early December just might be delivered before the country shuts down

For several weeks before and at least a month after that Jan 27, dealing with businesses in China can become an exercise in frustration and futility.

Even if you don't need to place orders at this time, don't forget to send greetings to your suppliers or potential suppliers. Send them about a week ahead of the holiday.

Walter

Golden information as always Walter, thank you.

Roli

 

[Mac]

Hey Walter, I'm about to place my first order. Your book has helped a lot.

This is what one of the suppliers has quoted me for freight. He didn't quote FOB, simply gave me this quote in terms of freight:
Take 6 to 15 days delivery to Canada by DHL/UPS express freight: $625 USD. Would I still need a freight forwarder with this method of freight? This is for 500 Pcs.

Thank you,
Mac.

 

[Walter Hay]

Hey Walter, I'm about to place my first order. Your book has helped a lot.

This is what one of the suppliers has quoted me for freight. He didn't quote FOB, simply gave me this quote in terms of freight:
Take 6 to 15 days delivery to Canada by DHL/UPS express freight: $625 USD. Would I still need a freight forwarder with this method of freight? This is for 500 Pcs.

Thank you,
Mac.

You would need to ask the supplier is this a door to door air courier delivery. If so, DHL or UPS will handle customs clearance for you, and you should have nothing to do but pay any duty or taxes they pay on your behalf, and the goods will be delivered to you. 6 to 15 days is a bit longer than usual air courier times, although I think they are quoting air courier but just playing it safe regarding delivery time.

Sometimes the courier will charge you an additional fee for handling the clearance but it should be included in any door to door service.

If in the unlikely event that it is actually air freight, as opposed to air courier, yes, you would need to use a freight forwarder, but they should organize everything from point of pickup at your supplier's premises to delivery at your address. Forget DHL or UPS for that. You shouldn't use DHL or UPS for only part of the service, which is what air freight entails. That is because the term "air freight" refers to transport airport to airport only, and doesn't include terminal charges, clearance, or delivery to your address. All that can amount to substantial costs.

Walter

 

Dislike ads? Remove them and support the forum: Subscribe to Fastlane Insiders.

[ProblemSolver]

Hi Walter!

I've placed my first order from a Chinese manufacturer. Learning as I go here. I agree'd to 30/70 DDU terms for product/shipment. I have completed the 30% transfer to get production started. Now they want additional funds to deliver it to my door. They are asking for Customs Bond, Import Duty, and Lift Truck payments and calling it DDP instead. Does this sound accurate? The total cost for the product with shipping was $2,500, which it seems should negate any customs bonds needed since it is not over $2,500.

We also agreed upon 30% payment to start production and 70% once the shipment arrives at the port. Now they are asking for the 70% payment prior to shipping. Is this common?

I am considering paying the fees just to create a mutual relationship. I am not sure if that is something they would deem beneficial in their culture though. Next time, I will be much clearer in my expectations and likely chalk this one up to a learning experience.

Thank you!

 

[Walter Hay]

Hi Walter!

I've placed my first order from a Chinese manufacturer. Learning as I go here. I agree'd to 30/70 DDU terms for product/shipment. I have completed the 30% transfer to get production started. Now they want additional funds to deliver it to my door. They are asking for Customs Bond, Import Duty, and Lift Truck payments and calling it DDP instead. Does this sound accurate? The total cost for the product with shipping was $2,500, which it seems should negate any customs bonds needed since it is not over $2,500.

We also agreed upon 30% payment to start production and 70% once the shipment arrives at the port. Now they are asking for the 70% payment prior to shipping. Is this common?

I am considering paying the fees just to create a mutual relationship. I am not sure if that is something they would deem beneficial in their culture though. Next time, I will be much clearer in my expectations and likely chalk this one up to a learning experience.

Thank you!

Customs bonds are insurance policies, but as you rightly observe, they are not legal requirements for shipment values below $2,500. Nevertheless, I think that if you refuse you will delay shipment unnecessarily. If you get one, I recommend a continuing bond. Let me know if you need help to find a reasonable price.

If the original quote was DDU, what was the point of delivery specified? If it was the arrivals port, you might be stuck with the extra charges, except for the fact that if it is DDU warehouse at port, that should include Lift Truck charges as well as all port charges. In that case you will still also have to pay trucking to your door. If it was DDU at dock at your port, all of those charges will be added, and in fact such terms would amount to FOB port of destination, not DDU.

In the case of DDP, that must specify to your door otherwise there will be even more charges such as warehouse fees, truck hire etc. They can't expect duty paid in advance unless they they can tell you exactly what is the HS code and how much the duty is. When the shipment is cleared the rate of duty estimated by the carrier could be a lot less or a lot more than the actual rate levied by Customs, so they are taking a risk, or they are charging at a high duty rate, anticipating a lower real rate and then they will pay the lower rate. I doubt you would see a refund for the difference.

Payment being required prior to shipping is the norm, and that is what they must mean by payment "once the shipment arrives at the port." The question is: Which Port? I am guessing they mean port of loading.

You might like to play safe by having an inspection company inspect your shipment at time of loading into the container.They will email a report to you, and then you could make the payment. I am assuming LCL quantity, and that makes inspections a bit harder, because the inspection company can't witness the container being sealed unless your cargo is last to go into the container. At least you will know that the cargo has passed QC and has arrived at the port of loading or at the container depot. Without that, you are gambling that the shipment has even left the supplier's premises. It's possible they could inspect it at the supplier's premises and put a seal on the pallet wrapping. You would need to ask the inspection service. Unless it's at the port that would still be a gamble.

Should you choose to have an inspection, you might like to contact a Chinese inspection company that I can now recommend after good reports from Fastlane members, and no bad reports being found in my research. I have arranged a good deal for my book readers and to obtain that, email Samson at safeimport@topwininspection.com. Such an inspection as you need will cost you $197.

Walter