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NOTABLE! Going "All In"

Discussion in 'The Unscripted Entrepreneurial Mind' started by 458, Apr 20, 2016.

  1. MJ DeMarco
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    MJ DeMarco Raving Lunatic Staff Member Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass LEGENDARY CONTRIBUTOR Summit Attendee

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    Admin Post
    "All-in" for me means an obsessive commitment, not necessarily a "do or die" (as in poker) but more like a "do and never stop."
     
  2. GuestUser450
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    Yes but no. No but yes. Funny how quickly OP's very simple and straightforward message splinters into "It depends upon what the meaning of the word 'is' is".

    The only idea to redefine is risk. Is real risk taking an educated guess based on math or doing what you've always done?

    I hope MJ's next book hits on emotional i.q. and decision-making because I've come to believe it's 100% mental; market barriers to entry pale in comparison to the artificial ones we make up because of fear.
     
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  3. biggeemac
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    I agree.....MJ beat me to it. On my project, I am "all in" as far as i'm concerned. I haven't quit my day job, I don't spend every single non-day-job moment working on my project, I still spend time with my family, and manage to watch TV sometimes. I have taken a very calculated risk, and even if my plans didn't unfold the way that I have projected, I would still make money. As far as I'm concerned, there are too many folks that are basically throwing a "hail Mary".......it might make sense to them, but I have a family and I can't afford hail Mary's. My business isn't going to go viral and make me an over-night millionaire, and my growth may be a little slower, but I am certain that my day is coming.
     
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  4. Yoda
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    Yoda Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED FASTLANE INSIDER Speedway Pass

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    "Do or do not. There is no try."​

    I'm happy to enter this fantastic discourse.

    First of all, it's very enlightening to see what the phrase simply means to each person. There is obviously a direct correlation, though perhaps a bit evasive, how each of you have come up with your own conclusions when referencing an "all in" nature.

    For this reason, everyone's "all in" should be different. Those of you referencing poker... you're missing your own points! Scottie Nguyen, Phil Helmuth, and Chris Moneymaker will absolutely not go "all in" in every situation even if every other variable was identical. Yes, poker players know when to go "all in," but it's based on their own behavior, past and present, their own perception of the circumstance, and their risk tolerance. What they've actually done is gone "all in" to their profession and committed an insane amount of learning, anguish, and risk to get to where they are.

    But see, I gave this particular example a more thorough examination because it helps me showcase my own perception of the "all in" you're each debating.

    I, personally, believe going "all in" is a massive commitment towards a positively perceived outcome given a span of time. Three components:
    1. Massive commitment
    2. Positively perceived outcome
    3. Time
    We are all going to have our own definition of what "Massive Commitment" might be, but we can probably all agree there is some level of perseverance towards a goal, with the notion we need to give something up (money, time). When you commit to something, you're offering full focused attention in a particular direction.

    Obviously, there better be a positively perceived outcome. You're just a dunce if you commit to anything which you don't 'feel' or 'believe' or 'know' there is a light at the end of then tunnel. Look both ways before you cross the road.

    Finally, something a few of you have touched in brevity... the time element.

    Let's go back to poker. If a poker player goes "all in" on one hand, he is, indeed, risking his tournament entry. The time frame, however, is limited to his tournament entry (assuming we're not talking cash games at the moment). Therefore, if your particular focus is the moment he is in, then he's likely "all in." However, if your particular focus is his career... well, there's always next year, and you better believe he's going to be doing WSOP's, cash games and more until next year's main event. In this case, the hand he went "all in" is no longer much more than a tick on a timeline.

    My point being:

    You, and only you, can determine your own "all in."

    But, you have to measure it with a level of commitment you can sustain, aim it towards a positively perceived outcome, and relentlessly take action for a defined amount of time.

    Commit, aim, don't stop.

    That's my "all in" folks.
     
  5. happybhoy
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    happybhoy Bronze Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    For me, I'm keeping my job until I see some signs that this might work. Working 40 hours a week slowlane certainly isn't slowing me down.
    I'm going all in emotionally, I've had many half arsed tries but I'm taking this idea to the end.
    Quiting your job might add a pressure to succeed but I'm creating the pressure by making it public that I'm trying to start a business. I'm not willing to look like a failure, so it gives me motivation to work and make the sacrifices.
    "All in" to me means getting into the mindset that failure isn't an option.
     
  6. JScott
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    That's fine...but that's not what you implied in your original post when you said:

    "That means no plan b, willing to lose every cent you have in front of everyone you know."

    My point is that there are often times when you *shouldn't* be willing to lose every cent you have (I can't imagine a situation these days where I'd be willing to risk all the assets I currently have). Just because you're not willing to lose every cent you have doesn't mean you are running your business sub-optimally...
     
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  7. nradam123
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    Ah man, I can't believe people are saying not to go all in.
    Obviously do not takes risks that are so big that you will not be able to feed your 3 month year old baby or something like that. Or taking a loan so big that you get bankrupt for life. I think the key to taking risk is to take risks really big but if you fail you should be able to get back up and play again.

    And going all in basically means immersion. Don't confuse it with taking risks.
    It just means that you are working so hard that you are not sleeping much, you are pissing off your friends and family and you are always grinding hard.

    I think Gary Vaynerchuk said he always goes all in. So when he is working he works 18 hours a day as you can see in his Daily Vee shows and when he is taking a vacation he is sleeping on a beach and he wont wake up even if someone stabs on his chest several times.
     
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  8. 458
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    458 Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    Your missing the point entirely. Keeping a Zen like state when the "possibility" of losing everything and being embarrassed infront of everyone is what separates the Jorge Perez's of the world from the common folk.

    I don't expect everyone to get it.. This is certainly not for the masses.
     
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  9. nradam123
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  10. Tom.V
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    Hmm, working so hard that all you can do is sleep on your time off. Sounds like such a dream. :cookoo:
     
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  11. Ubermensch
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    Wait.

    I don't get it.

    1) What, exactly, makes @AndrewNC 's post "biased"?

    First, there is a logical follow-up question here: How exactly did @AndrewNC "discount" what he just wrote?

    Of course, you don't mean "discount," as in AndrewNC literally "lowering his price" on a product or service. No, you meant that he - in essence - contradicts himself, that all of the pain that he went through somehow proves that it wasn't the .

    2) Why should we care that AndrewNC has a "biased" perspective?

    All perspectives are biased; that's what makes them perspectives.

    He describes the experience as "the best decision I made in my entire life..." Lol. I couldn't agree more. Floyd Mayeather, Michael Jordan, Usain Bolt, Michael Phelps... these athletes experience great pain in the training period before the Big Competition Day. You experience this pain if you train yourself. You know that the results only come if you're doing something "hard." Hard can have many contexts, and I mean it that way, to allow for many different types of training.

    Hustler training is brutal.

    Those of us that RI$E to the top, we are like Gladiator's in Rome's Arena. When we fight, we are ALL IN; we live and die by the sword of the game we play.

    And even though we may have literally put our lives on the line - and suffered physically, emotionally, psychologically (the game ABUSES you, forcing you to evolve into whatever it takes to be successful) - our training... it makes us great, it makes us winners.

    Who appreciates freedom more than a recently freed slave?

    Who relishes the taste and satisfaction of food and water more than the hungry and starving?

    The depth of the agony that andrewnc felt is equivalent to the degree of success and accomplishment he now enjoys and continues to build.
     
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  12. JScott
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    Thank you for so graciously accepting my intellectual limitations and inability to grasp concepts.
     
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  13. EPerceptions
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    For me, "All In" = "Do Not Dabble"

    Decide. Do.
     
  14. 458
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    458 Gold Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane Speedway Pass

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    Thank you for a good laugh.
     
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  15. StevieB
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    StevieB Silver Contributor Read Millionaire Fastlane I've Read UNSCRIPTED Speedway Pass

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    Agreed.

    My definition of "going all in" doesn't mean you quit your job, kick out your girlfriend, get a divorce, sacrifice everything for a business.



    Here is the simple definition of "going all in" -- even if you have kids, a marriage, are single, have a full-time job, whatever your circumstances are it's all the same. In fact doing some of those things are completely reckless -- so don't confuse "going all in" for chucking it all and selling everything and moving into a 500-sq ft apt. in the Philippines for "going all in".

    What it means is having the discipline and laser focus on a goal. This one goal. This "one thing" is what you'll dedicate all of your time to outside of your current responsibilities. It means other than the basics of either taking care of your children (if you have them), your wife (if you have one), your dog (if you have one), your rent payment (if you have one), you water bill (if you have one), and someone ponying up the money for Ramen noodles.

    Outside of that YOUR FOCUS is this ONE GOAL. The rest of your time is committed to that, not partying, not chasing tail, not going to dinner with your friends, not watching TV, not playing video games, anything outside of your basic responsibilities you use your time to focus on this goal.

    That is going all in.
     
  16. Silverhawk851
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    Wow, I haven't came across a thread of such high intellectual level in a while.

    Thank you all for sharing your perspectives.

    For me,
    my mind goes to a quote by Marcus Aurelius,

    "Our actions may be impeded . . . but there can be no impeding our intentions or dispositions.
    Because we can accommodate and adapt.
    The mind adapts and converts to its own purposes the obstacle to our acting."

    -Meditations, Marcus Aurelius

    All-in to me means, even though sh*t goes up, down or sideways,
    the intention remains the same. It remains stoic.

    And the ability to keep that same INTENSITY of doing what is in our control,
    to making progress, no matter what. That, to me, is what I consider all in.

    All-in can be after failing on 100 different campaigns,
    spending another precious $100 on a new campaign, instead of spending it on a drink at a bar somewhere.

    After having been rejected from 46 sales calls that day,
    making one more.

    After having lost all your money, friends and family doubt you,
    you say f*ck it and plug forward.

    Your actions and situations may be impeded, may go wrong,
    but your intentions can not.
    You simply adapt to the situation at hand with the same goal.

    The word decision comes from the Latin word Decidere, which means to cut off.
    Basically once you decide, you are all in.
    You cut-off any other possible outcome.

    You jump off the cliff.

    Yes, you can get hurt if you jump too hard,
    and it can actually cause lost time and set back,
    but still you jumped.
    Never apologize for taking a chance.
    What doesn't kill you will make you stronger.
    Life teaches you what you need to learn.
    No pain, no growth. No evolution.
    You come back stronger and jump again.

    At the end of it all,
    you only have 29,400 days to live in your entire life, that's IF you live to 80.
    f*ck it.
    No risk no reward.
    Plus, you're really only 1 in 7,500,000,000 people.
    Nobody really cares what you do, and it's really not that important in the big picture.
    You might as well jump. Go for the big stuff.
    No growth happens inside the comfort zone anyways.


    ....Fastlane philosophy class is epic :D

    TL;DR
    -All in is when sh*t goes wrong, and you still plug forward
    -Say f*ck it and just do it
    -What doesn't kill you will make you stronger
    -Don't do permanent damage.
    -Luckily very few things actually cause permanent damage
     
  17. The-J
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    So, what does cause permanent damage?

    Death, obviously. Don't put yourself in a position that makes you more likely to die. This is kind of a given...

    Bodily injury: same thing.

    Reputational injury: this could shove you out of a business entirely. Jordan Belfort was able to turn it around. Other people have been able to successfully turn it around too. But you are very unlikely to be back into a business. Luckily, it takes a lot to suffer reputational injury, like committing a crime.

    Relationships: Screw up a key relationship and it can hurt you emotionally and financially. Key relationships mainly being spouses and kids, as well as parents and mentors. These are probably the most easy to screw up.

    For the young, single person with very little in assets and a relatively non-existent rolodex, going 'all in' makes perfect sense. However, a married parent of 3 with 20 years experience in the field needs to know who not to piss off and has to keep the spouse and kids happy, housed, and fed. Not only this, but if you have $10m in hard assets, it's a rare situation that you would NEED to bet it all, let alone being in a situations where betting it all is a wise thing to do. However, if you've got 2k in cash and a beat-up Geo Metro, spending that $2k on paid traffic might very well be an excellent risk.

    tl;dr it's all relative
     
  18. vinylawesome
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    It's interesting to see the different meanings that we all give to, "All In".

    I thought this article was relevant to this discussion as it has good insight into the term, "All in" and how it's meaning has evolved over the years.

    http://www.newyorker.com/culture/cultural-comment/going-all-in-on-all-in


    "In American usage, the phrase “all in” began as a colloquial expression meaning to be in a
    bad spot—exhausted, worn out, and spent. In the game of poker, it refers to the moment when a player—
    whether out of bravado, recklessness, or desperation—bets all of his or her chips on a single hand.

    Thanks to the Texas Hold’em craze of the nineteen-nineties and two thousands, and the public’s
    appetite for new forms of dramatic hyperbole, the poker version of the phrase crossed over to
    general use and, along the way, became denuded to the point of near meaninglessness.

    Whereas “all in” once referred to a scenario in which someone either wins a
    hand or loses everything in a flash, now it means that a person is simply generallyenthusiastic or fully committed.

    It’s everywhere these days—business jargon, marketing catch phrases, sports mantras, and the idioms of religion and self-help.

    "The all-in moment in poker is a thrilling win-or-lose-everything crisis of dramatic clarity: you’ve wagered all you’ve got, giving your fate over to the cards, and you can’t go back out again. Going all in is often a spectacularly bad idea. But in life, it seems, it is all good—the only way to live boldly is to be all in on many different things at once."


    ........

    "Many of poker’s words and phrases are tinged with a kind of roguish romance and drama that we hope may rub off on the more mundane activities of normal life—upping the ante, stacking the deck, calling a bluff, putting your cards on the table. "
    ............................

    In poker, being all in is a lonely place to be. But elsewhere, “all in” is used to evoke inclusiveness and community, as in, “we’re all in this together.” In 2006, when Alex Rodriguez wanted to assure Yankees fans that the team was serious about winning, he said, “To use a poker term, we’re all in..."
    .............................................................................................

    For me I have always thought "All in" meant to commit to something fully by executing a well thought out plan.

    i.e. If your going to jump out of an airplane you better pack your own chute.







     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2016
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  19. Kingmaker
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    Kingmaker Gold Contributor Speedway Pass

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    You don't buy the New York Jets by living a well-balanced life.
     
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  20. blueoceanblues
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    Not a bad place for the mind to go, for this month of April I was reading that book. Came across it from Ryan Holiday's blog.

    Excellent post too.
     
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  21. OVOvince
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    The funny part is that even after puttin in all the work to be able to afford that... you still don't buy the New York Jets hahaha :D
     
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  22. StevieB
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  23. randomnumber314
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    I hear (read into) a lot of fear in many of these arguments. There's a quote by Seneca that states something like "live for a week without that which you fear losing the most" (I'm sure I butchered it)

    Going all in, usually, means having the willingness to swap the leased Audi for a cash Toyota, and not worrying about what Mom/Dad/Mr. Jones will think.

    Going all in, usually, means sticking to a single idea to the end, not worrying that people will see you struggling, or you'll fail and they'll talk sh*t about you, or your inner demon was right and you do suck. Going all in, usually, means systematically pursuing a goal while being open minded to the fact that you're probably wrong about what you think you know, and you're going to let people with wallets tell you what they want to buy/value.

    Going all in, always, means accepting responsibility for your decisions, preparing to takes risks by using whatever information you have available, and not "pushing it all in the pot" unless the table/tourney allows you to buy back into the game.

    Watch the movie Joy. She went all in, and because she did she fought and fought to make her concept a reality. That's the mindset difference (I believe) 458 is speaking about.

    Take this for example. A guy decides to go all in. He takes his retirement funds, and savings, and starts a business. Within a few months the company is doing between $20-40k a week in sales. After a few months the businesses is struggling to find employees to fulfill sales. The guy sells some personal assets to bolster the company's bank account. Eventually the guy realizes that the company can't fulfill the sales as "winter is coming" and he's down to two employees. He refunds the customers, sells the equipment, and moves on. Total timeline 9-10 months.

    Did he go all in ?

    I don't think so. I think he tried, really hard, for a bit, but in the end he gave up.
     
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  24. CaptainAmerica
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    "All in" for me means putting everything on the line, and I won't yet, because kids. But - I buy myself time. When I have to, I get some stupid a$$ job that pays between customers. Then I quit in disgust and hustle more.

    I'm committed to building a lifestyle, including right freaking now. My time isn't going to be spent only working (whether for my own business or not). My goals are bigger than my business.

    I have housemates, so my mortgage is down to -$19. I work from home, so I don't buy much gas. Why should I sell my house to get capital I don't really need? Sure, I could sink $100,000 into my business and 'get there faster'. But that takes all the fun out of the process. Ask any trust fund kid why they work when they don't have to.

    It doesn't matter if 95% of businesses fail. They're not there to exist. They're there to promote the economy. This is why serial entrepreneurialism is a real career choice. My mission isn't to make $48 million. That's a goal. My mission is to change the way the world does business. My vehicles will change along the way, but that road won't.
     
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  25. Tom.V
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    And I'm all in again. Difference? I took the time to gain new skills, eliminated all debt (shackles), figured out how to generate a lot of recurring income, and much more. Much better probabilities and it made total sense to go all in this time around.

    Was it still an unnatural, scary feeling? Absolutely.

    Every step of the way I was second guessing myself at each invisible plateau I approached. And I still do, and I will continue to. But looking back, I know they are just that. Just lines in the sand.

    Is irrational fear controlling you, or are you biding your time and stacking the deck in your favor?
     
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