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Mentorship program

max4c

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Here are two threads to find fastlane-backed books:


Reading your above post, I went through the exact same process you did, so here are a couple of books I personnaly liked a lot and that you might like too:
- Unscripted
- TMF
- Blue ocean strategy
- zero to one (peter thiel)
- principles (ray dalio)
- losing my virginity (richard branson)

Don't forget that you should read a book that solves your current problem. In this regard, Dane Maxwell's start from zero might be good for you, I know thx to this forum that he's legit, but i haven't read it.

Good luck!

Thank you SOOO much! You simplified my whole search immediately. I like your suggestion about Start from Zero. This sounds like something I need. I'll definitely take a look at all this books.
 
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NicolasEmi

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i stumbled on TMF...thanks to him, he talked about the book in one of his videos (who knows, he is probably lurking on this forum).

Me too! He recommended TMF as you said, in one of his videos

Other books: "Purple Cow" by Seth Godin, "Oversubscribed" by Daniel Priestley,
If you want to offer a service, there's a ton of free info. on youtube: tim conley, ryan stewart, fox web school.

Thank you man! I'm checking that out

I typed the name of the business today and stumbled across a reddit discussion about it, it is indeed a scam, there are only very few people that manage to make 2000$ at most per month, while most people quit because it is sh*tty.

Uff, the power of marketing all over again... thanks for that!

Here are two threads to find fastlane-backed books:

Awesome threads :clap:::clap:::clap::
 

lowtek

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The landing page SCREAMS BRO marketing.

This is like a checklist for scammy marketing.

1) Pictures of the scammer with beautiful women (check)
2) Pictures of the scammer with a supercar (check)
3) Pictures of the scammer lecturing a room full of suckers (check)
4) "Apply now" button to create the illusion of a filtering process (check)
5) Promises of personalized attention (check)
6) Illusion of belonging to an elite group of entrepreneurs (check)
7) Mentor coach (consultant) teaching you to be a mentor coach (consultant) (check)

Please note, for all who cast their gaze on this post, this is the tried and true formula of all scammers. Anything that conforms to this formula, or has 1 or more of these elements on the landing page, is to be avoided at all costs. The odds are overwhelming that you will be suckered out of your money and get little to nothing in return.
 
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max4c

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The landing page SCREAMS BRO marketing.

This is like a checklist for scammy marketing.

1) Pictures of the scammer with beautiful women (check)
2) Pictures of the scammer with a supercar (check)
3) Pictures of the scammer lecturing a room full of suckers (check)
4) "Apply now" button to create the illusion of a filtering process (check)
5) Promises of personalized attention (check)
6) Illusion of belonging to an elite group of entrepreneurs (check)
7) Mentor coach (consultant) teaching you to be a mentor coach (consultant) (check)

Please note, for all who cast their gaze on this post, this is the tried and true formula of all scammers. Anything that conforms to this formula, or has 1 or more of these elements on the landing page, is to be avoided at all costs. The odds are overwhelming that you will be suckered out of your money and get little to nothing in return.

It seems quite obvious when you put it that way. I can't help but feel tremendously disappointed in him because, he does have a GREAT youtube channel and he talks about real stuff. In the end, this makes him a completey hypocryte. I know that he has quite a legacy of followers (like myself) and I guess that makes me overlook this fancy aspects of his marketing.

I am not interested in what he offers because of the way he presents it, I'm interested because I know the guy and I admire him in many ways. But I guess this building of followers is in the end no more than a funnel. Anyway, I can take the free value of his videos and will still do. But I'm leaving my wallet away from his program
 

Lex DeVille

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I joined the exact program you mentioned (Freedom Business Mentoring by Max Tornow) and I'm ashamed to admit that I felt for it. It's a total SCAM. They get you to do a "free consultation call" where they just pressure and manipulate you into buying the very expensive (or "high ticket") course. Right now, they have over 1100 students and 95% of them don't even make their money back, including me.

They don't practice what they teach. The premise is "building an online business without a brand, youtube channel, or social media following". While in fact, the only way they get clients is with all those things. And they treat you like garbage. Once they've got your money, they don't care what happens to you. Do you struggle to get any results following their advice? It's your fault! You're not executing enough.

As someone else said in this thread: They don't care if you succeed, they get paid anyway.

Thanks for sharing from an INSIDERS perspective. I don't know anything about this company or the person behind it, but all of this is outlined in my GOLD thread on Guru cults here.

I would caution against the idea that you should make your money back from any mentoring program unless the marketing materials directly state that you will make your money back.

Regardless of how good or not the mentoring program is, it is always your fault if you fail in business, just like it is your fault if you waste money on a worthless product because you failed to do proper due diligence.

To suggest anything else is to adapt a victimized mentality, which is how people end up in shady mentoring programs in the first place.

I'm not saying this program is "right" for doing business this way and I'm not suggesting that you are a victim or anything else negative about you.

The point is that anyone who joins these programs has to accept that they either did proper due diligence, vetted the program, asked questions upfront, checked reviews, asked others, and came to the reasonable conclusion that the program was likely to propel them forward in some way...

Or they did not do those things, and the result was that they did not get the outcome they hoped for.

The forum has had many lengthy discussions about the legitimacy of mentor and coach programs. Some are good. Some are bad. But there is no mentorship on the planet that decides your fate as a business. Only you get to do that.

I would also suggest that anyone who feels they wasted money on a mentorship program should review those feelings. Use them to help you learn the importance of proper due diligence in the future. It takes extra time, but it's worth the effort.
 
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Deleted78083

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It seems quite obvious when you put it that way. I can't help but feel tremendously disappointed in him because, he does have a GREAT youtube channel and he talks about real stuff. In the end, this makes him a completey hypocryte. I know that he has quite a legacy of followers (like myself) and I guess that makes me overlook this fancy aspects of his marketing.

I am not interested in what he offers because of the way he presents it, I'm interested because I know the guy and I admire him in many ways. But I guess this building of followers is in the end no more than a funnel. Anyway, I can take the free value of his videos and will still do. But I'm leaving my wallet away from his program

Wise decision, I've been following him on IG for many years and he gave me a lot of value too, really disappointed, i unfollowed his account
 
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Deleted78083

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Regardless of how good or not the mentoring program is, it is always your fault if you fail in business, just like it is your fault if you waste money on a worthless product because you failed to due proper due diligence.

To suggest anything else is to adapt a victimized mentality, which is how people end up in shady mentoring programs in the first place.

True, we are the sum of our own choices and if one fails at something, it is one's fault only
 

Lex DeVille

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True, we are the sum of our own choices and if one fails at something, it is one's fault only

Even in instances where it truly isn't your fault, like say a tornado destroys your business, it is still a matter of personal choices that decide the outcome.

Doesn't matter whose fault it is. Tornado's fault. God's fault. Whatever. Storms and Gods do not replace businesses.

If you have proper insurance, then you're good to go. Not carrying insurance is a personal choice by the owner. Many owners don't carry insurance. Business gets destroyed, they wind up on the news, "I lost everything to that tornado."

They lost everything because they made poor decisions before the storm, not because of the storm. The storm was just the catalyst that revealed weakness in their foundation.
 
D

Deleted78083

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I joined the exact program you mentioned (Freedom Business Mentoring by Max Tornow) and I'm ashamed to admit that I felt for it. It's a total SCAM.

At least we know now for sure it is a scam, thank you, your mistake will save thousands of dollars for other people who'd be tempted to sign up!
 
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Lex DeVille

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At least we know now for sure it is a scam, thank you, your mistake will save thousands of dollars for other people who'd be tempted to sign up!

Based on what? The made-up number that 95% of coachees don't make their money back? Do you believe this poster took the time to contact or poll even one single other individual in the program to come up with a legitimate statistic? Especially considering he didn't do proper due diligence before joining? At best this is speculation, which isn't fact.

It isn't due diligence to take the word of a single person who didn't get the results they wanted when that person didn't do proper due diligence to begin with (this is indicated by all the red flags that person pointed out as obvious indicators that the program was a scam after the fact). If the indicators were so obvious, then he wouldn't have spent money in the first place. In another thread this oversight is attributed to not having read an article in time:

This article is pretty on-point. I wish I've read it sooner: 12 Warning Signs Of A Coaching & Mentoring Service To Avoid

But had the poster in question performed any kind of due diligence, then he would have come across many similar articles with a simple Google search.

The point is not to bash the poster. But none of this indicates that the program is a scam to me.

Instead, it indicates that the individual has mindset issues to deal with. He's quick to throw blame on the program as the reason he didn't get results. He's also established a pattern of high-ticket course buying when he said this in another thread:

Definitely not ALL, but I would say a LOT. I paid well into 5 figures for different coachings. Some of them were total scams, some were OK, and some of them were amazing and changed my life.

Next he proclaims "vague language" tricked him into buying, then describes "other" programs as producing "amazing life changing results" but is vague about those programs and their results so there's nothing to really compare to.

So due diligence in this instance would be to ask:

- Which coaching programs changed his life?
- How did his life change?
- What specifically did those coaches do that changed his life (because he attributes the change to the coaching, and not to himself) "some of them were amazing and changed my life."
- What were the goals of each program and were they similar? If they weren't similar, then they can't be compared. It wouldn't make sense to compare a coaching on mindset to a coaching on how to build an engine.
- If the goals were monetary results, then what specific monetary results did he get from each program?
- When were the amazing coaching programs taken? Before or after the program that made him disgruntled toward the program in question? It makes a difference if they came after because it suggests mindset problems going into the first program.
 

Lex DeVille

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I disagree. When buying any mentoring program, you should always be thinking what ROI it will bring you. If we're talking about business, you should definitely make your money back and then proceed to make more. Otherwise you're just paying for expensive entertainment or feel-good materials. You're action-faking.

Yes, you should think about the ROI. Part of that consideration is due diligence, which you did not properly do as indicated in the previous posts.

If we're talking about business, you should definitely make your money back and then proceed to make more.

If we're talking about business, you should aim to make your money back and make more. There's no such thing as you "should" make your money back and make more. You're not entitled to money. That's an entrepreneur's utopia. Everybody thinks they'll be successful because they start a business or make an investment. Most people aren't.

Otherwise you're just paying for expensive entertainment or feel-good materials. You're action-faking.

I don't have that problem because I spend a lot of time on due diligence. But this does seem to accurately describe your situation, so I don't disagree.

Off course. Nobody held a gun to my head and forced me to buy the product. Ultimately, I have to take responsibility for my actions.

Yes.

BUT this doesn't mean it's OK if somebody creates a shitty product and is scamming people. You can't say "Oh, he's a scammer but that's ok. It's not his fault, it's the fault of the people who fell for his scam".

Nobody said that makes it ok. But just because you think something is a shitty program doesn't make it true. For every student who says my courses suck, there's another who claims it changed his life.

My point is that these mentoring programs always have a an excuse for not working. Regardless if the advice you get is good or bad, they can always say it didn't work because you didn't try hard enough.

Victims always have an excuse for why its the program's fault they didn't make money. Advice is just advice. What you do with it determines the outcome. Just like they can always say it didn't work because you didn't try hard enough, you can always say it didn't work because their program is "bad."

For instance, I can create a weight-loss product. I will sell it to you for thousands of dollars and inside I will tell you "Use this special prayer I've created, and pray 3 times per day. This will make you lose weight." When you don't lose weight by following my advice, I can say it didn't work for you because you didn't pray hard enough.

No you can't because based on the responses above, you'd never get something like this off the ground. You consume courses. You don't appear to be the one selling them. Plus I would never buy it from you because I spend a lot of time reading between the lines and would see right through your bullshit. That's called due diligence.

Unless the program promised you something very specific, and then did not deliver on that promise, it is incorrect to call it a scam. It is just a failure on your part to vet the program.
 
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Einfamilienhaus

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mentoring program I looked in the Internet.
(the link is this: An important letter from Max Tornow – please read it carefully! ).

Uff, this guy is a pickup Artist. You better watch out or he will pick you up for your money. Maybe he will use the escalation method and the alpha game to impress you. Most of his money he has done to tell insecure guys how they could "game" girls, if they just use the right technique and all kind of stuff. Now the whole pickup industry is about to get exposed and more and more of the insecure boys are about to turn against their "pickup masters". For example: Some of the dudes started to make some research and they found out that many of the girls are just paid call girls.

If a grown up men is talking on YouTube about how he has picked up some random girl, like it is the most amazing thing a guy can experience, then you shouldn't expect too much from his program.
 
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Lex DeVille

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Wow, to say you're making a lot of assumptions about me is a huge understatement. You're obviously biased because you also have an online course.

But notice the difference between you and me. Just because you have an online course, I don't automatically assume you are a scammer. But when I criticize an online course, you automatically start assuming I'm a victim and that my opinion is irrelevant. I'm treating you with respect, but you don't do the same.


So you admit that you don't know anything about the course but you automatically assume that the problem is not in the course but in me.


Yes, as I said before, I feel stupid for making this mistake. Hopefully, if someone is doing research in the future, they will be able to find my posts.


That's irrelevant to the point I was making.


Yes but there is good advice and there is bad advice.


Yes it did broke specific promises.

You should reread the posts you quoted. But good luck with your nonsense. I won't be responding further to you.
 

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